10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Anamelia Ladyhawk.3689

Anamelia Ladyhawk.3689

I am having a great time in WvW this week… great fights… enjoyed the Garri battles last night on SoS BL… TY SBI & SoR. Now I have a challenge for you off the battle fields…

Sea of Sorrows is currently challenging all other servers to meet or beat their $1337.42 donation for Pink Day in LA! Simply donate with your ign name to the cause and post your local server next to your name when you do! Which server is going to rise to the top?

Who will pick up the gauntlet? http://pinkday.gamergivingback.com/

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Fannwong.3059

Fannwong.3059

To the SOS Commander and troops of Overlook in EB, I have nothing but the sincerest respect for you. The battle for Overlook that stretched 2 hours ending at 1130pm (GMT+8) was really tough. The tenacity and the never say die attitude of SOS soldiers are awesome. You guys never ever gave up and for that we salute you.

FW

[SoX] – JQ

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Jyeoi.6027

Jyeoi.6027

Having the means to play on both servers with great people is salt in a wound when you lack time!!!

SBI fight well, don’t give up, learn as much as you can.

SoR always respectful, classy and fun loving, keep being a great model to inspire others.

Yulo – Champions of Stormbluff [SBI]

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Sanduskel.1850

Sanduskel.1850

lets see how many guilds sor poaches/buy from sbi or sos this time. they already bought a guild from sos last matchup

Ive never heard or seen any guild buying in SOR. People who come here cite the better community and nicer people. Maybe you should look to your attitude if you are losing guilds.

OP’d thief, lol

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Sanduskel.1850

Sanduskel.1850

SoR zerg more next time, can’t take the tower with relatively even numbers so you have to bring a whole map queue to take a paper tower against 15 defenders.

It is always cute when people flatter themselves and think they are more important than they really are. A more likely scenario is that bored groups are jumping at any hint of action because there is no one to fight.

or you could split up into groups of 2 or 3 and actually fight us with even numbers, we’ll give you alot more fights there.

Why would we want to do that? We want to pwn you with huge numbers! Makes the emoting much more entertaining!

OP’d thief, lol

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Omaris Mortuus Est.2738

Omaris Mortuus Est.2738

Time for some PvE!!

Attachments:

Macros, you can use them as long as they arent macros.
Remember to buy the officially endorsed GW2 Steel Series Keyboard, it supports macros!
WvW, we only care if it affects the servers we play on.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Chris.3290

Chris.3290

SBI hasn’t padded their score at all since Saturday and has actually lost ground, the guy (to SBI’s credit only one guy)who accused SoS of tanking looks pretty stupid right now.

Something weird is happening with us; our casuals and usually PvE only folks are poking their heads out.
I’m on the record in saying that I’m not a big fan of going to the Gold League, but if the trade off is getting more of our native population active and involved with WvW; then it would definitely be worth more to us in the long run than a last minute influx of fairweathers and a new finisher.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Chris.3290

Chris.3290

Mad props to the guilds on SoR who are trying to fight with fewer numbers. Choo and HL are two that have stood out.
I’ve seen a few TSYM tags, but we appreciate not getting the full group. Haven’t seen much of TW so no call there.

Everyone else on SoR, I suggest running in smaller groups to work on your skills. Treat this as a training week for the next 7.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Qadr.5217

Qadr.5217

To the guys using the eyefinity (whatever you want to call it) to destroy the siege inside towers when you have vastly superior numbers outside. Stay classy.

Arrow in the pic is where a cata used to be until magical red circles formed directly on top of it (didn’t get the ss off fast enough). Totally working as intended.

Attachments:

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Posted by: Corran.4957

Corran.4957

To the guys using the eyefinity (whatever you want to call it) to destroy the siege inside towers when you have vastly superior numbers outside. Stay classy.

Arrow in the pic is where a cata used to be until magical red circles formed directly on top of it (didn’t get the ss off fast enough). Totally working as intended.

Not played today really as it boring as hell. Only fights on EB and a 4day queue to get in there…. but that screenshot tells nothing. The question I have is “Where was the Arrow Cart?”

I constantly destroy catapults by merely aiming over the top of the door. As long as you position in a way that allows you to turn the camera to see the gap you can do it. Even easier with arrow cart mastery.

Not saying eyefinity wasnt in use, but at least give the full picture and show the arrow cart positions

p.s.
Catapults behind the door is so 3months ago. You need to update your seige defense tactic handbook

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: eksn.7264

eksn.7264

To the SOS Commander and troops of Overlook in EB, I have nothing but the sincerest respect for you. The battle for Overlook that stretched 2 hours ending at 1130pm (GMT+8) was really tough. The tenacity and the never say die attitude of SOS soldiers are awesome. You guys never ever gave up and for that we salute you.

FW

I was wondering if I was the only one having fun around here.

Noz

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Andrew Clear.1750

Andrew Clear.1750

Please bring it SBI and SoS. 2v1 as much as you can and kick our teeth in. Thanks.

The problem with that is we are both fighting to get into gold league, and we need to win the ppt against each other to accomplish that.

On the other hand, if we both did 2v1 you and kept the score close to yours it would almost guarantee a spot in gold, since mag and fa are not spanking CD like they should be.

But 2v1 you is the riskier proposition. If it fails, neither of us could get into gold.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Andrew Clear.1750

Andrew Clear.1750

When facing SoS (BP) their SEA/Oceanic time was crazy strong waking up to see 600 ppt ticking, but I don’t see that this match up. I know SoR should have good coverage but SoS seems to be not gaining any during one of their strongest time zones?

Is SoS tanking or is SoR so much stronger at this time?

SoR is strong in that time zone, and SBI has more numbers than it used to have then. SoS is getting the score to around 200, so they are doing good, it is just hard to combat SoR since they have 2 80 man zergs that can map hop in an instant. At 6am est time, they had every waypoint except hills in SoS, and bay in SBI.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Xillllix.3485

Xillllix.3485

SoR, you are very good practice for us when we go rolling as a guild, but this matchup is downright ridiculous as you seem to have no down time at all.

From what I can see the major guilds of SBI are chilling out doing some PvE or real life stuff at the moment and testing different tactics with you guys when they roll. All day today it seems our BL was defended mostly by pugs.

Anyway very cool fights so far. Fighting you I think made us realize the full potential of our guild (Abyss).

As for SoS, we will have a real 3 way match-up in the future where we will fight each others more evenly… As it is right now most of SBI have decided to focus on SoR, out of respect and also for training purposes .

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: SirNukes.7854

SirNukes.7854

You hit the nail on the head, Radioactive. It just boggles my mind, why one server accuses another server of doing something and the server who is doing the accusing does the exact same thing.

Servers don’t make accusations, people do. Each world is made up of a lot of people playing in different guilds on different maps at different times and having different experiences. So you might have one guy saying X world doesn’t spawncamp and then a day later on a different map people from X have sieged up all of Y’s exit points, or whatever.

Amazon Basin
SBI

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Jeydra.4386

Jeydra.4386

To the SOS Commander and troops of Overlook in EB, I have nothing but the sincerest respect for you. The battle for Overlook that stretched 2 hours ending at 1130pm (GMT+8) was really tough. The tenacity and the never say die attitude of SOS soldiers are awesome. You guys never ever gave up and for that we salute you.

FW

Not sure if we actually had a commander lol – there was a period when we had no commander, just several vocal people yelling things on mapchat.

As a whole SoS are doing better than we did against JQ. In the past few hours we witnessed SoR zerg overpowering SBI and seizing everything in their corner of the map – in that sense while we made no progress in terms of possessions, holding Overlook and getting it upgraded was a decent achievement itself. If we had a defensively-minded commander we could have not just defended Veloka and Overlook, but also defended and upgraded Anz, Mendons and Ogrewatch, such that when Luvpie logged on later he would have a lot more room to work with.

Props to the people who spend all their time doing essential things like scout for zergs, refreshing siege and running supply. They get no reward, but they’re crucial in us advancing our map position.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Kire.2364

Kire.2364

SoR, you are very good practice for us when we go rolling as a guild, but this matchup is downright ridiculous as you seem to have no down time at all.

From what I can see the major guilds of SBI are chilling out doing some PvE or real life stuff at the moment and testing different tactics with you guys when they roll. All day today it seems our BL was defended mostly by pugs.

Anyway very cool fights so far. Fighting you I think made us realize the full potential of our guild (Abyss).

Our downtime is Late Late NA(After all the east coasters log off, where we have only 1 true wvw guild that fields ~20, rest are PUGs they drag around) until the Oceanics start getting on in force. That Pacific Ocean is a doozy when it comes to finding coverage. Apart from BG previously and now JQ its hard to find anyone with decent coverage in that area apart from PST NA staying up super late and Oceanics getting on early. The transition from SEA->EU is usually a little bumpy for us as well as our numbers drop a little when the SEA commanders get off and the EU commanders havent gotten on yet. They may not be noticeable right now because the weekend allows for people to more easily play out of their time zone and bolster numbers.

And for the guy saying someone used eyefinity, that whole cata behind the gate defenses tactic is easily canceled by dropping a sup ac in front of the gate, maneuvering your camera to see through the gap up top. It is easily done without eyefinity. Just because something happens that you dont understand how, doesnt mean its a hack, we may be opening our bag of tricks and letting you get a peek.

I played s/d before it was cool

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Le Rooster.8715

Le Rooster.8715

Just to clear something up with the SBI chest thumpers,
We in SoS are not tanking, what you are seeing is a morale high SBI who have coasted through the past matchups against a SoS who has been demolished 2 weeks straight. I guess once the week rolls then we will get to see the true test but don’t think that taking the 2nd place will be a cake walk for you guys SoS usually does better towards the end of the week anyways ( we caught up 10k points against FA with JQ murdering us in the matchup).

So yeah SBI moral of the story, don’t chest thump seriously this is your first week fighting a t1 server in like 30 weeks, just wait till the leagues are over if you can keep your community and server morale intact like we have then i tip my hat to you.

Roosters Inc-Team Shatter [TS] Commander
Sea of Sorrows http://www.gw2sos.com/index.php

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Werat.7063

Werat.7063

We in SoS are not tanking.

Define “we”. You know there are some of our people going around asking us to to do exactly that, right?
Who is tanking and who not i am not discussing. But i know the crowd is definitly smaller. I am taking that as a sign that we have shook off of the karma farmers to some degree and getting lots of practice in doing last stands.

eu league
“Opportunities multiply as they are seized.”

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Jeydra.4386

Jeydra.4386

Man WvW can be so depressing. I log on after taking a 3-hour break to see that SoS not only held all the towers on our side of the map but also Stonemist Castle. To top it off all of them, including SM, were either upgrading or upgraded. Good job to whoever was commanding and the players that did it!

Then in just a few minutes all their hard work becomes undone. SM was upgrading, but there was zero siege in the castle. When SoR comes to retake it we don’t even bother to defend it and just lose it. The same went for Mendon’s. In just a few minutes, everything our teammates had spent the past few hours working for vanishes into smoke.

Imagine how the people who advanced SoS’s position so much must feel. If we lose SM to a 70-man SoR zerg with 10 omega golems that rolled over 20 SoS defenders, fair enough and it can’t be helped. At least we tried. But we lost SM and Mendon’s with nary a shot being fired in defense. If we’re going to lose those possessions that someone else had put in so much effort into taking and $$ into upgrading, can’t we lose them in a blaze of glory rather than in a muffled whimper?

If one day I buy a commander tag of my own, I’ll probably become one of the most defensive commanders ever … after taking SM, I’d immediately lay down 10 ACs and Ballistas, covering both inner gates, running supply from Overlook, Pang and Speldan to do it.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Jubelum.3472

Jubelum.3472

If one day I buy a commander tag of my own, I’ll probably become one of the most defensive commanders ever … after taking SM, I’d immediately lay down 10 ACs and Ballistas, covering both inner gates, running supply from Overlook, Pang and Speldan to do it.

Well if you did that then you’d be acting like an SoR commander, and servers like SoS would troll you and say you can only win by blobbing.

Wolfgang Von Goethe [VIG] – Warrior of Rall
“He who defends everything, defends nothing” – Frederick II

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Blodeuyn.2751

Blodeuyn.2751

snip

If one day I buy a commander tag of my own, I’ll probably become one of the most defensive commanders ever … after taking SM, I’d immediately lay down 10 ACs and Ballistas, covering both inner gates, running supply from Overlook, Pang and Speldan to do it.

As one of the most defensive commanders on SBI, I can tell you it is not as easy as it sounds. We’ve had completely sieged towers fall to the sheer number of SOR’s forces. They will push in, wipe your eleventy billion pieces of siege, then proceed to eat you for breakfast.

It can be fun to hold/farm them as long as possible, but yah…

Blodeuyn Tylwyth
Quaggan OP [QOP], League of Extraordinary Siegers [LEXS]
Ehmry Bay

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Jubelum.3472

Jubelum.3472

Really SoS and SBI, please form some sort of double team, I think a lot of our main WvW guilds are taking a breather this week, you could come out and fight what’s in the borderlands right now and score some real victories, please please PLEASE don’t avoid WvW this week because you think it’s futile, there’s lots of fun to be had, I’ve seen a lot of Rallians levelling new toons in the BLs, it’s mostly karma training which isn’t very organized, this would be a good time for you guys to really show up in full force and put up your best fights. I implore you! Pleeeease! with sugar on top, and and and cherries! just um, pwease pway wif us?

Wolfgang Von Goethe [VIG] – Warrior of Rall
“He who defends everything, defends nothing” – Frederick II

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: eksn.7264

eksn.7264

Really SoS and SBI, please form some sort of double team, I think a lot of our main WvW guilds are taking a breather this week, you could come out and fight what’s in the borderlands right now and score some real victories, please please PLEASE don’t avoid WvW this week because you think it’s futile, there’s lots of fun to be had, I’ve seen a lot of Rallians levelling new toons in the BLs, it’s mostly karma training which isn’t very organized, this would be a good time for you guys to really show up in full force and put up your best fights. I implore you! Pleeeease! with sugar on top, and and and cherries! just um, pwease pway wif us?

Hey you VIG guys killed me when I was a quaggan with a kite, not cool bro.

Noz

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Azure Prower.8701

Azure Prower.8701

SoS is tanking guys.

Attachments:

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Kalla.4290

Kalla.4290

I may be a bit clueless but why are people saying SoS is tanking? Is it because they are below SBI in points or something else?

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: elkirin.8534

elkirin.8534

IMHO, There have been some great fights over the weekend. SoR is as usual very organised and fights well. It is good to see SBI on the rise again as they were fine opponents in the days when T1 was JQ/SoS/SBI.

As to SoS, speaking for my own guildmates, we are turning up in larger numbers than usual and doing what we can, fun defence of Longview last night.

The 3 way fight in SoS Garrison was tremendous fun in spite of the skill lag.

Props to all actual ingame combatants, keep bringing the fun

Dubain – Sea of Whoever we are Linked to now

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Chris.3290

Chris.3290

I may be a bit clueless but why are people saying SoS is tanking? Is it because they are below SBI in points or something else?

Some folks on SBI have long memories. We crash the party right as they were in position to dominate T1, last fall. WM blamed AGG (on SoS at the time) and trolling for their departure, so some guilt by association there.
Additionally, we didn’t have as far as a fall as they did and we stopped our drop literally upon them in T4, and proceeded to once again make life suck for them.

The truth about tanking is that two people have came on our TS3 at different times and asked people to consider tanking. We managed not to use profanity when telling them to take a hike; and that’s as far as it went.

SoS is not trying any less or more than it does in any other match. While some guilds are not as active right now, others have stepped up their game and a lot of casuals have taken up an interest.

So SoS is just fine, and if we can get SBI interested in a 2v1 on SoR this week can get a whole lot funner for everyone (means get out of OL, darnit!)

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Posted by: Jubelum.3472

Jubelum.3472

Hey you VIG guys killed me when I was a quaggan with a kite, not cool bro.

Sorry but there’s a long history of bad blood between VIGs and Quaggans and the kite is a symbolic Quaggan gesture for hostile intentions

Wolfgang Von Goethe [VIG] – Warrior of Rall
“He who defends everything, defends nothing” – Frederick II

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Posted by: earendil.1290

earendil.1290

Nobody is tanking – at least no server is. Some people might think it better to end in Silver on all 4 servers involved and decide to take a break from WvW. We have our Silver/Gold discussion in the open.

SBI has few WvW guilds – so they rely on militia mostly – and militia is getting demoralised now.

And SoS – I don’t really like you – you are associated with our Exodus. Agg had a part in it, so did PrX (they were too tough to beat ). And I disliked that Laylyn Illuminati leader. But I dislike BG more than you

WM did not leave SBI because of Agg – they did it because of Anet and maybe SBI. That was almost a year ago – few remember. We like or dislike you based on what you do now.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Becka Williams.4978

Becka Williams.4978

I’m pretty sure FA is tanking. They did better than we did against JQ, and now they’re losing to maguuma, who we can beat pretty easily?

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Amurond.4590

Amurond.4590

Please bring it SBI and SoS. 2v1 as much as you can and kick our teeth in. Thanks.

The problem with that is we are both fighting to get into gold league

Speak for yourself, if SBI makes it to Gold League I will probably transfer off for the first time since launch.

Go Mag/FA.

~ The Server I Play On Is Better Than The Server You Play On ~
- Kudzu, Dreamer, Frostfang, Eternity, Flameseeker Prophecies ~
~Nevermore, HOPE, Moot, Incinerator, Meteorlogicus, Howler ~

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Miss Firesss.3704

Miss Firesss.3704

Please bring it SBI and SoS. 2v1 as much as you can and kick our teeth in. Thanks.

The problem with that is we are both fighting to get into gold league

Speak for yourself, if SBI makes it to Gold League I will probably transfer off for the first time since launch.

Go Mag/FA.

I would prefer silver too, more even coverage and fights.


[Abys]

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Phedre Scion.1520

Phedre Scion.1520

. We like or dislike you based on what you do now.
[/quote]

What exactly did SoS do right now that makes you dislike us? We are a great group of folks.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: earendil.1290

earendil.1290

What exactly did SoS do right now that makes you dislike us? We are a great group of folks.

who said I disliked you ? Maybe I like you – that was my message. Someone brought the past into it and I answered to that

So far there has been no major offensive stuff from SoS (few forum warriors but we have some on SBI too) – I would welcome a 2v1 against SoR.

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

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Posted by: Johje Holan.4607

Johje Holan.4607

Really SoS and SBI, please form some sort of double team, I think a lot of our main WvW guilds are taking a breather this week, you could come out and fight what’s in the borderlands right now and score some real victories, please please PLEASE don’t avoid WvW this week because you think it’s futile, there’s lots of fun to be had, I’ve seen a lot of Rallians levelling new toons in the BLs, it’s mostly karma training which isn’t very organized, this would be a good time for you guys to really show up in full force and put up your best fights. I implore you! Pleeeease! with sugar on top, and and and cherries! just um, pwease pway wif us?

So SoS is just fine, and if we can get SBI interested in a 2v1 on SoR this week can get a whole lot funner for everyone (means get out of OL, darnit!)

I’ve been trying.

What about this. SoS would you all be able to queue SoR BL one night this week (by night I mean NA night)? If so, we could both attack SoR BL at the same time and thus 2v1 them as WvW was meant to be played.

Would you like that SoR? SoS? SBI? We’ve got two posts here asking for SoS and SBI to double team SoR. Let’s do it.

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Posted by: hardknockbb.6284

hardknockbb.6284

Yes, double team SoR BL! That way everyone will be having fun.

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Posted by: Tyaen.5148

Tyaen.5148

you kidding right. when you outnumber the opponent 5:1 what do you expect.

Not that.

Tyyaen – Engineer (80) [SS]
http://camelotunchained.com/v3/

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Posted by: Sabastian.7126

Sabastian.7126

Sanctum of Rall
born Sept 20 – died Nov 11. reborn August 10
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEfbwJLw04I

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Posted by: Brutus.5732

Brutus.5732

I’m pve’ing (lvl 32 :P) but I’m sure we would welcome a 2v1. Get all your guilds on board and spam your map chats.

Someone asked earlier in the thread if formal 2v1s ever worked. I didn’t bother responding at the time but T1 has seen plenty of hardcore 2v1s, a few of which ran almost the entire match.

Good luck, if you pull it off you may catch us napping.

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Posted by: Kire.2364

Kire.2364

Had some fantastic fights with TE in SBI bl today and then TE and BEAST in SoR BL. Hope to see you guys out in during the rest of the week for more fights. And that golem rush on SBI hills by Abys and other assorted SBI members was good, you guys almost caught us out there.

I played s/d before it was cool

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Posted by: Andrew Clear.1750

Andrew Clear.1750

Ty for the zoom hacks just now in SBI Bay, SoR. Guess the people who were taking the place wasn’t man enough to fight us.

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Posted by: Miss Firesss.3704

Miss Firesss.3704

I honestly expected more from a T1 server, that outnumbered us at least 3:1. :|

Attachments:


[Abys]

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Posted by: Nakoor.1980

Nakoor.1980

I honestly expected more from a T1 server, that outnumbered us at least 3:1. :|

Take one arrowcart.. Place said arrowcart next to door or slightly back from it. Said arrowcart can now shoot inside the bay inner.

Plot Twist: It’s not a hack.

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Posted by: Doomdesire.9365

Doomdesire.9365

I honestly expected more from a T1 server, that outnumbered us at least 3:1. :|

I hate to break it to you, but there are certain AC spots that can hit that particular area. Without a picture of where the AC was, there’s no way we can reach any conclusion.

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Posted by: Miss Firesss.3704

Miss Firesss.3704

Hate to break it to you, but look at the mini map, where the orange swords are.


[Abys]

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Posted by: The Ajax.4967

The Ajax.4967

I honestly expected more from a T1 server, that outnumbered us at least 3:1. :|

I hate to break it to you, but there are certain AC spots that can hit that particular area. Without a picture of where the AC was, there’s no way we can reach any conclusion.

not only that but the gate is down… theres LOS. Also we went tagless and noone apart from sos (until they went back to objectives) wanted to give us fights when we had less numbers.

Evin Arris

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Posted by: JJBigs.8456

JJBigs.8456

scootshoot and sostronk are like a match made in heaven the way they compliment each others comments

whats funny is the speculation done by them, hoping their spies have told them the right rumors. “JQ Q’s sooo many maps bro” – How about SoR’s 4 Map Q during NA?

Just a fyi, Stealth.8150 is a duo account troll, his main is on BG, and his troll is on SOR. He has a huge infatuation with SOR guild FEAR, lol. Read his posting history, all that needs to be said.

Without going into detail, since you can ask him yourself, his main isnt on BG (or is it)! Also second accounts arent troll accounts unless they are wasting supply, siege griefing etc which no one has ever even accused him of, so I highly doubt that he is “trolling on sor”

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

in Match-ups

Posted by: electriette.8952

electriette.8952

Hate to break it to you, but look at the mini map, where the orange swords are.

That spot (where the orange swords are) can also bit bay inner with a bit of camera work. IIRC, anyone with ac mastery 1 (and 4?) can hit that spot from where the orange swords are.

And honestly sometimes the combat icon can be misleading/inaccurate. >_>

10/11 SoR/SBI/SoS

in Match-ups

Posted by: Miss Firesss.3704

Miss Firesss.3704

We had people over there, they saw the ac’s. Argue all you want, we know what happened, and we were bummed.


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