Guild Wars 2

While I appreciate this idea of “collaboration” between the team and the community, I won’t believe it until I see it… And the track record is not proving positive.

Well this is random

clint.5681:

Well this is random

I kept waiting for him to say something, then he didn’t. Consider our collective wrists slapped?

I think this is more about how needlessly angry some people get over the “direction” GW 2 is taking than simple opinions about it. I know it can be easy to be swept up in the drama of the forums, but there’s no point being so mad over a video game. I never take offense to an opposing opinion on the game, only when someone’s really snotty about it. (Doesn’t mean everyone should gift wrap criticism either, there’s a good middle-ground).

I don’t think the OP will do much though. If anything, it’ll just give some posters fuel.

I agree with wookie. Just relax and be respectful. That’s what i read in Chris’s post and i agree wholeheartedly.

While the comments are appreciated, many players in this game play it for the PvP (both PvP and WvW) and you’ve let that community down. I know it’s silly having a player complain about content being released too often, but that’s kind of what’s happening here. Each thing you release is available for a short period of time, so players want to experience it all right away. To do this they alienate the other areas of the game because there’s nothing that involves them.

On top of this we’re going on 3 months now with absolutely no class changes whatsoever. Yes yes, I know, next week. But you have a thread with nearly 2k posts in it and only a single response from ANet with any meaningful content. This patch has got to be finalized at this point and there’s no reason for so little information to have reached the players. Especially after 3 months of waiting.

You come and tell us a teaser video is available Friday, but we’ve been ‘teased’ by you guys a lot over the last few months and they’re often underwhelming. It’s funny, but the only thing I really look forward to were the monthly SotG podcasts which have dried up.

I have no idea how many players play PvE exclusively vs WvW exclusively etc. I’d like to think that any overlap between the playerbase favors WvW though, but I couldn’t tell you. All I know is the PvP (PvP + WvW) community has been let down big time for 3 months now. No information has come out. Bloodlust is a bust. No class or balance changes in months. etc.

This is all strictly my opinion, obviously. And sorry for venting etc.

Its hardly random. There’s so much anger in this forum you could show it to religious zealots (any of them, lets not be discriminatory) and they’d step back and go “whoa guys, chill a little.”.

And some of it is warranted, most of it less so, and it kindof feeds itself until everyone loses their reason and focuses on the negatives.

And honestly, I don’t think the rage level is indicative of the actual player base, but like all things, that’s heavily tinted by my opinion.

And I honestly would have expected this sooner. And much more rudely. Some of the posts are really inflammatory and I’m certain its hard not to just whip out the ban hammer in a rage, or at least respond angrily. I’d have been tempted myself, especially if they work as hard, and for as many hours, as I think they do on this game.

Actually I think ANET for the most part does listen when it comes to PvE. The problem is that the PvP team is stubborn and won’t increase game modes (hello team deathmatch) and the WvW team is completely out of touch. The WvW team in particular is a problem.

Chris, I appreciate the post. However, I would appreciate it even more if you guys could do something like a State of the Game. And what we should expect moving forward. A lot of players don’t know where GW2 is going and they don’t know what to expect. It seems like a game without direction at the moment, and to me that is the key issue. There seems to be some sort of indecisiveness within GW2 (real or perceived).

You don’t have to do something like that, but players would like to see something like that. People are not being negative for no reason (most of the time). There are some underlying issues why it seems like people are upset. And yes I agree, being a troll or angry is not the best way to go about it.

I am afraid without tackling the root issue, nothing will change.

Considering Anet has 4 living world teams and a multitude of feature teams, it would make sense that they would have little time to answer every single thing. This post seems to be aimed at people who troll and prefer to start argument posts every single time an update is released.

what am i…
…what is this…

wut do

I feel like… they miiiight be listening, but then somehow Professor X very carefully avoids adding that Catalyst beaker we place adjacent to their experiment, and instead they very predictably add the same beaker of sparkle quaggan gunk instead only to have 3 MojoJoJo’s pop out of the mixture

That’s their entire development process…. they listen to everything, and then only “take” the advice they were going to DO ANYWAY. …instead of taking the suggestions that truly are innovative, risky, or atleast similar to GW1’s solutions for similar problems.

Lord Rheios.4152:

Its hardly random. There’s so much anger in this forum you could show it to religious zealots (any of them, lets not be discriminatory) and they’d step back and go “whoa guys, chill a little.”.

And some of it is warranted, most of it less so, and it kindof feeds itself until everyone loses their reason and focuses on the negatives.

And honestly, I don’t think the rage level is indicative of the actual player base, but like all things, that’s heavily tinted by my opinion.

And I honestly would have expected this sooner. And much more rudely. Some of the posts are really inflammatory and I’m certain its hard not to just whip out the ban hammer in a rage, or at least respond angrily. I’d have been tempted myself, especially if they work as hard, and for as many hours, as I think they do on this game.

Yeah, you’re right about the anger, there is a lot of anger. I’m one of the calmer people on here and I just lost 400g by accident.

The post started to give me a headache but I think he either said to stop being a jerk on the forums or if you don’t like the game to just leave

anyone care to clarify?

I think the post was incredibly correct in saying that we have been behaving badly.

I am part of the “Community” please don’t lump me in with those that are supposedly tired of some imaginary bait and switch.

I suggest you read the post again. I do not see where he has stated anything like “accept it or move on”.

Thank you Chris. I liked your post.

Thanks for this post Chris – though I think you have to be “black and white” and your choices you’ve made in game.

So far, what i’ve seen is:
- Ascended gear was added not because we asked for it (in fact, you guys stated you didn’t want to be like other games and add another tier of gear), instead it was because you found that people were gaining their legendaries too fast for you too curb. You underestimated player’s potential then fumbled and released something which Anet had openly said, they’d wished they’d released it in a better fashion.

- Living story – was this really added for benifit to players or to keep server numbers up?
Colin had mentioned, the reason you’re doing this crazy 2 week cycle is because you saw player numbers drop off after about 2 weeks….not necessarily because of player feedback, not because people wanted more storytelling (because after the personal story being less about the player and more about Trahearne, it was baffling you decided to go the story route)

Up till now as well, it seems that metrics seem to trump player feedback, but that’s a pretty long argument. All I can say is…I’ve barely seen anyone say that they wanted a DR implementation.

inb4 “Excalibur”.
And yup (imo) all this can be summed up in “jump on the train or leave”.
They should create a satisfaction questionnaire at the end of each living story and/or asking players what do they think about some of the decisions taken, like it was done during the beta, but no, devs know what is good because numbers are showing it.

So, would it be possible to make an extra tumbs up (a star?) for the Arenanet team? To let us know what kind of feedback has been read and appreciated?

I know that responding to all the threads that come up on these forums everyday is too much to ask, but a star or other sign of approval could really make a big difference. Not only could it inspire people to write better feedback, it also gives us an incentive to write more of the good stuff if we know that our previous posts have been appreciated.

Nice post and all, we know you love us (and our seldom valuable feedback), you tend to say it in all of your posts (too much ‘thank you’ doesn’t feel natural to me also). In all honesty, I like your ‘living world’ approach, but, one of the most impotant aspects of a game is not its amount of content, it’s the ease of play while looking good; your game promotes cooperative play (mostly zerg play). The problem lies on the game been built on an archaic directx 9 engine, is poorly optimized and just doesn’t perform well on average systems while mntaining good visuals, it’s basically way below industry standards, the promoted zerg paly (as I call it) makes this even worse. We all know optimization is an ongoing process, but it’s an issue often overlooked in these kinds of posts.
Any words on this regard Mr. Whiteside?

Most of us know how to be respectful and provide somewhat valuable feedback, many of us .are very experienced forumites, this post seems like a reaction to a forum outrage (almost like. damage control), so most of these ‘teachings’ could be applied to yourselves as well, Jonathan Sharp’s post on the sPvP forum no further.

The Lost Witch.7601:

So, would it be possible to make an extra tumbs up (a star?) for the Arenanet team? To let us know what kind of feedback has been read and appreciated?

I know that responding to all the threads that come up on these forums everyday is too much to ask, but a star or other sign of approval could really make a big difference. Not only could it inspire people to write better feedback, it also gives us an incentive to write more of the good stuff if we know that our previous posts have been appreciated.

There is, occasionally, a red line under the ‘thumbs up’ symbol. It would not surprise me if that’s a notification that an ArenaNet employee hit the +1. If not, it should be.

Chris Whiteside.6102:

constructive feedback

Accurate communication is possible only in a non-punishing situation.

Totally appreciate Chris taking the time to post. Thanks man. I agree, there are a lot of people on these forums that need to tone it down. There are always ways to express yourself and get your point across without anger and hurtful words. In fact, if you can communicate your frustrations void of anything inflammatory, you are more than likely to be heard and responded to with action. If forum goers stop posting in anger and with curt words, things will be better between community and ArenaNet.

Now for the ArenaNet team. There are some big things that were supposed to happen this year with precursors that look like they may get moved to next year. My suggestion is to do everything on your end in your power to make sure that those things get implemented this year. People shouldn’t lose their minds when things don’t happen. If something is stated in a “State of the Game” address though as being out this year, then it should come out this year.

I also think we should be told whether or not Ascended stuff is the ceiling for this game. I think that the Living Story needs to be more focused as well as far as the story telling part goes. We are getting an expansion’s worth of game content over the course of the year, it is true. The story though has not been as good as if it had been told in a single expansion type release.

I for one am willing to go on the adventure. It’s exciting getting a release every two weeks and having my favorite game do so many things that have not been tried before. I just hope that we don’t go down that rote road of new tiers of gear every year locked behind time gated mechanics. Keep it the Guild Wars way and keep it to cosmetics being what is chased. Shore up the story you are telling and give others incentive to dive into pvp by adding skins that can only be obtained in pvp but can be used in pve.

Thanks for the amazing game. I am looking forward to 2014.

Ok let’s collaborate – Cantha please.

Let’s expand on the already established old GW lore.

Lord Rheios.4152:

And I honestly would have expected this sooner. And much more rudely. Some of the posts are really inflammatory and I’m certain its hard not to just whip out the ban hammer in a rage, or at least respond angrily. I’d have been tempted myself, especially if they work as hard, and for as many hours, as I think they do on this game.

Now you know why most dev responses are light-hearted comments and fluff, and the “I demand an answer or I’ll stop buying gems” threads are ignored. There is no point (and it’s unprofessional besides) to fanning the flames.

I wouldn’t exactly call the current crop of content we’ve been getting from the living world “ground breaking.” But whatever. As long as the development team starts making an effort to fix some of the hundreds of bugs and balance issues with this game, and swiftly gets over the “your professions is only 10%, so you’re not worth paying attention to” development philosophy I’ll be happy.

Sungak Alkandenes.1369:

The Lost Witch.7601:

So, would it be possible to make an extra tumbs up (a star?) for the Arenanet team? To let us know what kind of feedback has been read and appreciated?

I know that responding to all the threads that come up on these forums everyday is too much to ask, but a star or other sign of approval could really make a big difference. Not only could it inspire people to write better feedback, it also gives us an incentive to write more of the good stuff if we know that our previous posts have been appreciated.

There is, occasionally, a red line under the ‘thumbs up’ symbol. It would not surprise me if that’s a notification that an ArenaNet employee hit the +1. If not, it should be.

They could just be plain, fair and simple and make an official “get satisfaction” page..where they can look at legitimate suggestions and let us know which ones will work or not. If they really read them…it’d take them all of 1 second to say “Yup, that could possibly work”..or ..“Not a chance in hell!”

I think there’s even a button on the site to let you do that.

@Chris Whiteside

As an active player and forum reader/contributor since Beta, I have definitely noticed the many improvements to the game that originated from the community and ended up being implemented. I respect Anet for seriously taking player suggestions and shaping their game in the direction that the community wants to see it go.

However, I think the turn-around time from when suggestions are made to when they are released (if they are released) is something that needs serious improvement. A couple examples that come to mind are Edit Guild Message of the Day and Targeting without a party. Both are great quality of life improvements and I’m very glad that they are now part of the game, but I’m disappointed that it took over a year for them to be implemented even though they were constantly being suggested since day 1.

There are still many similar things for which the community has asked over and over, but have not even received an official response. Two which are in my opinion most important and most frequently suggested are Guild Features and TP Search Options. I feel that after one year, Anet has no excuse for not at the very least addressing these issues. Is that something we can ask for right now?

As for continual improvements, I think a good way to get a feel for what the community really wants is to monitor Reddit, as quality of life game improvement suggestions usually surface to the front page every couple days. Seeing a greater percentage of them come to life would really solidify this Dev-Community bond that you are describing.

We need the option to down-vote statements that do not add to the discussion beside just the +1.

On second thought (hate to say it) there will be those that abuse it.

I personally very much appreciate this post.

If it seems like we complain a lot it’s certainly not because it’s a bad game, but simply because we love it and would like to see it live up to it’s full potential.

Best,

Apart from the PR stuff, I guess what he wanted to say that a lot of people here on the forum voice their opinion in a very impolite way (to say the least). In addition to that, i think he wanted to say that a lot of things are read and reviewed but not being implemented, either because of a lack of time or because they don’t want to have it that way, despite some players wanting it.

In response to the devs i would take the flame as a compliment. People only get this upset because they care for the direction of the game as much as you do. A lot of players i know (me included) have four digit numbers of playing hours. I would not play this game this much if I did not like it. Remember the uproar about the Mass Effect 3 ending? That even forced the developers to develop an 1,6GB extended ending DLC? People would have never gotten this worked up about a bad ending if the game had not been so outstanding beforehand.

That being said, its just understandable that people get worked up in GW2 as well about the current class balance for example. Its just a big letdown to know that the char you spend hundred (thousands) of hours playing is just becoming more and more obsolete and unfun to play because the game makers just decide to nerf it or completely neglect to bring it up to other classes.

There is a lot of work to do, and we just hope you make the right decisions. The complete absence of certain classes from the last MLG tournament should give you a good point to start regarding class balance.

Mordule Standish.2371:

I think the post was incredibly correct in saying that we have been behaving badly.

I am part of the “Community” please don’t lump me in with those that are supposedly tired of some imaginary bait and switch.

I suggest you read the post again. I do not see where he has stated anything like “accept it or move on”.

Thank you Chris. I liked your post.

Not to write off your positivity here…b/c honestly we do need more things to be positive about… but when he says:

to pioneer in a space that the team at ArenaNet feel is of huge importance? Many of you are not only comfortable with this paradigm but embrace it, and your contribution, as you know has already shaped Tyria immensely, for which we are extremely grateful and excited about.

…literally the ONLY thread on the entire forums that fits that purview (that isn’t purely support/account management based … but entirely developer handled) … is this one right here:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/bltc/List-Of-Things-We-Want-In-Gemstore/first

Kuzzi.2198:

@Chris Whiteside

As an active player and forum reader/contributor since Beta, I have definitely noticed the many improvements to the game that originated from the community and ended up being implemented. I respect Anet for seriously taking player suggestions and shaping their game in the direction that the community wants to see it go.

However, I think the turn-around time from when suggestions are made to when they are released (if they are released) is something that needs serious improvement. A couple examples that come to mind are Edit Guild Message of the Day and Targeting without a party. Both are great quality of life improvements and I’m very glad that they are now part of the game, but I’m disappointed that it took over a year for them to be implemented even though they were constantly being suggested since day 1.

There are still many similar things for which the community has asked over and over, but have not even received an official response. Two which are in my opinion most important and most frequently suggested are Guild Features and TP Search Options. I feel that after one year, Anet has no excuse for not at the very least addressing these issues. Is that something we can ask for right now?

As for continual improvements, I think a good way to get a feel for what the community really wants is to monitor Reddit, as quality of life game improvement suggestions usually surface to the front page every couple days. Seeing a greater percentage of them come to life would really solidify this Dev-Community bond that you are describing.

While they’re at it, it’d be awesome if those people who contributed got a little shout out (not everyone, but ya know…highlighting the MAIN reddit post that caused the shift or gave the most valuable feedback) and saying “This -Link- was asked of us XX months ago. We kept an eye on it and thought we’d share our progress”

The problem with ANet is that, the secrecy for things that we are really eager to see, is not working in their favour. They’re attempting to create suspense.

You can’t be excited for something you know nothing about.

A lot of words…

When you just could have said, “Everyone be respectful of each another even through you may disagree”…

Why so many words?

I’ve always felt ArenaNet’s participation both in-forum and in-game was leagues better than that of any other game company I have seen.

That being said, would you please stop posting things exclusively to stupid social media sites and actually add them to your official site or forums as well?

Thanks! ^.^

Words, words, words. We’ve heard a lot of them, but only a change in action will matter. Many of the words you’ve said before are in complete disagreement with what you do.

So no, many players don’t feel like this is a “journey” they want to be a part of.

It also sounds like it was written by marketing. “Be sure to drop ground breaking in there at least twice!”

Also, how can you be reading all our feedback if mods can change what we say, whenever and to whatever?

I guess I should be more tactful this time when I post. This is coming from sPvP point of view, but I’m just going to come out and say it. You guys dropped the ball. I understand that the PvP department isn’t as large and has less resources then PvE or WvW.

However that doesn’t give you the excuse to just keep stringing us along. It’s been months since PvP had any type of meaningful update. Exploiters are running Skyhammer non-stop, leaderboards are still broken, and yet the only thing you seem to care about are esports. Yes, esports are great and all. Ergo, you need a player base to watch it. Which you don’t have because of the lack of communication with the PvP community and all the false promises. Most pvpers left this game long ago, but there are a few that stick around, such as me, hoping you guys pull it together.

Before this thread hits 15 pages of grumbling, conspiracy theories and basically turns into the behavior the OP was trying to minimize (it’s started already); today I noticed the Mesmer great sword no longer makes that ear piercing noise. Thanks for doing that.

@Chris: I hear (and believe!) you guys reading these forums a lot and trying very hard to separate the good from the bad suggestions discussed here and take some of what we say into shaping the future of this game. I also fully support the urge for people being polite (evidently that’s not a given in the gaming community, sadly as is).

However, communication is a two-way process.

Personally I sometimes wish that if the community is engaged in a very lively discussion about something (a recent example would be the issue about hardcore vs. casual content), that developers would weigh in and offer -their- perspective and reasoning and plans for the future. It can be frustrating offering a lot of feedback and ideas (and yes, I know that some of what we say might be silly or infeasible), and getting not a lot of reaction in return. Being able to listen is good. Being able and willing to explain is better.

Chris Whiteside.6102:

I ask that you remain respectful to your fellow man/woman, and be constructive in your approach to the development of the game, and understand Tyria is made up of communities and not individuals.

Chris W

It is such a simple concept, yet its always ridiculed by folks consumed by anger, bordom and frustration.

You guys at ArenaNet have done hell of a job dealing with endless negativity.
Keep up the good work.

if you are listening then make a expansion already

Erick Alastor.3917:

inb4 “Excalibur”.
And yup (imo) all this can be summed up in “jump on the train or leave”.

This.

They should create a satisfaction questionnaire at the end of each living story and/or asking players what do they think about some of the decisions taken, like it was done during the beta*

And this. HE SPEAKS THE TRUTH!!

I’ve (for my own sake, for fun) made a poll on ascended weapons a day or two before they came out and the poll lasted till after the day of their release (and it’s still there). The poll was very basic, “Do you like Ascended Weapons?” with 3 options, Like/Don’t care/Dislike. Although it’s “very” biased and “doesn’t represent the population has a whole”, it’s still fun to see that majority DISLIKE it. There could be various reasons for it, such as unnecessary power-creeping, time-gating (that’s what I’m against). But really, it’s been implemented, it’s not going anywhere, but it’s nice to see that I’m not the only one that dislikes it…. If the poll was actually accessible to everyone (say when they logged in after week or two of “ascended” experience), I’m still willing to bet that more people will hit the dislike then like+don’t care.

Check my signature for the poll.

Stats right now are:
Like 21% (172 votes)
Don’t care 15% (118 votes)
Dislike 64% (515 votes)
805 total votes

Surprising number of posts going missing. I keep trying to reply to them. :-(

While they’re at it, it’d be awesome if those people who contributed got a little shout out (not everyone, but ya know…highlighting the MAIN reddit post that caused the shift or gave the most valuable feedback) and saying “This -Link- was asked of us XX months ago. We kept an eye on it and thought we’d share our progress”

I do agree with this, a lot. There are two good examples from my personal experience.

1) During Second Life’s early years, when you participated in testing new features on the test server (and submitted results per their format), the avatar names involved were placed in the ‘About’ page for that release. IIRC I’m in the release notes for 1.5 and 1.6 (circa 2005-2007), and maybe 1.7.

2) Participating in FOSS projects tend to have devs place your name in the release notes, in particular if you submitted a patch or did other work toward helping the project. From the projects I follow, I think Icinga has been a great example of that.

If an overt way is not possible, perhaps a semi-covert one? Note the users that supplied the best feedback for a particular release and send them a little something extra – perhaps a crafting/speed booster or a BL Key – as a thank you. I doubt that’s going to break the gem store any by handing out the cheaper items as a thank you once in a while (at least for now).

Sungak Alkandenes.1369:

The Lost Witch.7601:

So, would it be possible to make an extra tumbs up (a star?) for the Arenanet team? To let us know what kind of feedback has been read and appreciated?

I know that responding to all the threads that come up on these forums everyday is too much to ask, but a star or other sign of approval could really make a big difference. Not only could it inspire people to write better feedback, it also gives us an incentive to write more of the good stuff if we know that our previous posts have been appreciated.

There is, occasionally, a red line under the ‘thumbs up’ symbol. It would not surprise me if that’s a notification that an ArenaNet employee hit the +1. If not, it should be.

Nope, I believe this has something to do with whether it got a thumbs up from people within the thread, or people across the forum. (I’m guessing through other parts of the forum like the dev tracker?)

At least, that’s what I’ve been able to discover about this mysterious red line through browsing the ‘forums’ section of the forum.

Martin Kerstein.3071:

This thread is about discussing the post from Chris Whiteside, not the moderation on this forum. Please focus on the topic at hand. Any further posts discussing things not related to the original post will be removed.

well that cleared things up

A concern I have is the majority of “content” that has been added is temporary. I’m sure others would agree with me that I want to consume content at my own pace, not be forced to play the flavor of the week living story events…

Kimyrielle.3826:

@Chris: I hear (and believe!) you guys reading these forums a lot and trying very hard to separate the good from the bad suggestions discussed here and take some of what we say into shaping the future of this game. I also fully support the urge for people being polite (evidently that’s not a given in the gaming community, sadly as is).

However, communication is a two-way process.

Personally I sometimes wish that if the community is engaged in a very lively discussion about something (a recent example would be the issue about hardcore vs. casual content), that developers would weigh in and offer -their- perspective and reasoning and plans for the future. It can be frustrating offering a lot of feedback and ideas (and yes, I know that some of what we say might be silly or infeasible), and getting not a lot of reaction in return. Being able to listen is good. Being able and willing to explain is better.

This ^^^

And my thanks to the OP for taking the time to address the community.

So when can the thief forum expect to see more red posts? There are a few things that we need to talk about. LOTS of a few things.