Guild Wars 2

klemen.8439:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

klemen.8439:

oxtred.7658:

Won’t comment on this one, I was toxic enough for today. I lol’d at the fgs part, though.

Try the Noob guild, they help people inexperienced in dungeons.

Maybe read before judging people’s experience I’ve been playing this game for 2 years using meta, even doing hardcore dungeon speedclears but I am sick and tired of doing the same thing in same content for 2 years straight.

I think you’ll find he did. Or ox is very good at estimating players skill with very little information. Either way, ox is correct, you should go away, and learn the meta, before sprouting about it. See further up about the 29 page thread i linked? Take your own advice, and go read it before making claims.

How is he right? I play in meta for 2 years but am tired of it. How does this make me need instructions for new players? Are you dumb?

Congratulations on being abusive. You’re so leet.

He is correct because you don’t know what the meta is.
You claim you know. All evidence to the contrary.

Molch.2078:

klemen.8439:

Q: Do you realize you can play any role you want? Just join parties that don’t say meta zerker speedruns!
A: I know this and I do run meta, but it’s boring, it doesn’t bring any challange and complexity and the whole concept of current meta is based on exploiting issues with current AI and other mechanics such as buffs and debuffs.

You can quote this as often as you want, but it still doesnt make sense. The question is “why do you play meta when its boring” and your answer is “I play meta and it’s boring”.

I hate the meta and I find it boring, yet I want the shinies and in order to be efficent, I have to play it for fast gold.

As for that guy smacktalking, be my guest, make a list of your issues and keep on talking. You haven’t played with me, you don’t know me, you don’t know how long and how i’ve been playing the game or what I have accomplished and vice versa. I don’t go around calling you a noob as I have nothing to back up my statement, and the same goes for you.

As for your understanding of meta, let me break it up for you. Meta is the most optimal way to do something. Hardcore and competitive takes on the meta might be far more efficent. Currently, there are builds that can be better than meta but only if used properly, yet they are not meta because the majority of people would be unable to use it properly and it would result in being less efficent than the current one.

And meta isn’t DnT world record run or whatever guild holds most records nowdays (SC maybe? not sure). Meta isn’t guild run or run with your friends, meta is mainstream PUG run where things are done as efficent as possibly. Of course meta has many different meanings but it’s the one that’s being discussed in this presentation and post but again, you would’ve known if you would’ve read.

You’re being ignored until further notice.

Mainstream PUG is so far from meta it wouldn’t reach it with traited grenades.

jackaljag.8637:

Mainstream PUG is so far from meta it wouldn’t reach it with traited grenades.

Yet again, you fail to understand the definition of meta and the type of meta that’s being discussed in this post.

klemen.8439:

jackaljag.8637:

Mainstream PUG is so far from meta it wouldn’t reach it with traited grenades.

Yet again, you fail to understand the definition of meta and the type of meta that’s being discussed in this post.

and you fail to understand the type of people that frequent this subforum. Nearly everyone in this subforum is in either a speedclear dungeon or follows the meta used by the speedclear dungeoner’s. So when “META” is in discussion here, 99% of people talk about the builds termed as meta. And they are meta because they are the most efficient and useful builds for that class.

klemen.8439:

How is he right? I play in meta for 2 years but am tired of it.

Based on your answers no, you dont.

How does this make me need instructions for new players?

See above

Are you dumb?

Reported.

ps: please check out the linked thread about the issue before posting here, thanks!

I forgot to include this in my earlier post.

jackaljag.8637:

Mainstream PUG is so far from meta it wouldn’t reach it with traited grenades.

lol, its posts like this that make me want to browse these threads

Carrion and Dire have use in WvW. Dire especially, carrion a bit less, but about in the same proportion as Valkyrie so, either cross them both or don’t cross neither.

‘’7/8 professions are utilized and traited 100% based on damage’‘, that’s just wrong. Ppl often switch trait for a bit more stealth on their thief (even record runs), Mesmer have their reflect build for focus which is often use, Elemenatlist S/X sacrifice personal dps for more might stacking, same with Phalanx Warrior. Now you can say that its dps support, but that’s still support. And those are all really powerful known build that are even use in speed run.

‘’5/8 professions have a stable spot in PvE-related parties’’ 5/8 profession have a place in record run dungeons. Not the same things. Engineer and Rangers have a spot in any PvE parties other than that. Anet fixed those profession (they are now 3rd and 4th best dps), its not their fault if part of the community still have a hard time keeping up.

‘’We have 8 dungeons and 24 dungeon paths (story instances excluded). Only 14 of those are being ran on daily basis.’’ Pls. The only path that people avoid are CM path 2, SE path 2, CoF path 3, TA Aether and Arah path 4. CM path 2 is super easy with a guild or with ppl that know what they are doing, SE is not that hard it’s just annoying, CoF path 3 is actually nice and easy but ppl still remember the old path, TA Aether is super nice but a bit long and Arah path 4 that’s normal, its the longest path of the game. Its not because pugs are afraid of paths that they are not used to do, that those paths are badly design, too hard or boring. A lot of ppl are avoiding some path only because they remember it when they were fresh level 80 in rare gear and inexperienced. Go back in those path and you’ll see that they are super easy now.

‘’Out of those 14 paths being run on daily basis, 7 (+/- 2) of those paths have bosses that don’t include stack and kill tactics.’’ Depend on what you define as stacking. Are you talking about staying in group close or using LOS and stack in a corner? Because the first one is the base of the game, while the second is OVERUSED by pugs because they don’t know better. Corner used to be a really good strategy because of FGS. Since the nerf, stacking in a corner is not the best tactics for MOST bosses, but pugs are comfortable with what they know and they will continue to stack even if that doesn’t bring nothing anymore. Just take a look as records run, most boss are killed where they are, they are not pulled in a corner or a wall.

CoF 3 is actually quicker than p2. Not to mention far more interesting. It does require some experience for that though. Which is why pugs won’t do it til the reward gets buffed for a short period of time (daily dungeon anyone…).

klemen.8439:

Also, many competitive guilds refrain from using exploits such as stacking and using fiery greatswords.

Fiery Rush was nerfed over four months ago. Link

Fiery Rush no longer generates fire fields if the character’s position does not change significantly (for example, running against a wall).
The number of fire fields created by this skill has been reduced by 50%.
Reduced damage of fire fields by 70%.
This skill now ignores the movement penalties from chilled and crippled conditions.
Increased damage of the leap attack by 140%.

Video

It’s usually a good idea to understand how the wheel works before you try to improve it.

What did we learn from all these walls of text? Klemen doesn’t know how to play anything else than guardian.

klemen.8439:

24 paths, excluding story instance and I did say dungeons. Fractals are great as they are – mechanic wise.

Remember that you’re alleging that your problems come from fundamental flaws with the game’s combat. Even if your central complaint is about how explorables are done, if there is other instanced content that doesn’t suffer from the same problems, that’s evidence that there isn’t a fundamental flaw with the game’s combat.

A far simpler explanation for the problems you’re seeing in dungeons is that too many people have been allowed — and encouraged — to keep them on farm for too long.

klemen.8439:

let’s take a sample PUG meta group:
1 Guardian, 1/2 Elementalist, 2/3 Warriors – this is what I call a standard group.

In that group, warriors in particular, pre-cast their banners and after that, all they do is solo. Not solo as in soloing all the bosses but mind their own business. There’s no to little cooperation and the only actual cooperation we have is those 321go bits of the dungeon that are pathetic.

Elementalist also spawns a fire field, does ~3 blast finishers (considering eles usually run staff in PUGs) and after that, it’s minding their own business.

As for guardian, this is the only profession currently that focuses on other players over himself. It’s the reason why I chose it as my main profession (and don’t get me wrong, I play all 8 prof on lv80 meta). It is one of rare classes that has to adjust his skills to the situation for group’s sake – wall of reflection, stability, protection, aegis and so on and so forth.

Sure warriors, eles, thieves and mesmers also have to adjust their skills to the situation from time to time but …

… skills eles will get are self-dependent and don’t benefit the group (flash, mist form).
Skills warriors take are also self-dependent and don’t benefit the group either (berzerker stance, dolyak signet, …).

…

Currently, there is no actual teamwork, the one where team needs to synchronize their skill rotations, positioning and what not. And in the current build, this is acceptable. Why?

I think I found the problem.

Teamwork is not strictly enforced nor required for completion of content. This is a good thing, as it makes the game more accessible to more people, especially pick-up groups.

What you fail to consider is that the addition of teamwork makes things go that much faster and smoother. For example, everyone can contribute to stripping defiant stacks so that the boss can get a second Deep Freeze.

Also, not sure what you were intending with bit about eles and warriors taking selfish utilities. Eles generally bring some combination of Frost Bow, Glyph of Storms, Arcane Wave, and Signet of Fire, and defensive skills are only brought as a crutch by those who need them. Warriors generally bring some combination of either/both banners, For Great Justice, and Signet of Fury/Might. Again, generally no selfish personal skills like Berserker Stance or Endure Pain, although Shake It Off could be used as a crutch that also has cooperative capabilities.

Perhaps what you should be asking for is better rewards for the more difficult content that does require (or benefit greatly) from higher amounts of coordination.

Hey! Really like the ideas you have presented, and appreciate the thought put into making this. Really sorry you have to put up with this unnecessary childish hate. Perhaps you should take this to Reddit, where you are guaranteed more positive and constructive feedback from the people reading. These forums sadly do not seem to have people with enough maturity to have a civil discussion on what you have to say.

Soulaxer.1509:

Perhaps you should take this to Reddit, where you are guaranteed more positive and constructive feedback from the people reading.

Reading this put the biggest smile on my face.

klemen.8439:

oxtred.7658:

Yup. They don’t use it because it’s suboptimal. Fgs was nerfed months ago and you probably just discovered it.

You’re one dumb motherkittener. I never ever ever said it’s an exploit that is still in the game. It was an example that took place – of course with basic knowledge of english, took is a past word and puts an event like the one in question in a past time.

For rest of your reply, I won’t even bother reading. See what I did there? kitten

Ohoho, this thread is awesome!

Rabid and sinister set are used in dungeon solo, so add another 2 stat combo to the list ty.

klemen.8439:

To answer your question, let’s take a sample PUG meta group:
1 Guardian, 1/2 Elementalist, 2/3 Warriors – this is what I call a standard group.

I try, but it really hard to take you seriously after this line in particular lol.

klemen.8439:

Molch.2078:

So, let me get this straight: You want all those huge changes to the game and your only reason is because… the way you want to play the game is not the way you get the most shinies…

Egoistic. There are people who like the game as it is, what about them? And by the way, stacking in corners with meta groups is not even close the best way to make money.

Edit: I want to mention that this is only about the gameplay changes you suggest. A lot of the other stuff, like new classes or better game balance are very valid points I’d love to see.

I don’t see how it’s egoistic from me when all I’m asking for is this game to be fixed.

The way combat mechanics are now and the way the AI acts in dungeons is far from how it was designed. Anet promised us a type of trinity but a different one from what we see in classic MMOs. Instead of healing, dps and tanking, we were supposed to get support, dps and control. Hence why we have so many control skills but at the moment, we’re only using 80% of DPS, 19% of support and 1% of control. That is far from a balanced and challanging trinity.

I know many people like it and that’s the problem. There are way too many comfortists in GW2. The blocks and blinds are overpowered for PvE the way stealth is overpowered for PvP. AI should never act the way they do (following into corners and not using all skill rotations when in range under 150).

I’m sorry if I’m attacking you with this reply but by saying,

Egoistic. There are people who like the game as it is, what about them?

this is the dummest counter-argument I’ve heard in ages. Of course everyone will love exploits and use them as long as they can, doing the easy mode. But there are also people who don’t like exploits and want to play the game without bugs – afterall we did buy it and personally I buy lots of gems.

The people who like the game as it is are comfortists and they’ll like it however the game will be, as long as they can make quick gold. Who is being egoistic here would be rather you because you leave out all those newcommers who want to play the game as they like it, but sooner or later find out that their cool necromancers, rangers and engineers aren’t that desired in dungeons and that they can’t play healer/tank/support roles the way they enjoyed them in previous MMOs.

And what’s even more heartbreaking is that sooner or later, they all find out that this game is 90% melee in PvE. Those 10% are ranged bosses with PUGs in high level fractals.

It’s almost impossible to get completely new players to MMO genre in 2012-2015, when there were so many other MMOs players were exposed to pre-GW2 and many have preference playstyle based on those previous MMOs, so having no type of trinity is lack of complexity.

Hey OP, I agree so much with your statement, and I am pretty sure you will get flamed for this since many do like the quick easy gold by using stacking and other ai abuses. Many believe this is the correct way to play, and it is their right (true) to like the game as it is.

Personally, the only ones that can either agree or disagree with the direction of the game mechanics as they are are ANET devs. They can change the system or leave it as is.

I just started a small guild called KOKORO NO ZERO, just to invite players who are tired of stacking and want to play the game, how we see it, “normally”. I wont bash those that stack (Im tired of it, they wont change their mind), so making my own LFG seems to do the trick, there are many out there that agree with us.

Still, because of lack of attention to dungeons and enemy AI in this game, it has become a bit boring for me. I already have 4 legendary skins, fully ascended, fully Mighty Infused, and every other skin I want. So… I jumped to FF14 for a while. Hopefully I can someday find that GW2 has changed to become a real strategy game that doesn’t involve exploiting enemy AI and defining the correct way to play as ZERKER only. Until then, I can only do my dailies…

Aden Celeste.3650:

ai abuses

You are a human. Fighthing against a scripted enemy. No matter what the developers do, you are better, so you basically abuse its flaws. Try. To. Understand. It. Finally.

ps: please show me an engaging fight (for you) from FF XIV or any other game please. Im interested in those non-abusable super intelligent AI’s i never heard of.

pps: Ad new content. Make no guides for it. People get rektd in zerker. Well, the majority ofc. Just check out the Silverwastes threads, everybody packs up tanky gear to survive mobs that can be killed really fast by the way.

Aden Celeste.3650:

defining the most efficient way to play as ZERKER only.

fixed it for ya pal. Zerk gear isn’t the only way to play, you can complete all the content in any gear at all. It is just that berserker gear is the most efficient gear to wear while doing so.

Minigrump.4961:

Aden Celeste.3650:

defining the most efficient way to play as ZERKER only.

fixed it for ya pal. Zerk gear isn’t the only way to play, you can complete all the content in any gear at all. It is just that berserker gear is the most efficient gear to wear while doing so.

And they’ll get back at you spouting that they want their build and gear of choice to be as efficient as zerker; that mindless sheep zerkers are being mean to them and forcing them to play something they don’t want to because it’s so obviously wrong and they’re sick of it°; that playing zergburger and meta is mindless, easy, boring and that’s why everyone plays it; that it’s stale and abused and exploited and whatnot (you don’t say?). All of this anet… anet should fix, fix it some way, because we obviously live in the land of unicorns where rivers are made of wine, flowers sing the most beautiful songs and honey pours from the sky right into your mouth whenever you’re craving a sugar rush…
…and mmos have unbreakable AI that is intelligent and unpredictable – cannot be twisted or circumvented in any way. Plus, every single part of the game is balanced and every gear works great. Not decent, not good, not viable (it’s a word they hate!), but great. For instance, a zerker party will have the same efficiency and speed completion of a party with a cleric healer elly, 3 ranged dps (rangers?) and a tank soldier warrior with mace/shield.
Cus trinity.
Cus shinies.
Just knock it off, already… It’s like watching a bad movie for the 10th time and insisting in following the plot. It was crap the first time.
It’s all a big, stinky, steaming pile of crap.

… Should seriously post this on reddit, it’d get a load of likes. <3

° bonus point: they’ve already mastered every single part of this game, they know all zergburger tactics; they play full zergburger so that means they reached the end of the learning curve, right? Since AC is easy and the spider queen dies in 3 seconds, the game must be completely broken and has to be twisted upside down to fix it, right? Right guise? Right?

Aden Celeste.3650:

Hopefully I can someday find that GW2 has changed to become a real strategy game that doesn’t involve exploiting enemy AI and defining the correct way to play as ZERKER only.

Real strategy certainly isn’t that delusional concept you ran through your mind when you typed this line out. Stop lying to yourself.

Aden Celeste.3650:

So… I jumped to FF14 for a while. Hopefully I can someday find that GW2 has changed to become a real strategy game that doesn’t involve exploiting enemy AI and defining the correct way to play as ZERKER only. Until then, I can only do my dailies…

There’s plenty of “AI Abuse” or unintended ways of playing in Final Fantasy XIV. Either you’re ignorant of them, or you’re hoping others are.

Nokaru.7831:

There’s plenty of “AI Abuse” or unintended ways of playing in Final Fantasy XIV. Either you’re ignorant of them, or you’re hoping others are.

Turn 2 enrage method, anyone?

In any event, the ‘meta’ strategy for FFXIV dungeon runs is… stack lots of mobs up in one place and burn them down with AoE. It turns out that that sort of technique is pretty easy when you have a tank, the bulk of enemies are melee, and level 50 dungeons permit you to massively outgear them.

And ultimately, you will always be wearing max DPS gear as well — every item for your class or job grants bonuses to your main damage stat and to your hp, and the effect of your primary stat dwarfs the potential effect of literally any other stats you might find on your gear.

Why do you guys even bother…? Really…

The OP is the prime example of the current meta tryhards. Nothing you’ve said will get through him. Just raise the white flag, like the true French.

Iris Ng.9845:

Why do you guys even bother…? Really…

The OP is the prime example of the current meta tryhards. Nothing you’ve said will get through him. Just raise the white flag, like the true French.

You are right, but maybe a bad time to make French jokes.

Acotje.5689:

You are right, but maybe a bad time to make French joke

I disagree it would be bad times for jokes in general look around :/, besides it wasn’t even related to the recent happenings, sorry Rpwalker

klemen.8439:

oxtred.7658:

Won’t comment on this one, I was toxic enough for today. I lol’d at the fgs part, though.

Try the Noob guild, they help people inexperienced in dungeons.

Maybe read before judging people’s experience I’ve been playing this game for 2 years using meta, even doing hardcore dungeon speedclears but I am sick and tired of doing the same thing in same content for 2 years straight.

So, don’t do the same thing anymore. I have also been playing since launch and have had many dungeon partners and friends quit or take extended breaks from the game. Everytime I found myself getting strung out or bored of the game, I took breaks as well.

The folks that know me and play with me on occasion know that I don’t log very regularly but when I do it is enjoyable to do a few runs with friends or whoever happens to be on! Why ruin that for people?

We know that content is the issue, or rather lack of new dungeon content. New dungeons can introduce new mechanics and spice things up. Right now, we’re playing 2 year old dungeons and we know nearly every tip and trick in the book thanks to the research and work of some dedicated members and the community’s input.

If it’s boring for you, make it fun by playing low man, solo, naked, etc… Or just have fun doing something else. PvP, WvW, even just roaming around and chatting with friends can be fun. If none of that floats your boat, there’s this huge world offline which I hear can be pretty cool.