Guild Wars 2

The average will be much higher for anyone who’s not that lucky. So who’s willing to risk 400+ gold on the off chance of gaining notihng in return? If very few people actually attempt to do it, because of the unreliable chance for profit, there won’t really be that many of them around, hence the market will be cornered and the prices will soar far above their statistical value since the statistics are so unreliable.

But yes, at the end of the day, just increasing the drop chance to something that can be realistically attempted would effectively stabilize the price and solve the whole problem.

I still see absolutely no reason why there should be more ways to get legendary precursors.

It offers no additional stats whatsoever over weapons that are craftable for 2-3g, so progression or wvw usefulness is a non-issue.

It is the rarest weapon in the game, meant to be legendary.

You want to talk about “fair”? How about what’s fair to people who managed to work for 200g and purchase it off the TP, and then Anet releases a new method to easily craft them, thus plummeting the value of the item.

Again, find a way to effectively make money to buy the precursor you want. Or find a way to craft it. Or hope you get luckl. Or settle for a less-expensive precursor. Or settle for a pearl weapon.

Legendaries aren’t about equality. It’s about either hoping you get lucky, or being smart enough + work hard enough to obtain sufficient money so that you don’t have to be lucky.

I know it’s harsh, but honestly it’s the only sensible approach to a weapon with a “legendary” tag. Right now legendaries are priceless considering their extreme rarity, and that’s the way it should stay.

Or drop $1150 on gems. It’s probably the best choice atm.

DeathTouch, I’m perfectly fine with paying the fair price of 200 gold, even though the people who got them early would pay as little as 60 gold.

What’s so unfair about wanting the price to remain stable? Why should I be punished with 10 times higher prices just because I’m taking my time.

I want the legendary to be my endgame, something I accomplish after long long months of persistent play. I just want that goal to be set so I can see myself progress towards it instead of watching the end getting farther and farther away.

I’ll always defend having to work hard for your accomplishment but I won’t defend exclusivity for the tiniest amounts of people at the top.

Edit: I just checked the TP and Dusk is now going for 299 gold. Will it be 400 tomorrow? So where’s that fair price of 200 gold we were talking about? This is exactly what I’m talking about. The price just rose by another 100 gold, apparently at the whim of a single person.

I totally agree, Luck should not be a factor this only rewards those A H o l e s that exploited a broken game at launch and now control the AH on precursers. Something needs to be changed with how we aquire these. the weapons already take forever to make.

Archer.6485:

DeathTouch, I’m perfectly fine with paying the fair price of 200 gold, even though the people who got them early would pay as little as 60 gold.

What’s so unfair about wanting the price to remain stable? Why should I be punished with 10 times higher prices just because I’m taking my time.

I want the legendary to be my endgame, something I accomplish after long long months of persistent play. I just want that goal to be set so I can see myself progress towards it instead of watching the end getting farther and farther away.

I’ll always defend having to work hard for your accomplishment but I won’t defend exclusivity for the tiniest amounts of people at the top.

Edit: I just checked the TP and Dusk is now going for 299 gold. Will it be 400 tomorrow? So where’s that fair price of 200 gold we were talking about? This is exactly what I’m talking about. The price just rose by another 100 gold, apparently at the whim of a single person.

Price is increasing because demand is increasing at a faster rate than supply. Demand will eventually cap and, assuming inflation is under reasonable control, price will eventually stabilize.

Realize precursors sold earlier for 150g or less because:

1) People hadn’t yet acquired more than 150g and;

2) Demand rose sharply after the initial weapons were finished and everyone saw how awesome they are.

This is basically a simulation of what happens in real life with regards to perfect diamonds of sizable quality. It’s known there is an extremely limited production of these diamonds from mines. A combination of extremely limited supply coincides with extremely high demand and shoots the price higher than 99% of the population can afford.

Well it’s going to be a real kitten to stabilize that price when there are only 1 or 2 available at any given time. It’s way too easy to monopolize that kind of market and put up the maximum possible price.

At this rate of them appearing I doubt the Demand for them will cap anytime soon and probably at a completely stupid high number.

My fear is that because of my slow ingame income (I suck at farming ok? I never even reach the DR.) I’ll be forced to do 10x the effort of those that did it fast and early. That is not my idea of stabilization.

Supply wont stabilize the price. the price for achieving/crafting one will.

So I am no math genius but currently lvl 75 rare greatswords are 20-22s with a need of 4 pr craft and a speculated drop chance of 0,2% (No official word that magic find helps – But mmo superstition forces me to blow this out of proportion aswell and get everything)

2000 rare greatswords (0,2% chance*500 tries =100% chance – this is incorrect but the closest i could get over my napkin maths) equals to a price of around 400g as the top market value for this item!

400g…

400g…

10g for 50 euros… Only 2000 euros for a pixel sword… Bargain I say!

This needs to be fixed and set into proportion with other hard to get exotics!

In regards to the diamond theory above. You could look as Anet as the diamond supplier.

Diamond suppliers world wide are grossly holding back supply for profits which is against the free market values!

If all diamonds in stock were put on the market a diamond (even a perfect one) could be bought for pocket change!

(Just fun facts)

I am more bothered with the people that were able to get into the alpha and got knowledge of stuff no one else had any chance to know, and then (ab)using that info to get more money then everyone else, making the whole ‘legendary weapon’ thing a cakewalk.

Pretty much 99.9% of dawn/dusk etc. purchases are made by gold seller companies to just resell at higher price.

Hasek.6807:

Supply wont stabilize the price. the price for achieving/crafting one will.

So I am no math genius but currently lvl 75 rare greatswords are 20-22s with a need of 4 pr craft and a speculated drop chance of 0,2% (No official word that magic find helps – But mmo superstition forces me to blow this out of proportion aswell and get everything)

2000 rare greatswords (0,2% chance*500 tries =100% chance – this is incorrect but the closest i could get over my napkin maths) equals to a price of around 400g as the top market value for this item!

400g…

400g…

10g for 50 euros… Only 2000 euros for a pixel sword… Bargain I say!

This needs to be fixed and set into proportion with other hard to get exotics!

The worst part of this is that even though statistically speaking you should get one after 500 tries, statistics doesn’t mean guarantee.

Five people could be spending 400g each and still not get anything in return just because they were unlucky. On the other hand a really lucky person will get 5 of them in those 500 attempts and be set for life.

It just goes to show how broken the kitten thing really is.

I have zero motivation to throw more rares and exotics into the mystic forge. Seeing hours and days of farming destroyed over and over by stupid RNG makes me sad.

Someone in my previous guild got Dusk on his 20th attempt of adding 4 rares to the MF. How is this fair compared to people who did 10x more tries and still have nothing to show for it.

Malediktus.9250:

I have zero motivation to throw more rares and exotics into the mystic forge. Seeing hours and days of farming destroyed over and over by stupid RNG makes me sad.

Someone in my previous guild got Dusk on his 20th attempt of adding 4 rares to the MF. How is this fair compared to people who did 10x more tries and still have nothing to show for it.

It is fair because they had the same chance of getting a reward on any given attempt. Your old guildmate didn’t exploit the system, didn’t gain any unfair advantage, he was simply lucky. Instead of gambling those rares, maybe it would have been a smarter investment to sell them to others and use the money to buy the precursor outright. (20 × 4 × 10 = 800 rares, at 50s each, less 15% TP fees is 340g—I don’t know the current rates, but thats at least an estimate of what people have put in).

If you want to make it “fair” then the threshold will probably be somewhere around 700 attempts—on your 700th attempt, you get a precursor. Nobody will ever get a precursor before then, and they will get one for every 700 attempts. I find that considerably less fun than chance.

I dont even know if he used that exploit. He got the weapon before that stuff got fixed. But assuming he got it with lvl 80 rares, I still think its unfair some get it in 20 tries and others need 500.

@Malediktus

I don’t mean to single you out, but as the OP, and one of the more outspoken of the contributors of the thread, but you and other like minded posters, keep using the term “fair”, or how “unfair” things are.

RNG, by its very nature, is about as fair as it gets. It doesn’t care who you are, or what you’ve done. It doesn’t care if it’s your first try, or your hundredth.

Anyone can gather all the necessary mats, and get their chance at getting the precursor. Everyone is well aware that it’s just a chance, and things can go bad.

Fairness has nothing to do with the outcome. A player makes a choice whether they wish to risk their materials, or not. Even before that, they can make the choice whether to dedicate themselves to gathering them, or, perhaps they may choose to spend their time and efforts elsewhere.

There is nothing hidden here. Anyone dropping the mats into the MF is well aware of their chances. If they don’t get the outcome they want, it’s not becuase things aren’t fair, it simply is random. They had the same chance they player before them did, and the one after them will.

Fair, unfair – compeltely irrelevant to this discussion as it’s entirely the players choice whether to subject themselves to the conditions of the task they seek an outcome for.

However the chances change randomly and with no warning. Their fix to people getting precursors through the god skull glitch was to make those exploited precursors double in price overnight.. Basically sends a strong measure that in order to get anything in this game you need to find a glitch and exploit it, you’ll be rewarded not only by the exploit, but by arenanets overreaction to it.

Stratzvyda.3921:

However the chances change randomly and with no warning. Their fix to people getting precursors through the god skull glitch was to make those exploited precursors double in price overnight.. Basically sends a strong measure that in order to get anything in this game you need to find a glitch and exploit it, you’ll be rewarded not only by the exploit, but by arenanets overreaction to it.

There was a bug, and it was fixed. The result is a panic-driven surge in price. This is commonly known as a “bubble.” In short, the price inflates due to panic, not due to actual changes in the marketplace. Sure, closing a bug like this does mean the supply drops, but as it resulted from a bug, the intended value is unchanged.

If you want to get antyhing in this game, invest the necessary effort. Not the amount you think is necessary, but the amount that is actually needed.

@Mourningcry: To me RNG is almost always unfair, especially when the chances are very low. How can RNG be fair if some people get lucky and lets say get it on first try and some several 100 tries? Its only fair if everyone has to make about the same total investment.
Its not like you need 100s of these precursors and eventually it will even out. If you have 1 dusk and 1 dawn you are set for life. If you would need a huge noumber of precursors, then yes it would be more fair, but not if you only need 1 or 2 of something.

RNG is fair yes.

However I don’t want just a fair chance. That’s not good enough. I’m willing to put all the effort it takes, however with the unstable pricing of the prerequisites all my efforts could be in vain and that’s not acceptable.

What kind of a messed up system do we have if people spend hundreds of hours of farming and then we’re told that some of us get to have legendaries and some of us just won’t be so lucky.

There’s different kinds of fairness, I want a fairness where people get awarded according to their work not according to their luck.

P.S.
Please stop saying that we just need to work hard for it. That isn’t the issue, no one here said they want an easy legendary we just want it to be a stable and tangible goal.

Archer.6485:

Please stop saying that we just need to work hard for it. That isn’t the issue, no one here said they want an easy legendary we just want it to be a stable and tangible goal.

That is exactly it. Anybody that is complining right now is complaining that, in the 42 days the game has been out, they have been, thus far, unable to acquire one of the rarest weapons in the game.

The goal is stable and tangible, the objection is to the RNG in the precursor, but the RNG rears its head in every aspect of building a legendary. Why aren’t people complaining about the RNG being behind the distribution of ectos? It is, if the instability of uniformly distributed pseudo-random systems is a problem, you need to complain about it on all fronts, not just one.

The fact remains that a legendary in 42 days is rediculously fast. If you think you should have one already, you’re wrong—any fair assessment of effort says it should take longer than 42 days. Some people exploited. Some got very lucky. Some profited from the exploits of others. I did the math using the most accurate numbers I can find; your chances of a precursor inside a year are pretty good. That is a much more reasonable time span to look at than 42 days. And if you don’t get one in that time, the market will have had some time to stabilize, and the alternate-form cash option will be much better defined. There is stability, but nobody knows what that stable point is yet—do not blame the system when it is the community of players so desperate for legendaries that has caused the hardship.

The biggest issue with the ways to obtain a precursor weapon is that, unlike every other component of the legendary, there is no progression towards it. Every other component, be it exploration, dungeon tokens, karma, mystic clovers, etc. has a sense of progression. If use the forge recipe to make mystic clovers 10 times you most likely won’t get all 77 clovers, but you might get 15 or 20 – there is a sense of progression.

With the precursor, however, it is not the case that after putting 40 weapons into the forge you are 20% of the way there, after 100 weapons you are 50% of the way there, etc. It doesn’t matter how many times you put weapons in – if you didn’t yield a precursor you are still 0% of the way to getting one. This is why people are so adamantly upset with this currently. They have put in hundreds of weapons and have nothing to show for it; there is no progression to speak of.

A solution to this, as was outlined in another thread, is to add new mystic forge recipes akin to the “clover” recipes, that have a chance to produce “precursor components”.

For example, one recipe may have a 10% chance to produce “Precursor component A” and a different recipe for “Precursor component B”. Once you have say, 10 of each precursor component, you can combine them together with an Eldritch scroll and some crystals or mystic coins to create your precursor. This will give you the sense of progression towards your reward that is desperately needed.

In addition, though not really necessary, having these “precursor components” be a tradeable commodity will help to stabilize the market for all precursor weapons. For example, if you use the recipe and get a “Bifrost” precursor component when you wanted a “Dawn” precursor component, you can just sell it on the trading post and buy the ones you need. It would have much more stability that what we are seeing now, the prices of the precursor fluctuating by hundreds of gold in a matter of days.

Fildydarie.1496:

Archer.6485:

Please stop saying that we just need to work hard for it. That isn’t the issue, no one here said they want an easy legendary we just want it to be a stable and tangible goal.

That is exactly it. Anybody that is complining right now is complaining that, in the 42 days the game has been out, they have been, thus far, unable to acquire one of the rarest weapons in the game.

The goal is stable and tangible, the objection is to the RNG in the precursor, but the RNG rears its head in every aspect of building a legendary. Why aren’t people complaining about the RNG being behind the distribution of ectos? It is, if the instability of uniformly distributed pseudo-random systems is a problem, you need to complain about it on all fronts, not just one.

The fact remains that a legendary in 42 days is rediculously fast. If you think you should have one already, you’re wrong—any fair assessment of effort says it should take longer than 42 days. Some people exploited. Some got very lucky. Some profited from the exploits of others. I did the math using the most accurate numbers I can find; your chances of a precursor inside a year are pretty good. That is a much more reasonable time span to look at than 42 days. And if you don’t get one in that time, the market will have had some time to stabilize, and the alternate-form cash option will be much better defined. There is stability, but nobody knows what that stable point is yet—do not blame the system when it is the community of players so desperate for legendaries that has caused the hardship.

The RNG in ectos and clovers occurs over many many many trials, and has a very high chance of averaging out. The RNG in precursors, however, does not have a very high chance of averaging out because the chances are so low.

Furthermore, players must gamble on one specific recipe hoping for one specific result. It makes it so that any other result is automatically a failure and is disappointing. RNG is only exciting when it’s unexpected. You don’t play slot machines expecting the jackpot, you play them expecting perhaps a moderate payout. If the jackpot happens you’re overjoyed. Here, however, the only result is either the jackpot or failure. There’s no smaller rewards to keep you coming back.

If they want RNG to be interesting, the recipe in question should be a staple recipe. For example, one that produces a consumable that’s used by the majority of the population on a regular basis. Then if you fail you at least get something ok, and the precursor is an unexpected bonus.

@Fildydarie

Dude, what the hell? You don’t just get to make stuff up. That is NOT exactly it and I NEVER said I wanted a legendary in 42 days. If you read my previous posts you can see I don’t expect to have a legendary anytime soon and I’m completely fine with that.

So to reiterate: NO I don’t think I should have one already or anytime soon for that matter. That settled? Good.

Now the reason I’m perfectly fine with Ecto RNG or Mystic Clover RNG is because those RNGs aren’t so low as to create a large differences between player luck. Anyone who salvages for ectos regularly will eventually fall into a statistical success average.

The prerequisite RNG however is a huge problem becase it’s so low and because most players only need one successful roll. That creates a huge amount of difference between the needed amount of time and effort from players based completely on luck.

You can’t rely on a statistical average with such low numbers. It’s all just luck based. With the current system some people will spend 3 gold and others will spend 500 gold. That is in no way a reasonable system.

Cant we get a red on this subject? Linsey? Also if you could spare some more time, there is a worth reading (imo) proposal on this post https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Could-a-dev-please-confirm-if-this-is-a-genuine-dev-reply-regarding-exotic-precursors/page/2#post349637

@ Belmont That guy has it all thought out. Please Anet consider what this guy is proposing. It sounds like a very solid plan (might take a bit to implement) but its better then pure random luck with those pre cursor weapons.

Looks like that thread got deleted. I get the following message: Cannot find topic with that permalink!

Just out of curiosity, you guys do know that in addition to the precursor, you need over 400g worth of mats to make it right? So even the most expensive precursors still only represent 1/3rd of the total cost of crafting the weapon, not including karma, wvw tokens, dungeon tokens, or map completion.

If you’re complaining about obtaining the 200g portion of it, why aren’t you complaining about the 400g of additional mats that you need? Likewise, if you think a 200g component of the weapon is hopelessly hard to obtain, how the heck are you going to obtain 400g?

deathTouch.9706:

Just out of curiosity, you guys do know that in addition to the precursor, you need over 400g worth of mats to make it right? So even the most expensive precursors still only represent 1/3rd of the total cost of crafting the weapon, not including karma, wvw tokens, dungeon tokens, or map completion.

If you’re complaining about obtaining the 200g portion of it, why aren’t you complaining about the 400g of additional mats that you need? Likewise, if you think a 200g component of the weapon is hopelessly hard to obtain, how the heck are you going to obtain 400g?

Dusk is currently going for 275g, so that’s actually 40% of the total cost. That also assumes the price doesn’t increase between now and whenever a player manages to farm that gold.

More importantly, those figures only hold for players who simply buy everything needed for the Legendary. I plan to farm almost all those components myself (excluding some of the really tough ones). So my gold cost for the Legendary itself will be much much lower.

Malediktus.9250:

Looks like that thread got deleted. I get the following message: Cannot find topic with that permalink!

Smells like censorship

GoddessHrist.8472:

deathTouch.9706:

Just out of curiosity, you guys do know that in addition to the precursor, you need over 400g worth of mats to make it right? So even the most expensive precursors still only represent 1/3rd of the total cost of crafting the weapon, not including karma, wvw tokens, dungeon tokens, or map completion.

If you’re complaining about obtaining the 200g portion of it, why aren’t you complaining about the 400g of additional mats that you need? Likewise, if you think a 200g component of the weapon is hopelessly hard to obtain, how the heck are you going to obtain 400g?

Dusk is currently going for 275g, so that’s actually 40% of the total cost. That also assumes the price doesn’t increase between now and whenever a player manages to farm that gold.

More importantly, those figures only hold for players who simply buy everything needed for the Legendary. I plan to farm almost all those components myself (excluding some of the really tough ones). So my gold cost for the Legendary itself will be much much lower.

1) You quoted the sell price, not the buy price. The sword at 275g has been up for more than a day at this point, the ones in 300g have been up for multiple days. You need to look at where the transactions are actually occurring, which is at 207g. Trends also indicate a new price plateau for dusk.

Also, no one said you had to go for Dusk. Sometimes compromise is necessary in life.

2) One of the most bizarre things I hear is people claiming that their cost of producing an item is reduced because they farm their own mats. Your mats have a value, as well as your time. When you say you’re “farming” your own mats, and that it will be “free”, what you are basically saying is I’m doing a service that pays me X amount of gold worth of materials per unit of time.

Whether you farm each individual mat you need for the weapon, or farm a completely unrelated mat to the weapon, sell that mat, and buy the mats you do need, or whether you make money trading commodities on the TP, has absolutely zero impact on the total cost of producing a legendary.

deathTouch.9706:

Also, no one said you had to go for Dusk. Sometimes compromise is necessary in life.

When the whole point of something is its looks … and since this is a game, not “real life” … I find this argument to be rather disingenuous.

One of the most bizarre things I hear is people claiming that their cost is reduced because they farm their own mats. Your mats have a value, as well as your time.

The reason people phrase it this way is that these materials are always there. Every day I go into Orr, I find the ori nodes and I farm them. This is steady, guaranteed progress with no RNG involved and no possibility for market manipulation.

Precursors, however, are random (thus success for creating them is absolutely never guaranteed for the unlucky) and are subject to inflation/manipulation because of this. It doesn’t matter what sums people set for ancient logs or whatever … if my income doesn’t keep up, then I am still guaranteed of a set number a day assuming I spend an hour or so in Orr.

Material prices do of course factor into precursors for those trying to make them, but that’s not what people are talking about. They’re talking about getting materials for the gifts/etc. No one is ever going to be unable to get mithril or platinum or whatever. People may, however, always be unable to afford a precursor.

EDIT: And to clarify my beef a little further, Legendaries are a huge investment of time and effort and resources. That’s awesome! But I don’t want to find out, 2 years into it, that despite all that time and effort I’ll always be SoL because I can’t get a precursor. That’s just plain terrible design.

Well, don’t worry, because that simply won’t happen. Precursor prices will easily have stabilised 2 years from now.

Actually a game is real life, especially one that has an economy that is based on supply/demand, where certain goods are rarer than others, and certain demand for goods are higher for some than for others.

The mats that you mention that you can conveniently farm are the cheapest portions of the legendary (such as ori ore), since everyone else can conveniently farm them too. The ones that actually make up the bulk of the legendary (ectos, lodestones etc) are expensive because they are very hard to acquire. So you will be farming either money or materials at some point or another for an extended period of time. The question is whether you think you make the most of your time farming the items itself, or doing something else in the game that makes you more money/time unit that you can then use to buy said mat. It’s called opportunity cost.

Demand for these weapons are enormous. Everyone wants one because they look amazing and are incredibly rare. The only reason they are special is because they are rare. A low RNG system ensures they will continue to be rare.

Ultimately this comes down to how badly you want a legendary. If you’re willing to do the 500-1000 combines to get a precursor, then you’ll do it. Other people are willing to do it, or find ways to make money such that they can buy the weapons off TP. Don’t ask to significantly devalue the weapon that other people have worked hard to acquire because you’re not willing to put in the effort yourself.

I disagree. The full combination of mats for the legendary already makes them extremely rare, since not everyone is willing to take the time to make them.

They are GW1’s equivalent of FOW armor. That armor required incredible amounts of farming and as far as I know remained extremely rare at least for the major part of GW1’s lifetime. A lot of prestige came with wearing it as well, people were respected for having it and it didn’t require any crazy RNG of such insane proportions.

As far as I can tell, the legendaries are a lot harder to acquire than FOW armor even without factoring in the prerequisite’s RNG. If you want to make legendaries more rare make them take longer to acquire instead, the current system makes it that some people will have to spend literally 100 times more time than others.

Just to repeat myself: I’m fine with paying 300 for the prerequisite or even 400 AS LONG AS it stays 400 and doesn’t change after the several months it will take me to farm that amount of gold.

If they want to keep RNG, they should at least raise the chance to get it from the MF by a lot. 0,33% for using 4 lvl 80 rares and 5% for using 4 lvl 80 exotics.

It would mean you get an average of 1 precursor for 20×4×3g =240g or 300×4*0.2g =240g invested into the MF. Still very expensive, but a decent chance.

240g is value of two tier 3 cultural sets and thats just 1 ingedient for the legendary.

Your math is off.
1) Plenty of level 80 exotics can be had at 2g, not 3g.
2) Since you get one exotic back for every forging, on average you’re using 3 exotics per attempt at the forge, not 4.
3) Precursors are not the only worthwhile things you can get out of the Mystic Forge – things like Naegling also come out as well, apparently. If you sell those for a profit, you’re not spending as much as you might think.

As such, a better estimate would be 20*3*2g = 120g, and that’s without giving consideration to point (3).

I have yet to get anything out of the mystic forge which was worth enough to not waste it on the next try. And 120g is a whole set of t3 cultural armor. Seems fine to me.
After all plenty of people got their precursors for less than 100g from TP already before inflation got out of hand or by exploiting alpha/closed beta knowledge.
But bring on the entitlement argument again lol.

Malediktus.9250:

I have yet to get anything out of the mystic forge which was worth enough to not waste it on the next try

Maybe you haven’t, but others have. Even something like Ebonblade, which is currently down at ~3.4g, is something you’d be better off selling than simply throwing back into the forge.

Malediktus.9250:

And 120g is a whole set of t3 cultural armor. Seems fine to me.

The legendary precursor is a component that goes into making legendaries, which are supposed to be the rarest things in the game. Considering that there’s ~400g worth of other components that go into making a legendary, I would expect the precursor to be a significant fraction (let’s say 30-50%) of the overall cost. To me, 120g definitely seems too low.

Malediktus.9250:

After all plenty of people got their precursors for less than 100g from TP already before inflation got out of hand

Can you actually support this claim that “inflation has gotten out of hand”? If you’re just referring to the price of legendary precursors, the term “inflation” doesn’t really apply.

In any case, the TP is not a magical source of items; those items came from other players who made the huge mistake of putting them up for sale for less than 100g in the first place. The fact that players are not continuing to make that mistake is unfortunate for anyone who wants one now, but the fact that you can’t take advantage of those people any more is hardly a good reason to increase the drop rate.

Malediktus.9250:

or by exploiting alpha/closed beta knowledge.

If you mean actual exploits, then that is definitely regrettable, but once again this simply doesn’t justify increasing the chance of getting one.

Wow 3.4g, what a great price. Considering how much you need to throw in to get that its a horrible value.
If you think a precursor should be rare enough to be worth 250g+++, then the prices between trash and a precursor should be worth at least 25g to keep people motivated. Noone likes going through hundreths of sacrifices without anything to show for it.

Malediktus.9250:

Wow 3.4g, what a great price. Considering how much you need to throw in to get that its a horrible value.

Obviously you’re not putting exotics in with the intention of getting Ebonblades… However, I said “even” for a reason; the main point is that at those prices it’s still better to sell them than it is to put them back into the forge.

If you think a precursor should be rare enough to be worth 250g+++, then the prices between trash and a precursor should be worth at least 25g to keep people motivated. Noone likes going through hundreths of sacrifices without anything to show for it.

I’ve heard that you can get Naegling out, which is a decent intermediate result at 13~17g; there could be others, but I haven’t heard much.

Ultimately, though, if you don’t want to do the forging, let other people do it for you.

I thought Naegling is only avaible for a fixed recipe. And even if its true, 13-17g is horrible for the rarity. Low chance RNG just sucks big time, nothing more to say about it.
Id rather have an NPC sell it for 500-1000g than having to pay a lucky guy, trader or exploiter 250g++ for it.

deathTouch

Ultimately this comes down to how badly you want a legendary. If you’re willing to do the 500-1000 combines to get a precursor, then you’ll do it. Other people are willing to do it, or find ways to make money such that they can buy the weapons off TP. Don’t ask to significantly devalue the weapon that other people have worked hard to acquire because you’re not willing to put in the effort yourself.

Please stop pulling up strawman arguments. Luck =/= effort.

Some people are hardwired to enjoy gambling. That’s fine, and the lottery method should exist for those people. However, some people are hardwired to hate gambling, and desire instead steady effort = progress. Not “steady effort maybe never get anything” or “threw 4 things into Mystic Forge on a lark and got precursor on first try.”

Anet themselves know how unfun RNG can be when there is a specific outcome you’re looking for — they set up the dungeon armor system the way they did because of that.

I played AoC for years, did same raid every week looking for the ToS chestpiece. I just wanted the skin, didn’t care about stats. Never saw it even drop, let alone win a roll on it. One week the raid leader asked me to bring my PoM because they really needed one. I obliged, and guess what dropped? Yup, ToS chestpiece. That wasn’t rewarding, or exciting — it was demoralizing as hell. I quit raiding after that, and I don’t ever want to subject myself to that kind of system ever again.

It seems like the prices stabilized again. Price seems to stay about the same over the day and night. But who knows when the next price spike starts.

Yep, rather have a recipe for precursors which requires all kinds of rare stuff, lodestones, skill points, karma, some kind of tokens etc, ATM all you need is luck and/or gold for it, rather get it with hard work and effort with some account bound items etc.

Do not understand why some people favor the 0.1% chance or 1% chance bs. It’s absolutely idiotic. The amount of players who have given up or quit already lol…
I can spend 1000g and never get it from forge, if its 1% chance it doesnt mean im guaranteed a precursor after 100 tries with lvl80 exotics…
Yes you can buy it but still it’s VERY expensive but also a really bad way to get 1 of the most important and hardest items required for the legendary. Recipe with account bound and rare mats would be ideal.
I’d rather work hard for the precurser for weeks and know 100% that I’m going to get it if I get these mats, rather then: ‘OK SO I GOT 100G LETS DUMP IT IN THE FORGE AND HOPE FOR THE BEST’. That’s a really pathetic system for a legendary weapon. This kind of 0.1% RNG belongs in grindy hardcore asian mmorpgs like aion.

Atm Legendary = ~1mil karma, 500 badges, 500 tokens + kitten loads of gold. A really rich kid/gold seller or whatever can buy nearly everything but karma and then he’s basically got it (500 badges is not hard with jumping puzzles neither is 500 tokens when u get 180 per day easily.)

Rainshine.5493:

deathTouch

Ultimately this comes down to how badly you want a legendary. If you’re willing to do the 500-1000 combines to get a precursor, then you’ll do it. Other people are willing to do it, or find ways to make money such that they can buy the weapons off TP. Don’t ask to significantly devalue the weapon that other people have worked hard to acquire because you’re not willing to put in the effort yourself.

Please stop pulling up strawman arguments. Luck =/= effort.

Some people are hardwired to enjoy gambling. That’s fine, and the lottery method should exist for those people. However, some people are hardwired to hate gambling, and desire instead steady effort = progress. Not “steady effort maybe never get anything” or “threw 4 things into Mystic Forge on a lark and got precursor on first try.”

Anet themselves know how unfun RNG can be when there is a specific outcome you’re looking for — they set up the dungeon armor system the way they did because of that.

I played AoC for years, did same raid every week looking for the ToS chestpiece. I just wanted the skin, didn’t care about stats. Never saw it even drop, let alone win a roll on it. One week the raid leader asked me to bring my PoM because they really needed one. I obliged, and guess what dropped? Yup, ToS chestpiece. That wasn’t rewarding, or exciting — it was demoralizing as hell. I quit raiding after that, and I don’t ever want to subject myself to that kind of system ever again.

Guess what? If you don’t like gambling, then you can buy it off the TP.

Or is finding creative ways to make money in this game unfair too?

Legendaries require mastery of making money in this game, either through farming, understanding the economy and investing, etc. Don’t expect to do something that 99% of the rest of the population can do easily and expect to get the rarest weapon in the game, explicitly designed such that only 5% of less of the total population will ever be able to obtain.

If you even spent a fraction of the time you invested complaining about the system into developing ways to reduce costs to combine weapons in the MF, or understand how the economy works in the game, you’d probably be done with the whole thing by now.

People suggesting that precursors should be worth 50g haven’t looked hard enough yet at making money. Give me 10g and I’ll give you back 60g by the end of the day. Making a precursor worth 1 day of income is ludicrous.

I want to see how you make 60g from 10g in one day without exploiting or scamming (or any other behavior against anets rules)
Too bad I cant trust any random dude on the forums with 10g.

@deathTouch.9706 if i read you posts i guess you just don’t want it because you own one(only ?) by yourself (…).
and that is exactly why I do not like those kind of weapons and stuff in mmos in general.
first it separates the player apart in two groups like this kind of conversations perfectly show. and secondly such high priced items in the tp leads to inflation since there is a huge gap between demand and offer which in addition obviously attracts “trader” and this both even affects players that never ever would think once about such a item.
for the tp this is from my pov actually very worse, because with mats some “traders” could not have such great market impact like it is right now. they constantly keep up buy orders and place sell orders high enough – so they will stay in control for very long time – after all it is always profit… there should not be such pricey items in the tp economy…
if i like the game i play it no matter if 50% own this weapon or 0.01% – but I do not need to agree to its mechanics that affect everybody – so i accept you think that way and please accept that most of the people probably dont think so and dont care how rare something is. all your posts will not change anything on those peoples attitude.
for me a game should be fun and luck is of course a good element to let people feel good – but right now the opposite is the case, because it also affects the unlucky.

deathTouch

If you even spent a fraction of the time you invested complaining about the system into developing ways to reduce costs to combine weapons in the MF, or understand how the economy works in the game, you’d probably be done with the whole thing by now.

I’m not sure how long it takes you to type up 4 or 5 posts, but apparently it takes me much less effort than you if you think that I could have made hundreds of gold and over a million karma during that time.

I’m flattered by how much of your time and effort putting into this conversation. I had no idea. It could have saved you much time by just typing up “BUT THE TRADING POST.” I’m not sure why you spend countless hours on your responses if you’re just going to ignore points that people have already addressed.

I’m currently working on my legendary. I do not have the precursor

I’m taking it easy, collecting as i go along, and it feels like i’m making real progress. I do really want it, and I will get it, but i know i won’t get it tomorrow, it will likely take me a few more months, and in that time, so much can happen. Including me getting the precursor.
With the attitude i’m seeing it, if i would have 3 out of 4 parts of the Legendary, i wouldn’t be all like “OMG SO MUCH WORK AND NOW I HAVE TO RELY ON kittenING RNG!” I would go “Omg! So close! Only 1 more item! /happydance”

Have you ever considered taking on that attitude?

Edit: Fail, it didn’t put “kitten” in all caps