Guild Wars 2

duckideva.6358:

I’ve almost completely checked out of gw2 after starting a new character with the NPE. It killed the love I’ve had for this game. The traits thing…just…no. And 6 months of thread, with the only comment of substance from the anet team being “wow, this is too long to read, could you summarize it?”…and then never ever coming back, it tells me that the traits thing is permanent, and that we’ve all just completely wasted our time by trying to get them to listen.

So yeah, I’m kinda sad about the direction they decided to take GW2, and I’m sure I’ll pop back in randomly for things like halloween or what have you; but I’ve gone from an every day player to a once a week or so player, and I’ll probably fade out for a while entirely.

I’m so disappointed that a game that once promised that we could play and explore the way we wanted to has become a game on rails where you have to play the way they want you to play if you ever want to see the full potential of your character.

I’m sure the white knights will be in any second now to say that the company won’t miss me and my regular gem card purchases, which ya know…true enough. But I’m still sad, watching something I loved become something I can’t be bothered with.

^ this ^

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

tofumon.5924:

Mister zeeRo.8561:

55Pages
when someone asks me if GW2 is a good game my answer is : not anymore, dont buy it.

Same. I can’t really recommend this game to anyone.

I agree. The sad thing is that arenanet doesn’t realize the power of word of mouth and how much faster the negative spreads compared to the positive.

^ & this ^

“We want it to be much easier to experiment with and learn new builds as you explore the world of Tyria.”

Ran across a build I’d like to try on my NPE ele. Despite having taken the time to unlock quite a few traits in the past couple of weeks, I still don’t have all the traits I need to try this one.

“We want it to be much easier to experiment with and learn new builds as you explore the world of Tyria.”

To unlock the ones I need for the build, I’ll have to complete two zones, capture some spire in EoTM, and run some dungeon path.

“We want it to be much easier to experiment with and learn new builds as you explore the world of Tyria.”

Hah. Yeah.

So what’s the word on this? Are we stuck with it, as is, and if not, how much longer must we wait for some change? What, if anything, anything at all, is going to be done about this?

How about a little transparency here?

I was at my local store recently and swung by the electronics section. Oddly enough, they seemed to be completely out of gem cards. This has been the first time I’ve ever seen them without gem cards in this store. They had TONS for other games on their shelves, just none for GW2. I just found it interesting since I am pretty sure there wasn’t someone buying them out of these cards.

Is this a shift in how Anet/NCSoft are selling gems for the game? The timing of it just seemed a bit off is all, as we are entering into the holiday season and just came off of a free weekend for the game itself. i truly wonder if the trait and other changes that have come about have actually hurt Anet’s bottom line and are now showing an outward effect is all. If so, can we PLEASE get someone to answer us in this thread again.

Once again, a simple “Yes we have a few more changes coming in the next patch”, or “No, we have no more changes coming to Traits in the near future.” Fifty-six pages is simply absurd.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

I was at my local store recently and swung by the electronics section. Oddly enough, they seemed to be completely out of gem cards. This has been the first time I’ve ever seen them without gem cards in this store. They had TONS for other games on their shelves, just none for GW2. I just found it interesting since I am pretty sure there wasn’t someone buying them out of these cards.

…

One possibility that comes to mind is the store may have seen a decrease in gems cards being bought after April so cut back on their orders. But with recent free trials there may be an influx of new players who are now buying gems cards.

Lazuli.2098:

PookieDaWombat.6209:

I was at my local store recently and swung by the electronics section. Oddly enough, they seemed to be completely out of gem cards. This has been the first time I’ve ever seen them without gem cards in this store. They had TONS for other games on their shelves, just none for GW2. I just found it interesting since I am pretty sure there wasn’t someone buying them out of these cards.

…

One possibility that comes to mind is the store may have seen a decrease in gems cards being bought after April so cut back on their orders. But with recent free trials there may be an influx of new players who are now buying gems cards.

Thing is, I’ve NEVER seen them without a stack of those cards, and my wife and I used to buy them somewhat regularly. The display was most recently restocked with all kinds of cards from various games that offer them, and the GW2 gem cards were nowhere to be found. Just seemed odd to me.

going after my third adept trait unlock on my new character and i’m sitting… waiting… waiting for the event. I’m not even 100% sure i’m where i’m supposed to be.
This is a miserable, boring system that makes me feel weak and stupid since I can’t get clear knowledge of when and how to get my trait just by playing the game.

ps- 100% zone completion for a single adept trait oh my god there’s a reason this thread is 56 pages long and has been front page for months. This is ridiculous.

pps- four or five hours later I’ve done it and I don’t even want to look at pve for the next few weeks. ((Map exploration and leveling new characters was my absolute favorite part of this game previously))

Found another build I’d like to try on my NPE ele. Guess what? Can’t. Don’t have four of the necessary traits. Two of them require map completions, one requires my ele to befriend the dredge in WvW, and the other requires the defeat of a Risen High Wizard in Orr.

How does that make experimenting with and learning new builds easier?

Seems to me it makes experimenting with and learning new builds a bore, a chore, and not particularly fun.

So. Any communication about this coming our way anytime soon?

Tachenon.5270:

Found another build I’d like to try on my NPE ele. Guess what? Can’t. Don’t have four of the necessary traits. Two of them require map completions, one requires my ele to befriend the dredge in WvW, and the other requires the defeat of a Risen High Wizard in Orr.

How does that make experimenting with and learning new builds easier?

Seems to me it makes experimenting with and learning new builds a bore, a chore, and not particularly fun.

So. Any communication about this coming our way anytime soon?

My guess is no.

If something is going to be done, they may just slip it into the next patch and it will be something like “Kill this other guy instead of the first one we had you kill, and do this event instead of open this map.” Mind you, this is just based on past updates they’ve made to the trait system without ever communicating it with us in this thread, even though it was in the chamber ready to go so there would have been no conflict with their communication strategy to mention it.

tl:dr: no. we won’t hear a thing it seems.

It really annoys me when I see devs talking all over the place while pointedly ignoring this thread.

Yeah, Jon came in around page 41 to tell us that nobody has been watching and to hop on the hamster wheel again. Recently Gaile came in, copying and pasting Jon’s hamster wheel post.

Its been six months with this garbage.

By now platitudes will not help. If they had communicated throughout this thread, maybe we would tolerate them. By now, however, this issue has well passed its “sell by” date. The only thing that would satisfy me is specifics on what is going to be done and when.

I know fully well that such a thing is not going to happen. Maybe in another 20 pages we will get a non specific platitude from a dev but that is all we will get.

[deleted]

I would prefer a “deal with it” regarding the traits. At least that would be honest.

Gregori.5807:

It really annoys me when I see devs talking all over the place while pointedly ignoring this thread.

Yeah, Jon came in around page 41 to tell us that nobody has been watching and to hop on the hamster wheel again. Recently Gaile came in, copying and pasting Jon’s hamster wheel post.

Its been six months with this garbage.

By now platitudes will not help. If they had communicated throughout this thread, maybe we would tolerate them. By now, however, this issue has well passed its “sell by” date. The only thing that would satisfy me is specifics on what is going to be done and when.

I know fully well that such a thing is not going to happen. Maybe in another 20 pages we will get a non specific platitude from a dev but that is all we will get.

Recently, Anet flat out admitted that there are lucky and unlucky accounts (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/bltc/RNG-as-a-concept-Discuss/first#post4488821). It stung to have my suspicions confirmed but I also feel relief because they admitted it.

I would prefer a “deal with it” regarding the traits. At least that would be honest.

they didnt really admit to unlucky and lucky accounts, via game design/programming. However there will be unlucky and lucky accounts just due to fate. The same way there is that lucky guy who goes to vegas and always comes back 500-2000 dollars richer, there will be players who seem lucky and those who seem unlucky.

See the thing is, that will always happen with random.

The reality is, people have been using random as a means of game design for a long time, without considering what random really means. If you are trying to duplicate a random distribution, you are trying to duplicate the reality that some people will get more out of something, and some people will get less.

As far as the traits, i think they actually know its basically a failure, and they are working on it. however the problem with this is two fold

1) The amount of time it will take them to revamp the system is large, we will be stuck with the current implementation for a long time.
2)when they actually do finish the new version, track record of this last year says it will probably not be good, at best it will less bad, with a lot of problems.

I really think they need A LOT of feedback during the development process, I dont think the current development strategy is working. Every major change seems to bring with it major problems. and then we have to sit and wait months upon months with no real info on how/when/what will be changed.

phys.7689:

stuff about RNG

I am deleting my comment in the hopes of not derailing this thread about traits any further.

Right now, Anet is kittening on the player base. Has been since April.

I want only to know the answer to ONE question:

Why on earth did they think that limiting trait acquisition would allow for improved build experimentation?

Pretty please. Let us get back the original character leveling and trait system.

GuzziHero.2467:

Right now, Anet is kittening on the player base. Has been since April.

I want only to know the answer to ONE question:

Why on earth did they think that limiting trait acquisition would allow for improved build experimentation?

Certainly a dissonance between ideology and behavior, yeah?

So, I’m at the Master point with my ranger, 2 levels shy of 80. There’s some traits I want to get at, but they’re:

• locked behind level 70 story.
• locked behind a dungeon.

The story I’ll eventually get to. It’s bad design, but little trouble in the end.

The dungeon? A friggin’ mess. My options are to pester a guild to run/carry an underleveled (read as “non-80 exotic+ geared”) character, LFG, or buy the trait.

So, for the guild, one guild I’m in is a tad… busy. They might run dungeons, but overall, my times don’t mesh their times.
Soooo.. I had to go farming for guilds on the forums. Moderate success, perhaps, and at least the tools to find a guild were there. ( Thanks to everyone who contacted me. I was quite surprised, by the way. )
Still, this requires pestering someone. Bad design and highly inconvenient for someone with time limits.

LFG? Not while the 2-person vote-kick exists. I mean, seriously, ANet? But, if that’s changed in the past while, correct me for working on outdated info, so I can LFG with more confidence. But GW2-LFG is racing FF14’s dungeon community to the bottom right now. :\

Which means I’m probably going to waste time and money to buy at least one trait for the build I’m working on. And it’s just for that build, which is starting to wane in effectiveness due to what seems to be internal cooldowns on spirits.

tl;dr – Trait system still isn’t fun.

I have about 45 traits unlocked on my necro, my newest toon. What’s missing for now is map completion, most dungeons except for Arah as I completed my personal story, Branded Devourer Queen as that event seems to be bugged and some traits I haven’t come to yet – might never unlock the Trait for Vexas Lab, which was bugged the last time I tried and well yeah, I don’t really like that “quest”.
Anyway, I wouldn’t have made it without Dulfy and that’s kind of the contrahery what they tried with the NPE – I have to know there is a webside outside of GW2 which explains me how to do stuff in GW2. I found Dulfy 3 or 4 months after I started to play and pretty sure someone on my server linked it – I have never seen Dulfy being linked on my now EU server.
So, it is possible to unlock traits but it takes a while and doesn’t work without knowing how. A vague map direction doesn’t really help.

GuzziHero.2467:

sparc.3649:

Between making PVP not enter-able until level 22, to siege disablers (WVW BAND-AID), now this! Seriously ANET!? You’re taking what WAS a great game and “fixing” stuff that’s NOT broke. This one has to REALLY take the cake!

Just saying… you can still enter WvW and EotM using portals and the hotkey. I was in EOTM on a level 2 the other day.

That just makes it that much more senseless. Hiding things, that are still there is more likely create confusion, not reduce it if we are really concerned about “new players”.

Skill Point challenges are map hidden and disabled unless another player has already initiated a skill point encounter, then the under-level player can get credit.

Vistas are map hidden but achievable.

Many gather nodes were removed in addition to being map hidden…but entirely usable…

It’s a confusing inconsistent muddled mess that was perfectly fine before ANet changed it!

Kuldebar.1897:

GuzziHero.2467:

sparc.3649:

Between making PVP not enter-able until level 22, to siege disablers (WVW BAND-AID), now this! Seriously ANET!? You’re taking what WAS a great game and “fixing” stuff that’s NOT broke. This one has to REALLY take the cake!

Just saying… you can still enter WvW and EotM using portals and the hotkey. I was in EOTM on a level 2 the other day.

That just makes it that much more senseless. Hiding things, that are still there is more likely create confusion, not reduce it if we are really concerned about “new players”.

Skill Point challenges are map hidden and disabled unless another player has already initiated a skill point encounter, then the under-level player can get credit.

Vistas are map hidden but achievable.

Many gather nodes were removed in addition to being map hidden…but entirely usable…

It’s a confusing inconsistent muddled mess that was perfectly fine before ANet changed it!

Is this thread about traits or NPE?
I think the NPE doesn’t really hinder new players only older players who really want to do PvP, the rest is something most people can live with (if they’re willing to admit it) – the trait changes effect all of us.

Jana.6831:

Is this thread about traits or NPE?
I think the NPE doesn’t really hinder new players only older players who really want to do PvP, the rest is something most people can live with (if they’re willing to admit it) – the trait changes effect all of us.

Why are you talking about the NPE, this thread is about Traits, please stick to the topic!

So far, I’ve only found one way that makes the new Trait system … somewhat bearable.

> Speed level to 80 using EOTM, which saves up enough badges and gold for an exotic armour set; weapons can be gotten with excess gold.
> Systematically unlock traits based on their location.

At level 80, unlocking traits would be trivial (for the most part). Some of them will still take time, but at least it won’t be difficult when properly geared. The problem is, at level 80, you’ll have no traits unlocked, so you’ll be severely kitten until you start unlocking traits.

The method is still flawed.

If the intention was to give an incentive to do varied content for a specific purpose, there are much better ways of doing so than creating a trait unlock system. Having the alternative purchasable guide is also not a solution that improved upon the system, since it costs 43g and 360 skill points to unlock everything that way.

I would be fine if the total cost was 20g (attainable for any level 80), with the skill point requirement only needed for unlocking the ability to purchase particular tier of traits. For instance:

10 skill points – unlock ability to purchase adept trait guides
30 skill points – ditto for master trait guides.
50 skill points – ditto for grandmaster trait guides.

Grandmaster XIII – only unlocked through doing content in Orr – which is actually not that bad since there’s always a group doing the necessary temple events for 4 of the 5 GM traits, and the one sunken treasure only requires spotting the treasure.

Once you’ve unlocked the ability to purchase a tier of trait guides, the guides themselves should only cost gold.

90 skill points is attainable through normal gameplay and some level of map completion. Alternatively, remove the skill point requirement altogether and make the trait guides only require gold – reducing the total cost to less than half.

Rashy.4165:

So far, I’ve only found one way that makes the new Trait system … somewhat bearable.

> Speed level to 80 using EOTM, which saves up enough badges and gold for an exotic armour set; weapons can be gotten with excess gold.
> Systematically unlock traits based on their location.

At level 80, unlocking traits would be trivial (for the most part). Some of them will still take time, but at least it won’t be difficult when properly geared. The problem is, at level 80, you’ll have no traits unlocked, so you’ll be severely kitten until you start unlocking traits.

No, it isn’t trivial at level 80 and your method has got some flaws: There are 5? traits which are only obtainable by doing personal story quests, that takes time and one also gets a lot of exp, so powerleveling in EotM is a method but not the best method – combining it with personal story might be.
Also as I’ve stated somewhere in this thread: My mesmer for example is pure knights, she has got few traits unlocked and in any way nobody would really want me in their party when doing a dungeon. Same goes for my necro who is full zerker but.. necro. So even at level 80 not trivial, there are a lot of factors which make traithunting difficult – another of them is wvw – I do it all the time, so I don’t mind waiting for the dredge, frogs, ogres or grub, but I can imagine that it’s really exhausting for someone who doesn’t play wvw regularly.

Jana.6831:

No, it isn’t trivial at level 80 and your method has got some flaws: There are 5? traits which are only obtainable by doing personal story quests, that takes time and one also gets a lot of exp, so powerleveling in EotM is a method but not the best method – combining it with personal story might be.
Also as I’ve stated somewhere in this thread: My mesmer for example is pure knights, she has got few traits unlocked and in any way nobody would really want me in their party when doing a dungeon. Same goes for my necro who is full zerker but.. necro. So even at level 80 not trivial, there are a lot of factors which make traithunting difficult – another of them is wvw – I do it all the time, so I don’t mind waiting for the dredge, frogs, ogres or grub, but I can imagine that it’s really exhausting for someone who doesn’t play wvw regularly.

The method is still flawed.

I already know it’s flawed. The method is bearable, and may be better combined with other methods, but it’s still flawed because the system is flawed.

The only real benefit of EOTM leveling is that you don’t need to worry about having traits while leveling. Normal PvE leveling would be slower without traits, and unlocking them as you go would be cumbersome.

Either way, I’m not suggesting it as a method that will work with the new trait system. I can’t really find any other method that makes the new trait system work (aside from forking over 43g and 360 skill points).

The biggest problem is that to get your whole character this goes from a journey of growth to a checklist of chores before you can actually grow and experiment.
I’m being forced to level up faster than I want to in order to do different things in the game. It seems that’s what anet wants now, linear everything and to screw up what made the game fun to begin with. /upset grumbling

Yes, I get that this is the best method for you, sorry if it sounded as if I didn’t acknowledge that you were talking about your personal preferences. I disagreed with that at level 80 getting traits is trivial and my personal preference would be doing the story while leveling up for above reasons.

I actually leveled my necro almost purely in pve and it worked without traits, didn’t take me any longer than with my other newer characters who were mostly leveled in EotM, but then again I did the story and it never takes me long to get a character to 80 anyway. My necro had been leveled under NPE which was pretty helpful to me as the free gear helped a lot as I didn’t need to do EotM to get gear for my level.

If one isn’t into wvw, EotM, dungeons (for various reasons, like wrong gear, wrong class, no guild) and personal story it’s about 20 traits one misses out on, no matter the level.

“We want it to be much easier to experiment with and learn new builds as you explore the world of Tyria.”

Please either revise this statement or revert back to the old trait system where as experimenting and learning new builds was possible. With the way the traits are now, this statement is false and SO untrue!

Decided to try a new build, and after spending 4 or 5 gold and a but load of skill points, it didn’t work out. This is much easier HOW???? Please explain!

Still waiting for traits to be fixed. I don’t want to be forced to do areas of the game I dislike just so I can unlock fundamental gameplay mechanics. Nor can I afford to spend the gold AND skill points (which are already used for unlocking skills!).

6 months of community being in complete agreement, that the new trait system is complete kitten. I mean seriously GW2 community has not seen such an unified opinion on any other feature in game… yet we see 6 months of Anet completely ignoring this terrible issue. Honestly, I am lost for words… I can’t really begin to understand why Anet is treating this the way they are.

The attitude Anet is showing here on this matter is on par with terrible, ignorant South Korean MMORPG developers. Did you really want to be in that company Anet?!

You used to be so much better…

also this is the only forum that has over 100k + views with almost 3k replies
over 6 months
we are ignored completely

i guess the only way to get their attention is
everyone posts a forum and ask them to change the trait system with the same title same content.
and soon when the whole dicussion board is covered by all the same posts
they will start to panic and do something about it

and i will be banned perminantly
they already deleted my 3-4 replies.. saying they had no real value….
cos i “accused” them for being ignorant and dont give a kitten about players

I gave up on this game and just started playing Archeage yesterday. In Archeage your “class” is comprised of 3 skillsets of your choosing, from a pool of about 10 skillsets. That means there’s about 120 different classes (120 different combos of 3 skillsets). Guess what? You can swap out skillsets at any time in town by talking to a priestess lady for a very fair small fee. THAT’s actually player freedom.

also this is the only forum that has over 100k + views with almost 3k replies
over 6 months
we are ignored completely

i guess the only way to get their attention is
everyone posts a forum and ask them to change the trait system with the same title same content.
and soon when the whole dicussion board is covered by all the same posts
they will start to panic and do something about it

and i will be banned perminantly
they already deleted my 3-4 replies.. saying they had no real value….
cos i “accused” them for being ignorant and dont give a kitten about players

Tachenon.5270:

Found another build I’d like to try on my NPE ele. Guess what? Can’t. Don’t have four of the necessary traits. Two of them require map completions, one requires my ele to befriend the dredge in WvW, and the other requires the defeat of a Risen High Wizard in Orr.

How does that make experimenting with and learning new builds easier?

Seems to me it makes experimenting with and learning new builds a bore, a chore, and not particularly fun.

So. Any communication about this coming our way anytime soon?

ANet wanted to bring a bit of GW1 skill capturing to GW2 but since there are like no skills in GW2 traits were the next thing they thought of.. too bad we hardly have any of those as well. It was a bad idea imo.

It worked in GW1 because you could make thousands of builds

kitten .9460:

Tachenon.5270:

Found another build I’d like to try on my NPE ele. Guess what? Can’t. Don’t have four of the necessary traits. Two of them require map completions, one requires my ele to befriend the dredge in WvW, and the other requires the defeat of a Risen High Wizard in Orr.

How does that make experimenting with and learning new builds easier?

Seems to me it makes experimenting with and learning new builds a bore, a chore, and not particularly fun.

So. Any communication about this coming our way anytime soon?

ANet wanted to bring a bit of GW1 skill capturing to GW2 but since there are like no skills in GW2 traits were the next thing they thought of.. too bad we hardly have any of those as well. It was a bad idea imo.

It worked in GW1 because you could make thousands of builds

Ehh, but there were still more than a few Elites which were . . . kind of junk.

Often I’ll see players in PvE who appear intelligent (dodge well, weapon swap to range) but are just hilariously underpowered at their level, and I wonder if their gear is just trash or they didn’t bother unlocking (or are not even using) any of their traits

Scientia.8924:

Often I’ll see players in PvE who appear intelligent (dodge well, weapon swap to range) but are just hilariously underpowered at their level, and I wonder if their gear is just trash or they didn’t bother unlocking (or are not even using) any of their traits

Did create a character after April 15th and unlocked traits with them? Just curious.

Scientia.8924:

Often I’ll see players in PvE who appear intelligent (dodge well, weapon swap to range) but are just hilariously underpowered at their level, and I wonder if their gear is just trash or they didn’t bother unlocking (or are not even using) any of their traits

I’ve noticed this as well. I recently brought a character through 100% map completion and came across A LOT of players who took absurd amounts of time to kill trash mobs for hearts. I mostly figured they were just poorly geared.

Ive tried doing this ‘system’ whilst levelling my new Ele trying the ‘wander around the game technique’ and the result is she is now 80 with only 7 traits to her name.

Sod this and im not going to pay for Traits either when they are essential – im reduced to reviving my level 2 Ranger mule from when I started with a total makeover kit and 20 level scroll just to AVOID all of this.

I don’t even want to play a Ranger I wanted to roll a Necro…

So, 56 pages in to this thread with some recent requests to get SOME kind of feedback, whether it was yes smething might be updated in the next patch or nope, not yet but still looking at options or SOMETHING, and still nothing.

Yet a post about mail doves and conditions get a nod.

Yep. So, anyone else have any “fun” trait stories to share. My test necro hit 80 and is still running around with the hodge podge of traits she’s acquired forcing me to play in a way I don’t care to play until I map open some more and do more of the personal story. I’m frankly terrified to take her into EBG for 3 of those traits as she is right now and have yet to really test her in some of the other higher level areas. Oh well, I guess I should just stop trying to think that I could get any freedom to play this toon the way I’d hoped without dropping serious gold on her, and since farming on my 80s isn’t a fun idea to me…

I bought some traits the other day for my NPE ele. Just didn’t feel like completing Fields of Ruin (again) for a trait I needed for a build I wanted to try. Nothing against Fields of Ruin, other than it’s a zone I’ve already completed on numerous characters, most recently on my sylvari guardian just a few weeks ago before NPE hit. Too much deja vu, ya know. Not good. I also bought one of the Orr-related XIII ones because blah. Really, I wouldn’t mind so much if it was just the XIII ones that were grind/luck/whatever gated.

But every. single. trait?

No one at anet thought this might be a bad idea?

Kuldebar.1897:

GuzziHero.2467:

sparc.3649:

Between making PVP not enter-able until level 22, to siege disablers (WVW BAND-AID), now this! Seriously ANET!? You’re taking what WAS a great game and “fixing” stuff that’s NOT broke. This one has to REALLY take the cake!

Just saying… you can still enter WvW and EotM using portals and the hotkey. I was in EOTM on a level 2 the other day.

That just makes it that much more senseless. Hiding things, that are still there is more likely create confusion, not reduce it if we are really concerned about “new players”.

Skill Point challenges are map hidden and disabled unless another player has already initiated a skill point encounter, then the under-level player can get credit.

Vistas are map hidden but achievable.

Many gather nodes were removed in addition to being map hidden…but entirely usable…

It’s a confusing inconsistent muddled mess that was perfectly fine before ANet changed it!

I’d bet money that they really wanted to level gate the entire wvw and pvp but they either couldn’t figure out how to or no one ever thought about the portals and hotkeys. Its 1/2 assed crap but they aren’t fixing it to be what I think they originally intended because it gives the white knights away to defend stuff. By making it sound like every complaint is really just misinformation. Which is why they won’t come out and say what is working as intended and what is not. They won’t say because they don’t know what they can spin one way or the other.

Edit to add: Honestly it just feels like it was a rushed job removing things off the map, having some of those things still usable but others level gated. All of it just seems rushed and half done with another patch expected to fix it. But that patch never came and arenanet has remained silent about it all. It makes me think they really do not know what they are doing.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

I’d bet money that they really wanted to level gate the entire wvw and pvp but they either couldn’t figure out how to or no one ever thought about the portals and hotkeys. Its 1/2 assed crap but they aren’t fixing it to be what I think they originally intended because it gives the white knights away to defend stuff. By making it sound like every complaint is really just misinformation. Which is why they won’t come out and say what is working as intended and what is not. They won’t say because they don’t know what they can spin one way or the other.

No serious wvw player levels their alt in wvw because of the traits. Had my mesmer as an example early in this thread: I had to do 100% map completion of herathi hinterlands to be able to remove conditions when healing. So even if they would hide it it wouldn’t make a difference, except for EotM which is doable without traits.
In the end what destroys their NPE is the traits as that will likely be the most confusing part for new players as one starts with none and they are hidden behind mechanics one only understands when knowing a website which explains it. So there’s no idicator as to how useful these traits are (and if they’re needed) and how to obtain them.

I wonder what the data on the new trait aquisition is.

How many charachters created after have all their traits ?
How many new players understand trait aquisition well?
How many buy versus hunt?
How long does it take the average player to have traits in every slot/synergistic builds

Jana.6831:

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

I’d bet money that they really wanted to level gate the entire wvw and pvp but they either couldn’t figure out how to or no one ever thought about the portals and hotkeys. Its 1/2 assed crap but they aren’t fixing it to be what I think they originally intended because it gives the white knights away to defend stuff. By making it sound like every complaint is really just misinformation. Which is why they won’t come out and say what is working as intended and what is not. They won’t say because they don’t know what they can spin one way or the other.

No serious wvw player levels their alt in wvw because of the traits. Had my mesmer as an example early in this thread: I had to do 100% map completion of herathi hinterlands to be able to remove conditions when healing. So even if they would hide it it wouldn’t make a difference, except for EotM which is doable without traits.
In the end what destroys their NPE is the traits as that will likely be the most confusing part for new players as one starts with none and they are hidden behind mechanics one only understands when knowing a website which explains it. So there’s no idicator as to how useful these traits are (and if they’re needed) and how to obtain them.

I agree with everything you said. I had guildies that used to level up almost 100% in WvW. I agree that being an up level in WvW is a recipe for failure but if you ran with a zerg you used to level up pretty fast. Now that EotM was introduced and the rewards are so much better than the other WvW maps I see no reason to level in WvW. When you throw on the new trait system that makes it even worse. Now people will grind level 80 in EotM and then grab the few easy to get traits for a build and then buy the rest.

The NPE and new trait system both have made things more confusing. None of it makes sense and nothing has shown that it was worth doing. If it really made a difference they would have been spouting off about how much better the change made things for retention after the free weekend by now.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

The NPE and new trait system both have made things more confusing. None of it makes sense and nothing has shown that it was worth doing.

I couldn’t agree more! Sure doesn’t make sense for the vast majority of the players. BUT, with the China release, makes sense to Anet. Someday, hopefully, they may see this only hurt their game.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

snip

The NPE and new trait system both have made things more confusing. None of it makes sense and nothing has shown that it was worth doing. If it really made a difference they would have been spouting off about how much better the change made things for retention after the free weekend by now.

I just kind of wanted to (again) point out that the trait system is a mess – that was nothing against your post =)

I actually think that the NPE is a good thing for new players but delaying and hiding traits isn’t. I know that I didn’t really care about traits although they have been availlable to me back then, but I accidently chose the then meta build for power rangers 1 month after I started this game and 2 weeks after I hit 80 – so even new players can make something useful out of traits.

Here’s another suggestion: replace the skill points needed to buy the traits with gems. I hear they are really easy and unconfusing to get these days, especially for new players.

…kitten, I just realized that that is still an implementation actually superior to what we currently have.

sad now.

barefootstep.7026:

Here’s another suggestion: replace the skill points needed to buy the traits with gems. I hear they are really easy and unconfusing to get these days, especially for new players.

HAHAHAHA

We do need to keep this thread on topic and constructive.

Any word on a revamp yet ANet? I really feel that you’ve gotten well more than enough feedback to make some decision on how to improve the “new” (really getting old now, isn’t it??) trait system. Yet another patch has come out with no improvements. Why?

Ok… I’ve been avoiding this thread for a while because 4/6 of my characters have been around or high enough level not to be bothered by it.
The unlock mechanism is silly, when you get your second trait point and you only have 1 choice for a trait.
My suggestion would be: give us a list of events we need to do, and as we do it we get to pick the traits unlocked. If we need to do 3 lists for the different tiers so be it. Plus Spvp doesn’t have this problem but once again you play favorites and shoot wvw up levels in the foot.

I have 4 level 80 characters I do not play regularly because they are hamstrung by these trait changes. Any word on this?

I’ve not commented on the new trait acquisition method yet because I wanted to try it for myself….and here are my thoughts.

PRO

• I like the earning of traits. It is a nice throwback to earning skills in GW1
• I like that it shows you where to go to unlock the trait.
• I like that it helps point people to different areas of the game and things to do.

CON

• When I leveled my newest characters, by the time they got to 80 I had almost no traits at all. Even going through 100% map completion, I found I still had to buy traits in order to have any sort of a build.
• While some unlocks have changed, that dang overgrown grub is still in there. No one ever kills that thing. Change it to capturing Stonemist or something that people ACTUALLY do.
• Trait unlocks point you to jumping puzzles, mini-dungeons, dungeons, map completion and wvw….why not include completing a pvp match in order to unlock a trait (Or something that points people to try pvp at least once). If you’re going to include all parts of the game, include ALL parts of the game.

SUGGESTION

• Give the first trait of each tier (in all lines) for free….even if it doesn’t make a “real” build. The rest should remain as unlocks to be earned through the world. This would allow players to have something in their chosen trait lines as they go out and earn the rest. To roam around without traits at all feels very wrong to me.
• Make the unlocks account wide per class. Example: You have a guardian main and have unlocked all of the traits, your new guardian would automatically know these traits because your older guardian “mentored” them in the learning process. If you made a new thief though, the skills would be locked until a thief on that account unlocked those the traits. I know this would not be easy to implement, but it would be a huge QOL improvement.

I have two empty character slots and don’t want to deal with the trait system anymore. I’ve tried it and really dislike not being able to have traits at all (even cruddy ones) until I can discover them myself. It makes doing the content to GET the traits harder when you don’t have any traits at all to start with.

So, it only took like, 30 pages on the gemgate scandal to get some action, yet here we are, 57 pages in to traitgate and… what?

ANet, I honestly would like to know WHY? Maybe we should “revolt” against this en force as well?! It affects our gold. It affects our time.

Time for change here. 7 months past time, actually.