Linux Client
The forum search is broken.(since launch) There’s a sticky at the top of this forum titled “Searching the Forums”, that has a workaround for searching the forums with google.(I’m totally serious.)
So you can search on “linux”, but you’re not going to find a lot, and none of it good. There is technically a native Mac client, and I think that’s the closest that you’re going to get. I don’t think they’re willing to put the resources towards developing and sustaining a client for yet another OS. But we’ll see. I hope you get some kind of response, but they haven’t been communicating much lately.
On linux, you either use windows with pci e passthrough or use wine
btw, I want to make sure you are using wine – staging with csmt patches. It add threading to wine
If you have an amd card, you can use gallium nine with open source driver
I’ll necro this thread for a bit since it popped up on google and I play a necromancer.
Anyway, wine simply won’t do. I have GW2 maxing out one core, barely having any presence on any other core and leaving my GPU at 50% utilization while producing a measily 20fps. Even poorly optimized Linux binaries give better results and since the wine has such a major influence, it means that the Mac client is subpar as well. (This is with CSMT and none of the command line arguments that gw2 has to offer fix the performance issue).
With modern hardware it should not be difficult for GW2 to render 50 character models, yet the game ends up choking at a mere 20. It is so bad that terrain and enemy models are not being rendered at all.
There’s a new graphics library on the rise that is supported at least by Windows and Linux (and perhaps Mac support will have made it as well) so switching to that would greatly benefit any future development. It should also make it easier to improve performance across all three platform even if wine were still to be used. Preferably of course, I would really like to see a Linux version that is properly optimized so that it can be obvious to all that when performance is involved, Linux blows Windows out of the water.
Additionally, it seems that the golem world boss’s hints are not rendering properly either. When the screen gets too busy it may completely omit any point about what attack is coming and that means my character finds itself within the static field without warning.
Expecting the game to be ported to Linux when it has only one real bug on Wine (a patching bug) compared to Windows is highly unlikely, its basically saying to the developers “hey, I know you guys put alot of work into getting this working good on Wine but I want a native client anyway so I can get double FPS”.
Here’s the problem though: That wouldn’t actually happen. The framerate problems that you see in the game also happen on Windows, it is due to the age of the GW2 engine since it is also based upon the GW1 engine from like 2001. Its been ported to newer DirectX versions and rewritten several times (first before release, then with HoT), but at its core its still the same old engine.
A native client would use OpenGL without a translation layer, and thus would free up a bit of overhead to be spent on processing dynamic objects, but it wouldn’t make a huge difference except in zergs of say, 50+ players (WvW, bosses, etc.). The majority of content, including structured PvP, story, dungeons, fractals, and the average open world experience with 5-10 players around, would be unaffected.
What can help is to use Wine Staging instead of stock Wine. Stock Wine, as many distributions package it, has a severe threading bug that affects games like GW2 and Starcraft 2 where the thread locking mechanisms effectively reduce the game to a single thread even though it is multithreaded. A technology called CSMT is designed to mitigate this somewhat, and can be enabled in Wine Staging, increasing the maximum CPU utilisation of the game from a single core to two full cores.
Furthermore, if you’re using an NVIDIA card, you can enable threaded optimisations and increase the CPU utilisation to nearly three full cores (average 280%).
Daisuki [SUKI] LGBT-Friendly Guild Leader | NA – Jade Quarry
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
(edited by Hannelore.8153)
While I don’t mind people putting forth a contradictory argument, I would highly prefer that you read what I write before responding. I am using wine staging, it is too slow. There is no bug with the patching for me (and I think it was fixed long ago with wine).
Objects are not rendering. I do not know what “making compatible with wine” means to you, but if the game doesn’t render properly, I’d consider that a serious failure.
I also didn’t ask for a Linux client in just one go, I recommended to rewrite the renderer using Vulkan (that’s not OpenGL) so that the migration to more platform independent libaries and tools may be done in phases. If there are any performance issues that also occur on windows, this would be one of the ways to go about solving them, since as a library, Vulkan is significantly faster than DX9.
Now to compare wine performance with windows performance. We’re not talking about a small dip, we’re talking about streamers with hardware slower than mine getting decent framerate while streaming while my game turns into a slideshow. A friend of mine playing on Mac is avoiding areas due to the performance issues associated with them.
I’m also pretty sure that of all the middleware they use, directx9 is the only one not supporting Linux. Even then, you could use valve’s directx9 wrapper to produce a Linux version or even a mac version that is actually a mac version. So there’s that.
As for what I’ve tried: all the recommended things on the arch wiki, wine wiki, gw2 forums/wiki and several command line parameters trying to get some performance out of it. The game when it initially loads recommends high quality settings suggesting that my system is well above specs and should run the game flawlessly in most cases. It is simply admitting that the performance produced through wine is not good enough.
I’ll necro this thread for a bit since it popped up on google and I play a necromancer.
Anyway, wine simply won’t do. I have GW2 maxing out one core, barely having any presence on any other core and leaving my GPU at 50% utilization while producing a measily 20fps. Even poorly optimized Linux binaries give better results and since the wine has such a major influence, it means that the Mac client is subpar as well. (This is with CSMT and none of the command line arguments that gw2 has to offer fix the performance issue).
With modern hardware it should not be difficult for GW2 to render 50 character models, yet the game ends up choking at a mere 20. It is so bad that terrain and enemy models are not being rendered at all.
There’s a new graphics library on the rise that is supported at least by Windows and Linux (and perhaps Mac support will have made it as well) so switching to that would greatly benefit any future development. It should also make it easier to improve performance across all three platform even if wine were still to be used. Preferably of course,
Since you are necroing this old thread, I would say wine is a fine piece of technology. Most of the performance problems comes from the dx9 -> opengl runtime conversion.
If csmt does not work for you, sell your nvidia card and buy an amd card and use gallium 9. The performance should be much better since there is no conversion. Gallium nine is a native implementation of dx9 in mesa.
If you really want to wait, you can wait for vk9 to be released which will take awhile
I would really like to see a Linux version that is properly optimized so that it can be obvious to all that when performance is involved, Linux blows Windows out of the water.
Errr no, performance is usually directly related to the amount of money spent of the platform. Linux will trail windows for a pretty long time. Either way, I dont care because good enough performance is achieve on linux already.
You’re comparing queensdale farmland with no events nor a decent amount of players to the situations I have problems with which are Lion’s Arch, every world boss event, verdant brink night bosses and octovine. At which several of these events DO NOT RENDER KEY INFORMATION.
My point in requesting a vulkan renderer was to avoid the wined3d problem altogether, I am aware that direct translations tend to work faster. Though for example, WoW still had about 1/3rd fps less in wine than in windows, even when comparing OpenGL with OpenGL.
You’re comparing queensdale farmland with no events nor a decent amount of players to the situations I have problems with which are Lion’s Arch, every world boss event, verdant brink night bosses and octovine. At which several of these events DO NOT RENDER KEY INFORMATION.
that sounds more like a driver bug then actual issue with gw2 or wine.
My point in requesting a vulkan renderer was to avoid the wined3d problem altogether, I am aware that direct translations tend to work faster. Though for example, WoW still had about 1/3rd fps less in wine than in windows, even when comparing OpenGL with OpenGL.
A few things
First, 60-80% of expected dx9 performance is achievable with gallium nine, since MESA does have an actual implementation of Dx9. btw, tweak wine to use win XP since it seems to have better performance.
Second, Opengl renderer has been unmaintained in Wow for quite some time.
Third, I already ask for vulkan a long time ago. Meh, I guess Anet do not have a good business reason because Apple adopted Metal instead. Opengl is not exactly a cohesive standard.
I would love a native Linux client as I am transitioning away from Windows since I don’t trust Microsoft anymore. I’ve been running various versions (Typically the most popular distros) on my older hardware just to get my hands dirty with it. Only my most recent laptop remains, running Windows 8 (lol) because I refuse to get Windows 10 for reasons I won’t go into here. But I’m just getting my voice out there.
You’re comparing queensdale farmland with no events nor a decent amount of players to the situations I have problems with which are Lion’s Arch, every world boss event, verdant brink night bosses and octovine. At which several of these events DO NOT RENDER KEY INFORMATION.
that sounds more like a driver bug then actual issue with gw2 or wine.
Except other games don’t have this.
My point in requesting a vulkan renderer was to avoid the wined3d problem altogether, I am aware that direct translations tend to work faster. Though for example, WoW still had about 1/3rd fps less in wine than in windows, even when comparing OpenGL with OpenGL.
A few things
First, 60-80% of expected dx9 performance is achievable with gallium nine, since MESA does have an actual implementation of Dx9. btw, tweak wine to use win XP since it seems to have better performance.
But as it is now: my WineD3D performance > your MESA Dx9 performance
Second, Opengl renderer has been unmaintained in Wow for quite some time.
That is irrelevant, I was comparing OpenGL performance with OpenGL performance.
Third, I already ask for vulkan a long time ago. Meh, I guess Anet do not have a good business reason because Apple adopted Metal instead. Opengl is not exactly a cohesive standard.
And now I’m asking for a Vulkan renderer again, because we (as wine users) are taking significant performance hits where we shouldn’t. We’re looking at one core used on the CPU and a mere 50% GPU utilization.
And while OpenGL used to be extension reliant to compete, modern OpenGL implementations (3.0 and higher) contain all features that are found in D3D 12. Since the Khronos group took over they’ve been making great strides on that department.
Except other games don’t have this.
Other games are not relevant to Gw2
That is irrelevant, I was comparing OpenGL performance with OpenGL performance.
Nvidia is known to do crazy things with their driver. How can you know if you are running the exact same Opengl code and driver code
But as it is now: my WineD3D performance > your MESA Dx9 performance
my Dx9 performance? I am just documenting that there is no cpu translation cost when you use gallium nine. I am not using myself as a sample
You can verify it yourself and ask those devs on irc
And now I’m asking for a Vulkan renderer again, because we (as wine users) are taking significant performance hits where we shouldn’t. We’re looking at one core used on the CPU and a mere 50% GPU utilization.
And while OpenGL used to be extension reliant to compete, modern OpenGL implementations (3.0 and higher) contain all features that are found in D3D 12. Since the Khronos group took over they’ve been making great strides on that department.
With the Mac port, there is very little chance anet will extend opengl to other platforms. I been reading Feral and Asypr comments on porting. Although you may have tons of shared code, those porters end up writing paths for Mac OS X, Nvidia, and AMD for Opengl. Albeit they had to do it because feature mismatch between supported opengl and game requires. Gw2 might not be as bad.
I want Vulkan too. I am just here trying to give you suggestions that work today rather than hoping something will happen at all. Hardware is meant to run software. Not the other way around
(edited by loseridoit.2756)
+1 for Native Client, GW2 on Wine is buggy as hell, especially if you use multiple monitors.
GPU passtrough solved my issue for some time, still i dont play much on that comper cause some friends told me that mmo playing on VM’s tend to get banned.
yeah vulkan would be nice to see if would worth it, defenitly gw2 would be the top game for linux.
1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.
(edited by Aeolus.3615)
This may be of interest regarding a Linux client: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Feedback-Guild-Wars-2-Mac-64-Bit-Client/first#post6626267
Good luck.
While I don’t mind people putting forth a contradictory argument, …
This contradictory argument is coming from one of the people responsible for GW2 running on Wine for the last three years or so. And I did read the thread, but I felt the need to do a detailed writeup for everyone anyway.
This may be of interest regarding a Linux client: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Feedback-Guild-Wars-2-Mac-64-Bit-Client/first#post6626267
Good luck.
I haven’t checked the new client, but the old Mac client was just Cider (a Wine bottle). Can someone confirm if they actually ported it to a native client or if they just wrapped it up again in a modern version of 64-bit Wine ?
Maybe I’ll check it myself when I get time. Busy busy …
Daisuki [SUKI] LGBT-Friendly Guild Leader | NA – Jade Quarry
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
(edited by Hannelore.8153)
Can someone confirm if they actually ported it to a native client or if they just wrapped it up again in a modern version of 64-bit Wine ?
You should read that thread:
Can someone confirm if they actually ported it to a native client or if they just wrapped it up again in a modern version of 64-bit Wine ?
You should read that thread:
That thread tells me nothing about the underlying mechanics of the port, just the problems people are having with it with vague info from the devs.
I just checked it myself. Suprisingly, it appears to be a native port ! All of the proper frameworks are in place without a hint of Wine or Winelib. This basically means that the 64-bit client codebase, despite ArenaNet just changing a number on it, has absolutely nothing to do with the 32-bit client. :o
How ambiguous, but as expected of them by now.
Daisuki [SUKI] LGBT-Friendly Guild Leader | NA – Jade Quarry
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
(edited by Hannelore.8153)
Can someone confirm if they actually ported it to a native client or if they just wrapped it up again in a modern version of 64-bit Wine ?
You should read that thread:
That thread tells me nothing about the underlying mechanics of the port, just the problems people are having with it with vague info from the devs.
I just checked it myself. Suprisingly, it appears to be a native port ! All of the proper frameworks are in place without a hint of Wine or Winelib. This basically means that the 64-bit client codebase, despite ArenaNet just changing a number on it, has absolutely nothing to do with the 32-bit client. :o
I think the dev is denying that it is a wrap up 64 bit client
Can someone confirm if they actually ported it to a native client or if they just wrapped it up again in a modern version of 64-bit Wine ?
You should read that thread:
That thread tells me nothing about the underlying mechanics of the port, just the problems people are having with it with vague info from the devs.
I just checked it myself. Suprisingly, it appears to be a native port ! All of the proper frameworks are in place without a hint of Wine or Winelib. This basically means that the 64-bit client codebase, despite ArenaNet just changing a number on it, has absolutely nothing to do with the 32-bit client. :o
I think the dev is denying that it is a wrap up 64 bit client
Yes, I see that now, thank you.
However: They also say that getting the OpenGL renderer in the Windows version is not going to happen (for now), which means no passthrough.
Getting a native Linux client is about 10% as likely as that, even.
Daisuki [SUKI] LGBT-Friendly Guild Leader | NA – Jade Quarry
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
I’m usually really sweet… but this an internet forum and you know how it has to be.
/i’m a lesbiab… lesbiam… less bien… GIRLS/
Can someone confirm if they actually ported it to a native client or if they just wrapped it up again in a modern version of 64-bit Wine ?
You should read that thread:
That thread tells me nothing about the underlying mechanics of the port, just the problems people are having with it with vague info from the devs.
I just checked it myself. Suprisingly, it appears to be a native port ! All of the proper frameworks are in place without a hint of Wine or Winelib. This basically means that the 64-bit client codebase, despite ArenaNet just changing a number on it, has absolutely nothing to do with the 32-bit client. :o
I think the dev is denying that it is a wrap up 64 bit client
Yes, I see that now, thank you.
However: They also say that getting the OpenGL renderer in the Windows version is not going to happen (for now), which means no passthrough.
Getting a native Linux client is about 10% as likely as that, even.
Other than that annoying launcher, i wonder why would people want a native client when vulkan renderer gives a much better performance boost. Wine + vulkan > opengl + native.
Wine overhead is not that large. Most issues is that d3d to opengl translation.
https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/17x0sh/john_carmack_asks_why_wine_isnt_good_enough/
+1 for Native Client, GW2 on Wine is buggy as hell, especially if you use multiple monitors.
And Hugalolic. Native client will probably not fix multi monitors. X11 is just crap as mentioned by former VP porter jaycee_1980.
Yes I already wrote an entire thread about this up above. :p
Opengl is a nonstarter thou for lead engine programmer. At least, Apple forces everybody to use one crappy Opengl implementation. If allow opengl on windows, they must debug Nvidia/AMD/Intel etc.
If they allow different rendering api, vulkan have much better conformity overall.