Guild Wars 2

Good list. Agree with all your points, some are a bit more cynical than you might suspect. For example, the three currency system has been carefully designed to prevent the perception of pay-to-play with most of what karma buys being soul or account bound and karma being only earned through play.

Gems must exist separate from coin because it gives ArenaNet the ability to control the market. $10 USD may buy your 32s in game coin when the gates first open and nearly two million people are on-line. Moving forward as the launch rush crowd has died down ANet needs a way to entice the ones who are playing still to spend more in the cash shop to make up. It’s simply math really, Instead of having 100,000 people all spending $10 a month in the gem store suddenly yo only have 50,000 people and you need them to spend $20 a month in the gem store to keep the income current.

How do you do this? You make it so $10 USD now buys 62s instead of 32 and next week when only 32,000 are playing you increase the value of gems even more and make it so $10 USD buys 80s, etc…

This is what they have created. I don’t have a problem with it as it gives us reason to watch the market and it allows them to get some stable income from the gem store.

SamTheGuardian.2938:

Good list. Agree with all your points, some are a bit more cynical than you might suspect. For example, the three currency system has been carefully designed to prevent the perception of pay-to-play with most of what karma buys being soul or account bound and karma being only earned through play.

Gems must exist separate from coin because it gives ArenaNet the ability to control the market. $10 USD may buy your 32s in game coin when the gates first open and nearly two million people are on-line. Moving forward as the launch rush crowd has died down ANet needs a way to entice the ones who are playing still to spend more in the cash shop to make up. It’s simply math really, Instead of having 100,000 people all spending $10 a month in the gem store suddenly yo only have 50,000 people and you need them to spend $20 a month in the gem store to keep the income current.

How do you do this? You make it so $10 USD now buys 62s instead of 32 and next week when only 32,000 are playing you increase the value of gems even more and make it so $10 USD buys 80s, etc…

This is what they have created. I don’t have a problem with it as it gives us reason to watch the market and it allows them to get some stable income from the gem store.

I actually have 0 problems with the gem system! I’ve bought quite a few gems myself.

I agree with most every point, although I have no issues with combat and dodging, it’s an MMO, I expect crap combat though.
If this game had a sub fee I’d never have even considered buying it.
Since there is no sub, I can’t be too hard on AN. It’s one of the best MMOs out there and it’s B2P so..
I have no reason to log in anymore though, the game is boring to me, no direction, no point, nothing to strive for.

DieScream.6972:

I agree with most every point, although I have no issues with combat and dodging, it’s an MMO, I expect crap combat though.
If this game had a sub fee I’d never have even considered buying it.
Since there is no sub, I can’t be too hard on AN. It’s one of the best MMOs out there and it’s B2P so..
I have no reason to log in anymore though, the game is boring to me, no direction, no point, nothing to strive for.

This is my issue as well. I log in and I’m just…bored. I don’t wanna PVP or WvW. I want to do CoE to get that sweet looking gear but no one wants to. Once I’m in the dungeon, the dungeon and gameplay mechanics are generally unfun. I go around the world, doing stuff. Nothing seems rewarding. Its just not a fun a game for me.

Dungeons are terribly boring. The most boring experience I’ve had in a game in probably 10 years. Couple that with the utter lack of a sense of reward you have a guaranteed fail.

Sadly, I still find myself agreeing with most of the OP’s post.

And like the OP, these are only my views – not meant to cause offence……………………I’m happy that many seem to enjoy the more casual approach of GW2.

For myself though, I like immersing myself in PvE – and compared to GW1 (or any other game such as NWN, Baldurs Gate, Icewind etc), GW2 fails miserably on the PvE side.

It’s still a grind (however you wrap it up) playing PvE. I was curious to see how GW2 would be, given that lack of grind was heavily sold as I recall.
But instead of having any real back story, it just seems to be completing heart events or killing the odd horde with other players (who may as well be game generated given the lack of interraction anyway).

I think I’ve figured out this game isn’t for me before anyone else says it

Just a shame that after 4-5 years of development, there wasn’t more to cater for fans of the original Guild Wars (at least for those of us who loved the PvE elements).

I just find myself hoping that Anet either release more instalments of the original Guild Wars (which is unlikely).
Or perhaps release a paid update to GW2 that allows more PvE elements (GW1 style including combat and skills) that many of us GW1 players miss.

DieScream.6972:

I agree with most every point, although I have no issues with combat and dodging, it’s an MMO, I expect crap combat though.
If this game had a sub fee I’d never have even considered buying it.
Since there is no sub, I can’t be too hard on AN. It’s one of the best MMOs out there and it’s B2P so..
I have no reason to log in anymore though, the game is boring to me, no direction, no point, nothing to strive for.

:) If GW2 had a sub fee, I’d have cancelled it pretty quickly………………………..yet ironically, I would have paid a sub fee for GW1 (and still would if it was still being developed).

I just wanted to point out you said the game was made with horizontal scaling system and armors make marginal difference. Then you criticize magic find items needing to sacrifice effectiveness. I mean the effectiveness trade off cant be that much if even you admit its a horizontal system and armors are only marginal difference

“Armor rarity disparity – The ArenaNet team promised before launch that all armor would be created equal. Instead, we now have masterwork, rare, and exotic armor. They all have different stats. This means if you have level 80 exotic armor, you are better equipped (albeit marginally) than someone with level 80 masterwork armor. For a game that is designed with a horizontal scaling system, this also doesn’t make much sense.

Magic Find armor – There is no reason to include Magic Find items in this game. One of the biggest flaws of this system is that players need to sacrifice effectiveness to gather drops. Why this design? Is it to create a challenge for players who want to farm? When players equip Magic Find armor in dungeons, they are detrimental to the team. It baffles me that ArenaNet thought this was a good idea."

juiceman: Magic Find armor != armor rarity disparity.

These are two completely unrelated things. You lose stats by using Magic Find armor. Period. I’ll let you figure it out.

I strongly agree with what he had to say in regards to game design and dungeons….This game promised soo much more and they even made soo many bold claims about how Guild wars 2 wouldn’t be a grind-fest yet this game ended up having a grind just as bad a Korean mmo’s…atleast World of Warcraft let you gear your character with a reasonable cap

Its sad to see how Arenanet ruined this game because of their lust for punishing “bots” and so called “exploiters”

ooh yeah…I like they “optimised” the game for medium/ low end pc’s…..wouldn’t hold my breathe for that to happen anytime soon

pretty much agree with most of this.

wvwvw is a mess
dungeon runs are not rewarding

bored at this point

Gonna agree with OP here with an extra emphasis on combat.

I agree with most of the OP. To me, this game feels like having on your scuba gear, looking out on a beautiful ocean, only to realize its a foot deep. Feels like a co-op console port instead of an MMO.

@dimgl, well written and thought out post. Ignore the white knights. Constructive criticism is a healthy thing.

Sorry but am SO MUCH happy with this game

Thank You ArenaNet!

Trixa.5237:

Sorry but am SO MUCH happy with this game

Thank You ArenaNet!

It’s possible to enjoy the game and acknowledge good criticism at the same time.

People doesn’t seem to realize that tokens buy end game armor. Is pretty much having all the tier gear with different looks so people can actually wear what they like with high end stats. Crafting is a great way to gear and level, over all comparing it to WoW is like comparing an orange to a lemon. Dungeons, some are fun some have stupid mechanics, rewards from chest are garbage but you get a decent amount of Karma, money and tokens for completing them. Tokens become 80 exotic armor or weapons. Karma can become crafting ingredients, any level gear and another set of choices for exotic armor. Gold become the normal currency of trading, over all this is not a problem. Every game got different currencies this is so people can obtain gear the way they want. So over all all comments on dungeons not rewarding enough is B.S. Same goes to crafting, not only do craft end game stats but you get to pick the stats that are best for you.

Magic finding gear is there for people who wants to farm, if you aren’t a farmer then ignore it. Many of my guildmates go crazy over magic finding, they love getting ectos and sharing with the guild. Me, I got 0% magic find.

Story started good, except asura that one sucked from the start, yet reality is a decent story. Over all the story got it’s ups and down, yet the mayor down is the fact that it turns from a personal character story into a Game story near the mid point.

Combat is by far the best I seen. If you are a competitive person, you will love this, if you are a classic MMO player who wants like 32 keys or 5 macros to lol with a ranged class then you will not like this game, things are close to very balanced. Specially in world vs world and pve, the SPvP and Tpvp needs some work but yeah.

Also Anet is not staying alive because of no monthly fee, they staying alive cause the mayority of the pvp players enjoy this game, also many people who are bored of the classic MMO enjoy it. If you are a huge fan of old school grind then by all means people should go for it.

Comments on your first post:

I’ve never played a game where the crafting system wasn’t complete rubbish. GW2 is no different; I do it to get an XP boost, make useful food or bags, but I’m not that interested in playing ‘Cottage Industries Simulator v2.0’. At least I haven’t spent a billion gold in order to train some fool up so he can make me a lampshade or something (yup, looking at you, “Master Blacksmith” in Diablo III).

I don’t understand magic find items in this game either and don’t bother with it, seems more like an ARPG thing to me. I don’t see GW2 as a heavily loot-based game.

Nobody is forcing you to join more than one guild. I have found a very friendly guild and I’ll stick with it, it’s simply my choice not to join another.

Comments on your second post (combat):

Some trait lines need rethinking and reworking, I agree. The system has sufficient depth for me personally, IMO infinitely more than a ‘typical’ MMO which is right-click, watch animation sequence. One could make the argument that combat in many FPS’s lacks depth – place cursor on target’s head and left-click. Yes that’s a superficial argument which ignores a lot of what gives depth to FPS combat, but the point is so is saying that there’s no depth to GW2’s combat system. I found this comment of yours particularly illuminating and relevant to this matter: “it’s necessary to constantly move in combat”. Thanks heavens for that I’d say. I find it hard to understand why somebody would want to play a game where it is more appropriate to not move when in combat, but different people have different tastes.

I don’t like the downed system much myself. I often just let myself die already.

I have no comments on your last post as I haven’t reached the end game and do not have much dungeon experience. However, I agree that higher level monsters and bosses need to be more interesting than ‘big bullet sponges’, as a general rule regardless of genre of game.

I am very close to loving this game though, despite its flaws of which there are many. It’s still very young and I’m willing to give ANet a bunch of time to slowly improve upon and add to the game. I really like the core mechanics and the world but they’re not for everybody; I would guess they’re not for you.

stonberg.4198:

I have no comments on your last post as I haven’t reached the end game and do not I am very close to loving this game though, despite its flaws of which there are many. It’s still very young and I’m willing to give ANet a bunch of time to slowly improve upon and add to the game. I really like the core mechanics and the world but they’re not for everybody; I would guess they’re not for you.

Wait until you hit so called “endgame”. I and many many others felt exactly like you do until we hit the great wall of Anet at the end.

I feel like this beautiful girl that I fell head over heels over suddenly revealed that he’s really a shemale….

Guy said: >>"Traits may as well be renamed to attributes. The only real reason to use traits is to boost certain stats. "<<

I can’t help but think yer doin’ somethin’ wrong with yer traits, because there are all sortsa useful skills in the trait trees. I got one what poisons things when I steal from em; another what gives boons ta me an’ my allies when I steal; another what hastes me when I kill; another drops caltrops when I dodge; another gives me endurance when I dodge; another lays down a trap when I rez someone … an’ more an’ more what are just useful as hell. I think ya need ta really look at yer weapons an’ skills and make some better decisions ‘bout how yer using yer trait points … ’cause sounds ta me like yer just not doin’ it right.

I agree with some the OP’s post. Things could have been… much less watered out and still appealed to all types.

Combat wise I am disappointed in the dodge roll and auto-targeting… the dodge roll just feels like something to buy a bit of time for your heal to cool down so you can eat hits with you hp while fighting again. Coming from a a player with an action combat gaming history; the dodge roll just feels like a cheap gimmick in Gw2 just to say they have one.

Auto-targeting seems like they are just giving a handicap to players instead of actually making them aim (if even just a bit). I mean all you have to do is aim for the wide side of a barn and it counts as a hit… just very un-involving; they might as well have stuck with their original Guild Wars combat as the “build wars” were much more involving (it was kind of like a card game if you played your “cards” right, aka your skills, you could win).

The combat in Guild Wars 2 just feels like the designers weren’t sure of the direction they wanted to take it.

Oh, and who could forget the bots…

Also, some of the events are just overly simplified (ex. Dragons: spam attack -> feared out of place -> run back and spam attack again); others just have poorly designed mechanics (temple of balthazar; randomly teleports -> everyone’s dead -> balthazar makes troll face).

Funny.
Seems like many of the things you listed are actually things I like a lot.

I REALLY like doing dungeons! It might even be my favorite part of GW2.
I just love running them with random people.
The loot sucks, yes, but I actually never really even paid attention to it because I have fun, get tokens for the stuff I want and sell all the blues and greens to an NPC for Gold.
I was surprised to read that Anet is planning to make the loot better because I already make most of my Gold off dungeons.

I also like how the game tells you to not to pidgeonhole yourself into something.
In GW1 you had builds that only worked in one or two places and nowhere else.
I found it fun for Jade Quarry but aside from that it was a huge hassle managing all the different builds.

I really like that there are many currencies.
Karma can be handed out like candy because it can’t be traded, same with tokens.
This leaves just Gold as something to keep an eye on.

It also means that even if you are dirt poor on Gold you can still get things with Karma and tokens.
No need to save up a ton of Gold for something.

Funny that you think that there are too many weapons (thus skills) and not enough useful ones.
The whole reason GW2 went this route is that it’s easier to balance than GW1, which has even more skills and very few good general use builds.

GW2 just isn’t balanced properly yet, which is why there are useless skills.
They’ll become better over time.
Since they are stuck in their respective professions/slots/weapons they can actually be balanced eventually.

Combat sucks?!
I love the combat! … aside from those huge zergs where you spam 1,1,1,1.
The game scales really poorly when you have more than 5 or so people around.

I also really, really like the downed system.
I like it in L4D, in Borderlands and in GW2.

“If all players are equally viable, why aren’t all healing skills the same across the board?”
I don’t think you are serious. :P

The world bosses could be more interesting… that I agree with.
Story? Uh.
(Spoilers for GW1:)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DxmkAoLC6_4
Sorry, just had to throw it out there.

But yeah I don’t really care much about the main stories of either game.
With that said GW2’s personal story has parts that actually made me feel sad.
In a good way.

I agree on that magic find crap, why on earth did Anet think that was a good idea.

I actually hate all the dodging and poncing around…it’s a cheap mechanic and shows they couldn’t be arsed making more complex systems like aggro, defence, trickier attacks from the mobs than just BAM BAM BAM. Build my chars around being able to take a few hits for this reason :P Rather go play a game with more ways to mitigate damage than cheaply dodging the BAM attacks.

I like the combat system; I’m constantly movin’ in and outa melee with me thief … rollin’, leapin’, dodgin’, hidin’ … keeps it exciting, heck of allot moreso than the fire ’n forget systems most MMOs got.

Jack of Tears.9458:

I like the combat system; I’m constantly movin’ in and outa melee with me thief … rollin’, leapin’, dodgin’, hidin’ … keeps it exciting, heck of allot moreso than the fire ’n forget systems most MMOs got.

It’s actually worse. You’re just getting tricked by the idea you’re doing something fresh (you’re not). You can make combat systems with dodge rolling in it that also have the other mechanics (Tabula Rasa being the pinnacle of good combat never seen since), GW2 didn’t do this right at all.

I agree with your opinion by 99%. The worst thing that can happen to a player GW2 is being level 80 and get exotic equipment. The game offers nothing to do in PVE. Spending money traveling empty maps, or with many people and bots looking for money is not FUN!

The only things I can find myself agreeing with are the points of crafting and the story.

Combat is why I stay. It involves you. It makes you think of combat in a tactical way. I have always hated that other MMO’s made you stay stationary in order to cast something. Where is the fun in sitting there hitting your normal rotations? Why not be involved and dodge that warrior charging at you? I would, but other MMO’s don’t think so.

I saw a few posts ago where someone said that you weren’t doing something right with your traits, and I agree with them. <_< Maybe check the class sections? The traits are a great way to diversify ourselves and build what we want to play (or, really, be able to play the way we want to play when they make every build viable for every class, like they said. (cough) Necro (cough)).

This game is only 2 months old. Sure, some priorities need to be shifted (bug fixes on classes, then balancing, anyone?), but I will be sticking with this game for a long time. ANet is truly a credible company with a good history, but they will need time.

lollie.5816:

It’s actually worse. You’re just getting tricked by the idea you’re doing something fresh (you’re not).

I’m gettin’ tricked inta believin’ I’m havin’ fun? Ya know what? I can live with that … ‘cause at the end of the day, it means I’m still enjoyin’ meself. It isn’ always about whether a thing is new or not, it’s about the packaging (you can boil every computer game quest ever inta “kill, fetch, gather, protect, puzzle” after all) – and I like the way GW2 packages it’s product.

You’ve spoken my mind OP.

What can you say though? It’s a B2P MMO, it’s a good game to drop in on every month or so until you get bored and leave again, no worries.
Sure it has all these flaws and more, but it’s not like GW2 is the kind of game you really get invested in long term anyway.

Game is excellent really. Best combat system out there, with best traits and gearing metagame. Great world, very social game, and with better server systems etc than any other MMO, certainly puts games like WoW SWTOR etc to shame.

So many “viral marketers” on this forum.

Go play something else if you’re a gamer who doesn’t want to play GW2, if you want to hang around this forum and try viral marketing tricks, at least be less obvious about it.

If you are not happy with the game then quit it, here is my cynical answer.

A lot of the issues you complain about are not really issues and just come from the lack of understanding mechanics. Complexity is not the same as depth.

I do think that crafting sucks and they should be recipes that can only be acquire by a few players aka recipes that have the same amount of Work as legendaries.

Synn Dinalt.7251:

DieScream.6972:

I agree with most every point, although I have no issues with combat and dodging, it’s an MMO, I expect crap combat though.
If this game had a sub fee I’d never have even considered buying it.
Since there is no sub, I can’t be too hard on AN. It’s one of the best MMOs out there and it’s B2P so..
I have no reason to log in anymore though, the game is boring to me, no direction, no point, nothing to strive for.

:) If GW2 had a sub fee, I’d have cancelled it pretty quickly………………………..yet ironically, I would have paid a sub fee for GW1 (and still would if it was still being developed).

guild wars 1 would have probably failed IF it did have a sub. Guild wars 1 was a fun game at its time but compared to its competition WoW it was extremely limited and it would have been even more of a niche that it was when compared to WOW.

By that same token, guild wars 2 would have probably be designed to reflect a sub based game aka WOW with dynamic events. Personally, it would have failed also because the people that like WOW would have played it, and JUST like every mmo release after WOW then go back to WOW after a month like they usually do. The truth is a lot of MMO players just want a WOW game with better graphics, even if they wont admit it.

The thing is that at heart GW2 is non linear exploring game. And it does that so much better than any other multiplayer game out there right now, the quality of the environments and for me interaction with them is simply on another level to previous games.

The problems in the game, I reckon, arise from compromises made to appeal to those who like a more competitive gear oriented, progressive, levelling game and these seem somewhat half hearted. Instead they should stick to their vision of making a compelling virtual world, that isn’t a gear farm, since that’s clearly where the bulk of the effort has been made – you don’t make cities such as Divinity’s reach and all those detailed events in five minutes and it’s a pity that some of the game mechanisms tend to encourage you to skip over them.