Guild Wars 2

I’ve found ‘casual’ and ‘hardcore’ most often defined interchangeably as ‘Them’ and ‘Me’ for a varying definition of what constitutes Them and Me.

As far as who Anet is targeting, I think it has less to do with who they target then who’s been coming to the plate when the dinner bell rings. Not to mention that I believe John Smith has a bigger hand in the scheme of things than most people realize.

Snowshadow.3105:

Is GW2 shifting its target group? from casual gamers to hardcore gamers?

One of the most important reasons why I and most of my friends bought this game, is that we thought it was a game not specifically designed for hardcore gamers, but also for casual gamers, that play the game only at the weekend or sometimes after we come home from work. But the recent development of the game makes it nearly impossible for casual players to “keep up” with the other players. I’m going to list a few points that heavily disadvantage casual players in my opinion, hoping to call some attention to the problem. There are a lot of changes that discourage casual gamers:

- Introduction of the ascended gear:
It all started with the fractals which lead to the first ascended equipment available in the game. This first equipment was only available for players that play the fractals quite often. In my opinion too often, because searching for a group in your level became harder and harder the following weeks. I know they fixed part of the problem, but then came the rest of the gear. Assuming, you still hadn’t been able to get to fractals level 10, you got a new possibility of getting the ascended gear, dailies. This – again – kind of solved the problem for players with only one character, so they were at least able to get the best possible equip on one character in about half a year playtime. (I know it’s possible to get it faster, but it’s really hard to do so. I just don’t have time to do them every day.) Let’s not even talk about the stuff you need guild points for and the problems involved with it regarding smaller guilds. Just some days ago, I was able to get the rest of my ascendant gear, even though I’ve been playing this game since it was released. I am still missing the overpriced back piece though.

Yesterday a new patch introduced yet another set of ascended gear. This time it’s getting really ridiculous. You need more than 100Gold to level one profession up to 500 before you can see which resources you need for the gear. I don’t even want to think about the next update that introduces the rest of the stuff.
All this in a game where the developers said there won’t be an item progression system so all players are equally equipped and it’s a skill based game.
I’m really getting tired of trying to get the best equipment in order to keep up with other players, just to realize by now my stuff is outdated once again. Why do I even want to keep up with the other players you might ask? See the point below.

Maybe it shifts no none-existing players? The temporary content is bad for hardcore players because they want to get all there achievements and thats impossible now for anybody with a life (there are many HC players with a life). And for casual it is bad because they also mis out on a lot of stuff. The only group who it is not bad for is for those who really don’t care about it.

The ascended gear has two problems. IT requires crafting and while I loved crafting in some other mmo’s.. loving meaning it was the main thing I did I don’t like it at all in GW2. It’s a boring grind to level 400 now 500 and then you can make what you need. In other mmo’s they usually have some sort of fun craft that rewards you at every level with some fun items and are linked to the none-fun crafts so you level them in the meanwhile. So you have fun leveling. Before not liking crafting was no problem but now it is.
Another problem is the time-gated part of it. Temporary / time-gated content is bad for every game and about every player.

coronaas.4362:

Ichishi.9613:

LFM FotM 10 daily. Min 45 ar, 50+ pvp rank, 60 wvw rank and 10k+ achievement score. Only warriors with GS.

Its that game.

45 ar min? what are you some sort of casual? 55 ar min is the new standard

Well the only time i ask to see 45 AR is in my fotm 48 runs, but thats only because it is REQUIRED by Anet themselves. Other then that i couldnt care less what prof or build your running because 99% of the time you have to have at least half a brain to get to 48.

Also, gs wars kinda suck in high level fractals. I rather have you running mainly a/a or a/m

rjnemer.7816:

coronaas.4362:

Ichishi.9613:

LFM FotM 10 daily. Min 45 ar, 50+ pvp rank, 60 wvw rank and 10k+ achievement score. Only warriors with GS.

Its that game.

45 ar min? what are you some sort of casual? 55 ar min is the new standard

Well the only time i ask to see 45 AR is in my fotm 48 runs, but thats only because it is REQUIRED by Anet themselves. Other then that i couldnt care less what prof or build your running because 99% of the time you have to have at least half a brain to get to 48.

Also, gs wars kinda suck in high level fractals. I rather have you running mainly a/a or a/m

Nope. It is, however, possible you misinterpreted GW2’s “target group” (or did yourself a disservice by beginning with the premise that there is a single one at all).

Well… you’re not competing with anyone for armour still.. Ascended is only PvE armour right? So you’re never going to have to worry about stats really in PvE.

Erasculio.2914:

Snowshadow.3105:

Is GW2 shifting its target group? from casual gamers to hardcore gamers?

I think the way you worded your statement is a bit vague, considering how there are many definitions of “hardcore”. But I agree with your point – I think ArenaNet is changing its target audience.

Before release, ArenaNet said, paraphrasing, “if you like MMOs, you should try Guild Wars 2; if you don’t like MMOs, you REALLY should try Guild Wars 2”, hinting that they were aiming at the players who skewed classic MMO conventions. At release, we got a game filled with content for players focusing on having fun, with all the little bits of world dialogue, all the nice Easter eggs hidden in many out of the way places, and so on; sure, the game had its flaws, but it had a lot of potential to improve and become something truly unique.

Since release, ArenaNet took the game in the opposite direction. They have focused on introducing farming content, be it the second Southsun Cove with 200% Magic Find, or the Queen’s Pavillion, or the invasions. All of those had very shallow events repeated over and over, completely disconnected from the world around them, without the charm or care seen in much of the game at release. This content was not aimed at the players who “don’t like MMOs”; it was aimed at the MMO locusts who want to farm, grind, and exploit.

What probably happened is that ArenaNet noticed the MMO players not only are the majority of their current playerbase, but also the easiest to please. If you don’t have to worry about the quality of the content you build, only that it will give a reward shiny enough, it’s easier to make a game than if you are trying to please a group who wants fun content (and all the subjectivity implied there).

Thus, then, the reversal of GW2’s target audience. Not players who don’t like MMOs, but MMO players who play (farm?) Guild Wars 2. Those are who the game is currently being made for.

This was a very well written post.

ShadowPuppet.3746:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Galtrix.7369:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Galtrix.7369:

90% of the ascended stuff is time-gated so the hardcore players can’t have their ascended items in a day. Instead, by time-gating this content, casual players and hardcore players are on equal footing.

In fact, it isn’t just 90% time-gated on ascended. Almost all content in Guild Wars 2 is time-gated so as to level the playing field for casuals and hardcores.

Guild Wars 2 is still 100% casual. How can I assume that? Well, I’m a hardcore player myself, and I can say that there is absolutely, positively, no hardcore content in this game at this time.

You’re soooo wrong… What kind of so called ‘casual’ have the astronomical amount of gold needed to reach 500 and then actually start crafting the weapon? This isn’t aimed at casuals but grind bots/hardcore crowd.

No… I’m really not wrong. The fact that Anet time-gated almost everything in this game should tell you that they want this to be a casual experience. You could play for half an hour a day and have the money you need in about 3 weeks. My brother barely plays GW2 anymore, and he still has over 120 gold because he plays once every few weeks and doesn’t spend any money.

The problem isn’t that casuals can’t get enough money. Your problem makes it seem like you don’t know how to save money. It’s a l2p issue.

Read Nuka’s post history. People who want the best stuff to come from doing very hard content are not casuals.

For what it’s worth, if you want an Ascended weapon, the implementation is making the game very like a Facebook game. Rather than enticing people to play the game because there are fun things to do, ANet is enticing people to worry about whether they did their laundry list of tasks today. This is an insidious practice used by so-called “social” game designers.

Ascended may not be ANet’s fault. After all, some players demanded carrots. However, the weapon crafting implementation is ANet’s fault. It’s casual friendly only in that a casual can get one eventually. If Nuka had his way, most casuals wouldn’t see one. Other than that, Ascended weapons are not player-friendly — unless the player is borderline addicted to the game and wants to be led around by the nose from one thing to another because he wants to feel like he’s making progress.

Sounds like you have listened to Jonathan Blow, now there is a game designer who gets it.

Actually, I heard about him just last week and have listened to some of his talks. I’ve disliked Facebook games since a friend suggested I try Cityville — maybe two years ago. Having worked in psychology for many years, I knew those practices were manipulative. I’ve found Mr. Blow’s talks interesting, and am gratified to see that someone in the industry understands these things.

coronaas.4362:

IndigoSundown.5419:

If Nuka had his way, most casuals wouldn’t see one.

and they shouldn’t. this should have been gated by higher level fractals to advance further in fractals. Play how you want should not mean get everything just by logging in.

That quote was intended to respond to the assumption that Nuka’s comments about casuals meant he was a casual — and he isn’t. Yes, the fact that anyone can get one (eventually) means that casuals were taken into consideration in the overall design. However, the way to get them is no one friendly — unless you like laundry lists of things to do.