Guild Wars 2

I just want to add my appreciation for the wonderful story instance in this patch. There was some really good dialogue and backstory in there and we got a new main character to the Living Story!

This is definitely the kind of stuff I like to see in LS releases. I hope to see more in future ones!

2 things…..best story instance ever…..and also the updating living story panel on the top right made it that much better….optional talk to rox thing more of this well done ANET….now just give us instanced difficult content and I will throw all my money at that sexy gem store.

Just to be sure everyone know this. Dialogs (not voice ones) depend on your race. On my charr I could ask Rox about “It’s a char thing”, on my asura I could speak with Taimi about her background. I hope I’ll get invite to go home with Marj and Kasmeere when I come with my human female. wink wink

This instance was one reason why I logged in for the new release.
The other is Scarlet’s base.

I like the fact that Braham just can’t get the whole need for a warband. It does go to show how different Norn are to Charr. Whatever Rox chooses I hope for the best, and thank you Rytlock for giving a good motivation for killing that boring weed!

Jory and Kas, yes slight exposition dump but I’m glad the truth is finally out there.
Which in hindsight makes Lord Faren even more awesome that he didn’t judge her the way others did.

I too want to hunt down that minister and give him a thwacking. Please be Caudecus!

As for Taimi I’m glad she’s a child because the Jimmy Neutron voice on a girl seems strange. I know that’s ironic considering the voice actress is female, but every time she talked I wondered if she’s eventually going to hit Asuran puberty or not.

To be honest the most fun I’ve had in this update was this one instance. It made my day and practically gave me hope for future LW (LS) content.
Aside from that, waiting around for an hour at the time for 10-15 minutes of fun is well… not very engaging.

I guess this is the continuation of the story writers learning to edit game elements during the tower development.

Romo.3709:

To be honest the most fun I’ve had in this update was this one instance. It made my day and practically gave me hope for future LW (LS) content.
Aside from that, waiting around for an hour at the time for 10-15 minutes of fun is well… not very engaging.

Never mind the stomper grind to get on with the story…

Even though the waiting for the time gate was a hassle I have a bigger problem with the boss fights.
Sometimes they are “too busy” for us to actually look at the changes and art.

During the tower defense sequence on the puppet, all I did was focus on the trenches and zergs of bad guys. To be honest there could have been a giant puppet but it wouldn’t have mattered.

As for Wurms, when I’m replacing the toner on the Asuran printers to kill those things I can’t help but wonder where the platforms were.
Oh…wait…under the 5 Champion Husks who keep jumping up and down on them.

I luv it <3

Aedelric.1287

know we all said we wanted the lore in game and not on the website, but the Scarlet scribe is a fairly rubbish way of doing it. Go on. Go on. Go on.
.

It’s still better than nothing in-game! While written as a meh recap and pretty straightforward, at least it is in game and not on some random blog post, and it gives us information. So thanks for listening, Anet! This update, along with the Nightmare Ends, is probably the most they’ve given us in terms of the story since the release.

Had one issue with it. The new character Taimi rambles on about how Scarlet might be the good guy raising an army to fight the dragons. Since the damage is done, it’s be better removing her without infuriating the players even more, by making her Trahearne 2.0.

And yes, the instance conversations are repeatable.

BobbyStein.2315:

Thanks for the thoughtful comments and honest criticisms regarding the story instance. We tried something new this time by putting a lot of character moments into a single area, but also by allowing folks to advance their LW progress while making the scenes available as optional story bits. We realize that for some players who haven’t met these characters before, there was a lot of “catching up” to do, but we hope you found it entertaining. The fact that many of you are speculating about where these characters are headed in the future makes me smile. Thanks for that.

You guys really knocked it out of the park this time! Keep up the good work.

MacKela.7024:

My main problem with the story instance (and the whole living story arc for that matter) is how disconnected my character feels to the overall plot. I’m just that guardian they call when they need additional muscle and nothing more. It’s getting tiring to be honest.

I feel the opposite. Especially after this story instance we are talking about.

After watching the short little scenes and then conversing with the team, they all act as a teammate towards you the player. Braham and Rox especially.

I enjoyed this. Kudos to ANET.

I enjoyed the instance, but it also showcases the trap GW2 has worked itself into.

All of these incredible world shaking events… and my character is struck mute.

It’s all massively important… just not important enough to get the hero voice-actors back into the studio to record dialogue for the players.

Please, review all the heroic dialogue you have recorded, and try to at least scavenge a word or two for us to say aloud in response to the events going on around us.

I too really loved the conversation story instance in LA, it was the highlight of this patch. I would love to see more of them scatter throughout the living story in the future.

MacKela.7024:

My main problem with the story instance (and the whole living story arc for that matter) is how disconnected my character feels to the overall plot. I’m just that guardian they call when they need additional muscle and nothing more. It’s getting tiring to be honest.

Seems a few people feel this way, and I can see where you’re coming from but I can also understand why they have decided to use other characters to drive the plot.

I’m curious, how would you have structured the living story to prevent this feeling of being a sell-sword?

I really loved the instance in LA. There was quite a bit of character development and Taimi seems like an interesting character. These characters really work well with each other.

(And, growing up in a family with a lot of debts I really feel for Kasmeer now)

I feel like the last 2 story instances. (fall of the tower, and LA) are steps in the right direction. I enjoyed the short stories posted on the webpage but it’s better to get most of this information and lore in game. Idol conversations and the ability to chat with the NPCs is refreshing I thought.

edit: While I did like and enjoy this I still feel like the story is moving rather slowly. Perhaps I am too used to being able to go and do my own story as much as I want. A couple of conversations were nice, but it still feels lacking overall.

Chidori.9483:

I’m curious, how would you have structured the living story to prevent this feeling of being a sell-sword?

I don’t really have an answer for this, even though I’ve stated many times I’m very disappointed of this direction where the story gets ran by the NPC’s and I’m more or less an errand boy. Maybe we could call the shots instead of them? “Okay hero, how should we do this?” – “Braham, you go there, Rox goes there, Kasmeer puts some real clothes on instead of an illusion and Logan jumps off a bridge. Go!” would be a good start.

Let me take an example from LoTRO. There you always were in the shadows, following the footsteps of the Fellowship and other big name hitters. And it’s understandable. It had a good storyline where you got to do heroic stuff and help out the Fellowship, like diverting an orc attack so they could escape. I could accept something like that in GW2 if we were playing second fiddle to someone like Rytlock. But instead we have some NPC’s we never heard before promoted to basically running the show and ordering us around. It doesn’t help that IMO all the new NPC’s are like cardboard cutouts and offer nothing interesting to grab on to. I get that they were trying to make us feel symphathetic towards Kasmeer with her little story, but it was just too much, too forced. Subtlety is the key again, here.

(Here’s a few good examples GW2 writing staff has come up with when it comes to interesting NPC’s: Malyck & Tybalt.)

Am I taking it too seriously or just unrealistically? You tell me. I just would like to be the hero in my own story, game limitations withholding.

They should call you commander

Barsimoprimo.2759:

They should call you commander

You can call me Al.

Delvoire.8930:

Barsimoprimo.2759:

They should call you commander

You can call me Al.

I prefer Colonel Sanders. /referencejoke

I loved the new story instance. This, the conversations at the camp in Kessex Hills and the Deadend instance has gone a huge way with connecting me with the characters. When I play the game, they -feel- as my friends and allies and I’m certainly starting to care for them.

Great job, Anet! ^^

Traveller.7496:

Chidori.9483:

I’m curious, how would you have structured the living story to prevent this feeling of being a sell-sword?

I don’t really have an answer for this, even though I’ve stated many times I’m very disappointed of this direction where the story gets ran by the NPC’s and I’m more or less an errand boy. Maybe we could call the shots instead of them? “Okay hero, how should we do this?” – “Braham, you go there, Rox goes there, Kasmeer puts some real clothes on instead of an illusion and Logan jumps off a bridge. Go!” would be a good start.

Let me take an example from LoTRO. There you always were in the shadows, following the footsteps of the Fellowship and other big name hitters. And it’s understandable. It had a good storyline where you got to do heroic stuff and help out the Fellowship, like diverting an orc attack so they could escape. I could accept something like that in GW2 if we were playing second fiddle to someone like Rytlock. But instead we have some NPC’s we never heard before promoted to basically running the show and ordering us around. It doesn’t help that IMO all the new NPC’s are like cardboard cutouts and offer nothing interesting to grab on to. I get that they were trying to make us feel symphathetic towards Kasmeer with her little story, but it was just too much, too forced. Subtlety is the key again, here.

That’s something I don’t like about the new team (that’s not to say there aren’t a lot of things to like about them). I was doing the marionette event and thinking to myself “It’s so cool that these NPCs are fighting on the battlefield with us, I like that” but then I thought about it again. Why, of all the people in Tyria are these five characters the ones protecting these five lanes (along with the players)? Why not Destiny’s Edge? Why not one of the orders (we are a 10 minute walk from the Priory HQ) or the Pact? Not one of them you would expect to see in that scenario (aside from Taimi because her role was literally an out place child), at least not as the sole NPC (compare that to Rox during Tequatl, she was present but she didn’t replace the appropriate Vigil forces). Scarlet is a threat. That was a giant laser weapon. Why are only these five people taking action?

Chidori.9483:

Seems a few people feel this way, and I can see where you’re coming from but I can also understand why they have decided to use other characters to drive the plot.

I don’t think they do drive the plot beyond their initial appearances (Rox and Braham during Flame and Frost, Marjory during Dragonbash, Kasmeer gets an honourable mention for removing the mesmer illusion). They seem incidental to the story. You could take every single one of them out of the story and it would make as much sense (replace them with event specific characters and it might make more sense). Take Kasmeer and Marjoy’s scene in the instance as an example. How would the plot be any different if it never happened? They are likeable characters but I don’t think they are doing anything for the plot.

CaptainVanguard.4925:

My ten cents?

Kasmeer’s story gave me enough feels to nearly cry a river, even if it wasn’t related it was kitten dark and tragic, and finally we get to know “who” these people are, you know what, I’m happy I got to hear that.

Also the new Asura char, loving it already.

Taimi for the win.

If people get picky about A-net actually “trying” to do good voice acting over Treesus god awful lack of it, then seriously, look in the mirror and ask yourself who are you to judge.

This was effort, not the best, not the worst, but when it came to Kasmeer talking about her back story to Marjory, that, was moving.

Taimi with Braham? Cute, adorable, funny, I liked it.

Its acting people, criticize it all you want but they are ‘trying’ even if it could still improve.

Also, id rather they over-acted, than didn’t at all, again, I remind you of Treesus wonderfully monotone voice and how little he actually said ANYTHING with feeling other than sounding like the freaking type vocal from the Microsoft word document.

Kasmeer overacting? Good, I want more overacting, I want as much overacting as A-net can throw because if its as good as that performance was then we need “more” of it.

So agree with all of the above. Kasmeer’s story was well acted, imo. It seemed a little out of nowhere, but the acting itself was what really moved me. Honestly, it’s one of the major times I can remember making an emotional connection with one of these characters. I expected to hate Kasmeer but I really love her and want to protect her as much as Marjory does. The story was good, too; it’s nice that she has some backstory and that Farren still chases her around after the other nobles supposedly shun her makes me like the scamp even more. Afterward, the first thing I said was, “Eff these random jungle wurms: Where is your jerk brother so I can give him a permanent imprint of MY FIST IN HIS FACE?”

You just can’t win. Trahearne, a more stoic and private character overall, is acted accordingly and gets called emotionless. Kasmeer, a more extroverted character telling some of her tragic backstory, gets criticized for overacting. Haters gonna hate.

To piggyback on Kimeekat, I also see this:

“God, Trahearne gets all the credit! I’m the hero! Why don’t I get treated like it!”

“UGH why aren’t there more people attacking the marionette? Where’s Destiny’s Edge? And the Pact? Why don’t they see her as a threat?”

If you fight as a team, it means sharing credit. So you can either 1) have little involvement from iconic/biconic/Order characters and be the hero or 2) you can be part of a team and share credit. You can’t have both.

I came in to say that not only have I loved the instance, but I especially loved Kasmeer’s part.

The only issue I have with it, is that I didn’t know when the instance ended, so was relutant to leave it.

Now that I’ve seen it, I absolutely loved the instance – and the new Asura Character. Asura ftw!

The scenes between Rox and Braham and Majory and Kasmeer in particular were very sweet

Much loooove for the new story instance! I liked the dramatic bit! It feels like especially in recent patches (I loved the instanced bit with the Seraph at the start of Kessex tower release as well), many character dialogues are written in a more believable way.

And somehow, even though I’m not a fan of Scarlet, for the first time since her initial appearance she seemed a bit more like a real threat instead of a random zany joker wannabe, so that’s well done from my perspective.

Now for the future I hope to see some more on Logan’s character, since he has so many potential character elements to make him a much needed stalwart human hero.
But this instance, he ran away before I could talk to him! The irony! :P

My only issue was the weird 4 element thing, because it honestly made little to no sense or had horribly loose tie ins; Flame legion was fine, dredge as “earth elementals” seems poor in the area that wants to be conveyed as they work with sound tech as importance, referencing their mines or ability to would have said the message better, the creation of the air ships seems off as originally mentioned as being stolen from the pact and the toxic alliance isn’t really water as their toxin is more air based than water in its distribution – here’s hoping it’ll at least seem clear in the next 3 parts

In her Lair there is a pic of the thumpers sending shockwaves, or soundwaves (probably shock) towards an Orb (probably Tyria’s Core).

In the drawing the core is sending waves back to the surface. My guess is that she’s trying to cause all sorts of earth quakes. Might be why there is a broken gate?

Paul Belz.7351:

Hey guys,

You must participate in the marionette encounter in order to progress to the step where you go to LA. You do not have to WIN the fight, only participate. Once you participated that step should go away.

How are we supposed to know this?! A mail update would have been nice. Our personal story progress always stands out and shows our toon where to go next and what to do….something the living stories seem to forget to add. You guys see the big picture and have a clear progression in your heads, but we as players (for the most part) are running around like head-less moas. If it wasn’t for Dulfy, I would have given up on a few living story metas by now. We should not have to go to Dulfy to figure out what to do, where to go, and what a meta achievement requires. This should be better communicated somehow…maybe similar to the personal story progressions? Please continue to work on this aspect.

Holy Whirlwind.2067:

Paul Belz.7351:

Hey guys,

You must participate in the marionette encounter in order to progress to the step where you go to LA. You do not have to WIN the fight, only participate. Once you participated that step should go away.

How are we supposed to know this?! A mail update would have been nice. Our personal story progress always stands out and shows our toon where to go next and what to do….something the living stories seem to forget to add. You guys see the big picture and have a clear progression in your heads, but we as players (for the most part) are running around like head-less moas. If it wasn’t for Dulfy, I would have given up on a few living story metas by now. We should not have to go to Dulfy to figure out what to do, where to go, and what a meta achievement requires. This should be better communicated somehow…maybe similar to the personal story progressions? Please continue to work on this aspect.

Well to be fair if you looked at your Living Story UI it tells you. When you start there are three Living Story Points of Interest in ascending order. First is the Marionette. Second is escorting the Vigil for the Wurm. Third and last is heading to LA to meet with some friends. After that, all is left to do is hunt down Scarlet’s Secret Lair.

I will commend ANET on the story instance this time. Finally, we’re seeing some actual storytelling with character development. Hopefully this keeps up.

However, the way to these instances still feels disconnected. A single pointer in the upper right side of your screen telling you to go to Lornar’s Pass is just not enough. I want to see cutscenes with the Orders giving out commands and strategies to the players to go out and aid Marjory and the others in Lornar’s Pass. I want to hear them discuss HOW they obtained information that Scarlet is going to fly over Lornar’s Pass exactly this week.

“Go to this waypoint” is not enough for me.

Delvoire.8930

Well to be fair if you looked at your Living Story UI it tells you. When you start there are three Living Story Points of Interest in ascending order. First is the Marionette. Second is escorting the Vigil for the Wurm. Third and last is heading to LA to meet with some friends. After that, all is left to do is hunt down Scarlet’s Secret Lair.

Where do I find this? The only thing I got was a letter and for some reason it only shows on the first toon that opened it? I can’t find it on my main toon. The HUD on the right side of my screen only shows my daily and monthly achievements.

Well, I for one did enjoy the instance but mostly for the fact that there was voice acting in the conversations. But while the limitations of the player character, as mentioned before, are understandable it still gave me a slight feeling of being some random goofy eavesdropping them. While there are players who haven’t been on the past living stories I still think they should treat you like you had been in the battles somehow, or in some other way recognize the player character. If just to give the feeling of being part in the whole thing since to me it seemed rather cold that they didn’t really greet you on approach. Or then I just missed it.

Am thinking of perhaps using the non-used character personality system, the militant, charming, etc, thing here, give a few options how to approach the… whatever it is atm… militant disposition could give some sort of: Let’s gather up and plan something. Or, brute I think it’s called, could just: Let’s go for it and decide tactics later. Or something. On a side note, Rox and Braham conversation gave me an odd feeling like there’s something more, intimate, than just friendship between them… naah… that can’t be right.

cheshirefox.7026:

so marj + kas could sit on the beach together? rolls eyes

I’m glad I’m not the only one that thought this when I saw the two together… it seemed so cliche. Lets get all the main players and have them discuss Scarlet on the beach. Weird.

Also I listened to the conversation hoping that the story may develop but it just seemed like a lot of unimportant background info which I guess is ok. So Kasmeer had a dad in jail, knowing this didn’t really explain Kasmeers actions or her personality, the whole story seemed out of place.

Tami does interest me. She seems like a 4yr old genius with the ability to toy with peoples minds.

I have to say that i loved this. Finally a lot of information, and a lot of progression. IN GAME.
Nicely done in my opinion. keep it that way.

I only missed Logan, i expected him to stop at some point but he run away and i couldn’t talk to him.

Yeah well done anet, the story instance was brilliant. Take it from someone who missed the first half of this season of living world, i know feel some connection to these characters and actually understand them a bit more.

Perfect.

Edit: Progression is tied to each character.

For some reason, even after doing both events I can’t get acces to the instance =/

The conversations are great but I felt like I was eavesdropping. Then I clicked on Braham and he called me his friend, and it was one of the most bizarre feelings I experienced in GW2. I’ve hated on the 2D conversations from the personal story a lot, but at least they include you.

Rox and Braham- This time they showed a bit emotions but it was more like Rox wanted her new warband and trying to please Rytlock and having Braham remind her of her true friends and not some fancy warband

Taimi and Braham- I can see something going on more like comedy duo maybe if Rox changes her mind her and Braham can adopt Taimi?

Marjory and Kasmeer- oh boy that is kind of a bit drama there so is Kasmeer going to move in with Marjory?

Rytlock and Logan- Was they ignoring each other? no conversation at all

I have to say it was alright

Holy Whirlwind.2067:

Delvoire.8930

Well to be fair if you looked at your Living Story UI it tells you. When you start there are three Living Story Points of Interest in ascending order. First is the Marionette. Second is escorting the Vigil for the Wurm. Third and last is heading to LA to meet with some friends. After that, all is left to do is hunt down Scarlet’s Secret Lair.

Where do I find this? The only thing I got was a letter and for some reason it only shows on the first toon that opened it? I can’t find it on my main toon. The HUD on the right side of my screen only shows my daily and monthly achievements.

I can’t seem to find if it’s an option but mine do show up on the right. I have Personal Story (Green Star) Living Story (Gold Star) and then Daily Achievements (Purple)

I thought I remember setting what showed up there and what didn’t. I can’t find that again though.

Yeah, I think this was very well-written with an emotional grab and humor in good taste and all of which I didn’t find much in the storytelling up until now. So please keep up the good work!

Not sure if spoiler tag is required, but o well.

About Kasmeer and Marjory

Regardless, Anet, you guys have outdone yourselves. While Boss fights are ok and everything, the story is finally there! The story is finally connecting us to the characters on a level that we thought we’ll never get from Living Story. I know that your fans give you hard time now and then, but when you give us something like the LA story instance… It… That… Thank you. That’s all that really needs to be said. No boss fight or dungeon would make it any better than that small little area in LA with lore practically leaking out of it! Thank You!

I also want to say how much I appreciated the story instance. It was great just to stand there and listen to the characters. The voice overs are great and so are the dialogs. I didn’t really care about any of those people before. Rox, Marjory and Kasmeer were just some NPCs that helped me to inject the final dose of venom for example. But now they really got a story, a personality.
BTW, Peneloopee and Bloomanoo are quite cuddly as well.

I really enjoyed this instance. It is probably the highlight of the update for me. I liked the development of the characters and the refinement of the scene interaction mechanic. Taimi made a really memorable introduction and I was really intrigued by the twist with the relationship of Rox and Braham. I laughed to see Frostbite burrow and hide when Braham came up. Majory and Kasmeer’s scene was poignant and well done. The whole instance was great and I really want to see more story and lore delivered this way.

Only ArenaNet needs to communicate with their customers and tell people about it.

I have friends who have been logging on far more than I have and I they knew nothing about this instance. I have seen forum posts from other players saying the same thing. I only learned about it because I stumbled across a post here on the forums and then I had to look it up in the wiki to figure out where it was. An icon on the LA map UI and the text buried in the UI is not a decent way to communicate this the players.

It is aggravating to think there are people who may completely miss this great piece of the story because ArenaNet isn’t using the in-game mail system that they have spent months training their customers to expect to see.

The icon on the LA map is not enough nor is some text in the corner or buried in the LS UI. It’s good to try to show the instance is accessible in different ways but not when you miss the biggest and most obvious method of the in-game mail. ArenaNet please, make a patch and send an in-game mail to people so they can be sure to be made aware of this instance.

Hey guys, You must participate in the marionette encounter in order to progress to the step where you go to LA. You do not have to WIN the fight, only participate. Once you participated that step should go away.

I am not sure why this was done, it seems to have contributed to the confusion and inability of people to know about the instance. It is not a very onerous gate, but it is still a gate to this story/lore scene and the resulting confusion with people missing it is an example why any gating of lore should really be avoided.

In the future, I think ArenaNet would be better served avoiding making their lore dependent on players doing an event, or a puzzle, or a boss, or jumping up and down for 5 mins or some other condition. If you just can’t get away from the old-school attitude of gating lore, then please, at least clearly communicate with players about how they can see it.

TLDR: Loved the story instance but ArenaNet needs to tell ppl about it with in-game mail.

DoctorOverlord.8620:

I really enjoyed this instance. It is probably the highlight of the update for me. I liked the development of the characters and the refinement of the scene interaction mechanic. Taimi made a really memorable introduction and I was really intrigued by the twist with the relationship of Rox and Braham. I laughed to see Frostbite burrow and hide when Braham came up. Majory and Kasmeer’s scene was poignant and well done. The whole instance was great and I really want to see more story and lore delivered this way.

Only ArenaNet needs to communicate with their customers and tell people about it.

I have friends who have been logging on far more than I have and I they knew nothing about this instance. I have seen forum posts from other players saying the same thing. It is aggravating to think there are people who may completely miss this great piece of the story because ArenaNet isn’t using the in-game mail system that they have spent months training their customers to expect to see.

The icon on the LA map is not enough nor is an update of some text in the corner of the UI. ArenaNet please, make a patch and send an in-game mail to people so they can be sure to be made aware of this instance.

Hey guys, You must participate in the marionette encounter in order to progress to the step where you go to LA. You do not have to WIN the fight, only participate. Once you participated that step should go away.

I am not sure why this was done, it seems to have contributed to the confusion and inability of people to know about the instance. It is not a very onerous gate, but it is still a gate to this story/lore scene and the resulting confusion with people missing it is an example why any gating of lore should really be avoided.

In the future, I think ArenaNet would be better served avoiding making their lore dependent on players doing an event, or a puzzle, or a boss, or jumping up and down for 5 mins or some other condition. If you just can’t get away from the old-school attitude of gating lore, then please, at least clearly communicate with players about how they can see it.

TLDR: Loved the story instance but ArenaNet needs to tell ppl about it with in-game mail.

I agree that the connection isnt handled great, however lore should totally be gated via content. You should discover lore, and uncover it as you play through the game. I think the idea here is specifically that these npcs take part in the event, and this meeting in lions arch occurs after they have done this. Its sequential, and pretty logical.

As i said though, the npc stuff in the event is hard to see/hear/find, so it does feel pretty disconnected.

And i thought it was pretty good, but i think the pacing was slightly off, too much slow walking with nothing happening.

And personally i found kasmeer and marjory to be kind of EHHHHH, just didnt feel connected to her, or her sob story about her dad. I give marjory props for basically being like ok yeah that sucks, so you am i coming over tonight. But im probably not the target demographic there anyhow so whatevers clever.

phys.7689:

I agree that the connection isnt handled great, however lore should totally be gated via content. You should discover lore, and uncover it as you play through the game. I think the idea here is specifically that these npcs take part in the event, and this meeting in lions arch occurs after they have done this. Its sequential, and pretty logical.

As i said though, the npc stuff in the event is hard to see/hear/find, so it does feel pretty disconnected.

I suppose I should clarify that I think lore should not be gated by content that keeps players from ever seeing it because of the difficulty or inaccessibility. I guess I agree that lore should be discovered but that discovery should be something that anyone, casual or hardcore, should be able to accomplish.

Perhaps if the connection and communication of this lore scene to the boss fight had been better done, then I wouldn’t have suggested they should not gate lore like this again. As I mentioned, simply participating in the fight is not a difficult gate but I think it did contribute to the confusion.

Plus they need to somehow make certain that players are aware that there is a story for them if they do participate in something that is not usually connected with detailed story development, like a mass open-world event such as the marionette boss fight. It’s like connecting a detailed character development/storyline to a jumping puzzle, it’s not something people are used to seeing.

Instances are where people usually expect storylines to be found, gating accessibility of the story/lore instance to an open world event certainly added to that disconnect you mention. They really need some extra effort to communicate to players because of that.

DoctorOverlord.8620:

phys.7689:

I agree that the connection isnt handled great, however lore should totally be gated via content. You should discover lore, and uncover it as you play through the game. I think the idea here is specifically that these npcs take part in the event, and this meeting in lions arch occurs after they have done this. Its sequential, and pretty logical.

As i said though, the npc stuff in the event is hard to see/hear/find, so it does feel pretty disconnected.

I suppose I should clarify that I think lore should not be gated by content that keeps players from ever seeing it because of the difficulty or inaccessibility. I guess I agree that lore should be discovered but that discovery should be something that anyone, casual or hardcore, should be able to accomplish.

Perhaps if the connection and communication of this lore scene to the boss fight had been better done, then I wouldn’t have suggested they should not gate lore like this again. As I mentioned, simply participating in the fight is not a difficult gate but I think it did contribute to the confusion.

Plus they need to somehow make certain that players are aware that there is a story for them if they do participate in something that is not usually connected with detailed story development, like a mass open-world event such as the marionette boss fight. It’s like connecting a detailed character development/storyline to a jumping puzzle, it’s not something people are used to seeing.

Instances are where people usually expect storylines to be found, gating accessibility of the story/lore instance to an open world event certainly added to that disconnect you mention. They really need some extra effort to communicate to players because of that.

yeah they could have had some sort of central event or pre event (say the 5 min warning) where you the npcs are central, and mention lions arch.