Guild Wars 2

Tigaseye.2047:

…and as a Ranger, who wants to range, it does not make me a happy bunny.

The word ‘ranger’ is older than anyone ever using the word ‘range’ to mean “fight from range”. That simply isn’t what it means.

Bows cannot be tactically appropriate everywhere, because if they were, you wouldn’t need any of the other weapons you’re allowed to use. Like nearly any other MMO, this is meant to be one of those games where you’re expected to use the most appropriate tools for the job out of those you have available, not one where you can just do whatever you think would be coolest at any given moment of time.

Tigaseye.2047:

Even in my current guild, I have to listen to certain members constantly laughing about bearangers (or whatever they call them) and going on about them not stacking and using longbows, like that is some kind of crime.

Players who use bears and wield longbows are called ‘bearbows’. The problem is that they camp longbow and use bears even when they have far better options, not that those are what they use.

You’re also missing what I said about stacking. You have to stay close enough to the rest of the group to get buffs (and to provide some buffs). However, the groups that stand in tight stacks up against walls or in corners? For the most part, they’ve been doing it wrong for months now.

The knockback thing I can somewhat understand and I have tried not to use it in groups (or only when absolutely necessary), but isn’t it funny that it’s apparently fine for other players to pull mobs towards them (even if that reduces our potential to do as much damage, with longbow), but it is not considered OK for Rangers to do the equivalent, by knocking back?

Why would it be OK when there are usually four other players all using attacks that rely on mobs staying where they are?

As I say, the whole thing needs a total rework, as currently melee is considered by most to be absolute king (and given buffs are gained from stacking and that melee has been made to do more damage than ranged, who can even argue with that?) and anyone who tries to do anything else is just considered a noobish annoyance.

Currently, content design massively favours melee and attacks that rely on enemies staying where they are. Yes, that’s lame. But there are situations where ranged is better, and there’s a good chance we’ll start to see more of them in the expansion.

And again, all of the tools you have at your disposal are meant to be used. If bows were good everywhere, you’d be breaking that rule and we’d be complaining about swords being lame.

Iris Ng.9845:

At sub level 80 dungeons, I would gladly replace the warrior with a ranger, considering this factor:

- Fight is too short and skip is too fast. The banners, the sole reason to bring the warrior (aside from the kittenty Empowered Allies build), are simply not off cool down for half of the fight. Meanwhile Frost Spirit has shorter cool down so the damage buff is quite persistent.

- With the way adrenaline currently working, warrior’s burst is a joke. Nowadays, I use Healing Surge to ensure that my 100b actually deals some damage in team fight. On that regard, ranger opening burst is simply much better and they can even start it before engaging the enemy (aka. precasting Long bow 5-2 -> Signet-QZ -> Path of Scars -> finally auto attack). So much damage, so many vuln in a very short ramp up.

- With its decent amount of damage modifier, I would gladly to let the ranger pick up the ice bow. If it was the warrior or the guard, sorry take this slap in the wrist and a second slap in the face if they talk back.

- Unless you go for the EU meta (PS warrior and two staff ele), then well, excuse me, no comments.

Alright, now let’s talk about the points that I have made NoTrigger (our famed DnT resident guard, former rT -eh- player) sneer at me. No doubts he’s a very good guardian, but he just doesn’t play a ranger as well as Swiftpaw, both of whom will be the examples of my comparison.

I said:

it requires more situation awareness, better reflection damage, better CC overall

• CC: the only CC worth used against the boss at the current game build is Deep Freeze (elementalist’s ice bow #5) and all the other CC serve as peeling Defiant stack. Thief is unarguably the best for this job with Headshot is the easiest spammable CC in the game. However, there are two problems. First, the thief with max DPS build can only remove 4 stacks of defiance at one time. Second, there is a bug that every thieves are aware of: Headshot would sometimes stop remove the Defiant stack even if the shot connects and initiative spent. It would be up to your teammate to remove the defiance. Warrior’s mace 5 is okay, not a loss in DPS but it affects your rotation. However, both guard and ele’s CC will result in their loss of DPS. Ranger’s Path of Scar has short CD and is also a part of their DPS. If the fight is long (for example, the Icebrood boss or Andal in HotW p2) then even long bow’s push back come in handy to remove defiance.

• Better reflection damage: if both guardian and ranger was to stand in front of the Legendary Jotun to reflect its damage then ranger would win hands down. Even back when Marolna’s poison spit is reflectable, the ranger was one of those who can kill her the fastest and guardian couldn’t even compete. If we talk about who can provide more reflect between the two classes, guardian surely wins, only because the fight lasts long enough to require a second reflect. Then it is meant for protection, not damage.

• Situation Awareness: It is rather challenging to play a ranger. You provide buff like a warrior, so you need to pick up your spirit and know where to place it. You can provide reflect like a mesmer or guard but it’s not your primary job so you put it in queue. You have to micromanage your pet. You can provide a heal burst and condi cleanse but have to make sure not to interfere with the ele’s fire field. Most of the time, you try to max out your damage but not put others into the harm way (like, not using greatsword for Lupi melee). When your teammate fails to pull, you can fill in the job too.

Last but not least, here is a great display of the ranger’s mobility: https://youtu.be/g8J2RkYUSAE

Don’t forget PS Warrior can grant enough might that ele can safely go for double staff for maximize damage instead of lightning hammer. Banner’s up time is not so low though. It can present in most boss fights, provided the team help carry the banners. Also EA is a rly strong buff for the whole party.

In tougher dgn, warrior has even more use for it’s tankiness and battle standard. For CC it’s almost always thief’s job. If you interfere with more cc, there’s a chance thief messed up and pop another defiant that ele doesn’t has time to use deep freeze on boss.

Iris Ng.9845:

former rT -eh- player

not sure what that means but feel free to send me a pm to enlighten me.

Iris Ng.9845:

I said:

it requires more situation awareness, better reflection damage, better CC overall

• CC: snip

• Better reflection damage: snip

• Situation Awareness: snip

CC: ring of warding, bane signet, command hammer of wisdom, and judgement are among the strongest cc skills in the game. you could argue that ranger can use CC more often or loses less/no dps while doing so, but saying “overall better cc” is just wrong.

reflection damage: im not sure at what ranger build you are looking to do this comparison but when we consider the same party buffs, guardian has the better multipliers.

talking about malrona, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwljZutTpvU
its pretty obvious why guardian didnt come close. the ranger reflect has a bigger radius and i believe thats why all projectiles are reflected.

situation awareness: while its true that dodging on ranger is not that easy, the situational awareness of the guardian doesnt only affect himself, it affects the entire party and lacking awareness, encounter knowledge or simply not paying attention can pretty much lead to a party wipe. thats why “situation awareness” is more important for the guardian class and guardian player than for the ranger.

Iris Ng.9845:

Last but not least, here is a great display of the ranger’s mobility: https://youtu.be/g8J2RkYUSAE

you can do the same part even faster on guardian. flashing blade -> judges intervention -> leap of exploit

Jerus.4350:

@Zenith, umm pretty sure rangers have some of the best burst. Barrage + Rapid Fire under Quickening Zephyr/Signet of the Wild/Rampage as One, swap sword/axe use Path of Scars and then auto to finish out your buffs, really some of the best burst, only downside is long reuse on the buffs.

It’s true.

I did some DPS checks in HotM.

With Frost Spirit up, starting a timer at 30 seconds right before casting Barrage then Signet+QZ then RF then sword 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1, the ranger’s DPS was at just over 5000 when the 30 seconds were up. It started off around 7000 and worked its way down.

Using a 6/6/0/0/2 guard with GS/S+F the DPS sat around 3500 the whole 30 secs, perhaps spiking to 4000.

Calculated off screenshots of the combat log.

DarkWasp.7291:

Resurrecting fallen allies – I’m not saying we’re the BEST at it, after all, Warrior does have Battle Standard. However, if you’re a ranger and find that SotW and QZ are charged and ready to go, you can quickly rez a downed party member up before the CCs and damage get out of hand.

I probably should have realized that QZ would accelerate revives a long time ago, but inexplicably didn’t. Thanks for the tip

NoTrigger.8396:

Iris Ng.9845:

it requires more situation awareness, better reflection damage, better CC overall

lol

Doggie.3184:

maha.7902:

Doggie.3184:

Meditation Guardian destroys all the things. Extremely Offensive, Extremely Defensive, Extreme Praise the Sun.

and is also not a build used in pve, lets stay on topic here

Sure it is, silly goose.

dont really know what i can say

You can say “Yes, Doggie, I understand naow that Meditation Guardians are a beautiful, majestic and poweful beast in both PvP and PvE and I love you very much for setting me on the right path to greatness.”