Guild Wars 2

Demonwarrior.4763:

Using the mystic forge is just another form of gambling. and it’s quite sick to bring this into the game.

Not really. Many Mystic Forge recipes have 100% result rates, they are not gambling.

What is gambling, though, is grinding for rare materials – you spend time killing some enemies hoping they will drop the rare material you need.

Grinders don’t oppose this kind of gambling, of course. But it’s still bad for the game.

The sad thing is, when I see a player in full Arah I have more respect for them than I do for someone that has a Legendary, atleast I know they took to the time to do something hard for it. Not sure why people think that making precursors hard to get skill wise is going to make them common, how many people have full Arah armour?
Edit: This is coming from someone in full Arah and with only the precursor missing (have 450g for it, but it’s raised in price 100g over a few days), and I know that whilst i’ve put alot of effort into getting the money for my precursor and other mats, I haven’t had to show any great skill to do it. I know I feel prouder of full Arah than I will of my legendary.

Red Falcon.8257:

There is no such thing as a legendary “grind” because you’re not meant to grind them, you’re meant to save for them in the very long run – infact, legendaries are merely aesthetic so I don’t see why one would want to grind them.

I totally agree.
I’d consider myself a casual player, and for me getting my legendary is a long-term goal and something special to work towards to.

I hate any sort of grinding – I don’t go out in the world and “farm gold” hitting things for an hour, I don’t go and “farm dungeons” either. I just do whatever I feel like and usually none of that for an extended amount of time because I get bored when things feel tedious. It’s a game and my free time after all.

Initially I thought gathering all the mats for crafting the legendary would probably take me a year or two, which would have been just fine with me.
Now by just having played the game “my way” for a couple months I’m basically watching those objectives complete themselves bit by bit. Several hundred skill points on a character, crafting mats accumulating in my bank, WvW badges piling up etc etc.

For me, crafting a legendary is no grind at all because I refuse to make it one. I see it as my big long-term goal and find it very motivating because there is satisfaction in completing the little steps on the way and having the bigger thing in mind.

I also don’t need an epic story, spectacular this, spectacular that in order to have this feel big and special, because at the end I’ll know and remember the journey it’s been to get there. And at least for me, it won’t be a grindy one but just the fun of having played this game that I love for a long time.

Edit: I’m going after The Bifrost, so 500 Arah shards are also part of the fun. ^^

Velkyn.5168:

I also don’t need an epic story, spectacular this, spectacular that in order to have this feel big and special, because at the end I’ll know and remember the journey it’s been to get there. And at least for me, it won’t be a grindy one but just the fun of having played this game that I love for a long time.

Edit: I’m going after The Bifrost, so 500 Arah shards are also part of the fun. ^^

How can you call doing something a thousand times a “journey” and not a grind? There’s nothing different or unique about doing that vs. everything else in the game. There is nothing about it that makes it “legendary” by any stretch of the definition.

Zeldain.5710:

How can you call doing something a thousand times a “journey” and not a grind? There’s nothing different or unique about doing that vs. everything else in the game. There is nothing about it that makes it “legendary” by any stretch of the definition.

Then point me to all those MMOs where you feel legendary for having gotten an item.
Every single long-term goal in the world requires some degree of repetition.

Every day of our life we repeat some actions; I get up, make coffee and light a cig every morning yet I don’t think my life is a grind – nor I feel the taste of coffee and tobacco in the morning is less legendary because I do so every morning.
I also don’t believe having a good time more than once with my girl is a grind.
Variety is ok but there is nothing wrong with repeating actions that are fun and satisfying.

Dreamer.9072:

The sad thing is, when I see a player in full Arah I have more respect for them than I do for someone that has a Legendary, atleast I know they took to the time to do something hard for it. Not sure why people think that making precursors hard to get skill wise is going to make them common, how many people have full Arah armour?
Edit: This is coming from someone in full Arah and with only the precursor missing (have 450g for it, but it’s raised in price 100g over a few days), and I know that whilst i’ve put alot of effort into getting the money for my precursor and other mats, I haven’t had to show any great skill to do it. I know I feel prouder of full Arah than I will of my legendary.

I personally do not care if it is respected or prestige or anything. I don’t care what others think of my toon. Arah armor, yes a lot of work and all that, but it is not the look I want. I happen to really like the skin on the legendary bow, I need something to work on as a longterm goal. Will it give me prestige? Admirers? Perhaps not. But hey I like it and thats all I need.

I agree Zeefa Im working towards the Dreamer and I could of gone for gear or other things but i wanted to put my time into something I can log on and be like “This is awesome!” and I think a Legendary gives Prestige but sure it might not be as much as certain other items or gear. for example I saw someone with Azureflame they went for that instead of Kudzu as they wanted something that reminded them of Storm bow from GW1 so i mean its all about what you want/like.

Red Falcon.8257:

Zeldain.5710:

How can you call doing something a thousand times a “journey” and not a grind? There’s nothing different or unique about doing that vs. everything else in the game. There is nothing about it that makes it “legendary” by any stretch of the definition.

Then point me to all those MMOs where you feel legendary for having gotten an item.

He said nothing about it feeling Legendary. He said there’s nothing that makes the current Legendary weapons Legendary.

By definition, something that is Legendary usually has some sort or story attached in how they were made / gained:

• Excalibur was pulled out of the stone / given by the Lady in the Lake, depending on the story.
• Naegling was gained by Beowulf when he slayed Grendel and his mother.
• Longinus was supposedly the spear that pierced Christ’s side.
• Caladbolg was supposedly able to cleave hills and left a rainbow trail.

And then we got fictional weapons:

• The Elder Wand was supposedly crafted by Death.
• Vorpal Sword, which was use to slay the Jabberwocky
• Narsil, which cut the One Ring from Sauron’s finger.

As it stands in game, the level 6 accessory Pyre Fierceshot’s Arrow has more history than the current Legendary weapon (save for maybe The Flameseeker Prophecies shield).

The majority of people aren’t asking to make it easier. We’re asking that they actually have a story, and that it isn’t so dependant on gold and RNG.

Zeldain.5710:

Velkyn.5168:

I also don’t need an epic story, spectacular this, spectacular that in order to have this feel big and special, because at the end I’ll know and remember the journey it’s been to get there. And at least for me, it won’t be a grindy one but just the fun of having played this game that I love for a long time.

Edit: I’m going after The Bifrost, so 500 Arah shards are also part of the fun. ^^

How can you call doing something a thousand times a “journey” and not a grind? There’s nothing different or unique about doing that vs. everything else in the game. There is nothing about it that makes it “legendary” by any stretch of the definition.

I call it a journey because I don’t log into the game and plan to grind a certain amount of xyz. I log in and have fun with friends and guildies and whatever I do, I also get things out of it that add to my overall progress on getting the legendary weapon. And those fun times are what I remember fondly and will most likely think of symbolized in the achievement of that shiny weapon some day, too.

Running dungeons I simply like or haven’t seen or fully completed yet, helping friends achieve their goals or complete their dungeon sets, playing WvW together, leveling alts.. whatever I end up doing is fun and good times with people in a fun game in first place.

It doesn’t feel repetitive to me because while at the end I might have run a hundred dungeons in order to earn gold, it’s not a grind with a set purpose but just a result of time “naturally” spent in the game. Doing whatever I feel like and enjoy at that moment, without letting any of that get boring or tedious. No “I spent a whole weekend running Arah in order to ‘farm’ my 500 tokens”. I just don’t do that.

The epic or legendary feeling for me is simply in knowing what a mamooth task it is to collect all these things, and that it isn’t something to complete on one weekend but a long journey. Basically a collection of fun memories and little adventures shared with friends in all sorts of aspects of this game.

In the end I guess it’s really what you make of it…
I’m going to look at my Bifrost some day and think about what I did in order to get it, where I went, who was there and what happened, what we laughed and raged about. That’s much more epic to me than any pre-made quest chain would possibly be that just tells the same story to everybody anyway.

Velkyn.5168:

Running dungeons I simply like or haven’t seen or fully completed yet, helping friends achieve their goals or complete their dungeon sets, playing WvW together, leveling alts.. whatever I end up doing is fun and good times with people in a fun game in first place.

It would be good if you could get all components for Legendaries doing that. And, to say the truth, you can get many of them just by playing the game, without grind. Those are the parts of the Legendaries that ArenaNet has done right.

Some other parts cannot be earned through common play. You are not going to get Charged Lodestones playing the way you do. You won’t find yourself with almost 500 globs of ectoplasm unless you focus on earning them. You won’t get 250 of all T6 materials just by playing casually.

And even if you were to get all of those playing the game normally… It would be very underwhelming. Earning a Legendary shouldn’t be a matter of just playing a bit every day for a few years; using an example above, the One Ring in Lord of the Rings wasn’t something dealt with after Frodo spent every day tending to the Shrine. Those items sould have lore, be part of a fun task, almost small events by themselves.

Erasculio.2914:

Some other parts cannot be earned through common play. You are not going to get Charged Lodestones playing the way you do. You won’t find yourself with almost 500 globs of ectoplasm unless you focus on earning them. You won’t get 250 of all T6 materials just by playing casually.

And even if you were to get all of those playing the game normally… It would be very underwhelming. Earning a Legendary shouldn’t be a matter of just playing a bit every day for a few years; using an example above, the One Ring in Lord of the Rings wasn’t something dealt with after Frodo spent every day tending to the Shrine. Those items sould have lore, be part of a fun task, almost small events by themselves.

To the first part, I do believe it is quite possible, seeing what amount of stuff I have already accumulated during the past few months. Like I said, I am fine with the idea of this whole thing taking a year or two, playing the way I do. Feels just right to me.
(Charged Lodestones can also be created via mystic forge from charged cores etc).

I agree that it would be nice to have more individual lore and background for each weapon, can never have enough lore in my opinion. But personally I really don’t need it in order to have this feel special and I’m kind of glad that there isn’t a mandatory quest chain to play through at this point because I’m not into that kind of thing and don’t enjoy scavenger hunts and the like.. but again, I see your point and more lore and story sure wouldn’t hurt.

Red Falcon.8257:

Again with this?

There is no such thing as a legendary “grind” because you’re not meant to grind them, you’re meant to save for them in the very long run – infact, legendaries are merely aesthetic so I don’t see why one would want to grind them.
Also, if they didn’t require a lot of time to aquire they would lose the point of being legendaries.

If you decide to grind 25 hours a day for something that’s just aesthetic you’re really messed up.

Can’t save for something over the very long run when the trend lines between average gold intake and precursor price are rapidly diverging.

Anyone who feels “special” with a legendary in their current state needs to ask sane people what they think.

Whenever I see a legendary in gw2, i think “gold buyer”, whereas, even in the dark regions of WoW, at least someone with a legendary has to have:
A – a supportive guild
B – the capacity to take their tongue off a frozen flagpole while in combat
C – experience in most of endgame

I look with disdain on people who have legendaries in this game because it involves zero skill, and either insanely good luck (of getting one of the “lucky” accounts with anti-dr) or a fat wallet.

plasmacutter.2709:

Anyone who feels “special” with a legendary in their current state needs to ask sane people what they think.

Whenever I see a legendary in gw2, i think “gold buyer”, whereas, even in the dark regions of WoW, at least someone with a legendary has to have:
A – a supportive guild
B – the capacity to take their tongue off a frozen flagpole while in combat
C – experience in most of endgame

I look with disdain on people who have legendaries in this game because it involves zero skill, and either insanely good luck (of getting one of the “lucky” accounts with anti-dr) or a fat wallet.

Sadly right Legendary wepons are no longer a badge of achievment.

Sure there are people out ther that worked hard to get thiers but when you can get the ultimate achievment in game buy droping your credit card down it becomes about as Legendary as a fluffy hat in maple story

Sure legendary acquisition is technically optional, however, it is a major goal after reaching level 80. So realistically speaking nearly everyone will go after.

Now, I agree that end game goals should take fairly large ammounts of time to acquire but not at the current proprotion. Right now you could level all characters in the same time, if not less, than acquire a legendary.

There are several issues that make this process more boring and frustrating than rewarding. In the end one may feel like just putting a tick next to his check-list and move on not enjoying his reward as much.

Like it was pointed out previously, legendary weapons should have more lore and world exploration input. Generally speaking, right now players are focusing on the TP too much.

IMO, just as Orr was rushed to some extend so was the process of legendary acquisition. Some poor mechanics implementation IMO.

P.S. What would make this more unique, would be so that each character can only acquire ONE legendary weapon. This could have story/lore behind it and could branch of in different directions for different weapon.

Dreamer.9072:

The sad thing is, when I see a player in full Arah I have more respect for them than I do for someone that has a Legendary, atleast I know they took to the time to do something hard for it.

loled in mmorpgs ive played if i ever admired someone or thought he had prestige was because being good at PvE and mainly in PvP too…not because what was he wearing or using…and in PvP if he was using a bop vs draconic bows (any lineage 2 players will know what iam talking about) which means using lower tier gear than other person and yet completely obliterating him/them…i guess i would admire that…not what they wear.

I think i only admired one guy, and was in Lineage 2 long time ago, was a mystic muse which was able to beat people and didnt require to be feeded for be hero (again only a L2 player would know what iam talking about) was nice player.

Probably because i dont enjoy barbie dress games…i like to beat stuff (pve) and beat people (pvp), i could careless if someone looks prettier than me in the game, because i know iam an alluring gentleman in rl.

TheDaiBish.9735:

Red Falcon.8257:

Zeldain.5710:

How can you call doing something a thousand times a “journey” and not a grind? There’s nothing different or unique about doing that vs. everything else in the game. There is nothing about it that makes it “legendary” by any stretch of the definition.

Then point me to all those MMOs where you feel legendary for having gotten an item.

He said nothing about it feeling Legendary. He said there’s nothing that makes the current Legendary weapons Legendary.

By definition, something that is Legendary usually has some sort or story attached in how they were made / gained:

• Excalibur was pulled out of the stone / given by the Lady in the Lake, depending on the story.
• Naegling was gained by Beowulf when he slayed Grendel and his mother.
• Longinus was supposedly the spear that pierced Christ’s side.
• Caladbolg was supposedly able to cleave hills and left a rainbow trail.

And then we got fictional weapons:

• The Elder Wand was supposedly crafted by Death.
• Vorpal Sword, which was use to slay the Jabberwocky
• Narsil, which cut the One Ring from Sauron’s finger.

As it stands in game, the level 6 accessory Pyre Fierceshot’s Arrow has more history than the current Legendary weapon (save for maybe The Flameseeker Prophecies shield).

The majority of people aren’t asking to make it easier. We’re asking that they actually have a story, and that it isn’t so dependant on gold and RNG.

This^

I never complained to make it easier…

I want a reason to aspire to get it other then farming a dungeon or buying it straight off the AH.

Theres nothing legendary in that.

Slander, Meteorlogicus has history! It has been used to dictate whither or not it was going to rain that day for generations! To heck with just guessing by looking at the clouds!

garraeth.3267:

You can grind until your fingertips bleed.

Or you can be smart about it and have your legendary…well, last week.

Why? The only thing about them is the shines that are totally superfluous. No improved stats, just ages wasted getting comps to flush down the Toilet for a skin. When the Legendaries also have legendary stats, then they will be worth my time.

Course, I haven’t seen a Legendary I’d want yet so…. :P

Sleel.8365:

garraeth.3267:

You can grind until your fingertips bleed.

Or you can be smart about it and have your legendary…well, last week.

Why? The only thing about them is the shines that are totally superfluous. No improved stats, just ages wasted getting comps to flush down the Toilet for a skin. When the Legendaries also have legendary stats, then they will be worth my time.

Course, I haven’t seen a Legendary I’d want yet so…. :P

I actually prefer the precursor skins to the legendary ones.

They look better period, and are great for trolling. (for every precursor, there is a regular named exotic with the same skin, and they’re usually cheap)

Linking two threads so to speak, was following the precourser price thread in the BLT forum and thinking about this one as well.

Is all the work being done to remove botters and gold sellers from the game just undermined by people who go the pay to win route ( note some not all i dont have on my flame kittenant undies )

What else is there really to buy in game apart from seasonal skins or a few gold to craft up an alt.

Most precoursers are 500g+ now, well except for disco stu’s, a legendary 4 times that,are we caught in a cycle where Anet wants us to buy gems to finace our legedary drive, wants to nerf any way of gaining more than a copper and an old bone out of pve to kill off the bots and traps the player in the middle?

Account bound legendaries precoursers for sale on an NPC for 500 account bound daily tokens the bottom falls out of the gold selling market no need for DR, play the way you like OMG its starting to sound like GW2

cargan.5689:

Linking two threads so to speak, was following the precourser price thread in the BLT forum and thinking about this one as well.

Is all the work being done to remove botters and gold sellers from the game just undermined by people who go the pay to win route ( note some not all i dont have on my flame kittenant undies )

What else is there really to buy in game apart from seasonal skins or a few gold to craft up an alt.

Most precoursers are 500g+ now, well except for disco stu’s, a legendary 4 times that,are we caught in a cycle where Anet wants us to buy gems to finace our legedary drive, wants to nerf any way of gaining more than a copper and an old bone out of pve to kill off the bots and traps the player in the middle?

Account bound legendaries precoursers for sale on an NPC for 500 account bound daily tokens the bottom falls out of the gold selling market no need for DR, play the way you like OMG its starting to sound like GW2

Depends on how many tokens you get a day.

If you get 1 token a day you may as well just hit the stores for your next MMO now and not bother.

Zeldain.5710:

It isn’t fun at all. It’s a terrible failure at content creation… there’s no context for the legendaries, there’s no story. Just grind — grind of Asian proportions, 10x worse than anything World of Warcraft ever had.

Ditto. I quit Aion after two years while waiting for Gw2 release. The endless gear grind and broken RNG for some players (inc me) was causing more frustration and anguish than joy.
Some enjoy the grind, have more luck with RNG, don’t work or have other commitments in real life and can play 24/7.
That game companies promote this kind of play is cause for deep concern with the ensuing possibilities for serious psychological and physical outcomes.
As for buying precursors, the Korean market expects to buy everything, hence the massive rise of RMT companies. This is big business in Asia for a reason and every Mmo that copies the same game model will have the same problems in controlling them.
Where did game designers forget that games are supposed to be fun for all, not endless grinds for something always out of reach. There’s other ways to provide incentives, it just takes a little more thought than following the same worn out formulas.

plasmacutter.2709:

Depends on how many tokens you get a day.

If you get 1 token a day you may as well just hit the stores for your next MMO now and not bother.

I guess that is some thing for discussion but 1 a day 20 for a monthly and being able to say Ok 10 months from now i will have my precourser i can plan out all the other bits and have a goal.
Rather than 10 months from now i will have saved 400g and my precourser is now 1000g to buy and im further behind than when i started.

Grinding for legendaries can be fun, if you can see that you are progressing towards your goal. With RNG/DR always lurking about it is too unpredictable to tell how much progress you have done.

I am temped to begin my legendary but when I look at what is required, and specificaly how to get it, I calculate the potential time needed and honestly, I would much rather spend this time doing other things.

“I know its optional…”

Zeefa.3915:

I personally do not care if it is respected or prestige or anything. I don’t care what others think of my toon. Arah armor, yes a lot of work and all that, but it is not the look I want. I happen to really like the skin on the legendary bow, I need something to work on as a longterm goal. Will it give me prestige? Admirers? Perhaps not. But hey I like it and thats all I need.

That was very well said, and if everyone heeded that, there’d be no more of these back-and-forth threads. Do it (or don’) for YOURSELF, and give less than a kitten about what others think.

Call it a journey, a grind, whatever. It’s a means to an end, and nobody is forcing you down that road one way or another.

PRO TIP: Finish your clovers FIRST (never do 10 at a time)…this gives you reasonably priced mats for the gift of might and gift of magic.

Get that precursor LAST. I would even go so far as to wait for the scavenger hunt. The only 2 parts I really dislike about legendary weps are the lodestones (just a money sink, imo) and the badges of honor.