Guild Wars 2

I prefer metaphors, and such is my view on this idea.

When Guild Wars 2 was new, four adventurer’s set fourth: Quaggan, Skritt, Hare and Tortoise.

Quaggan thought “Oooooo”, followed by “pretty” and “I wonder if”, and headed off on their own. Not being focussed on any one ideal.

Skritt thought “Shiney”, but then got distracted with other games and split time between other things and Guild Wars 2, returning for new content, Living Stories, Events etc.

Hare thought, “I need to make as much wealth as possible, maybe Karma and other stuff could be used to advance my wealth – I’ll target what is selling for in-game funds, play the Trade Post and target my in game aims to being rather successful. Nothing problem about that, easy come Karma, easy go.”

Tortoise thought, “I don’t really need all that, I’ll spend as little as I need, to unlock skins, or stuff I really want. Maybe if I bank it I’ll spend it on something that I really need.”

Time Passed.

Hare did very well, in advancing ingame presence. Got in early on the Trade Post and soon knew how to buy/sell, with a constant supply of resources.

Tortoise also advanced in game, but built up reserves for “a rainy day”

No one saw Skritt for 6 months than it returned for “Shiney gear” and was seen not as frequent as Hare or Tortoise.

Quaggan had fun.

Then an Asura popped up her head and stated “Things are going to change!”

Hare panicked and thought, “could the changes cause others to take the lead?”

Tortoise thought “Maybe I can spend my banked resources on stuff I really want!”

Skritt thought “Change, what change?” and proceded to speculate on things that had not yet existed

Quaggan thought “Ooooooo.”

So Hare thought, “If i convince Skritt and Quaggan that Tortoise should loose half of their resources, maybe I can catch up with the change.”

Tortoise thought, “Thieving Hare”

Skritt thought, “Yes, Shiney, I want Shiney”

Quaggan thought “Ooooooo.”

Then Tortoise thought, “But if I loose my resources, maybe there should be a retrospective reduction of resource, Hare could then be in debt, but Skritt and Quaggan would be fine as they rarely spent resources”

Hare thought “No, that’s not how I meant it to be”

Skritt thought “I will still get Shiney, yes, yes?”

Quaggan thought “Ooooooo.”

The moral of the story is for the most we all had the opportunity to gain from Guild Wars 2, and chose our own paths and aims. And due to being abscent during a lot of last year, I consider myself to be Skritt. Shiney, Yes Yes Yes.

I hope this helped.

This thread is interesting. It looks like the main issue is a psychological one.

Ok So with that in mind.

They start to use a new more universal currency for open world type things, it has a cap. They allow you to trade away old currencies for the new currency, but it has a time lock on how often you can trade an old currency.

New zones use renown based systems that give you discounts on how much the items cost, and have the vendors locked behind zone conditions. Or something like dry top discounts based on the state of the level.

To be fair dungeon tokens are already ‘capped’ by how much you can get per day. I totally disagree with adding another cap on top of that, there are far more important fixes to dungeons required than some cap that serves almost no purpose to most people.

Badges of honor, karma maybe a cap for these. But if you set the cap too low, the guys with 100k+ badges of honor will flood the market with siege and devalue what little badges the rest of the people have, I really don’t see a benefit here.

Rather than screw with all the old currencies perhaps ANet can add a new one with more stringent stuff so that you can’t “hoard” 10000000000000 of it, maybe. Although personally, I hoard a lot and don’t really see a problem with it.

To quote JS: “I’m not even sure we even agree there is a problem to solve in the first place.”

If it aint broke, dont fix it. If you dont understand the reasoning behind it, dont try to “fix” it. Just leave it.

The whole “players collect them though” is BS. Older tokens you had a defined date they would be useless. It’s your fault for hoarding them (yes, I said you’re a hoarder) beyond their life of usefulness. Newer tokens are your fault for hoarding them as well. There’s things such as bags of loot they can be spent on. Got all the unique crap already? Start buying the gear/loot bags. there’s no reason at all to “hoard” them thinking they’re going to be used in the next map. Anet clearly made it obvious when SW did not use geodes.

Aidan Savage.2078:

To quote JS: “I’m not even sure we even agree there is a problem to solve in the first place.”

If it aint broke, dont fix it. If you dont understand the reasoning behind it, dont try to “fix” it. Just leave it.

The whole “players collect them though” is BS. Older tokens you had a defined date they would be useless. It’s your fault for hoarding them (yes, I said you’re a hoarder) beyond their life of usefulness. Newer tokens are your fault for hoarding them as well. There’s things such as bags of loot they can be spent on. Got all the unique crap already? Start buying the gear/loot bags. there’s no reason at all to “hoard” them thinking they’re going to be used in the next map. Anet clearly made it obvious when SW did not use geodes.

Do you seriously think there’s no problem with karma, though? It’s rewarded near-universally, you get it for doing everything in the game, but there’s nothing to spend it on apart from legendaries (which a lot of people don’t go for anyway). And if you are making a legendary, karma is most likely the least of your worries. So we have a situation where players have 10 or 20 million karma, nothing to do with it, and it just keeps accumulating.

Oh, sure. They could mindnumbingly convert it to linen, a few thousand at a time.

It’s not a matter of hoarding, it’s a problem with the balance between supply and desirable (or accessible) sinks. BoH’s have a similar problem. And because of it, Anet actually had to make sure we had even less sinks, by preventing salvaging of karma or WvW gear.

With SW and DT and dungeon tokens, you’re probably right that there’s not much of a problem in that sense. The income isn’t too high, and there are enough sinks to satisfy anyone. The problem with those currencies, if there is one, is simply that new ones keep being added.

I’m not saying that a cap is the answer, but there are definitely problems with at least some currencies.

No… just no… Putting a cap on certain currencies doesn’t change anything. We still won’t have anything useful to spend it on AND we won’t be able to amass it in case it ever is useful. Also if they ever did do this, what about those us of with over 10 million karma?

Olvendred.3027:

Aidan Savage.2078:

To quote JS: “I’m not even sure we even agree there is a problem to solve in the first place.”

If it aint broke, dont fix it. If you dont understand the reasoning behind it, dont try to “fix” it. Just leave it.

The whole “players collect them though” is BS. Older tokens you had a defined date they would be useless. It’s your fault for hoarding them (yes, I said you’re a hoarder) beyond their life of usefulness. Newer tokens are your fault for hoarding them as well. There’s things such as bags of loot they can be spent on. Got all the unique crap already? Start buying the gear/loot bags. there’s no reason at all to “hoard” them thinking they’re going to be used in the next map. Anet clearly made it obvious when SW did not use geodes.

Do you seriously think there’s no problem with karma, though? It’s rewarded near-universally, you get it for doing everything in the game, but there’s nothing to spend it on apart from legendaries (which a lot of people don’t go for anyway). And if you are making a legendary, karma is most likely the least of your worries. So we have a situation where players have 10 or 20 million karma, nothing to do with it, and it just keeps accumulating.

Oh, sure. They could mindnumbingly convert it to linen, a few thousand at a time.

It’s not a matter of hoarding, it’s a problem with the balance between supply and desirable (or accessible) sinks. BoH’s have a similar problem. And because of it, Anet actually had to make sure we had even less sinks, by preventing salvaging of karma or WvW gear.

With SW and DT and dungeon tokens, you’re probably right that there’s not much of a problem in that sense. The income isn’t too high, and there are enough sinks to satisfy anyone. The problem with those currencies, if there is one, is simply that new ones keep being added.

I’m not saying that a cap is the answer, but there are definitely problems with at least some currencies.

I disagree with the amount things to spend karma on. There are tons of skins available only that can only be gotten with karma.

8 weapon set skins, 20 different weapons = 160 skins
5 armor sets, 6 pieces per set = 30 skins
190 total skins that can only be bought with karma.
The upper Tiers cost 63,000 each piece.

For a full set of tier 3 lion guard weapons would be 1,260,000 karma.
Yeah not nearly enough uses or sinks for karma.

Also you can throw rare and exotic karma items into the forge… which of you had 10 million karma, would not be a terrible way to use it, and make some serious gold. At the very least be able to salvage rares for ecto, which can also net you a decent chunk of change.

pdavis.8031:

Olvendred.3027:

Aidan Savage.2078:

To quote JS: “I’m not even sure we even agree there is a problem to solve in the first place.”

If it aint broke, dont fix it. If you dont understand the reasoning behind it, dont try to “fix” it. Just leave it.

The whole “players collect them though” is BS. Older tokens you had a defined date they would be useless. It’s your fault for hoarding them (yes, I said you’re a hoarder) beyond their life of usefulness. Newer tokens are your fault for hoarding them as well. There’s things such as bags of loot they can be spent on. Got all the unique crap already? Start buying the gear/loot bags. there’s no reason at all to “hoard” them thinking they’re going to be used in the next map. Anet clearly made it obvious when SW did not use geodes.

Do you seriously think there’s no problem with karma, though? It’s rewarded near-universally, you get it for doing everything in the game, but there’s nothing to spend it on apart from legendaries (which a lot of people don’t go for anyway). And if you are making a legendary, karma is most likely the least of your worries. So we have a situation where players have 10 or 20 million karma, nothing to do with it, and it just keeps accumulating.

Oh, sure. They could mindnumbingly convert it to linen, a few thousand at a time.

It’s not a matter of hoarding, it’s a problem with the balance between supply and desirable (or accessible) sinks. BoH’s have a similar problem. And because of it, Anet actually had to make sure we had even less sinks, by preventing salvaging of karma or WvW gear.

With SW and DT and dungeon tokens, you’re probably right that there’s not much of a problem in that sense. The income isn’t too high, and there are enough sinks to satisfy anyone. The problem with those currencies, if there is one, is simply that new ones keep being added.

I’m not saying that a cap is the answer, but there are definitely problems with at least some currencies.

I disagree with the amount things to spend karma on. There are tons of skins available only that can only be gotten with karma.

8 weapon set skins, 20 different weapons = 160 skins
5 armor sets, 6 pieces per set = 30 skins
190 total skins that can only be bought with karma.
The upper Tiers cost 63,000 each piece.

For a full set of tier 3 lion guard weapons would be 1,260,000 karma.
Yeah not nearly enough uses or sinks for karma.

Also you can throw rare and exotic karma items into the forge… which of you had 10 million karma, would not be a terrible way to use it, and make some serious gold. At the very least be able to salvage rares for ecto, which can also net you a decent chunk of change.

Most of the karma skins (from heart vendors) are very cheap. Or, some that are expensive have alternative means of acquisition that are much, much cheaper (eg. BoHs).

No one buys T3 lionguard weapons, because they only have Rare stats and the same skins as the much cheaper T1 weapons. The only reason to buy them is for the skins, which comes to a total of 186,200 karma for all of them. The fact that you could, if you so choose, profligately spend more than 6x the price on the exact same thing, isn’t a real option.

Yes, there are the Orr armour skins (42k x 18) and the T3 cultural skins (63k x 19 × 5). Those could be a big chunk of karma, if you wanted to buy them (although, the T3 cultural can also be acquired from various PS stages).

In practice, few people buy the entirety of skin sets “just because.” They’ll get the ones they want or think they’ll use. And none of the karma sets seems particularly popular. Further, skins are a one-time purchase. There’s no continuing sink.

Moreover, even if you bought every single skin available for karma it comes to maybe 7.5M karma (probably less, but I was generous with the amounts for all the cheap skins). Which is millions of karma less than what a lot of players have stocked up (and we can assume that those players have probably bought the skins they actually want already anyway).

Converting karma to gold: forging rare/exotic items is an insanely inefficient way of converting karma to gold. The best ways are forging light armour for lower tier cloth – you’ll make more gold for a few thousand karma that way, than you would for the tens or hundreds of thousands of karma you spend in the way you suggest. The theoretical ability to throw money(karma) down the drain does not a good sink make.

Finally, if there were good sinks for karma, then there wouldn’t be such a problem with people having so many millions of it stocked up.

pdavis.8031:

Olvendred.3027:

Aidan Savage.2078:

To quote JS: “I’m not even sure we even agree there is a problem to solve in the first place.”

If it aint broke, dont fix it. If you dont understand the reasoning behind it, dont try to “fix” it. Just leave it.

The whole “players collect them though” is BS. Older tokens you had a defined date they would be useless. It’s your fault for hoarding them (yes, I said you’re a hoarder) beyond their life of usefulness. Newer tokens are your fault for hoarding them as well. There’s things such as bags of loot they can be spent on. Got all the unique crap already? Start buying the gear/loot bags. there’s no reason at all to “hoard” them thinking they’re going to be used in the next map. Anet clearly made it obvious when SW did not use geodes.

Do you seriously think there’s no problem with karma, though? It’s rewarded near-universally, you get it for doing everything in the game, but there’s nothing to spend it on apart from legendaries (which a lot of people don’t go for anyway). And if you are making a legendary, karma is most likely the least of your worries. So we have a situation where players have 10 or 20 million karma, nothing to do with it, and it just keeps accumulating.

Oh, sure. They could mindnumbingly convert it to linen, a few thousand at a time.

It’s not a matter of hoarding, it’s a problem with the balance between supply and desirable (or accessible) sinks. BoH’s have a similar problem. And because of it, Anet actually had to make sure we had even less sinks, by preventing salvaging of karma or WvW gear.

With SW and DT and dungeon tokens, you’re probably right that there’s not much of a problem in that sense. The income isn’t too high, and there are enough sinks to satisfy anyone. The problem with those currencies, if there is one, is simply that new ones keep being added.

I’m not saying that a cap is the answer, but there are definitely problems with at least some currencies.

I disagree with the amount things to spend karma on. There are tons of skins available only that can only be gotten with karma.

8 weapon set skins, 20 different weapons = 160 skins
5 armor sets, 6 pieces per set = 30 skins
190 total skins that can only be bought with karma.
The upper Tiers cost 63,000 each piece.

For a full set of tier 3 lion guard weapons would be 1,260,000 karma.
Yeah not nearly enough uses or sinks for karma.

Also you can throw rare and exotic karma items into the forge… which of you had 10 million karma, would not be a terrible way to use it, and make some serious gold. At the very least be able to salvage rares for ecto, which can also net you a decent chunk of change.

and the poor thing as some players (including me) stated in the rng concept tread
we still have no collection for the karma weapons
but cash shop weapons get one every time hahaha
40-45ap for complet weapon set(like the minipets)
maybe a titel include “weapon collector” if you get ALL
and some people would have enough intention to got for it
8 weapon sets?uhm there are more
some more / some less expensive
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cultural_weapon
+lion guard,pirate and the ones in ebon hawk
18? maybe i forget one as well hm…
jup that cuts down some mio karma
even if i would still sitting on my 10mio ^^
because i don t care
i would like to see new karma weapon set
but oh this would cut into the bltp weapons
so they not do it
even if they would do 1month karma 1month bltp weapons and switch every month
it cuts into profit and that bad so nope we not get it
still waiting for obsidian edge based set
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/File:Obsidian_Edge.jpg
after the chaos one (even if we can not chose the colour like gw1 :/ axe )
or a shiny one based on http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Amethyst_Aegis
or from that scyte with same efect/material http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/File:Saurian_Scythe.jpg

and to op
if they inrease stuff to 15k stacks fine
(would also cut maybe in bag slot sales so they not do this)
a cap? rly no need for it
stop farming or go for junk items and a view copper

maddoctor.2738:

Why? You want to have thousands of dungeon tokens and millions of karma just staying there being useless? You want to hoard your currencies for no reason at all, and the developers never ever release anything new for those?

karma = gold,
dungeon tokens = gold,
fractal relics = pink items, 20 slot boxes and obsidian shards.

So far I’m at 200 000 karma and I wouldn’t want a cap on it. I’m planning on buying all the karma skins. Then completing the 100 000 drinks achievement with karma. Then going back to karma to gold conversion.

I tend to reach up to 1000 dungeon tokens before I spend them. I want to once again collect all the skins. That’s over 5000 tokens. Then it pays to try for a legendary with tokens. That would be anywhere between 800 to 1600 a try. Or you can convert them to potions. Or you can buy yellows. Or you can salvage exotics for ectos. Or you can gear up your alts.

Even if karma gets capped, ANet will end up making more currencies anyways because:

• It brings players to other parts of the game.

If the new Living story uses karma as currencies, would you want players to farm EOTM so that players get what they want or farm the new area they added?

runeblade.7514:

Even if karma gets capped, ANet will end up making more currencies anyways because:

• It brings players to other parts of the game.

If the new Living story uses karma as currencies, would you want players to farm EOTM so that players get what they want or farm the new area they added?

a currency/token for every area is a very inelegant solution. It would be better to use a renown system, and an event based system.

I would prefer a cap on the number of currencies.

The closer to “one” the better.

runeblade.7514:

Even if karma gets capped, ANet will end up making more currencies anyways because:

• It brings players to other parts of the game.

If the new Living story uses karma as currencies, would you want players to farm EOTM so that players get what they want or farm the new area they added?

This is a real problem with the Living Story because the LS can’t work without multiple currencies as it is now. However, would you want each map in HoT to have their own currency, or use the same one on all new maps?

Mirta.5029:

maddoctor.2738:

Why? You want to have thousands of dungeon tokens and millions of karma just staying there being useless? You want to hoard your currencies for no reason at all, and the developers never ever release anything new for those?

karma = gold,
dungeon tokens = gold,
fractal relics = pink items, 20 slot boxes and obsidian shards.

So far I’m at 200 000 karma and I wouldn’t want a cap on it. I’m planning on buying all the karma skins. Then completing the 100 000 drinks achievement with karma. Then going back to karma to gold conversion.

I tend to reach up to 1000 dungeon tokens before I spend them. I want to once again collect all the skins. That’s over 5000 tokens. Then it pays to try for a legendary with tokens. That would be anywhere between 800 to 1600 a try. Or you can convert them to potions. Or you can buy yellows. Or you can salvage exotics for ectos. Or you can gear up your alts.

Alright, if a cap is implemented it will need to account for any possible usage of the target currency, that includes getting 4 items to forge them.

Let me ask this, why do you feel you need to finish something like the 100k drinks achievement in one go, and not spend your karma towards it, as you get it? I’m just curious. I always thought the purpose of these types of achievements is to get them through play and not all at once.

phys.7689:

Lishtenbird.2814:

“I am too inefficient at earning and spending and don’t want to improve, so let’s make EVERYONE ELSE equally inefficient!”

Where do people even get those ideas from?

thats not really how it works.

Basically what happens when you have caps, is people spend their currencies. You can then keep using the same currencies, in non stupid amounts for new content.

For this to work, there should be something interesting to spend these currencies on. The point is, if such things existed, the unlimited cap would not be needed, because people would be spending it.
Case in point? Laurels.

No, instead of caps, what needs to be introduced is interesting, continuous (as opposed to things you buy only once) sinks. Laurel vendor crafting bags are a good example.

Riesty.9075:

and to op
if they inrease stuff to 15k stacks fine
(would also cut maybe in bag slot sales so they not do this)
a cap? rly no need for it
stop farming or go for junk items and a view copper

I don’t want the cap because I have problems with my inventory and how to manage my currencies. I believe one of the reasons currencies come and go and not get any updated items to get with them, is because there is no cap on them, so I proposed a way to make older currencies important again by capping the amount you can have.

I’m open to more solutions to this issue though. Somehow some players are content in having a billion currencies in the game, and a lot more to come with expansions. Where do we stop adding new ones?

Astralporing.1957:

phys.7689:

Lishtenbird.2814:

“I am too inefficient at earning and spending and don’t want to improve, so let’s make EVERYONE ELSE equally inefficient!”

Where do people even get those ideas from?

thats not really how it works.

Basically what happens when you have caps, is people spend their currencies. You can then keep using the same currencies, in non stupid amounts for new content.

For this to work, there should be something interesting to spend these currencies on. The point is, if such things existed, the unlimited cap would not be needed, because people would be spending it.
Case in point? Laurels.

Exactly, this is another way of solving the currency problem. However is it realistic for them to add new things for karma as often as they add things for gold? (Gem store)

maddoctor.2738:

runeblade.7514:

Even if karma gets capped, ANet will end up making more currencies anyways because:

• It brings players to other parts of the game.

If the new Living story uses karma as currencies, would you want players to farm EOTM so that players get what they want or farm the new area they added?

This is a real problem with the Living Story because the LS can’t work without multiple currencies as it is now. However, would you want each map in HoT to have their own currency, or use the same one on all new maps?

For now, I will be in the multiple currency side. I never had a problem with it, and I explore through many parts of the game because of it. Your idea sounds interesting enough for me to be swayed.

• The idea of doing whatever I want to get the same reward is interesting.
• The problem is: People will flock to the most efficient way to farm the currency leaving every other part of the game being a deserted wasteland. Meaning, I won’t be able to do what I want.

Until you think of a good idea that will eliminate that problem, I am sticking with the multiple currencies.

maddoctor.2738:

Vukorep.3081:

maddoctor.2738:

Why can’t we use Geodes outside Dry Top? Bandit Crests outside Silverwastes? I doubt we will use those in Heart of Thorns, HoT will use their own new Currencies. Why?

Why cant se use AC tokens outside AC? CM tokens outside CM? Dungeon tokens outside dungeons? Why?

Geodes and Bandit Crests could both be replaced by karma. A universal non-gold currency that is used on all other open world maps in the game.

But they didn’t want universal currency. They wanted people to farm their current map, to ensure it won’t be empty. This is a reason behind crests and geodes.

maddoctor.2738:

Exactly, this is another way of solving the currency problem. However is it realistic for them to add new things for karma as often as they add things for gold? (Gem store)

There’s a reason why i mentioned constant, repeatable sinks of currency, right? It just needs to be something that will always be useful.

Astralporing.1957:

phys.7689:

Lishtenbird.2814:

“I am too inefficient at earning and spending and don’t want to improve, so let’s make EVERYONE ELSE equally inefficient!”

Where do people even get those ideas from?

thats not really how it works.

Basically what happens when you have caps, is people spend their currencies. You can then keep using the same currencies, in non stupid amounts for new content.

For this to work, there should be something interesting to spend these currencies on. The point is, if such things existed, the unlimited cap would not be needed, because people would be spending it.
Case in point? Laurels.

No, instead of caps, what needs to be introduced is interesting, continuous (as opposed to things you buy only once) sinks. Laurel vendor crafting bags are a good example.

but they dont want to put interesting things in currency, because then people with a lot will get it instantly.
They will never put anything valuable for karma again because of this.

maddoctor and phys are absolutely right. If they ever want to release something cool using karma again it will either need to have an insane cost, or be hidden under insane rng like say a chest that drops stuff. Thats a tragedy because karma is one of the few reasons that incentives doing events properly IE with the intention to actual win the event rather then fail it.

Same thing with gold really. Does it make sense to release a new cultural set for gold? either if you price it so high that new players will run away screaming or instead of a long term goal it will turn into a quarter of an hour goal.

What about dungeons? does it make sense to release new rewards to incentive dungeon runs again? If they’re prized the same as existing rewards whats the point? most people can get them without running that dungeon again. I dont do dungeons and would still be able to out right buy them from 1/2 the dungeons.

laurels? Same story, Mystic coins? ditto

What Maddoctor says is absolutely right. Think about it, if they add a new armor skin akin the karma skins in Orr can they sell them for 42k karma each? those are rewards aimed at keeping you busy for months. 42K karma meant 100 events at max level. if they put an armor set for 42k each it will mean instant buy for the majority of the players. So what can Anet do? either no karma sets or what? 1 million karma per item? and even though that sounds absurd i bet most people would still be able to out right buy close to 5 pieces. What about new players? is it fair to ask them to invest close to 3 years play time to earn the same set we can nearly buy instantly?

I too think this is a real issue, It just doesnt make sense to have a new main currency every 6 months. Would love to hear John Smith’s thoughst on the subject. Think this may make good material for a blog post or maybe a future CDI?

I wish there would be something useful for my 10m of karma. Already got all cultural weapon skins and some extra stacks of obsidian shards. Converting it to linen is too much clicking for me.

Riesty.9075:

~snip~

8 weapon sets?uhm there are more
some more / some less expensive
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cultural_weapon
+lion guard,pirate and the ones in ebon hawk
18? maybe i forget one as well hm…

I stand corrected.

Olvendred.3027:

Converting karma to gold: forging rare/exotic items is an insanely inefficient way of converting karma to gold. The best ways are forging light armour for lower tier cloth – you’ll make more gold for a few thousand karma that way, than you would for the tens or hundreds of thousands of karma you spend in the way you suggest. The theoretical ability to throw money(karma) down the drain does not a good sink make.

Finally, if there were good sinks for karma, then there wouldn’t be such a problem with people having so many millions of it stocked up.

True, it may not be the most effecient way to make gold, but the way I see it, is if you are drowning in karma, already have purchased the skins you want/are not interested in karma skins, why not?

It gives you a chance to get some pretty cool exotics. (I got Moonshank last night from T3 rare weapons. It’s only 3g, but still 3g is 3g.) And also a chance at a precursor, or other expensive exotic gear. (Tossed in some pieces of exotic temple gear, got beserker leggings back. sold for 5g.)

Of course it is gambling, but as you said, you can get karma from doing just about anything, it’s easier to get than gold. So if you are sitting on millions of karma, have the skins you want, you really don’t have much to lose forging rares/exotics, and have a chance to get something cool.

Galen Grey.4709:

42K karma meant 100 events at max level.

Yes. Once. Now it’s 4 teq events.

phys.7689:

but they dont want to put interesting things in currency, because then people with a lot will get it instantly.
They will never put anything valuable for karma again because of this.

You are still thinking only about singular, high price tag purchases.

What needs to be introduced is karma purchases that offer a constant sink (for example consumables, crafting materials and one-use vanity items of some kind). Guild Halls might possibly offer a nice karma sink source, as (since it would be pooled together by many members) there would be far less disincentives to use big price tags on things.

Generally, do not think in terms of storage space. Think in terms of supply and demand. Adding one-time purchases will not increase that demand significantly, cap or no cap, while adding many small sinks has a potential to increase demand to the level where caps would be completely unnecessary.

(think of karma as silk from pre-ascended armor era. There was a huge supply, and massive amounts of it stored on TP and in personal accounts. And yet one change managed to exhaust all that almost instantly, with no cap needed for this at all. All that was needed was to introduce a sink that was significantly bigger than the supply)

pdavis.8031:

Of course it is gambling, but as you said, you can get karma from doing just about anything, it’s easier to get than gold. So if you are sitting on millions of karma, have the skins you want, you really don’t have much to lose forging rares/exotics, and have a chance to get something cool.

You have. Time. If i could just pour karma into MF (or something similar) directly for a result, i’d likely have far less of it than i have now. Now, all that stuff with buying stuff, forging stuff, salvaging stuff? Too much hassle, i’d rather farm sw.

Astralporing.1957:

Galen Grey.4709:

42K karma meant 100 events at max level.

Yes. Once. Now it’s 4 teq events.

Now those rewards are expired. Which veteran doesnt have millions of karma stored? Anet definitely no longer see them as something that keeps player interested in playing. In fact I wonder how many players actually care about karma anymore.

I was naturally speaking at launch when those rewards were still in play as an item to provide longevity to the game. Thats why I said “meant” not “means”

I’d like bloodstones, emp frags and drag ores become currency pls.

Galen Grey.4709:

Astralporing.1957:

Galen Grey.4709:

42K karma meant 100 events at max level.

Yes. Once. Now it’s 4 teq events.

Now those rewards are expired. Which veteran doesnt have millions of karma stored? Anet definitely no longer see them as something that keeps player interested in playing. In fact I wonder how many players actually care about karma anymore.

I was naturally speaking at launch when those rewards were still in play as an item to provide longevity to the game. Thats why I said “meant” not “means”

Wanna know who cares about karma? New and current people who are interested in making a legendary. Don’t be selfish just cause you think you don’t need karma.

Caelus.7139:

I’d like bloodstones, emp frags and drag ores become currency pls.

Galen Grey.4709:

Astralporing.1957:

Galen Grey.4709:

42K karma meant 100 events at max level.

Yes. Once. Now it’s 4 teq events.

Now those rewards are expired. Which veteran doesnt have millions of karma stored? Anet definitely no longer see them as something that keeps player interested in playing. In fact I wonder how many players actually care about karma anymore.

I was naturally speaking at launch when those rewards were still in play as an item to provide longevity to the game. Thats why I said “meant” not “means”

Wanna know who cares about karma? New and current people who are interested in making a legendary. Don’t be selfish just cause you think you don’t need karma.

sorry I meant veteran players wasnt clear enough. As for karma, its far from a bottle neck to craft legendary weapons. it takes what 500k-1m karma to craft a legendary weapon? how many veterans dont have 2m+, I bet most have 3m -5m. Thats enough for 4-10 legendary weapons. I doubt anyone has enough gold to get 4-10 precursors though.

Also I think you may have missed what the argument is about somewhat. I have like 3.5m karma but what we’re saying is cap that to say 1m perhaps 1.5m I am personally willing to loose the 2.5m – 2m karma specifically because i care for new players and am being the opposite of selfish.

As is right now either Anet never release another karma reward or like op said they have no choice but to price it high enough so that people like me cant just outright buy it without playing any of the content. In turn that means someone who is just starting out needs to earn millions of karma just to get to the baseline of when his effort to earn the reward starts.

Lets say for the sake of argument they make precursors buyable by karma and lets say they want people to play an average of 6 months to earn a precursor. As is they cant simply charge 6 months worth of karma because most players would be able to buy 3 – 5 precursors the moment that goes live. So they need to charge a lot more. average amount of karma people have + 6 months on top of that. For us it means 6 months more work, for new players it will mean 2 – 3 years work.

Thats just no fair and is bad for the game. of course in escense the result is what maddoctor said, Anet will simply not use karma for such rewards and use something else. In fact ironically they’re using collections which is in a way a capped currency

Putting a cap on my wealth? No thanks…

Galen Grey.4709:

Caelus.7139:

I’d like bloodstones, emp frags and drag ores become currency pls.

Galen Grey.4709:

Astralporing.1957:

Galen Grey.4709:

42K karma meant 100 events at max level.

Yes. Once. Now it’s 4 teq events.

Now those rewards are expired. Which veteran doesnt have millions of karma stored? Anet definitely no longer see them as something that keeps player interested in playing. In fact I wonder how many players actually care about karma anymore.

I was naturally speaking at launch when those rewards were still in play as an item to provide longevity to the game. Thats why I said “meant” not “means”

Wanna know who cares about karma? New and current people who are interested in making a legendary. Don’t be selfish just cause you think you don’t need karma.

sorry I meant veteran players wasnt clear enough. As for karma, its far from a bottle neck to craft legendary weapons. it takes what 500k-1m karma to craft a legendary weapon? how many veterans dont have 2m+, I bet most have 3m -5m. Thats enough for 4-10 legendary weapons. I doubt anyone has enough gold to get 4-10 precursors though.

Also I think you may have missed what the argument is about somewhat. I have like 3.5m karma but what we’re saying is cap that to say 1m perhaps 1.5m I am personally willing to loose the 2.5m – 2m karma specifically because i care for new players and am being the opposite of selfish.

As is right now either Anet never release another karma reward or like op said they have no choice but to price it high enough so that people like me cant just outright buy it without playing any of the content. In turn that means someone who is just starting out needs to earn millions of karma just to get to the baseline of when his effort to earn the reward starts.

Lets say for the sake of argument they make precursors buyable by karma and lets say they want people to play an average of 6 months to earn a precursor. As is they cant simply charge 6 months worth of karma because most players would be able to buy 3 – 5 precursors the moment that goes live. So they need to charge a lot more. average amount of karma people have + 6 months on top of that. For us it means 6 months more work, for new players it will mean 2 – 3 years work.

Thats just no fair and is bad for the game. of course in escense the result is what maddoctor said, Anet will simply not use karma for such rewards and use something else. In fact ironically they’re using collections which is in a way a capped currency

I’ve played off and on since head start and never crossed the 1M mark. I luckily had the amount I needed to buy enough obsidian shards for the Gift of Mastery and to get the Mystic Clovers I needed. And by then I was under 30K karma.

So don’t lump all veterans on the same boat. Us more casual veterans may not have the huge stores of karma.

I personally do not think there needs to be a cap in currencies. Yes, the veterans may reach the finish line sooner, but they spent the time to earn whatever it is that it took to buy the item. Why does it matter when they earned it?

Especially when they have found a solution to the keep the veterans from getting things on Day 1 problem: new currencies.

It is a solution. And not being in the wallet gives people a choice. Lose inventory holding space to hoard the currency or spend the currency. And that’s a LOT better than being told there is a cap on how much you can hold with no choice in the matter.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Putting a cap on my wealth? No thanks…

But…but it’s not FAIR that you have more money than me!
We need a wealth cap so that the top 1% players don’t get richer, and that extra money can be spread around to those who have less!
Theres no reason that you should be able to make more money than someone else, thats just unfair and not right!!
#gw2incomeinequality

(Sorry couldnt resist, been talking about income inequality with my brother-in-law and how unfair it was that certain companies make millions of dollars a year, and how unfair that was and why shouldn’t he be able to make millions of dollars a year. Its stupid.)

Even if there is a cap and old currencies are re-used, then people will hoard them. Put it this way, when I finish getting everything I want with a currency, then I’ll max it out and leave it that way for the next thing that comes along that will use it. I don’t see it solving anything as I’ll still have a head start.

From a QOL perspective, how about making a collections tab for new currencies? If you think about it you may come to the conclusion that everything in collections are already currencies. Would be a kind of cap without an actual hard cap if one wanted to use normal bank space for more.

I don’t even see how karma belongs in this discussion. It’s a different animal – game wide like gold. Unless you propose a cap on gold too.

My view at this point: Just say no to CAPS

While I do tentatively agree with this, there are however certain issues, most notably what to do with the existing amounts that would already be considerably above any potentially implemented cap? What about the people with the hillarious of karma or tens of thousands of dungeon tokens, laurels, or what-have-you? Perhaps a method of converting those excess currencies to Gold. Perhaps all currencies should involve a Currency to Gold exchange like Gems(though only the 1 way). While this would allow for people to quickly and easilly get rid of excess amounts and monetize their stacked currencies, it has a host of issues associated with.

Devildoc.6721:

I’d be happy to just see geodes and crests go to the wallet instead of taking inventory/bank space..

This.

If it took up inventory space, I would say put a cap on it. The currencies like Karma, Laurels, Fractal Relics don’t take up space though so no cap is necessary.

Astralporing.1957:

Galen Grey.4709:

42K karma meant 100 events at max level.

Yes. Once. Now it’s 4 teq events.

phys.7689:

but they dont want to put interesting things in currency, because then people with a lot will get it instantly.
They will never put anything valuable for karma again because of this.

You are still thinking only about singular, high price tag purchases.

What needs to be introduced is karma purchases that offer a constant sink (for example consumables, crafting materials and one-use vanity items of some kind). Guild Halls might possibly offer a nice karma sink source, as (since it would be pooled together by many members) there would be far less disincentives to use big price tags on things.

Generally, do not think in terms of storage space. Think in terms of supply and demand. Adding one-time purchases will not increase that demand significantly, cap or no cap, while adding many small sinks has a potential to increase demand to the level where caps would be completely unnecessary.

(think of karma as silk from pre-ascended armor era. There was a huge supply, and massive amounts of it stored on TP and in personal accounts. And yet one change managed to exhaust all that almost instantly, with no cap needed for this at all. All that was needed was to introduce a sink that was significantly bigger than the supply)

pdavis.8031:

Of course it is gambling, but as you said, you can get karma from doing just about anything, it’s easier to get than gold. So if you are sitting on millions of karma, have the skins you want, you really don’t have much to lose forging rares/exotics, and have a chance to get something cool.

You have. Time. If i could just pour karma into MF (or something similar) directly for a result, i’d likely have far less of it than i have now. Now, all that stuff with buying stuff, forging stuff, salvaging stuff? Too much hassle, i’d rather farm sw.

if karma is silk, from pre ascended, the best solution they can come up with is to create an insane grind, which gives karma use, by mechanically requiring you to burn thousands of it every day for months to achieve a goal.

The reality is, such perfect sinks arent easy to come by, and if they did, they would probably put them on other things related to the gold economy.

I dont really feel there is much gained by having no cap, except the ability to be more lazy, or stack up a lot at a time and spend it in one go. Which is nice, but it isnt really worth it in the long run, because really how much something is worth depends on what you can get with it.
once you cant get anything new with it, its worth less than before. and you can generally just use it for converting, which you can still do with a cap system, you just cant wait until the number is super high to do it.

basically you lose the ability to store a lot of currency at one time in exchange for the possibility of having that currency be more valuable, and have less currency glut.

Now dont get me wrong if they could make great, non grindy sinks that would be awesome, but i really dont think its very likely.

Erus Keb.8379:

Even if there is a cap and old currencies are re-used, then people will hoard them. Put it this way, when I finish getting everything I want with a currency, then I’ll max it out and leave it that way for the next thing that comes along that will use it. I don’t see it solving anything as I’ll still have a head start.

From a QOL perspective, how about making a collections tab for new currencies? If you think about it you may come to the conclusion that everything in collections are already currencies. Would be a kind of cap without an actual hard cap if one wanted to use normal bank space for more.

I don’t even see how karma belongs in this discussion. It’s a different animal – game wide like gold. Unless you propose a cap on gold too.

My view at this point: Just say no to CAPS

the cap is generally set at an amount that gives you a jump ahead, but not enough to make it that big a jump.

lets say the cap on dunegon tokens was 1000, they release an elite version of the dunegeon armors, with some added stuff. They make each piece cost 600.
yeah you get a jump on it, but you dont have it all in one day, and new players arent given some insane number like
5000 tokens per piece, which is designed not in terms of a good amount of runs before getting something, but in terms of how much old players have stacked up.

maddoctor.2738:

So how do we fix this? Let’s take a look at the BEST DESIGNED currency in the game, Guild Merits. Before anyone mentions how it is bad for small guilds, I’m not talking about acquisition here, I’m talking about hoarding and spending it (acquisition could use some work for small guilds, that’s NOT my point)

No and exactly because acquisition for small guilds is near impossible. Guild Merits are one of the WORST design currencies in game for this. Why, because of the limitations on acquisition, the capping of them, and especially because there is no exchange available for them. What the game needs is a currency exchange. Badges, crest, tokens, karma, and all other currencies should be on a commodities exchange. This way we can convert karma to tokens, tokens to crest, Crest to karma or whatever we want to, especially Guild Merits.

I also do not see a problem with players hoarding. Nor, do I see a problem with players being able to max out a Guild Hall in one day. Besides the fact that the gating comes from build timers as well as currency.

phys.7689:

the cap is generally set at an amount that gives you a jump ahead, but not enough to make it that big a jump.

Following that line of reasoning I believe that gold would also have to be capped. I recall a post some time back (possibly over a year ago) where a person bought every legendary weapon in the game with gold earned in game. The figure of 60K+ gold comes to mind as to what they made on the TP. That is a huge jump. And I’ve since heard others say that they have more on-hand than that 60k figure.

The more I think about it, the less I like the idea of caps.

phys.7689:

Erus Keb.8379:

Even if there is a cap and old currencies are re-used, then people will hoard them. Put it this way, when I finish getting everything I want with a currency, then I’ll max it out and leave it that way for the next thing that comes along that will use it. I don’t see it solving anything as I’ll still have a head start.

From a QOL perspective, how about making a collections tab for new currencies? If you think about it you may come to the conclusion that everything in collections are already currencies. Would be a kind of cap without an actual hard cap if one wanted to use normal bank space for more.

I don’t even see how karma belongs in this discussion. It’s a different animal – game wide like gold. Unless you propose a cap on gold too.

My view at this point: Just say no to CAPS

the cap is generally set at an amount that gives you a jump ahead, but not enough to make it that big a jump.

lets say the cap on dunegon tokens was 1000, they release an elite version of the dunegeon armors, with some added stuff. They make each piece cost 600.
yeah you get a jump on it, but you dont have it all in one day, and new players arent given some insane number like
5000 tokens per piece, which is designed not in terms of a good amount of runs before getting something, but in terms of how much old players have stacked up.

Why shouldn’t players get it instantly? What differences does it make if it happens 5 days later or instantly. Those players worked for it.

Erus Keb.8379:

phys.7689:

the cap is generally set at an amount that gives you a jump ahead, but not enough to make it that big a jump.

Following that line of reasoning I believe that gold would also have to be capped. I recall a post some time back (possibly over a year ago) where a person bought every legendary weapon in the game with gold earned in game. The figure of 60K+ gold comes to mind as to what they made on the TP. That is a huge jump. And I’ve since heard others say that they have more on-hand than that 60k figure.

The more I think about it, the less I like the idea of caps.

Gold is a different beast
1) its heavily managed
2) its relative; earning potential changes, costs change, etc
3) gold earning is pvp.

Tokens/other currencies have fixed values, in earning and in spending. And they are not competitive, you don’t have to out earn ot outbid players for dungeon tokens. How much you make isn’t effected by other players

runeblade.7514:

phys.7689:

Erus Keb.8379:

Even if there is a cap and old currencies are re-used, then people will hoard them. Put it this way, when I finish getting everything I want with a currency, then I’ll max it out and leave it that way for the next thing that comes along that will use it. I don’t see it solving anything as I’ll still have a head start.

From a QOL perspective, how about making a collections tab for new currencies? If you think about it you may come to the conclusion that everything in collections are already currencies. Would be a kind of cap without an actual hard cap if one wanted to use normal bank space for more.

I don’t even see how karma belongs in this discussion. It’s a different animal – game wide like gold. Unless you propose a cap on gold too.

My view at this point: Just say no to CAPS

the cap is generally set at an amount that gives you a jump ahead, but not enough to make it that big a jump.

lets say the cap on dunegon tokens was 1000, they release an elite version of the dunegeon armors, with some added stuff. They make each piece cost 600.
yeah you get a jump on it, but you dont have it all in one day, and new players arent given some insane number like
5000 tokens per piece, which is designed not in terms of a good amount of runs before getting something, but in terms of how much old players have stacked up.

Why shouldn’t players get it instantly? What differences does it make if it happens 5 days later or instantly. Those players worked for it.

It doesn’t matter if they should, they won’t give it to you for that amount of past work. It just won’t happen. New work, items, content etc will not be given to players so they can get it instantly based on past work.
They may allow people to get a slight advantage, but that’s it.

The end result is more and more currencies, less inventory space, and less value per currency.

“New work, items, content etc will not be given to players so they can get it instantly based on past work” How about new legendary weapons that were announced? Or the new content that was ascended gear. Those with plenty of gold were even able to bypass the time gate for ascended items. Which leaves me to believe that they want people to do things in a specific area. So, new content comes along, and let’s say they use crests again. If I don’t like the new content, what’s to stop me from going to Silverwastes to earn them for the new rewards? In essence, defeating the purpose of new currencies.

Dungeon tokens are not at a fixed value in relation to gold. One can use them in different ways and get different amounts of gold out of them. For one particular use, the value of them has gone down over time. I suspect that with a cap that value would just go down faster as people wouldn’t hoard them any longer resulting in more supply. Which does make them competitive depending on how they are used.

If we’re going to get a cap, I’d greatly prefer it if things that can be converted into gold are not capped.

Erus Keb.8379:

“New work, items, content etc will not be given to players so they can get it instantly based on past work” How about new legendary weapons that were announced? Or the new content that was ascended gear. Those with plenty of gold were even able to bypass the time gate for ascended items. Which leaves me to believe that they want people to do things in a specific area. So, new content comes along, and let’s say they use crests again. If I don’t like the new content, what’s to stop me from going to Silverwastes to earn them for the new rewards? In essence, defeating the purpose of new currencies.

Dungeon tokens are not at a fixed value in relation to gold. One can use them in different ways and get different amounts of gold out of them. For one particular use, the value of them has gone down over time. I suspect that with a cap that value would just go down faster as people wouldn’t hoard them any longer resulting in more supply. Which does make them competitive depending on how they are used.

If we’re going to get a cap, I’d greatly prefer it if things that can be converted into gold are not capped.

As I said, gold is different.
The prices for items based on gold are competitive, and gold doesn’t directly create items. The player gets the items through play and then he sells it for what he thinks its worth.
No amount of gold can make a precursor. You can buy one, but only for what someone is willing to sell it for.
Gold is competitive, they have decided for those items its ok that its pvp.
Token items are supposed to be different, they exist to represent actual game play

The fact that you can some times trade currencies ineffeciently for gold is not relevant. Because you can’t trade gold for the currencies, its primarily one way.

A cap doesn’t stop you from trading items for gold. It just means you trade it before hitting the cap, that’s all.

As for tokens being about new areas, that is very rough solution. It would be better to create a renown system.

Iason Evan.3806:

If it took up inventory space, I would say put a cap on it. The currencies like Karma, Laurels, Fractal Relics don’t take up space though so no cap is necessary.

But the currencies that take up inventory space, like geodes, bandit crests or pristine fractal relics, effectively are already capped. Only it’s not a hard cap, where the game says "you may store 3 stacks of that currency, and not a single bit more), but instead a soft cap, where you decide yourself where to put the cap. You are free to dedicate a full bank tab to one currency (at the expense of not being able to store other stuff in there), or only keep a single stack and spend it all as soon as your stack is full.

While inventory management can sometimes be a nuisance this way (personally I am often so indecisive about what to spend my currency on first, that I end up not spending it at all and dealing with the hassle of not enough bank space instead ), to me it is still infinitely preferable to a hard cap that doesn’t leave any room for each person’s priorities concerning whether to save or spend their loot.

Besides, one of the technical advantages of new currency is that it gives people incentive to play different areas of the game. Take dungeon tokens as an example: Let’s say they unify tokens from different dungeons to all be the same kind of currency. New dungeons are added, that also give unified dungeon tokens and offer rewards for that. Even with currency cap, how many people do you think will go through the process of truly learning and running the new dungeons compared with people just running CoF1 and SE1 daily to grab the new rewards?

New rewards for old currency are nice to have every now and then, but let’s face it: they also take away incentive from diving deeper into new content if you can just collect the currency needed by running old stuff brain-afk. As such, I don’t see currency caps as nothing but an artificial barrier to different playstyles and priorities. We already have soft caps on all the inventory-based currencies (due to limits on available inventory space), no need to make it more of a nuisance by adding hard caps.

Rasimir.6239:

Iason Evan.3806:

If it took up inventory space, I would say put a cap on it. The currencies like Karma, Laurels, Fractal Relics don’t take up space though so no cap is necessary.

But the currencies that take up inventory space, like geodes, bandit crests or pristine fractal relics, effectively are already capped. Only it’s not a hard cap, where the game says "you may store 3 stacks of that currency, and not a single bit more), but instead a soft cap, where you decide yourself where to put the cap. You are free to dedicate a full bank tab to one currency (at the expense of not being able to store other stuff in there), or only keep a single stack and spend it all as soon as your stack is full.

While inventory management can sometimes be a nuisance this way (personally I am often so indecisive about what to spend my currency on first, that I end up not spending it at all and dealing with the hassle of not enough bank space instead ), to me it is still infinitely preferable to a hard cap that doesn’t leave any room for each person’s priorities concerning whether to save or spend their loot.

Besides, one of the technical advantages of new currency is that it gives people incentive to play different areas of the game. Take dungeon tokens as an example: Let’s say they unify tokens from different dungeons to all be the same kind of currency. New dungeons are added, that also give unified dungeon tokens and offer rewards for that. Even with currency cap, how many people do you think will go through the process of truly learning and running the new dungeons compared with people just running CoF1 and SE1 daily to grab the new rewards?

New rewards for old currency are nice to have every now and then, but let’s face it: they also take away incentive from diving deeper into new content if you can just collect the currency needed by running old stuff brain-afk. As such, I don’t see currency caps as nothing but an artificial barrier to different playstyles and priorities. We already have soft caps on all the inventory-based currencies (due to limits on available inventory space), no need to make it more of a nuisance by adding hard caps.

you make the unlocks for the dungeon require gameplay within the dungeon.

Beat all paths and you have access to a hidden room in the dungeon with an npc who sells items.
so you basically have to beat the paths, and then whenever you want to spend them you need to do at least one dungeon run.
If you have beaten every path, and can beat the dungeon itself in order to get the npc, you have proven enough skill at it. After that point its just repeating something you may not want to do, for something you do want.
If they want some rewards to require more effort, make them have different npcs they unlock after dungeon completition that require harder achievements.

That type of method makes dungeons relevant, but also doesnt force you to grind specifics too much. and keep in mind you can already get dungeon tokens now, without doing any dungeons, in spvp.

renown/achievement based systems can better reward gameplay, without adding grind, and inventory issues. The tokens in that case would be your effort put in, and the achievements/renown is your key to make sure people do, and have reason to do the content.

As long as there a method to convert a given currency to a standard one (gold), creating a cap on a currency naturally will force a conversion to that standard as the cap is reached.

Without taking that flight into account, it’s irresponsible to simply implement such a cap.

For all those requesting a non-gold currency cap, how do account for this conversion and it’s impact?

Mourningcry.9428:

As long as there a method to convert a given currency to a standard one (gold), creating a cap on a currency naturally will force a conversion to that standard as the cap is reached.

Without taking that flight into account, it’s irresponsible to simply implement such a cap.

For all those requesting a non-gold currency cap, how do account for this conversion and it’s impact?

they already accounted for that. Thats why all the conversions are so crappy in terms of value of the cash out.

keep in mind that these items arent free, they are obtained through effort. a dynamic event gives like 2 silver and 378 karma. farming any event besides a few, is giving you virtualy no value. 378 karma
266 karma for a linen item.
you need 4 of them to make one salvageable item
1064 karma for one salvageable linen item
3 events, in exchange for 1 drop.
thats crappy payout. You are basically wasting your resource, and the time earning it. Its easier to get profit by killing bandits than by getting karma.
and thats one of the best payouts using karma.

Point is, they already figured in people offloading karma into their equation, people cannot earn enough to actually effect the economy for more than small amount of time, because the payouts are designed to be poor.
People built up tons of karma by playing for a long time, they dont actually earn that much, after an initial drop, these currencies can only add a very small amount of supply relative to any particular market.

just like when they added orrian boxes
at first everyone was burning them up.
then they ran out of karma, and had barely any profit to show for it, and couldnt earn new karma fast enough to make a dent in any of the markets.

@Phys

The difference being that the current implementation offers an optional conversion. A hard cap forces a conversion.

With respect to your analysis, the current conversion rates may be considered poor by some, and hence they chose not to convert, rather opting to bank the given currency. A cap will force such a conversion or result in wasted currency.

Regardless of what this rate is, it will be an increase versus the current rate.

In the simplest terms, an increase in gold and it’s resulting impacts.

Devildoc.6721:

I’d be happy to just see geodes and crests go to the wallet instead of taking inventory/bank space..

I second this – reason why I have no interest in the new zones whatsoever “Take this junk to get that junk oh and you also need this junk and that junk and here’s some more junk and we also have that junk – all of it is 1% useful so don’t delete it”.