Guild Wars 2

For all the people suggesting a nerf to might because it makes cele more powerful. Might is not exclusive to people with Celestial builds, anyone can do it. Which also means that if you nerf how might works, you are slightly hurting those celestial builds, and really crippling any other build that relies on might but doesn’t use celestial. I mean, boonstripping is a thing for many classes. Watching an ele or engineer get to 20 might stacks then sending them into the void can really screw them over. Pretty much any class can have access to might, and the intended draw back of this is that Might isn’t permanent like your amulets and runes are. Might can be stolen(believe me, you don’t want a zerker mesmer stealing 20 stacks of might from you), corrupted and stripped and it has a duration.

Celestial is really powerful, IF you can maintain access to a wide variety of boons. This almost always requires building around obtaining boons and always keeping on eye on what boons you have during fights. This encourages more active play and gaining specific boons in reaction to things, instead of just at random times when the skill is off cd.

Saying something is OP just because with active play and proper boon management(which can be shut down by 1-2 boon targeting skills) it is very strong seems like you just want every class to be some variation of each other, just with less health and more damage or less damage and more health.

Necrotize.2974:

For all the people suggesting a nerf to might because it makes cele more powerful. Might is not exclusive to people with Celestial builds, anyone can do it. Which also means that if you nerf how might works, you are slightly hurting those celestial builds, and really crippling any other build that relies on might but doesn’t use celestial. I mean, boonstripping is a thing for many classes. Watching an ele or engineer get to 20 might stacks then sending them into the void can really screw them over. Pretty much any class can have access to might, and the intended draw back of this is that Might isn’t permanent like your amulets and runes are. Might can be stolen(believe me, you don’t want a zerker mesmer stealing 20 stacks of might from you), corrupted and stripped and it has a duration.

Celestial is really powerful, IF you can maintain access to a wide variety of boons. This almost always requires building around obtaining boons and always keeping on eye on what boons you have during fights. This encourages more active play and gaining specific boons in reaction to things, instead of just at random times when the skill is off cd.

Saying something is OP just because with active play and proper boon management(which can be shut down by 1-2 boon targeting skills) it is very strong seems like you just want every class to be some variation of each other, just with less health and more damage or less damage and more health.

I very much agree with this. Thank you for posting.

Mbelch.9028:

Necrotize.2974:

For all the people suggesting a nerf to might because it makes cele more powerful. Might is not exclusive to people with Celestial builds, anyone can do it. Which also means that if you nerf how might works, you are slightly hurting those celestial builds, and really crippling any other build that relies on might but doesn’t use celestial. I mean, boonstripping is a thing for many classes. Watching an ele or engineer get to 20 might stacks then sending them into the void can really screw them over. Pretty much any class can have access to might, and the intended draw back of this is that Might isn’t permanent like your amulets and runes are. Might can be stolen(believe me, you don’t want a zerker mesmer stealing 20 stacks of might from you), corrupted and stripped and it has a duration.

Celestial is really powerful, IF you can maintain access to a wide variety of boons. This almost always requires building around obtaining boons and always keeping on eye on what boons you have during fights. This encourages more active play and gaining specific boons in reaction to things, instead of just at random times when the skill is off cd.

Saying something is OP just because with active play and proper boon management(which can be shut down by 1-2 boon targeting skills) it is very strong seems like you just want every class to be some variation of each other, just with less health and more damage or less damage and more health.

I very much agree with this. Thank you for posting.

You are using the wrong reasoning to suggest someone else is claiming something is OP. The reason folks are pointing out that might is the problems, is because useless threads of the nature of this one are made. So we have to educate the thread creators. celestial hase been around for a long time. Yet no one mad threads complaining about it untill the rune and might stacking changes occurred.

Not to mention, the guy who created this thread clearly made a very strong effort not to do any comparisons of damage out put or defensive capabilities. If you actual feel you have a strong point, you offer those cases to support it. The fact that they do not exist, is strong evidence that the OP may not even believe the smoke and mirrors he created to blame celestial gear.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Mbelch.9028:

Necrotize.2974:

For all the people suggesting a nerf to might because it makes cele more powerful. Might is not exclusive to people with Celestial builds, anyone can do it. Which also means that if you nerf how might works, you are slightly hurting those celestial builds, and really crippling any other build that relies on might but doesn’t use celestial. I mean, boonstripping is a thing for many classes. Watching an ele or engineer get to 20 might stacks then sending them into the void can really screw them over. Pretty much any class can have access to might, and the intended draw back of this is that Might isn’t permanent like your amulets and runes are. Might can be stolen(believe me, you don’t want a zerker mesmer stealing 20 stacks of might from you), corrupted and stripped and it has a duration.

Celestial is really powerful, IF you can maintain access to a wide variety of boons. This almost always requires building around obtaining boons and always keeping on eye on what boons you have during fights. This encourages more active play and gaining specific boons in reaction to things, instead of just at random times when the skill is off cd.

Saying something is OP just because with active play and proper boon management(which can be shut down by 1-2 boon targeting skills) it is very strong seems like you just want every class to be some variation of each other, just with less health and more damage or less damage and more health.

I very much agree with this. Thank you for posting.

You are using the wrong reasoning to suggest someone else is claiming something is OP. The reason folks are pointing out that might is the problems, is because useless threads of the nature of this one are made. So we have to educate the thread creators. celestial hase been around for a long time. Yet no one mad threads complaining about it untill the rune and might stacking changes occurred.

Not to mention, the guy who created this thread clearly made a very strong effort not to do any comparisons of damage out put or defensive capabilities. If you actual feel you have a strong point, you offer those cases to support it. The fact that they do not exist, is strong evidence that the OP may not even believe the smoke and mirrors he created to blame celestial gear.

In addition, such collection of data would be time consuming and it is far easier to just claim something is broken rather than take the time to test it. I play ele fairly often, I can hold my own against 2v1’s, but I eventually die if help doesn’t arrive and I rarely down either of them unless they’re full glass(but if they are full glass I need to dodge their burst before executing mine, since mine is a lot longer). What really destroys me is, like I mentioned earlier, Necros and Mesmers that understand how ele is meant to be played. You support yourself with boons, you don’t have a big burst heal, just smaller heals over time. See an ele switch into water then out? Signet of Spite+Fear(to force stab) then Corrupt Boon. This pretty much destroys the elementalist. All passive heals gone, no condi clears(or few) and now damage is in the toilet due to loss of might, all while conditions eat up health. Celestial builds in general are like speeding trains. They start slow, but as they build up might they get stronger and stronger. Stripping might even once is like pulling the emergency break.

Just to clarify. I’m not for nerfing might or cele. Cele is niche and requires very active play to maintain and we don’t want to discourage that. Might is powerful for all classes. Always has been. The strongest burst came from classes that could temporarily supply their own might or maintain several stacks all the time. I just think other things should be buffed to the same level. But before that, bugs should be fixed, since as a person who also loves mesmers and thieves, there are a lot of little bugs that really screw over things.

Collection of data regarding cele and might wouldn’t really prove much that we don’t already know. Might increases damage, both condition and power. Celestial increases power, crit, crit damage and condition damage. People who utilize all those stats will have none of them wasted, whereas say a pure power build is really only using half of the might and half of the stats.

I’ve been playing something close to my current build on engie since before celestial weapons and armor were added. After they were added, I went to them immediately, wanting to spread out my assets to match my relatively jack-of-all-trades build. As it stands now, my build has gone mostly unchanged, and falls pretty well into this “might stacking celestial” archetype.

In my opinion, removing a stat from celestial hurts the archetype it represents- I’d much rather see a blanket reduction to all stats, if it indeed needs a nerf. That said, I’m inclined to think might would be the better target for a nerf- by reducing the amount of stacks given by certain skills.

In its current state, though I can’t speak for all celestial, might-stacking engies, I can describe how to beat my build, which may or may not be useful in beating others:

-I have no stability, and no stun break. I have one “surprise shot” bullet and one “vent smoke” blind which can be fired from stun- that’s it. I dish out CC, but I can’t take it.

-I have one condition cleanse, which knocks out two conditions. I use this as part of the several steps I need to perform to heal. Using it at other times screws up my heal rotation. Interrupting any of these several steps, or nuking one of my turrets, also screws up my heal rotation.

-Restacking my combo-field might also screws up my heal rotation, and by that I mean skips a cycle. During the fight, my might stacks will go down, not up unless I take no damage and want to gamble. (Your vulnerability will go up, though.)

-Anything that mitigates projectiles is hard for me to deal with. I do not have a melee weapon, and my flamethrower is difficult to use for damage if you’re paying attention.

-My two big-damage and vuln-inducing attacks (grenade barrage and jump shot) are telegraphed, ground target AOE’s. Interrupting the jump shot will throw it on FULL cooldown, not the reduced cooldown normally caused by interrupts.

-If i remember correctly, I have at most 3 boons- might, swift, and regeneration. consider that because of speedy kits I expect to either currently have swiftness or receive it by swapping to a kit- if I don’t have it I am caught off guard.

-I also swap kits like a madman, which counts as skill uses. It usually takes two skills at least to proc my condition cleanse- if it’s off cooldown (It’s not though- I detonated that turret as my heal rotation, or to stack might). Confusion wrecks me.

I rely HEAVILY on movement and positioning for my skills. Torment, cripple, chill, and immobile all destroy my ability to fight.