Guild Wars 2

Why are you even bringing that up though? The 80 duo has way more reflects and doesnt have to deal with melee attacks. Its impressive because of how dangerous those elementals are at 80, but the way you dealt with them wasnt really that impressive. I find it boring to watch ranged kills no matter how difficult the fight is.

ozma.3498:

My point was that if you’re chaining reflects and kiting in between, then the only extra difficulty a melee player faces is the slow AoE you can walk out of and the spinning attack, which compared with many bosses in the game isn’t too fast, and is very easy to see since it’s a big boss model hovering above the ground.

And an arrow.

And like Wethospu said, they are chaining reflects even more easier so what exactly does make it harder?

Plus, you will rarely find people in this subforum genuine impressed when you mostly use ranged attacks, whatever content you do.

At range you can avoid pretty much all arrows without dodging just by side stepping.

Wethospu.6437:

If meleeing was fairly easy why did they range then?

They already stated why – because it’s a more suitable option for the fight. It’s a bad fight to melee in, since there is more DPS downtime (leaving melee range, the boss invulnerable during the AoE attack), and you can’t DPS the adds while kiting if you’re melee. Longbow is (imo) the most suitable weapon, since you have two large-radius AoEs that do a hefty amount of damage, as well as being able to Blind the boss (making arrows miss) and use Bleed/Immobilize during the add phase. You already stated that you went melee purely because it’s too easy at 48 otherwise.

Also you are missing some major things which makes me believe you really haven’t meleed it. Most importantly when he “spins” you have to react immediately because the attack hits really inconsistently (before circles even appear and outside of them). There might be something I don’t know about this attack so feel free to tell me. One little thing is that you have much less time to avoid his arrow (you have to dodge based on animation instead of dodging when it flies towards you). And finally you have position properly for Firestorm and it’s much easier to take damage from lava.

I admit, meleeing Shaman isn’t my “normal” approach during 48 daily runs and whatnot. But after Define released their full melee video and then again when you released your duo video, I tried melee and it wasn’t difficult enough to make a ranged duo 80 kill seem like they cheated somehow. It’s much easier than something like Legendary Archdiviner, where you literally (I timed it) have to press dodge in 0.2 seconds on his non-leap melee hits to avoid taking ~5k damage at the old 48.

Also I don’t think the lava damage actually scales (not 100% sure but I think I tested it at some point). At least on the video I saw Mesmer getting hit for about 2.5k from an Elemental. That’s about 13% of his health, not 75%.

I can’t remember exact numbers, but me and an Elementalist were messing around on 80 Shaman a couple of days before the patch, I’m 99% sure it was over 10k damage per hit (I checked my combat log at the time). I can remember, because I then went to re-trait Missile Deflection to see if I could burst them down a bit with their own damage and was disappointed that it “only” did 1-2k damage when reflected. Unfortunately I didn’t take any screens or record it.

According to you with reflects you can just faceroll. So what made this fight so impressive then?

That was in response to you implying melee is much more difficult on this fight than ranged, even though both groups make liberal use of reflects and the boss attacks aren’t supremely difficult to dodge or anything. What makes it impressive on both videos is dealing with the general chaos of the fight, regardless of reflects.

haviz.1340:

And an arrow.

And like Wethospu said, they are chaining reflects even more easier so what exactly does make it harder?

Plus, you will rarely find people in this subforum genuine impressed when you mostly use ranged attacks, whatever content you do.

Everybody seems to be entirely missing my point. People implied that it’s not very impressive because it’s ranged. I’m pointing out that meleeing Shaman isn’t some kind of impressive feat in itself (there are countless examples of bosses that have already been meleed in solo videos that are much more difficult to dodge at melee range) and shouldn’t be used as a reason to say they somehow cheesed it because they used ranged weapons.

Ranged weapons are much more suitable on Shaman, kind of like when soloing Lupicus meleeing is much more suitable, since you don’t get hit by projectiles etc. People don’t start criticizing players for doing that, so I don’t see why it’s appropriate here.

If there is some kind of unspoken rule that you should always use the worst choice of weapon as some kind of community-imposed gambit, then Warriors for example, should stop using GS since it provides an extra dodge, or offhand sword since it provides an extra block.

ozma.3498:

Ranged weapons are much more suitable on Shaman, kind of like when soloing Lupicus meleeing is much more suitable, since you don’t get hit by projectiles etc. People don’t start criticizing players for doing that, so I don’t see why it’s appropriate here.

You can sidestep projectiles at lupi the same way you can sidestep arrows at shaman.

If there is some kind of unspoken rule that you should always use the worst choice of weapon as some kind of community-imposed gambit, then Warriors for example, should stop using GS since it provides an extra dodge, or offhand sword since it provides an extra block.

No one cried about that yet.

ozma.3498:

They already stated why – because it’s a more suitable option for the fight. It’s a bad fight to melee in, since there is more DPS downtime (leaving melee range, the boss invulnerable during the AoE attack), and you can’t DPS the adds while kiting if you’re melee. Longbow is (imo) the most suitable weapon, since you have two large-radius AoEs that do a hefty amount of damage, as well as being able to Blind the boss (making arrows miss) and use Bleed/Immobilize during the add phase. You already stated that you went melee purely because it’s too easy at 48 otherwise.

5 man would also be more suitable.

We wanted to melee it because of higher risk. Ranged would have been really boring.

I admit, meleeing Shaman isn’t my “normal” approach during 48 daily runs and whatnot. But after Define released their full melee video and then again when you released your duo video, I tried melee and it wasn’t difficult enough to make a ranged duo 80 kill seem like they cheated somehow. It’s much easier than something like Legendary Archdiviner, where you literally (I timed it) have to press dodge in 0.2 seconds on his non-leap melee hits to avoid taking ~5k damage at the old 48.

No one is talking about cheating. The truth is melee has higher risk which makes it more impressive. Also only reason this was brought up because someone said our meleeing was a mistake and people acting so high about their ranging.

Important thing is that because they ranged and we meleed the fights aren’t comparable. They ranged for easier difficulty, we did 48 for easier difficulty.

I can’t remember exact numbers, but me and an Elementalist were messing around on 80 Shaman a couple of days before the patch, I’m 99% sure it was over 10k damage per hit (I checked my combat log at the time). I can remember, because I then went to re-trait Missile Deflection to see if I could burst them down a bit with their own damage and was disappointed that it “only” did 1-2k damage when reflected. Unfortunately I didn’t take any screens or record it.

I based my number on their video.

Modesty doesn’t exist when you have to deal with people that have such a big ego.
Reading the pathetic drama in this thread makes me feel embarassed for you. “I’m proer than you because I did x!” Please. It’s… awkward.

deSade.9437:

Modesty doesn’t exist when you have to deal with people that have such a big ego.
Reading the pathetic drama in this thread makes me feel embarassed for you. “I’m proer than you because I did x!” Please. It’s… awkward.

I’m pro’er than you because your name only has one capital letter and mine has three.

Actually I think you will find that names with the least capital letters are the pro’ist. Which makes sense because im pretty awesome.

Don’t forget who was the man that graciously lent me his surname. His – ah so delicious – twisted actions and torrid perversions echo from the past…
You better not make me angry…!

spoj.9672:

im pretty awesome.

I don’t even think your grandma believes this. But… ok. /pat
Pfff, all these noobs doing easy stuff like lvl 80 shaman… they never had the pleasure to facetank lupi aoes and stand defiantly in his drain, powered by all dem heals and the banners’ regen. Amirite? :P

I would be genuinely impressed at a roaming/successful dueling videos for a staff ele in WvW or tpvp.

Range may be easy in PvE, but it’s actually the inferior dueling/roaming option in pvp formats. Melee is easymode there.

P.S. I really want to see some necro melee solo videos. That’s easily the hardest spec to run given necro’s lack of access to vigor, forcing them to have stew food for the endurance regen buff. It feels like the least forgiving, encouraging you to waste not a single one of your dodges.

I could actually even see an arch diviner melee with necro if you took the cooldown reduction on shroud to tank some melee swings in place of dodging. The projectile whirl would probably be the wrench thrown in for this fight since the lack of reflect/block will force a dodge on that and you may run low for when he leaps at you.

I never expected that such capable people may be involved in such an immature dispute. Shame on you, guys -_-

strill.7459:

I never expected that such capable people may be involved in such an immature dispute. Shame on you, guys -_-

Well stop bringing the post back to the top of the page xD

Come on guys, it was just a discussion. No hard feelings involved.

Aswell as I am not able to see any immatury from ‘our’ side.

It’s just typical talking down people’s achievements to make one’s self look better..

Nothing new to see on the internet here.

/meh.

Are you now talking us down to make you look better?

Wethospu.6437:

Are you now talking us down to make you look better?

Pfft you all know I’m a scumbag!

You said that!

We like you nevertheless.

Oh, I’m at two hours flood control now.

Nice video.

This thread is a good read. It’s great to see the GW2 community coming together and basking in each other’s positive vibes.

Seems like some comments were deleted just a minute ago.

Dat flag function.

Thank for proving me right

Who are you?

Waxpax is one of the best players in DNT. I’m surprised you haven’t heard of him.

My last post is 3 days ago since I have a lot more to do than just follow a Guild Wars 2 Discussion, but I’d like to share some of my thoughts about the negative comments I got at least and thanks for the positive ones!

Wethospu.6437:

Great challenge for playing the easy mode profession and not even attempting to enter melee range so he won’t use half of his attacks.

I haven’t watched the video but you probably just hid behind reflects all the time.

So you argue without even taking the time to look up the discussed topic or reading the 3rd post in this thread about the inefficiency? Of course I know about the warrior’s mentality to slay everything down within seconds but sometimes you just have to open up your horizon.

Occasionally I went melee range on purpose to trigger the bosses AoE Attack which gave us enough time to recover so you can’t dilute that.

Wethospu.6437:

If people think we were stupid to melee it (due to inefficiency) then I say you were stupid to 2 man it.

I completly unterstand your argument and I also feel it’s very reasonable!

Wethospu.6437:

And one of the biggest reasons why we meleed was that ranging 48 would have been too easy.

You played a warrior a profession basically made to play in melee range. I just can’t understand why you want to hinder your groupmate’s gameplay to force him to play in your comfort zone.

Wethospu.6437:

For the record, I have melee soloed it to 75% on scale 80 couple of times (just can’t do anything with the Elementals).

I’m happy you reached the actual level of problem now so we can continue with constructive posts.

We didn’t bring in the reflects for the shaman fight. Since we just dodged the arrows and evaded the AoE fields. The risk is just too high to not have them for the add phase if you chain them. Also it doesn’t really matter because you can deny the agony damage reflected to the shaman so there is no real reason to use them. Meeleing might work at level 48 but on scale 80 the damage gets mostly trivilized by the health pool of the lava elementals. There are simply too much with way more health.

I actually did level 48 after patch and told my friend to do the same tactic we used to but adds were already dead by breaking the bubble.

Breaking the bubble is actually one of the most difficulties as a two man party, breaking a bubble with 40 stacks and no ground targeted freeze or immobilize. You basically have to hold the shaman in the middle of all points and than be mobile to walk with him while breaking the bubble and double check to still be in timewarp range. Also you have to place the wall of reflection so that you can walk in it the same direction the shaman is moving.

So why did we chose exactly those two professions if at least one elementalist would have made it a lot easier to break the bubble and we don’t need no reflects anyway?

It’s hard to say but damage doesn’t matter anymore. We tested two elementalists who were supposed to first kill the adds having the shaman perma freezed in the bubble and than simply remove his stacks. Sadly after two frost bow chains and two fiery greatsword’s in full zerk mode no add has been killed yet.

The key of this encounter is kite because dps is too low for it to work and the only solution to get the adds down is to kill them with their own reflected damage.

This just leavs us with the you’ve called easy mode professions while you need the guard to tank them and make them follow as well as the mesmer for the timewarp (bubble breaking) and the pressure.

Wethospu.6437:

According to you with reflects you can just faceroll. So what made this fight so impressive then?

One sidestep or AoE in a wall already means death.

If you stay in you’ll die if you dodge out you’ll die aswell since the adds just hit you twice while immobilizing you so that you are unable to move.

Positioning is the key, watching the adds, shaman and your friend at the same time and carrying each other. You have to play with the adds. They can easyly walk through your reflects so you have to make wise use of line of warding and also kite them best to always generate new short cuts to pressure while kiting through the whole map.

haviz.1340:

Plus, you will rarely find people in this subforum genuine impressed when you mostly use ranged attacks, whatever content you do.

Impressive or not try this with a melee weapon!

Wethospu.6437:

No one is talking about cheating. The truth is melee has higher risk which makes it more impressive. Also […] someone said our meleeing was a mistake and people acting so high about their ranging.

For me your meleeing on 48 was a legit choise even if there is no reason to dodge the arrows anyway with 55AR and the mesmer wasn’t the best to come up with for the reasons I stated 3 days ago. It would for example be possible to exchange him with an elementalist.

If I look at the traits and builds I think there is still a lot of possible improvement.

Does the mesmer know his illusions aren’t affected by his 10% more dps buff from his scholar runes?

At least ruby orbs would have done the trick to transver all the possible stats to his illusions aswell.

On a sidenot I would be happy if you promote your video next time on another thread. There is,… you know the possibility to open one.

Dub.1273:

We like you nevertheless.

Oh, I’m at two hours flood control now.

It seems someone has now surpassed me.

Bart Weird.9671:

You played a warrior a profession basically made to play in melee range. I just can’t understand why you want to hinder your groupmate’s gameplay to force him to play in your comfort zone.

And guardian wasn’t? Before some beta weekends he didn’t even have 900 range weapon. Iirc it was only because of wvw-ers complaining about lack of ranged options that anet increased scepter range to 1200, though they forgot to improve speed of the projectiles which clearly shows that scepter was designed as a short range weapon.

Bart Weird.9671:

Impressive or not try this with a melee weapon!

Sure, done it.

*licks icecream*

I assume that either OP or someone from his crew reported my recent post (which was perfectly valid).
So I change my opinion of this video from “nice, good job!” to “wow, EASY!!! why did you guys even bother?”

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Waxpax is one of the best players in DNT. I’m surprised you haven’t heard of him.

What is DNT?
I remember it mentioned in some Ebi thread. Down Syndrom and Tourettes?

Anicetus.1253:

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Waxpax is one of the best players in DNT. I’m surprised you haven’t heard of him.

What is DNT?
I remember it mentioned in some Ebi thread. Down Syndrom and Tourettes?

Dogs N caTs, I think. It used to say in my signature, but now that is gone and I don’t know what it means.

Do Not Troll? No that cant be it.

Dying Numerous Times, of course.