No living story deserves to be this hard

No living story deserves to be this hard

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Posted by: joe.9815

joe.9815

Now before anyone says i’m just a whiner, I have beat every single achievement of these living stories.
First, 2 weeks was not long enough to master that dungeon I pulled many long nights to manage to get the achievements, if it was a month like dragon bakittenhink it would have been better.
Second, you had to be in a group to beat the achievements and most gw2 players aren’t that good… It would have been better with single player hard achievement.
Finally, isn’t the point of living story to beat everything in it? I thought the achievements that you needed to work for was everything other then living story.
Any other comments on this event?

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Posted by: Chase.8415

Chase.8415

It really isn’t that hard. THe lack of a LFG tool is what makes it difficult for other players.

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Posted by: Barabbas.8715

Barabbas.8715

I agree. Beat it with a PUG after 8 hours of game play and multiple people quitting. It really took forever to find people good enough to get this thing done.

If this were permanent content, I’d have no problem with it. But making this a major part of the story arc and putting a time limit on it, combined with ultra-hard achievements is a bit much.

I like challenging content but I can tell there are going to be a lot of people who can’t complete this due to lack of skill or simple lack of patience/time to get good at it.

And the fact that it’s so hard is leading to people not wanting to do it again after beating it or getting the achievements. Personally, I’d rather light myself on fire than spend 8 hours on a single dungeon again.

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Posted by: Payadopa.4706

Payadopa.4706

I hope it stays hard. We had enough easy-as-pie content for the last months.
All we need (and I can’t believe we don’t have it STILL) is a find party tool.

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Posted by: Azraeel.1238

Azraeel.1238

I agree with you that such achievement should be related to permanent content, not temporary. If it was single player, then the player can just keep trying until they get it. However considering this being a team related fight, between having a good team and a bad team makes a HUGE difference.
First Team: We couldn’t even beat Fizz without having 80% of the team dead by the end of it. Spent 3 hours, only one got the Faster Than Light achievement.
Second Team: We were aiming for Personal Space. During Fizz fight, one died, 2 or 3 got the Faster Than Light Achievement.
Third Team: We were going for Unfriendly Skies. During Fizz fight no one died, and no one got hit by Lazer. The fight barely even lasted that long.

Why such results? First team is mostly composed of noobs trying to get the first achievement. Second team was aiming for a bigger achievement, so the Faster Than Light was just secondary. Third team was handpicked to do the hardest achievement, and so the team was full of competent people which made almost every encounter in the dungeon look like a joke.

That’s my intake on the issue.

80 Necromancer (Main) | 80 Thief | 80 Guardian | 80 Warrior
Engineer and Elementalist in progress…

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Posted by: BilboBaggins.5620

BilboBaggins.5620

The dungeon is a joke! Hard mode has officially arrived. I don’t mind the dungeon being that difficult, but I’m one achievement away from earning the mini and I can’t even beat Frizz let alone the dungeon! It’s frustrating to get so close to earning a reward for the living story only to run into a buzzsaw of a dungeon.

I’m not saying don’t create hard content for pro players, I’m just asking please don’t abandon us casuals in the process.

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Posted by: Mortifer.2946

Mortifer.2946

I played it with PUG + one guild mate everytime. There was not a single time we didn’t finish it. I did it around 10 times. If you cannot master this dung I suggest you wach some video guide on youtube. It’s just 1 running around fight and 1 boss fight with some killing trash in between.
If you are from EU server I can help you with it if you want.

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Posted by: Mortifer.2946

Mortifer.2946

The dungeon is a joke! Hard mode has officially arrived. I don’t mind the dungeon being that difficult, but I’m one achievement away from earning the mini and I can’t even beat Frizz let alone the dungeon! It’s frustrating to get so close to earning a reward for the living story only to run into a buzzsaw of a dungeon.

I’m not saying don’t create hard content for pro players, I’m just asking please don’t abandon us casuals in the process.

You don’t need to run this dungeon at all to get Horrik mini.

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Posted by: BilboBaggins.5620

BilboBaggins.5620

I played it with PUG + one guild mate everytime. There was not a single time we didn’t finish it. I did it around 10 times. If you cannot master this dung I suggest you wach some video guide on youtube. It’s just 1 running around fight and 1 boss fight with some killing trash in between.
If you are from EU server I can help you with it if you want.

I appreciate the offer but I’m on a U.S. server. I’m an average player, I’m working on getting better but there is content that’s definitely geared to pro players. I have no problem with this but does a mini really have to be tied to pro content? We’re not talking ascended gear here. I just think there should be a better mix of achievements. I’ve completed every cache I’m capable of but Goemm’s Lab and the WvW jumping puzzles are pro level jumpers, so i’m one achievement short of earning a mini and my efforts are wasted.

And I also appreciate your advice. i do watch videos to help me understand the mechanics of a dungeon I’m going to run. Like I said, I’m an average player trying to get better. Thank you for a helpful response, some people are not so nice.

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Posted by: Mortifer.2946

Mortifer.2946

Stability and stun breakers…. great way how to beat laser room, you just have to watch when golem aim his hand toward you or start spinning. For the final boss – ranged weapon and as much condition removals as you can bring NP, I hope you will eventually beat it.

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Posted by: Barabbas.8715

Barabbas.8715

I played it with PUG + one guild mate everytime. There was not a single time we didn’t finish it. I did it around 10 times. If you cannot master this dung I suggest you wach some video guide on youtube. It’s just 1 running around fight and 1 boss fight with some killing trash in between.
If you are from EU server I can help you with it if you want.

Well gratz on lucking out and getting a good team from the start. Not everyone is so fortunate. Took me and my brother 8 hours before we had a team that could follow instructions and take down Mai. Most PUGs simply aren’t coordinated or obedient for this content. With content this hard all it takes is one doofus running around doing his own thing and the entire party is screwed.

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Posted by: ppaladin.4608

ppaladin.4608

They sent mixed messages: it is a limited time dungeon that levels everyone up to 80 upon entering. That suggests they want everyone to experience it and that it will be similar to the winterfest instance. Then they stacked it full of stun-locking, lethal AoE-generating mobs and bosses that require coordination and practice.

This dungeon would be excellent permanent end-game content to run with your guild and practice dozens of times (if it had rewards worth striving for).

As a temporary dungeon meant to be accessible to anyone regardless of level, it is a failure.

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Posted by: Absconditus.6804

Absconditus.6804

I’m all for hard achievements, if you have endless time to complete them.

When you are given pretty challenging achievements, on top of a decently challenging dungeon (when focusing on these achievements anyways), with a rather limited time to complete them, you just create a recipe for stress, and that ultimately means you are most likely not enjoying the content you’re playing.

I sure did not enjoy hunting these achievements and was borderline ready to quit the game if I didn’t get them. (That may of course seem silly to some people, but as a completionist, having a hole in your achievements will irk you endlessly for the future, and I figured it’d be better to quit than to be in a sour mood every day I log in to play.)

I also really hate the fact that they are saying they’ll pump out these Living Story updates every two weeks, since to me it feels like that’ll just make it a large headache, at least when combined with hard achievements like this.

It leaves nearly no time to do anything else in the game, when you got to focus so much on these updates, that on the bright side will keep you busy, but on the downside, way too much. I applaud that they want to give us things to do, I do and I appreciate that, but every two weeks seems like it’ll be a bit too much. If each segment starts every 2 weeks and last for a month, overlapping eachother, that’s something else, but it doesn’t sound like that from what they’re saying.

Vella Absconditus | Human Mesmer
Seafarer’s Rest

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Posted by: cranked.3812

cranked.3812

The dungeon is a joke! Hard mode has officially arrived. I don’t mind the dungeon being that difficult, but I’m one achievement away from earning the mini and I can’t even beat Frizz let alone the dungeon! It’s frustrating to get so close to earning a reward for the living story only to run into a buzzsaw of a dungeon.

I’m not saying don’t create hard content for pro players, I’m just asking please don’t abandon us casuals in the process.

I have the mini and I haven’t stepped foot in the dungeon.

Really should though, want to try it before it’s gone

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Posted by: Meriem.3504

Meriem.3504

I will say I like that is it hard but NOT ON A TIME LIMIT! Being not a level 80 on top of people hate people lower level even if you bring 1 lowbie on top of the fact this has PART OF THE STORY in it, makes me very unhappy!

Im growing weary of getting only bits and pieces of these stories because of bugs that aren’t fixed the whole way through and/or the stuff is too hard for pugs to do most of the time.

While I love the environment of this game, the story has been really lacking to begin with in the first place, then add insult to injury, you can’t even get to see the whole story.

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Posted by: Glorius.4067

Glorius.4067

worst updates made ever…. the game is wonderful but the updates its like from people dont know what the majority of people want…bad jp bad achievements worthless rewards.the game is excellent. i played many others mmorpgs for 10 years gw2 is excellent in all means… be careful plz with updates.

(edited by Glorius.4067)

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Posted by: Justin.7163

Justin.7163

This is something I would expect from an Elite, permanent dungeon in terms of difficulty. Subjecting many average players in order to experience the full story arc was just bad design.

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Posted by: Aerinndis.2730

Aerinndis.2730

Honestly, I stood outside dungeon and tried to find a group and got in one time, group that was nice but we tanked before getting to Frizz. Was not able to find enough folk after that to go in and try again. I think odds are better early on than later and it was later that I tried…. Hubby and I managed all but two of the Atherblade Caches – two of the jumping puzzles were just beyond us. So we are at 11 of 12 for this. We are proud of what we managed, sorry we were not able to get the rest but there you go – obviously for us it was not meant to be. We had a fun time with what we did do and did get some good rewards. Overall we both got two tickets each so we feel it was time well spent even if we did not get the end part. Hubby did not attempt the jumping puzzle. I did and got pretty far before falling. I will probably try that again since the steam thingies are a lot like the dragonball playing so if you position yourself right you go right up to where you want to. Part I fell was stationary, lol.

Definitely not tired of it even if I couldn’t finish. It was a fun run to see if we could. We managed the last event and hope the next one we can.

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Posted by: Keira Wildflower.7304

Keira Wildflower.7304

I love GW2.. I really do.. but being a completionest this isn’t fair in the slightest.. You said "let’s make it for the casual player.. then you go back on that phrase and stomp it into the ground.. Why turn away from the majority players when the ones who complain that the game is too easy don’t make handicaps for themselves? They can fight with a stick if they are that awesome.. anything that difficult should be permanent so us casual players can get better and take it down. Please fix this!! I’m prolly not gonna get my achievements now.. I did Dragon Bash in 3 days and worked hard to get them before time ran out cuz I didn’t have any internet for 2 months so I missed flame and frost.. I just want achievements….

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Posted by: Ayrilana.1396

Ayrilana.1396

Not everything in the game can be a faceroll.

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Posted by: binidj.5734

binidj.5734

Not everything in the game can be a faceroll.

Nor would I want it to be, however making challenging content temporary basically silos it off from the casual player. If you’re a skilled player then you can complete the Aetherblade Retreat and get the Obsidian Sanctum cache with ease; however if you’re a casual player who takes time to practice in an effort to overcome challenges then content that doesn’t give you time to practice puts it out of your reach.

As it stands, I won’t make it through the boss fights in Aetherblade Retreat unless I’m carried; give me a couple of months on it though and I might be looking at getting some of the achievements (eg. Faster Than Light). As for the Obsidian Sanctum cache, well some groups appear to be using that as an excuse to farm PvE players, and because it’s a short window of opportunity there’s more PvEers than normal passing through the puzzle.

In short, if your content is temporary then actually yes, it does need to be “faceroll easy” or, as we casuals like to call it “normal difficulty.” If content is permanent then make it as challenging as you like, we’ll have all the time in the world to go back and practice if we want to.

Glad to be [Grey] – http://thegrey.enjin.com/home
Piken Square

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Posted by: Gyl.1238

Gyl.1238

I rarely post but want to add my comments in support of several who have posted here. I like this dungeon. I like that it is more challenging. It is hard and in my opinion that is good. But as someone who also likes to try and get all the achievements – and especially so now that achievements will give you rewards – I am not happy about the time-limited nature of this content. I have completed the dungeon twice but would like to try and get all of achievements. Work this week has meant that I have not had as much time to play. Each group I have done this dungeon with has been different. To get all of the achievements requires practice and therefore requires time. This content should either be around longer or permanent.

Whilst getting new content every two weeks sounds great, if it is content like this with this degree of difficulty but only available for a short time, then for me – as a completionist – playing will become more stressful and less enjoyable.

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Posted by: Anakita Snakecharm.4360

Anakita Snakecharm.4360

In short, if your content is temporary then actually yes, it does need to be “faceroll easy” or, as we casuals like to call it “normal difficulty.” If content is permanent then make it as challenging as you like, we’ll have all the time in the world to go back and practice if we want to.

I agree. I also think that temporary basic story content in particular needs to be pretty accessible. It’s one thing when the dungeon is something extra, but when this dungeon pretty much is the story for this chapter, I think players should be able to have a reasonable expectation of just being able to play through it to see the plot.

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Posted by: Pixelpumpkin.4608

Pixelpumpkin.4608

Not everything in the game can be a faceroll.

In short, if your content is temporary then actually yes, it does need to be “faceroll easy” or, as we casuals like to call it “normal difficulty.” If content is permanent then make it as challenging as you like, we’ll have all the time in the world to go back and practice if we want to.

Thank you for pointing this out. I feel that this point has been completely neglected in the discussion so far. I would like to elaborate on it some more:

Casual players have limited time to play. But that does not just apply to this week. They’ve most likely had limited time to play since the beginning.

That means

  • They may not have had the time (or felt the need) to sit down and learn the nooks and crannies of their character class(es); or to build up the elaborate knowledge to trait and skill for maximum efficiency. Their build may be kind of random.
  • They may not have the funds to get the best exotic armour for their playstyle. Their armour may well be a mix and match.
  • They very certainly haven’t had time to do 60 explorable dungeons for a set of rabid armour.
  • They may not have planned ahead – they may have spent their karma on whatever seemed useful at the time (and why wouldn’t they, if that was always good enough) and may not have ~ 300k karma for soldier’s armour or 150+ gold for sentinel’s armour
  • They may not have assembled enough laurels or guild commendation (let alone fractal tokens and vials) for ascended jewellery and back pieces. (I have some of each, but not enough of either to fully gear myself in purple.)
  • They may not even be level 80 (although I know many players who made it to level 80 on multiple characters without becoming pro players).

And you know what, PvE (the core game, I might add) difficulty levels suggest that this casual playstyle is okay. Then suddenly the living story content suggests it is no longer good enough, and people need to L2P within 2 weeks. If you look at the list above, that is a lot more of catching up to do than to simply understand the boss fight mechanics.

(I pointed out rabid, soldier’s and sentinel’s as these are the set that myself and friends of mine have been recommended for better survivability or efficiency.)

Just because you, dear non-casual player, with your specific build, min-maxed stats, fully optimally traited and skilled, geared in exotics and ascended items character(s) find the normal PvE content too easy and boring, doesn’t mean that it is face-roll easy for a casual player. For a casual player with their non-min-maxed, random gear character, this is indeed normal difficulty.

You, with all the time you’ve had to build up knowledge and assemble gear, may be soloing champions for fun, but you cannot assume that everybody else is on your level.

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Posted by: Conner.4702

Conner.4702

Not everything in the game can be a faceroll.

In short, if your content is temporary then actually yes, it does need to be “faceroll easy” or, as we casuals like to call it “normal difficulty.” If content is permanent then make it as challenging as you like, we’ll have all the time in the world to go back and practice if we want to.

Thank you for pointing this out. I feel that this point has been completely neglected in the discussion so far. I would like to elaborate on it some more:

Casual players have limited time to play. But that does not just apply to this week. They’ve most likely had limited time to play since the beginning.

That means

  • They may not have had the time (or felt the need) to sit down and learn the nooks and crannies of their character class(es); or to build up the elaborate knowledge to trait and skill for maximum efficiency. Their build may be kind of random.
  • They may not have the funds to get the best exotic armour for their playstyle. Their armour may well be a mix and match.
  • They very certainly haven’t had time to do 60 explorable dungeons for a set of rabid armour.
  • They may not have planned ahead – they may have spent their karma on whatever seemed useful at the time (and why wouldn’t they, if that was always good enough) and may not have ~ 300k karma for soldier’s armour or 150+ gold for sentinel’s armour
  • They may not have assembled enough laurels or guild commendation (let alone fractal tokens and vials) for ascended jewellery and back pieces. (I have some of each, but not enough of either to fully gear myself in purple.)
  • They may not even be level 80 (although I know many players who made it to level 80 on multiple characters without becoming pro players).

And you know what, PvE (the core game, I might add) difficulty levels suggest that this casual playstyle is okay. Then suddenly the living story content suggests it is no longer good enough, and people need to L2P within 2 weeks. If you look at the list above, that is a lot more of catching up to do than to simply understand the boss fight mechanics.

(I pointed out rabid, soldier’s and sentinel’s as these are the set that myself and friends of mine have been recommended for better survivability or efficiency.)

Just because you, dear non-casual player, with your specific build, min-maxed stats, fully optimally traited and skilled, geared in exotics and ascended items character(s) find the normal PvE content too easy and boring, doesn’t mean that it is face-roll easy for a casual player. For a casual player with their non-min-maxed, random gear character, this is indeed normal difficulty.

You, with all the time you’ve had to build up knowledge and assemble gear, may be soloing champions for fun, but you cannot assume that everybody else is on your level.

As a casual player your reply and the guy you quoted completely irk me. Casual != Unskilled, which both of you seem to try and perpetuate. I don’t min-max, I don’t have properly statted gear, I certainly don’t know my class to perfection especially the one I did the dungeon on.

Casual and Hardcore doesn’t say anything about a players skill level. Are there more skilled hardcore players, yes. That is due to experience though and experience is just a minor factor in skill. You can train a monkey to do tasks to perfection, but that is often just a matter of repetition.

I spend a total of 5 times in the Dungeon and have all the achievements, because I am a skilled player, not because I am uberleet hardcore master of death. On top of that I have a physical handicap that can easily get me killed. That being really bad eye sight

Do the achievements have issues sure.

It requires a good group to get them. Dead weight probably means 1 or all of the harder achievements will fail. If people die at Frizz it means it is just that much harder for the surviving members to get the achievement. Can still be done though.
Having to res people at the end is also an issue, but there is some leeway as long as you know what to do.

Intelligence is more important than experience when it comes to skill.

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Posted by: Bezayne.6459

Bezayne.6459

First time into AR I did it with a pug, with two players being up leveled from the 30ies to boot. Only one of the group had seen the dungeon before and made it past the laser room. It took us two tries to beat the lasers, as in: see it once and get the idea, then do it.

Sadly after that we couldn’t proceed due to the common bug of the NPC not opening the gate to the last boss.

In the end I did the achievements with a guild group, and even though we had one or even two people rather prone to dying we still made it. Granted, especially the last boss achievements are about teamwork, which is a matter of luck with pugs.

So I do not think at all this dungeon is too hard, it offers a little bit of welcome challenge. Now this being coupled with achievements and time-limited is a bad idea, and people are justifiably annoyed about it. I would very much welcome more challenging parts in the game, just make them optional and don’t time-pressure people into doing them!

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Posted by: Spencer.1386

Spencer.1386

I spent a pretty substantial amount of time running the Aetherblade dungeon. The difficulty of the fights was fine (I’ve solo’d the laser golem boss and two manned Mai. No enrage timer on bosses makes most content trivial if you are patient). The duration of the event however should have been longer.

Two week long content just doesn’t seem like enough time for players to get to fully experience the dungeon content. A lot of players in the pugs I ran with had never even gotten past the first boss after a week of trying to run the dungeon.

Bad players exist and while I dislike that they never learn or improve their abilities (watching the boss fight when you are dead instead of alt tabbing to youtube is a GREAT way to learn the fight). I still think they deserve more time to clear the content. A month would seem to fitting for a decently difficult dungeon with some rather infuriating achievements attached.

“Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games.”
- Mike Obrien

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Posted by: Draknar.5748

Draknar.5748

Casual player can get mini, pro player can get mini, neither has to do dungeon for mini. If you are a completionist and want every achievement then you are not a casual player and need to l2p. The difficulty of this dungeon is perfect. So what you might wipe 10 times on an encounter – that’s how you learn.

I won’t stop because I can’t stop.

It’s a medical condition, they say its terminal….

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Posted by: Meriem.3504

Meriem.3504

Casual player can get mini, pro player can get mini, neither has to do dungeon for mini. If you are a completionist and want every achievement then you are not a casual player and need to l2p. The difficulty of this dungeon is perfect. So what you might wipe 10 times on an encounter – that’s how you learn.

The problem is I need more time to L2P!

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Posted by: ghettogenius.9174

ghettogenius.9174

The difficulty of this dungeon is perfect for the right group.

That is what you meant to say. This is a matter of perspective, and perhaps luck in group setup if you pug. I have no issues with the difficulty in general. I rather enjoyed the challenge. However, after 5 attempts, 15 hours, various group compositions and no completion – I just can’t agree that it is perfect. Perfect for kitten ing many players off maybe. There is a flaw somewhere – and you can’t just completely blame it on the players. Some people fail to adapt that’s for sure. The learning curve for failure seems to be a bit steep IMO.

I know what I’m doing – dragging corpses past Frizz, rezzing the whole team vs Mai. I got my mini and FTL, but somehow can’t find a group to stay alive during the barrage for a completion? Groups got worse as the event went on too from my point of view.

Bad luck? L2P? Join a guild lol. I’ve heard it all. Ironic thing is before this week I could give a kitten about the achievement points but now that they are inextricably attached to various rewards, well that’s another story now isn’t it?

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Posted by: daicon.2476

daicon.2476

I was with a pretty solid group earlier, but we kept failing at FTL. Once two or more people get hit we have to start over, and well, eventually the group just falls apart.

The argument isn’t about the content being hard. It’s about the limited time sillyness that Anet is sold on that is birthing all these complaints. Honestly, the whole mess is stupid.

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Posted by: Behellagh.1468

Behellagh.1468

I have little or no skill with JPs. So I was able to get 4 caches without problems but that was it. I gave up trying to to Vexx’s after 2 hours, at one point Vexx’s instanced crashed and everyone inside ended up at the entrance to the cave.

Vexx’s was the only cache in Ascalon (but 3 in Maguuma) and since the holo projectors weren’t even close to 50/50 spitting out Aethers to fight farming was the only option and since I couldn’t get far enough into Vexx’s, those two achievements were unreachable as well.

Please, not all of us have grown up playing platformers, please don’t one chunk of achievements behind JPs and nearly all the rest in a Dungeon. At least Southsun and Dragon Bash were doable without the need of reflexes of youth.

So in the end I had only 9 of the 12 to get the pet prize. Good thing I’m not a pet collector or I would have felt shortchanged.

We are heroes. This is what we do!

RIP City of Heroes

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Posted by: Xavos.9357

Xavos.9357

the dungeon is not hard at all, what is hard is finding the right players to do it with, because some really are just plain noobs that cant see how the mechanics are and couldn’t even get it after explaining it to them

Xavos – Guardian
Rasz Algethi – Hunter
Fort Aspenwood

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Posted by: IndigoSundown.5419

IndigoSundown.5419

Please, not all of us have grown up playing platformers, please don’t one chunk of achievements behind JPs and nearly all the rest in a Dungeon. At least Southsun and Dragon Bash were doable without the need of reflexes of youth.

^This also applies to the Frizz fight. I would have no issue with that fight in a permanent explorable dungeon. The manual dexterity requirement is beyond what arthritis allows me to do. I was shocked to find a fight like this in a supposedly story mode dungeon.

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Posted by: kimeekat.2548

kimeekat.2548

Yeah, I actually really liked the dungeon even though I only played it once, died a ton of times (4 medium armors, 1 light), and we didn’t make it halfway through the last fight. But I can see how, now that I’ve read how to beat Mai, it would be easier (mind hinting at mechanics in-game? That would be really nice). Make that kind of tough ‘ish permanent, please. I have no problem playing it repeatedly for achievements, but I just do not have that kind of time (+dailies, +weekly guild events, +reality). I’m terrible at jumping puzzles (lots of lag lately, my main is a Norn, no checkpoints on Not So Secret areyoukiddingme), so I’ve been less and less excited for the cache system that seems to get its jollies off JPs being the main feature of Living Story stuff.

Unfortunately, I have a family and a full time job so I’ve come to find I don’t count when it comes to Living Story completion. 2 weeks… ridiculous.

Clove Zolan – Bringers of Aggro [Oops] – Blackgate