Guild Wars 2

Now as much as I love to gamble and try my hand at games of chance, I simply have neither the money, nor like the possible rewards for this RNG gamble. Not to mention I’m saving my gems for the next unlimited use harvesting tool.

Not me boycotting RNG chests

As someone who has spent $300 on RNG chests, Halloween/consortium chest/wintersday an now the crates. I can say it hasn’t been worth it. Opened 100 Halloween chests and got nothing. Opened $60 worth of wintersday presents and did get enough to get foostivoo but no ticket to get a weapon skin. Opened 10 of the crates an got 1 shoulder skin that’s been around since the karka event. Not to mention all the BL keys I’ve bought.

I’ve bought ITEMS on the gem store an i get what i pay for, i buy RNG and i get a pain in my anus.

Treeline.3865:

No. This is not possible. Anet does not throw gems into the system. Only players do. If players do not buy gems, prices will go up as we have seen since launch. The result is that gem price will only go up until players can’t afford them anymore, at which point they will have to buy gems or miss out.

Higher gem to gold price also means that there will be players converting the opposite way of course. Anet will not miss out.

I alluded this to above. There will be an increse in gem price, as has been demonstrated numerous times in the past. And with that, came the complaints of individuals who refuse to outright purchase gems. And thus, just shifting the discontent to that community. Why is their discontent any less significant that that of those who don’t like RNG? Even if it does come down, just looking at rate history shows that any jumps in rates are never fully corrected in the short term (when the items are available).

So, even if I grant that revenue won’t be affected (which I don’t personally believe). All this does is shift the discontent from one group to another. Is that considered a “solution”?

Ok, wasting real money is better in favour of those who just make gold by consuming a game?

And I know you are playing devils advocate here. If they think it’s a nice way to make revenue let them do so, but they and you too should accept the down-side of that, that people get angry about their behaviour (and hopefully don’t buy).

Clearly the majority of players dissagree with this post. Anet tried doing the whole buy skins directly thing for wintersday. Guess what, they weren’t rare since everyone could get them so no one bought them. It was a failure. Anet has repeatedly said that they will put things in the gem shop based on what players like to buy. Significantly more people spend more money at the chance for a rare skin then those who buy a skin everyone has access too directly.

You have no one to blame but the players themselves for this.

Interesting that you seem to have their sales-figures.

Mourningcry.9428:

I’d love to see you, or any other likeminded individual, offer an acceptable, reasonable alternative revenue stream for ANet to substitute for removing the BL chests.

I’ve yet to see a single such proposition backed up with any type of financial analysis. Would love to see such a post. (And don’t just come back with "make the items direct purchases. Gotta offer more than that… A little thought, and basic math invalidates that kind of thought. At the very least you’d have to show some kind of pricing methodology for it to be a viable consideration).

Honestly, I cant. But of course it’s not my job to dream up revenue streams for game companies. I am merely a consumer, and as consumer I think I prefer to pay a straight up monthly fee and be exposed to an environment where all players can reach the same goals without mass amounts of RNG and blind luck. I would rather rely on time and effort to get me through to those goals.

Unfortunately the F2P model has taken over the industry and is here to stay. Companies clearly are making more money this way as opposed to being subscription based. Consumers think they are getting a deal, but in the long term they probably spend more on the RNG items than they would with a flat fee. Sure, super casual players don’t need to drop a dime, but most of them won’t be buying up RNG items from the store either. I’m sure there are some exceptions.

As an informed consumer, I refuse to buy items in game for a “chance” to get something – unless it is something absolutely amazing and I REALLY REALLY want it. Haven’t come across that yet.

Also, I wouldn’t pay more than what a sub would cost for that month, that would just be silly. Especially considering the RNG game comes around each month. No, I am the sort of player which you need to collect the money up front, and if the “free” version doesn’t provide enough or locks me out of too much then I’ll just find another form of entertainment.

ZudetGambeous no one bought the wintersday skins because they looked like kitten I wouldn’t want those skins if they where free.

ghettogenius.9174:

Honestly, I cant. But of course it’s not my job to dream up revenue streams for game companies. I am merely a consumer, and as consumer I think I prefer to pay a straight up monthly fee and be exposed to an environment where all players can reach the same goals without mass amounts of RNG and blind luck. I would rather rely on time and effort to get me through to those goals.

Unfortunately the F2P model has taken over the industry and is here to stay. Companies clearly are making more money this way as opposed to being subscription based.

/snip

Yep. Pretty much with you on this.

I bought the wintersday long bow for my norn ranger, I liked the bows. The rest were meh.

I will not be buying keys or crates anymore, certainly not this time around. Put the skins in the gem store and if I like it I’ll buy what I don’t have to gamble for, thanks!

Vayne.8563:

While in the past I’ve bought black lion keys, I’ve made the personal decision not to buy keys or chests, because I dislike the cash for RNG thing.

I’m not calling for a boycott, but I am choosing to express my personal displeasure.

Shame too. I really like the new skins..but not enough to play the RNG game for them. Maybe I’ll get one from a chest drop.

I don’t buy them. I come from a game which heavily used rng boxes, and I swore to myself: never again. It helps that I – contrary to you – don’t like the skins.

I want that Sclerite shotgun. Unfortunately I like the guild skin more, so I just bought the 2 miniatures and am done with anything that might come out of the chests.

I’m going to pass, the “new armour skins” are just the island things from november, the regular drops are found everywhere now, and the only new things added are the minis and weapon ticket, neither of which are interesting enough motivation for me to get the chest rather than hope some drop

when evaluating if I should get something or not, locking it behind RNG is a significant turn off, either it needs a guarantee that I’m getting SOMETHING unique from it, or I’m not buying it, I could easily spend £12 for 10 boxes and get nothing but karka shells and passiflora, both of which I can just kill mobs to get

I won’t be buying chests, but that’s nothing new for me, I haven’t bought anything other than some transmutation crystals off the gem store, and that was with gold bought gems.

Mourningcry.9428:

Chopps.5047:

You must be an engineer—great display of estimation skill. Here’s an alternative : make more skins and sell them (non-rng) for less per unit but make more money via volume. Of course, that takes more effort than hiding the odds from people who are not as gifted as yourself at estimation. RNG boxes play to the LCD <— there’s my math.

Thanks

As I mentioned above, the problem with offering cheaper purchases is that players can simply use gold to convert to gems, and negating any revenue what so ever to ANet. And then you get the cascading issues there (unfavorable exchange rate, etc.). The number of avaialable items isn’t so much the issue. Rather, it’s the price of the items due explcitily to the gold to gem mechanism.

Chopps.5047:

Btw, again, good dimensional analysis there. 13k gems/skin. Based on the unbreakable choir bell research, I would estimate a drop rate of 0.004% (1 in 25,000)—with an accelerated rate at the start of the event to make the odds appear better than they really are over the course pf the week. This puts us well above 100k gems/skin. Thoughts?

Would agree that drop rate is pretty representative for the Choir Bell. Given that, and the unique attributes and attractiveness to some players, it’s amazing that it’s currently only 68 on the TP going for ~48G each (compared to a SAB skins going for 10-75% of that) – it’s a steal. Simply put, 48G is a tiny fraction of the value of what it argueably would have taken to acquire one, yet, there they are. But this really just goes to show there’s a ceiling for just how much the market will value an item regardless of rarity.

So, that kind of dovetails back into the individual pricing problem. What’s the least you can charge for one of those items without risking losing too much revenue to gold to gem conversion, while at the same time, making it high enough to not exceed the market’s valuation of that item. I dunno.

I’m just repeating this because it’s probably one of the most insightful things. Ty morningcry

If I’m going to gamble real money it’s going to be for real money, not virtual skins. I’ll never spend $$$ on keys or chests, I don’t care what’s in them.

Yeah, after blowing a lot of gold on keys during the F&F and only getting one ticket to show for it I’m going to pass.

I don’t even like the look of these weapon skins.

But I will try to get those minis on the TP.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Clearly the majority of players dissagree with this post. Anet tried doing the whole buy skins directly thing for wintersday. Guess what, they weren’t rare since everyone could get them so no one bought them. It was a failure. Anet has repeatedly said that they will put things in the gem shop based on what players like to buy. Significantly more people spend more money at the chance for a rare skin then those who buy a skin everyone has access too directly.

You have no one to blame but the players themselves for this.

I didn’t buy the Wintersday skins because they didn’t look good enough for me to spend any amount of time or effort to obtain, as they were mostly goofy wooden toy themed.

Had they offered something ice themed and cool looking, that might have been a different story. Anet only has themselves to blame for making something that a lot of us did not want to buy, gamble, or grind for at all.

For the price of $10 aka 800 gems, I’d expect at least 15 crates, so at least I don’t feel half as humiliated.

It takes 30minutes to get some Flowers and Karka Shells that these 10 crates would give, plus maybe they’d of dropped a free crate themselves.

When You put Braham and Rox’s weapons in the gem store to directly buy them, I thought you learned your players hated feeling discouraged with the Low chance at Fused weapons and such.. But apparently not.

I’m not trying to complain, but its hard not to when I feel as ripped off. I’m just saying, you wont see me, or anyone I tell this to, spending any gems on these or future chests.
I’m happy I paid for the Deluxe Version of this game, it is a great game.
But I am unhappy with this extra $10 dollar (Plus about 20gold) investment I made on these crates. I am happy however, it was only a small investment.

Good day,
-Ehmry Bay President

Im not buying gambling chests nor gambling keys, specially because the drop rates of the stuff Id be interested is so low that it is cheaper just to buy the gold then buy the itens in the AH.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Clearly the majority of players dissagree with this post. Anet tried doing the whole buy skins directly thing for wintersday. Guess what, they weren’t rare since everyone could get them so no one bought them. It was a failure. Anet has repeatedly said that they will put things in the gem shop based on what players like to buy. Significantly more people spend more money at the chance for a rare skin then those who buy a skin everyone has access too directly.

You have no one to blame but the players themselves for this.

You cannot prove the assertions I’ve highlighted in bold in your post. Since RNG items still appear, one can assume ANet is making money on them. However, there’s no way for us to know if it’s a majority of players, or a minority of players who are willing to spend large sums to get their rare shiny.

I won’t be buying chests or keys going forward. It’s simply not a rewarding model.

Caedmon.6798:

Vayne.8563:

Caedmon.6798:

Vayne.8563:

Caedmon.6798:

Flissy.4093:

Assyrian.4827:

We have players under the age of 18 if they do buy it is that illegal(online gambling).

It’s not gambling. You are GUARENTEED to get something, just maybe not what you want.

I guess lucky dips should be illegal for children too.

It is gambling.The item you want is not guaranteed when opening the chest,you buy the chests to get a chance on the weapon skins,and nothing else..How in the world are you missing the fact that this is gambling ?

Gambling “. To take a risk in the hope of gaining an advantage or a benefit.” " An act or undertaking of uncertain outcome; a risk: I took a gamble that stock prices would rise."

It’s not gambling, because you don’t have to buy it for the skin. The skin is just one possible item that you can get. It’s like buying a raffle. You get a raffle without any guarantee of getting anything except that you get nothing for buying it and only get something if you win. In this case, you’re buying something which contains something. It’s not TECHNICALLY gambling.

If you put a dollar in a slot machine there’s no guarantee you get anything out of it. If you buy a consortium chest, you get something for your money.

I mean for years, cereal packets have random prices in them. Collect all the toys. Collect all the stickers. We’ve seen McDonalds have a monopoly game where you have to get different pieces to get a chance to win.

Gambling? Nah, not really. But it’s still annoying as hell. lol

.Read the definition of gambling,because it is.And dont even compare gambling to cereal packets,wich you buy to Feed yourself and the toy is a little extra,you dont get a chance to get food,you get food for 100% and a chance on a toy.In this case,i would buy the chest to get the skin since im not interested in getting anything else,now if im buying 100 boxes because i want the weapon skin and i keep getting something else,How is this not gambling….? You can keep telling yourself it isn’t,but it is.

Again..Gambling; An act or undertaking of uncertain outcome; a risk
I buy those chest to get a weapon with uncertain outcome…it’s a risk……

By your definition then, running a dungeon for tokens is a risk too, because there’s no guarantee you’ll complete it. It may be gambling in your mind, it’s not gambling by law. And that’s sorta what matters. You can’t regulate something that isn’t gambling.

Baseball cards have random cards in them, you buy them in packs for real money and there’s no guarantee you’ll get a good card. It’s not considered gambling.

It’s not by my definition,it’s by the Dictionairy’s definition,wich you can’t seem to grasp.

I think what you are not grasping is it really doesn’t matter if it falls under the term gambling. Because even if it is a gamble in theory, it has no legal basis here. No laws can be applied, no one can fight “the man”, no one can take legal action against Arenanet or NCsoft for it. You do not gain real cash by “gambling” in game. So sure, call it gambling, but don’t try and make people think it is the same as real life gambling, or make it sound like arenanet is somehow influencing our children into gambling addiction or some crap like that. The gamble isn’t a win or lose, the gamble is on WHAT you win.

i had it in my mind to spend 25g for gem conversion to see if i could get a ticket from the crates and another 25g after if i didn’t. so 50g in total.

anyway, went to ss after i woke up early and couldn’t get back to sleep and in the second crate the dropped, i received a ticket.

guess i won’t be spending that g after all, but yes, i would have. just set limits on how much you want to spend and have the willpower to stop yourself when you get there. i find that people in general don’t have any willpower when it comes to games of chance. the thrill of winning on the ‘next one-more try’ is very alluring…enough to make people do things they didn’t want to initially.

I would also like to add, that while the quiver was tempting, I’m tired of “temporary” sales. Add cosmetic armour and weapon skins to the store and keep them there.

Same reason why I am not going for the minis either.
I love to collect and have a complete collection – in time I could even spend the money for it – but I will not be pressured. As such collecting became secondary for me.

Find a more balanced approach to roll out items in the store and not just temporary vs again another set of town clothes (why I’m not buying those is another subject).

So why did you spend 10$ then? Also, you can hardly call spending $$ on gamble investment.
If somebody forced you to spend money against your will you have all my sympathies.

As much as it sucks for you I have to admit I’m happy you came to this conclusion.

Hopefully if enough people refuse to buy RNG boxes they’ll stop selling them and offer the items another way.

They wouldn’t do it if people didn’t pay for it. Tell anyone else in the game what a terrible waste it was and hope that eventually people will stop buying into the RNG cash shop items.

I have to hope that eventually everyone will get burned and learn the lesson but so far that obviously hasn’t happened yet.

I won’t be.

I went the slightly cheaper route of buying gold with gems and then buying materials to make the RNG chests during the Lost Shores event, got lucky and got a mini karka for about what it would have cost to just buy it from the trading post.

I completely refused to buy the Wintersday ones after they made the minis account bound and from what I’ve heard the drop rate is so low this time that it’s not worth the risk.

I use to have no problem spending money on this game.Now i didnt spend a lot maybe $150 in 5 months but them days are over.It was bad enough with how rare fused weapon skins were but at least you had a choice to do key runs.You dont even have that with this event.You either need to get extremely lucky and get chest drops or buy chests for a slim chance at getting a weapon skin.

I dont want sympathy. I never asked for that once.
I just want everyone to know what a waste it is, and if this is ANET’s plan to support their game, then forget it, they need a new plan.

I dont mind paying 10 dollars for the exact skin I want. But paying over 10 dollars for a low chance at a skin I might get… yeah not ever doing that again.
^Thats what I wanted people to see. How silly that sounds.
I just was hopping this time the chances were not as bad. But they are.

Luckily i’ve gotten 4 to drop within about 9-10 hours of farming…. But still nothing.

This is their business model, the target customers are those who would spend money to buy RNG stuffs. They are motivated because those skins would be rare and has perceived value. You want it? Pay it! That’s simple enough. I don’t know why people would be upset by this RNG things… just ignore it!

I just spent thirty dollars on southsun boxes. 26 of them dropped nothing but passion fruit and passion flowers. I’m just done with this game. This solidifies the fact that Arena Net does not deserve my money. I wanted one freaking skin and the odds are so stacked against getting it that there is no point in buying anything that requires chance.

Bought 20 crates got all mats! Karka shells, passion fruits and passion flowers. Never again Anet, Never again.

…I tried to warn people not to gamble for one skin :/ I tried.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/southsun/A-Public-Service-Announcement/first#post2027421

Thanks for supporting their RNG money-making bs.

It’s whatever.. It just solidifies the need to get away from this game to one that actually appreciates it’s customer.

I’m sorry that you had bad luck with RNG. Unfortunately that’s just how those chests work. You don’t have to quit over this.

Nobody forced you to spend real life cash on a small possibility of getting pixels in a video game. With the way that regular BL chests work, it should be pretty obvious that there’s a very small chance of getting what you want from any of their RNG boxes.

A fool and their money are soon parted!

Well, maybe he don;t have to but I’m not suprised. Okay, fair enough you can’t say that’s Anet fault cause he knew what he was doing, but again…having 0,xxx % chance to drop token, makes that skin less accessible than precursor lol. Why can’t this be solved by making that skins accesible by hard work, or by Gem store directly ? Blocking gamers to acquire wanted skins makes me wanna leave that game too.

Wildly appropriate:

We need to protest RNG real money items. Nobody should buy things like black lion keys or these chests. We need to make it clear that the GW2 community does not like it.

I feel your pain, RNG is worst thing ever. Especially for a game that has already lost tons of players. If they wanted to make their customers happy they should have put them up for 400 gems each like brhams mace and shield. But this is just their way to make money. Its exploiting the customers who have gambling addictions. I bought 35 chests for the fused skins with my gold and also some real money and did not get 1 key. i did however get full makeover and 2 hair makeovers. but thats still bs. i will not spend any rl money this time, i learned my lesson.

lol dude… ignore it… wait until you gonna like some weapon skin that would be accesible only by RNG…

Pay it ! … ok I can spend even 50 bucks but I demand a solid thing, not some kitten craft loot.

I agree with you, but I feel no sympathy for your story. ANet clearly stated that the items were a rare chance. Previous content definitely suggested that spending a lot of money != getting what you want. Finally there were PSA about not doing this very thing.

However, I agree that these skins should be directly purchasable, and not in chests. Spend a few dollars and get the skin you want. If it worked like that, waaaay more people would do it. It’d be happier for players and increased revenue for ANet. This system hurts both, and I am unsure why they continue to use it.

Done for the ordinary people (poor); there are many rich kids out there enjoying getting rare RNG items. If you aren’t those kids, you need to let go the urge of owning everything you want in game. Don’t let the game control you.

Or you just play for free and not spending all the extra money? You really need a skin that bad you’d spend 30$

Thanks for supporting ANET! More content here I come!!!!

I have to assume that the RNG boxes bring in a fair amount of revenue for a.net, or else they wouldn’t be doing it this way. People were talking about spending literally hundreds of dollars to try to get the fused stuff, so I’d believe it.