Guild Wars 2

Aomine.5012:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

I think this thread wins the award for being my most pervasive thread. Months later and people are still trying to tear me down.

Aomine.5012:

It really depend on class/ build and the food you’re using.

For condition Berserker, you only need 27% condition duration to hit 100% burning duration with food. (Assuming you’re using sigil of malice and sigil of smoldering)
Any extra point in the condition duration would be a waste.
If you use the expensive stuff like toxic toning crystal, the requirement would be even lower.

Again, you’re excluding the traits synergy. I did my own min-max and find out exactly how many pieces I need to hit 100% burning duration while maximizing my condition damage

Each class’s requirement would be different. Requirement for cond necro and engi is an entire different story too!

I’m not excluding anything. I’m not going into the specifics for every single class and build. That would take forever and wouldn’t accomplish anything, as it would give players a million ways to nitpick. Instead, I just showed that, so long as you gain condition duration, Viper’s is better than Sinister. That fact holds true no matter what class you’re playing, or what build you use. As much as I like buzz words, “trait synergy” here doesn’t describe anything meaningful to the topic.

As far as build specifics go, that really depends. It sounds like you’ve just come up some generalized idea and are arguing my post without actually checking anything. For all we know, smoldering + malice in sinister is worse than bursting + corruption with Viper.

Guess someone really is kinda over-reacted, thinking people are all trying to tear you down or something by discussing different situations and different opinion.

All I do is providing some real life experience about a specific spec that may not need too many viper sets to begin with. Even the top raid groups know that going full Viper is never the smartest idea in raid, proven by their time record and gear choice.
Anything that exceed that threshhold diminishes the value of Viper gears. The purpose of my previous post is to prove that you may not need as many Viper gears to achieve the best result, depending on class and spec, and going full Viper may not necessary be the best idea either.

And no, by choosing full viper, you waste alot of stats, giving up straight 20% or 10% worth of stat for an inferior 6% trade-off. Corruption is also very situational, and may not be useful/ optimal in many situations where you may go down often or not enough mobs to begin with.

Last note, don’t be offended just because someone is trying to discussing/ debating a point with you and suddenly you go all aggressive. To me, your attitude is like: “I’m right! You’re wrong! You’re annoying, so shut-up now!”, somewhat childish attitude.

ok lets say you have full sinister with smoldering/malice to reach 100% burn duration and youre looking at full viper instead.

when you put on that viper gear, you can ditch both sigils. you straight up do not need them. instead, you can take bursting to put your condi damage back to where it was in sinister.

the net effect is you have a free sigil slot, higher effective power, insignificantly different condi damage, and 20% more duration on everything besides burn.

idk how to make it any simpler.

This was posted in another thread but posting it here to preserve the post. Players performing a search for condition damage vs condition duration (sinister vs vipers) will likely come upon this thread first and this should help them understand a little more clearer. I know that this was the first thread that I saw when I was looking a couple months ago.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

I guess I’m going to have to start from basics. For this demonstration, I will give you a few things:

#1: There is a player
#2: Who is attacking once per second
#3: That applies a bleed once per attack
#4: That lasts for 5 seconds, base duration.

So an auto attacking like scenario. Stripped bare and with its most basic premises.. There are few things to look at. First, consider this: if we were to do one attack, that attack would take 1 second, and would inflict bleeding for 5 seconds. Thus, the overall damage that the attack would do is equal to 5 ticks of bleed, and since it takes one second to execute that attack, that is roughly equal to 5 ticks of bleed per second. This may seem a bit odd, but consider this: while that bleed is ticking away, you are capable of performing other actions at the same time, which may add more bleeds or do more damage. This can be considered the “DPS per skill use”, and it is one way of comparing damage.

But there are other ways. Taking into consideration the fact that we can perform multiple actions while a bleed is ticking away, we can use this time to apply more bleeds, using the same “5 ticks of bleed per second”. Over the period of 10 seconds, we would see this happen:

1st second: 1 bleed
2nd second: 2 bleeds
3rd second: 3 bleeds
4th second: 4 bleeds
5th second: 5 bleeds
6th second: 5 bleeds
7th second: 5 bleeds
8th second: 5 bleeds
9th second: 5 bleeds
10th second: 5 bleeds

The crucial part being that, once we reach 5 seconds, the first bleed that we applied has expired, and thus the new bleeds replace the old one. While the overall damage inflicted doesn’t go away, the DPS of this setup is going to be equivalent to the damage that 5 bleeds will do. So, if your bleed ticks for 120, you will be doing 600 DPS, or 120 × 5. This is called many things, such as the stacking limit or the stacking threshold, and it is the average amount of conditions you sustain going through a rotation. You may notice that the DPS we got from the stacking limit is equal to the DPS we got from considering the “DPS per skill” method above. That is not coincidence. The time it takes to reach this peak is the “ramp up time” for conditions.

Now, lets add in a comparison. Lets say that, instead of lasting for 5 seconds, the bleed lasts for 8 seconds. Looking at a 10 second period, we’d get the following:

1st second: 1 bleed
2nd second: 2 bleeds
3rd second: 3 bleeds
4th second: 4 bleeds
5th second: 5 bleeds
6th second: 6 bleeds
7th second: 7 bleeds
8th second: 8 bleeds
9th second: 8 bleeds
10th second: 8 bleeds

See what happened here? The bleed lasts longer, so you get more concurrent stacks of bleeding at the same time. Assuming the bleeds do 100 damage instead of 120, this means that from 8 seconds onward, you will be doing 800 damage per second, which is more than the 600 damage per second that the previous setup capped at.

You can also consider this a DPS per skill use: one attack inflicts 8 ticks of bleeding per second, and even given the weaker bleed, this means that in the long run, you will do more damage and have higher sustained DPS than the 5 second long but stronger bleeds.

Lets take the bleeds in isolation. One 5-second long bleed, and one 8-second long bleed. Lets put their total cumulative damage side by side.

1st second: 100 | 120
2nd second: 200 | 240
3rd second: 300 | 360
4th second: 400 | 480
5th second: 500 | 600
6th second: 600 | 600
7th second: 700 | 600
8th second: 800 | 600
9th second: 800 | 600

The 5 second long bleed stops doing damage at 5 seconds, and the 8 second long bleed stops doing damage at 8 seconds. What happened here is that, at 6 seconds, their cumulative damage became equal, and at 7 seconds, the longer bleed did more cumulative damage. So, even though the 8 second long bleed does more damage in the long run, it has a longer ramp up time, which means that in the short run it does less damage.