Guild Wars 2

Ben K.6238:

Charr females did get a different version of the Wintersday town clothes. It was so hilarious I had to buy one.

Haha yeah I did remember the cute outfit for the girl charrs during Wintersday.

To the person who stated that female players want their character to look feminine, unless you send out a survey to all the female players who have a female charr, you can’t determine that.
I have four female charr. I don’t want them to look human-female feminine at all. Rather, I want them to look like huge, muscular, eat-your-face-off beasts. It wouldn’t make sense to choose a cat-monster-from-hell race if you wanted a human-female-pretty character. While my charr are vicious, they also feel very much like females to me. If they were forced to wear “girl clothes”, they would actually feel less female to me. They’d stop being females, and start being cats in silly dress-up-clothing. I relate to them much better when there’s nothing to show their gender except biology.

Weindrasi.3805:

To the person who stated that female players want their character to look feminine, unless you send out a survey to all the female players who have a female charr, you can’t determine that.

Several people have already pointed that out to him. Obvious hyperbole was obvious. I have a female Charr character myself and I do -NOT- want her to look feminine. It ruins the mod of the Charr.

There’s a great scene in the Serrated Blade where a drunk patron hits on a female Charr, then mockingly says “Oh, kitten’s got claws,” when she rebuffs his advances. Her reply is so sweet: “Kitten’s got a sword, too. Now, back off.”

I can’t see that kind of behavior coming form someone in a frilly dress or wearing boob plate.

I have four female charr. I don’t want them to look human-female feminine at all. Rather, I want them to look like huge, muscular, eat-your-face-off beasts. It wouldn’t make sense to choose a cat-monster-from-hell race if you wanted a human-female-pretty character. While my charr are vicious, they also feel very much like females to me. If they were forced to wear “girl clothes”, they would actually feel less female to me. They’d stop being females, and start being cats in silly dress-up-clothing. I relate to them much better when there’s nothing to show their gender except biology.

Yep. I agree.

Brutalistik.6473:

Meh don’t bother with the creative ideas about more feminine armor etc on the charr forums. You’ll get nothing, but criticism, insults and my view is right.

You know what dude I think I understand that insight of yours. I’m not much of a charr fanatic to care if charr females happens to receive some feminine armor, but when some people start saying force to wear and some other nonsense that doesn’t agree to their view. Giving it all negative vibes like it’s a taboo.

I think that’s just messed up overall. Coming to the charr forum your ideas are limited depending on the topic.

I know everyone has different tastes, but I can see why furries are frowned upon.

The thing you have to realize is most people who pick up an MMO will never choose a beast race willingly. It’s a head scratcher myself but people choose to play humans because they are humans. It probably has to do with immersion- and just over all comfort towards content.

For me, Guild wars got it right. Charr are a true beast race, they aren’t cat men, they aren’t furries, and they arent women with animal heads. Anatomically they are beautiful in ways I have only seen in pen to paper artwork- Yeah, we got a little shafted with armor- but after years of tauren, and worgen, and other ‘boobied’ beast races- I cannot say enough about how much I love charr design.

They didn’t cave in where most mmo’s did, females weren’t forced into a ‘sensual’ sexual dimorphism- and charr females were given fitting lore to explain their place in charr society, for this very reason they aren’t objectified- they are equal to males in every way, except to the flame legion.

On another note, I am extremely curious to see where Everquest Next goes with the Kerran, We’ve seen the male so far, and its been long enough since EQ2 that they could follow the paradigm shift from cat-man to anthropormorhic beast. I have hopes for it- and I sincerely hope they follow suit, its a change almost all of us beast race lovers wanted, and I really, really want to see it become standard.

Listen I don’t really care about whatever reason, what lore, why they look like that has anything to do with extra options. In my view it’s just game and any free addition I get for my character whether it’s armor or character creation looks is a birthday gift to me.

Going into silly arguments about furrie sexual this and that means it’s a personal problem that does not agree to their view. Just because you dislike it doesn’t mean others don’t. Don’t even categorize them either just because it appeals to them. You suppose to play what appeals to you overall that’s just nature.

We know the female charr body is a different version of a furrie, but regardless it’s a furrie and its model not changing so I don’t know why all this fear is coming up about feminine armor changing. You’ll always have choices to wear that armor so it’s not a mandatory thing.

Glad I am not a furrie fanatic. Too much of a headache over silly stuff for silly reasons.

FenGuild.1097:

Listen I don’t really care about whatever reason, what lore, why they look like that has anything to do with extra options. In my view it’s just game and any free addition I get for my character whether it’s armor or character creation looks is a birthday gift to me.

Going into silly arguments about furrie sexual this and that means it’s a personal problem that does not agree to their view. Just because you dislike it doesn’t mean others don’t. Don’t even categorize them either just because it appeals to them. You suppose to play what appeals to you overall that’s just nature.

We know the female charr body is a different version of a furrie, but regardless it’s a furrie and its model not changing so I don’t know why all this fear is coming up about feminine armor changing. You’ll always have choices to wear that armor so it’s not a mandatory thing.

Glad I am not a furrie fanatic. Too much of a headache over silly stuff for silly reasons.

You may not care, because well it doesn’t interest you- thats fine, but I think you don’t realize what has given us a greater part of this mentality. Many of us have been gaming for years, decades even- we’ve seen things grow and progress- but nothing has been so difficult as to shaping the future of beast races in games.

Why? Because they have had to take that step back for a long time, they were often given the shortest straw- left over rigs, reskinned skeletons, because its cheaper that way- More people play humans and elves- so they always get more attention. Sexy beast race is the most often used cop-out when it comes to games, because they are most often created last- and its the easy, lazy, and cheap thing to do.

The fight to get something like charr was hard, hard fought. Between Furry fear mongering and people that didn’t want to give up having a “sexy” character it has been slow going.

The Term Furry even, is extremely dirty to a lot of people, almost to the par of the word gay- some people will gladly adopt it, and embrace it, but when you refer to things as gay, or furry- its usually done as a means to be offensive- or hurtful, not a classification.

Our fear isn’t so shallow that were afraid of being called a furry because we play a beast race, we’ve all been there, we’re over it- it’s that slippery slope. We are afraid that things will simply revert to as they used to be, because developers will think it’s ok. Don’t get me wrong- I’m open to there being feminine town clothes for charr- because well gemstore stuff is an exception- its something that was made for the sake of defying lore, and being silly. I just don’t want to see it spill out any more then it has to.

Since when does feminine=boobilicious? I mean goodness, someone states they want a little style and instantly that means we’re going to go full DD-cup furries? Calm yourselves please. Like I stated previously, I like the current armor we have, and I made very pretty/feminine (COME AT ME I SAID IT) charr with what I had to work with, and they’ll still kick your kitten if you mess with them. Is it so wrong I didn’t want to look like brutes? A little variety isn’t bad, I mean if you’re arguing that “It’s against the lore” I implore you to look at half the armor in the light category and tell me just how much goes with the lore. I see charr wearing a frilly flower dress (TA armor) in ALL the lore stories. (Sarcasm at it’s finest)

Leia Spiritrose and her warband partner Karra Bloodrose everybody. Showing the world you can be beautiful and classy all at the same time. (Oh and Karra’s loyal devourer Lillith, she’s beautiful too.)

WhiteRose.6934:

Since when does feminine=boobilicious? I mean goodness, someone states they want a little style and instantly that means we’re going to go full DD-cup furries? Calm yourselves please. Like I stated previously, I like the current armor we have, and I made very pretty/feminine (COME AT ME I SAID IT) charr with what I had to work with, and they’ll still kick your kitten if you mess with them. Is it so wrong I didn’t want to look like brutes? A little variety isn’t bad, I mean if you’re arguing that “It’s against the lore” I implore you to look at half the armor in the light category and tell me just how much goes with the lore. I see charr wearing a frilly flower dress (TA armor) in ALL the lore stories. (Sarcasm at it’s finest)

Leia Spiritrose and her warband partner Karra Bloodrose everybody. Showing the world you can be beautiful and classy all at the same time. (Oh and Karra’s loyal devourer Lillith, she’s beautiful too.)

And that’s fine because guys can get that same armor. There are people who play male Charr who would want something sleeker or more “feminine” as well and actually like what your Charr looks like btw. Not what I’m going for with mine but it’s nice.

If it’s big “kitten off” set of armor of it should remain so on both genders and likewise for more feminine stuff. I don’t want to be in situation again with an mmo where I have to reroll as a guy or miss out on being able to use most the options I like. Especially with Charr are concerned because anatomy isn’t an issue and yes “lore wise” gender is not really a factor for them so why should it be with armor? The fact they don’t separate out genders is one of the things I like about the race and it’s reinforced by having the same armor for both.

That’s said people do need to stop jumping on" feminine armor" as boob armor and sexy beast race. I get why since this is a common and irritating issue but it’s pretty safe to say that is not going to happen with the Charr. At worst you’ll get stuck with skirts and frills.

WhiteRose.6934:

Since when does feminine=boobilicious? I mean goodness, someone states they want a little style and instantly that means we’re going to go full DD-cup furries? Calm yourselves please. Like I stated previously, I like the current armor we have, and I made very pretty/feminine (COME AT ME I SAID IT) charr with what I had to work with, and they’ll still kick your kitten if you mess with them. Is it so wrong I didn’t want to look like brutes? A little variety isn’t bad, I mean if you’re arguing that “It’s against the lore” I implore you to look at half the armor in the light category and tell me just how much goes with the lore. I see charr wearing a frilly flower dress (TA armor) in ALL the lore stories. (Sarcasm at it’s finest)

Leia Spiritrose and her warband partner Karra Bloodrose everybody. Showing the world you can be beautiful and classy all at the same time. (Oh and Karra’s loyal devourer Lillith, she’s beautiful too.)

They’ve given me such a hard time on the previous page and I wasn’t asking for much. However I think that’s why FenGuild said furrie community overall is frowned upon because one little idea such as feminine armor for female charr and asura is cataclysmic to their minds. I’m thinking patterns while they’re thinking sexual stuff which tells you where their minds are at. Then they use lore as the excuse..I mean what about the charrs living in the diverse city Lion’s Arch. Sooner or later they’ll follow the trend on who wears what, but its always an optional choice for them.

@ Frayta

I don’t think FenGuild was using the furrie term in a offensive way nor is it overall. He probably think it’s absurd on how people come with a reason why this cannot have that because it doesn’t fit their view. Then uses words as * our * or * we * as if they talking for the whole furrie community.

He isn’t a furrie, but if he was…. he’ll probably lose interest in it quick if he had to deal with this type of resistance on a small idea and then gets criticize about it.

Brutalistik.6473:

WhiteRose.6934:

Since when does feminine=boobilicious? I mean goodness, someone states they want a little style and instantly that means we’re going to go full DD-cup furries? Calm yourselves please. Like I stated previously, I like the current armor we have, and I made very pretty/feminine (COME AT ME I SAID IT) charr with what I had to work with, and they’ll still kick your kitten if you mess with them. Is it so wrong I didn’t want to look like brutes? A little variety isn’t bad, I mean if you’re arguing that “It’s against the lore” I implore you to look at half the armor in the light category and tell me just how much goes with the lore. I see charr wearing a frilly flower dress (TA armor) in ALL the lore stories. (Sarcasm at it’s finest)

Leia Spiritrose and her warband partner Karra Bloodrose everybody. Showing the world you can be beautiful and classy all at the same time. (Oh and Karra’s loyal devourer Lillith, she’s beautiful too.)

They’ve given me such a hard time on the previous page and I wasn’t asking for much. However I think that’s why FenGuild said furrie community overall is frowned upon because one little idea such as feminine armor for female charr and asura is cataclysmic to their minds. I’m thinking patterns while they’re thinking sexual stuff which tells you where their minds are at. Then they use lore as the excuse..I mean what about the charrs living in the diverse city Lion’s Arch. Sooner or later they’ll follow the trend on who wears what, but its always an optional choice for them.

@ Frayta

I don’t think FenGuild was using the furrie term in a offensive way nor is it overall. He probably think it’s absurd on how people come with a reason why this cannot have that because it doesn’t fit their view. Then uses words as * our * or * we * as if they talking for the whole furrie community.

He isn’t a furrie, but if he was…. he’ll probably lose interest in it quick if he had to deal with this type of resistance on a small idea and then gets criticize about it.

You know it’s hard to tell on the internet when it comes to context- Its some something I have to say at times, not just toward him- but generally speaking- its a volatile word that shouldn’t be used unless it has to be- there are so many different opinions of what is furry, none of them are standard- Personally I follow the thinking that beast races come in 3 major classifications Were, Anthro, and furry- the last being mascot like, or pertaining to fur suit aesthetic.

As for just a generally tamer, softer armor for charr- I’m ok with that too, as long as it isn’t dimorphic like someone else suggested. Female charr don’t have breasts- so were sort of safe from ‘versioning’ But it is that lore that gives reason for female armor to hold little to no difference to the males. When I throw some pants on my charr- I expect pants, and skirt to skirt. Ironically this means the devs actually have less work when making armor for charr, because they don’t have to map out a female version.

It’s difficult to place the word feminine when it comes to armor, and general fashion. Let us say a man and woman are wearing the same clothes- the only defining difference then is how they choose to wear them-obviously anatomy has a lot of influence on this- but when we are on equal playing fields, its harder for us to say what still makes her version feminine, other then the fact she is female.

Brutalistik.6473:

They’ve given me such a hard time on the previous page and I wasn’t asking for much. However I think that’s why FenGuild said furrie community overall is frowned upon because one little idea such as feminine armor for female charr and asura is cataclysmic to their minds.

Actually, you were “asking for much”, and it is not a “little idea”. Would you consider it a little thing if the reverse happened to the other species and all their gear was made to look the same on men and women?

If gendered armor was forced on this species, too, it would destroy a huge part of the charr appeal, that being the fact that a charr is a charr. Plumbing does not matter. Unlike humans, norn and sylvari, where equality is also part of the lore but not of the gear design, there is no such disconnect with this species. And that is tremendously refreshing.

I want to play a character. Not a “girl character”.
I want to play a hero. Not a “girl hero”.
I want to play a warrior. Not a “girl warrior”.
I want to wear armor. Not “girl armor”.

I do not want to be “othered” by constant reminders of the fact that my characters are female while male characters are considered the default. I do not want to have someone else’s idea of stifling gender stereotypes forced on my characters. I do not want to lose access to sweet armor designs because someone decided that my characters must wear “girl armor” instead.

The issue, as has been pointed out, is that gendered armor does not give us a choice. No one objects to a greater variety of armor styles, as long as it applies to both genders equally. Hell, I certainly wouldn’t mind some armors for charr that show more fur, because fur color and pattern are such a big part of charr character design that it’s a shame they’re barely visible. But I do want to choose whether I go for fully-covering versus less-covering, plain versus ornate, practical versus fanciful. Only playing a charr really gives me that choice. (Okay, there’s the asura — but I hate pretty much everything about them so they don’t count in my book. :p)

Chadramar.8156:

Actually, you were “asking for much”, and it is not a “little idea”. Would you consider it a little thing if the reverse happened to the other species and all their gear was made to look the same on men and women?

Yes because all I was asking was armor changes and not a re modification of a race.

Chadramar.8156:

I want to play a character. Not a “girl character”.
I want to play a hero. Not a “girl hero”.
I want to play a warrior. Not a “girl warrior”.
I want to wear armor. Not “girl armor”.

So don’t play a female character and that solves your problem. If you can’t do that you’re only contradicting yourself. I play a girl charr warrior hero that wears girl armor skirt though it’s like a roman skirt. I guess that makes it a man armor skirt.

Chadramar.8156:

I do not want to be “othered” by constant reminders of the fact that my characters are female while male characters are considered the default. I do not want to have someone else’s idea of stifling gender stereotypes forced on my characters. I do not want to lose access to sweet armor designs because someone decided that my characters must wear “girl armor” instead.

The issue, as has been pointed out, is that gendered armor does not give us a choice. No one objects to a greater variety of armor styles, as long as it applies to both genders equally. Hell, I certainly wouldn’t mind some armors for charr that show more fur, because fur color and pattern are such a big part of charr character design that it’s a shame they’re barely visible. But I do want to choose whether I go for fully-covering versus less-covering, plain versus ornate, practical versus fanciful. Only playing a charr really gives me that choice. (Okay, there’s the asura — but I hate pretty much everything about them so they don’t count in my book. :p)

Yeah I get it like most of you guys in this thread don’t want their * precious female charrs to be different * ignoring the fact I said it’s an optional choice if you want to wear the other armor.

I’m sorry that I don’t have that defensive insight you guys have, because I’m the type that likes to add more stuff to game to make it fun and creative.

Back on topic..that’s probably we do not see many charr representation in the game especially the females which are a myth.

Brutalistik.6473:

Yes because all I was asking was armor changes and not a re modification of a race.

Wrong. It would be exactly the same thing: a complete change in gear design for the female characters.

Chadramar.8156:

I want to play a character. Not a “girl character”.
I want to play a hero. Not a “girl hero”.
I want to play a warrior. Not a “girl warrior”.
I want to wear armor. Not “girl armor”.

So don’t play a female character and that solves your problem.

Thank you for proving my point. Notice what I specifically did not write? “I want to play a boy character. Not a girl character.” You’re basically saying that being male is the default, and that being female is something “other” that should be separate, that needs attention drawn to it if there is to be any point to it. That is exactly what I do NOT want. I want to play characters who happen to be female, not characters who are defined by being female (and not even defined by me, but by someone else, in ways I do not agree or identify with).

I’m sorry that I don’t have that defensive insight you guys have, because I’m the type that likes to add more stuff to game to make it fun and creative.

So why not join us in calling for more armor style choices for ALL charr (and all other species)? There’s no less creativity in that on the design front — and more creativity for the players since we’d all have more options overall. Gendered armor does not actually “add” anything because it cuts your pool for gear choice in half from the start.

If they fix how the charrzooka looks and is being held as it was shown on the amazing artwork. If they do that, watch as at least 35-40% ppl reroll to charr.

I really think there would be a larger percentage willing to play charr if ArenaNet would fix the problems with armor on them.

When I had first started the game, I had pretty much once of each race. I was about to make a guardian and had been set on sylvari at the time until I took a look at charr. I really liked the idea of having one and thus my charrdian was born.

I had a great time on him, got him to 80 and was ready to start making an outfit for him. A lot of my guildmates had great looking guardians, I wanted something just like they had, a nice outfit in line with my ideas of the profession. But as I went through the heavy armor for charr, I was completely disappointed. Nothing truly felt epic enough, outside of the racial armors.

It was actually a lack of customization for my poor charrdian that I ended up deleting him.

I really want a charr, but Anet’s strange choice to remove horns or make strange massive floating shoulders, or big stretchy pieces of plate drove me away from having one. Now I’m back in this same hole again because I think the female charr sound awesome (fantastic VA, love it for ele), but the armor I’m seeing has many problems which ruins the perfect outfit. It doesn’t seem as bad when it comes to light/medium, but there’s still issues.

I would really love to see Anet gradually fix charr armor.

Charr armor needs an overhaul. Charr anatomy does not. I like the fact that my female Charr is anatomically distinctive, different from the usual “Barbie doll with a different head” fantasy chick mold that Star Trek created and most RPG’s have followed. It’s also fun roleplaying an independent-minded female in a society where females are still at least slightly looked down on; chip on shoulder, check.

If you guys want you can check my topic! Its about Charr issues (armor, physics and the lack of attention the Charr gets) https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/We-Charr-Demand-For-More-Attention/first

I really want to play a Charr, but i’ve failed multiple times already, every Charr character i made can’t get pass lv4….

My issue is not with the armor clipping issue yet… its the running animation, i hate being the only Charr that run around with 4 legs “slowly” when every npc is running in 2 legs….

Also i hate the body type, why don’t we got a more humanoid body shape like GW1 Charr?

So i guess the armor issue will eventually bugged me out later as well….

I have made an attempt at a survey. It’s in two parts, about 20 questions covering all races.

Part 1: http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/P9QGGGL
Part 2: http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/P9Q2J86

If you like the survey, feel free to share it. Or, if someone knows of a better site (was only allowed 10 questions per as a free account) or is better at making surveys, feel free to say.

Crossaber.8934:

I really want to play a Charr, but i’ve failed multiple times already, every Charr character i made can’t get pass lv4….
My issue is not with the armor clipping issue yet… its the running animation, i hate being the only Charr that run around with 4 legs “slowly” when every npc is running in 2 legs….

Run with a weapon drawn, or using a kit as an Engineer. They run upright all the time that way.

Also i hate the body type, why don’t we got a more humanoid body shape like GW1 Charr?

Why should they? They aren’t humans in furry suits. They’re Charr, a unique blend of animal traits in a vaguely humanoid body. Posture is the least concern of all concerns about them.

So i guess the armor issue will eventually bugged me out later as well….

Hasn’t bugged me much so far. I’m too busy burning things to the ground with my Flamegineer.

Chadramar.8156:

Thank you for proving my point. Notice what I specifically did not write? “I want to play a boy character. Not a girl character.”

Well…actually, you kinda did.

Chadramar.8156:

I want to play a character. Not a “girl character”.
I want to play a hero. Not a “girl hero”.
I want to play a warrior. Not a “girl warrior”.
I want to wear armor. Not “girl armor”.

Well, half of it, at least. That could lead to some confusion on what you had meant.

Eddie Royale.9605:

Chadramar.8156:

Thank you for proving my point. Notice what I specifically did not write? “I want to play a boy character. Not a girl character.”

Well…actually, you kinda did.

Chadramar.8156:

I want to play a character. Not a “girl character”.
I want to play a hero. Not a “girl hero”.
I want to play a warrior. Not a “girl warrior”.
I want to wear armor. Not “girl armor”.

Well, half of it, at least. That could lead to some confusion on what you had meant.

Oh, and I did understand what you meant, you like that the female Charr armors aren’t feminine and instead of a design overhaul, you’re rather they add more armor so the people who want their cat ladies running around in chainmail bikinis with skirts can, while you keep your option of having normal gender neutral armor.
Just saying that your list could confuse people on what your mean due to the way you phrased it.

Eddie Royale.9605:

Oh, and I did understand what you meant, you like that the female Charr armors aren’t feminine and instead of a design overhaul, you’re rather they add more armor so the people who want their cat ladies running around in chainmail bikinis with skirts can, while you keep your option of having normal gender neutral armor.

You might want to visit Animal Lover’s Boutique (<- “You Don’t Know Jack” reference) if you’re looking for a bikini for a cat. Personally, that’s something I hope I NEVER see in GW2. I don’t need chainmail bikini’s to make the Charr complete.

Honestly, there are several female Charr that demonstrates being strong female presences in-game, and to add chainmail bikinis for them would be doing the Charr a disservice. One is a female in the crafting area bar in Black Citadel who tells a drunk male to back off and she isn’t interested, eventually having to threaten him with her sword. The other is one of the Ashford Fields SPs, where you fight her and she tells you “There, you learned something. Now go away.” I don’t feel she would be improved by adding chainmail bikinis.

Overall, I don’t see them as a wonderful expansion of the game world. I see them as cheapening and pandering to prepubescent children and adults clinging to being prepubescent children (perverts). The devs have taken the step of creating a unique and interesting gender-equal race. That’s more than enough. Hell, in this atmosphere of objectification of women that pervades the industry as a whole, the fact that a company created females in a game that don’t look like sex objects is not only laudable, but cause of celebration.

Drakkon.4782:

Eddie Royale.9605:

Oh, and I did understand what you meant, you like that the female Charr armors aren’t feminine and instead of a design overhaul, you’re rather they add more armor so the people who want their cat ladies running around in chainmail bikinis with skirts can, while you keep your option of having normal gender neutral armor.

You might want to visit Animal Lover’s Boutique (<- “You Don’t Know Jack” reference) if you’re looking for a bikini for a cat. Personally, that’s something I hope I NEVER see in GW2. I don’t need chainmail bikini’s to make the Charr complete.

Honestly, there are several female Charr that demonstrates being strong female presences in-game, and to add chainmail bikinis for them would be doing the Charr a disservice. One is a female in the crafting area bar in Black Citadel who tells a drunk male to back off and she isn’t interested, eventually having to threaten him with her sword. The other is one of the Ashford Fields SPs, where you fight her and she tells you “There, you learned something. Now go away.” I don’t feel she would be improved by adding chainmail bikinis.

Overall, I don’t see them as a wonderful expansion of the game world. I see them as cheapening and pandering to prepubescent children and adults clinging to being prepubescent children (perverts). The devs have taken the step of creating a unique and interesting gender-equal race. That’s more than enough. Hell, in this atmosphere of objectification of women that pervades the industry as a whole, the fact that a company created females in a game that don’t look like sex objects is not only laudable, but cause of celebration.

I agree that it is refreshing to see a game race where the female side isn’t objectified and all dolled up, but it would be nice to have a large variety of both masculine, gender neutral AND feminine armor for all the armor classes so that people can better choose how they want their Charr to look.

Yes, there are many strong female Charr, both physically and willfully, but even in a military culture like the Charr, where the vast majority of them are powerful, hulking soldiers, there’s bound to be individuals who would want to dress more femininely. I don’t see it as cheapening the Charr as a race so much as giving the option for people to dress diversely and realistically.

The chainmail bikini was only an exaggerated example seeing how it’s a common “Women’s” armor choice in most games, and I admit that it was a bad choice of an example. My bad. I feel as though I’m doing a horrible job of explaining what I mean, so sorry about that.

Eddie Royale.9605:

The chainmail bikini was only an exaggerated example seeing how it’s a common “Women’s” armor choice in most games, and I admit that it was a bad choice of an example. My bad. I feel as though I’m doing a horrible job of explaining what I mean, so sorry about that.

The problem with “feminine” armor for Charr is cultural. What is “feminine” to Charr? They don’t strike me as a race that sees any value whatsoever in “dainty”. Strength, prowess, and power mean things to them. How do you make that “feminine”?

The “Chainmail Bikini” is appropriate to the discussion, though, because it exemplifies everything wrong with how we treat women and the female image in general. It also exemplifies what is wrong with the concept of feminine armor for Charr. The “chainmail bikini” is not practical, not protective, and not attractive. Charr would seek to minimize their exposure, both visually and defensively. Skimpy clothing, low cut necklines, silky veils… None of these things say dominant military. I can’t see any Charr reaction to them except negative. And that’s the problem with trying to push our concepts of sexy on another culture, even a fictional one, where the basic premises are at odds with our own preconceptions. Not only will they look wrong on a Charr, but they will feel wrong.

I might go so far as to call them game breaking, because just seeing one would destroy any sense of immersion in the game world. Yes, we accept the “fun” things in the game because they’re fun and it is a game, but when you design things for the world that are supposed to be a part of it, and they aren’t, it causes a disjunction in perception. It throws you out of your game state and makes it hard to get back into it.