Guild Wars 2

I’m just throwing this topic into the ring again, because it’s something that bothers me immensely and with the expansion pack coming out, I’d like to raise this point.

It would be really nice if you guys over there at ArenaNet took the time to give female Asura feminine sets of armor instead of giving us the male options. The Asura females now have incredibly feminine hairstyles, but we’re stuck with such masculine options for clothing.

I’m not asking for tons of dresses and what have you, but it would be nice if we had the same options the other female’s in other races have. I’m sure many Charr females may feel the same.

I think today, I was so disheartened by the fact that the Shadow Assassin Outfit, which is absolutely adorable on other races, was the male version for us female Asura. Why? Is it really that time consuming to create a shrunken version for the females? Why not make the males wear feminine clothes then?

At the end of the day, I’d really just like more options that don’t make me look like a male with a female hairstyle.

So many people have argued that the race is androgynous, thus why does this matter, right? But that’s a cop out at the end of the day… The fact that this has indeed been brought up so many times before, especially when we had the race-based forums, shows that this is something that many of us female Asura-players would like to see.

Just spending my two cents.

Urgh. This again?

My asura and charr females are very happy without ridiculous-looking human-culture-specific female-with-prominent-breasts clothes, thank you very much.

Unisex for all, or nothing. I am 100% against more skins with boob windows on boobless species.

Rangelost.4857:

Urgh. This again?

My asura and charr females are very happy without ridiculous-looking human-culture-specific female-with-prominent-breasts clothes, thank you very much.

Unisex for all, or nothing. I am 100% against more skins with boob windows on boobless species.

Reading the OP’s entire post, I didn’t see anything about the OP specifically stating they wanted ‘armor showing cleavage’ or concerning the breasts at all. Merely a difference in appearance from the male gender.

You know.. like smaller sized shoulder pauldrons, lighter/thinner armor frame, etc. Something to make you less inclined to think an asura or what have you (that might happen to have a similar appearance as a male of that species) might possibly be a male.

Since when was personalization for any race frowned upon? And before anyone brings up clipping issues, there’s countless of those already. So I don’t see why this is such a black and white issue.

HOW DARE WE WANT TO DRESS OUR CHARACTERS MORE FEMININE!!! Jeez. I wish i could i put my asura and charr in dresses. I dont want to run around in guy clothes all the time, i have to do that enough in real life. I stopped buying armor from the gem store all together because of not having differences between the two genders. I dont care if they are unisex race. If i want to wear a dress i should be able to and if i want to wear a suit i should be able to. I want my butterfly pauldrons. i want the fancy dress from the fancy outfit.

Make it toggelable for the asura and the charr, that way those who have problems with their characters getting dresses dont have to see them, i dont care. but i want to wear more girl looking clothing on some of my 8 charr characters.

mXz.4512:

So I don’t see why this is such a black and white issue.

Because players don’t get a choice. When we equip a piece of equipment, the armor skin that shows up is the one and only version that was made for the character model.

Those of us who don’t want asura and charr females to suffer from human gender stereotypes are against the idea of basing armor models on sex alone.

The most worthwhile suggestion so far was to make all armor unisex, and if the devs want to make a skimpy and/or skirty version, both sexes should have access to it. These threads wanting to enforce human culture on all races in the game are regressive.

ETA: Using armor to identify a character’s sex is the stupidest idea I’ve ever heard. If you can’t tell the difference between a male and a female asura/charr, you haven’t been paying attention. This isn’t the kind of behavior that should be catered to.

Rangelost.4857:

Because players don’t get a choice. When we equip a piece of equipment, the armor skin that shows up is the one and only version that was made for the character model.

Those of us who don’t want asura and charr females to suffer from human gender stereotypes are against the idea of basing armor models on sex alone.

The most worthwhile suggestion so far was to make all armor unisex, and if the devs want to make a skimpy and/or skirty version, both sexes should have access to it. These threads wanting to enforce human culture on all races in the game are regressive.

ETA: Using armor to identify a character’s sex is the stupidest idea I’ve ever heard. If you can’t tell the difference between a male and a female asura/charr, you haven’t been paying attention. This isn’t the kind of behavior that should be catered to.

And what about those of us who would like to see more female armor choices for charr and asura huh? Not because they have breasts, but because i dont know, we want dresses? and skirts? and other clothing? are we to be ignored? because thats what you are saying, ignore the people who would like to dress their characters more feminine like. and well thats just not right.

Unisexing does not = male in real life, but thats what it means in game. Again, not right and slightly annoying. And unisexing everything isnt the solution, and its not likely to happen either.

Converting both male and female armor for charr and asura, and and allowing the players to choose in the hero tab which version they want to wear is though. Little harder to implement but it would save everyone trouble in the end. Those who dont want feminine looking armor dont have to wear it, ANET stops getting these threads suggested to them, The players who want feminine armor get to wear it. Win Win Win id say, minus development time of course. Still i think it would be worth it in the end.

Dante.1763, I won’t go into details about how insulting saying “dresses and skirts and the color pink are feminine”, but I will state that it is wrong, and should absolutely not be exemplified, let alone become a standard for non-human races.

What we don’t want is future armor sets to be available to asura and charr in the human female version. Those versions are simply not designed to fit characters with a body shape without prominent breasts.

With your idea, however, not only would ArenaNet have to design a third version (so you wouldn’t be getting what you want to anyway), but only one sex from two races (in other words, only 2 characters out of 10) would get the option to get an alternative design option. That makes no sense on both a developer’s and a player’s point of view.

You’re gonna have to get your definition of “feminine” rectified. Pants are not masculine, skirts are not feminine. Asura and charr females are very feminine as it is. They just happen to have different cultural standards, which is a breath of fresh air I don’t want polluted.

Rangelost.4857:

Dante.1763, I won’t go into details about how insulting saying “dresses and skirts and the color pink are feminine”, but I will state that it is wrong, and should absolutely not be exemplified, let alone become a standard for non-human races.

What we don’t want is future armor sets to be available to asura and charr in the human female version. Those versions are simply not designed to fit characters with a body shape without prominent breasts.

With your idea, however, not only would ArenaNet have to design a third version (so you wouldn’t be getting what you want to anyway), but only one sex from two races (in other words, only 2 characters out of 10) would get the option to get an alternative design option. That makes no sense on both a developer’s and a player’s point of view.

You’re gonna have to get your definition of “feminine” rectified. Pants are not masculine, skirts are not feminine. Asura and charr females are very feminine as it is. They just happen to have different cultural standards, which is a breath of fresh air I don’t want polluted.

Im sorry its insulting? what if i told you i want to dress like that in real life and i cant? and why shouldnt i as some one who would enjoy dressing that way, be able to in the game on my characters regardless of race. IM Sorry that offends you! You wait, im not. I want to dress my Charr in dresses, because I Like dresses. And yes actually i do want them to have the outfits available to them. SORRY that offends you again.

Its not my fault that arena net got lazy and decided not to design armor properly for the charr. and lets face it, they did. Cutting and pasting has never worked ever.

And its not my definition of Feminine, its theirs, because they dont put “Female” armor on charr and asura, they get the “Male” version, not a “Unisex” verison. And as i said, i want to be able to wear dresses on my charr, because i like the way they look. Despite what you think.

AND another point. they wouldnt have to design a third, they would convert both the male and the female armor over, like they already do for the male, and allow the player to choose if they where male or female. AND it does make sense to me, because there are some that do want and SOME like YOU who dont, and so the option should be present.

Dante.1763, it is impossible to apply the current female version armors to asura and charr female models because humans, norn and sylvari have monkey boobs while asura and charr do not. This means both the model and textures cannot be applied to the asura and charr.

And maybe you’d like to see charr in a dress designed for a human, but I wouldn’t. What makes your opinion more valuable than mine? Or even better, what if I want my norn male to be in a dress? What makes your charr female more qualified to wearing a dress than my norn male?

It just doesn’t add up, and trying to mix your personal culture’s gender stereotypes with the sex of different non-human species isn’t going to win you an argument.

I don’t give a hoot about boobs and cleavage, in real life or in game. My main issue is that I’m just tired of seeing my character in things that are so masculine. I think it would be nice to have some feminine options.

I mean, they made the winter costume a dress, it looked like all of the other female’s in the other races and it was spectacular. I loved the fact that I had an outfit that wasn’t masculine in nature.

I’m all for making all of the outfits unisex, but I think that would probably be a large, demanding job, to get all of them to fit all of the model sizes, which is why they haven’t done it. But I just don’t see big deal with modifying the current feminine outfits to show no cleavage on breast-barren characters.

Clearly there will always be people who think one way or another and there is nothing that I can do about that. The forums as a whole are a vocal minority, so maybe the non-vocal majority don’t care about the armor models and they just deal. But I’m choosing to be vocal about my stance on this, because it’s something that matters to me.

Rangelost.4857:

Dante.1763, it is impossible to apply the current female version armors to asura and charr female models because humans, norn and sylvari have monkey boobs while asura and charr do not. This means both the model and textures cannot be applied to the asura and charr.

And maybe you’d like to see charr in a dress designed for a human, but I wouldn’t. What makes your opinion more valuable than mine? Or even better, what if I want my norn male to be in a dress? What makes your charr female more qualified to wearing a dress than my norn male?

It just doesn’t add up, and trying to mix your personal culture’s gender stereotypes with the sex of different non-human species isn’t going to win you an argument.

It is not currently impossible, Because the way i understand how the make armor for the charr at least, they just take the human armor and stretch it to fit. So they could do it. which as a 3 modeler, its easier to stretch something than make a entirely new model. its also easy to close gaps in armor too, at least with the 3d program i use.

And your opinion isnt more important than mine anymore than mine is more important than yours, Its just not a nice thing to disqualify someones opinion, which you did try to do. that you dont like, because you dont want to see it. There are those of us who would, so the option should at least be present.

And im aware that you dont want to see it, thats why im standing by the thing that i offered. it would appease both sides, You have it toggled off? You dont see the female armor version on asura and charr. you have it turned on? you do, if they are female!

And what about you mixing your personal cultural? You clearly dont want to even have the Option for it exist in game. what does that say, because its not going to win you an argument either.

This is why these threads always get locked and a new one is made. Both sides are so adamant on that theirs is better that neither side is willing to meet in a middle ground. and those that present middle ground options are ignored.

What i would LOVE to see is armor DESIGNED for Charr, NOT stretched human male armor, which is what we get now. armor DESIGNED for Asura, NOT stretched human male armor which is what we get now. But its to much work to do that, and when the races had their own forums, it was OFTEN stated in the charr forums, that more players would play them, if they had armor DESIGNED for them instead of just stretched. AND if they had SOME more feminine looking armor. If ANET did that. and made Charr and Asura armor, fit comfortably and look proper on them, and NOT stretch them, these threads wouldnt pop up so often.

Dante.1763, it looks like we’re going to have to get technical, because you don’t get my point.

First, let’s take a look at the Grasping Dead heavy armor set. It comes from the City of Arah, a human civilization. This is important.

Here is the human male model.
And here is the human female model.

Aside from being more skimpy (which is a recurrent theme in female human culture from the Guild Wars universe), you’ll notice that the female version also has nice plate cups for the breasts, perfectly designed to funnel incoming thrusting blades straight into the heart.

These cups cannot be flattened. They are modeled, textured and shaded/mapped this way. Because of this, it is impossible to use this design on a species that has no breasts, unless you want them to look like they have breasts because of the armor.

To have the human female version available for asura and charr, the breasts would have to be edited out. This means that a whole third version of the armor would have to be made. Well, those other three get something unique, so why don’t we, right?

Let’s look at some generic chain armor set.

Here is the human male model.
And here is the human female model.

What’s this? They are both the same?

Almost. While the armor is similar, the model is different, and so is the texture and shading. On a flat chested creature, the female version would have some sort of extra chainmail on the front for breasts that would just sag. It simply wouldn’t fit. So why would asura and charr want to wear the human female version, right?

Well, that’s exactly my point. I get that you want your asura to look like a human Barbie doll rather than a dignified asuran genius, but catering to an extreme minority won’t do. Either everyone gets to wear both versions (which would double development time for each armor set, not to mention development time to give players the option to choose which one they want), or characters continue wearing armor that is perfectly logical for them to wear.

If everyone got unique armor sets depending on both their race and gender (*cough*cultural armor sets*cough*), development time for each armor set would be multiplied by 10. That’s simply unrealistic, and we’d run into the exact same problem: people like you who want their asura and charr to dress like humans.

Rangelost.4857

Oh lets get condescending again why dont we… “Well, that’s exactly my point. I get that you want your asura to look like a human Barbie doll rather than a dignified asuran genius” You can be dignified, and look “feminine” at the same time. I dont think you realize just how much time some players put into their characters appearance

I do not want my fictional Asura to look a bloody barbie doll nor do i want my very real 8 female Charr to look like that either. What i do want is more feminine looking armor for Asura(I do not play Asura) and female Charr for those who want it available to them. You really sound so condescending in your posts, you really really do most of the time.

IT IS NOT Impossible to flatten those armor pieces EDIT: Maybe they should rework the chest pieces so they dont have breasts cups instead of just converting it over. which is not i really care about. Im aware that all the armor for human,norn and sylvari has room for breasts to sit in. Im also aware that most armor sets dont have much difference between the two over all, however there are sets that do have parts that are different. The sylvari dungeon armor, for light armor users, the female leg armor is much more smoother and has less spikey things than the male version.

Lets look at the one that got me the most disappointed recently. The Luminescent armor, for light armor wearers(just as an example). The females of every single race get to have cool butterflys on their right shoulder, wait….The charr, and asura do not…they get the male version…. as such i wont be going after these armor sets except to get the ascended chest. i will never use them., there is no point, i like that butterfly, it would be neat to have that butterfly, actually my mother who plays this game, far far more than i do, with 13k ap was looking over my shoulder as i was looking at the armor gallery when it was first released. the conversation we had went sorta like what follows.
Her. “Oh that armor looks cool, i love the butterfly, cant wait to get it unlocked so i can use it on my little asura, she will look cute!!”
Me. “i wish, but it doesnt work that way, you get this version” little pause as i flopped over the male* “as will the charr”
Her. “That..is stupid…why not? it would look so much better”

How do you answer that? i couldnt think of anything other than i dont know, there really isnt a reason that they couldnt convert the butterfly look over. I dont know, but for some armor, and some pieces of that armor, both sexes should be ported over.

Thats what im getting at, do you know how annoying it is to see stuff like that shoulder, and then not be able to use it? For players who want to dress their Charr and Asura in more feminine looking pieces of armor we cannot. At least with Norn, Sylvari, and Human, Both male and female of all those races have armor that looks Masculine and Feminine for both sexes.

The asura and charr only. ONLY get the Male version, so we get very few feminine looking armors. im not talking out right “Girly” If you wish to call it that. But i would like to have some prettier looking armors in game that the charr can get their hands on.

Ive spent more time trying to find armor that looks good for some of female charr, Mainly my elementalist, mesmer, and necromancer than i have playing them.

My guardian, warrior, ranger, and engineer where easier.

I wanted my engineer to look like a mechanic again easy to do. and i wanted my ranger to look like Aragorn met Legolas, pretty, but not obnoxiously so, again easy to do.

My Necromancer, i wanted to make look like a shaman( sorta like this http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2012/223/5/e/magic_beak__shaman_of_the_wild__by_suzanne_helmigh-d5ao158.png ) which the tribal armor male or female would work for.

My Mesmer, i wanted to make her look like she walked out of a ballroom, Not at all easy to do with the shear lack of feminine armors that Charr get. Which i was very excited about the fancy outfit…until i realized that i had to wear a tuxedo, so that didnt get bought.

And my Ele would have worn the Luminescent set as i use her to do all the stories, and most of the PvE content in the entire world and loved the way that set looked, that is..up until i saw that they wouldnt get the butterfly shoulders, now shes just wearing cultural armor and probably will remain wearing cultural armor as its the only true unisex option available to charr.

I do not want my charr to dress like a human. i want my charr to have some more feminine options available to them, instead of not being able to see some of the more smoother, and prettier armors in the game. EDIT: If you are going to put a beast race in, you should be prepared to invest time into that races armor.

Dante.1763:

what if i told you i want to dress like that in real life and i cant? and why shouldnt i as some one who would enjoy dressing that way, be able to in the game on my characters regardless of race.

As far as human values go, I’m on board with your reasoning. GW2 isn’t just about human values though – it’s about many different (fictional) races in a fictional place.

What Rangelost is trying to impress upon you is that from a development standpoint, it’s simply madness to rework each piece of armor so many times to please such a wide variety of people, especially when it’s contradictory to the lore.

Think of it also from a cultural standpoint. Asura and Charr don’t share the same gender roles and gender-specific fashion folkways that Tyrian humans share with us. Their culture is just entirely different. I imagine that Asura would be concerned that floaty fabric would get caught in machinery, regardless of the gender who wears it. Same with Charr – it would be a hazard on the battlefield.

What this issue is really about is sexual dimorphism – a phenotypic difference between males and females of the same species. The dimorphic traits that Asura/Charr possess are different from humans, but equally apparent. Different faces, bodies, tails, horns. The difference between the sexes is clear, if for some reason that’s important.

It doesn’t make sense to make this an issue about human gender roles, since they simply don’t apply to these fictional races. Lack of conventionally “girly” clothing doesn’t say anything about the femininity of your character (or lack thereof) given that human values couldn’t be less relevant.

Elegy.2159:

Dante.1763:

what if i told you i want to dress like that in real life and i cant? and why shouldnt i as some one who would enjoy dressing that way, be able to in the game on my characters regardless of race.

As far as human values go, I’m on board with your reasoning. GW2 isn’t just about human values though – it’s about many different (fictional) races in a fictional place.

What Rangelost is trying to impress upon you is that from a development standpoint, it’s simply madness to rework each piece of armor so many times to please such a wide variety of people, especially when it’s contradictory to the lore.

Think of it also from a cultural standpoint. Asura and Charr don’t share the same gender roles and gender-specific fashion folkways that Tyrian humans share with us. Their culture is just entirely different. I imagine that Asura would be concerned that floaty fabric would get caught in machinery, regardless of the gender who wears it. Same with Charr – it would be a hazard on the battlefield.

What this issue is really about is sexual dimorphism – a phenotypic difference between males and females of the same species. The dimorphic traits that Asura/Charr possess are different from humans, but equally apparent. Different faces, bodies, tails, horns. The difference between the sexes is clear, if for some reason that’s important.

It doesn’t make sense to make this an issue about human gender roles, since they simply don’t apply to these fictional races. Lack of conventionally “girly” clothing doesn’t say anything about the femininity of your character (or lack thereof) given that human values couldn’t be less relevant.

I fully understand that believe me, this is a game after all! But also from a development standpoint, if you are going to put a beast race in, you should be prepared to invest some time in making that races armor work properly. I would just like to have some prettier options available to my female charr characters, the butterflys of the luminescent armor for example. the smoother leaves on the leggings from TA, for a few examples.

No the difference in sex isnt important, at least to me, i could care less if its male or female, i have a male charr with pink hair because he got in an accident with an asuran progeny once(my former female engineer xD but the name was not very good name for a female charr like i wanted, so i swapped its gender).

And true they dont have the gender roles, but at the same time, that doesnt meant that they should only have male armor available to them. for an example of another solution im going to continue to use the Luminescent set. For female charr. They get the male, Chest, gloves, Legs, Boots, and helm, but the Female shoulders. that wouldnt be so bad now would it?

Rangelost.4857:

Urgh. This again?

My asura and charr females are very happy without ridiculous-looking human-culture-specific female-with-prominent-breasts clothes, thank you very much.

Unisex for all, or nothing. I am 100% against more skins with boob windows on boobless species.

You are incorrect on every count

First, human standard male clothing is not any more unisex than female.

Second, as confirmed by a dev, asura are in fact mammals and therefore do have breasts.

Dante.1763, I still haven’t a single clue what you mean by “masculine” and “feminine”. Armor isn’t dictated by gender. It depends on the body shape. It’s all a matter of boobs or no boobs. Anyhow, let’s roll with your example of the Carapace light armor.

Here’s what it looks like on a female norn.

Right off the bat, you’ll have to agree that the chest piece couldn’t be applied to a character with no prominent breasts. Or, at least, not without some changes. Either way, the armor piece would have to be redesigned from the ground up for boobless creatures, which includes only 40% of the playable female characters. Hence, a third version.

But flat-chested creatures also include 100% of the playable male characters. Do you think only asura and charr females should get the third version? Since we went through the trouble of making a version flat-chested creatures can wear, why not also allow all flat-chested creatures to wear it as well?

If we do, then we can make a fourth version. A modified version of the currently boobless chest piece (the “human male” version) so that all female characters can wear Carapace armor without butterflies, in case they prefer the no-butterfly version.

From this, we get two unisex versions of the armor: Carapace Armor, and Butterfly Armor. They could be two different sets players can work towards, instead of just one. And a bearded norn male could enjoy his armor with butterflies, too.

That’s what I mean by “all armor should be unisex”. I think it’s extremely frustrating in a video game when the same set of armor on two characters looks completely different from head to toe just because one of them has giant bags of fat on her chest.

What looks good or not on a character, that’s a matter of opinion. Personally, I would be mortified if I had the same Light Armor options on my asura and charr than what humans have to deal with.

PS: Sorry if I sound like a complete jerk. It’s partly due to my English being self-taught, but mainly due to me actually being a complete jerk.

ETA: What Elegy.2159 said. People who know fancy words can explain it better than I ever could.

Rangelost.4857:

That’s what I mean by “all armor should be unisex”. I think it’s extremely frustrating in a video game when the same set of armor on two characters looks completely different from head to toe just because one of them has giant bags of fat on her chest.

PS: Sorry if I sound like a complete jerk. It’s party due to my English being self-taught, but mainly due to me actually being a complete jerk.

This i can completely utterly agree with( as well most of you post, just didnt want to qoute the whole thing) its always been stupid to me. Probably one of the main reasons i do not play many games where you dress your characters up because like with this, it bugs me that some appearances cannot be achieved, plus all developers could save time if they you know…used the same armor appearance for both genders.

Uhm, thanks? im not really offended by it, but its not a great way to get your point across really, as soon as people start thinking you are being condescending and or rude to them they really do stop listening for the most part.

Dante.1763:

But also from a development standpoint, if you are going to put a beast race in, you should be prepared to invest some time in making that races armor work properly.

I couldn’t agree more. What’s been said in the past is that Anet doesn’t want to devote the resources to constructing armor for a race few people play. I’ve never read anything from a dev directly stating that, so it could be player opinion for all I know. If it is true that few people play Charr, I bet a whole lot more would play them if they looked a little more polished. I’m hoping that with the expansion (given that Rytlock is playing such a large role) we’ll get some armor that at least fits Charr well.

Rangelost.4857:

And a bearded norn male could enjoy his armor with butterflies, too.

The funniest part of this butterfly debacle are the male norn who can’t wear it, imo. Given how connected the norn are to “the spirits of the wild,” I can’t think of anything more appropriate for them to wear. I used the carapace shoulders on my female asura for a while, and I was happy to have the male version. It would have been better if they’d been two distinct shoulder skins though. The butterfly version is unique and it does royally suck to have your character’s gender determine whether or not you can wear it. Especially for mesmers.

Rangelost.4857:

That’s what I mean by “all armor should be unisex”. I think it’s extremely frustrating in a video game when the same set of armor on two characters looks completely different from head to toe just because one of them has giant bags of fat on her chest.

This is partly why I gravitate towards asura so much. A few some Most female human armors are hilariously skimpy, especially for caster classes. This is endemic to mmorpgs though. That’s not to say I wouldn’t be thrilled if Anet took a different direction in the future – just to say I’m not getting my hopes up. At least we have some interesting races you can play as a female without looking like you just got off a stripper pole. All my human females are adventurers at least – medium armor isn’t quite as comical to me as light or heavy.

I mean, come on. This armor couldn’t even protect this poor lady from a mosquito bite, rofl.

Elegy.2159:

I couldn’t agree more. What’s been said in the past is that Anet doesn’t want to devote the resources to constructing armor for a race few people play. I’ve never read anything from a dev directly stating that, so it could be player opinion for all I know. If it is true that few people play Charr, I bet a whole lot more would play them if they looked a little more polished. I’m hoping that with the expansion (given that Rytlock is playing such a large role) we’ll get some armor that at least fits Charr well.

I mean, come on. This armor couldn’t even protect this poor lady from a mosquito bite, rofl.

Its more of a player opinion coupled with the lack of evidence that anet has tried to do so, and yes, alot of people seem to agree that if the charr where more polished armor appearence wise, they would probably consider rolling them, the other reason they wont play them is well they dont want to be seen as a furry(a huge deal i gather). shrugs i am hoping so too, and who knows maybe anet will surprise us and have a ton of new armors that look rather nice.

Good lord, i dont play human characters but thats just horrible!!! im guessing thats heavy armor right, look like the gladiator armor!? Jeez, My Charr Demon Knight..thing..laughs at that puny armor!

I would like to give support to the general topic of something feels amiss, or lacking if you will, with asura clothing options. After reading through this thread, one thing is quite clear. The issue isn’t cut and dry one way or the other.

I’d like to first point out that GW2 is a game. Games are intended to be fun for ALL who play them. Clearly there are many players who are being quite limited in fun because of this particular issue.

I see lots of you, who are against a change, pointing out that Asura and Charr are androgynous and shouldn’t be subject to human standards. While I see the the logic in most of that reasoning, I feel it is being short sighted. One thing that always happens when different cultures meet is that they affect each other. Both cultures end up taking aspects of the other that they like and applying them to their own.

Seeing as three of the five races have females wearing dresses, skirts, and various feminine clothing, there is no logical way that the other two races would not take notice of that. Certainly there would be plenty of Asura and Charr that would ignore or not want to adopt such aspects of other races. However, there would absolutely be many that would take note and want to try it.

It may or may not be unreasonable to tweak each of the current armor sets but, in the end, that is for the developers themselves to decide. If the developers decide that it’s an unreasonable task, I wouldn’t hold it against them.

Moving forward, regardless of what is done about the current armor skins, I think it would be quite reasonable to start including a decent amount of feminine armor sets and outfits for Asura and Charr. This way, there would be options to please and give fun to all of us.

Asura are my favorite race by far, however, i’m a bit of an oddball overall, for an Asura. I’m have almost zero interest in our technological and incredibly science heavy culture. I greatly appreciate the conveniences it provides for us and the rest of Tyria. My interests and heart lie with magic, myths, legends, AND I personally adore and am fascinated by the clothing worn by females of races.

Thank you for taking the time to read my post and I hope it is found to be constructive, palatable, and without enmity. I wish you a pleasant journey.

Conncept.7638:

asura are in fact mammals and therefore do have breasts.

Where?

Elegy.2159:

I mean, come on. This armor couldn’t even protect this poor lady from a mosquito bite, rofl.

Well, it’s some kind of gladiator armor, so honestly I’m glad the characters are half naked in it (yeah, the male top shows even more skin). Also, it allows people who enjoy seeing norn tatoos/charr fur patterns/sylvari glow to use armor that doesn’t cover everything.
At least, playing a heavy class, we’ve got the choice to use some heavy plate armors that hide every inch of skin, or skimpier sets, regardless of your gender. If you play an adventurer class, well, good luck finding more revealing male armors. :p

That being said, I wish the armor sets looked more like they were actually from the same sets. Cabalist armor, Phoenix armor, Phalanx armor, anyone ? :[

And for the whole asura/charr female armors…
I prefer it the way it is, but I understand that some people would like to see their female characters in dresses or frilly outfits… I just wish they gave us choice, so everybody could be happy, but that’s probably too much work.

AliceKaye.1903:

So many people have argued that the race is androgynous, thus why does this matter, right? But that’s a cop out at the end of the day… The fact that this has indeed been brought up so many times before, especially when we had the race-based forums, shows that this is something that many of us female Asura-players would like to see.

The main issue I have is that they are not consistent with it! On most pieces, we get the male version. But on others, they choose to provide a female version (such as the ancestral outfit).

Crazy suggestion here: why not give players the choice of which version of the model they get? Then it’s not forced no anyone, but those that want dresses and skirts can have them.

Alkalissa.1706:

Crazy suggestion here: why not give players the choice of which version of the model they get? Then it’s not forced no anyone, but those that want dresses and skirts can have them.

I like this idea. I’d love to put my male norn guardian in a long, flowing dress.

Alkalissa.1706:

Crazy suggestion here: why not give players the choice of which version of the model they get? Then it’s not forced no anyone, but those that want dresses and skirts can have them.

No point. You do realize what a female asura looks like while wearing the ancestral outfit, right? Chestless. That’s further coupled by the fact that, iirc, asura are more fascinated (sexually or otherwise) by ear size. The form of clothing is more irrelevant compared to it being functional. Anyone wanting asura to have the female version of armors should have their motives questioned, as very few of them ever look like they’d be functional. This is even moreso considering the fact that because asura dont have a chest, most “feminine” armors wouldnt even work.

I like it how it is. The male armor is part of what drew me to make so many female Asurans in the first place.

This gorgeous dress for female humans/norns is a boys tux for female asuras/charrs. This was very dissapointing. Not the least bit femine nor different from male versions

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Noble_Count_Outfit

Considering it’s a gem outfit, anet shoud’ve put a little effort into this.

i only got interested in checking outfit in the last few days and i was really disappointed when i found about this female asura getting the same outfit as the male ones. i can see that im not the only one so i hope Anet will think about this.

Rangelost.4857, as a game developer I will say.. you don’t have the slightest idea what you are talking about. Game armors are a skin that is applied to a model using texture coordinate mapping, and the model varies depending on male or female to include breasts or to exclude breasts. The only thing that makes armors have separate apperances in GW2 are that they use two entirely different base models for the armors depending on gender, while most other games do not.

I repeat, the skin does not change, only the model to which it is applied, which parts of the texture are used and how they are stretched to cover it.

Do you know why some armors support a Charr’s tail and others don’t? Because only the skin of these armors varies, and they all use the same base model (while other armors don’t use the model and thus don’t support the tail). Unused polygons are thus rendered transparent so that it takes on a different “shape”.

Repeatly saying something is impossible when the very nature of doing something like this is how half the game’s graphics are built is a bit silly. Modelling in games is always about making a baseline model that can handle every possible variation and then applying lots of interesting skins to it in different ways.

The same model can even support both male and female variations just by making a mesh for the breasts that is toggled on or off. Its actually very easy. So you can still have a dress that lacks breasts just by differentiating between race and “has breasts” instead of automatically assuming that all females equal “has breasts”.

I will also say this: There are no impossibles in game development. This is often a lie that game developers (or companies) force upon themselves to save time and resources. The entire premise behind games is to do things that are impossible, and many games are built upon fantastically weird engines that derive most of their functionality from being lovecraftian horrors made by geniuses.

Hannelore.8153:

Rangelost.4857, as a game developer I will say.. you don’t have the slightest idea what you are talking about. Game armors are a skin that is applied to a model using texture coordinate mapping, and the model varies depending on male or female to include breasts or to exclude breasts. The only thing that makes armors have separate apperances in GW2 are that they use two entirely different base models for the armors depending on gender, while most other games do not.

I repeat, the skin does not change, only the model to which it is applied, which parts of the texture are used and how they are stretched to cover it.

Do you know why some armors support a Charr’s tail and others don’t? Because only the skin of these armors varies, and they all use the same base model (while other armors don’t use the model and thus don’t support the tail). Unused polygons are thus rendered transparent so that it takes on a different “shape”.

Repeatly saying something is impossible when the very nature of doing something like this is how half the game’s graphics are built is a bit silly. Modelling in games is always about making a baseline model that can handle every possible variation and then applying lots of interesting skins to it in different ways.

The same model can even support both male and female variations just by making a mesh for the breasts that is toggled on or off. Its actually very easy. So you can still have a dress that lacks breasts just by differentiating between race and “has breasts” instead of automatically assuming that all females equal “has breasts”.

I will also say this: There are no impossibles in game development. This is often a lie that game developers (or companies) force upon themselves to save time and resources. The entire premise behind games is to do things that are impossible, and many games are built upon fantastically weird engines that derive most of their functionality from being lovecraftian horrors made by geniuses.

While the information is nice to know, the post you responded to is 3 months old. I don’t think he is still reading the forums at this time.

I know this is an old thread, but I think what the game needs, in general, is more armour for female chars, that is neither masculine, nor overtly feminine.

So, more feminine than the masculine version, with slightly less heavy shoulders and lower cut necklines etc.; but not, necessarily, full-on frou frou, with frilly skirts and high heels all the time (although, they can be nice too, sometimes).

So, a kind of happy balance between femininity and (relative) practicality.

There are some things like that already, but it could do with a few more.

An example would be my previous suggestion of a leggings and flatter-heeled boots version of the Daydreamer’s outfit.

Is there possible to make more feminine outfits for female asura/char… Yes
Fancy winter outfit have gender variations… And you know what… They are not “overly sexualised”, or creepy.

Will leave it here.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Fancy_Winter_Outfit

I know this is an old thread, but I have been thinking about this a lot recently.

The fact that there ARE female clothing options for Asura and Charr is proof that female clothing can work on all models.
Anet CAN make female clothing for these models, they just chose not to.
This is nothing more than laziness/cutting corners by Anet, and this is why we are upset.

As such, I will not be buying HoT or Gems until this is fixed, which is to say I am done spending money on an incomplete game, because I doubt this will ever change.

even if this is an old thread ,but its better to add my opinion here rather than making a new thread and hopefully the developers will someday consider this thread.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

While the information is nice to know, the post you responded to is 3 months old. I don’t think he is still reading the forums at this time.

The information was posted for others as well since those posts took up most of the thread at that time and gave some misconceptions about the subject.

Even though its a necro’d thread, people will base future posts on existing content.

I believe it shouldn’t cost them so much unthinkable effort to actually create a third option beside the male/female we have for Norn, Humans and Sylvari. A third option specifically for female Asura and Charr, to look feminine BUT appropriate for their bodies. All the crappy arguments of “these races don’t care for style” and whatever make no sense. If they don’t care, why in the world would they own outfits/need charges to change the looks of their armors? Why have such feminine hairstyles?
Lazy and lame excuse to justify this lack.
I myself agree perfectly that most of the armors would look ridiculous, hideous and inappropriate if just copy/pasted on shrunken version from female humans to female Asura, but I can’t stand that if I want my Asura to look feminine and not just like a male I have barely a couple max, of ugly options to content with -beside the outfits.-

I’d vouch for this concept of female Charr and Asura having 2 armor gender option choices, even if the envious females of other races start an uproar. I’ve been waiting for this concept to happen ever since this game started.

Why all this “I want feminine Asura/Charr” stuff? If you want femalenss, roll a female human. That’s what they are there for. The other races are different in order to be different. To use the fantasy genre and GW2 univese specifically to displace yourself from real life, to make characters and storylines that couldn’t exist in the real world. This is part of the appeal of the fantasy genre and fantasy MMO’s. You can’t blame the game for not giving you options; you’re the one who chose to roll Asura in the first place, knowing full well that they were different from humans.

Asura are not human. What they find feminine is not what you find feminine. Stop projecting your cultural ideas about clothing onto them.

Asura value ear and head size above other traits. A balanced, symmetrical face typically called “cute” by humans will be referred to as “deformed” by Asura. They expect their females to have long supple ears, a gracefully curved ellipsoidal skull, enticingly slender pointed teeth, and the highest IQ possible.

Why would you want to look like just another human Bookah, anyway? Yuck.

Rhyse.8179:

Why all this “I want feminine Asura/Charr” stuff? If you want femalenss, roll a female human. That’s what they are there for. The other races are different in order to be different. To use the fantasy genre and GW2 univese specifically to displace yourself from real life, to make characters and storylines that couldn’t exist in the real world. This is part of the appeal of the fantasy genre and fantasy MMO’s. You can’t blame the game for not giving you options; you’re the one who chose to roll Asura in the first place, knowing full well that they were different from humans.

Asura are not human. What they find feminine is not what you find feminine. Stop projecting your cultural ideas about clothing onto them.

Asura value ear and head size above other traits. A balanced, symmetrical face typically called “cute” by humans will be referred to as “deformed” by Asura. They expect their females to have long supple ears, a gracefully curved ellipsoidal skull, enticingly slender pointed teeth, and the highest IQ possible.

Why would you want to look like just another human Bookah, anyway? Yuck.

This is a fantasy game and would like our female charr and asura toon to wear feminine clothes. Their female human, norn and sylvari friends thought it would look cool on them. The trend begins there where they have a choice to wear whatever they want. It’s all about creativity plus you don’t have to wear it if you dislike it. Not every female charr and asura are the same. They got different taste in accessories and now coming from realistic point of view. Not every player will have interest in playing human- sylvari characters. What you’re saying is suffer with the consequences when rolling an female asura or charr. All we just ask is for more variety for those two specific female race to wear female attires or have the choice to. If it can’t be implemented through existing armor sets. Then at least do it through gem shop because I guarantee many will buy for that purpose.

After all….Fantasy = freedom of creativity.

Rhyse.8179:

Why all this “I want feminine Asura/Charr” stuff? If you want femalenss, roll a female human. That’s what they are there for. The other races are different in order to be different. To use the fantasy genre and GW2 univese specifically to displace yourself from real life, to make characters and storylines that couldn’t exist in the real world. This is part of the appeal of the fantasy genre and fantasy MMO’s. You can’t blame the game for not giving you options; you’re the one who chose to roll Asura in the first place, knowing full well that they were different from humans.

Asura are not human. What they find feminine is not what you find feminine. Stop projecting your cultural ideas about clothing onto them.

Asura value ear and head size above other traits. A balanced, symmetrical face typically called “cute” by humans will be referred to as “deformed” by Asura. They expect their females to have long supple ears, a gracefully curved ellipsoidal skull, enticingly slender pointed teeth, and the highest IQ possible.

Why would you want to look like just another human Bookah, anyway? Yuck.

we didnt ask for big boobs nor nice butts for Asura and Charr(-.-"). we are simply asking to give female asura and charr different look for clothing for males and females instead of making it the same.

Leveling my Charr now and I’ve really got to agree. Had to use one of the total makeover kits I somehow acquired at some point, but my Charr actually has a decent face and hairstyle now. The clothes she wears though kind of drag it down.
The concept for her means she needs a black dress. I’ll have to try and force something when I get to 80 (Guild top and forgeman pants?), but having access to actual dress-type outfits would work much better.
My Asura needs a dress too, but she’s a heavy-armour class, so I’ve kind of given up on her getting anything worthwhile.

Tachenon.5270:

Conncept.7638:

asura are in fact mammals and therefore do have breasts.

Where?

I always thought asuran were like Echidna and didn’t have breasts but weird milk patches. Charr probably are like every other mammal on earth and are only prominent when nursing.

As for Norn in skimpy outfits, in lore norn produce massive amounts of body heat and don’t require as much clothing as other races.

heartless.6803:

Tachenon.5270:

Conncept.7638:

asura are in fact mammals and therefore do have breasts.

Where?

I always thought asuran were like Echidna and didn’t have breasts but weird milk patches. Charr probably are like every other mammal on earth and are only prominent when nursing.

As for Norn in skimpy outfits, in lore norn produce massive amounts of body heat and don’t require as much clothing as other races.

http://guildwars2.pl/about_lore_and_mechanics_with_eric_flannum_guildwarspl_exclusive,a545

Never saw this until now, but the link above is where I get it from. A developer states that Asura are mammals complete with mammary glands and breasts the same as humans, but their breasts do not ever grow, as humans do when producing milk (no idea how that works, logically speaking to contain more material they would need to grow).

There is also another one somewhere where a developer is asked if Asura give live birth and confirms that they do. So while there are mammals which do not give live birth, and produce milk in other ways than with breasts, Asura are not one of them.

Conncept.7638:

heartless.6803:

Tachenon.5270:

Conncept.7638:

asura are in fact mammals and therefore do have breasts.

Where?

I always thought asuran were like Echidna and didn’t have breasts but weird milk patches. Charr probably are like every other mammal on earth and are only prominent when nursing.

As for Norn in skimpy outfits, in lore norn produce massive amounts of body heat and don’t require as much clothing as other races.

http://guildwars2.pl/about_lore_and_mechanics_with_eric_flannum_guildwarspl_exclusive,a545

Never saw this until now, but the link above is where I get it from. A developer states that Asura are not only mammals, but are breastfeeding live-birth mammals just the same as humans.

Well according to my Raiment of the Lich Costume, they don’t have nipples. Or they’re super kinky and they’re pierced. That costume alone is why female’s can’t always use male costumes, it’s super creepy to look at that.

heartless.6803:

Conncept.7638:

heartless.6803:

Tachenon.5270:

Conncept.7638:

asura are in fact mammals and therefore do have breasts.

Where?

I always thought asuran were like Echidna and didn’t have breasts but weird milk patches. Charr probably are like every other mammal on earth and are only prominent when nursing.

As for Norn in skimpy outfits, in lore norn produce massive amounts of body heat and don’t require as much clothing as other races.

http://guildwars2.pl/about_lore_and_mechanics_with_eric_flannum_guildwarspl_exclusive,a545

Never saw this until now, but the link above is where I get it from. A developer states that Asura are not only mammals, but are breastfeeding live-birth mammals just the same as humans.

Well according to my Raiment of the Lich Costume, they don’t have nipples. Or they’re super kinky and they’re pierced. That costume alone is why female’s can’t always use male costumes, it’s super creepy to look at that.

Males humans can go completely shirtless, and do not have nipples. Obviously the developers just chose not to model their characters with those details regardless of their gender.

heartless.6803:

Conncept.7638:

heartless.6803:

Tachenon.5270:

Conncept.7638:

asura are in fact mammals and therefore do have breasts.

Where?

I always thought asuran were like Echidna and didn’t have breasts but weird milk patches. Charr probably are like every other mammal on earth and are only prominent when nursing.

As for Norn in skimpy outfits, in lore norn produce massive amounts of body heat and don’t require as much clothing as other races.

http://guildwars2.pl/about_lore_and_mechanics_with_eric_flannum_guildwarspl_exclusive,a545

Never saw this until now, but the link above is where I get it from. A developer states that Asura are not only mammals, but are breastfeeding live-birth mammals just the same as humans.

Well according to my Raiment of the Lich Costume, they don’t have nipples. Or they’re super kinky and they’re pierced. That costume alone is why female’s can’t always use male costumes, it’s super creepy to look at that.

The nude glitch on preview sometimes shows that males lack certain male parts. That doesn’t mean that they aren’t there, just that they don’t always show. Same as with Asuran female nipples.

I know of at least 3 different outfits where I should have had a wardrobe malfunction (the “feathered” one i think is probably the most revealing) but i didn’t find any nips. This even when my underwear is a full 1 piece.

I wouldn’t mind some girlier things to wear. It’s not impossible to find a dress. I want to be able to go full on frou frou though. What little girl is complete without a flowing skirt?

We all should be able to use all clothes, regardless of the gender of the character.

I don’t see any legitimate reason to limit clothes to one gender only. Enven less to limit Asura and Charr to only half of the options out there.

Too revolutionary for you? Well, sorry, that’s the spirit of our times.