Anet please give us an honest answer
At the end of the day – the financial reports will speak for themselves.
You can keep telling me I’m off base on my assessment of the state of the game, and the feelings of the playerbase, but you aren’t convincing me.
I see (and feel) massive dissatisfaction with the game – and I am willing to bet that this is reflected in declining cash shop sales.
Anet isn’t going to prove either one of us right with any information, so ultimately, this argument can only be settled when and if the game declines.
If it’s just you’re massive dissatisfaction, it’s not from the playerbase. You keep deluding yourself that you know what’s best for the game and that it’s bound for utter failure that you keep spouting it out.
Why do some players suffer from " I hate it, therefore it sucks, and it will fail." Why can’t people just accept " I hate it, therefore this game may not be right for me…but…it may be right for others, since no matter how logically I try to prove to them, that they hate it also…they keep saying they like it"?
The mind is its own place and in itself, can make a Heaven of Hell, a Hell of Heaven.
Mental delusion is all I can say…
i wished GW2 PvE mob fighting mechanics are just like in GW1 where they synergize i.e. they help each other, just like us players. that will make the fighting more interesting.
remember doing vanquishing in the area with 2/3 grawl udolytes in a group in GW1 with just 4 people ? yeah… that experience….
Cutie Phantasmer/Farinas [HAX] – CD Casual
Archeage = Farmville with PK
Archeage = Farmville with PK
(edited by azizul.8469)
At the end of the day – the financial reports will speak for themselves.
You can keep telling me I’m off base on my assessment of the state of the game, and the feelings of the playerbase, but you aren’t convincing me.
I see (and feel) massive dissatisfaction with the game – and I am willing to bet that this is reflected in declining cash shop sales.
Anet isn’t going to prove either one of us right with any information, so ultimately, this argument can only be settled when and if the game declines.
If it’s just you’re massive dissatisfaction, it’s not from the playerbase. You keep deluding yourself that you know what’s best for the game and that it’s bound for utter failure that you keep spouting it out.
Why do some players suffer from " I hate it, therefore it sucks, and it will fail." Why can’t people just accept " I hate it, therefore this game may not be right for me…but…it may be right for others, since no matter how logically I try to prove to them, that they hate it also…they keep saying they like it"?
See that’s the thing. I’m not saying no one has a point. I’m saying the way they express the point is more detrimental to getting the game changed, than anything else they could say.
If there’s a problem with the game, and it’s not addressed politely, it’s just a waste of everyone’s time. Prophecies of doom, threats…totally worthless. All they do is detract from the argument.
This game has some flaws, there’s no question about it. It also has some good points. Pointing out the flaws while ignoring the good points isn’t honest and invites conflict. It’s the same by just saying the good points.
Posts that list both are far better than posts that are simply meant to antagonize.
Some interesting points in this thread. Some interesting positions as well.
1) Those who are unhappy might want to restrict themselves to speaking for themselves and those they personally know. Unless you can back up claims of, “most, majority,” etc with verifiable facts you look like you are inventing facts to support your position. If you need, apparently, to invent facts to support your position it gives the impression that the position must be very weak. The arguments you are choosing to use are actually working against your point.
2) Anet has spoken of an interest and desire to potentially add an expansion at some point:
“Expansions are definitely something that we’ll potentially look at in the future,”…“We don’t have a timetable on it….” -Colin Johanson
Sure using, “definitely,” and, “potentially,” together like that is an odd choice, but are pretty much the opposite of, “not gonna do it.”
3) The gem store is not, “extra money,” or, “gravy.” It is an integral part of the monetization of the game. Box sales are only part of the picture. Consider some hypothetical/approximate numbers:
1) 300 employees.
2) Average game designer salary in Washington state is around 70k per year (of course not all employees are designers but salary rates for some other positions are higher while some positions pay less.
3) Salary is only a portion of the cost to employ someone. Benefits, payroll taxes, etc add up. On average the real cost is between 1.20 and 1.4 times the employees base salary (I will be using 1.3 as a median for this).
Combining #’s 1-3 you end up with a cost of 70k * 300 * 1.3 = 27.3 million dollars per year. The basic version of GW2 costs between 25 and 50 dollars (I will use 37.50 as a meadian price for this calculation) and so the game would need to gain 728k players every year just to cover payroll costs. There is no way that Anet (or especially NCsoft) would have launched a game where they needed to gain nearly three quarters of a million players per year post launch just to cover payroll costs. No way.
Of course then there is the fact that some portion of those box sales will occur in brick and mortar retail locations meaning that Anet does not get all of the money from the sale. Then there are the costs of the servers, equipment, electricity, property lease (or taxes), and so on.
The gem store is an inherent and important aspect of the game’s profitability.
4) GW2 may have launched with double the number of missions of GW1 (including expansions) but it also took longer to develop and required significantly more resources. It still is, post launch, adding content and features at a slower rate. Larger company, more people, less being released. I do think that there is something big going on behind the curtain however and look forward to seeing what it might be…when/if we ever get to see it.
(edited by Ashen.2907)
A few things I got from the OP.
2nd, he doesn’t understand that rewards from dungeons/events can be inflationary unless sinks are also part of the equation.
3rd, prices on the TP are based on supply and demand. Yes ANet can control the sources of supply and can influence demand by making an item that needs X material to craft but that’s it.
Basically his primary complaint is his inability to make lots of gold quickly due to all the restrictions put in place to keep the injection of new gold and items under control.
no my primary complaint isn’t my inability to make lots of gold (thoug a massive wealth would be nice but nvm) my complaint is that by now It’s extremely hard to raise money and the problem is that we have both sinks AND diminishing returns and both of them is excessively severe. I perfectly understand the necessity of gold sinks in the game otherwise the risk is to have too much gold circulating BUT I think it’s not a fair politic to keep nerfing drop. It’s true that prices on tp is given by the supply but items have to be dropped prior to put them on sale and with almost every update the drop rate of nice things like T6 mats/rares/exos diminishes and as it’s clear looking at the trading post the equation “money loss due sinks + missing income given by not-dropping items = price rising on the TP” it’s perfectly verified
Some interesting points in this thread. Some interesting positions as well.
4) GW2 may have launched with double the number of missions of GW1 (including expansions) but it also took longer to develop and required significantly more resources. It still is, post launch, adding content and features at a slower rate. Larger company, more people, less being released. I do think that there is something big going on behind the curtain however and look forward to seeing what it might be…when/if we ever get to see it.
I hope there’s something big going on behind the courtain too but if they keep pressing us players with nerfs and the lack of some very desired content they risk to lose players and so the income to develop other things; let’s assume there’s something big coming, what would happen if they keep their mouths shut and doing so they lose veteran players due the general feeling of “I’m sick of them not delivering what they promised so I’ll leave and not coming back” (yeah i don’t have numbers but it’s a fact that many old players have left the game due missing of new contents you just have to ask around in mapchat to be aware of this)? The answer is, they develop something brilliant, they release it but the players are gone so they won’t have income from the gemstore to develop anything new -> game stagnation -> more players go away -> game closed.
A good medicine (other than releasing stuff) would be a more significant communication with us players than a general “we’re working on it”
(edited by TheCheater.5190)
I know a guy that bought 50 precursors in the begining, and is good exploiting the trading post (buy low, sell high) and now has over 90.000 gold
Are you Shpongled?
Unnecessarily personal, perhaps, but your posts are some of the most obnoxious on the forums, and they exemplify the absurd “white knight” syndrome going around. It’s predictable and pointless. Someone chimes in to voice a concern or request new content and cue obnoxious WK to butt in and accuse everyone of “not understanding”, being “entitled”, and senselessly defend ANet’s “right” to do what it wants. The last is especially bizarre because forum requests/complaints aren’t legal challenges to ANet’s right to do anything – they’re requests, feedback, attempts to dialogue and engage ANet and to hopefully change the game for the better.
If we really want to talk about a sense of entitlement let’s talk about the WKs self-appointed authority to tell everyone to “love it or leave it”, and call frustrated players who voice concerns “toxic” and “negative”.
I´m almost daily looking over the forums, probably spending more time here reading than still playing the game. While I would say “White Knights” were not even a thing here half a year ago, in the meantime I know those 4 – 5 names almost by heart . . .
no my primary complaint isn’t my inability to make lots of gold (thoug a massive wealth would be nice but nvm) my complaint is that by now It’s extremely hard to raise money and the problem is that we have both sinks AND diminishing returns and both of them is excessively severe. I perfectly understand the necessity of gold sinks in the game otherwise the risk is to have too much gold circulating BUT I think it’s not a fair politic to keep nerfing drop. It’s true that prices on tp is given by the supply but items have to be dropped prior to put them on sale and with almost every update the drop rate of nice things like T6 mats/rares/exos diminishes and as it’s clear looking at the trading post the equation “money loss due sinks + missing income given by not-dropping items = price rising on the TP” it’s perfectly verified
You can make money, but it doesn’t seem for you to be fast enough.
Any reward being dropped is “new” to the game’s economy. To keep inflation from going nuts, the various sinks need to compensate a fair amount of that “new” income flowing into the game. That’s why they can’t open the reward tap. That’s one reason they but the kibosh on any player activity that is bringing in to much “new” income compared to their targets.
As for highly desirable but rare items, their prices are more associated to the wealth gap in the game. Only the players who both desire and are one of the wealthier can afford it. That’s low supply meeting demand. If instead of a TP we had an auction the prices will still be high with only the most wealthy among us being able to afford it.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
So for you fiery greatsword shouldn’t be modified? Because in pve i want to play a game called Guild Wars 2 and not a game called Guild Walls 2.
First of all Fiery greatsword was not nerfed actually fiery greatsword will be way more powerfull in pvp unless you fight in the wall in pvp lol then yeah its a nerf… that modification was needed for pve because it was overpower in dungeons it was just stupid… it takes 0 skill to kill the kitten and the boss’s.
Fiery Greatsword being nerfed into uselessness in PvE won’t change one single thing about stacking. Bosses will take slightly longer to die. They won’t be more challenging, they’ll just take a bit longer to die. That’s it. Nothing is being done to address the symptoms of why FGS #4 was so good: namely, that stacking is simply the best way to do most of the dungeon content on offer.
It astonishes me that people are actually acting as if this change is going to make dungeons challenging. Nothing about this change makes them the slightest bit more challenging.
They couldn’t have released Guild Wars 1 without NCsoft. What’s your point. This game is already more successful than Guild Wars 1 was…the only question is how long that success will last.
And you know, Guild Wars 1 came out at a time with far less competition. It was the only free to play multiplayer fantasy game out there. There weren’t 50 free MMOs to choose from at the same time…and Guild Wars 2 is still making more money than Guild Wars 1 did.
So I’m not sure what your point is.
My point is that many people, myself included, trusted ArenaNet because they had established themselves in the market as being something different. GW1 was a CORPG that focused on interplayer cooperation and instanced content, and despite being a virtually unknown company before GW1 was released, they still managed to grab a nice market share and compete with WoW, especially with their innovative B2P model.
They established a wonderful, trusting relationship with a lot of consumers, and they made a name for themselves.
Thus, when GW2 came around the company had a strong foundation and a wider audience to whom they could advertise their game.
It’s a lot easier to profit when you aren’t starting from scratch.
Look, GW2 was different than the original, and that’s fine. It still was an incredible game at launch and in many ways improved from the original. For many people (note, I’m not speaking for everyone, I’m not speaking for you) the past two years saw larger and larger deviations not only from the original game, but from the GW2 manifesto as well.
With no expansion in sight, a focus on living story and simple QOL changes, the game feels like it’s moving at too slow a pace and is disappointing for many people (note, I’m not speaking for everyone, I’m not speaking for you.)
And you’re making a fair point.
This game was always going to have problems because Guild Wars 1 was a cult classic. It has a relatively small very die hard community, particularly the PvP community. Arguably, the PvP community would be the most disenfranchised with this game.
But Anet also saw in Guild Wars 1 a huge shift from PvP to PvE. Their PvE population eventually outnumbered the PvP population and so in the later years that’s where Anet put their effort.
I wasn’t a PvPer in Guild Wars 1. I do some PvP and WvW here, but mostly I’m a PvE’er. Not a dungeon runner. Someone who likes PvE in the open world. There are a bunch of us. No game has done it better as far as I’m concerned.
The fact that a relatively hard core group of players find a game that’s quite different to be unacceptable doesn’t surprise me at all. However, I still think Guild Wars 2 will ultimately be more successful, not less successful, even if some Guild Wars 1 players feel disenfranchised…I understand why they do, and I don’t blame them for feeling that way.
I fixed it for ya. The problem with being a ‘cult’ classic is the rabid attitude of fans. Remember when Star Wars Episode 1 came out and the reaction of Die Hard fans to that movie? Well it is the same with GW2 versus GW1.
I was a GW1 player and I prefer the open world that GW2 offers. It doesn’t seem static and non-changing. I like the fact that there are no henchmen, no heroes, etc. That just took away the group play and made it a single player game. I treat the game as two distinct games – not the same game with a 2 after it.
no my primary complaint isn’t my inability to make lots of gold (thoug a massive wealth would be nice but nvm) my complaint is that by now It’s extremely hard to raise money and the problem is that we have both sinks AND diminishing returns and both of them is excessively severe. I perfectly understand the necessity of gold sinks in the game otherwise the risk is to have too much gold circulating BUT I think it’s not a fair politic to keep nerfing drop. It’s true that prices on tp is given by the supply but items have to be dropped prior to put them on sale and with almost every update the drop rate of nice things like T6 mats/rares/exos diminishes and as it’s clear looking at the trading post the equation “money loss due sinks + missing income given by not-dropping items = price rising on the TP” it’s perfectly verified
You can make money, but it doesn’t seem for you to be fast enough.
Any reward being dropped is “new” to the game’s economy. To keep inflation from going nuts, the various sinks need to compensate a fair amount of that “new” income flowing into the game. That’s why they can’t open the reward tap. That’s one reason they but the kibosh on any player activity that is bringing in to much “new” income compared to their targets.
As for highly desirable but rare items, their prices are more associated to the wealth gap in the game. Only the players who both desire and are one of the wealthier can afford it. That’s low supply meeting demand. If instead of a TP we had an auction the prices will still be high with only the most wealthy among us being able to afford it.
That’s precisely the point, the sinks remove far over a “fair amount” of items. In fact while the sinks impact on the game almost remains untoched the occurrency of drops keeps decreasing, this generate a vicious circle that makes the prices costantly going up because the less high end materials drops the more prices will go up due costant (and growing) demand. That’s the basis of the economy, the only way to reduce prices is to increment the supply.
When I say rewards, I’m talking coin or items that players sell for coin to vendors since that’s also a source of income. I’m not talking about mats. Excess items are removed via selling to vendors, salvage or tossing them into the Mystic Slot Machine. And I guess by simple deletion.
So I don’t know what sinks remove “over a fair amount” of items or what items you are referring to.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
Things that have been said way too many times:
1. “ANet can’t win no matter what they do” / “make up your minds”
Yeah this is called “people disagreeing with each other” and it happens literally all the time at any place where there are 2 or more people. This is not a reason for them to be quiet about potential upcoming features. Trying to avoid backlash is not only futile, but harmful, especially when you’re prone to miscalculation (see commander tags, instance ownership).
2. “The players are unhappy”
On the forum, which probably doesn’t even account for 1% of the player-base. While this is the main avenue for player communication with ANet staff, it is hardly a perfect representation of what the majority of players want.
3. “It’s not fair for someone to spend 2000g in the MF and get nothing when someone else spends 400g and gets Dusk”
If the forge had a sign posted “2000g for a precursor” then yes, this would be unfair. But look, it’s RNG, and it works as intended. You may not like it, but everybody rolls the same dice, and that’s fair.
“You’ll PAY to know what you really think.” ~ J. R. “Bob” Dobbs
(edited by Andred.1087)
i also would like to see more pve content in the game. looking back on the guild wars 2 web site they say the game is different every time you play, but actually its not. i quit playing for a year, came back, and still the same boring stuff. i really dont care to play wvw, pvp, or fractals so im left standing in the cold. i am unable to do those things do to a disability. pve is hard for me. first of all i love the community, i love the game, i just want more. i wish we could do everything with just one toon. all crafting, gathering, and fighting classes just like ff. that way we could make special gear for each ability we use. i also would like to be able to fly or have a mount so i could get around a little faster when mapping. i would also like to be able to some times just do something simple like go fishing, i miss being able to set my own skills, share my hall of monuments with friends, the different dances by class not race, guild halls, capes, and my henchies and heros. i also miss my derv, paragon, rit, assisin. hell i miss my monk. i played ff for awhile during beta and payed for a time, missed gw community, i liked alot of there features like being able to see others armor so i could find it for myself. i wish we could have the under word fow and other places to venture in. as a pve player i feel left out. i am bored out of my mind.it bothers me so much that a game i loved so much left pve out in the cold.
When I say rewards, I’m talking coin or items that players sell for coin to vendors since that’s also a source of income. I’m not talking about mats. Excess items are removed via selling to vendors, salvage or tossing them into the Mystic Slot Machine. And I guess by simple deletion.
So I don’t know what sinks remove “over a fair amount” of items or what items you are referring to.
I’m referring to the main sink of the game, the Mystic Forge, in fact due to the huge amount of players that’s working on legendaries there’s a huge request for lvl 80 weapons but due to the lack of T6 mats (T5 are more common but we need more of them) there’s a very few people crafting weapons so we have a small supply that generates high prices at every single tier of materials because the promotion mechanic makes lower tier materials go up aswell
…there’s a huge request for lvl 80 weapons but due to the lack of T6 mats (T5 are more common but we need more of them) there’s a very few people crafting weapons so we have a small supply that generates high prices at every single tier of materials because the promotion mechanic makes lower tier materials go up aswell
HEH, if I knew people were interested in my Level 80 exotics? I’d stop chucking them into the Forge or salvaging for Dark Matter. Because when I go to sell them, I still am not getting as much for them as you imply . . . could be because it’s Huntsman I’m working.
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