Tribulation Mode - I am ready

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Posted by: Xuro.5861

Xuro.5861

Been preparing since the last week of the first time SAB arrived for this mode.

Hopefully it will provide a challenge similar or harder than the halloween jumping puzzle

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Posted by: Karizee.8076

Karizee.8076

I have a feeling I’m going to need more coinage.

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Posted by: Doggie.3184

Doggie.3184

You mean your body is ready, right?

| Fort Aspenwood (NA): Sylvari Daredevil Thief Main: All Classes 80. |
Please Remove/Fix Thief Trait: “Last Refuge.”
“Hard to Catch” is a Horrible and Useless Trait. Fixed 6/23/15. Praise Dwayna.

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Posted by: GoldenTruth.2853

GoldenTruth.2853

There’s going to be a lot of QQ considering Josh planned on making Hard mode have very cheap deaths that require high muscle memory. For example, the “pointer arrows” that point to the exit will sometimes (or maybe always) attack you as something akin to a rocket.

That said….bring it on!

Alara Vesmir – Guardian
Tyr Sylvison – Warrior
Illyiah – Revenant

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Posted by: Josh Foreman.6542

Josh Foreman.6542

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Posted by: havoc.6814

havoc.6814

Tribulation mode? /Yawn

Sure, I’ll knock that out in between my dailies and grabbing another charged crystal thing. Why not?

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Posted by: Auesis.7301

Auesis.7301

I was told Liadri was going to be a hellstorm, that only the best of the best in the game would be able to take her down. Yet, half my guild has managed to do it, and so have a bunch of other people I’ve talked to.

I hope TM is more of the old school difficulty I crave. Kill me! KILL MEEEE!

Gnome Child [Gc]
Resident Thief

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Posted by: John.2783

John.2783

You are not ready. Stock up on more coins.

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Posted by: Randulf.7614

Randulf.7614

Last week I downloaded all the NES Mega Man games

I’ll be ready

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Posted by: ezd.6359

ezd.6359

I don’t think i am ready >:(

I expect much kitten :’(

https://vine.co/v/hirFnqpVOBx

English is not my native language, sorry :<

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Posted by: Smooth Penguin.5294

Smooth Penguin.5294

Tribulation Mode is ridiculously difficult and time consuming.

Which Dev is responsible for this? I want to send him/her cookies.

In GW2, Trading Post plays you!

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Posted by: Auesis.7301

Auesis.7301

Tribulation Mode is ridiculously difficult and time consuming.

Which Dev is responsible for this? I want to send him/her cookies.

Don’t get too excited just yet. We were told that dungeons were notoriously hard before launch and…well…yeah.

However, if it DOES end up being excruciatingly, horrifyingly, PAINFULLY difficult, then TAKE MY COOKIES. TAKE THEM ALL AND EAT THEM IN FRONT OF ME WITH A SMUG GRIN.

Gnome Child [Gc]
Resident Thief

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Posted by: Smooth Penguin.5294

Smooth Penguin.5294

Tribulation Mode is ridiculously difficult and time consuming.

Which Dev is responsible for this? I want to send him/her cookies.

Don’t get too excited just yet. We were told that dungeons were notoriously hard before launch and…well…yeah.

However, if it DOES end up being excruciatingly, horrifyingly, PAINFULLY difficult, then TAKE MY COOKIES. TAKE THEM ALL AND EAT THEM IN FRONT OF ME WITH A SMUG GRIN.

On a related note – Oreo came out with the MEGA STUF. This could make any Dev smile.

In GW2, Trading Post plays you!

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Posted by: Dan.8709

Dan.8709

JOSH!!!!!!!!!!!!! YOU’RE MY HERO AND I LOVE YOU DEARLY, YOU AND YOUR TEAM, but mostly you, I’m a guy and I’m a fangirl for you, seriously.

Great youtube videos on your channel, I LOVE SAB TO DEATH, THANKS.

Daniel Cousland – Darkhaven

(edited by Dan.8709)

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Posted by: Zaxares.5419

Zaxares.5419

I get the feeling that all those pointy bamboo stakes on the ground in Tribulation Mode are going to be “instant death” pits. XD

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Posted by: Lokheit.7943

Lokheit.7943

The good thing about this is, while the gauntlet was possible for all professions, but not for all builds on all professions (I gave up on certain achievements because I refused to craft new equipment sets only for that, I hope next time it’s “pvp style” like other activities so we can use free pvp amulets), here we’re all equal, so that makes the bar the same for all of us. I think I can really make this (unless it is “Rytlock’s Critter Rampager” difficult, that thing was a challenge on apocalyptic levels!).

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Posted by: Coldin.2840

Coldin.2840

I’m not a fan of cheap deaths. If there are places in Tribulation where you get killed “just because” I will very likely stay far away.

Still, maybe it won’t be so bad. I mean, I did beat Liadri and the Clocktower. This might just be like trying to do both at once…

Coldin – Thief – Sanctum of Rall

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Posted by: Nilkemia.8507

Nilkemia.8507

I still don’t understand the idea that hard equals fun for some. I play for fun, not frustration. So I’ll stay away.

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Posted by: Zaxares.5419

Zaxares.5419

Some players play for the sense of accomplishment they get when they overcome a great challenge. I can understand this feeling, as I experienced it myself when I finally defeated Liadri after 86 attempts, but no, not all players play games for that reason. However, the fact that such players exist is why ANet SHOULD put in hard content like the Gauntlet and Tribulation Mode, so that players who do find satisfaction in overcoming great trials can have their needs met too.

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Posted by: Rayti.6531

Rayti.6531

Replace “frustration” with “challange”. I’m curious what they did with the world 1 levels in this mode.

In normal mode it was possible to do the whole world 1 in several minutes (solo speed runs digging for some baubles but without taking all secrets). There was no need for continue coins at all…

Of course there had to be something like the Tribulation mode so those of us yawning our way through after those weeks of SAB had another challange in the old world 1 missions and the coins get a chance to be consumed.

What I think to be very nice is, that they are offering a mode for each target group. Noone is forced into Tribulation Mode.

Those who aren’t used to JPs or simply hate jumping can still choose Infantile Mode, those who want to jump through the game and have some fun can choose the Normal Mode. And those who have finished both can have a try with the Tribulation Mode (I see lots of raging coming up in some TS channels xD).

EDIT: btw. anyone but me just listening to “8-bit” music in ANet’s sound cloud? :-9

(edited by Rayti.6531)

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Posted by: Xuro.5861

Xuro.5861

I still don’t understand the idea that hard equals fun for some. I play for fun, not frustration. So I’ll stay away.

As with everything in life, if there is no challenge in it for me, I have no interest in it. That’s why my hobbies all require intense physical dedication, the same is valid for any mmo’s I play. The entire game is a snorefest when it comes to challenge, even Liadri is a joke without the camera issues haunting it. I barely play for this reason aswell, so bored from all the easymode content.

People who seek this kind of goals/entertainment in life enjoy nearly impossible tasks as it encourages you to improve yourself. That’s what I enjoy, seeing myself improve in something which I at first couldn’t achieve or finish.

I certaintly hope Tribulation Mode will keep me occupied for atleast 3 days.

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Posted by: Rebound.3409

Rebound.3409

The only thing hard about halloween clock was the difference in character sizes and sometimes lag. Other then that it was extremely easy.

90% of the deaths i had were because of character sizes. That doesn’t translate into difficulty…

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Posted by: Onkelbubu.3108

Onkelbubu.3108

In 1 week there will be a post “OMG TRIBULATION MODE IS SO HARD AND WHY DONT I GET A GARANTUEED SKIN SUCCEEDING IT???!!!!”

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Posted by: Vol.5241

Vol.5241

In 1 week there will be a post “OMG TRIBULATION MODE IS SO HARD AND WHY DONT I GET A GARANTUEED SKIN SUCCEEDING IT???!!!!”

^ pretty much this

Forums complain that there is no challenging content

..then hey complain that the content is too challenging

[Permabanned on Forums]
[Currently Inactive, Playing BF4]
Magic find works. http://sinasdf.imgur.com/

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Posted by: Danikat.8537

Danikat.8537

In 1 week there will be a post “OMG TRIBULATION MODE IS SO HARD AND WHY DONT I GET A GARANTUEED SKIN SUCCEEDING IT???!!!!”

More likely “It’s so hard! Why do I have to actually complete achievements to get them? I should get full credit just for trying it!”

Like the people who said the Gauntlet achievements should be literally just for entering the fights, at absolute most for getting to the top tier and not for actually beating anything.

Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).

“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”

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Posted by: Avatara.1042

Avatara.1042

I hope it is actual difficulty, and NOT Lamedri camera angle, red floor, and random orbs ‘difficulty’.

(edited by Avatara.1042)

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Posted by: Piscore.6934

Piscore.6934

Tribulation mode?

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Posted by: Azure Prower.8701

Azure Prower.8701

As long as it is fun hard and not tedious hard. Bring it on!

Example of fun hard: Clocktower.

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Posted by: ezd.6359

ezd.6359

Clocktower is fun because it has 0 random elements. You can learn and adapt. Example of bad “hard” thing is: Liadri – you can’t adapt to random thing that happens behind camera angle.

English is not my native language, sorry :<

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Posted by: Fay.8167

Fay.8167

This thread really deserves this depiction of the different types of fun: [big image here]
(taken from dwarf fortress, but fits quite well here )

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Posted by: Lost in Hyrule.2963

Lost in Hyrule.2963

If only anything else could compare to Dwarf Fortress’s “Fun”!

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Posted by: Day Trooper.3605

Day Trooper.3605

So Josh – in your humble opinion how will Tribulation Mode compare to the ‘Light Up The Darkness’ achievement? To date that’s the most challenging thing bar none* I’ve done in game.

If harder than that then yes – your vid above most definitely applies xD.

*To clarify, prior to Liadri your awesome Clocktower was easily the toughest thing I’d done, but as others have stated above the Clocktower didn’t involve any ‘rng elements’ like Liadri – and so that’s why she took me sooo long to finally ‘Light Up.’

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Posted by: Nihilus.3015

Nihilus.3015

AmateurNet

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Posted by: Ant.3415

Ant.3415

The people complaining “its too hard” are a different set than those who complain"its not hard enough". I hope it’s challenging but not cheap.

Challenge our reaction time, intelligence, and skill, but not gear, build, or crappy camera mechanics.

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Posted by: Danikat.8537

Danikat.8537

The people complaining “its too hard” are a different set than those who complain"its not hard enough". I hope it’s challenging but not cheap.

Challenge our reaction time, intelligence, and skill, but not gear, build, or crappy camera mechanics.

Well considering it’s in SAB we already know gear and build won’t make a difference. Although unlocking all the items and extra heart(s) in normal mode will probably be a big help.

Not sure about camera angles, but I don’t remember any awkward places in World 1.

Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).

“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”

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Posted by: Merendel.7128

Merendel.7128

If only anything else could compare to Dwarf Fortress’s “Fun”!

Heh as much as I love DF there are so many way’s to cheese that game to make the difficulty trivial. once you learn how to make a self sustaining fort with a proper defense there are really only 2 difficulties left, your own boneheadedness or your processor catching fire.

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Posted by: Josh Foreman

Josh Foreman

Environment Design Specialist

Next

I’m going to lay out the game philosophy behind how we decided to do Tribulation Mode because I think it’s going to be misunderstood by a lot of folks.

First, here’s a playthrough of two games that are in the style we are doing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22oTEDa2Rxk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAH2KMiscqY

Some people aren’t aware that this genre exists, and SAB TM may be their first exposure to it. We took a creative risk by going in this direction with it rather than the standard make-enemies-hit-harder-and-give-you-less-health approach that most games use to ramp up difficulty. That would have been very easy and very safe. (And probably more popular.) But we never do anything the easy or safe way.

The thing that makes this approach tricky is that on its surface, it seems to be bad design because it is intrinsically unfair. What fans of the genre understand is that there is a depth there that comes from a really interesting dynamic in the communication between the designer and the player that doesn’t exist in other games. It’s hard to articulate, but I would say it’s something like friendly pranking. There’s great pleasure to be had in finding ways to outwit a prankster. And that can’t happen unless you have a prankster. And that’s what the designer provides. People who don’t ‘get’ this kind of game see it like the designer is trolling out of cruelty, and so they read malicious intent into the invisible insta-kills. But that’s just not the case. It’s simply a specific kind of content made for a specific kind of player who wants in on the pranks. Yes, raging is part of the process. In fact, I rage at myself when I play TM all the time!

And the thing about how it is unfair: yes, it is. However there is a deep satisfaction to be had in overcoming in an unfair fight. In these games your only real power is tenacity. And besides, it’s only unfair in the short feedback loops. (Here’s some information on feedback loops in game design: ) http://www.jorisdormans.nl/machinations/wiki/index.php?title=Feedback_Analysis_and_Recurrent_Patterns

But the longer (and more substantive) feedback loop is a process of learning how the designer thinks. Discovering that style and finding how to navigate the level better as a result. The first lesson is this: the most obvious easy way will most likely kill you. The harder, more circuitous rout will probably be the way to go. This creates a joy of discovery and overcoming that few other genres can provide. But it is an acquired taste.

Another commonality among games in the genre (which I’m not aware of having a name yet… let me know if you’ve heard of one) is that lives are extremely cheap, and you blow through them. Lives are like HP in an RPG or ammo in an FPS. You go in EXPECTING to lose a LOT. If you interpret losing a life as “failure” then you will have a miserable time. It would be like feeling like you “fail” when you take damage in a turn based role playing game. Instead, if you see every death as another learning experience, you’ll have a much better time. Kind of like the way your armor rating increases when you take damage in Skyrim. So part of preparing for a TM run, you’ll be ‘leveling up’ your ‘life meter’ by collecting as many lives and Continue Coins as you can.

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Posted by: Stormleaf.1769

Stormleaf.1769

And now I’m even more ridiculously excited than I already was. Thanks for being awesome, Josh!

…Just four more days!

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Posted by: Hyperionkhv.1978

Hyperionkhv.1978

Yes, raging is part of the process. In fact, I rage at myself when I play TM all the time! And the thing about how it is unfair: yes, it is. However there is a deep satisfaction to be had in overcoming in an unfair fight.

I play Guild Wars 2 to have fun and enjoy. Not to rage.

Even if one likes games, there’s a limit…

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Posted by: Chrispy.5641

Chrispy.5641

TM isn’t going to be as hard as I thought. Thank goodness! You scared me for a second there. I thought you were going to give us a link to Ninja Gaiden(NES) or something.

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Posted by: Coldtart.4785

Coldtart.4785

I wanna be the Guild Wars!

You know what they say; ‘Death…good.’

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Posted by: Stormleaf.1769

Stormleaf.1769

Yes, raging is part of the process. In fact, I rage at myself when I play TM all the time! And the thing about how it is unfair: yes, it is. However there is a deep satisfaction to be had in overcoming in an unfair fight.

I play Guild Wars 2 to have fun and enjoy. Not to rage.

Luckily for you, Tribulation Mode is optional!

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Posted by: ilr.9675

ilr.9675

interesting… Guess it’s all going to hinge on whether there’s a Repair Bill or not.
…and WP fee… That seemed to be where most of the rage came from in the last few updates

Watching that got me started on old Rage Quit episodes :p

(edited by ilr.9675)

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Posted by: Auesis.7301

Auesis.7301

Yes, raging is part of the process. In fact, I rage at myself when I play TM all the time! And the thing about how it is unfair: yes, it is. However there is a deep satisfaction to be had in overcoming in an unfair fight.

I play Guild Wars 2 to have fun and enjoy. Not to rage.

Then don’t play TM. Not everything is made for you.

Gnome Child [Gc]
Resident Thief

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Posted by: Shinzan.2908

Shinzan.2908

If it’s like those linked games then it should be doable with a guide. If there’s a pattern to learn then it’s not unfair, just difficult as it should be. To me unfair is something based on luck or random chance.

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Posted by: deSade.9437

deSade.9437

If it’s like those linked games then it should be doable with a guide. If there’s a pattern to learn then it’s not unfair, just difficult as it should be. To me unfair is something based on luck or random chance.

You know they love luck and random chance.

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Posted by: Chrispy.5641

Chrispy.5641

Shinzan.2908

If it’s like those linked games then it should be doable with a guide. If there’s a pattern to learn then it’s not unfair, just difficult as it should be. To me unfair is something based on luck or random chance.

There is nothing difficult about trial and error. The hardest thing about that type of game is setting aside the time to do it.

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Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

@Josh:

I know of this game, is this like the Kaizo Super Mario World thing? You know, romhacks doing stupidly crazy, player-frustrating traps?

. . . wow, I might just find this entertaining if TM has infinite lives attached to it. I mean, that blunts the challenge slightly because infinite lives makes it only a matter of time and muscle memory learning it all.

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

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Posted by: Pifil.5193

Pifil.5193

Yes, raging is part of the process. In fact, I rage at myself when I play TM all the time! And the thing about how it is unfair: yes, it is. However there is a deep satisfaction to be had in overcoming in an unfair fight.

I play Guild Wars 2 to have fun and enjoy. Not to rage.

Then don’t play TM. Not everything is made for you.

I know that I probably won’t play TM much because those kinds of games are a bit too punishing for me, but I’ll give it a shot and I’m completely fine with it if I get my butt kicked now that I know it’ll be back again.

Not having the “do it now because it’ll never be back” time pressure makes it fun again for me and not a chore with a deadline!

Oh and thanks, Josh, for the opportunity to get my pistol and dagger skins, I think blue will be fine, this time at least. ;-)

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Posted by: Pifil.5193

Pifil.5193

Yes, raging is part of the process. In fact, I rage at myself when I play TM all the time! And the thing about how it is unfair: yes, it is. However there is a deep satisfaction to be had in overcoming in an unfair fight.

I play Guild Wars 2 to have fun and enjoy. Not to rage.

Then don’t play TM. Not everything is made for you.

I know that I probably won’t play TM much because those kinds of games are a bit too punishing for me, but I’ll give it a shot and I’m completely fine with it if I get my butt kicked now that I know it’ll be back again.

Not having the “do it now because it’ll never be back” time pressure makes it fun again for me and not a chore with a deadline!

Oh and thanks, Josh, for the opportunity to get my pistol and dagger skins, I think blue will be fine, for this time at least.