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My thoughts on GW2 from a GW1 player
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I started last weekend to play GW1, since I want the HoM Points.
At the beginning I wanted to do all 30 Points, but now I’m happy when I get to Level 10 and get the 3 points from linking the accounts.
Sorry, but I can’t see whats so great about GW1.
I wouldn’t be so fast to sell Guild Wars 1 short. One of the big problems with the game isn’t really a problem with the game at all.
Guild Wars 1 is what I call a slow burn. It doesn’t really kick in right away. Not everything has to. There are books that jump into action right away, but they’re not the only kinds of books. There are books that also build over time and by the time you get to the end of them, they’re as good or better than anything else. Babylon 5 wasn’t all that impressive during the first season but the third and fourth seasons were some of the best scifi I’ve seen on TV.
The same is true of Guild Wars 1. Compared to most MMOs it’s a very slow progression,. particularly if you started in Prophecies. Faction was relatively fast, Nightfall was slow again.
But what Guild Wars 1 had that MMOs don’t have is that the entire game was like your personal story. Everything in the game was more like an RPG than an MMO. It was your story about your character.
In Guild Wars 2, you don’t really have it on the same level. Part of the reason for this is because you don’t see the same people over and over from the beginning to the end. It makes it harder to stay involved. If you start a Sylvari you meet Trahearne a lot earlier in the piece, but other than that he just feels thrown in. It wasn’t like that in Guild Wars 1.
The original designers of Guild Wars 1 weren’t looking at MMOs for their skill system either, but something more akin to Magic the Gathering. You have to build your deck to really be great at the game. That mean getting the skills you need unlocked.
It takes time and patience, something the modern gaming community doesn’t have in huge supply.
i would like to say that whoever started playing the game after Eye of the North came out never really experienced the true game. By this time, PuG’s were for the most part dead, Anet said they scrapped the expansion and settled for EotN, and they made it so heroes and henchies were more reliable than other players.
When GW1 was first out I couldn’t stop playing. Currently I can’t log in because I have no idea what my 100 character password is, which is ridiculous on it’s own, but the last time I did everything was dead. Even random arenas. You can’t go to a dead game and expect to get the same impression from a game that’s currently being focused on and is lively. When EotN came out, no one was playing anymore to play the game. They were all playing to farm and speedclear to get real rich because Anet made all the older content obsolete. I enjoyed GW1 more without all the EotN dungeons than with them. I enjoyed the two big faction dungeons, in which the first run I obtained Urgoz’s longbow which was my first real rare item and made me want to do the difficult content even more so, for the chance of sweet items. Without this inherent “chance” factor, it all becomes work and grind. It never feels like a grind when any moment could be “The moment”.
Certain armor/weapons required specific materials that were rare and usually had to be farmed. Some people enjoyed the farming because they could get what they want, or use there time to sell for something else and gain a profit. Other’s, like me didn’t. I went through the game doing dungeons, gathering my money slowly and obtaining a few rare drops along the way in which I could keep or exchange for what I want.
In GW2 I have to do everything the way they want me to in order to obtain the items I want. This is even more restrictive than before!
But in all seriousness, any GW1 veteran will have you know that you didn’t experience the true guild wars. The true guild wars was a competitive, fun, and engaging game that never made you want to quit. You literally never got bored of the game. You experienced the grind wars, in which they implemented all the new various titles which bear a very similar resemblance and role to all the currencies in GW2, except now they take up kitten loads of inventory space and everything is cluttered. This game feels so unorganized it’s almost overwhelming.
i would like to say that whoever started playing the game after Eye of the North came out never really experienced the true game. By this time, PuG’s were for the most part dead, Anet said they scrapped the expansion and settled for EotN, and they made it so heroes and henchies were more reliable than other players.
When GW1 was first out I couldn’t stop playing. Currently I can’t log in because I have no idea what my 100 character password is, which is ridiculous on it’s own, but the last time I did everything was dead. Even random arenas. You can’t go to a dead game and expect to get the same impression from a game that’s currently being focused on and is lively. When EotN came out, no one was playing anymore to play the game. They were all playing to farm and speedclear to get real rich because Anet made all the older content obsolete. I enjoyed GW1 more without all the EotN dungeons than with them. I enjoyed the two big faction dungeons, in which the first run I obtained Urgoz’s longbow which was my first real rare item and made me want to do the difficult content even more so, for the chance of sweet items. Without this inherent “chance” factor, it all becomes work and grind. It never feels like a grind when any moment could be “The moment”.
Certain armor/weapons required specific materials that were rare and usually had to be farmed. Some people enjoyed the farming because they could get what they want, or use there time to sell for something else and gain a profit. Other’s, like me didn’t. I went through the game doing dungeons, gathering my money slowly and obtaining a few rare drops along the way in which I could keep or exchange for what I want.
In GW2 I have to do everything the way they want me to in order to obtain the items I want. This is even more restrictive than before!
But in all seriousness, any GW1 veteran will have you know that you didn’t experience the true guild wars. The true guild wars was a competitive, fun, and engaging game that never made you want to quit. You literally never got bored of the game. You experienced the grind wars, in which they implemented all the new various titles which bear a very similar resemblance and role to all the currencies in GW2, except now they take up kitten loads of inventory space and everything is cluttered. This game feels so unorganized it’s almost overwhelming.
I never run with pugs in any game. I had a pretty active guild in Guild Wars 1. In fact a few of those guys are here in game with me in my current guild. I was actually in two guilds in my time in Guild Wars 1 and people from both of my guilds are here in Guild Wars 2.
For the most part, we like this game better. In fact, I don’t think any of us liked Guild Wars 1 better than Guild Wars 2, though we loved Guild Wars 1.
I didn’t just play with heroes. I played with real life players too. And we had a great time playing together, but I realize that a lot of the actual stuff I was doing wasn’t “great content”. It was great because of the people I was playing with.
I generally liked the Fissure of Woe for example, I thought that was good content. I didn’t love DOA, even though I beat it. I particularly didn’t like Slaver’s Exile, even though I beat that. But I liked a lot of the other dungeons.
But as I said, no matter how many people you played with, there’s no justification for something like Thunderhead Keep. I thought the mission was poorly designed. They’d give you enough time to kill the guys even if you sucked, so if you were good, you just had to sit around and wait for the next group to get to you. Not fun in my book.
I didn’t like several of the missions, but really liked other ones. As a game, Guild Wars 1 was uneven. For everyone person who loved the game, there was someone who wanted to kill Rurik or Komir. There was someone who suggested making a minipet of Alicia that dropped dead every ten seconds randomly as well.
Maybe it would have been a better game if I were a PvPer, but at heart, I’m not. And it was still one of the best games I’ve ever played. But that doesn’t mean that I don’t like Guild Wars 2 more.
All of my GW1 guild mates have all quit GW2 and the three random people that happen to get on are always representing other guilds. GW2 just has no spark, it’s very visually stimulating and the combat is fun at first, but in an mmo the combat is tedious for how much variation there is. It almost makes it more fun to have the auto targeting because then I don’t feel like I have to dance around to avoid a stupid misquito and put too much work in for something so little.
I can’t say I really like GW2, but I also can’t say I dislike it. It’s just bland after you get over the initial differences in combat and the attention grabbers.
When I play pve, whenver I get to the mission points I usually just log off because the missions are zero fun and offer no cool rewards. There are no unique drops in missions and there about the same as any other mmo. The pvp can entertain me for awhile, but it ends up becoming mundain with the same skill rotations being used, It’s like having a gw1 assassin skill chain but you aren’t able to mix and match the chains.
I also found the elites in gw1 to be more impactful. They were more usable and really determined how you played. I don’t feel gw2 elites are really all that epic besides the visuals for them, but a lot of them are gimmicks. (Fiery greatsword/Tornado anyone?).
Honestly Vayne, your arguments could be used in the reverse direction in terms of players making the game. And the Thunderhead keep mission, yeah that sucked, but theres only a very few bad mission for how many great ones there are. How many missions can you name from GW2 that are memorable and enjoyable? for me its none, hopefully it’s different for others though.
All of my GW1 guild mates have all quit GW2 and the three random people that happen to get on are always representing other guilds. GW2 just has no spark, it’s very visually stimulating and the combat is fun at first, but in an mmo the combat is tedious for how much variation there is. It almost makes it more fun to have the auto targeting because then I don’t feel like I have to dance around to avoid a stupid misquito and put too much work in for something so little.
I can’t say I really like GW2, but I also can’t say I dislike it. It’s just bland after you get over the initial differences in combat and the attention grabbers.
When I play pve, whenver I get to the mission points I usually just log off because the missions are zero fun and offer no cool rewards. There are no unique drops in missions and there about the same as any other mmo. The pvp can entertain me for awhile, but it ends up becoming mundain with the same skill rotations being used, It’s like having a gw1 assassin skill chain but you aren’t able to mix and match the chains.
I also found the elites in gw1 to be more impactful. They were more usable and really determined how you played. I don’t feel gw2 elites are really all that epic besides the visuals for them, but a lot of them are gimmicks. (Fiery greatsword/Tornado anyone?).
Honestly Vayne, your arguments could be used in the reverse direction in terms of players making the game. And the Thunderhead keep mission, yeah that sucked, but theres only a very few bad mission for how many great ones there are. How many missions can you name from GW2 that are memorable and enjoyable? for me its none, hopefully it’s different for others though.
You’re missing the point here. Guild Wars Prophecies had 25 missions, period end of story. That’s what it had. I don’t really remember any memorable quests…very few anyway. So you have 25 missions. If five of them sucked and I’m pretty sure at least five did you had 20 repeatable quests.
Guild Wars 2 doesn’t have 20 repeatable quests. It has dozens upon dozens of little personal story missions. Some people actually do like the Battle of Claw Island for example (I"m not one of them). But there are other individual instances that I did like. Some of the Charr stories I liked, SOme of the Asuran stories I liked. But they’re not like missions.
More to the point, there are dynamic events I like and they’re repeatable. Even if you liked a quest in Guild Wars 1, let’s say, for some obscure reason, you liked Althea’s Ashes. You did it and it was over.
But there are dynamic event chains I generally like. Probably as many as missions I liked in Prophecies. Factions only added 13 missions to the mix. Nightfall added another 20. Some of those were good, some weren’t.
I’m willing to wager there are as many specific dynamic events that I like in Guild Wars 2 out of 1500, than there are missions I liked out of 58. As I said earlier, EotN was my favorite Guild Wars 1 product, because I liked most of those story quests better than the bulk of the other missions. But even with that, it took years for that amount of content to be out.
By the time Guild Wars 2 has three expansions out, how much more enjoyable content will there be?
All of my GW1 guild mates have all quit GW2 and the three random people that happen to get on are always representing other guilds.
I was in a large/active alliance/guild in GW1 and most of my GW1 mates that tried GW2 are still playing it, others stopped yes, but did not return to GW1 either.
I don’t know, I play most professions and find them unique, so I never get bored of the combat in GW2. Maybe if you stick to one prof since release you might feel bored doing the same, but playing lots of profs and mix/maxing is important and keeps things fresh. Also, people like to talk about variety, on my Guardian for example I use every single weapon available, that’s 9 different weapons with lots of combinations main hand/off hand and a huge variety in skillbars. Surprisingly enough, I have much more builds on my Guardian than I ever had on my Monk in GW1. Not to count utilities and traits which push the builds even further.
You talk about the assassin skill chains, which profs do you play in GW2 and which weapons sets are you using? Starting from level one and playing a dual dagger Thief since release up to now, yes it will bore you, or a Staff Elementalist, or playing any prof with a specific set-up for a long period of time. The variety is actually there, if you take the time to form a build of your own, to suit your playstyle. Unfortunately you can’t change the skills on a weapon and choose different ones, but that’s not a big issue, since you have way more combinations to choose from.
Elite skills in Guild Wars 2 are terrible, few deserve the type “elite” and in most cases players would rather have an extra utility instead of an elite in that slot. In Guild Wars 1 your build was your elite, sure there were variations in the same build, but a SoS rit, a UA Monk, a SF Sin etc had a very specific build. Which was awesome by the way, since there were so many elite skills to choose from. Nobody can say now, “I’m a TW Mesmer!” or a “Fiery Greatsword Ele!”, it wouldn’t make much sense, which is one of Guild Wars 2 main issues.
There are no “missions”, Personal Story steps, that I actually find remarkable or amazing, mostly because they were soloable. In GW1 there was almost nothing soloable (with one character) you were forced to form a party, which was one of the best things about it. Maybe, if they added heroes/npc henchmen just for PS would solve some of these issues, being able to equip them, change their skillbars etc, we get a vast amount of npcs as allies but they are all useless gameplay-wise.
Dynamic events aren’t engaging though and I’ll take quality over quantity any day in terms of missions. I’d rather do a few missions I straight out love, than many mediocre missions.
In gw1 I felt like I was on a journey. I felt like i was part of gandalf’s crew to destroy the ring. You can say dynamic events are actually part of the real world, but they all reset and it takes away from the experience making them not really feel like true dynamic events. (which is somewhat impossible which is why I don’t care for the idea.)
the storyline and the way it is told is also rather important to the missions, and not just whatever path your following and waves of mobs your defeating. The cut scenes and story made me actually want to beat the missions to figure out what was going on next, they actually gave me emotions and goosebumps. they did this while also being able to include light heartedness. Too many bad in game racial slurs can get rather annoying between the asura and charr…
They have also stated many times that they don’t have plans for expansions and only want to keep adding the new content slowly. I’m more of an expansion guy because the content from expansions always feels more tightly knit and better put together, but I can see how others may like the other way.
Dynamic events aren’t engaging though and I’ll take quality over quantity any day in terms of missions. I’d rather do a few missions I straight out love, than many mediocre missions.
In gw1 I felt like I was on a journey. I felt like i was part of gandalf’s crew to destroy the ring. You can say dynamic events are actually part of the real world, but they all reset and it takes away from the experience making them not really feel like true dynamic events. (which is somewhat impossible which is why I don’t care for the idea.)
the storyline and the way it is told is also rather important to the missions, and not just whatever path your following and waves of mobs your defeating. The cut scenes and story made me actually want to beat the missions to figure out what was going on next, they actually gave me emotions and goosebumps. they did this while also being able to include light heartedness. Too many bad in game racial slurs can get rather annoying between the asura and charr…
They have also stated many times that they don’t have plans for expansions and only want to keep adding the new content slowly. I’m more of an expansion guy because the content from expansions always feels more tightly knit and better put together, but I can see how others may like the other way.
Dynamic events aren’t engaging TO YOU. You can’t say they’re not engaging, because they engage me. I’m looking at the stories of zones. I love, for example, taking back outposts. I’m completely engaged when doing that.
When I hit a DE that is like part of the battle between centaurs and humans, and there’s a ton of guys coming in and not much of us defending…yeah that I find engaging. If you don’t, that’s okay…but it doesn’t mean it’s not engaging. Only that you don’t find it so.
I had a similar experience in Rift, defending stones from attacking invaders during zone-wide events. Me and my wife would defend stones against increasingly large numbers of invaders. Sometimes it was just the two of us. It was a rush. Sometimes it was the last portal stone standing.
I didn’t find most missions in Guild Wars 1 engaging, and many of the quests were just filler anyway. How many times do you have to run back and forth to Togo and Menhlo outside of Maatu Keep for example. Run back talk to them, to run back to talk to the guard to go to KC to talk to the Emperor. Sure there was a story there, but not an engaging one.
To me the DE are just wave clears or follow some dude from point A to point B as random things pop up. they are alright when the area has some people in it but most times it’s up to yourself. The comparison they made is that they didn’t want quests that were like kill X amount of whatever creature and stuff like that. But now when I don’t want to participate in a DE they just cause aggro and generally interrupt me from what I was originally planning to do.
It’s cool when there’s other people in the area to take care of it or join you, but otherwise it’s more of a nuisance.
I will say though, when exploring and there is nothing else to do if you are in an area with a decent amount of people, DE’s do make exploring more fun and can sometimes take you to places you probably wouldn’t have gone to otherwise. I just don’t think GW2 missions amount to GW1 and I don’t think DE’s really replace that either. They are in a separate category of their own uniqueness.
@Op
here my thoughts : I didn’t think that GW1 was a so great game. I only played the 1rst game and didn’t bother buying the expansions. The story was so remarkable that I can’t tell you what it was anymore (though I don’t really like the story of GW2 that much).
I tried GW2 cause I had nothing to do after holidays and I’ll gladly buy the future expansions, I really love the foundations of this game, I really love the dynamic fights of this game.
You can’t tell that everyone that loved GW1 hate GW2. Half of my guildies have GWAMM or champion of god title and they play everydays.
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