Guild Wars 2

I think that gw2 did a lot about moving the whole industry forward. But AN failed so hard at making a really good game.

But back to the topic. Is there anything that AN can do to fix this game?

Why do I ask that?
First of all: NOT BECAUSE OF ASCENDED GEAR!!! This topic is NOT ABOUT AC GEAR!!! Just wanted to make that clear. And to the real reasons why I think the game is beyond fixable state:
1. Whole world is dead and pointless with exclusion of few farming places.
2. World Bosses are broken (because of so many reasons that it’s really hard to sum it all up).
3. Whole PvE meta is broken (damage over defense, conditions are useless).
4. Dungeons are dead and pointless with exclusion of few farming places.
5. Living World has no story and it’s more about farming something. And is a really good example of the reason why standard MMO quests are not in this game.
6. The game can’t be expanded because it would only spread the community even more and make the world even more dead.
7. Main reason to play PvE now is to farm for AC gear that has no real use (just makes the game even easier).
8. Or to farm Legendary weapons – waste even more time at doing the same thing over and over again without having fun.

To sum it all up: all that what this game is after completing personal story is POINTLESS and really feels like a waste of time. The game has no structure or anything that would keep normal people around.

I’m not sure I’m following. What would be an example of a game which is not pointless? I’m playing games because I think its fun. I have no interest in grinding for legendaries etc. For me, the main problem in this games is that most people I run into are only interested in dungeon speed runs, champion trains and other such nonsense.

ayayyayayayayayayaaaye

I must be honest, after mulling over the “Collaborative Development” topic, I’m starting to lean on ‘no’ as my answer, though I would love to be proved wrong.
The thing that’s starting to creep into my mind with that topic is it feels like they’ve lost control over the game.
They tried to please everyone but now every time they make a change they’ve stepped on someone’s toes.
It feels like there’s no concrete leadership or direction to the game, and the whole collaborating with the players reeks of ‘too many chefs spoil the broth’, especially since these ‘chefs’ are now everyone with conflicting ideas for the game (eg. traditional MMO players want grind vs casuals don’t want grind).
I also think their over reliance on “metrics” drove them into this corner and now they’ve forgotten how to make games being “fun” for the sake of fun.

None of the problems you listed can’t be fixed. Ironically, what makes this game unfixable is Ascended gear — once Pandora’s box is opened, there’s no closing it.

at least on the bottom of pandora’s box there was hope

green plum.7514:

What would be an example of a game which is not pointless?

For example Gw2 to the point when you complete your personal story. As stated in the first post.

Some of your problems would be fixed with the following actions.

Most dungeons and zones are empty because of no worthwhile loot.
Every mob on every zone drops same type of loot, so people find the best zone with most farmable mobs and just stick to it until a better one comes along.

Anet needs to improve the loot table and give good looking armor/weapons that drop from specific dungeons and zones, hence spreading out the playerbase and making every bit of content used.

Do not get me wrong though, i am saying they need to add good looking SKINS to different dungeons and zones as low chance drops. Skins that have no stats to them(or make them exotic stats as ascended would be too low drop chance)

There you go, a huge world with many different places worth a visit if you want your character to look cool

Gathslan.1870:

Some of your problems would be fixed with the following actions.

Most dungeons and zones are empty because of no worthwhile loot.
Every mob on every zone drops same type of loot, so people find the best zone with most farmable mobs and just stick to it until a better one comes along.

Anet needs to improve the loot table and give good looking armor/weapons that drop from specific dungeons and zones, hence spreading out the playerbase and making every bit of content used.

Do not get me wrong though, i am saying they need to add good looking SKINS to different dungeons and zones as low chance drops. Skins that have no stats to them(or make them exotic stats as ascended would be too low drop chance)

There you go, a huge world with many different places worth a visit if you want your character to look cool

Brilliant idea… Not!

Dungeons already have unique armor and weapon skins… People play CoF p1. Tequatl has it’s unique skins. And there are 2 servers that can beat him… Everyone else ignore him.

After 12 months all they managed to develop was two(2) armor sets! So that really sounds more like bad joke than a fix.

HiddenNick.7206:

Gathslan.1870:

Some of your problems would be fixed with the following actions.

Most dungeons and zones are empty because of no worthwhile loot.
Every mob on every zone drops same type of loot, so people find the best zone with most farmable mobs and just stick to it until a better one comes along.

Anet needs to improve the loot table and give good looking armor/weapons that drop from specific dungeons and zones, hence spreading out the playerbase and making every bit of content used.

Do not get me wrong though, i am saying they need to add good looking SKINS to different dungeons and zones as low chance drops. Skins that have no stats to them(or make them exotic stats as ascended would be too low drop chance)

There you go, a huge world with many different places worth a visit if you want your character to look cool

Brilliant idea… Not!

Dungeons already have unique armor and weapon skins… People play CoF p1. Tequatl has it’s unique skins. And there are 2 servers that can beat him… Everyone else ignore him.

After 12 months all they managed to develop was two(2) armor sets! So that really sounds more like bad joke than a fix.

Yeah they have not added that many skins as they are probably quite difficult to make, i think this would do what i said it would but if Anet can pull it off is another question.

And Tequatl requires 100 people to do it, it is a poor example : P a dungeon needs 5 and a zone 1.

And yes dungeons have their own skins, but not as drops. You slowly get them by doing it over and over again which is much less exciting ^^

1. Whole world is dead and pointless with exclusion of few farming places.
Can be fixed if there is a purpose to drive there. Living story is having the opposite effect (except the scarlet events).
2. World Bosses are broken (because of so many reasons that it’s really hard to sum it all up).
Agree… But a revamp like the one it was made to tequalt is enough to make it. Have them drop tokens for incredible rewards!
3. Whole PvE meta is broken (damage over defense, conditions are useless).
Agree! Easy to fix by adding immunity to types of damage to champs/Bosses
4. Dungeons are dead and pointless with exclusion of few farming places.
That’s what happens when content is handed out almost for free! No point in going there!
5. Living World has no story and it’s more about farming something. And is a really good example of the reason why standard MMO quests are not in this game.
Here i disagree. The Living Story does indeed creates the illusion of time passing by. The World is evolving, but with the evolution, some relevant content should stay as permanent!
6. The game can’t be expanded because it would only spread the community even more and make the world even more dead.
It doesn’t need expansions in the traditional format! -__-
7. Main reason to play PvE now is to farm for AC gear that has no real use (just makes the game even easier).
Don’t know what the heck you are doing… I always find content to do in PvE. My Main character has already 5 full sets of gear! Testing different things is quite refreshing!
8. Or to farm Legendary weapons – waste even more time at doing the same thing over and over again without having fun. Made my Legendary by the end of September. Not even once i had to farm excusively to make it. The materials i got, i was saving and then → bam! Bought the rest!

To sum it all up: all that what this game is after completing personal story is POINTLESS and really feels like a waste of time. The game has no structure or anything that would keep normal people around.

I haven’t made the personal story yet. In neither of my Lv80 characters. What do you consider “Normal people”?

/cheers

HiddenNick.7206:

green plum.7514:

What would be an example of a game which is not pointless?

For example Gw2 to the point when you complete your personal story. As stated in the first post.

I fail to see how a badly written, boring questline makes a MMORPG ‘not pointless’. Actually, the game would be so much better without it. The storytelling in the zones is much more engaging than the cheesy personal story writing.

green plum.7514:

HiddenNick.7206:

green plum.7514:

What would be an example of a game which is not pointless?

For example Gw2 to the point when you complete your personal story. As stated in the first post.

I fail to see how a badly written, boring questline makes a MMORPG ‘not pointless’. Actually, the game would be so much better without it. The storytelling in the zones is much more engaging than the cheesy personal story writing.

I absolutely agree with you. I had much more fun discovering zone stories. But I was making a point.

LHound.8964:

What do you consider “Normal people”?

For example people that play LoL or Starcraft have fun playing and competing in those games. People playing gw2 have fun by standing in LA and showing their new just farmed back piece.

Whats to fix?

The game is delivered as “promised” in the manifesto even though people seem to have read in a lot of stuff that wasnt covered by the manifesto in the first place.

The only real problem with this game is that there are to many individuals that expected something that wasnt promised and they seem to roam the forums posting “Is this game fixable” like threads.

Basically they cant change their expectations and seem to think that changing a wonderful game to suit their own agenda. I assume that people tend to do that rather than implicitly admit that they didn’t understand the concept in the first place.

Are there things to improve? definitely! Is the game in any need of a “fix” due to being broken? Absolutely not!

I think the problem with the Personal Story is that it is so fragmented. It’s not like you do it straight. You do a story line quest, then you go to a zone, level up, do different events, and then you come back and do another personal story line quest where you don’t even remember what happened in the last quest. Sometimes there are months between when I do a personal story and I’m really only doing it do get it done.

I have no investment in the characters or what is actually going on, it feels more like a chore because it isn’t fluid. It’s jerky. Oh man, this strong bad guy is summoning bad guys! Two weeks later when I get to the next one, oh man we are gathering some item that is needed to fight the bad guy! Two weeks later, we are talking about how to infiltrate some base or area to fight the bad guy! Two weeks later, we’re fighting the bad guy!

All the while in between all of this I’ve been killing Tequatl, other world bosses, have done multiple dungeons, PvP, etc. The personal story just feels so out of place because everything is moving around it but it stays completely static.

I don’t know what else to say about it, and I’m not quite sure how you’re going to fix it.

The main reason you lose people is because often you finish a PS quest, you’re maybe 3 levels away from the next one, you start playing to get to that level, then by that time you really stopped caring and end up leveling way past and then it just seems anachronistic to jump back to the level 15 zone and have some “epic” battle, when you’re having epic battles in level 60 zones already.

HiddenNick.7206:

7. Main reason to play PvE now is to farm for AC gear that has no real use (just makes the game even easier).

Wow. No, it is not.

Brutaly.6257:

Whats to fix?

The game is delivered as “promised” in the manifesto even though people seem to have read in a lot of stuff that wasnt covered by the manifesto in the first place.

The only real problem with this game is that there are to many individuals that expected something that wasnt promised and they seem to roam the forums posting “Is this game fixable” like threads.

Basically they cant change their expectations and seem to think that changing a wonderful game to suit their own agenda. I assume that people tend to do that rather than implicitly admit that they didn’t understand the concept in the first place.

Are there things to improve? definitely! Is the game in any need of a “fix” due to being broken? Absolutely not!

I’m not talking about what was promised and is the game following someones ideology. I’m asking if the broken structure/mechanics of the game can be fixed? I gave a lot of examples of content that is broken or dead.

Let me give you one more example of how AN tried to fix something and broke it even more. It’s about Tequatl. AN tried to create some really hard and epic battle into a game. Raid like content. But they’ve mixed their own sauce and created Raid like content but in the open world. And now this boss can be beaten by 2 or 3 servers(1-2% of players?). So they’ve broken that encounter instead of fixing it. And that’s why I’m asking is AN really able to fix the game.

HiddenNick.7206:

Brutaly.6257:

Whats to fix?

The game is delivered as “promised” in the manifesto even though people seem to have read in a lot of stuff that wasnt covered by the manifesto in the first place.

The only real problem with this game is that there are to many individuals that expected something that wasnt promised and they seem to roam the forums posting “Is this game fixable” like threads.

Basically they cant change their expectations and seem to think that changing a wonderful game to suit their own agenda. I assume that people tend to do that rather than implicitly admit that they didn’t understand the concept in the first place.

Are there things to improve? definitely! Is the game in any need of a “fix” due to being broken? Absolutely not!

I’m not talking about what was promised and is the game following someones ideology. I’m asking if the broken structure/mechanics of the game can be fixed? I gave a lot of examples of content that is broken or dead.

Let me give you one more example of how AN tried to fix something and broke it even more. It’s about Tequatl. AN tried to create some really hard and epic battle into a game. Raid like content. But they’ve mixed their own sauce and created Raid like content but in the open world. And now this boss can be beaten by 2 or 3 servers(1-2% of players?). So they’ve broken that encounter instead of fixing it. And that’s why I’m asking is AN really able to fix the game.

I don’t consider Tequatl a broken encounter at all. What’s wrong with a single event that only 1-2% of the people can beat? It’s only one or two percent.

Where you see broken, I see fixed.

I considered it broken when it was meaningless.

Vayne.8563:

HiddenNick.7206:

Brutaly.6257:

Whats to fix?

The game is delivered as “promised” in the manifesto even though people seem to have read in a lot of stuff that wasnt covered by the manifesto in the first place.

The only real problem with this game is that there are to many individuals that expected something that wasnt promised and they seem to roam the forums posting “Is this game fixable” like threads.

Basically they cant change their expectations and seem to think that changing a wonderful game to suit their own agenda. I assume that people tend to do that rather than implicitly admit that they didn’t understand the concept in the first place.

Are there things to improve? definitely! Is the game in any need of a “fix” due to being broken? Absolutely not!

I’m not talking about what was promised and is the game following someones ideology. I’m asking if the broken structure/mechanics of the game can be fixed? I gave a lot of examples of content that is broken or dead.

Let me give you one more example of how AN tried to fix something and broke it even more. It’s about Tequatl. AN tried to create some really hard and epic battle into a game. Raid like content. But they’ve mixed their own sauce and created Raid like content but in the open world. And now this boss can be beaten by 2 or 3 servers(1-2% of players?). So they’ve broken that encounter instead of fixing it. And that’s why I’m asking is AN really able to fix the game.

I don’t consider Tequatl a broken encounter at all. What’s wrong with a single event that only 1-2% of the people can beat? It’s only one or two percent.

Where you see broken, I see fixed.

I considered it broken when it was meaningless.

It’s not broken because 1-2% of players can beat him. It’s broken because only people that happen to be on the right server can defeat him (and that’s 1-2% of people).

PS: He is also broken because he spawns randomly and you have to stand and wait god know how long.
He is also broken because he NEVER rewards players accordingly to effort.

I have never seen or heard of one game that at least one person did not complain about. The game is what you make of it. If you expect one thing and don’t get it, then you cry about it. This game is not perfect, but I can still play it because it can better then most other games that I’ve play and are sick about. They have done good and bad things. I am here to focus on the good stuff and to play with some good friends. That is all. Thank you.

1. Partially agree. I’d like to see the population more spreaded, but at least on yak’s bend (where I play, and on the times I play at least) I’d say it’s far from dead. I’m yet to play any day where I don’t see other people around completing events, even on areas far from any boss fight or popular farming area. I think this could be very fixable, just more incentive needs to be added to go to those other areas. Adding more permanent things like the invasions would help a lot with that. I’d also like them to copy a feature from WoW and create “underflows” for maps with not enough people on them, but would have to fix a lot of technical issues first (for example what to do with big events on underflow servers, do they keep the timer of a server or their own, and what to do with them if a big event starts and suddenly lots of people start porting in?)

2. Disagree. If anything I’d say world bosses are broken because they’re too easy. The Golem Mk II is a perfect example of good difficulty for a standard open world boss fight and a good yardstick to tweak other boss fight difficulty. And as for tequatl, a popular example these days, I have to agree with Vayne, I see it as fixed now.

Dragon champions (tequatl, shatterer, claw of jormag) should be HARD, tequatl as it is now is a perfect example IMHO. Nothing wrong with having one event (or three if I get my wish and shatterer and claw of jormag also get buffed up) only few people being able to do it (insert randon TTS ad here). Agree it’s not for everyone… which is why it’s great that there are 19 other open world boss fights in the game that award bonus chests rewards and that are mostly guaranteed if you show up.

Is it perfect?… far from it… personally I think needs several tweaks, like better rewards, a tighter AFK disconnect timer once the event starts, a much shorter spawning window and so on… but I consider it a huge step in the right direction and I want to see more of it.

To sum it up, 2: VERY fixable, and they already took the first steps towards it.

3: Agree on this one. I’d like to see much more use in PvE towards defense stats, and a fix for the condition (specially bleeds) cap. Might be fixable, no idea there.

4: Disagree on this one. Just checking the LFG tool I see groups forming all the time, and filling up so fast that if I try to read the description they’re usually full before I have time to join up, so I’d say dungeons are far from dead. About them being pointless, well, it’s up to each person to decide, I guess, I think that the dungeon skins are a good reward (still working for a few of them myself).

Are the dungeons perfect?… of course not… I’d like to see lots of changes to them, specially more strategy needed for bosses. The new TA path is one good example of them fixing it, though, and so would have been the molten facility and aetherblade retreat had they been permanent (we’ll wait and see how they work as fractals). So I’d say fixable, but might take time.

5: Depends on each person I guess. I like following the story with the short stories and stuff (though I do agree story could be better and better presented). There have been achievements that were VERY farm or grind intensive (one word… piñatas), but I’m seeing less of it these last few living stories and I like the fact that in the last few of them you could skip achievements you didn’t want and still get the meta, so I’d say they have started to fix it, we’ll see.

6: Partially agree… I’d like to see new areas but they must also encourage people to also visit the old areas. This one we’ll see I guess.

7 and 8: I strongly disagree… at least in my case, this one is up for each person to decide. I’m VERY slooowly leveling crafting to I eventually get an ascended weapon, but I see it as a very long term goal, I’m not going out of my way to farm, I just do what I find fun to do, which is entirely why I’m playing the game.

And to sum it up… this is a game, something we do for fun, no other reason, nobody is forcing us, or paying us, and it’s one game of many. If you feel the game is pointless or a chore, just stop playing. Go play something else, take a break, anything, it’s what I’d do as soon as I feel the game stops being fun for me.

Is it a perfect game?… of course not, none is, but at least as of right now it’s the best one for me, it’s up to each person to decide if it’s true for them as well. Is it fixable?… I’d say it depends on how you define something broken or fixable. For some people, for example, tequatl was fine and it’s broken now, at least for me, it was broken when you could just sit near his leg, autoattack and collect loot, and while I wouldn’t say it’s perfect now (FAR from it), I would say it’s much better now. For me right now, the things I do find annoying seem fixable enough, and lots on the way to be fixed (well, with the exception of the bleed cap, but I’ll wait and see).

HiddenNick.7206:

To sum it all up: all that what this game is after completing personal story is POINTLESS and really feels like a waste of time. The game has no structure or anything that would keep normal people around.

Without getting into a bit-by-bit reply to everything the OP wrote, whether or not I agree, I think this last line is very telling, and fairly questionable. I’m not sure what you mean by “normal.” The game seems developed in such a way as to appeal to a lot of gamers for very different reasons. I’ve known a lot of people who didn’t like the personal story, and either ignore it or have finished it begrudgingly. I, on the other hand, liked it, finished it in the first month, finished it two more times, and am still hanging around in the game, largely for the personal story and the fun I get doing the World Boss circuit.

I don’t submit myself as an example of the average player, but I think it’s worth keeping in mind that not everyone is going to like the same content, and that’s okay. We shouldn’t be too quick to say “I’m not having fun, so the game itself must be totally broken,” and write off massive parts of the game that we don’t personally enjoy.

It seems like a lot of the complaints in the OP are very efficiency-minded, like saying that only the best farming dungeons count, or that only reason to play PvE is for a particular type of armor. I’m not saying these areas are perfect, but I am saying that they’re being looked at through a very narrow-minded lens here.

I’m going to drop this here.

The title is misleading, he talks about what future MMORPGs should do, but fail to do when they create new mmos. A lot of what he says makes perfect sense, and a lot of his reasoning is my reasoning as well. Watch the first 10 minutes, and if you feel the need, watch the entire 21 minutes. You’ll see the mistakes that Anet made when creating GW2 as well as things they should’ve improved instead of entirely getting rid of.

I hope GW2 is fixable because I’ve enjoyed it a lot up until recently. I quit PvP (r40) because there was no reason to play outside of titles. Its a shame because I love PvP because its dynamic and you will almost never see the same thing twice. In other games I would PvP when I was not doing dungeons or raids.

On the PvE side I was working towards my second legendary and I just became burnt out. I have the “end of expansion blues” right now. I can’t get myself to log in because I’ve already done everything 100s of times, and I stopped having fun. GW2 has evolved into Champion and world boss farming. I got my Ascended weapon, and then I asked myself “what the heck do I even need this for?” Until we get an expansions worth of content, I don’t think I’ll be logging back in. After killing Tequatl I somehow lost interest in the game. I guess i’ll be playing BF3 until BF4 comes out.

The game would have to be broken for it to need fixing.

BlueZone.4236:

The thing that’s starting to creep into my mind with that topic is it feels like they’ve lost control over the game. They tried to please everyone but now every time they make a change they’ve stepped on someone’s toes.

It feels like there’s no concrete leadership or direction to the game, and the whole collaborating with the players reeks of ’too many chefs spoil the broth

I agree with this 100%, and mentioned it in the thread that Chris Whiteside had created. I find this to be the biggest problem in the game. The game doesn’t know what it wants to be. It is so indecisive.

First and foremost, this response is solely MY opinion. I cannot and will not speak for anyone else.

This game is not as “broken” as the forums would have you to believe. Yes, there are some problems, but in general, the game is still fun to play for me.

The problems with this game that I see are mostly player generated. In other words, a lot of people don’t think that the loot matches the effort, and they want their shineys RIGHT NOW or they’re going to /forumrage.

First, people complained that there was no “difficult” content, so they made the new and improved Tequatl. Now people complain the event is too difficult and that the events are ghost towns.

People complained that there was no vertical progression, so they made AC weapons etc. Now people are complaining about how long it takes to get them.

People complain about one thing, and when they fix it or change it, they complain that it’s “going the wrong direction.” That may well be, FOR THEM.

The one thing in this whole thread that I do agree with is the thought that ANet has tried to please everyone, which just isn’t possible.

As for the current game, no, I do not think it’s irreparably broken. I just think that some players want it all right now, and they aren’t happy with the way ANet is handling their “requests.”

At the risk of being clichéd, maybe it’s time for “them” to find a different game instead of raging in the forums.

I’m going to have to be one of those guys who thinks its not broken. Not perfect, but not broken.

LHound.8964:

I haven’t made the personal story yet. In neither of my Lv80 characters. What do you consider “Normal people”?

/cheers

If you play enough to have ‘casually’ earned a legendary in only a year, you do not qualify as normal by any stretch of the imagination.

No.

You’d have to remake the AI to actually play the same game you’re playing, rethink how players are rewarded instead of endless RNG, add more skills to actually give us full skillbar customisation, which would require rebalancing the entire game from a DPS race into meaningful roles in combat, rethink the placement of mobs in the open world to reflect said changes, severely minimise time gated content and etc. etc. etc.

Ahlen.7591:

The game would have to be broken for it to need fixing.

You must glaze over your eyes to not see many of the inaccuracies of this game.

It’s fixable, but anet still needs to shift away from certain design perspectives, like having extrinsic rewards NOT tied to gold/RNG

Ashabhi.1365:

First, people complained that there was no “difficult” content, so they made the new and improved Tequatl. Now people complain the event is too difficult and that the events are ghost towns.

Geeezzz… It would be enough to make that encounter summon-able by guilds (maybe with merits?) or instanced and scaled up from 25 people up (not 80!). I’m one of the people that had ZERO fun with that encounter. LIKE 98% of people that was waiting HOURS and played minutes and got wiped! And it gets worst because now I don’t even get a chance to try and beat that encounter!

Waiting is not fun! It’s the reason why trinity was removed from this game in the first place!

Ashabhi.1365:

As for the current game, no, I do not think it’s irreparably broken. I just think that some players want it all right now, and they aren’t happy with the way ANet is handling their “requests.”

You can think whatever you like. But everything in this game is broken or removed from the game. Guild Missions? Dead. Tequatl? Dead. Farms… Cought… Dungeons? Broken and dead. Dynamic Events? Dead. Jumping puzzles? Broken(camera) and dead.

The only people still playing this are ones that like to farm endlessly for legendary weapon or people that don’t expect much from an MMO – just an empty world to run around endlessly.

Galtrix.7369:

The title is misleading, he talks about what future MMORPGs should do, but fail to do when they create new mmos. A lot of what he says makes perfect sense, and a lot of his reasoning is my reasoning as well. Watch the first 10 minutes, and if you feel the need, watch the entire 21 minutes. You’ll see the mistakes that Anet made when creating GW2 as well as things they should’ve improved instead of entirely getting rid of.

Pretty bad arguments there… You really think that MMO’s with vibrant colors succeed because of that fact?!(lol) And gw2 is not dead. It’s just broken and is made even more broken with each patch.

No. It’s broken because of the community.

GW2 will never be the game most people envisioned after watching the Manifesto. To do that, the whole game would need to be taken back to the beta days up to last November, when things started going downhill. At this point, it can only be improved with what people think are the most pressing issues. The “Collaborative Development” thread show that it’s pretty much broken beyond repair. Now we just have to band together and make it slightly less broken. All this lies on the shoulders of the devs and if they actually listen from now on. Which is shady given their track record, but I’m willing to give them a single chance.

BlueZone.4236:

I must be honest, after mulling over the “Collaborative Development” topic, I’m starting to lean on ‘no’ as my answer, though I would love to be proved wrong.
The thing that’s starting to creep into my mind with that topic is it feels like they’ve lost control over the game.
They tried to please everyone but now every time they make a change they’ve stepped on someone’s toes.
It feels like there’s no concrete leadership or direction to the game, and the whole collaborating with the players reeks of ‘too many chefs spoil the broth’, especially since these ‘chefs’ are now everyone with conflicting ideas for the game (eg. traditional MMO players want grind vs casuals don’t want grind).

Spot on, whilst I appreciate the communication, it does look like a lack of direction on the part of the devs. But then I’ve felt this for a long while with the lack of clear overall design goals and direction within the living story and the game as a whole.

HiddenNick.7206:

Geeezzz… It would be enough to make that encounter summon-able by guilds (maybe with merits?) or instanced and scaled up from 25 people up (not 80!). I’m one of the people that had ZERO fun with that encounter. LIKE 98% of people that was waiting HOURS and played minutes and got wiped! And it gets worst because now I don’t even get a chance to try and beat that encounter!

Waiting is not fun! It’s the reason why trinity was removed from this game in the first place!

Agree with it being summonable by guilds (or even by individuals after completing a hard dynamic event), not with being instanced. Personally I like it in the open world, so we don’t have things like “Looking for X more for tequatl, no necros, rangers…” and so on.

You can think whatever you like. But everything in this game is broken or removed from the game. Guild Missions? Dead. Tequatl? Dead. Farms… Cought… Dungeons? Broken and dead. Dynamic Events? Dead. Jumping puzzles? Broken(camera) and dead.

The only people still playing this are ones that like to farm endlessly for legendary weapon or people that don’t expect much from an MMO – just an empty world to run around endlessly.

There I disagree…
Guild missions?… my guild does them all weekly twice (second time for those that didn’t make it to the main one so they also get commendations), plus I see several times in map chat guilds advertising their guild missions with temporary invites to whoever wants to go (so they get their commendations), plus I see several inviting here:

http://www.reddit.com/r/GuildMissions

Dungeons?… well, I do agree lots of them need improvements, but I do think that they’re far from dead. Looking at the LFG tool I see groups forming all the time and filling so fast that most times I don’t even have time to join before they fill up if I try to read the description

Tequatl… agree that it’s dead on regular server except for 1 or 2… but I still see servers organizing nights to attempt it with decent turnover, and the dedicated slaying guilds have several overflows full every night doing the tequatl fight.

Dynamic events… mixed agreement there. Some zones are indeed very low population, but I’ve always seen at least 2 or 3 people anytime I’ve been there doing events, not taking into account the big meta ones that are even now sometimes still creating overflows (at least on yak’s bend at night)

Jumping puzzles… agree that the camera needs a LOT of work… but I still consider them very fun to do (slowly working my way into doing them all), and I do remember some of them being full of people during the bazaar living story.

I guess I’m just not normal then, never even interested into grinding for a legendary, sloooowly leveling up crafting so I might (if ever) get an ascended, but mostly because I do enjoy crafting, and I love playing around with other people, which I still do in this game (of course, it helps being a member of a large guild)..

HiddenNick.7206:

Galtrix.7369:

The title is misleading, he talks about what future MMORPGs should do, but fail to do when they create new mmos. A lot of what he says makes perfect sense, and a lot of his reasoning is my reasoning as well. Watch the first 10 minutes, and if you feel the need, watch the entire 21 minutes. You’ll see the mistakes that Anet made when creating GW2 as well as things they should’ve improved instead of entirely getting rid of.

Pretty bad arguments there… You really think that MMO’s with vibrant colors succeed because of that fact?!(lol) And gw2 is not dead. It’s just broken and is made even more broken with each patch.

MMO’s do not succeed solely because of vibrant colors. Vibrant colors help a ton though, and they help you to pay attention a little more. When he said GW2 is dead, he was basically saying that it is dead enough at the moment to know that it will become dead in the future. You’d have to take a marketing class or a business class to believe that colors and shapes help a game a lot.

Galtrix.7369:

HiddenNick.7206:

Galtrix.7369:

The title is misleading, he talks about what future MMORPGs should do, but fail to do when they create new mmos. A lot of what he says makes perfect sense, and a lot of his reasoning is my reasoning as well. Watch the first 10 minutes, and if you feel the need, watch the entire 21 minutes. You’ll see the mistakes that Anet made when creating GW2 as well as things they should’ve improved instead of entirely getting rid of.

Pretty bad arguments there… You really think that MMO’s with vibrant colors succeed because of that fact?!(lol) And gw2 is not dead. It’s just broken and is made even more broken with each patch.

MMO’s do not succeed solely because of vibrant colors. Vibrant colors help a ton though, and they help you to pay attention a little more. When he said GW2 is dead, he was basically saying that it is dead enough at the moment to know that it will become dead in the future. You’d have to take a marketing class or a business class to believe that colors and shapes help a game a lot.

I don’t think it necessarily has to do with vibrant colors, but it has to be pleasing to the eye as we look at it a lot. Vibrant colors might help with that a lot. I do think GW2 is pleasing to the eye. A game like SWTOR was not even though it had vibrant colors. I am not talking about graphics but art style.

Chris’s post on collaboration, combined with their report on working on the development of a better support role, combined with what they revealed with the recent changes coming to classes on Oct 15th, combined with the recent changes that have actually made my account drop rares and exotics on occasion without reaching 100% magic find leads me to believe yes yes it is fixable and it looks like someone or something put a fire in the office under some people’s chairs and now things seem to be rolling.

You all know I am the first person in here complaining about something that’s either unfair or not well tested but it does seem to me that there is hope for the future for this title. We just have to be patient long enough for them to do something about the glaring problems this title faces. Give it time.

Vayne.8563:

HiddenNick.7206:

Brutaly.6257:

Whats to fix?

The game is delivered as “promised” in the manifesto even though people seem to have read in a lot of stuff that wasnt covered by the manifesto in the first place.

The only real problem with this game is that there are to many individuals that expected something that wasnt promised and they seem to roam the forums posting “Is this game fixable” like threads.

Basically they cant change their expectations and seem to think that changing a wonderful game to suit their own agenda. I assume that people tend to do that rather than implicitly admit that they didn’t understand the concept in the first place.

Are there things to improve? definitely! Is the game in any need of a “fix” due to being broken? Absolutely not!

I’m not talking about what was promised and is the game following someones ideology. I’m asking if the broken structure/mechanics of the game can be fixed? I gave a lot of examples of content that is broken or dead.

Let me give you one more example of how AN tried to fix something and broke it even more. It’s about Tequatl. AN tried to create some really hard and epic battle into a game. Raid like content. But they’ve mixed their own sauce and created Raid like content but in the open world. And now this boss can be beaten by 2 or 3 servers(1-2% of players?). So they’ve broken that encounter instead of fixing it. And that’s why I’m asking is AN really able to fix the game.

I don’t consider Tequatl a broken encounter at all. What’s wrong with a single event that only 1-2% of the people can beat? It’s only one or two percent.

Where you see broken, I see fixed.

I considered it broken when it was meaningless.

Well it is meaningless by apparently 98% (if i follow your numbers of course), either way, making content only 1-2% can complete seems very silly and quite game breaking for most, and will kill a business if it continues this direction.

I personally believe yes its all fixable OP but its on the devs to do it, and from what i’ve seen this past year i’m not even sure they see a problem or even want to fix it, that herein is the main problem in my opinion.

For me i see fixes as a no for now.

locoman.1974:

Guild missions?… my guild does them all weekly twice (second time for those that didn’t make it to the main one so they also get commendations), plus I see several times in map chat guilds advertising their guild missions with temporary invites to whoever wants to go (so they get their commendations), plus I see several inviting here:

OK, some people run them… Fine. But why? What purpose they serve? It’s just another option for farming. By doing Guild Missions you don’t compete with anyone. You just spend time by playing a random encounter with people you know. So Guild Missions has no place in the structure of this game. They aren’t challenging. You don’t need to plan for them. So there is no satisfaction in doing them. And besides of skin, ecto and silver rewards there is no point in doing them.

locoman.1974:

Dynamic events… mixed agreement there. Some zones are indeed very low population, but I’ve always seen at least 2 or 3 people anytime I’ve been there doing events, not taking into account the big meta ones that are even now sometimes still creating overflows (at least on yak’s bend at night)

But why they are doing them? They are also pointless… Besides the fact that completing them brings you tiny bit closer in completing your legendary weapon. Formally they were used to level up characters and bring you closer to defeating zaihtan. It was cool and exciting to travel through the world in that quest. Now they are only there to farm whatever you are after.

locoman.1974:

I guess I’m just not normal then, never even interested into grinding for a legendary, sloooowly leveling up crafting so I might (if ever) get an ascended, but mostly because I do enjoy crafting, and I love playing around with other people, which I still do in this game (of course, it helps being a member of a large guild)..

So you like playing the game. You don’t need a competition or a goal to have fun playing with others. Fine! I don’t have an issue with that.

But I must ask. What is this game about? What’s the goal? What is the structure of this game? How can we compete each other in other way then PvP?

The game should be structured in a way that you are constantly challenging yourself against other players. But here it’s all about farming. And the whole content (new and old) with some minor exceptions, serve that purpose. And that’s why most of that content is broken or dead. They just aren’t good enough farming points.

Of course the game is pointless. Every game is pointless. Being pointless waste of time is the point of every game!

HELLO KITTY ONLINE THIS WAY——→>>>>>>>>

god this pve… they already spent too much time on this.

I think devs should make 3 things to keep the players busy.

1)
An Ascended armor set that requires 30 normal mode UW and FoW runs.
And then a “special” Ascended set with very unique looks (but same stats) that requires 100-200 hardmore runs of both (aka GW1 fow armor).

2)
Bring back unique boss weapons.
Some very strong bosses give unique weps with sigils that can only be gotten there (and not salvageable).

3) Coliseum / Olympiads a la Lineage 2.
Make a Coliseum where people can pvp in cities and players can place bets.
Olys every month for Hero status, one per class; Hero status gives Hero aura and some Hero skills that can be used in WvW and Coliseum.

Basically people get ways to create their own content/goals.

Dante.1508:

Vayne.8563:

HiddenNick.7206:

Brutaly.6257:

Whats to fix?

The game is delivered as “promised” in the manifesto even though people seem to have read in a lot of stuff that wasnt covered by the manifesto in the first place.

The only real problem with this game is that there are to many individuals that expected something that wasnt promised and they seem to roam the forums posting “Is this game fixable” like threads.

Basically they cant change their expectations and seem to think that changing a wonderful game to suit their own agenda. I assume that people tend to do that rather than implicitly admit that they didn’t understand the concept in the first place.

Are there things to improve? definitely! Is the game in any need of a “fix” due to being broken? Absolutely not!

I’m not talking about what was promised and is the game following someones ideology. I’m asking if the broken structure/mechanics of the game can be fixed? I gave a lot of examples of content that is broken or dead.

Let me give you one more example of how AN tried to fix something and broke it even more. It’s about Tequatl. AN tried to create some really hard and epic battle into a game. Raid like content. But they’ve mixed their own sauce and created Raid like content but in the open world. And now this boss can be beaten by 2 or 3 servers(1-2% of players?). So they’ve broken that encounter instead of fixing it. And that’s why I’m asking is AN really able to fix the game.

I don’t consider Tequatl a broken encounter at all. What’s wrong with a single event that only 1-2% of the people can beat? It’s only one or two percent.

Where you see broken, I see fixed.

I considered it broken when it was meaningless.

Well it is meaningless by apparently 98% (if i follow your numbers of course), either way, making content only 1-2% can complete seems very silly and quite game breaking for most, and will kill a business if it continues this direction.

I personally believe yes its all fixable OP but its on the devs to do it, and from what i’ve seen this past year i’m not even sure they see a problem or even want to fix it, that herein is the main problem in my opinion.

For me i see fixes as a no for now.

Tell it to the leader in the MMO market who has content that only 5% have finished. It won’t ruin the game. You have to have something for everyone and this game had very little for people who wanted a large scale PvE group challenge. Now they’ve added it.

If people weren’t so stuck up on having to do everything in the game, they wouldn’t be so worried about this.

They’ve been adding more challenging content lately. They’ve added the Queen’s Gauntlet, and the new dungeon, both of which are relatively challenging. Why? Because people asked for it.

Some people won’t be able to beat Liadri….but since even the most successful MMO of all time has that sort of stuff in it, I’m not sure why you think it would kill the game.

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

Vayne.8563:

HiddenNick.7206:

Brutaly.6257:

Whats to fix?

The game is delivered as “promised” in the manifesto even though people seem to have read in a lot of stuff that wasnt covered by the manifesto in the first place.

The only real problem with this game is that there are to many individuals that expected something that wasnt promised and they seem to roam the forums posting “Is this game fixable” like threads.

Basically they cant change their expectations and seem to think that changing a wonderful game to suit their own agenda. I assume that people tend to do that rather than implicitly admit that they didn’t understand the concept in the first place.

Are there things to improve? definitely! Is the game in any need of a “fix” due to being broken? Absolutely not!

I’m not talking about what was promised and is the game following someones ideology. I’m asking if the broken structure/mechanics of the game can be fixed? I gave a lot of examples of content that is broken or dead.

Let me give you one more example of how AN tried to fix something and broke it even more. It’s about Tequatl. AN tried to create some really hard and epic battle into a game. Raid like content. But they’ve mixed their own sauce and created Raid like content but in the open world. And now this boss can be beaten by 2 or 3 servers(1-2% of players?). So they’ve broken that encounter instead of fixing it. And that’s why I’m asking is AN really able to fix the game.

I don’t consider Tequatl a broken encounter at all. What’s wrong with a single event that only 1-2% of the people can beat? It’s only one or two percent.

Where you see broken, I see fixed.

I considered it broken when it was meaningless.

Well it is meaningless by apparently 98% (if i follow your numbers of course), either way, making content only 1-2% can complete seems very silly and quite game breaking for most, and will kill a business if it continues this direction.

I personally believe yes its all fixable OP but its on the devs to do it, and from what i’ve seen this past year i’m not even sure they see a problem or even want to fix it, that herein is the main problem in my opinion.

For me i see fixes as a no for now.

Tell it to the leader in the MMO market who has content that only 5% have finished. It won’t ruin the game. You have to have something for everyone and this game had very little for people who wanted a large scale PvE group challenge. Now they’ve added it.

If people weren’t so stuck up on having to do everything in the game, they wouldn’t be so worried about this.

They’ve been adding more challenging content lately. They’ve added the Queen’s Gauntlet, and the new dungeon, both of which are relatively challenging. Why? Because people asked for it.

Some people won’t be able to beat Liadri….but since even the most successful MMO of all time has that sort of stuff in it, I’m not sure why you think it would kill the game.

Actually they have it already it’s called fractals there was no need to change the content in the open world.

Also, you like the devs are ignoring what happened in other markets in other games when they tried to make their game events only completeable by 5% of the population, exodus. It happened to WoW. They tried to make things extremely hard just after launch in WoW and after about 3months after the release of BC people were leaving that game like crazy. I know I was there. It got really bad until they made these things much more accessable to the rest of the population. They apologized to the community at Blizzcon for making heroics extremely difficult and made it possible to complete these dungeons.

So really it’s not popular to do this it’s like banging up against a brick wall over and over eventually everyone gives up. Try running the game with only 5% of their previous income because unlekittenanges that’s next. History repeats.

Main reason to play is to have fun. Zones and dungeons are not dead, it makes sense, that people gravitate to more rewarding content, but imo it ads to it’s charm when you for example discover some abandoned cave with a jumping puzzle at the end, just like in real life, if you want solitude you can explore more obscure and hidden places and if you want to socialize, you go with a flow.

What’s the point of Timberline Ridge? There is nothing there. No reason to go there. Nothing that can only be found there. Why would anyone go there once they’ve fully explored it? It needs a reason for people to travel there. It’s not the only place that’s like this.