Guild Wars 2

With right strategy and skill you can easily do all dungeons without wipe or even die. Until now dungeonst was waypoint rush pugfest. Best change ever! But I agree noobs will cry now because it was only way how they can handle it.

I completely agree that while this is a good change for the overall quality of the game it is somewhat lacking in regards to PUG’s.

A lot of the comments I’ve read in this thread have been of the ‘oh noobs, qq more’ variety and whilst I’m sure there is an element of this in the complaints the larger issue/point is not being addressed: that there is minimal (at best) communication between PUG members. This means that even the best GW2 players on the planet would run into difficult with these changes in a PUG setting.

It’s great and all to up the difficulty of dungeons, I’m all for that but at the expense of PUG’s seems really imbalanced without the introduction of a mechanic that will aid in improving PUG teamwork/communication beyond ctrl + t….

RlyOsim.2497:

I completely agree that while this is a good change for the overall quality of the game it is somewhat lacking in regards to PUG’s.

A lot of the comments I’ve read in this thread have been of the ‘oh noobs, qq more’ variety and whilst I’m sure there is an element of this in the complaints the larger issue/point is not being addressed: that there is minimal (at best) communication between PUG members. This means that even the best GW2 players on the planet would run into difficult with these changes in a PUG setting.

It’s great and all to up the difficulty of dungeons, I’m all for that but at the expense of PUG’s seems really imbalanced without the introduction of a mechanic that will aid in improving PUG teamwork/communication beyond ctrl + t….

People WILL get use to it. AC explorable was deemed impossible to complete at launch by most people. People used to brag all the time pre-launch for clearing AC. Now, it’s a staple farm for most players. They’ll get use to it.

The game already lack quality content that are worthwhile, with the end of fractals, ANet should focus on bringing content to people that have gone through everything and give the rest time to chew on existing content, not bringing everyone to the same bar again and let the older players languish.

Svarty.8019:

DeathPanel.8362:

All the people in this post casually dismissing the fact that the current state of dungeons (like cof p2) is near impossible for pub groups either haven’t tried those dungeons post patch or are trolling.

Is the new CoF p2 Assassin encounter difficult?

Nope, a lot easier than the previous dps check. Takes longer since the assassins seem to spawn percentage based, so you can’t really slack at 94% after killing everything. Silver assassins melt fast, move at a reasonable pace and the regular mobs apart from some hammer guys aren’t really a bother. If you have a guard with stability it should be a breeze. If you could do the wall part without graveyard zerging before, you shouldn’t have any problems with the new version. I like this change, more flexible group composition wise, any group should be able to handle it.

I was a little disappointed in CoF p3, since I liked the need to communicate, but the new change has made things a lot easier. Yesterday, 3 of us ran in, killed all of the mobs, light and profit. The time to sync has also been increased to 7 seconds. Imo they should have kept 5 torches and just increased the sync window. Didn’t notice any other changes in that path, last boss is still annoyingly long.

I thought CoF part 2 was incredibly fun and while not as challenging as killing the mobs before, much more doable in a pick up.

most of the ppl crying are glass cannon ^^ just learn to stay alive, roll , use defensive skills etc.

CABS.1386:

most of the ppl crying are glass cannon ^^ just learn to stay alive, roll , use defensive skills etc.

This.

Seriously, being able to respawn during a fight was the I forgive you of the game. People die in dungeons mostly because they screw up! Yes, its easy to screw up, especially if you are not paying attention. Not being able to respawn means you need to think of your strategy, skills and teamwork better… you may need to lead the boss away or kite him long enough to get a downed player up!

Anyways, I welcome the change… it also makes me realize the consequence of my own actions during a fight.. like not dodging correctly when lieutenant dan raises his right arm in AC… which I do so often.

guess this is for encourage ppl use combo fields and every tool available, learn mobs atacks, etc and not just bruteforce dps. die and come back.
+1000 to Anet on this change.

CABS.1386:

guess this is for encourage ppl use combo fields and every tool available, learn mobs atacks, etc and not just bruteforce dps. die and come back.
+1000 to Anet on this change.

I bruteforce DPS and I’m feeling just lovely. You don’t need dodge replacements from vit/toughness.

Daecollo.9578:

Without the ability to respawn in combat with no difficulty decrease, dungeons are now long and rediculous.

Reduce the amount of damage/HP mobs do and reduce there HP.

I think this may be the most rediculous post in all of the guild wars 2 forums. And that is saying a lot…a lot my friend.

“Not being able to rez in combat makes encounters harder”. In what other game can you do this? Besides a few encounters in wow, a lot of times the encounter is blocked off. Seriously. You needed this ability to complete dungeons? Are you that bad? Is the rest of the community THIS bad that theres this much of an uproar?

You guys truely make me not want to run a dungeon anymore because I am afraid I’ll have YOU whiners in my pug. Can’t stay alive? Can’t play the dungeon the way it was meant to? Can’t glitch it out now? Can’t sit up on a ledge, dps the boss anymore worry free? Are you really that bad of a player? Levels 1-80 teach you nothing?

You guys are amazing. Absolutely incredibly amazing.

Leave arenanet alone. This was a fantastic change. Quit trying to glitch crap, and you won’t miss the crutch when its gone. Trust me.

And soon, very soon, I can see that skipping all trash mobs will be an obsolete practice, once they change it so that mobs do not de-aggro. Oh boy I can see the fire now. Get used to it boys. Dungeons are being fixed the way they should be and I love it.

And I am not elitist. Casual gamer, a mere level 20 fractal player. In a casual small guild.

But I do not suck, which is why this change has not impacted me.

Love the change. Makes dungeons difficult and fun again. I hope the next change makes it impossible to skip trash mobs. People need to stop cryin about not bein able to farm instances as simply as they could before. Rez-rushin was one of the most frustrating, idiotic strats ive ever seen used in an mmo…very happy to see it go.

Svarty.8019:

Good luck with CoE. Buy Charged Lodestones while they’re only 3g, because no PUGs will be completing this dungeon.

I pug it, had no problem. I play Gw2, wich game are you playing ?? O.o"

Carzor Stelatis.9435:

It’s the first day of the new changes, give them time. When something utterly breaks a game mode Anet will fix it. For example the free world transfers (which many PvE players had wanted) were cancelled entirely due to exploit guilds using them to cheat the WvW ranking system. If this is still broken in a fortnight with no fix announced, then we can call it ridiculous.

They should have kept it free and punished/banned said guilds who knowingly did the exploit.

Lunarain.8430:

just did fotm 10 currently at 17 got the dredge ice elemental, and it’s completly different now. the elemental now applys agony 100% of the time. how are we even suppose to do this

Um, all of his agony fields are giant very avoidable aoe fields, you dodge bro?

@can- I still see it as kind of a chore, the dungeons haven’t become harder just whining.
@CABS, defensive skills are the entire reason I can roll full dps, I have the most op binded to my alt key, makes me do barrel rolls and such.

bottom line.. casual players are effed.. while some of us can still do a CoF run in 15 minutes… i still get my tokens and pretty armor… but is this balanced?

DeathPanel.8362:

Sarie.1630:

angan.6572:

How do you expect people to run dungeons now ?

Properly, or not at all?

Everyone complaining sounds just like the players complaining at Beta because AC was “omg impossible”, to paraphrase. You learn, you adapt, you IMPROVE. Why is it wrong for ArenaNet to not want people to stagnate and get lazy?

That’s a good way to lose more casual players.

Since when did casual equals wanting everything to be a walk in the park?
Plenty of casual people and pugs doing these encounters just fine. But yes you have to actually talk to people, make a plan and sometimes sort out traits and that kind of thing. Don’t create your own headache by making it harder for yourself then what it needs to be.
Doing the slightest of prep work does not make you a hardcore player, not by my definition. That is just being smart about it – but I guess that’s subjective.

Dempsey.8760:

Lunarain.8430:

just did fotm 10 currently at 17 got the dredge ice elemental, and it’s completly different now. the elemental now applys agony 100% of the time. how are we even suppose to do this

Um, all of his agony fields are giant very avoidable aoe fields, you dodge bro?

@can- I still see it as kind of a chore, the dungeons haven’t become harder just whining.
@CABS, defensive skills are the entire reason I can roll full dps, I have the most op binded to my alt key, makes me do barrel rolls and such.

Ice elemental was bugged, it applied agony they moment you touched a redring (which had no tells) they hotfixed it like 13h ago or so.

i do not understand why res rushing was bad ? i did die and want to come back to the fight. Why everyone needs to die (see the boss who prioritize the chars who ress you) so i can fight again ?(high possibility to drag my mates along with me to the dead land)

in my opinion we are being trolled… and just wastes more of our time.
what if no one wants to ress me ???

angan.6572:

Kareth.6572:

Blah, blah blah, I cant farm tokens, karma and so, blah, blah, blah – isnt it supposed to be a challenge?

I don’t see any challenge at all in it. What’s the point anymore of doing a dungeon that will require you an hour to get ~40 silver and spent 11+ on armor repairs ?

Really challenging and fun…. not !

The challenge would be to do it without spending money in repairs… that’s why its called a ‘challenge’.

Really ? Like.. REALLY ? Why arena net, why ? We were having so much fun doing dungeons with friends, it was hard, challenging, but fun. We died at times, learning from our mistakes, then got back in fight. Now if a player dies, he has to WAIT and watch OR the other players HAVE TO revive him, even if they’re in danger, putting themselves in EVEN MORE danger.

I just don’t see the point. We were working as teams before, now if a player dies too much he will probably be kicked out by his party. Congrats on the useless change.

Nnene.7231:

Now if a player dies, he has to WAIT and watch OR the other players HAVE TO revive him, even if they’re in danger, putting themselves in EVEN MORE danger.

In my opinion a legitimate point. An option to spectate while dead would be neato.

Shinki.8045:

Nnene.7231:

Now if a player dies, he has to WAIT and watch OR the other players HAVE TO revive him, even if they’re in danger, putting themselves in EVEN MORE danger.

In my opinion a legitimate point. An option to spectate while dead would be neato.

It was like this in Guild Wars 1. We could double-click on any party member to have the camera move to them. It made death more… entertaining in a way. We could also help the alive players by watching their back even though we were dead. We weren’t completely useless.
They should bring this back at least.

Because looking at my character on the floor isn’t particularly fun or engaging.

And… Please, people, the “JUST LEARN YOUR CLASS AND DON’T DIE” is a tiresome , unthoughtful and pointless argument. I’ve been playing Elementalist since April 2012, first beta. I know my class. I know my weapons, my traits. Same goes for many of my friends. They have been playing since the first beta. And we’re still one-shotted by lots of AOE, attacks. Yes, we dodge, yes we change our skills, but there is “giving a challenge” and “BE PERFECT OR YO’ DIE, PAY YOUR BILL AND GET DISGUSTED!”. I agree about the whole “learning from our mistakes and getting better”, that’s how my teammates and I always worked. First time we did AC (in October) we sucked, two days ago we did Twilight Arbor with no death (prior patch).
But now, even though I just bought a full Power+Vit+Toughness armor… I’m still being one-shotted at certain bosses. So much about learning, giving you chances or else.

Now it’s either “you success or you fail”, no in-between, no way to just hang in there and fight. It take forever to resurrect someone, even doing so often put us in danger (if the fight is in a little arena). I don’t call “suicide for others” being an useful teamwork method.

With all the constant change to the game, to the professions, to the bosses, to the dungeons, to the world, how are we supposed to learn anything? The next thing we know they’re changing it in our back.

NickChabby.8907:

Shinki.8045:

Nnene.7231:

Now if a player dies, he has to WAIT and watch OR the other players HAVE TO revive him, even if they’re in danger, putting themselves in EVEN MORE danger.

In my opinion a legitimate point. An option to spectate while dead would be neato.

It was like this in Guild Wars 1. We could double-click on any party member to have the camera move to them. It made death more… entertaining in a way. We could also help the alive players by watching their back even though we were dead. We weren’t completely useless.
They should bring this back at least.

Precisely why I recommended it. You could give advice to teammates, or even just enjoy looking at a different character for a bit.

As for the getting one-shotted bit, what is one shotting you in full P/T/V gear? Just curious, I’m sure I could give some advice.

Shinki.8045:

Precisely why I recommended it. You could give advice to teammates, or even just enjoy looking at a different character for a bit.

As for the getting one-shotted bit, what is one shotting you in full P/T/V gear? Just curious, I’m sure I could give some advice.

Mostly Subject Alpha, second encounter. I mean, sure, I count 2 seconds to dodge, but we don’t have an infinite amount, I have to care about downed teammates, crystals (or getting imprisoned) while being chased by the boss. The ice attack OR the two circle Aoe (earth spikes?) pretty much get my almost instantly every time. I won’t call “just learn yo’ mechanic and be bettah” a good advice or any kind of useful solutions.

We spent almost three hours without getting further than removing 10% of his health because of this. We were all 80 geared in full exotics, one elementalist (me), one mesmer, one thief, one warrior and one guardian. A big waste of time.
This fight was already a pain prior the patch, now it’s a real spike in the… hole…

I geuss the saying holds true that can’t please everyone. But really guys we all know exploits we’re being used as well as rez rushing and that was the norm before this patch. Anet saw this and took a stand to fix it as well as change the encounters to go along with the new rez method. Now it is true pugs will have issues now but all it takes is learning the dungeons. Can’t say this will work for everyone but why not look to making static groups to get through these now, or even guild runs. My guild and I were dreading the rez thing but now that its day 3 we see no problems. Dungeons have been made more challenging and we like that. We know how each other plays and look out for each other in the dungeons. Which is something a simple pug has trouble with. Sure we still die but for the most we destroy dungeons just like we always have and legitley to. So really guys its all about learning to do the dungeons.

I agree that waypoint rushing was pretty dumb and the invul spots where you could hit bosses were lame both needed to be taken out, but the increase difficulty in mobs are kind of ridiculus. I was wearing full cleric gear in AC em, and the graveling HATCHLINGS were hitting me for close to 400 per hit, not including their bleeds. It’s not like we didn’t finish dungeon but my point is this makes dungeons not friendly to non 80’s from the looks of it. It makes it extremely hard with sub 80’s who run this dungeon or new players with random gear. Yes i’m sure well adjust to the difficulty which really isnt much since its just increased mob hp and atk power, so it just means more kiting, but its ridiculus how i have to kite 10+gravelings hatchlings who hit for 300-400 per hit with bleeds.

I had around 2800 toughness and was taking 400 from hatchlings, I’m not saying it was impossible to do but i can imagine players who dont have toughness gear getting hit for maybe 700 from just gravelings, I saw a guardian in my party wearing full AC em tough/power/vit gear getting hit extremely hard by just 5-7gravelings, at first i thot he was just squishy but i started to get hit just as hard, so something isn’t right because our guardian was a decent player who knew his class very well and to play it but its just the dmg outputted by mobs is a little too much.

NickChabby.8907:

Mostly Subject Alpha, second encounter. I mean, sure, I count 2 seconds to dodge, but we don’t have an infinite amount, I have to care about downed teammates, crystals (or getting imprisoned) while being chased by the boss. The ice attack OR the two circle Aoe (earth spikes?) pretty much get my almost instantly every time. I won’t call “just learn yo’ mechanic and be bettah” a good advice or any kind of useful solutions.

We spent almost three hours without getting further than removing 10% of his health because of this. We were all 80 geared in full exotics, one elementalist (me), one mesmer, one thief, one warrior and one guardian. A big waste of time.
This fight was already a pain prior the patch, now it’s a real spike in the… hole…

You should try using Mist Form or maybe a Sigil of Superior Energy if you don’t have dodge rolls. Also, you could even use Burning Retreat or the Fiery Greatswords #3, both evade attacks during their animation. Perhaps you could even move out of the red circles of imminent doom if you know you can’t dodge roll instead of sitting in them. Oh and get Vigor (cantrips are an excellent way).

Alpha doesn’t hit that hard, honestly he doesn’t do damage unless you’re in front of him at farther than melee range (or if you get hit by red circles). In regards to killing crystals adn worrying about downed teammates, try stacking up next time, random AoE will kill crystals and stacking (albeit if you screw up will kill you if you miss a dodge) allows the other 4 non-bads on your team to res you near instantly just in time for the next round of AoEs.

And one more thing, stop being bad.

Papaj.9035:

And one more thing, stop being bad.

Seriously ?

Papaj.9035:

You should try using Mist Form or maybe a Sigil of Superior Energy if you don’t have dodge rolls. Also, you could even use Burning Retreat or the Fiery Greatswords #3, both evade attacks during their animation. Perhaps you could even move out of the red circles of imminent doom if you know you can’t dodge roll instead of sitting in them. Oh and get Vigor (cantrips are an excellent way).

Yes, useful informations, yes, but the fight isn’t all about me unfortunately. While I run, retreat from A to Z or hope for my elite skills to be ready, the boss need to be damaged and I need to look upon my fellow friends.

It’s not about just being difficult, but we have no rooms to mistake with this boss, it’s worse than a school test (which allows us to do mistakes without failing it).

Papaj.9035:

Alpha doesn’t hit that hard, honestly he doesn’t do damage unless you’re in front of him at farther than melee range (or if you get hit by red circles). In regards to killing crystals adn worrying about downed teammates, try stacking up next time, random AoE will kill crystals and stacking (albeit if you screw up will kill you if you miss a dodge) allows the other 4 non-bads on your team to res you near instantly just in time for the next round of AoEs.

Tried.
Tried.
Tried.

Papaj.9035:

And one more thing, stop being bad.

Typical comment from a haughty hardcore MMO narrow-minded player. You couldn’t just give (useful) advices could you? You had to go all “You’re bad, I’m good”.
How would you feel if, in order to have a job, you had to write a 20 pages essay without any grammar mistake at all? Spent hours and hours writing one only to fail it completely because you forgot a ‘S’ somewhere? Would you feel happy if someone told you “Stop being illiterate”? Would you find it useful?

It’s all about acknowledging that not everybody is alike and so is the experience in dungeons. There should be more room to mistakes, more than at the moment.

It’s MOST IDIOTIC THING I have ever seen, no heals in game, no instance res, you want that I will buy an orbs from store? I’ll not doing it. It’s one more step for leave the game. Grind for legendary (I’m playing from beta and till now I can’t grind it) and grind for money. Before, I can spend a couple of hours in dungeon, now after this INNOVATION I can’t fun in dugeons, dungeons become borring now, they too long, and come to no sence, no money (cause I need to repair) no any usable equip, for what this no res function was beeng done? Graz anet with onemore FAIL. For this moment, persanally me (I have 2 full exot with different sets chars) have no sence to play in GW2.

For those who are speaking about pugs. My guild left the game before new year, I play alone, and I use GWLFG site for seaching a group. I’m just a man who want to spend an hour or 2 in game after work . I do not want join to any guilds, just want to play with such pug like me, for this moment this possibility is lost.

If you all need videos explaining how to do each boss I’ll be happy to provide. Dungeons in this game are not so difficult that you shouldn’t be able to do them in a reasonable PUG. Fractals beyond a certain level are much more difficult and have always had this no WP until your party is dead mechanic. It really does come down to having to learn how to play properly. Bosses in dungeons shouldn’t even down anyone in your group much less kill them.

In regards specifically to Alpha Subject you do not need vigor, invulnerability, or extra evades to avoid his red circles. Simply just don’t waste your dodge rolls, don’t double dodge, etc. He often does two in a row, but he’ll stop in between and you’ll have plenty of time to refill your endurance. It’s a fight that is going to test your timing on dodging, though it’s not as bad as say fighting the Dredge boss on high level where a single agony hit will kill you. As for crystals I recommend stacking up and if you are having trouble on the crystals have party members mark them. As a tank Ranger (easily the lowest DPS profession in the game) I can easily break people out of crystals before Alpha subject does another attack solo, so if you are struggling with a full party then you simply aren’t spotting the crystals fast enough.

Remember other people can do this just fine. Dungeons are easily cleared without needing to use waypoint res zerging. I’ve completed CoE with PUGs before, some struggle, some do not. Chances are if you are not completing dungeons you may need to evaluate your own play style. Don’t assume just because you’ve been doing it since beta you are doing it correctly.

AIMonster.8236:

Remember other people can do this just fine. Dungeons are easily cleared without needing to use waypoint res zerging. I’ve completed CoE with PUGs before, some struggle, some do not. Chances are if you are not completing dungeons you may need to evaluate your own play style. Don’t assume just because you’ve been doing it since beta you are doing it correctly.

Good post and I agree. I never claimed being perfect and knowing everything, but people seem to be quick on judging others when they have certain difficulties. So much on human’s nature. A post like yours is way more useful than any kind of “you’re just bad” or “learn your class” type of post I’ve seen.

I know I’m not perfect, but I shouldn’t expect to be for a boss fight in a game said to be fun. That’s my point. Ask me to be irreproachable for an interview in real life, I will see the point, but when I play a game, I expect to have a fun experience yet challenging. Some things are way too much for certain players, they allow little to no room to mistakes. These information you and Papaj said about Subject Alpha, I should have been allowed to find them by myself while doing the boss. But it’s so messy I can’t. I have to rely on walkthroughs, the forums… And not everybody will think about checking on the net, or having the patience to consider it. A big amount will likely give up.

And from what I read, if a certain amount of players have a good time doing it, it invalidate the possibility that it might need to be reviewed. It goes both way: the dungeon might need to be a little bit changed. It’s not because you got used to a flaw it makes it perfect in any kind of way.
I completed the Mad King’s Clock Tower in the Halloween event. That didn’t prevent me to consider that it had flaws and others were having an understandable hard time. I didn’t put myself in a position to judge their capacity, their play style or just claim “you’re just bad”. Nothing is perfect in this game, even less the dungeons.

In this fight, either everybody in your party is good or you fail. That’s not a good mentality and it’s going against the idea of teaming with strangers.
There is always room to improvements, like I said in earlier posts first time I did AC with my guild we sucked hard. But certain fight are way too hard by time, it’s inconsistent.

If you watch some of his videos, you’ll probably find me in most of them, if only I had kept my Fraps footage…On another note, I still have people that get knocked down by Gravelings in AC, or can’t dodge Kohler’s Scorpion Wire (sometimes ts even the guys who typically do it flawlessly). We res them, I joke about them being terrible, they learn to dodge it or they equip stun breakers.

Edit: If you REALLY want a fight that requires everyone to be perfect or you fail (particularly now with the no waypoint zerging) try Giganticus Lupicus out for size in Arah (any of the paths).

I don’t wanna be perfect, and do not want real fight, I want receive fun with PUG, like many casual players. Like it was before this stupid innovation.

angan.6572:

Tried Sorrows Embrace path 2 and Citadel of flame after this patch. Is nearly impossible to complete them with random groups. If you don’t go with full dps group how do you expect to kill the adds to protect the NPC until it charges the bomb at 100% ??

CoF path 2 is a joke now. It’s far easier than it used to be, and if you can’t kill the trash spawns, then I don’t know what the problem is. Did a pug group after the patch and cleaned that path with 0 downs from anyone.

The problem i have with removing the ability to res at a wp is that, for the most part, half of the pugs i will join will not be able to finish some of the dungeons. The casual players will be put off by this increase in difficulty as many have mentioned previously. I completed my first ‘post-patch’ run of CoF path 2 yesterday and i have to say the changes to the fight before the final boss was challenging but the particular pug i was part of overcame it easily after a couple goes. Im by no means one of these obnoxious elitist players, i play a bit almost everyday but i wouldnt consider myself ‘hardcore’. Today on my second attempt with another pug, we must have wiped about 7 or 8 times before the group eventually disbanded. Now, it gets to a point when you’re no longer getting any enjoyment out of playing the game because you know the group wont be able to get through the instance, and we were all left feeling bitterly frustrated. If you have a good group of friends to run instances with then its fine, the ‘no ressing at wp’ doesn’t factor into the equation, its just the pugs which will suffer, especially on lower population servers like mine Fissure of Woe. I understand making things a challenge but there is a fine line between difficulty and alienating an entire demographic of players. Im sure A-Net will iron out the creases soon. Love the game, best mmo ever made, sets the standard for all mmo’s to come

NickChabby.8907:

Shinki.8045:

Precisely why I recommended it. You could give advice to teammates, or even just enjoy looking at a different character for a bit.

As for the getting one-shotted bit, what is one shotting you in full P/T/V gear? Just curious, I’m sure I could give some advice.

We spent almost three hours without getting further than removing 10% of his health because of this. We were all 80 geared in full exotics, one elementalist (me), one mesmer, one thief, one warrior and one guardian. A big waste of time.
This fight was already a pain prior the patch, now it’s a real spike in the… hole…

Sorry for the delay for the reply but:

Is this your standard Dungeon party? As in can you earnestly work with these people using different strategies?

When my standard dungeon party was having problems on Subject Alpha I told them to all stand on me in melee and dodge when I dodge. Made it cake.

From your description it really sounds like you are spending more time cleaning up your teams mistakes than making them yourself. Also in the second encounter you can soften up an undead tendril and if you go down it’s an easy thing to rally from. Stacking on him also makes breaking the crystals a snap.

My usual group of 5 contains: Mesmer, Guardian, Engineer, and 2 Thieves.

Up to this point, we’ve run through every dungeon with no issues. After the patch however? Eh…not so lucky so far.

CoF p1 and p2 are still super easy. I think the Magg bomb event is actually far easier now than it used to be.

However, we went to Crucible of Eternity(CoE) path 1….oh dear lord…This was the most miserable thing we’ve ever experienced. We tried stacking on Alpha. We tried ranging him. We tried to find exploits just to kill the kitten, all to no avail.

Our Guardian gave up and we had to pug someone else. That went even worse. So we gave up for the day and waited until later to try again. We grabbed a different guardian and set off into CoE p1. (Keep in mind we’ve done this dungeon a ton and most of my gear is from there. We’ve never had any trouble before). It went…miserably. So bad that we wiped enough to start breaking armor. But we were dedicated. We refused to give up.

Sadly, you know what our solution was? For our Mesmer to change professions to Elementalist so she could spam heals and condition removals along with the Guardian.

To me, that’s just wrong. The whole point in GW2 of not having ‘roles’ as so many fanboys cheer about…is that you are supposed to be able to do content with any combination of professions you want. But, it’s simply not true now. The moment you need someone spamming heals and condition removals while someone else tanks is the moment you have the ‘Trinity’ back. Only it is in a crappy and watered down form.

Rhysati.4932:

My usual group of 5 contains: Mesmer, Guardian, Engineer, and 2 Thieves.

Sadly, you know what our solution was? For our Mesmer to change professions to Elementalist so she could spam heals and condition removals along with the Guardian.

To me, that’s just wrong. The whole point in GW2 of not having ‘roles’ as so many fanboys cheer about…is that you are supposed to be able to do content with any combination of professions you want. But, it’s simply not true now. The moment you need someone spamming heals and condition removals while someone else tanks is the moment you have the ‘Trinity’ back. Only it is in a crappy and watered down form.

Mesmer couldn’t swap to nullity field (assuming condition removal and not healing was the issue)?

There are roles in GW2, nobody ever said there weren’t. What they said was that any Profession could fill any role. Roles being Support, Control, Damage instead of Tank, Healer, DPS.

Silidus.7985:

Rhysati.4932:

My usual group of 5 contains: Mesmer, Guardian, Engineer, and 2 Thieves.

Sadly, you know what our solution was? For our Mesmer to change professions to Elementalist so she could spam heals and condition removals along with the Guardian.

To me, that’s just wrong. The whole point in GW2 of not having ‘roles’ as so many fanboys cheer about…is that you are supposed to be able to do content with any combination of professions you want. But, it’s simply not true now. The moment you need someone spamming heals and condition removals while someone else tanks is the moment you have the ‘Trinity’ back. Only it is in a crappy and watered down form.

Mesmer couldn’t swap to nullity field (assuming condition removal and not healing was the issue)?

There are roles in GW2, nobody ever said there weren’t. What they said was that any Profession could fill any role. Roles being Support, Control, Damage instead of Tank, Healer, DPS.

there are roles but its turning into elitism mode. only the elites can play the game now.

I think people are forgetting one important thing here… a LOT of players found dungeons to be, more or less, a face roll. Few of them provided real challenges once you had done it a time or two.

I know there’s the opposite end of that spectrum too – people who haven’t done them much or who aren’t geared out yet.

The problem faced by A-net is finding a common ground. They made it a little harder via the WP removal (but in all honesty, I don’t know of other major MMO’s that would let you death-zerg bosses down). However, they made other aspects a little easier as well.

It’s possible that I may have been running too much fractals lately, but I swear the mobs seem to be a lot easier in dungeons like AC than they were before.

Boyd.5438:

there are roles but its turning into elitism mode. only the elites can play the game now.

Wow.. a minor change to something that should never have existed, and a few weeks of potentially challenging dungeon content (that is in no way required for anyone) before they get rebalanced has everyone all doom and gloom.
Seriously, the only people that make this game split between elites and casuals are the casuals who just up and quit. Casuals outnumber Elites… greatly.
So there is no shortage of other casual people with whom you can team with, and have fun. You don’t need to succeed all the time, you just need to try, and have some fun doing it.

Silidus.7985:

Boyd.5438:

there are roles but its turning into elitism mode. only the elites can play the game now.

Wow.. a minor change to something that should never have existed, and a few weeks of potentially challenging dungeon content (that is in no way required for anyone) before they get rebalanced has everyone all ‘doom and gloom’.

Wow.. a minor change to something that should never have existed, and a few weeks of potentially challenging dungeon content (that is in no way required for anyone) before they get rebalanced has everyone all ‘doom and gloom’.Seriously, the only people that make this game split between ‘elites’ and ‘casuals’ are the casuals who just up and quit.

Wow.. a minor change to something that should never have existed, and a few weeks of potentially challenging dungeon content (that is in no way required for anyone) before they get rebalanced has everyone all ‘doom and gloom’.Seriously, the only people that make this game split between ‘elites’ and ‘casuals’ are the casuals who just up and quit.Casuals outnumber Elites… greatly. So there is no shortage of other casual people with whom you can team with, and have fun. You don’t need to succeed all the time, you just need to try, and have some fun doing it.

people just stop trying after awhile. not everyone have the patience to sit stand and wait for something to work or use a pen and paper to write down what the have to do in a “game”. you do realize this is a game right? you dont get a real achievement from here right? there is no such thing as PhD in GW2 skillplay right?

Boyd.5438:

people just stop trying after awhile. not everyone have the patience to sit stand and wait for something to work or use a pen and paper to write down what the have to do in a “game”. you do realize this is a game right? you dont get a real achievement from here right? there is no such thing as PhD in GW2 skillplay right?

Lol, I love how when describing how it is just a game, you still focused on the REWARD for the activity in your examples.

Games are for fun. You do something, its entertaining. It doesn’t matter if you complete it, or if you win, or if there is a green ribbon at the end. Its about challenging yourself, or entertaining yourself in some way. So yes, I do know its a game.. but I am not sure you do.

Silidus.7985:

Boyd.5438:

people just stop trying after awhile. not everyone have the patience to sit stand and wait for something to work or use a pen and paper to write down what the have to do in a “game”. you do realize this is a game right? you dont get a real achievement from here right? there is no such thing as PhD in GW2 skillplay right?

Lol, I love how when describing how it is just a game, you still focused on the REWARD for the activity in your examples.

Games are for fun. You do something, its entertaining. It doesn’t matter if you complete it, or if you win, or if there is a green ribbon at the end. Its about challenging yourself, or entertaining yourself in some way. So yes, I do know its a game.. but I am not sure you do.

because i take it as a game, i don’t want to spend my life thinking of ways to do a certain thing to get the reward. it is very repetitive, and also tough job to guide new players to do the “right” thing. it is not fun when a game turns into additional stress when things does not work out after a lot of tries.

first of all, you got to understand this is not about just me, i honestly dont give a rats kitten if this goes to the kitten, it aint hard, close and eye its done. but the time used to get it done. its not enjoyable when people start abandoning ship. walk away and leave.

have you notice the sharp decline on gw2lfg for dungeons? those players with 400 – 800 achievement points, some with green gears or rares, go in, die, a few times, and they go offline. some with 2k achievement points just says “mate im goin off after this daily”. meh wtf is this? i want to have people to play with, especially friends. everyone is gone u get it? nobody left to play with. 3/4 of my friendlist is offline, sometimes its only 5 people on lol.

this so called minor change, is making life hard and tough for the beginners. you are maybe an old fart “in gw2 aka old player”, but heck man, what about the new dudes? before they could see whats being done, they already dead somewhere somehow.

I actually love this change that everyone in the party needs to be out of combat to use the waypoint. This is how it should have been from the beginning. Now if arena net would just fix the exploits so people actually have to learn to play, it would bring the challenge and fun back into dungeons.

I love the new change. The dungeons finally feel like a challenge. In fact I’m surprised it wasn’t like this from the start.

I still say that ANET is not looking at the big picture here. Sure make the dungeons harder for the more geared out groups of players. But, why do companies like this always forget about the smaller groups of people. Who by now, hopefully ain’t giving up soon. This game was suppose to be for everyone! It is what made it different. My guardian has 2 sets of exotic armor, dps/tank and healing/condition removal. And I try to help out the low levels in AC and AC EX. But because their levels are low and mines scaled down. They don’t have the proper dps or stats to finish it. So having not gave up trying to teach them and to tell them, things need to go slowly now. Most just leave and give up. All in all, I feel I was forced to become Support now. Can’t play the way I want too anymore… if I constantly change traits it will cost me a whole lot more. I don’t know what to say anymore…

Boyd.5438:

because i take it as a game, i don’t want to spend my life thinking of ways to do a certain thing to get the reward. it is very repetitive, and also tough job to guide new players to do the “right” thing. it is not fun when a game turns into additional stress when things does not work out after a lot of tries.

first of all, you got to understand this is not about just me, i honestly dont give a rats kitten if this goes to the kitten, it aint hard, close and eye its done. but the time used to get it done. its not enjoyable when people start abandoning ship. walk away and leave.

have you notice the sharp decline on gw2lfg for dungeons? those players with 400 – 800 achievement points, some with green gears or rares, go in, die, a few times, and they go offline. some with 2k achievement points just says “mate im goin off after this daily”. meh wtf is this? i want to have people to play with, especially friends. everyone is gone u get it? nobody left to play with. 3/4 of my friendlist is offline, sometimes its only 5 people on lol.

this so called minor change, is making life hard and tough for the beginners. you are maybe an old fart “in gw2 aka old player”, but heck man, what about the new dudes? before they could see whats being done, they already dead somewhere somehow.

Yup, quitters suck, and ruin the game for everyone. But you don’t fix a quitter by trivializing the game, they just get bored and quit anyways.

Helping new players is fun. Its something I try to do whenever I am on, and it keeps the game interesting and social. If your friends all quit within 2 days of what was essentially an exploit fix, it sounds like they forgot its a game too.

its not about the exploit fix, its about the waypoint being unable to be used. its not the case where we are ress-rushing or wtv its called, but sometimes ress is just impossible in certain situations especially guiding new players. how can people learn when things are set to be at elite mode and they are “barely legal”?

i dont really see the point in all this tho, i wouldn’t have said anything on the forums and stayed as a mute all the time if i had the choice but for Christ sakes, cant they just make an elite dungeon mode instead of ruining the fun for another group of people?

people learn and advance slowly in steps, as you have learned before all those patches that have occurred. if this was implemented from the start, i got nothing to say, everyone started the same. but changing it half way is just.. sigh..

do you remember your own first ac run? cm run? coe or arah? imagine if you cant wp, you dont see anything. there is no “experience” in that staying dead.