Guild Wars 2

I have been searching for days and cannot find clarification to this, only people repeating the same copy paste over and over again, so please read this through before replying. Apologies for the wall of text.

I have a permanent injury in my left hand and need to use a few very basic macros to enable me to play. The official statements don’t clarify whether it’s okay or not. Here is the macro policy for reference, my questions are below it:

“Guild Wars 2 players are permitted to use macros as long as the macros are programmed with a 1 key for 1 function protocol.

- This means that if you program a macro, it must require one keystroke per action. You may not program a single key to perform multiple functions.

- For example, if you Press A and it results in the casting of a single skill, you’re ok. If you Press A and it casts multiple spells, you’re not ok."

Question 1: I have heard 2 interpretations of the policy:

a) a macro is only allowed if one key press literally simulates another key press or click – but that makes no sense since that is not a macro at all – that is a keybind. A macro is by definition something that cause multiple inputs to happen. So in this explanation the macro policy would basically be saying “you can only use macros that are not macros” which makes no sense.

b) a macro is allowed if the end result is one ‘action’, ‘function protocol’ or ‘spell’ . As an example; the macro policy says “if you Press A and it results in the casting of a single skill, you’re ok”. So according to this if ‘A’ is a macro (f1 > 1) that first swaps attunment bar (f1) then casts the spell (1) it should be okay. That is 2 button presses but it is still only doing one thing – casting one spell.

Or what about situations where you have to press 2 buttons at once to perform one action, like a dodge left? (dodge + left)?

(it doesn’t help that they don’t define what they mean by “function protocol”)

Question 2:
This also does not cover situations where a macro does one action per press, but the action changes each time e.g. first press: ‘f1’ second press: ‘2’ third press: f3. If you are unable to move your hand this is the only way you can perform a rotation of casts while moving. It doesn’t give you an advantage, it just lets you not move your hand, and would meet the “one press, one action” rule. The rules say “You may not program a single key to perform multiple functions.” but it isn’t clear if this means one after another, or at the same time.

The issue boils down to this: some people say macros are totally banned (but continue to refer to keybinds as if they were ‘allowed macros’). Other people are saying they’re fine to help you press several keys, so long as the outcome is one discrete action (but they don’t define what one action actually is.)

Even guidelines like ‘does it give you an advantage over other players?’ is unclear, since for me I’m at a massive disadvantage already, only having one good hand. In some case a macro that presses 2 keys together (to perform one action) is the only way I can do it at all.

Even if the offical answer is “we’re leaving it vague on purpose so we have wiggle room” that would be better than nothing, although risking a ban for having an injury seems a bit unfair.

This is incredibly frustrating for me. I just want to be able to play with my friends without getting banned, so if anyone could clarify the official position for people in my situation I would be extremely grateful.

Officially, the use of any macro that is not a 1 to 1 keybind is a bannable offense.

Unofficially, there is clearly a set of subjective criteria being used by ArenaNet behind the scenes to determine if a ban is warranted or not.

They will not give any clarity, because clarity allows bots to get around the rules.

Thanks for the response.

“Officially, the use of any macro that is not a 1 to 1 keybind is a bannable offense.”

1 to 1 keybinds are literally not macros. Macros are sequences of actions. If the official position is that macros are totally banned, it would help if they’d stop calling keybinds macros!

So basically I either have to not play, or take my chances getting banned? Not exactly an inclusive policy :/

They aren’t macros in any useful sense, that’s for sure.
They are single sequence commands where you hit “1” and it executes “2” instead. In my case, I was using 1-5 and then doing a macro to change Ctrl + 1-5 into 6-0 so that I could execute all skills with one hand without moving.

You might want to look at a gaming mouse, they have extra buttons on them and will allow you to use your right hand to do more of the work.

@mtpelion – I have to do something similar. Just so you know (and I’m genuinely hoping to be informative here, not pedantic ) if I’ve understood your setup correctly, technically ctrl+1 is still just a keybind. A macro is a single computer instruction that represents a sequence of instructions or keystrokes. In fact, ctrl+1 would be the opposite of a macro; you’re having to press 2 keys to simulate one press?

@coulter Yea, I’ve ordered one; it helps to some degree, and might be enough if my condition improves.

thanks again guys.

Pedantry aside, ANet’s policy is that 1 button press for one button press is all you’re allowed. any macro sequences are techanically bannable unless being used for musical instrument playing.

So yes, if you want to be literal and pedantic (No one likes a pedant, by the way) about it, ANet allow keybind altering, not macroing

Karluum.8019:

@mtpelion – I have to do something similar. Just so you know (and I’m genuinely hoping to be informative here, not pedantic ) if I’ve understood your setup correctly, technically ctrl+1 is still just a keybind. A macro is a single computer instruction that represents a sequence of instructions or keystrokes. In fact, ctrl+1 would be the opposite of a macro; you’re having to press 2 keys to simulate one press?

@coulter Yea, I’ve ordered one; it helps to some degree, and might be enough if my condition improves.

thanks again guys.

Pedantically speaking, a “sequence” suggests “more than one”, however you can have a single command macro, which by literal definition wouldn’t be a macro yet it is because our language likes to play it fast and loose with literalness

Ctrl+1 is a keyboard shortcut that initiates a single command macro that activates “6”. It’s about the least efficient macro design possible, but it is the only kind we’re really allowed to have here (because it is effectively just a keybind that requires a single command macro to activate).

@rapthorne Thank you for confirming that ANet “allow keybind altering, but not macroing”. As I initally stated, I did not intend to be pedantic at all. Since the whole point of the original post was my total confusion over Anet’s use of the term Macro when they appeared to mean Keybind, I don’t feel it was off topic to clarify what we each meant by the term. No offence was intended.

@mtpelion No argument there my friend, just checking we’re all on the same page. I still feel ANet’s macro policy would be rather clearer if it just said “you can use keybinds but not macros, unless it’s for instruments”.

Thanks again for everyone’s help

Not sure how much this will help you but it could be an FYI =o. If you get a Mouse with a lot of buttons, you can bind one to Alt/Ctrl/Shift and then the rest to keys you need to use then you have 1/ ctrl+1/ Alt+1/Shift +1. So you could fit a ton of binds. But as far as macros I dont know sorry v.v

@Karluum
About the macro only doing 1 action involves other things like, make 1 keystroke perform “[enter] + /wave” for example, your macro will perform 6 commands to perform 1 action.

About making a macro that performs a rotation doing 1 stroke per command seem legal imo, but it is a quite elaborated macro to do correctly.

The example of the macro “F1 → 1” to switch attunement and then cast skill 1 would be illegal since switch attunement IS an action, so you did 2 actions with 1 key stroke.

@Infenso thanks for the suggestion

@Belzebu “make 1 keystroke perform “[enter] + /wave” for example, your macro will perform 6 commands to perform 1 action.”

Purely out of interest, could chat macros then be used to communicate quick tactics in pvp or similar, thus giving your team an advantage? (which is against their guidelines)? I know we used to have chat macros (‘inc. sawmill’ etc…) in WoW. Just curious. I’m so new to this I don’t even know if you have team chat in pvp!

“About making a macro that performs a rotation doing 1 stroke per command seem legal imo, but it is a quite elaborated macro to do correctly.”

I feel like it seems legal according to their guidelines too, but I’m getting the impression they don’t mean it to be?

You’re beginning to try to argue like you’re in a court, essentially if you start producing macros and anet detect it you will have your account suspended or banned THEN you’ll need to have this conversation with anet to get it restored (they might not listen).

Decide if you want that risk, take it or just buy the gaming mouse.

No one here can say “oh yes this is definitely ok because you’ve argued your case so well” and force anet to hold to it. The detection and suspension might even be automated and I’m not sure if this thread builds evidence for your defense or the side that keeps you banned.

Step 1: Get an “mmo mouse” (i.e. the Razer Naga)
Step 2: bind every key that can be bound to your mouse
Step 3: enjoy playing the game with nothing but a mouse.

@Coulter I think you may be misunderstanding my intentions. The intention of the thread was to try, as far as possible, to get to the bottom of what is already known (and what is not known) about the specific fine details of the macro policy, so asking about details seems reasonable.

I’m not trying to ‘get around’ the policy, I just want to be clear what it actually is, because it effects whether I can play or not. I don’t want anyone to say “it’s okay because you’ve argued your case”. If I seem to be asking about the fine print, it’s because that’s exactly what the pupose of this thread was. If the fine print isn’t publicly available, then there’s my answer.

I’m also not being picky for fun. I already have several gaming mice – that alone is not sufficient for me to simulate having two good hands without the help of a few macros. I’m asking about the details because I literally can’t play otherwise. I wanted to find out what what is considered acceptable, and we appear to have achieved that as far as possible.

I will attempt to play without macros by being creative with a gaming mouse, and if it isn’t possible then I’ll just have to put GW2 on the pile of games I can’t play. Presumeably as someone who enjoys the game yourself you can understand my disappointment, and my wanting to see if anyone knew what the rules actually are.

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

Karluum.8019:

@Coulter I think you may be misunderstanding my intentions. The intention of the thread was to try, as far as possible, to get to the bottom of what is already known (and what is not known) about the specific fine details of the macro policy, so asking about details seems reasonable.

I’m not trying to ‘get around’ the policy, I just want to be clear what it actually is, because it effects whether I can play or not. I don’t want anyone to say “it’s okay because you’ve argued your case”. If I seem to be asking about the fine print, it’s because that’s exactly what the pupose of this thread was. If the fine print isn’t publicly available, then there’s my answer.

I’m also not being picky for fun. I already have several gaming mice – that alone is not sufficient for me to simulate having two good hands without the help of a few macros. I’m asking about the details because I literally can’t play otherwise. I wanted to find out what what is considered acceptable, and we appear to have achieved that as far as possible.

I will attempt to play without macros by being creative with a gaming mouse, and if it isn’t possible then I’ll just have to put GW2 on the pile of games I can’t play. Presumeably as someone who enjoys the game yourself you can understand my disappointment, and my wanting to see if anyone knew what the rules actually are.

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

Most MMO style gaming mice have 12 programmable side buttons to work with, along with the standard mouse button fare. It should be more than possible with no macros whatsoever.

Karluum.8019:

I will attempt to play without macros by being creative with a gaming mouse, and if it isn’t possible then I’ll just have to put GW2 on the pile of games I can’t play. Presumeably as someone who enjoys the game yourself you can understand my disappointment, and my wanting to see if anyone knew what the rules actually are.

Thanks for taking the time to answer.

I know it’s not an answer to your question, but have you considered looking into a foot control? There seems to be several different styles and I’m sure at least one of them might be of help.

the example with 1 button first pressing f1 then nr1 weapon skill is not allowed since its two actions f1 and 1

@Quarktastic Thanks, but the number of buttons is not the issue, it is my physical inability to press enough of them at once. That is why I needed to know about whether macros were allowed for very simply combinations, like dodge+left.

@Palador I was actually just wondering whether pedals for strafing or something could work, thanks for the suggestion

mtpelion.4562:

In my case, I was using 1-5 and then doing a macro to change Ctrl + 1-5 into 6-0 so that I could execute all skills with one hand without moving.

Maybe I’m not understanding correctly, but it sounds like you don’t need macros at all.

If all you need is for Ctrl 1 through Ctrl 5 to trigger heal, utilities, and elite skills, then all you need to do is use the in-game key bind options to bind Ctrl 1 – 5 to those skills (see attachment). You could also use any other modifier key (alt or shift).

If for some reason you need Ctrl 1 -5 to not be the heals and utility skills all the time, then a script bound to a key not used elsewhere in the game that transforms 1-5 into 6-0 and back, either with separate full key presses† or just on key down and on key up‡, should still pass Arenanet’s 1 key press to 1 action policy.

What Arenanet is leery of is cycling a single key through multiple actions with that same key (for example, 1 is 1 then 2 then 3 then 1 and repeat) that would allow you to mash that key and activate several different skills in quick succession. WoW’s original macro system allowed this and it got very, very silly.

† This is functionally equivalent to Window’s Sticky Keys accessibility option, which will hold modifier keys down until you press a non-modifier key to complete the key stroke.
‡This is functionally equivalent to defining another modifier key.

Karluum.8019:

@Quarktastic Thanks, but the number of buttons is not the issue, it is my physical inability to press enough of them at once. That is why I needed to know about whether macros were allowed for very simply combinations, like dodge+left.

@Palador I was actually just wondering whether pedals for strafing or something could work, thanks for the suggestion

You’ll dodge in the direction of travel (default backwards) so if you get pedals for strafing the dodge left would be left pedal + dodge key, or double tap the pedal.

Karluum.8019:

@Quarktastic Thanks, but the number of buttons is not the issue, it is my physical inability to press enough of them at once. That is why I needed to know about whether macros were allowed for very simply combinations, like dodge+left.

@Palador I was actually just wondering whether pedals for strafing or something could work, thanks for the suggestion

Assuming your right hand is still perfectly functional, (you only made mention of your left hand being injured) you should have no difficulty pressing 2-3 mouse buttons at once or in quick succession.

For strafing: if your mouse wheel has a tilt function, you can use that.

@Artanis Regarding the first bit, I think you’ve got your wires crossed? The ctrl + 1 to 5 bit was just an example mtpelion gave when we were discussing his set up, it isn’t what I was trying to achieve. Hope I haven’t missed something there, it’s been a long day and I’m v. tired!

The pedals thing might be good since, as you say, the dodge issue would be sorted leaving your hand more free to be doing other things.

I appreciate why they would want to disallow cycling a single key through multiple actions since, as you say, WoW did get daft in that regard. It would have helped me a lot at the moment, but if they won’t allow it then they won’t, so that’s my problem. I just wanted to figure out what the rules specifcally were so I can operate within them.

Honestly, I’m stunned by the response overall. I wasn’t sure I’d get any answers at all, so thanks everyone.

From what I’ve seen of Anets behavior and some of the things Gaile has said/implied in the past, Anet will pursue botters and hackers relentlessly but it’s not a completely automated system. I think they have automated systems to help detect macros and bots and things, but once flagged, someone then has to look at the account. If that person determines they’re using macros, then the account gets banned/suspended.

All that being said, I have seen Anet reverse bans on accounts that were caught using macros. The people had to make an appeal to CS after the ban to show their situation and get the ban repealed. Anet wants to protect their game but they don’t want to treat people unjustly.

I think if you do go crazy with your macros, you’ll likely get caught and banned for it. I also think you wouldn’t have a problem appealing the decision and be allowed to return to the game. Yes, it’s a proceed at your own risk, and you might get a little bruised over it, but you’ll probably be fine in the long run.

Of course, this is just my opinion on how Anet works. I could be very wrong.

Karluum.8019:

@Artanis Regarding the first bit, I think you’ve got your wires crossed? The ctrl + 1 to 5 bit was just an example mtpelion gave when we were discussing his set up, it isn’t what I was trying to achieve. Hope I haven’t missed something there, it’s been a long day and I’m v. tired!

Heh. Somehow I managed to convince myself mtpelion was the threat author, so I thought that example was what was desired.

Karluum.8019:

Question 1: I have heard 2 interpretations of the policy:

a) a macro is only allowed if one key press literally simulates another key press or click – but that makes no sense since that is not a macro at all – that is a keybind. A macro is by definition something that cause multiple inputs to happen. So in this explanation the macro policy would basically be saying “you can only use macros that are not macros” which makes no sense.

It is confusing. The truth is that Arenanet only allows key binds. They don’t care how you make them. The policy should not have mentioned macros except to say they were not allowed.

Karluum.8019:

b) a macro is allowed if the end result is one ‘action’, ‘function protocol’ or ‘spell’ . As an example; the macro policy says “if you Press A and it results in the casting of a single skill, you’re ok”. So according to this if ‘A’ is a macro (f1 > 1) that first swaps attunment bar (f1) then casts the spell (1) it should be okay. That is 2 button presses but it is still only doing one thing – casting one spell.

The test is not “casts more than one spell,” it’s “performs more than one action.” Swap attunement is an action, casting a spell is a second action.

Karluum.8019:

Question 2:
This also does not cover situations where a macro does one action per press, but the action changes each time e.g. first press: ‘f1’ second press: ‘2’ third press: f3. If you are unable to move your hand this is the only way you can perform a rotation of casts while moving. It doesn’t give you an advantage, it just lets you not move your hand, and would meet the “one press, one action” rule. The rules say “You may not program a single key to perform multiple functions.” but it isn’t clear if this means one after another, or at the same time.

This is absolutely not allowed, and is the reason for the policy.

Karluum.8019:

This is incredibly frustrating for me. I just want to be able to play with my friends without getting banned, so if anyone could clarify the official position for people in my situation I would be extremely grateful.

You have a few options:

1. Do this all anyway (do not tell us that), and be prepared to appeal to costumer service. Keep in mind there’s no way for them to confirm your medical condition, nor are they required to make exceptions for it.
2. Acquire additional input devices. The pedals mentioned previously in the thread are a great idea. A gaming mouse with lots of buttons is also a good idea. It may be possible to build your own input devices, tailor made to maximize the use of your hand. Some rudimentary research on that front turns up the Teensy USB development board.

mtpelion.4562:

Karluum.8019:

@mtpelion – I have to do something similar. Just so you know (and I’m genuinely hoping to be informative here, not pedantic ) if I’ve understood your setup correctly, technically ctrl+1 is still just a keybind. A macro is a single computer instruction that represents a sequence of instructions or keystrokes. In fact, ctrl+1 would be the opposite of a macro; you’re having to press 2 keys to simulate one press?

@coulter Yea, I’ve ordered one; it helps to some degree, and might be enough if my condition improves.

thanks again guys.

Pedantically speaking, a “sequence” suggests “more than one”, however you can have a single command macro, which by literal definition wouldn’t be a macro yet it is because our language likes to play it fast and loose with literalness

Ctrl+1 is a keyboard shortcut that initiates a single command macro that activates “6”. It’s about the least efficient macro design possible, but it is the only kind we’re really allowed to have here (because it is effectively just a keybind that requires a single command macro to activate).

Well… you could probably have something that cycles through different outputs with repetitive actions. For example, with a warrior running banners, the pagedown key could be the activator for a 3 step “macro” that would place down 3 banners when you press pagedown 3 times in any given length of time. IE pagedown→7, pagedown→8, pagedown→9, rinse, repeat.

@Artanis Thanks for being so clear about the policy. That is exactly the sort of clarification I was after. It confirms what some others have said, or hinted at, so I know where I stand now.

I think using pedals to take movement and strafing off the mouse should make the difference for me, I’m going to give that a go. My mmo mouse has enough buttons for the keybinds, and with pedals I can press the ones I need quickly enough to get by.

To everyone who has chipped in; I genuinely appreciate it. The whole situation has been pretty **** for me frankly, and it’s great to know people are prepared to help. I’ll probably stop checking this thread soon, for now at least, but hopefully it’ll be useful for others in the same boat.

Thanks all

@Torsailr cheers for the heads up regarding ANet’s past behaviour too