You’re dumb. You’ll die, and you’ll leave a dumb corpse.
Making new chars as a Veteran of the game
@Zaklex; if you feel you “don’t need” traits until you’re level 80, then you are either new to the game, and do not understand traits, or are so used to being less than useful that it’s really quite sad.
Your second comment is simply silly and not worth responding to.
They don’t carry it. Period.
It kills the experience for all the people on the forums here complaining about it for over 8 months. Discount that all you want.
Do you work for ANet?
I don’t work for A.net, but I’ve been playing since before the Beta weekends so I’m quite familiar with the game. Traits might help you before level 80 but that’s where they really do the job, before that, IMO you can take em or leave em.
That’s why my second comment mentioned if they have a spot on the shelf for it. You know, a location with a tag on the rack that would show you where GW2 is on the shelf. If they don’t have a tag, they don’t carry it, as to why I couldn’t tell you. That’s up to the store manager of where you shop.
I also mentioned that the Trait set up WAS NOT PERFECT, the concept is fine, execution not so much. I agree with those that say some of the methods for acquiring some of the Traits weren’t thought out that well. I myself have no desire to enter the one area in WvW that has some of the Traits(not the Grub, I actually got that Trait on my Warrior). It might behoove you to read more carefully next time.
@Zaklex; if you feel you “don’t need” traits until you’re level 80, then you are either new to the game, and do not understand traits, or are so used to being less than useful that it’s really quite sad.
Your second comment is simply silly and not worth responding to.
They don’t carry it. Period.
It kills the experience for all the people on the forums here complaining about it for over 8 months. Discount that all you want.
Do you work for ANet?
I don’t work for A.net, but I’ve been playing since before the Beta weekends so I’m quite familiar with the game. Traits might help you before level 80 but that’s where they really do the job, before that, IMO you can take em or leave em.
That’s why my second comment mentioned if they have a spot on the shelf for it. You know, a location with a tag on the rack that would show you where GW2 is on the shelf. If they don’t have a tag, they don’t carry it, as to why I couldn’t tell you. That’s up to the store manager of where you shop.
I also mentioned that the Trait set up WAS NOT PERFECT, I agree with those that say some of the methods for acquiring some of the Traits weren’t thought out that well. I myself have no desire to enter the one area in WvW that has some of the Traits(not the Grub, I actually got that Trait on my Warrior). It might behoove you to read more carefully next time.
See this is where you confused me. “Played since BETA, Traits really do job before 80, but better after 80”. I have leveled through both “Old School” and “New School” and I’ll take being able to experiment with traits over having to “tome” level to 80 and get traits as an after thought.
For some of us it’s not the end but the journey.
For some of us it’s not the end but the journey.
Careful there, that’s some PHIW talk right there. #divisive jab
Level a character using Tomes only. Pop into your stack of scroll of knowledges for SPs by the hundreds and spend 10 gold on meta traits.
Job done.
The goals of implementing new systems should be to streamline, make more accessible and make for more enjoyment.
While the unrelated freedom to change traits OoC did make experimentation easier, the trait acquisition revamp did not streamline, did not make more accessible and in fact made experimentation on non-grandfathered characters less accessible. It also, for many, seems to have failed in providing enjoyment.
What you’re describing is making the current system work by spending 3 times the gold to get basic functionality, where the old system provided full functionality. While this is a workaround, the fact that there is a need to mention a workaround should tell the developers just how badly the new system has failed with regard to the goals I outlined above.
(edited by IndigoSundown.5419)
For instance, I am slowly levelling a human ranger. I used some tomes (not many) and some XP from the dailies, but for the most part I’m completing maps for XP. So, I’m level 51 and I have… wait for it… wait for it… ONE trait unlocked (applause here). Seriously. Wow.
How did you manage that? If traits are this important to you, didn’t you even look through the unlocks to see if there’s any near your leveling route?
I’m leveling an asura necromancer at the moment. She got a level 20 scroll to start out, then went into the world by herself (all daily xp scrolls go to another character currently). She’s at level 32 now, so can’t even slot a trait yet, but already has five (from assorted level 15-40 areas) unlocked simply because she passed by the spots to unlock them in her leveling journey.
If you see a champion (or even veteran) up, just shout it out in map chat, and you’ll have a player (or three) join you there in no time. Most of the time though, it’s not even necessary to go to map chat, as there are always people around leveling and keeping an eye out for those events/champions that unlock traits.
The only “work” this new system expects you to do is being mildly aware of what trait unlocks lurk in the area around you. If you are a veteran of the game, you should have a good idea where the events are or what chain you’d have to follow through to get to it. The tooltips for trait unlocks clearly tell you where the event is located, so it’s not like you’d have to hunt for an unknown in a whole map or something.
The necromancer is actually the fourth character I’ve started to level since April. The other three (guardian, ranger, ele) all leveled by exploration (plus a bit of EotM, but no more than a level or two worth of experience), and each had more than 1/3 of their traits unlocked by the time they got to 80 simply by participating in unlock events they came across (plus the occasional dungeon story instance … I really enjoyed doing those on-level instead of with a full 80s group).
Don’t focus on “I don’t have traits, I’m useless”. Just keep your eyes open, and you will find that a surprisingly large number of trait unlocks are right there, just waiting for you to pass by and pick them up.
For instance, I am slowly levelling a human ranger. I used some tomes (not many) and some XP from the dailies, but for the most part I’m completing maps for XP. So, I’m level 51 and I have… wait for it… wait for it… ONE trait unlocked (applause here). Seriously. Wow.
How did you manage that? If traits are this important to you, didn’t you even look through the unlocks to see if there’s any near your leveling route?
I’m leveling an asura necromancer at the moment. She got a level 20 scroll to start out, then went into the world by herself (all daily xp scrolls go to another character currently). She’s at level 32 now, so can’t even slot a trait yet, but already has five (from assorted level 15-40 areas) unlocked simply because she passed by the spots to unlock them in her leveling journey.
If you see a champion (or even veteran) up, just shout it out in map chat, and you’ll have a player (or three) join you there in no time. Most of the time though, it’s not even necessary to go to map chat, as there are always people around leveling and keeping an eye out for those events/champions that unlock traits.
The only “work” this new system expects you to do is being mildly aware of what trait unlocks lurk in the area around you. If you are a veteran of the game, you should have a good idea where the events are or what chain you’d have to follow through to get to it. The tooltips for trait unlocks clearly tell you where the event is located, so it’s not like you’d have to hunt for an unknown in a whole map or something.
The necromancer is actually the fourth character I’ve started to level since April. The other three (guardian, ranger, ele) all leveled by exploration (plus a bit of EotM, but no more than a level or two worth of experience), and each had more than 1/3 of their traits unlocked by the time they got to 80 simply by participating in unlock events they came across (plus the occasional dungeon story instance … I really enjoyed doing those on-level instead of with a full 80s group).
Don’t focus on “I don’t have traits, I’m useless”. Just keep your eyes open, and you will find that a surprisingly large number of trait unlocks are right there, just waiting for you to pass by and pick them up.
Don’t ever join my dungeon groups. If you don’t have traits, you’re useless. If you have ‘almost a third’ of your traits unlocked, I really don’t care – if they’re not the right traits to be useful, go away.
See how that works?
One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.
Don’t ever join my dungeon groups. If you don’t have traits, you’re useless. If you have ‘almost a third’ of your traits unlocked, I really don’t care – if they’re not the right traits to be useful, go away.
See how that works?
I don’t think I’d care to join your groups anyway … but just fyi, both guardian and ranger had a complete dungeon and wvw build each within a few hours of reaching level 80, without buying any of the traits. There was neither rocket science nor excessive grinding involved, just playing naturally and keeping requirements in mind while doing so.
For some of us it’s not the end but the journey.
Careful there, that’s some PHIW talk right there. #divisive jab
PHIW? Cool, this a new one on me! Let’s see…
Players Handbook Is Wrong?
Penguins Have Inferior Wings?
Pretty Horses Invalidate Waypoints?
Oh, I get it. ‘Play How Iggy Wants’. I didn’t know she played GW2 or that she was a Journey fan. And I can’t quite imagine how ‘The End’ would sound performed by Journey. Or Iggy.
Anyway, I, too, would prefer to build (more) as I go and not (mostly) after I get there, because alts. And if life is supposed to begin at 80 for our characters now, 80 is way too many levels to grind to get to the alleged fun stuff. 20 would be better. And not the current 80 re-proportioned, so to speak, as 20, but just 20. Perhaps even as part of a new framework for leveling in a growing universe. Yeah. I could get behind 20 quick levels and then the rest be all about exploring and growing and being the big kitten (or puppy) hero saving the day and the night and the morning and the evening and especially that first coffee break.
I never liked 80 levels anyway. 50 would have been better. 20 = perfection. /e opinion
The table is a fable.
woooh lvl 42 and I finally have 3 trait points to spend -o- “REALLY”
(edited by caveman.5840)
Reading this I am glad I levelled all my chars to 80 before this horrible change.
woooh lvl 42 and I finally have 3 trait points to spend -.- “REALLY”
Yeah .. beside the aquisition problem of the traits now, this is the other really ugly thing.
Take for example a thief .. a very important trait here is opportunist (at least for my
sword/pistol build) .. and thats the passive master trait .. so you need to be 60 now
to get it, while before it was 40. That means before you had it at least for half the
way to max level, while now you can’t use it for 75% of your way.
EVERY MMO is awesome until it is released then its unfinished. A month after release it just sucks.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
Existing players make it out harder than it is to obtain the Traits now, it’s not perfect, but it doesn’t kill the entire experience.
I’ve never played a character under the old trait system, but I did play Guilid Wars 1 extensively. I’m telling you there’s a problem when I get 100% map completion (and that requires 100% in the PvE areas as well as WvW) and still have 19 locked traits at the end of all that. This game is not like WoW, where you hit level 80 and suddenly start naturally accumulating more money than you know what to do with. After 7 months of play I finally maxed crafting in two professions, leaving me with about 11 gold banked. I imagine that it will eventually go towards the remainder of my ascended set, since I’ve only crafted two pieces so far.
As for killing the leveling experience itself, you’re right that it doesn’t do so. However, it does make traits completely irrelevant to leveling, and that’s a shame. From what I understand, gameplay didn’t change drastically between levelling and end game in the past. Now you pretty much play one way while levelling and then switch to a traited playstyle afterwards. I think that this is the complaint players are making when they say the overall experience has been killed.
~Snip~
As I stated in the trait thread, many times, the system brought in on Apr 15 for traits is horrible, awful, atrocious – I can’t think of enough bad words.For instance, I am slowly levelling a human ranger. I used some tomes (not many) and some XP from the dailies, but for the most part I’m completing maps for XP. So, I’m level 51 and I have… wait for it… wait for it… ONE trait unlocked (applause here). Seriously. Wow.
And this is a problem? You honestly don’t even really need the Traits until you’re level 80 if all the content you play is PvE.
What bothers me most is ANet’s complete lie of saying the new trait system was brought in to encourage experimenation. Really? On what planet? And after over 70 pages filled with about 90% bad reviews of this new system, and almost a year going by, we STILL HAVE IT. I am so disgusted by this that I tell everyone who even thinks about buying this game to NOT BUY IT.
Why, are you in marketing for another MMO or do you work for the places that sell it? It’s really not anyone’s job to tell someone else what to buy or not buy…friend or not, I neither recommend or tell anyone to not buy it. I let people make their own decisions.
I notice as well that in all the gaming stores around where I live, I can buy pretty much every other MMO on the market, but none of the carry this game anymore. Wonder why?
Perhaps because they can’t keep it in stock? At the retailers around me it’s always down to 1 or 2 copies, vs the multiple copies for all the others. Normally when something isn’t on the shelves it’s because the retailer can’t keep it in stock, especially if there are still spots for it on the shelves…which you didn’t mention.
TL;DR: NPE is not bad; trait system kills the ENTIRE experience, for new and vet players alike.
Existing players make it out harder than it is to obtain the Traits now, it’s not perfect, but it doesn’t kill the entire experience.
You really need traits for some classes. Mesmer comes to mind especially. Leveling a mesmer with no traits is miserable. It’s just not fun at all. Playing a mesmer with traits is one of the most fun classes in the game. It’s a night and day difference. Engineer also comes to mind.
Zapp – 80 Asura Afromancer
For some of us it’s not the end but the journey.
Careful there, that’s some PHIW talk right there. #divisive jab
PHIW? Cool, this a new one on me! Let’s see…
Players Handbook Is Wrong?
Penguins Have Inferior Wings?
Pretty Horses Invalidate Waypoints?Oh, I get it. ‘Play How Iggy Wants’. I didn’t know she played GW2 or that she was a Journey fan. And I can’t quite imagine how ‘The End’ would sound performed by Journey. Or Iggy.
Anyway, I, too, would prefer to build (more) as I go and not (mostly) after I get there, because alts. And if life is supposed to begin at 80 for our characters now, 80 is way too many levels to grind to get to the alleged fun stuff. 20 would be better. And not the current 80 re-proportioned, so to speak, as 20, but just 20. Perhaps even as part of a new framework for leveling in a growing universe. Yeah. I could get behind 20 quick levels and then the rest be all about exploring and growing and being the big kitten (or puppy) hero saving the day and the night and the morning and the evening and especially that first coffee break.
I never liked 80 levels anyway. 50 would have been better. 20 = perfection. /e opinion
No it’s “Play How Izzy Wants” more like it, as in Isaiah Cartwright, he’s one of the lead designers.
Zapp – 80 Asura Afromancer
Don’t ever join my dungeon groups. If you don’t have traits, you’re useless. If you have ‘almost a third’ of your traits unlocked, I really don’t care – if they’re not the right traits to be useful, go away.
See how that works?
I don’t think I’d care to join your groups anyway … but just fyi, both guardian and ranger had a complete dungeon and wvw build each within a few hours of reaching level 80, without buying any of the traits. There was neither rocket science nor excessive grinding involved, just playing naturally and keeping requirements in mind while doing so.
You missed the point entirely. Attempt two at communicating point.
Sure, you don’t absolutely need traits. You don’t need berserker metas or even gear that makes half a lick of sense to scrape through most any part of any dungeon eventually.
You can totally have a party of necros wearing cleric’s stats and bumbling around with whatever weapons amuse them and, if y’all can stay alive long enough, eventually clear anything.
But nearly nobody will want that hot mess in their run.
A guild I’m in does an awful lot of dungeons. Some in said guild duo and solo almost anything for those wanting to buy runs. In not so amazing as some of them, but I’m very comfortable in all the dungeons and have, many times, talked newbies through my pug runs.
Since these trait changes, agonist nobody winds up with many good traits unlocked if they’ve leveled by doing just whatever with no studied chore list every step of the way.
They’re not dead on arrival in dungeons, no, but they’re massively hindering to everyone else because they literally cannot keep up.
Not having an even halfway decent build isn’t required by the dungeons. You can be a pack of idiots and, if you’re simply persistent, eventually clear most anything in them.
It’s required to be able to pull your own weight on teams though. And even I, long happy to lead dungeon pugs for newbs and give them some confidence in doing that content successfully, am getting awfully sick of people showing up with fresh 80’s with maybe two garbage traits.
Those that lie about it become evident as soon as the wheels start turning. Anyone that can’t pick out the traitkitten after maybe five minutes into a run doesn’t run often enough to know exactly what everyone can be doing.
And that’s Anet’s fault. They made it be like this.
Who wind up paying the figurative bill for their bone-headed blunder?
The players of fresh 80’s that think hardly anyone doing dungeons is going to want to carry their crippled butts, because that’s exactly what they have to do, when all else is relatively equal, if you’re traitless and they’re not – carry you.
Your traits are as important as your gear. Would you show up to a dungeon with no gear? Don’t show up with no traits and expect that to go over will when veteran dungeon runners kick you for being slow and ineffective.
One is only the smartest person in the room if they are alone.
(edited by naiasonod.9265)
^^ I have tried to explain this more times than I can count and its a perfect explanation of why people need traits if they want to do dungeons.
This is a nice summary: “Your traits are as important as your gear. Would you show up to a dungeon with no gear? Don’t show up with no traits and expect that to go over will when veteran dungeon runners kick you for being slow and ineffective.”
~~On Blackgate since Beta~~
80s: Necro x2, Ranger, Warr, Guardian x2, Ele x2, Mes, Thief
80s: Necro x2, Ranger, Warr, Guardian x2, Ele x2, Mes, Thief
^^ I have tried to explain this more times than I can count and its a perfect explanation of why people need traits if they want to do dungeons.
This is a nice summary: “Your traits are as important as your gear. Would you show up to a dungeon with no gear? Don’t show up with no traits and expect that to go over will when veteran dungeon runners kick you for being slow and ineffective.”
Unless you’re intentionally listing a casual fun run, or you run with guildies or friends, I’d agree.