[KnT][KnM] – Blackgate
So Evolved Destroyer is a joke boss now
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The fight wasn’t hard, at all. It’s just a tedious fight. The entire strategy revolved around repeating one set of actions over and over again for an extended time. That’s tedium, not difficulty. Reducing the time involved just hastens the inevitable and actually get people to run the path again.
Pretty spot on. The fight wasn’t overly difficult, just tediously long. We plan on revisiting this boss during our Phase 2 pass, but for now this should lower the tedium of this encounter.
Any word on revisiting Zhaitan? I refuse to believe you think that is a good boss encounter, especially after the nerfs on the 28th.
I haven’t done it since the patch but do you actually mean Zhaitan? That would not make any sense! Zhaitan is one of the easiest part of Arah story mode. I remember the patch notes mentioned something about the plaguebearers.
The fight wasn’t hard, at all. It’s just a tedious fight. The entire strategy revolved around repeating one set of actions over and over again for an extended time. That’s tedium, not difficulty. Reducing the time involved just hastens the inevitable and actually get people to run the path again.
Pretty spot on. The fight wasn’t overly difficult, just tediously long. We plan on revisiting this boss during our Phase 2 pass, but for now this should lower the tedium of this encounter.
Any word on revisiting Zhaitan? I refuse to believe you think that is a good boss encounter, especially after the nerfs on the 28th.
I haven’t done it since the patch but do you actually mean Zhaitan? That would not make any sense! Zhaitan is one of the easiest part of Arah story mode. I remember the patch notes mentioned something about the plaguebearers.
Yes I mean Zhaitan. He’s even more of a complete joke now, a glorified quicktime event after the nerfs rather than a boss. Between this and the OPs video we can see the dark path the dungeon designers are going. Nerfed content and casual pandering.
The fight wasn’t hard, at all. It’s just a tedious fight. The entire strategy revolved around repeating one set of actions over and over again for an extended time. That’s tedium, not difficulty. Reducing the time involved just hastens the inevitable and actually get people to run the path again.
Pretty spot on. The fight wasn’t overly difficult, just tediously long. We plan on revisiting this boss during our Phase 2 pass, but for now this should lower the tedium of this encounter.
Any word on revisiting Zhaitan? I refuse to believe you think that is a good boss encounter, especially after the nerfs on the 28th.
I haven’t done it since the patch but do you actually mean Zhaitan? That would not make any sense! Zhaitan is one of the easiest part of Arah story mode. I remember the patch notes mentioned something about the plaguebearers.
Yes I mean Zhaitan. He’s even more of a complete joke now, a glorified quicktime event after the nerfs rather than a boss. Between this and the OPs video we can see the dark path the dungeon designers are going. Nerfed content and casual pandering.
The Jan 28 patch was a band aid. The real dungeon revisit has yet to come. Chill.
It is easier because I don’t need to go back up the stairs or the panels since we can kill it in one go. Less risk of dying + faster kill time = easier. However amount of less risk or faster time itll take to kill the boss, that change still amounts to the meaning of “easier”. Is it as noticeable? Maybe not, but for groups who used to take 2-3 drop downs to only needing 1, thats a 100-200% risk increase of having someone make a mistake.
And, as I said, if you forced them to do it 1000 times then the probability of someone eventually kittening up once goes up. The actually challenge and difficulty didn’t. Not to mention you didn’t actually need to go up and down. With pugs I usually just did it 3-2: 3 people spamming the cannons and 2 DPSing. Boring, but completely risk free.
It is easier because I don’t need to go back up the stairs or the panels since we can kill it in one go. Less risk of dying + faster kill time = easier. However amount of less risk or faster time itll take to kill the boss, that change still amounts to the meaning of “easier”. Is it as noticeable? Maybe not, but for groups who used to take 2-3 drop downs to only needing 1, thats a 100-200% risk increase of having someone make a mistake.
And, as I said, if you forced them to do it 1000 times then the probability of someone eventually kittening up once goes up. The actually challenge and difficulty didn’t. Not to mention you didn’t actually need to go up and down. With pugs I usually just did it 3-2: 3 people spamming the cannons and 2 DPSing. Boring, but completely risk free.
Not sure what part of “I don’t need to go back up since we can kill it one go” is hard to grasp as easier compared to “after going down to dps, we have to go back up another 1-3 times”. Faster kill = less window for mistakes = easier. Boss mechanic did not change, its difficulty did not change, but easy doesnt only measure that aspect.
Guess it’s good for those people who complain about things being too hard…
You thought this fight was hard before the change?
Lol.
Yea bro, my 15 min guide run where we kill him in 3 cycles before the patch definitely means I thought he was hard :ugh:
So what’s the problem then? And I can pick on whoever I want, given that their argument is poor enough. Yours fit the bill perfectly, cute videos or not.
Very Good Detectives [VGD]
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
Guess it’s good for those people who complain about things being too hard…
You thought this fight was hard before the change?
Lol.
Yea bro, my 15 min guide run where we kill him in 3 cycles before the patch definitely means I thought he was hard :ugh:
So what’s the problem then? And I can pick on whoever I want, given that their argument is poor enough. Yours fit the bill perfectly, cute videos or not.
I believe there’s a difference between picking on someone for having poor argument and taking what someone says and put a negative spin to it so that it can be attacked. (perfect example of this post)
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
Guess it’s good for those people who complain about things being too hard…
You thought this fight was hard before the change?
Lol.
Yea bro, my 15 min guide run where we kill him in 3 cycles before the patch definitely means I thought he was hard :ugh:
So what’s the problem then? And I can pick on whoever I want, given that their argument is poor enough. Yours fit the bill perfectly, cute videos or not.
Another nooblet who thinks if something isn’t a ‘joke’ it’s automatically hard.
Not to mention it’s cute you actually thought you were picking on me, “picking someone” != “picking on.”
Learn to read before posting next time, kthxbye.
Guard/War/Mesmer and Dungeon Guides:
https://www.youtube.com/user/strife025
https://www.youtube.com/user/strife025
(edited by Strifey.7215)
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
That is a statement. I am still genuinely confused at to what the OP is trying to argue here. (I’m gonna discuss with you since OP seems not know the art of discussion, judging by his latest rambling).
Very Good Detectives [VGD]
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
That is a statement. I am still genuinely confused at to what the OP is trying to argue here. (I’m gonna discuss with you since OP seems not know the art of discussion, judging by his latest rambling).
He is not arguing anything, he is merely stating the fact that The Destroyer boss was made into a joke boss compared to how it was prior to the patch.
Example: I think lupicus is an easy boss, i love his mechanics (most unique boss in game with more than 5 attack skills). If they nerf him to oblivion / gut his hp / make his attacks tickle, I would say that they have turned him into a joke boss. An easy boss made even easier.
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
That is a statement. I am still genuinely confused at to what the OP is trying to argue here. (I’m gonna discuss with you since OP seems not know the art of discussion, judging by his latest rambling).
He is not arguing anything, he is merely stating the fact that The Destroyer boss was made into a joke boss compared to how it was prior to the patch.
Example: I think lupicus is an easy boss, i love his mechanics (most unique boss in game with more than 5 attack skills). If they nerf him to oblivion / gut his hp / make his attacks tickle, I would say that they have turned him into a joke boss. An easy boss made even easier.
Oh, sorry. I thought there was some point to the thread.
Thanks for clarifying!
Very Good Detectives [VGD]
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
I’m yet to find a CoE path that isn’t frustration, tedious and down right Anger inducing, but hey these things are fun to some people right! but then 99% of the dungeons in this game are like that..
Staring at your dead bodies not being able to resurrect is so amazingly fun…
(edited by Dante.1508)
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
That is a statement. I am still genuinely confused at to what the OP is trying to argue here. (I’m gonna discuss with you since OP seems not know the art of discussion, judging by his latest rambling).
He is not arguing anything, he is merely stating the fact that The Destroyer boss was made into a joke boss compared to how it was prior to the patch.
Example: I think lupicus is an easy boss, i love his mechanics (most unique boss in game with more than 5 attack skills). If they nerf him to oblivion / gut his hp / make his attacks tickle, I would say that they have turned him into a joke boss. An easy boss made even easier.
Oh, sorry. I thought there was some point to the thread.
Thanks for clarifying!
The point of the thread was made pretty clear; the destroyer boss did not need to be “fixed”. It could be done well enough before, but so much noise was made by players about it being too hard or too long of a fight that it was given a “fix”. Robert has stated that this boss will be looked at in the second phase of the dungeon fixes, so this thread obviously got some point across that maybe the nerf was too strong.
Also, its not too long ago that I remember you refusing to do this path Gab because the of this boss. So far I have just seen you try to throw words into other player’s mouths by twisting statements.
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
That is a statement. I am still genuinely confused at to what the OP is trying to argue here. (I’m gonna discuss with you since OP seems not know the art of discussion, judging by his latest rambling).
He is not arguing anything, he is merely stating the fact that The Destroyer boss was made into a joke boss compared to how it was prior to the patch.
Example: I think lupicus is an easy boss, i love his mechanics (most unique boss in game with more than 5 attack skills). If they nerf him to oblivion / gut his hp / make his attacks tickle, I would say that they have turned him into a joke boss. An easy boss made even easier.
Oh, sorry. I thought there was some point to the thread.
Thanks for clarifying!
The point of the thread was made pretty clear; the destroyer boss did not need to be “fixed”. It could be done well enough before, but so much noise was made by players about it being too hard or too long of a fight that it was given a “fix”. Robert has stated that this boss will be looked at in the second phase of the dungeon fixes, so this thread obviously got some point across that maybe the nerf was too strong.
Also, its not too long ago that I remember you refusing to do this path Gab because the of this boss. So far I have just seen you try to throw words into other player’s mouths by twisting statements.
The boss was never too hard, it was only too tedious, and that is something Robert mentions in this thread as the specific reason as to why it was changed. A second change to it might very well be in the works, but if you think it means reverting him back to his old state you are sorely mistaken.
And yep. I did refuse to do this boss because of how horribly boring and tedious he was. That you try to make it come across as something else sounds very much like something you mention near the end of your post. Cute.
Very Good Detectives [VGD]
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
So … a group of 4 warrior and a mesmer is being used as an example? Yeah sure I’m pretty sure that group can do the boss in one go, but is that a standard? Pretty sure not.
I have killed the destroyers many time after patch and while I do agree he’s too easy right now, I also dislike using a skew example to blow a problem out of proportion. My group always consist of a mesmer, most of the time a war and a guardian with the last two spots on random. We had good run that we can finish him in 2 push, but our average attemp is around 3 and this is with everyone on top of the DPS mechanic. For example Mesmer copy stack of 25 might, Warrior running on my mark and Axe/mace for invul, Guardian using Aegis to block the AOE when the group is on the boss …etc…
This means that a average rounded group should take something like 4-5 attempts and for random pugs potentially more. So if you want the boss to last 3 attemps with a 1Mes/4War guild group in full zerker, it will easily turn into something like 10+ attempt for pugs, and everyone here agree that would be tedious. Again I’m not arguing against the point this boss right now is too easy, but be reasonable when citing your backup evidence since it’s like citing Einstein and say 99% of the world are stupid.
In fact, I’m basically ignoring every example where people citing a Mes/War composition as their example.
(edited by Abriel.4103)
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
That is a statement. I am still genuinely confused at to what the OP is trying to argue here. (I’m gonna discuss with you since OP seems not know the art of discussion, judging by his latest rambling).
He is not arguing anything, he is merely stating the fact that The Destroyer boss was made into a joke boss compared to how it was prior to the patch.
Example: I think lupicus is an easy boss, i love his mechanics (most unique boss in game with more than 5 attack skills). If they nerf him to oblivion / gut his hp / make his attacks tickle, I would say that they have turned him into a joke boss. An easy boss made even easier.
Oh, sorry. I thought there was some point to the thread.
Thanks for clarifying!
The point of the thread was made pretty clear; the destroyer boss did not need to be “fixed”. It could be done well enough before, but so much noise was made by players about it being too hard or too long of a fight that it was given a “fix”. Robert has stated that this boss will be looked at in the second phase of the dungeon fixes, so this thread obviously got some point across that maybe the nerf was too strong.
Also, its not too long ago that I remember you refusing to do this path Gab because the of this boss. So far I have just seen you try to throw words into other player’s mouths by twisting statements.
The boss was never too hard, it was only too tedious, and that is something Robert mentions in this thread as the specific reason as to why it was changed. A second change to it might very well be in the works, but if you think it means reverting him back to his old state you are sorely mistaken.
And yep. I did refuse to do this boss because of how horribly boring and tedious he was. That you try to make it come across as something else sounds very much like something you mention near the end of your post. Cute.
I never declared the boss was too hard, or that it was not tedious, I stated that it was simply disliked by a vocal group of players. Personally, I dont understand how people can find a fight tedious that can be as short as 1 minute and 30 seconds. Pre-nerf my team did this boss numerous times in just over 1 phase, having to knock off the last 1/4 of health in the 2nd attempt. So not sure why you as a player with talent would be against such a short, easy fight.
I never stated why you refused the path, you did. I did not make it come across in any intentional way, so I am not twisting anything around. Once again you are just turning words into a way you see fit.
off-topic: im clueless but do guards rly do that much dmg lol and i saw that ur defensively traited :/ is his gear also defensive ?
…
Point: Boss wasn’t hard, never was, tedious for those who never bothered going down. /argument.
That is a statement. I am still genuinely confused at to what the OP is trying to argue here. (I’m gonna discuss with you since OP seems not know the art of discussion, judging by his latest rambling).
He is not arguing anything, he is merely stating the fact that The Destroyer boss was made into a joke boss compared to how it was prior to the patch.
Example: I think lupicus is an easy boss, i love his mechanics (most unique boss in game with more than 5 attack skills). If they nerf him to oblivion / gut his hp / make his attacks tickle, I would say that they have turned him into a joke boss. An easy boss made even easier.
Oh, sorry. I thought there was some point to the thread.
Thanks for clarifying!
The point of the thread was made pretty clear; the destroyer boss did not need to be “fixed”. It could be done well enough before, but so much noise was made by players about it being too hard or too long of a fight that it was given a “fix”. Robert has stated that this boss will be looked at in the second phase of the dungeon fixes, so this thread obviously got some point across that maybe the nerf was too strong.
Also, its not too long ago that I remember you refusing to do this path Gab because the of this boss. So far I have just seen you try to throw words into other player’s mouths by twisting statements.
The boss was never too hard, it was only too tedious, and that is something Robert mentions in this thread as the specific reason as to why it was changed. A second change to it might very well be in the works, but if you think it means reverting him back to his old state you are sorely mistaken.
And yep. I did refuse to do this boss because of how horribly boring and tedious he was. That you try to make it come across as something else sounds very much like something you mention near the end of your post. Cute.
I never declared the boss was too hard, or that it was not tedious, I stated that it was simply disliked by a vocal group of players. Personally, I dont understand how people can find a fight tedious that can be as short as 1 minute and 30 seconds. Pre-nerf my team did this boss numerous times in just over 1 phase, having to knock off the last 1/4 of health in the 2nd attempt. So not sure why you as a player with talent would be against such a short, easy fight.
I never stated why you refused the path, you did. I did not make it come across in any intentional way, so I am not twisting anything around. Once again you are just turning words into a way you see fit.
You declared that other people said it was too hard. I retorted on that point, saying it was in fact not the case. There is nothing hard about this boss fight and I would give any such claims the same credit I would to someone saying AC story is hard. But since we seem to agree on this point, I really don’t understand what the point of you posting, or this thread in its entirety is.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m really happy for you guys’ achievement, and I am sure you are really proud over being able to kill him in one cycle too, but then it would be nice for you guys to show the same happiness for the people who can now enjoy this path without having to deal with an immensely tedious boss who serves no other purpose than to waste time and money towards repairs.
You say that it was disliked by a “vocal” group of players, but I’d say it was probably disliked by a majority of players. It’s kind of like grinding, isn’t it? When something isn’t very hard, but still takes a tonne of time to complete, you are usually not having fun. Right?
And you can deny your intentions for mentioning my refusal to run this path all you want, but given the context one might argue that it was to discredit me on this particular subject. I will leave it at that. There’s no need to go OT and bring up any personal issues you have with me or everyone.
Very Good Detectives [VGD]
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
Devonas Rest 4 lyfe
You declared that other people said it was too hard. I retorted on that point, saying it was in fact not the case. There is nothing hard about this boss fight and I would give any such claims the same credit I would to someone saying AC story is hard. But since we seem to agree on this point, I really don’t understand what the point of you posting, or this thread in its entirety is.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m really happy for you guys’ achievement, and I am sure you are really proud over being able to kill him in one cycle too, but then it would be nice for you guys to show the same happiness for the people who can now enjoy this path without having to deal with an immensely tedious boss who serves no other purpose than to waste time and money towards repairs.
You say that it was disliked by a “vocal” group of players, but I’d say it was probably disliked by a majority of players. It’s kind of like grinding, isn’t it? When something isn’t very hard, but still takes a tonne of time to complete, you are usually not having fun. Right?
And you can deny your intentions for mentioning my refusal to run this path all you want, but given the context one might argue that it was to discredit me on this particular subject. I will leave it at that. There’s no need to go OT and bring up any personal issues you have with me or everyone.[/quote]
I have no personal issues with you at all gab. I’ve always respected your gameplay above most in the past when we ran together. The reason I posted was to point out that this thread does serve a purpose and is a good place to discuss with players about the recent change. Lets not forget this all started when you questioned the ability of another player, for what seems like no real reason at all.
I brought you up personally because you made a claim that strife believed this boss in the past was difficult, which is not the case. My point was that you once avoided this boss, for which reason I did not know till you stated it. But you still avoided it, which I just wanted to point out to discredit the claim you made toward strife (never to call you a bad player).
But I’m happy to end it here!
(edited by Fury.6281)
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