About people selling dungeon runs.

About people selling dungeon runs.

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Posted by: Tyrantis.8640

Tyrantis.8640

I really think ANet needs to address this now if they ever plan on it. I think people that do this are scum and need to find better things to do with their time and not start flooding LFG for money.

ANet, I want to know your stance on this. In my opinion it ruins the community seeing “Selling Path for XXXX” and makes me feel like it does when I see some crappy gold selling email.

Will someone from ANet talk about this issue before it is an issue because I know it will become common soon enough if they don’t stop it now.

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Posted by: Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

Maybe bring it up again after New Years?

Most of Anet has Christmas vacation at the moment.

My posts are facts as I know them, or my own opinion, and do not represent any guild.

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Posted by: badwhitecat.5609

badwhitecat.5609

Im not to sure what Anet can do about it. I mean people dont HAVE to pay in game currency to these people if they dont want to.

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Posted by: Sins.4782

Sins.4782

This recent post in the Dungeon forum sums up ANet’s stance on selling dungeon paths perfectly.

Here’s a quick recap. Why would you still need word from Anet? The support team may just have confused Dungeon Sellers selling for in game gold with real money.

“Thanks for pointing out that we seemed to have had a bit of miscommunication about offering “runs” as a service in the game. I can tell you that runs are not disallowed if they do not in some other way form a breach of the User Agreement or Rules of Conduct. We consider such an offer a form of a “gentleman’s agreement” where two parties agree to a specific service for an agreed sum in in-game currency (or in-game items, as the parties decide).

Naturally, if the run itself involves the use of an exploit, that service is strictly and fully disallowed. (And of course we want to hear about any exploiters.) Runs for real-world money or goods are, likewise, strictly prohibited. And if the service ends in a disputed situation — for instance, someone offers a run and then leaves the party, or offers to pay and then declines to do so — then we may take action against a scammer, if an agent is able to confirm what took place. But because the service is a gentleman’s agreement, we do not get in the middle of repayments, re-dos of the run, etc.

Thank you for asking about this. I’ve written and circulated an internal e-mail so that all team members are clear about our policy on this.

Regards,

Gaile Gray
Support Liaison
ArenaNet"

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Please-fix-people-selling-dungeon-slots/page/5#post1162080
Hi everyone,

Just posting to inform you all that selling dungeon runs its NOT against the rules. People are free to do so. Please, exercise extreme caution to avoid getting scammed.

Thanks for your understanding

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Selling-dungeons-is-allowed/first#post3005032
Hello,

it is allowed, if you have a dungeon (you take as an example Arah) alone or in pairs legally – ie, without skips, exploits, bugs or other illegal means – through play, then sell in-game Lfg tool against gold to player ?

Thanks in advance for the answer.

answer
[11/10/2013 08:57]

Hello […]

Thank you’ve turned to the European support team.

There should be no problem, as long as it does not violate the User Agreement, or if you play through the dungeon without exploits or similar.

Should any questions or problems arise, please contact us any time you are available.

Sincerely yours

GM Andi
Guild Wars 2 customer care
http://de.support.guildwars2.com

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/account/Rightful-reporting

A guildwars tradition
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/currupts-running-services-outpost-missions-t10527035.html

TL;DR: Fine unless you use exploits, kick players to sell spots, or scam, or anything else that breaks the user agreement.

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Posted by: Tyrantis.8640

Tyrantis.8640

My issue is the advertising of it in game. That is where I think it’s BS. Kick players to sell spots?

So basically I can go into one of these Sell money spots, Tell them I don’t feel like paying and they can not kick me due to not wanting to pay?

I highly doubt thats enforceable.

Do I mind people selling spots (A gentlemans agreement) No.

It’s the friggen advertisements that will completely take over LFG that I have a huge issue with.

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Posted by: Darkobra.6439

Darkobra.6439

So basically I can go into one of these Sell money spots, Tell them I don’t feel like paying and they can not kick me due to not wanting to pay?

Nope. I’m not sure how you managed to interpret that part.

You’re also still free to advertise your own party. You’ll notice it won’t stay for long as they do get filled up fast at certain times. This does not influence your dungeon run in any way.

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Posted by: Tyrantis.8640

Tyrantis.8640

TL;DR: Fine unless you use exploits, kick players to sell spots, or scam, or anything else that breaks the user agreement.

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Posted by: Sins.4782

Sins.4782

Kick players to sell spots, as in players who completed the majority of the dungeon with the sellers.

The reason you see so many selling posts on LFG is because they don’t fill quickly. The groups with players who actually want to complete the dungeon do fill quickly, and then are gone until the next one pops up.

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Posted by: Darkobra.6439

Darkobra.6439

“…for instance, someone offers a run and then leaves the party, or offers to pay and then declines to do so — then we may take action against a scammer…”

Everything is clear as day in the full version.

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Posted by: Tyrantis.8640

Tyrantis.8640

Kick players to sell spots, as in players who completed the majority of the dungeon with the sellers.

The reason you see so many selling posts on LFG is because they don’t fill quickly. The groups with players who actually want to complete the dungeon do fill quickly, and then are gone until the next one pops up.

Yeah I agree. Maybe I just need to get over my hatred for “selling this or that” in MMOs.

It’s the way I have become over the years basically on Gold Selling and the like. I really hate the idea of folks helping other players for money. It’s scummy and whatever.

I feel like a “Gentleman’s Agreement” is way different than straight out advertisement. When I see a LFG selling paths it doesn’t seem like anything other than sales.

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Posted by: Sins.4782

Sins.4782

There’s a demand for the Arah tokens, so players are filling that demand. It keeps players who would rather not do Arah out of there, assuming they’re willing to pay for the convenience. So, in a way, more people running it are there because they want to run it, which you could probably argue ends in a better experience for all. Some dungeon selling in GW1 like the CoF runs were even monetarily beneficial to everyone— around 2 plat for a run, and over 2 plat in rewards from that run. If dungeon selling in GW2 overflows into other dungeons we may see situations like that here.

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Posted by: Orpheal.8263

Orpheal.8263

I absolutely share the opinion of the OP.
To me, that what these people do is clearly abusing the LFG Tools for something, for what the tool was in no way designed for.

The LFG tools function is to help people finding easier Groups for Dungeons, Personal Stories, Lifing Story Stuff ect.
It was never an intention of the Devs to give us players with the tool something, that is going to be so massively abused as a Selling Platform for people, that want to monetize everything out of this game for their own personal greedy selfs, that want just to make quickly as much gold in the game as possible.

Selling Dungeon Runs for quick high personal profits just completely ruins the social aspect of the whole game, that people should play together.
You see basically nothing else anymore in the tool, than those antisocial Dungon Run Sellers spamming the Tool full for those Dungeons that mean for them the most big profits, like Arah…

We’re talking here about something, that just started to exist from the moment on, when the LFG-Tool got implemented. Before the implementation, there was nothing like Dungeon Run Selling in this game.
You literally have never seen anyone kick other players out of groups, if they didn’t pay the party leader for the brain-afk instant dungeon success.

All of this crap just started with the implementation of this tool and all of the greedy people abusing it.
Theres even an option to report players for abusing the LFG-Tool.

I would love to hear from an Anet Dev, what exactly falls all here under the term of “LFG-Tool Abuse”, if not at all this!!
What really has a player to do more, than permanently abusing the LFG-Tool as a Selling Platform, to not deserve a temporal ban and if ithe player keeps abusing it that way quickly in a perma ban…

The OP is right, abusing the tool in this way is just like Gold Sellign Spam, just in a different way, that is internal of the game and not something external, that finds its way into the game only via Free to Play Test Accounts …

Personally I like the idea behind sub classes ~ quoted from Chris Whiteside

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Posted by: Healix.5819

Healix.5819

Selling dungeon spots by itself is considered okay. Also note that ArenaNet will not intervene in player made agreements.

Kicking players at the end of a dungeon is considered griefing. They used to recommend reporting it through support, but I don’t think they do that anymore. Reporting the person in-game is pointless since there’s no evidence and you can’t explain the situation. They probably flag the account after a certain amount of unique reports however.

Advertising a selling service in the LFG tool is not what the tool was intended for. They’ve said to report this (right click the listing), but have never further commented on it.

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Posted by: Aberrant.6749

Aberrant.6749

Selling dungeon spots by itself is considered okay. Also note that ArenaNet will not intervene in player made agreements.

Kicking players at the end of a dungeon is considered griefing. They used to recommend reporting it through support, but I don’t think they do that anymore. Reporting the person in-game is pointless since there’s no evidence and you can’t explain the situation. They probably flag the account after a certain amount of unique reports however.

Advertising a selling service in the LFG tool is not what the tool was intended for. They’ve said to report this (right click the listing), but have never further commented on it.

The quote from Gaile was in response to my ticket about the tweet telling people to report the LFG dung sellers (that’s the miscommunication).

Here is the ticket I submitted:

Is using the LFG tool to sell runs OK? [Incident: 131012-000305]

Hello,

I was wondering if it is ok to use the LFG system to sell dungeon runs. There is some confusion and contradictory information on this matter. There was a tweet that said it was against the rules and should be reported, while other players posted a response from a German support ticket that made this unclear. Can you please help clarify?

The tweet:
https://twitter.com/GuildWars2/status/380793184047366144

The post:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Selling-dungeons-is-allowed/first#post3005032

Thank you for your time

Response:

Thanks for pointing out that we seemed to have had a bit of miscommunication about offering “runs” as a service in the game. I can tell you that runs are not disallowed if they do not in some other way form a breach of the User Agreement or Rules of Conduct. We consider such an offer a form of a “gentleman’s agreement” where two parties agree to a specific service for an agreed sum in in-game currency (or in-game items, as the parties decide).

Naturally, if the run itself involves the use of an exploit, that service is strictly and fully disallowed. (And of course we want to hear about any exploiters.) Runs for real-world money or goods are, likewise, strictly prohibited. And if the service ends in a disputed situation — for instance, someone offers a run and then leaves the party, or offers to pay and then declines to do so — then we may take action against a scammer, if an agent is able to confirm what took place. But because the service is a gentleman’s agreement, we do not get in the middle of repayments, re-dos of the run, etc.

Thank you for asking about this. I’ve written and circulated an internal e-mail so that all team members are clear about our policy on this.

Regards,

Gaile Gray
Support Liaison
ArenaNet

So yea… it’s fine.

Tarnished Coast
Salvage 4 Profit + MF Guide – http://tinyurl.com/l8ff6pa

(edited by Aberrant.6749)

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Posted by: Turamarth.3248

Turamarth.3248

Selling Dungeon Runs for quick high personal profits just completely ruins the social aspect of the whole game, that people should play together.
You see basically nothing else anymore in the tool, than those antisocial Dungon Run Sellers spamming the Tool full for those Dungeons that mean for them the most big profits, like Arah…

We’re talking here about something, that just started to exist from the moment on, when the LFG-Tool got implemented. Before the implementation, there was nothing like Dungeon Run Selling in this game.

1. Helping me to get the armor I want without me having to spend hours in the dungeon . Yeah that’s antisocial.
2. If I remember correctly most posts on gw2lfg for arah were selling offers.

Brandar – Kodash [DE]
[SPQR]

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Posted by: Tyrantis.8640

Tyrantis.8640

Selling Dungeon Runs for quick high personal profits just completely ruins the social aspect of the whole game, that people should play together.
You see basically nothing else anymore in the tool, than those antisocial Dungon Run Sellers spamming the Tool full for those Dungeons that mean for them the most big profits, like Arah…

We’re talking here about something, that just started to exist from the moment on, when the LFG-Tool got implemented. Before the implementation, there was nothing like Dungeon Run Selling in this game.

1. Helping me to get the armor I want without me having to spend hours in the dungeon . Yeah that’s antisocial.
2. If I remember correctly most posts on gw2lfg for arah were selling offers.

Listen I am all for it right now, but there WILL be a day I go to use the LFG and all I will see is advertisements and I will be kitten ed. So will quite a few people. Soon normal folks will just stop using LFG.

2. Bringing up GW2LFG (Which I used as well) isn’t valid as it was outside of game.

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Posted by: Aberrant.6749

Aberrant.6749

Selling Dungeon Runs for quick high personal profits just completely ruins the social aspect of the whole game, that people should play together.
You see basically nothing else anymore in the tool, than those antisocial Dungon Run Sellers spamming the Tool full for those Dungeons that mean for them the most big profits, like Arah…

We’re talking here about something, that just started to exist from the moment on, when the LFG-Tool got implemented. Before the implementation, there was nothing like Dungeon Run Selling in this game.

1. Helping me to get the armor I want without me having to spend hours in the dungeon . Yeah that’s antisocial.
2. If I remember correctly most posts on gw2lfg for arah were selling offers.

Listen I am all for it right now, but there WILL be a day I go to use the LFG and all I will see is advertisements and I will be kitten ed. So will quite a few people. Soon normal folks will just stop using LFG.

2. Bringing up GW2LFG (Which I used as well) isn’t valid as it was outside of game.

Even if there is a day when that happens (which I doubt), nothing would stop you from making your own party. I don’t see the problem.

Tarnished Coast
Salvage 4 Profit + MF Guide – http://tinyurl.com/l8ff6pa

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Posted by: DivineSlayer.5039

DivineSlayer.5039

Anet doesn’t care if we use the lfg tool so get over it.

[DnT] Thief Main

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Posted by: Turamarth.3248

Turamarth.3248

Listen I am all for it right now, but there WILL be a day I go to use the LFG and all I will see is advertisements and I will be kitten ed. So will quite a few people. Soon normal folks will just stop using LFG.

2. Bringing up GW2LFG (Which I used as well) isn’t valid as it was outside of game.

Why not valid? It clearly contradicts Orpheals argument that where was no dungeon selling prior to the lfg tool.

Brandar – Kodash [DE]
[SPQR]

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Posted by: swiftpaw.6397

swiftpaw.6397

there WILL be a day I go to use the LFG and all I will see is advertisements and I will be kitten ed. So will quite a few people. Soon normal folks will just stop using LFG.

That is completely irrational.

Here is a handy tip, as I am a kind and just Swiftpaw.

Make your own party.

Grandmaster Forum Mind Brain
|-Swiftpaw Sharpclaw [DnT]-|

(edited by swiftpaw.6397)

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Posted by: Orpheal.8263

Orpheal.8263

Selling Dungeon Runs for quick high personal profits just completely ruins the social aspect of the whole game, that people should play together.
You see basically nothing else anymore in the tool, than those antisocial Dungon Run Sellers spamming the Tool full for those Dungeons that mean for them the most big profits, like Arah…

We’re talking here about something, that just started to exist from the moment on, when the LFG-Tool got implemented. Before the implementation, there was nothing like Dungeon Run Selling in this game.

1. Helping me to get the armor I want without me having to spend hours in the dungeon . Yeah that’s antisocial.
2. If I remember correctly most posts on gw2lfg for arah were selling offers.

No, whats antisocial, is that your behaviour of selling dungeon runs out of the clear simple reason of being just greedy and that greed is destroying the social aspect of playing the game in a normal manner together with other people AS A GROUP and not as a Solo Player or as a Duo to just invite other people join them for the last moment, when it is “cash in time” to make as much money out of other players, as possible and the really sad thing is…

It gives way more than enouch idiotic people, which support this to keep those greedy parasites alive. And why? Because if the game being just too grindy in regard of receiving the Dungeon Tokens to get the Armor Looks that you want.

Thats why so many people do make use desperately of this ridiculous “gentleman’s agreement” just to reduce for themself the grind, because of it being easier to just farm the ridiculous payment of 5G where 3G come from the Arah Path, so people have just to farm 2 simple dungeon runs to get the needed 2 G to pay a greedy person that makes for them the job of playing through the hard dungeons.

People will stop to play Arah together as group like it is intended to do so, because everybnody just wants to get the stupid tokens as quickly as possible to get the looks that they would.

Would be the dungeon armors alot easier to get, this ridiculpous antisocial Dungeon Run Selling would just as quickly DIE OUT as quickly that kitten has found its way into the game with the moment the LFG tool got implemented.

Thats the sad truth!!

Personally I like the idea behind sub classes ~ quoted from Chris Whiteside

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Posted by: maxinion.8396

maxinion.8396

Sellers don’t hurt ~you~ in any way. They provide a service, which you are free to ignore! It takes 1 ounce of mental effort to ignore the listing in lfg. You can do it guys, I have faith in you.

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Posted by: Dempsey.8760

Dempsey.8760

I absolutely share the opinion of the OP.
To me, that what these people do is clearly abusing the LFG Tools for something, for what the tool was in no way designed for.

The LFG tools function is to help people finding easier Groups for Dungeons, Personal Stories, Lifing Story Stuff ect.
It was never an intention of the Devs to give us players with the tool something, that is going to be so massively abused as a Selling Platform for people, that want to monetize everything out of this game for their own personal greedy selfs, that want just to make quickly as much gold in the game as possible.

Selling Dungeon Runs for quick high personal profits just completely ruins the social aspect of the whole game, that people should play together.
You see basically nothing else anymore in the tool, than those antisocial Dungon Run Sellers spamming the Tool full for those Dungeons that mean for them the most big profits, like Arah…

We’re talking here about something, that just started to exist from the moment on, when the LFG-Tool got implemented. Before the implementation, there was nothing like Dungeon Run Selling in this game.
You literally have never seen anyone kick other players out of groups, if they didn’t pay the party leader for the brain-afk instant dungeon success.

All of this crap just started with the implementation of this tool and all of the greedy people abusing it.
Theres even an option to report players for abusing the LFG-Tool.

I would love to hear from an Anet Dev, what exactly falls all here under the term of “LFG-Tool Abuse”, if not at all this!!
What really has a player to do more, than permanently abusing the LFG-Tool as a Selling Platform, to not deserve a temporal ban and if ithe player keeps abusing it that way quickly in a perma ban…

The OP is right, abusing the tool in this way is just like Gold Sellign Spam, just in a different way, that is internal of the game and not something external, that finds its way into the game only via Free to Play Test Accounts …

Dungeon selling was happening way before the in-game tool, now there is just an easier way to sell it because people don’t have to alt-tab to do so. Sell doesn’t effect you there are still plenty of people who cannot complete the dungeon themselves and don’t want to buy it so work through it with them.

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Posted by: Turamarth.3248

Turamarth.3248

No, whats antisocial, is that your behaviour of selling dungeon runs out of the clear simple reason of being just greedy and that greed is destroying the social aspect of playing the game in a normal manner together with other people AS A GROUP and not as a Solo Player or as a Duo to just invite other people join them for the last moment, when it is “cash in time” to make as much money out of other players, as possible and the really sad thing is…

Did I ever say that I was selling dungeon runs? I´m a buyer. Forcing other players to play how you think the game is meant to be played is antisocial.

Would be the dungeon armors alot easier to get, this ridiculpous antisocial Dungeon Run Selling would just as quickly DIE OUT as quickly that kitten has found its way into the game with the moment the LFG tool got implemented.

To quote myself

2. If I remember correctly most posts on gw2lfg for arah were selling offers.

Brandar – Kodash [DE]
[SPQR]

(edited by Turamarth.3248)

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

I sell Arah paths and do Arah pugs. There are plenty of pugs on the lfg, they just fill quickly.

Why is selling paths so bothersome when it doesn’t affect you at all? Do you hate people that play the trading post? That actually does affect you at least.

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Posted by: noobgood.8762

noobgood.8762

I made 180g today with selling Arah. Thanks to all the buyers, hope to see you tomorrow again!

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Posted by: Orpheal.8263

Orpheal.8263

It makes no sense to discuss this with people, that are blinded by their own greed.
It makes them unable to see in, that that what they do, is in fact ruining the game.

And postings like those from Noobgood disgust me. It clearly shows what a kind of person people are, that post stuff like this.
People that don’t care what happens with a game, as long they can make as much profit out of other players as possible and can abuse systems in a game so much they want, as long their are just standing in some kind of dev made “grey zone”.

The only real shocker to me far more than people making profit out of other players, because of the game being too grindy in the aspect of dungeon rewards is, that Anet seems to absolutely not care a slightest bit about this situation that ruins any social aspects of the dungeon gameplay.
Instead they call it simply a gentleman’s agreement and everything is love, peace and harmony directly?? Problem solved, right??

No, thats absolutely no solution that packs the issue on its root and eliminates it.
Its just only a fake solution to me.

The real solution of this problem can only exist, if as said the grind of dungeons get removed, so that people will have no “need” anymore to make use of people, that doo all the work for them so that they can get very quickly the needed tokens and greedy dungeon sellers profitate from such huge profits like said 180G a day just from constantly selling Arah Paths…

Dungeons and their rewards should motivate players to play together and not motivate to abuse internal as like external tools, just to maximise their personal greedy profits !!

If you play just a game to maximise profits, then I suggest those people to play Games like Monopoly, but not GW2 – a MMORPG, that should live from its social gameplay and promote it also.

Dungeon Run Selling absolutely promotes ZERO social gameplay.
Its just everythign based on 1 single personal question:

How do I make at any cost as quick as possible much money?

If Dungeons would promote social gameplay, we would see not Anet taking their heads into the sand like scaredy cats and changing the issues of the game into fake solutions, no, they would do somethign against this and rework the dungeon rewards so, that people really want to do the Dungeons together and that there simple won#t be ANY SINGLE DUNGEON PATH, that should be abler to solo/duo run.

If every dungeon path would require a full group of 5 players from begin to its end, then there simply wouldn’t be the problem of dungeon run sells also too and diungeons really would promote social gameplay again.

But complete dungeon redesigning takes time – alot of time and until Anet has the time to do it I guess, its naturally alot easier first to cover this issue of the game with this fake solution of calling the issue a “gentleman’s agreement” and provding that way players the needed grey zone to abuse as much as they want without havign to fear any reports for abusing the LFG Tool at all..

As long anet doesn’t change the dungeons and their rewrd system, the whole report option of abusing the LFG System will be a pure bad JOKE and nothing else.

That was my last posting in this thread.

Personally I like the idea behind sub classes ~ quoted from Chris Whiteside

(edited by Orpheal.8263)

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Posted by: Sins.4782

Sins.4782

I don’t sell dungeon paths. I’ve never even done Arah. But I don’t care at all whether people sell paths or not, or where they do it. Unless they start PM’ing me like those gold selling bots, but I seriously doubt that’ll ever happen. Their path selling does not affect me. At all. I don’t buy runs, I don’t sell runs. At most I’ll see 3-4 of them on the LFG in Arah section. I don’t mind. I’d rather see selling posts than no posts at all, because that means at least someone is doing the dungeon.

Adding more player-count gated mechanics in dungeons is not the answer. Some people like to challenge themselves by doing content with fewer than the recommended player count. Solo dungeon videos never cease to amaze me, and even though I know I don’t have the patience to do that sort of thing, I wouldn’t want to deprive those who do.

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Posted by: noobgood.8762

noobgood.8762

The reason why you see only dungeon sellers is not because they “ruined the game” and nobody wants to do normal runs any more. It’s because it takes much more time for their parties to get filled compared to the “normal” ones. You don’t realize it because you never observed it, unlike sellers who refresh their lfg every minute because of the competition.

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Posted by: NoTrigger.8396

NoTrigger.8396

I really think ANet needs to address this now if they ever plan on it. I think people that do this are scum and need to find better things to do with their time and not start flooding LFG for money.

ANet, I want to know your stance on this. In my opinion it ruins the community seeing “Selling Path for XXXX” and makes me feel like it does when I see some crappy gold selling email.

Will someone from ANet talk about this issue before it is an issue because I know it will become common soon enough if they don’t stop it now.

there would be less dungeon selling going on if arenanet fixed all exploits.
on EU, in 8/10 cases people skipped lupi.

[qT] Quantify

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Posted by: Tentonhammr.7849

Tentonhammr.7849

I really think ANet needs to address this now if they ever plan on it. I think people that do this are scum and need to find better things to do with their time and not start flooding LFG for money.

ANet, I want to know your stance on this. In my opinion it ruins the community seeing “Selling Path for XXXX” and makes me feel like it does when I see some crappy gold selling email.

Will someone from ANet talk about this issue before it is an issue because I know it will become common soon enough if they don’t stop it now.

there would be less dungeon selling going on if arenanet fixed all exploits.
on EU, in 8/10 cases people skipped lupi.

I do not understand why this is so kittening complicated for them. Insert a check so Brie and none of the other final bosses can be triggered if Lupi is still alive.

Zelendel

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Posted by: swiftpaw.6397

swiftpaw.6397

Everyone knows the real fix is just around the corner. Delete the whole thing and replace with living story, then no one will do it either way.

Grandmaster Forum Mind Brain
|-Swiftpaw Sharpclaw [DnT]-|

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Posted by: colesy.8490

colesy.8490

duo’d Arah p4 with durend and white knights kicked us.

I hate this game’s community so much.

Sanctum of Rall (NA) – [LOD] – PvE/Dungeon Phantasm Mesmer build
Morrï (Mesmer) | Serah Mahariel (Guardian) | Morrï Mahariel (Warrior)
“colesy’s on rampage today. Slaying casuals left, right and centre” – spoj

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Posted by: Minigrump.4961

Minigrump.4961

duo’d Arah p4 with durend and white knights kicked us.

I hate this game’s community so much.

I also hate this game’s community as well colesy
solo’d arah p2. posted to sell, some idiot merges party with me for an AC run, making me lose all my progress then getting irritated at me because I will not run AC with them.

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Posted by: robertul.3679

robertul.3679

I’ll just leave this here.

Attachments:

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

A lot of the US sell kicks come from one guy. He’s griefed dozens upon dozens of instances, and he’s still playing everyday. I find it unbelievable he hasn’t been banned yet.

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Posted by: rojak.1894

rojak.1894

in before thread merge.

Selling posts on lfg isnt spam, it’s a legit post looking for a group. It’s not like gold selling posts in mapchat which sell gold for Real $$$, and you get whisper spammed and have to block bots.

Joining and kicking sellers is griefing, that’s lfg tool abuse.

You will see more selling posts on LFG tool because it takes quite awhile to find buyers sometime and the other normal dungeon LFGs get filled up so quickly you dont see them.

Maybe a few yeears later, when lfg tool comes out of beta there will be filters for $$ posts and no party merging.

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Posted by: Wethospu.6437

Wethospu.6437

There is no integrity in the dungeon system so not sure why anyone would care about selling. Just makes me bit sad to know what we could have if the system was well designed.

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Posted by: TheKillerAngel.3596

TheKillerAngel.3596

It makes no sense to discuss this with people, that are blinded by their own greed.
It makes them unable to see in, that that what they do, is in fact ruining the game.

And postings like those from Noobgood disgust me. It clearly shows what a kind of person people are, that post stuff like this.
People that don’t care what happens with a game, as long they can make as much profit out of other players as possible and can abuse systems in a game so much they want, as long their are just standing in some kind of dev made “grey zone”.

The only real shocker to me far more than people making profit out of other players, because of the game being too grindy in the aspect of dungeon rewards is, that Anet seems to absolutely not care a slightest bit about this situation that ruins any social aspects of the dungeon gameplay.
Instead they call it simply a gentleman’s agreement and everything is love, peace and harmony directly?? Problem solved, right??

No, thats absolutely no solution that packs the issue on its root and eliminates it.
Its just only a fake solution to me.

The real solution of this problem can only exist, if as said the grind of dungeons get removed, so that people will have no “need” anymore to make use of people, that doo all the work for them so that they can get very quickly the needed tokens and greedy dungeon sellers profitate from such huge profits like said 180G a day just from constantly selling Arah Paths…

Dungeons and their rewards should motivate players to play together and not motivate to abuse internal as like external tools, just to maximise their personal greedy profits !!

If you play just a game to maximise profits, then I suggest those people to play Games like Monopoly, but not GW2 – a MMORPG, that should live from its social gameplay and promote it also.

Dungeon Run Selling absolutely promotes ZERO social gameplay.
Its just everythign based on 1 single personal question:

How do I make at any cost as quick as possible much money?

If Dungeons would promote social gameplay, we would see not Anet taking their heads into the sand like scaredy cats and changing the issues of the game into fake solutions, no, they would do somethign against this and rework the dungeon rewards so, that people really want to do the Dungeons together and that there simple won#t be ANY SINGLE DUNGEON PATH, that should be abler to solo/duo run.

If every dungeon path would require a full group of 5 players from begin to its end, then there simply wouldn’t be the problem of dungeon run sells also too and diungeons really would promote social gameplay again.

But complete dungeon redesigning takes time – alot of time and until Anet has the time to do it I guess, its naturally alot easier first to cover this issue of the game with this fake solution of calling the issue a “gentleman’s agreement” and provding that way players the needed grey zone to abuse as much as they want without havign to fear any reports for abusing the LFG Tool at all..

As long anet doesn’t change the dungeons and their rewrd system, the whole report option of abusing the LFG System will be a pure bad JOKE and nothing else.

That was my last posting in this thread.

You sound really kitten.

Think stacking and skipping trash is cheap?
Read: Playing to Win.
Guide: How to play a Mesmer in dungeons.

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Posted by: AndrewSX.3794

AndrewSX.3794

TL;DR: Fine unless you use exploits, kick players to sell spots, or scam, or anything else that breaks the user agreement.

This.

Also, joining groups and purposefully kick/disband them in order to delete their istances (cause you’re a white knight that must smite the dungeon sellers plague) should be banned aswell – just like kick for selling, which do is bannable and wrong.

Seafarer’s Rest EU – PvE/WvW – 8 × 80 chars.
Most used: Guard/Mes/War/Nec/Ele.
Yes, i use 5 chars at time. Because REASONS.

(edited by AndrewSX.3794)

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Posted by: Quickfoot Katana.8642

Quickfoot Katana.8642

@ Anet:

Fix the exploits, ban the exploiters (if possible to track them).

Result?
80% of arah sellers stop selling, sell prices go up, legit runners are happy and rewarded for their effort.

Is there really any other way to solve this?

Give me a dev menu and I will put a kittening invisible wall myself at that tunnel at stop the swimming exploit in 1 week time. Give me a dev menu and I will prevent reaching Brie if you didnt chose P2 or killed Alphard.

It’s not even hard fix it’s just that you don’t care and it’s just sad because it’s so easy to fix.

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Posted by: Quickfoot Katana.8642

Quickfoot Katana.8642

TL;DR: Fine unless you use exploits, kick players to sell spots, or scam, or anything else that breaks the user agreement.

This.

Also, joining groups and purposefully kick/disband them in order to delete their istances (cause you’re a white knight that must smite the dungeon sellers plague) should be banned aswell – just like kick for selling, which do is bannable and wrong.

I had people join my instance checked that I killed lupicus and then said: “congratz you are one of the legit, no kick, have fun”.

I honestly do not mind at all that we have these white knights, as long as they are only kicking exploiters, they are like an in-game moderator lol

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Posted by: Tyrantis.8640

Tyrantis.8640

I don’t understand why people would skip Lupi. He isn’t that hard unless you dont know what to expect. I PUGed him the other day and it was the first time I fought him. I watched Youtube videos of the run first and the party leader was so kind and helpful and patient with the group.

I like the conversations around this topic. I am not trying to screw over those that sell and help the community.

The point I was always trying to make is that there will be a day when all you will see are annoying sales ads within LFG. I feel like it abuses the purpose of it. Everytime I see a sales ad in LFG a baby Dolyak dies in my heart :P

It really doesn’t go any deeper than that.

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Posted by: Manijin.3428

Manijin.3428

Some people are going to want gear without running the dungeons. It’s odd, but it’s true. By paying someone to run it for you, at least you get someone running the content for the rewards. I can’t ever see myself doing it, but that’s because I’m playing GW2 to actually, ya know, play it. Sure, I could PROBABLY maximize my time by paying a dungeon runner for the tokens, but again, that’s not really my thing. For some people it is, and I don’t think that’s necessarily a bad thing.

I will say that it seems a little bit silly to get credit for not running the dungeon, though. A simple fix like needing to get credit for succeeding at the final encounter could change that, though.

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

The lfg seems like a logical place for selling to me. We’d all rather use gw2lfg to sell to be honest, but there’s no more traffic there. Anet has a officially said selling is fine. Someone who wants to buy a path need only open the lfg for the dungeon they wish to buy, seems a perfect fit. Now if they’d only fix the lfg.

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Posted by: Turin.1024

Turin.1024

TL;DR: Fine unless you use exploits, kick players to sell spots, or scam, or anything else that breaks the user agreement.

This.

Also, joining groups and purposefully kick/disband them in order to delete their istances (cause you’re a white knight that must smite the dungeon sellers plague) should be banned aswell – just like kick for selling, which do is bannable and wrong.

I had people join my instance checked that I killed lupicus and then said: “congratz you are one of the legit, no kick, have fun”.

I honestly do not mind at all that we have these white knights, as long as they are only kicking exploiters, they are like an in-game moderator lol

I got some of those as well, but its rare, most white knights just use the merge bug and don’t even check if you’re legit or not.

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Posted by: Tentonhammr.7849

Tentonhammr.7849

TL;DR: Fine unless you use exploits, kick players to sell spots, or scam, or anything else that breaks the user agreement.

This.

Also, joining groups and purposefully kick/disband them in order to delete their istances (cause you’re a white knight that must smite the dungeon sellers plague) should be banned aswell – just like kick for selling, which do is bannable and wrong.

I had people join my instance checked that I killed lupicus and then said: “congratz you are one of the legit, no kick, have fun”.

I honestly do not mind at all that we have these white knights, as long as they are only kicking exploiters, they are like an in-game moderator lol

I got some of those as well, but its rare, most white knights just use the merge bug and don’t even check if you’re legit or not.

Most white knights wouldn’t even know HOW to check and see if the sell is legit. Knowing the names of dungeon way points and all the progress prompts is only for dirty elistists.

Zelendel

(edited by Tentonhammr.7849)

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Posted by: notabot.3497

notabot.3497

I never understood why “greed” with only being concerned with receiving the rewards was bad in dungeons, but all the casuals are militant about “their” champ farm trains in Noobdale and Lazygorge Sound. Nobody ever fought champs until they made it (barely) rewarding. Nobody would be doing dungeons at all if it weren’t for the rewards, fun was had the first couple of months when they were still being done for the challenge of exploration and group fun. If you weren’t there you missed out on a completely different game experience that is like a soap bubble, short in life and quickly gone. Wanting to get the new game experience back is just not going to happen.

Anything worth doing more than once in a MMO gives a reward. Anything rewarding enough will be farmed. Anything rewarding enough but a pain to do will be sold (otherwise you would just do it yourself, its like people who don’t understand dungeon selling never took econ101). How about we make dungeons so rewarding you only have to do it once ever to get your full reward (account bound can’t sell whatever), to prevent people from “being greedy” about the rewards, meager as they are already (really, 5 gold is tiny, like a quarter dollar if you were to convert real money bought gems to gold), would anybody actually run them? No, the dungeons would be as deader than Timberline Falls or Snowden Drift’s map chat (actually would encourage selling as it would be impossible to get a non selling group after the initial wave, imagine if dungeons were like those living story instances where you only get rewarded once ever, dead after a week). How about if you made the content so hard that you couldn’t solo it? Yeah, there went any random scrub’s ability to complete any content since they would have to balance the difficulty on the handful of elite dungeon runners out there… The average casual player out there can’t even make it through SE 1 without being carried in my personal experience (seen entire team melt on the golems, team dps doesn’t go down even with only 1-2 players still up…) Make it so its just a body check event like CoF 1? Yeah, random Pugs can’t even do that reliably!

If you don’t like dungeon selling, don’t buy them. If you don’t like that you might possibly get kicked running arah, then play something else. Oh, you are wanting the rewards from that place without actually doing the work needed (like making in game friends who will run dungeons with you, social networking is after all by definition “work” and is required by most MMOs, GUILD Wars… hmm its like they want you to be in an organized group) and aren’t willing to pay, maybe you should move to a hug box game that gives no rewards but its a cool place to hang out with like minded friends built by Socialist Scandinavians. Like Habbo Hotel.

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Posted by: Ropechef.6192

Ropechef.6192

late Friday night here. thought about doing a run to finish off the day. pulled up LfG, went to arah because it amuses me.

for over 30 min, I watched. 2 (count them 2) sellers sit on their adds. they did eventually get filled. one was for path 2 the other path 4,

38 other parties. (yes I counted) poped and filled and ran in that 30 some odd min.

the only reason you see sellers is because it takes a long time to fill. Arah is run regularly. and often. you don’t see posts for it because they don’t last long.

If you are concerned about player greed, and all that jazz. try not using the trading post. ever, you have to farm ALL of your own stuff. you think there is a gear grind now?

The dungeon sellers that are perfectly capable of running a path solo or duo and sell of the work and make a little coin on the side. more power to them. ohh hey, I have an excess of mithril ore. I will just post it on the trading post… you see where were going?

Play your game, Have some fun with it, and enjoy yourself. that’s why we are here is it not?

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Posted by: Lukas.3950

Lukas.3950

it really seems anet doesnt care about exploits. i reported a ton of bugs, neither of them got fixed. and its not i didnt give them time, i reported them half a year ago and nothing happened. one might say, anet tolerates it, even if its an exploit, because its not a gamebreaking exploit like duping. although they said its against the users agreement.