ascended materials (ore, scraps etc related)

ascended materials (ore, scraps etc related)

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Posted by: Jia Shen.4217

Jia Shen.4217

I might be a bit late to the realization and so this may have come up before. But I wanted to post in case it has not or has been too long since last. Material supply (drop rates) are out of sync with the required amounts for the ascended materials. What I mean is cloth, as a focus example, has gone too far to the extreme of lowered drop rates to the supply needed to make ascended cloth gear. This is obvious in the nearly doubling of the price on the trading post in less than 2 months from the 9 months steady prices. But the cost is really a side note to my reason for posting.

At one point in time each refined material needed 2 raw (ore, wood, cloth, leather). At some point this changed. I seem to recall the reasoning behind that was to adjust supply and demand without adjusting drop rates since the ones changed had a huge over supply. And now with ascended materials the increased need of raw materials per refined material is that much more. But then is this made even worse by the acended material recipes not being in sync with each other. Damask being the perfect example as it requires 100 bolts of silk (300 scraps) compared to deldrimore 50 mitril ingots (100 ore) and spiritwood 50 elder planks (150 wood).

I think given this large discrepency at the ascended level that it is time to rebalance crafting to standardize the material requirements to 2 raw materials (ore, wood, section, scrap) to 1 refined material (ingot, plank, bolt, square). And equalize the ascended to 50 (T5), 20 (T2), 10 (T3), 20 (T4) for all 3 types. And then adjust the drop rates as needed to correct the desired pricing. Since the pricing is all over the place and messed up except for ore which still appears to be long term steady. Except silver which has plumeted due to some unknow cause of a supply demand shift to 3 times the supply from 3 months ago.

I’m not sure what the desired pricing should be. Though it seems to me to make sense at ~50c T1 —-- ~75c T2 —-- ~1s T3 —-- ~1s50c T4 —-- ~2s T5 for the raw materials (ore, wood, scraps, and sections).

ascended materials (ore, scraps etc related)

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Posted by: Wanze.8410

Wanze.8410

No to recipe adjustments. I crafted 5 sets of ascended armor and about 20 weapons, i dont see why you should need less mats to craft the same.

Silver has nothing to do with ascended crafting as it is only used by jewellers, which cant craft ascended yet.

That the prices for t1-5 mats are out of sync is fine as well. Its supply and demand.
t4 mats are expensive because not many players are active in the mid level zones. This gives new players, which play in these zones more gold earnings from trading with endgame players.

Tin Foil [HATS]-Hardcore BLTC-PvP Guild
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ascended materials (ore, scraps etc related)

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Posted by: Mystic.5934

Mystic.5934

I like that it requires different amounts of materials to create the refined material.
I do not like that it requires different amounts of refined materials to create the ascended material (100 bolts of silk instead of 50).
I believe JS said a little while ago that he approves of the effect that increasing silk’s required amounts has had. It’s my guess that he would also like mithril and elder and thick to be in the 2s-3s range.

ascended materials (ore, scraps etc related)

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Posted by: Jia Shen.4217

Jia Shen.4217

Let me preface by saying I too have crafted a lot of ascended gear. The reason for the recipe adjustments is, because the original reason for the adjustment to increase the materials is no longer needed. We have in fact actually swung to the complete opposite end of the intended stable supply and demand as we were before the increase to the recipes. The reason for the silk requirement of 100 bolts is the same. To stabilize supply and demand. However they either intentionally or due to a bug now have the drop rates of cloth and leather materials way lower than they were just a couple weeks ago.

Putting that thought aside for a minute, ascended crafting has been out for a very long time now and the supply and demand was stable and prices were stable within a predictable small range for almost as long as ascended crafting has been out. Sudden decrease in supply without a relative same decrease in demand has thus caused the price of cloth materials to skyrocket. This cannot be intended since for a very long time now arenanet’s respective in charge of game economy have been on top of making sure prices, supply, and demand are relatively stable so as to not bottom out or skyrocket prices due to insane increase or decrease in supply.

The amount of materials is irrelevant to your costs to craft vs someone elses costs to craft if supply and demand remains relatively constant to maintain an established stable value range of the materials needed. So why does it matter if it costs say 50g to make a piece of armor but you had to buy lets say 600 materials and the other person had to buy 400 materials if you both spent 50g to get the materials. The change in requiring more materials in the recipes had the same effect and nobody clamored that it wasn’t fair that people before them got to make the stuff with less materials.

The prices I put in my post was just a relative example based on market stability for nearly the length of time ascended crafting has been out. I have been regularly selling materials during all this time and the market has remained very consistent and good for both the buyer and the seller. So if the desired pricing of T5 materials is to be in the 2-3s range that is fine. Because it is not what the prices should be that is the intended topic of this thread.

It is the needed adjustments of supply and or demand to relatively stabilize the market again. Previously they accomplished this by altering the recipes to increase the materials needed. But for cloth and leather there is a second factor to supply and demand, drop rates. Because their source is not a node players can get those materials out of. If any at all and how many are gotten is up to drop rates.

The reason for making the ascended recipes uniform (adjusting down to compensate for the over swing) is for better control of supply and demand. Since they can simply alter the drop rates to correct any future freakish swing to one end or the other of supply due to game bug or unforeseen consequence of new or changed content. Even the rate of supply of wood and ore can be adjusted this way by altering the amount of them a node can give. They could uniform the ascended recipes up if they wanted to; and I would not have a problem with that as long as they adjusted the drop rates of the materials accordingly.

I gathered all of the materials I needed to make everything ascended that I made to date. And my realization was magnified when I integrated making cloth required ascended stuff and observed that I have suddenly got freakishly low drops of them (and remained freakishly low for weeks) from content I have been playing for months now and consistently got a predictable amount from for each hour I played.

ascended materials (ore, scraps etc related)

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Posted by: Zaxares.5419

Zaxares.5419

The editor in me would like to see the different materials and their requirements standardized, yes. It bugs me on a deep, visceral level that Silk requires 100 bolts while Leather, Wood and Metal all only require 50.

Since a reduction in the Silk requirement would also increase demand for other cloth tiers, we’d need to address it holistically by boosting cloth acquisition across the board, such as having cloth items salvage into 50% more scraps, and possibly by getting them as rare salvage from harvesting plant nodes too.

Little indiscrepencies like Soft Wood Logs requiring 4 logs to refine into 1 plank (when compared to 3 logs for all other tiers) should also be looked at. The change was needed back in the day when there was absolutely no need for Soft Wood Logs, but the introduction of Ascended gear changed that.

Finally, to help level price imbalances across the different tiers, I’d also like to see downgrade recipes introduced. Prices between Rugged and Thick Leather would equalise extremely quickly, for instance, (and between Gossamer and Silk) and this would flow on between all different tiers.