Guild Wars 2

Vayne.8563:

I have characters that have no ascended gear and again, they can do everything in the game. Even if I wanted to do high level fractals, I never need an amulet or earrings to do that. It’s just not necessary. You’re making a need that doesn’t exist.

Anet made a compromise, giving some people something to grind for without gating the content for everyone else. Do this. Take one character, get no ascended gear on him and run the game. Do everything. Then tell me you need that.

More than anything, you’re talking about a mindset. People thinking they need BIS gear on every character. A lot of this is a holdover from other games where content is gated because of gear.

That’s simply not the case here.

1. Will a character in full Exotics be at a disadvantage to a player decked out head to toe in Ascended gear in WvWvW?
2. I don’t recall actually saying Ascended gear was needed to complete content; I said that your character used to feel ‘complete’ when you had full Exotic gear, and now it doesn’t feel complete because Ascended. I don’t think this is an MMO thing, but a general hobby thing; alts are projects which I like to complete, and the standing means by which to get Ascended gear feels like a cheap kitten-block to finishing that project. I hope we can at the very least agree on that.

Out of curiosity, how many people -do- buy dyes with their laurels?

Vayne.8563. “Ask yourself this…if Guild Wars 2 suddenly went pay to play, how many people would still be here? Even I’d leave. Not because I don’t like the game, but because it would be a betrayal of trust I couldn’t live with. The five guys left paying a monthly fee wouldn’t keep the game alive.”

I guarantee you that more people would stay than you would think. As far as betrayal goes, many feel betrayed by the recent patches and are still here so… IMO people would leave and most would eat it and stay (depending on the price). After all, it is a great game. Definitely worth the money I put into it thus far. On that note, I do not think they will steal people’s gems or remove accounts for the LULZ. The point is that is the agreement, and that is what they are telling you they are willing to do. Regardless of what they end up doing or not doing, which is my point.

Agent Ice.6578:

Vayne.8563. “Ask yourself this…if Guild Wars 2 suddenly went pay to play, how many people would still be here? Even I’d leave. Not because I don’t like the game, but because it would be a betrayal of trust I couldn’t live with. The five guys left paying a monthly fee wouldn’t keep the game alive.”

I guarantee you that more people would stay than you would think. As far as betrayal goes, many feel betrayed by the recent patches and are still here so… IMO people would leave and most would eat it and stay (depending on the price). After all, it is a great game. Definitely worth the money I put into it thus far. On that note, I do not think they will steal people’s gems or remove accounts for the LULZ. The point is that is the agreement, and that is what they are telling you they are willing to do. Regardless of what they end up doing or not doing, which is my point.

No, the agreement is telling us what they might feel they need a legal recourse to do. It could be something as simple as confiscating gems from accounts bought with stolen card, or something to do with gold farming. They need legal stuff to protect them when they do certain things.

There’s no real benefit to taking gems away from a legit person who bought them. But if people found a way to scam with them, or if someone is using stolen cards to buy gems, sell them for gold and then sell the gold, Anet might want the ability to seize or freeze those gems, no?

Yeah yeah, WoW mindset. Hunter, Ranger, Tomato, Tomato(e). Both use bows, both have pets, just one game’s pets are in the special needs classes….

Technically, I am ‘paying’ a monthly fee. If I have the spare cash on my paypal, and I like the patch, I spend 10 bucks on gems. If anything else, other than the forums, this gives me at least the feeling of sending word to them on how I feel.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Dante.1508:

its just a money milking machine that cares very little for their players,

How do you reconcile this belief with the fact that many of the changes to the game were made in response to requests by players?

• Ascended gear: requested by people who wanted more to do, a way to progress
• Ascended available in a variety of ways: in response to outcry against FotM
• Dailies providing choices: requested by players
• AC changes: requested by dungeon players who thought the boss fights were boring
• Changes to meta boss chests I (guaranteed rare): requested by players
• Changes to meta boss chests II (1 day/account): an attempt, in part, to address the negatives brought up by players
• Guild Missions I: Players said there was no reason to be in a guild
• Guild Missions II: Response to small guilds which complained about Guild Missions I

Good kitten, man! If they care little about about what players want, why the frack are they listening to them? I recognize that not every change has pleased everyone, but sweeping, baseless generalities are over the top.

Everything you said circles around time gated grind and carrot on the stick to keep players in game and not leaving, the rares are there for exactly the same reasons to keep the populations playing, if you cannot see all those things you quoted are so the company can retain players to make money, i feel you’re a bit sheltered..

Has very little to do with caring about players and more to do with players buying gems..if they really cared about their customers over money the new and old weapons and items in black lion chests wouldn’t exist, heck the chests wouldn’t exist, we wouldn’t need 15 types of tokens, karma would actually get you stuff worth having, everything would be in game as drops etc..

Its not.

Vayne.8563, Yet they can choose not to refund you for those gems that someone bought with your info. They also have to approve the refund or they can take action against you. To straighten the record though, I am not the one that posted about the gem confiscation. I can see your point Vayne. However, unless something is stated specifically in a legal agreement, there is a lot of wiggle room. I would also want to believe that this is just to protect themselves and their property when necessary. Maybe I am just a paranoid human being? _ It would obviously not be to their benefit to be seen as abusive with their TOS. Maybe you actually sat and read the TOS in its entirety. I read through all of it at least once, and most of it a few times to make sure I actually read what I read. Again, I am not saying that they would do this, but they leave the possibility open. If you truly do not intend to do something, you would not put it or allow it to be on the table in the first place.

Agent Ice.6578:

V
I guarantee you that more people would stay than you would think. As far as betrayal goes, many feel betrayed by the recent patches and are still here so…

Thats because of the lack of competition, anet lucked out in terms of release date. I

If people are not enjoying themselves they will leave and do something else. It has nothing to do with competition. GW2 as a product is competing against every other game out there.

morrolan.9608:

Agent Ice.6578:

V
I guarantee you that more people would stay than you would think. As far as betrayal goes, many feel betrayed by the recent patches and are still here so…

Thats because of the lack of competition, anet lucked out in terms of release date. I

Not sure if you were quite done when you hit the reply button, but anyway… :-)

Unfortunately, this is as sad as it’s true.

I’ve had a look around and there are currently nothing in the MMO space to switch to.

It’ll be a difficult thing to switch, when a decent contender eventually arrives because GW2 did so many things right at launch. Give me something with a grindless character leveling system, astounding graphics, hearts based quest system, shared nodes/loot – as a start. Add to that: more skill variety, proper raid content, a lfg feature built in, personal goals (gated ONLY by challenging content), a proper player driven economy with tried-and-tested trading rules where playing the markets is possible, but not easily the most lucrative activity you can do in-game…

I can go on and on. But, give me that as a start, in a fantasy setting – and I’m there!

Agent Ice.6578:

Vayne.8563, Yet they can choose not to refund you for those gems that someone bought with your info. They also have to approve the refund or they can take action against you. To straighten the record though, I am not the one that posted about the gem confiscation. I can see your point Vayne. However, unless something is stated specifically in a legal agreement, there is a lot of wiggle room. I would also want to believe that this is just to protect themselves and their property when necessary. Maybe I am just a paranoid human being? _ It would obviously not be to their benefit to be seen as abusive with their TOS. Maybe you actually sat and read the TOS in its entirety. I read through all of it at least once, and most of it a few times to make sure I actually read what I read. Again, I am not saying that they would do this, but they leave the possibility open. If you truly do not intend to do something, you would not put it or allow it to be on the table in the first place.

It’s actually more than that. There are several legal precedents that require people to have things in there contracts, or they forfeit certain rights. This happens for example with trademark protection. If you don’t actively pursue someone who uses your trademark, then you, to some degree, forfeit the trademark protection. This law actually forces companies to go after people they might have left alone.

Legal departments produce the TOS and they do it, almost exclusively to protect the company. Many changes that are made to TOS’s are actually made based on new laws or new interpretations of old laws, based on trials that have recently concluded. Often changes to a TOS have nothing at all to do with a companies intent.

Yea, or I could go watch movies, play a sport, work on a hobby, or God forbid, or break out some other game… Everyone that plays this game, is not just a straight up MMORPG player. I am actually more of an FPS player myself because I like actual skill more than button spam and MMO player vs GM drama. However, this game sounded like it would be a good MMO so I thought I would give it a chance.

Dante.1508:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Dante.1508:

its just a money milking machine that cares very little for their players,

How do you reconcile this belief with the fact that many of the changes to the game were made in response to requests by players?

• Ascended gear: requested by people who wanted more to do, a way to progress
• Ascended available in a variety of ways: in response to outcry against FotM
• Dailies providing choices: requested by players
• AC changes: requested by dungeon players who thought the boss fights were boring
• Changes to meta boss chests I (guaranteed rare): requested by players
• Changes to meta boss chests II (1 day/account): an attempt, in part, to address the negatives brought up by players
• Guild Missions I: Players said there was no reason to be in a guild
• Guild Missions II: Response to small guilds which complained about Guild Missions I

Good kitten, man! If they care little about about what players want, why the frack are they listening to them? I recognize that not every change has pleased everyone, but sweeping, baseless generalities are over the top.

Everything you said circles around time gated grind and carrot on the stick to keep players in game and not leaving, the rares are there for exactly the same reasons to keep the populations playing, if you cannot see all those things you quoted are so the company can retain players to make money, i feel you’re a bit sheltered..

Has very little to do with caring about players and more to do with players buying gems..if they really cared about their customers over money the new and old weapons and items in black lion chests wouldn’t exist, heck the chests wouldn’t exist, we wouldn’t need 15 types of tokens, karma would actually get you stuff worth having, everything would be in game as drops etc..

Its not.

Yes, if they cared about their players they would do away with methods of their business generating income and instead increase farmability and encourage grind play on servers that they can no longer pay for.

Yes – if you track some of the most frustrating parts of the game back far enought they link directly to an initiative to encourage the player to chip a few bucks into the collection tray, I still don’t have a problem with paying to see this game evolve into something new and interesting – I don’t want to play GW1, WoW, DAoC or Aion (etc) again, if I did I’d go do that some more instead.

I do agree with some of your principal ideas, but think there is too much being forced together there…

Geotherma.2395:

TexZero.7910:

Geotherma.2395:

Disclaimer:This thread is not directed towards all players in Guild Wars 2, nor is it in any way a flame thread against others. The opinions herein are my own and reflect my personal beliefs and views.

Have you tried finishing the living story?
Have you tried the new content changes?
Have you found the perfect Guild or Guilds for you?
Have you made friends to occupy your time in between what you do everyday?

Just some questions to ask yourself while your farming the same 4-5+ events over and over.

Answering your questions in order.

Yes, whats been released is done.
Nope, been locked out of it thanks to ludicrous standards. (Please explain what you have been locked out of)
Been running with the same guild for ages now, thanks for the concern sorry it’s not upto your standards of being a 500man faceless organization.(At no time did I say you needed a 500 person guild)
Made friends just fine, thanks for assuming we are all anti-social because we voice complaints based on the gating of content when the manifesto said the content would be available to even smaller guilds.(There were no assumptions made, simply these questions are for yourself. They are not to appease my style of gaming, nor do I think anyone should tell others how to play)

The whole lot of your post assumes people just sit at events, not everyone is like that. Meanwhile no one should be forced to play the way we currently are being. You want to progress, Farm Fractals or CoF p1. That’s it. End of story. That’s pathetic and goes against Anets whole design choice. They want us to do these events but then put in restrictions. DR + Chest Limitations = Complete horsecrap. They seriously need to remove these foolish limitations or significantly revamp the Open World.

I feel like you skimmed the thread and responded. While you are allowed your opinion it is clear that you are the one making some pretty vague assumptions. I replied selectively to your points, as you can see in my thread in no way was I assuming anything about anyone. The questions I posted were something of a personal nature that players can ask themselves to see where they are in the game and evaluate how they play. The answer is purely personal and is for no one else to judge. they just added some small part to guilds to build influence and help them achieve enough to further there missions. This is a step not their entire answer to the problem at hand. They realize it is not ideal for all and they are working on trying to make it so it is. Please before responding read carefully and don’t make assumptions based on your anger at the game or forums.

You assume anger and want to patronize players for voicing their concerns, frustration and complaints. Good guy. Glad to see that you can peer into the text and instantly jump to anger as a conclusion as opposed to passion for the game.

Kinda what i expected though, the same psuedo-passive aggressive nonsense. Oh guys stop whinning they are trying. Yeah we know, and when they make missteps we(the players) are going to let them know it otherwise they will assume silence means everything is fine.

It’s better to let you voice be heard than silenced. So kindly OP stop trying to force your ideals on others, your aren’t a saint. Your post is a passive aggressive flame and troll bait. If people are going to voice their complaints and you disagree, do so constructively something you’ve failed miserably at when creating this topic.

TexZero.7910:

Geotherma.2395:

TexZero.7910:

Geotherma.2395:

You assume anger and want to patronize players for voicing their concerns, frustration and complaints. Good guy. Glad to see that you can peer into the text and instantly jump to anger as a conclusion as opposed to passion for the game.

Kinda what i expected though, the same psuedo-passive aggressive nonsense. Oh guys stop whinning they are trying. Yeah we know, and when they make missteps we(the players) are going to let them know it otherwise they will assume silence means everything is fine.

It’s better to let you voice be heard than silenced. So kindly OP stop trying to force your ideals on others, your aren’t a saint. Your post is a passive aggressive flame and troll bait. If people are going to voice their complaints and you disagree, do so constructively something you’ve failed miserably at when creating this topic.

I’ll just clear this up for you. At no point did I assume anything or tell people not to express their concerns please try reading as others have done. As far as the passive aggressive remarks I am a veteran who killed and protected people for my country. I am by far the least passive aggressive person you will find. It is called intelligent conversation and reasoning. if you care to reply next time try putting thought and reading comprehension into it.

I haven’t complained about anyone voicing concerns you seem to be the sole person stating as such. I’ll leave you with your snarky comments to be handled by someone else who has actually read and comprehended my purpose of this thread. Which again was in no way to deter people from voicing concerns.

Geotherma.2395:

Disclaimer:This thread is not directed towards all players in Guild Wars 2, nor is it in any way a flame thread against others.

Now I’m by no means an expert at any part of Guild Wars 2, nor do I think I’m better than anyone else.

When a patch comes and something is perhaps taken away, most often I see people complain that what they liked is gone. But rarely do I see those same people suggest what to fill in the gaps with that would be more beneficial than what we had.

I know it is simply because these and events like these offer loot, but I feel the community needs to look at the game as a whole.

So I would just like to say in closing, everyone has a right to an opinion. But there is so much to look at to truly grasp the size and magnificence of this game. It is not perfect, nor is anyone here, but it strives hard to be just the way we want it. Not as individuals but as a community.

Truly understand constructive feedback, and break free of being the shortsighted observer. become the player that others can respect even if they disagree with your opinions and ideas.

Disclaimer: Posting Disclaimer doesn’t make your viewpoint any less unbiased, passive aggressive or any less of a flame bait / troll thread.

You claim to be able to agree to disagree but can’t break free of the same preconceptions that you bash others for.

Disclaimer: I didn’t out right call you a hypocrite for this but it’s heavily implied.

As for “Serving your country” not making you a passive aggressive person, yeah sure. I guess you can’t be passive aggressive with your voice and bendover to commands when your life is on the line. The two arent even remotely the same. It has nothing to do with intelligent discourse. The manner in which you are trying to go about getting this discourse is several logical fallacies unto itself.

You want intelligent discourse, go read what you wrote. The tone and manner in which it is posted and ask yourself … Does this sound like a good premise for discussion or am i just trying to stroke my own ego and look down on others whilst playing on the emotions of others to ride my bandwagon.

Yeah intelligent discourse my foot.

TexZero.7910:

Disclaimer: Posting Disclaimer doesn’t make your viewpoint any less unbiased, passive aggressive or any less of a flame bait / troll thread.

You claim to be able to agree to disagree but can’t break free of the same preconceptions that you bash others for.

Disclaimer: I didn’t out right call you a hypocrite for this but it’s heavily implied.

As for “Serving your country” not making you a passive aggressive person, yeah sure. I guess you can’t be passive aggressive with your voice and bendover to commands when your life is on the line. The two arent even remotely the same. It has nothing to do with intelligent discourse. The manner in which you are trying to go about getting this discourse is several logical fallacies unto itself.

You want intelligent discourse, go read what you wrote. The tone and manner in which it is posted and ask yourself … Does this sound like a good premise for discussion or am i just trying to stroke my own ego and look down on others whilst playing on the emotions of others to ride my bandwagon.

Yeah intelligent discourse my foot.

You have yet to explain which part where I bash others. Still waiting for an intelligent response that isn’t an attack.

Vayne.8563:

Sarrs.4831:

I don’t know if I’d say the game’s degraded, but I’d definitely say that Anet seems to be moving out of the park of what the game originally was. There are only a few pieces of content that they’ve put out since release that I can definitely say have improved the game, those being FotM and the holiday events, and even then FotM needed some iteration to get right.

On the other hand, the new patches seem very interested in forcing you to do what they’re bringing, with Ascended gear, despite the fact that a lot of people enjoyed the base game’s content for what it was. What content are you ‘forced’ into to gear up a character? You’re at the very least forced to do your dailies and monthlies (kitten timegating), you have to do guild missions, the minimum size of which is pretty dang restrictive, and you have to do FotM; personally, I’m okay with FotM, but plenty of people are getting cranky over having to do it instead of playing in wuvwuv.

To me, it looks like ANet’s thinking “what patch feature can we slap ascended gear onto this time?” with every second patch, occasionally mixing it up with “let’s put in a timegate lol”. Admittedly, I’ve got a very limited data set, but you need to look at what they do, not what they say. What they’re doing?… Well, they added new weapon prefixes to the wuvwuv vendors, so I guess that’s a nice start, but no armors or Ascended gear. They changed the icons for light gear?… /shrug

Also maybe they should vet some of their bigger changes like the Quickness change before implementing them. A 50% nerf to the most popular elite in the game out of nowhere isn’t very nice.

So if you liked the original content, why do you feel you need ascended gear now. Most of my characters don’t have ascended gear and I do all the content in the game on them. The only thing you’d need ascended gear for, certainly at this point, is the higher levels of the fractals, and the fractals give you the gear you need to do them if you do them.

If you like the base game and you’re playing the base game, why do you insist you need to get ascended gear? Do you know how many people get laurels and just buy dye packs with them?

Ascended gear is simply the initial implementation of vertical progression. The power of the game will continue to progress vertically, because, well, that’s what vertical progression is. It doesn’t matter in the slightest whether you feel you need ascended gear or not. If you want to play the game over time you will follow the power curve. Vertical progression primarily is used for two things. One, to provide players with a sense of progression (necessary in any game) and two, to promote continued play. How does it promote it? Simple, it doesn’t really give you a choice. We are talking about the power level of the game. You can’t play the game, long-term, if you don’t perform the activities that keep you consistent with it. Here those activities are FotM, Dailies, Monthlies, and guild missions. Please educate yourself on this aspect of game design, it’s very well known, and stop spreading misinformation about it being optional.

Geotherma.2395:

TexZero.7910:

Disclaimer: Posting Disclaimer doesn’t make your viewpoint any less unbiased, passive aggressive or any less of a flame bait / troll thread.

You claim to be able to agree to disagree but can’t break free of the same preconceptions that you bash others for.

Disclaimer: I didn’t out right call you a hypocrite for this but it’s heavily implied.

As for “Serving your country” not making you a passive aggressive person, yeah sure. I guess you can’t be passive aggressive with your voice and bendover to commands when your life is on the line. The two arent even remotely the same. It has nothing to do with intelligent discourse. The manner in which you are trying to go about getting this discourse is several logical fallacies unto itself.

You want intelligent discourse, go read what you wrote. The tone and manner in which it is posted and ask yourself … Does this sound like a good premise for discussion or am i just trying to stroke my own ego and look down on others whilst playing on the emotions of others to ride my bandwagon.

Yeah intelligent discourse my foot.

You have yet to explain which part where I bash others. Still waiting for an intelligent response that isn’t an attack.

Have you at all read your threads title ?

I guess that reading comprehension you say im lacking was lost on both of us.

You have come into this thread hoisting yourself on a soapbox setting yourself apart from the community while simultaneously labeling those who don’t share your point of view.

You instantly start off with an ad-hominem right there. Not a good way to go about inciting “intelligent discussion”.

Then you further prove this by having the notion to put a “Disclaimer” on your post as if to say, hey i know im being offensive to you all but i honestly dont care because my opinions are better than yours.

Yeah real good man, real good.

Glad you served our country and all, but you totally are trampling on the very foundation of this country freedom of speech and expression.

TexZero.7910:

Geotherma.2395:

TexZero.7910:

Disclaimer: Posting Disclaimer doesn’t make your viewpoint any less unbiased, passive aggressive or any less of a flame bait / troll thread.

You claim to be able to agree to disagree but can’t break free of the same preconceptions that you bash others for.

Disclaimer: I didn’t out right call you a hypocrite for this but it’s heavily implied.

As for “Serving your country” not making you a passive aggressive person, yeah sure. I guess you can’t be passive aggressive with your voice and bendover to commands when your life is on the line. The two arent even remotely the same. It has nothing to do with intelligent discourse. The manner in which you are trying to go about getting this discourse is several logical fallacies unto itself.

You want intelligent discourse, go read what you wrote. The tone and manner in which it is posted and ask yourself … Does this sound like a good premise for discussion or am i just trying to stroke my own ego and look down on others whilst playing on the emotions of others to ride my bandwagon.

Yeah intelligent discourse my foot.

You have yet to explain which part where I bash others. Still waiting for an intelligent response that isn’t an attack.

Have you at all read your threads title ?

I guess that reading comprehension you say im lacking was lost on both of us.

You have come into this thread hoisting yourself on a soapbox setting yourself apart from the community while simultaneously labeling those who don’t share your point of view.

You instantly start off with an ad-hominem right there. Not a good way to go about inciting “intelligent discussion”.

Then you further prove this by having the notion to put a “Disclaimer” on your post as if to say, hey i know im being offensive to you all but i honestly dont care because my opinions are better than yours.

Yeah real good man, real good.

Glad you served our country and all, but you totally are trampling on the very foundation of this country freedom of speech and expression.

You have completely derailed the discussion that was happening because of said post. So in fact, you have proved my point. I at no point said i was better. The title implied a discussion on those who are a bit shortsighted on the games development. It brought relevant and intellectual discussion posts until you decided to flame the person who created the thread. I’m unsure of your reasoning or logic in doing this but you have done nothing but prove that people would rather flame others than have constructive things to say. This post was specifically to discuss what I felt, the disclaimer was simply to avoid people saying that this was how I want the game to be etc. At no point EVER did I say people cannot speak up or complain, I fail to see where you are getting this. But I can attempt to clarify once again JUST for you and maybe others who just didn’t get it:

This thread is to ask people to not troll, flame, harass others who had ideas or complaints. And for those who do complain to take a moment and see the entire picture before just posting a complaint that is not followed by a constructive suggestion. That is the entire point of this thread, and others have gone with the theme. The only person bashing anyone here is you, not that I mind, I’m a big boy and can take it. But seriously you have done nothing but derail some very good suggestions and discussions, which again, was the point of this thread. I’m very sorry if you or others for some reason thought I was somehow saying “I’m better than you, do things my way”. Clearly that wasn’t my intention. Now I don’t wish to sit here and have this pointless argument with you since clearly your headed somewhere with what YOU think my thread is about, and that road I’m not going to follow. I encourage others to continue with the interesting and enlightening discussion as was the purpose of this thread.

No really folks – most of the vocal player base cannot see three steps into the future, the constant concerns about “today” and the lack of interest in responses from other players and Anet regarding why things are not implemented, or can’t/ought not be – just tunnelled and shortsighted grinding an axe with their pet hate written on it.

Don’t buy it? Read this sub-forum, the suggestions sub-forum, and any of the class sub-forums for an hour or two – evidenced.

Sarrs.4831:

1. Will a character in full Exotics be at a disadvantage to a player decked out head to toe in Ascended gear in WvWvW?

That depends, are they an Engineer, Necromancer, or Ranger? If so why are you in WvW? RUN! RUN AND NEVER LOOK BACK!

Ahem.

The bigger question is why on earth are you attempting to solo-take someone in WvW?

2. I don’t recall actually saying Ascended gear was needed to complete content; I said that your character used to feel ‘complete’ when you had full Exotic gear, and now it doesn’t feel complete because Ascended. I don’t think this is an MMO thing, but a general hobby thing; alts are projects which I like to complete, and the standing means by which to get Ascended gear feels like a cheap kitten-block to finishing that project. I hope we can at the very least agree on that.

Hmmm, sort of. I’ve rarely had alts which I’ve felt the desire to polish up to “full spec”. I think the last one was my cleric in EverQuest because he was more in demand than a ranger. Also because I could read Game of Thrones books and heal at the same time.

Out of curiosity, how many people -do- buy dyes with their laurels?

I’ve considered it. I’ve also rejected it based on the concept of “I don’t need dyes that much”.

Geotherma.2395:

You have completely derailed the discussion that was happening because of said post. So in fact, you have proved my point. I at no point said i was better. The title implied a discussion on those who are a bit shortsighted on the games development. It brought relevant and intellectual discussion posts until you decided to flame the person who created the thread. I’m unsure of your reasoning or logic in doing this but you have done nothing but prove that people would rather flame others than have constructive things to say. This post was specifically to discuss what I felt, the disclaimer was simply to avoid people saying that this was how I want the game to be etc. At no point EVER did I say people cannot speak up or complain, I fail to see where you are getting this. But I can attempt to clarify once again JUST for you and maybe others who just didn’t get it:

This thread is to ask people to not troll, flame, harass others who had ideas or complaints. And for those who do complain to take a moment and see the entire picture before just posting a complaint that is not followed by a constructive suggestion. That is the entire point of this thread, and others have gone with the theme. The only person bashing anyone here is you, not that I mind, I’m a big boy and can take it. But seriously you have done nothing but derail some very good suggestions and discussions, which again, was the point of this thread. I’m very sorry if you or others for some reason thought I was somehow saying “I’m better than you, do things my way”. Clearly that wasn’t my intention. Now I don’t wish to sit here and have this pointless argument with you since clearly your headed somewhere with what YOU think my thread is about, and that road I’m not going to follow. I encourage others to continue with the interesting and enlightening discussion as was the purpose of this thread.

So you instantly dismiss what im saying yet again because it does not match up with what you view as your intent.

Fine. Let me give you a “Proposed Change” some constructive criticism.

Your topic line, is bad. Instead of labeling people as being shortsighted you could have instead started off with something like so.

“An in-depth look at the direction of change”

You can then lead off your first paragraph with something along these lines.

I believe, Anet is trying and to make a truly enjoyable product for the masses, and while the past few patches may have rubbed you the wrong way its not all bad. Infact … (insert claims of praise here). That isn’t to say they have strayed and made mistakes however i believe these slow patches are a sign of greater things to come (insert hypothesis here). I would like to see others take on this.

Your entire introduction then no longer needs a disclaimer

Instead you went the route of naturally introducing a divisive nature into your topic not once but twice. I’ll point this out again, then you keep on this path and use logical fallacies throughout your posting. If you really wanted any insightful constructive discourse to occur you would have refrained from all of that.

Vayne.8563:

Geotherma.2395:

Vayne.8563:

Geotherma.2395:

Agent Ice.6578:

Vayne.8563, I am sure Anet will do what it wants, just as it has. Just like recent patches, some love them, others lament them. Some will see this game as being worth a monthly fee or w/e. People would still pay to play this. After all, people played WoW for years, didn’t they? Many of those people still do. My point is that is in the TOS. They may, or may not implement, but if they did not intend to, why is it in the agreement? They are keeping all options on the table, which means that someday they may want to. Also, as my other point, if you refuse to play they may just delete your account that you spent hours/days/months/years on. Personally I hope this is not implemented, but only time well tell. I just felt that this deserved to have some attention as many readily click the “I agree” button and move on.

I was going to edit my post to say pretty much this as well. This is exactly why i believe it was added, to cover bases they have ideas for in the future. I doubt its as simple as “soon we will start stealing peoples gems and closing accounts for fun just because they clicked (Accept)”

Companies like NCsoft often have a single user agreement across ALL their products. It simplifies things for them. It doesn’t mean that this product will change.

Ask yourself this…if Guild Wars 2 suddenly went pay to play, how many people would still be here? Even I’d leave. Not because I don’t like the game, but because it would be a betrayal of trust I couldn’t live with. The five guys left paying a monthly fee wouldn’t keep the game alive.

I agree it makes sense to have a legal agreement company wide to simplify things. Somewhere inside I feel like Arenanet could be huge on its own, but we won’t go there :P

Anet could have been huge on it’s own, I agree, but they didn’t have the money to develop Guild Wars 1. That’s why they went to NCsoft in the first place. A lot of people don’t realize that NCsoft bought Anet before Guild Wars 1 launched. They’ve been around all along.

Without those funds, Anet couldn’t have released the first games and we wouldn’t have Guild Wars 2 at all.

It makes me wonder what would have been different if they had ^^

Raine.1394:

Vayne.8563:

Sarrs.4831:

I don’t know if I’d say the game’s degraded, but I’d definitely say that Anet seems to be moving out of the park of what the game originally was. There are only a few pieces of content that they’ve put out since release that I can definitely say have improved the game, those being FotM and the holiday events, and even then FotM needed some iteration to get right.

On the other hand, the new patches seem very interested in forcing you to do what they’re bringing, with Ascended gear, despite the fact that a lot of people enjoyed the base game’s content for what it was. What content are you ‘forced’ into to gear up a character? You’re at the very least forced to do your dailies and monthlies (kitten timegating), you have to do guild missions, the minimum size of which is pretty dang restrictive, and you have to do FotM; personally, I’m okay with FotM, but plenty of people are getting cranky over having to do it instead of playing in wuvwuv.

To me, it looks like ANet’s thinking “what patch feature can we slap ascended gear onto this time?” with every second patch, occasionally mixing it up with “let’s put in a timegate lol”. Admittedly, I’ve got a very limited data set, but you need to look at what they do, not what they say. What they’re doing?… Well, they added new weapon prefixes to the wuvwuv vendors, so I guess that’s a nice start, but no armors or Ascended gear. They changed the icons for light gear?… /shrug

Also maybe they should vet some of their bigger changes like the Quickness change before implementing them. A 50% nerf to the most popular elite in the game out of nowhere isn’t very nice.

So if you liked the original content, why do you feel you need ascended gear now. Most of my characters don’t have ascended gear and I do all the content in the game on them. The only thing you’d need ascended gear for, certainly at this point, is the higher levels of the fractals, and the fractals give you the gear you need to do them if you do them.

If you like the base game and you’re playing the base game, why do you insist you need to get ascended gear? Do you know how many people get laurels and just buy dye packs with them?

Ascended gear is simply the initial implementation of vertical progression. The power of the game will continue to progress vertically, because, well, that’s what vertical progression is. It doesn’t matter in the slightest whether you feel you need ascended gear or not. If you want to play the game over time you will follow the power curve. Vertical progression primarily is used for two things. One, to provide players with a sense of progression (necessary in any game) and two, to promote continued play. How does it promote it? Simple, it doesn’t really give you a choice. We are talking about the power level of the game. You can’t play the game, long-term, if you don’t perform the activities that keep you consistent with it. Here those activities are FotM, Dailies, Monthlies, and guild missions. Please educate yourself on this aspect of game design, it’s very well known, and stop spreading misinformation about it being optional.

Please educate yourself on this game, instead of taking crap from other games and making out like it’s the only option. I’m not spreading misinformation, but I suspect you are.

By the time this game REQUIRES ascended gear to do content, there will be enough ways to get it that it won’t be that much of a hardship. You can’t prove otherwise, at any rate, and I’m sure that’s what Anet has in mind.

They’ve made the roll out this slow for a reason. Your mind is so much on all the stuff you know from other games, you refuse to see that it can’t be any other way. That’s misinformation in and of itself.

Right now, no one knows what the future will bring…not me, and not you. We both have theories. I think my theory is more likely based on the situation as it stands now. You’re just guessing.

Maybe you’ve played so many MMOs you’re over-educated and like many over-educated people you believe you can’t be wrong. I’ve played a lot of MMOs too. I see a vast gulf between vertical progression here and vertical progression there. A lot of others see it too.

Too bad you don’t.

UnderdogSMO.9428:

Lightning.8397:

Substance E.4852:

Lightning.8397:

oh kitten just make the rare and all derivatives from the said rare account bound already. There! No more farming for ecto to sell, no more selling rares on TP, only farm for own use or for own farming to legendary. Removes the bots from the equation and reduces populations attending these events? Done? Done.

Ya, who needs trading in an online multiplayer RPG anyway? Right fellas!?

You can trade the rares from the multitude of other sources (fractals, dungeons, open world, guild missions, etc) which do not encounter the overflow problem. Removing ONE source of rares will not break the economy and will remove the cause of unhappiness of a lot of people. Why not?

-edit- a word which actually did not default to kitten?! omg.

there trying to make it so you only do the events some time’s…. not drive people away completely ((As every one runs back into the dungeons))

I feel like I was doing this too, just spamming the “big events”. Luckily I’m slowly breaking out of that lol and experiencing more of the content. I think it is much easier to enjoy the other content once you have mostly the things you want. When your starting off maybe the whole spam boss chests feels like a good route for some people.

Only 1400 hours in 2 months and you’ve played for 1100 of them? Way to start off your thread with a load of BS.

Romeo.4378:

Only 1400 hours in 2 months and you’ve played for 1100 of them? Way to start off your thread with a load of BS.

Saying 1100 hours in a little over 2 months when you have actually played 1050 hours in 3 months is the difference between playing 11 hours and day and playing 17 hours a day, every day.

Not only are you lying about your figures on the very first line of your thread, it also discredits your post – the very first response is about how long you’ve been playing for.

In any case, I stopped playing Gw2 a long time ago just popping in to see the patch notes and read more fail.

More weapon skills in chests, yay. More nerfs, yay. Just thought I’d respond to your thread, it will help your cause if you tighten your lexis up.

Good luck in future endeavors, maybe I’ll catch you in ESO but for now I’m back to the amazingness that is EoC Runescape

Romeo.4378:

Saying 1100 hours in a little over 2 months when you have actually played 1050 hours in 3 months is the difference between playing 11 hours and day and playing 17 hours a day, every day.

Not only are you lying about your figures on the very first line of your thread, it also discredits your post – the very first response is about how long you’ve been playing for.

In any case, I stopped playing Gw2 a long time ago just popping in to see the patch notes and read more fail.

More weapon skills in chests, yay. More nerfs, yay. Just thought I’d respond to your thread, it will help your cause if you tighten your lexis up.

Good luck in future endeavors, maybe I’ll catch you in ESO but for now I’m back to the amazingness that is EoC Runescape

It was actually still 2 months about a week ago. I just stated what it said at the time. I truly do stay logged in around 12 hours a day. As sad as that is to admit.. I wasn’t lying, purely going off what it had said some time ago. Also it seems more like people are trying harder to derail the thread and discount me rather than simply listen to what was said. or better yet, actually join the discussion. But this is what I have come to expect in forums.

Hickeroar.9734:

I’ve been playing since the day after launch, and I love it more now than I did at day 1.

I figure if you love it, play it. If you don’t…don’t.

What if several games come out and you love them all!? Will we ever sleep again come end of year 2013..

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Sarrs.4831:

1. Will a character in full Exotics be at a disadvantage to a player decked out head to toe in Ascended gear in WvWvW?

That depends, are they an Engineer, Necromancer, or Ranger? If so why are you in WvW? RUN! RUN AND NEVER LOOK BACK!

Ahem.

The bigger question is why on earth are you attempting to solo-take someone in WvW?

Necromancers are pretty good in WvWvW. They’ve got a button that makes conditions go everywhere, they’ve got an entire weapon’s worth of high-range, good width area of effect attacks, they’ve got a school of spells which can put some significant hurt on anyone dumb enough to stand in them, and one of the best scaling AOE heals in the game.

I’m sure Engis and Rangers have nice things too. I wonder if dropping a Thumper on a ram and using the overcharge would be hilarious enough to validate speccing into it?

Also solo roamers are pretty useful. I can cap unupgraded camps and everything lower on my own. Don’t need to roll with the zerg for that, but I do need to kill enemy roamers and counter-roamers.

2. I don’t recall actually saying Ascended gear was needed to complete content; I said that your character used to feel ‘complete’ when you had full Exotic gear, and now it doesn’t feel complete because Ascended. I don’t think this is an MMO thing, but a general hobby thing; alts are projects which I like to complete, and the standing means by which to get Ascended gear feels like a cheap kitten-block to finishing that project. I hope we can at the very least agree on that.

Hmmm, sort of. I’ve rarely had alts which I’ve felt the desire to polish up to “full spec”. I think the last one was my cleric in EverQuest because he was more in demand than a ranger. Also because I could read Game of Thrones books and heal at the same time.

Really, the only thing really in my way when it comes to getting my alts up to snuff is laurels choking amulets and those guild thingos. Get rid of the timegate and I’m happy; laurels should just be throttling fun toys.

Sarrs.4831:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Sarrs.4831:

1. Will a character in full Exotics be at a disadvantage to a player decked out head to toe in Ascended gear in WvWvW?

That depends, are they an Engineer, Necromancer, or Ranger? If so why are you in WvW? RUN! RUN AND NEVER LOOK BACK!

Ahem.

The bigger question is why on earth are you attempting to solo-take someone in WvW?

Necromancers are pretty good in WvWvW. They’ve got a button that makes conditions go everywhere, they’ve got an entire weapon’s worth of high-range, good width area of effect attacks, they’ve got a school of spells which can put some significant hurt on anyone dumb enough to stand in them, and one of the best scaling AOE heals in the game.

I’m sure Engis and Rangers have nice things too. I wonder if dropping a Thumper on a ram and using the overcharge would be hilarious enough to validate speccing into it?

Also solo roamers are pretty useful. I can cap unupgraded camps and everything lower on my own. Don’t need to roll ikittenerg for that, but I do need to kill enemy roamers and counter-roamers.

2. I don’t recall actually saying Ascended gear was needed to complete content; I said that your character used to feel ‘complete’ when you had full Exotic gear, and now it doesn’t feel complete because Ascended. I don’t think this is an MMO thing, but a general hobby thing; alts are projects which I like to complete, and the standing means by which to get Ascended gear feels like a cheap kitten-block to finishing that project. I hope we can at the very least agree on that.

Hmmm, sort of. I’ve rarely had alts which I’ve felt the desire to polish up to “full spec”. I think the last one was my cleric in EverQuest because he was more in demand than a ranger. Also because I could read Game of Thrones books and heal at the same time.

Really, the only thing really in my way when it comes to getting my alts up to snuff is laurels choking amulets and those guild thingos. Get rid of the timegate and I’m happy; laurels should just be throttling fun toys.

My alts leech off my 2 mains, I feel like I should tax them.. but that would only hurt me in the end. Luckily they bring in their own wealth via gathering, all the while getting pummeled by level 5’s. :P

Sarrs.4831:

Necromancers are pretty good in WvWvW. They’ve got a button that makes conditions go everywhere, they’ve got an entire weapon’s worth of high-range, good width area of effect attacks, they’ve got a school of spells which can put some significant hurt on anyone dumb enough to stand in them, and one of the best scaling AOE heals in the game.

I’m sure Engis and Rangers have nice things too. I wonder if dropping a Thumper on a ram and using the overcharge would be hilarious enough to validate speccing into it?

Also solo roamers are pretty useful. I can cap unupgraded camps and everything lower on my own. Don’t need to roll with the zerg for that, but I do need to kill enemy roamers and counter-roamers.

I can’t speak for Necro/Engineer other than the fact I’ve had a grand old time against them. It’s fun and it’s not a “curbstomp” like trying to fight a thief who gets the first hit.

(Seriously, that’s never worked out well for me.)

Now . . . Rangers can do a lot of good things, but they’re not an absolute “must have” for anything. However, I’ve found they can be useful to take camps if the other team is asleep at the wheel. It takes some cautious pulling but it can be done. Attract other players though, and it’s not working out.

I’m still learning. Please note I’m a stinky ranger because I don’t touch all the weapons and abhor wading into melee (my survival ability is questionable trying to melee anything other than a squishy type class).

Vayne.8563:

Raine.1394:

Vayne.8563:

Sarrs.4831:

I don’t know if I’d say the game’s degraded, but I’d definitely say that Anet seems to be moving out of the park of what the game originally was. There are only a few pieces of content that they’ve put out since release that I can definitely say have improved the game, those being FotM and the holiday events, and even then FotM needed some iteration to get right.

On the other hand, the new patches seem very interested in forcing you to do what they’re bringing, with Ascended gear, despite the fact that a lot of people enjoyed the base game’s content for what it was. What content are you ‘forced’ into to gear up a character? You’re at the very least forced to do your dailies and monthlies (kitten timegating), you have to do guild missions, the minimum size of which is pretty dang restrictive, and you have to do FotM; personally, I’m okay with FotM, but plenty of people are getting cranky over having to do it instead of playing in wuvwuv.

To me, it looks like ANet’s thinking “what patch feature can we slap ascended gear onto this time?” with every second patch, occasionally mixing it up with “let’s put in a timegate lol”. Admittedly, I’ve got a very limited data set, but you need to look at what they do, not what they say. What they’re doing?… Well, they added new weapon prefixes to the wuvwuv vendors, so I guess that’s a nice start, but no armors or Ascended gear. They changed the icons for light gear?… /shrug

Also maybe they should vet some of their bigger changes like the Quickness change before implementing them. A 50% nerf to the most popular elite in the game out of nowhere isn’t very nice.

So if you liked the original content, why do you feel you need ascended gear now. Most of my characters don’t have ascended gear and I do all the content in the game on them. The only thing you’d need ascended gear for, certainly at this point, is the higher levels of the fractals, and the fractals give you the gear you need to do them if you do them.

If you like the base game and you’re playing the base game, why do you insist you need to get ascended gear? Do you know how many people get laurels and just buy dye packs with them?

Ascended gear is simply the initial implementation of vertical progression. The power of the game will continue to progress vertically, because, well, that’s what vertical progression is. It doesn’t matter in the slightest whether you feel you need ascended gear or not. If you want to play the game over time you will follow the power curve. Vertical progression primarily is used for two things. One, to provide players with a sense of progression (necessary in any game) and two, to promote continued play. How does it promote it? Simple, it doesn’t really give you a choice. We are talking about the power level of the game. You can’t play the game, long-term, if you don’t perform the activities that keep you consistent with it. Here those activities are FotM, Dailies, Monthlies, and guild missions. Please educate yourself on this aspect of game design, it’s very well known, and stop spreading misinformation about it being optional.

Please educate yourself on this game, instead of taking crap from other games and making out like it’s the only option. I’m not spreading misinformation, but I suspect you are.

By the time this game REQUIRES ascended gear to do content, there will be enough ways to get it that it won’t be that much of a hardship. You can’t prove otherwise, at any rate, and I’m sure that’s what Anet has in mind.

They’ve made the roll out this slow for a reason. Your mind is so much on all the stuff you know from other games, you refuse to see that it can’t be any other way. That’s misinformation in and of itself.

Right now, no one knows what the future will bring…not me, and not you. We both have theories. I think my theory is more likely based on the situation as it stands now. You’re just guessing.

Maybe you’ve played so many MMOs you’re over-educated and like many over-educated people you believe you can’t be wrong. I’ve played a lot of MMOs too. I see a vast gulf between vertical progression here and vertical progression there. A lot of others see it too.

Too bad you don’t.

Yes, I have played other MMO’s but don’t consider myself over-educated. And, the issue at hand is a simple one. And, if you believe what Anet has said on the subject, we know what the future will bring. Vertical: the power level of the game will increase. Progression: it will continually increase over time. Vertical progression is vertical progression no matter how you implement it. It can be fast or slow, but it will always be vertical progression. One thing that can be said for certain with vertical progression, and a simple thought experiment should be all that’s necessary here, it is not optional.

Raine.1394:

Vayne.8563:

Raine.1394:

Vayne.8563:

Sarrs.4831:

I don’t know if I’d say the game’s degraded, but I’d definitely say that Anet seems to be moving out of the park of what the game originally was. There are only a few pieces of content that they’ve put out since release that I can definitely say have improved the game, those being FotM and the holiday events, and even then FotM needed some iteration to get right.

snip

To me, it looks like ANet’s thinking “what patch feature can we slap ascended gear onto this time?” with every second patch, occasionally mixing it up with “let’s put in a timegate lol”. Admittedly, I’ve got a very limited data set, but you need to look at what they do, not what they say. What they’re doing?… Well, they added new weapon prefixes to the wuvwuv vendors, so I guess that’s a nice start, but no armors or Ascended gear. They changed the icons for light gear?… /shrug

Also maybe they should vet some of their bigger changes like the Quickness change before implementing them. A 50% nerf to the most popular elite in the game out of nowhere isn’t very nice.

So if you liked the original content, why do you feel you need ascended gear now. Most of my characters don’t have ascended gear and I do all the content in the game on them. The only thing you’d need ascended gear for, certainly at this point, is the higher levels of the fractals, and the fractals give you the gear you need to do them if you do them.

If you like the base game and you’re playing the base game, why do you insist you need to get ascended gear? Do you know how many people get laurels and just buy dye packs with them?

Ascended gear is simply the initial implementation of vertical progression. The power of the game will continue to progress vertically, because, well, that’s what vertical progression is. It doesn’t matter in the slightest whether you feel you need ascended gear or not. If you want to play the game over time you will follow the power curve. Vertical progression primarily is used for two things. One, to provide players with a sense of progression (necessary in any game) and two, to promote continued play. How does it promote it? Simple, it doesn’t really give you a choice. We are talking about the power level of the game. You can’t play the game, long-term, if you don’t perform the activities that keep you consistent with it. Here those activities are FotM, Dailies, Monthlies, and guild missions. Please educate yourself on this aspect of game design, it’s very well known, and stop spreading misinformation about it being optional.

Please educate yourself on this game, instead of taking crap from other games and making out like it’s the only option. I’m not spreading misinformation, but I suspect you are.

By the time this game REQUIRES ascended gear to do content, there will be enough ways to get it that it won’t be that much of a hardship. You can’t prove otherwise, at any rate, and I’m sure that’s what Anet has in mind.

They’ve made the roll out this slow for a reason. Your mind is so much on all the stuff you know from other games, you refuse to see that it can’t be any other way. That’s misinformation in and of itself.

Right now, no one knows what the future will bring…not me, and not you. We both have theories. I think my theory is more likely based on the situation as it stands now. You’re just guessing.

Maybe you’ve played so many MMOs you’re over-educated and like many over-educated people you believe you can’t be wrong. I’ve played a lot of MMOs too. I see a vast gulf between vertical progression here and vertical progression there. A lot of others see it too.

Too bad you don’t.

Yes, I have played other MMO’s but don’t consider myself over-educated. And, the issue at hand is a simple one. And, if you believe what Anet has said on the subject, we know what the future will bring. Vertical: the power level of the game will increase. Progression: it will continually increase over time. Vertical progression is vertical progression no matter how you implement it. It can be fast or slow, but it will always be vertical progression. One thing that can be said for certain with vertical progression, and a simple thought experiment should be all that’s necessary here, it is not optional.

Except that so far we have vertical progression and it is optional. A simple thought process is all that’s needed to see that. Anet will make it easy to get the stuff you need to play the game, mostly because the target audience for the game is casual.

If the target audience for the game was competitive, you’d have a much better chance of being right.

Dante.1508:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Dante.1508:

its just a money milking machine that cares very little for their players,

How do you reconcile this belief with the fact that many of the changes to the game were made in response to requests by players?

• Ascended gear: requested by people who wanted more to do, a way to progress
• Ascended available in a variety of ways: in response to outcry against FotM
• Dailies providing choices: requested by players
• AC changes: requested by dungeon players who thought the boss fights were boring
• Changes to meta boss chests I (guaranteed rare): requested by players
• Changes to meta boss chests II (1 day/account): an attempt, in part, to address the negatives brought up by players
• Guild Missions I: Players said there was no reason to be in a guild
• Guild Missions II: Response to small guilds which complained about Guild Missions I

Good kitten, man! If they care little about about what players want, why the frack are they listening to them? I recognize that not every change has pleased everyone, but sweeping, baseless generalities are over the top.

Everything you said circles around time gated grind and carrot on the stick to keep players in game and not leaving, the rares are there for exactly the same reasons to keep the populations playing, if you cannot see all those things you quoted are so the company can retain players to make money, i feel you’re a bit sheltered..

Has very little to do with caring about players and more to do with players buying gems..if they really cared about their customers over money the new and old weapons and items in black lion chests wouldn’t exist, heck the chests wouldn’t exist, we wouldn’t need 15 types of tokens, karma would actually get you stuff worth having, everything would be in game as drops etc..

Its not.

“If they really cared about their customers over money…” No business can afford to just ignore the bottom line or they won’t be a business for very long. Of course they want to retain people. What business doesn’t want customers. It’s a stretch to get “ANet doesn’t care about players” from months of updates providing some of the things players asked for.

No, your disappointment with this game has poisoned your outlook. The grind comes from the thoughts “have to have that” and “want now.” How else do I account for the difference between you and me? I feel no pressure at all to buy gems, whereas you do.

Gotejjeken.1267:

Playing the game for 46 days (or roughly 1100/24) is not the same as being here the entire time. You talk about ‘wait and see’ when we have.

Sorry to say, the game keeps getting worse. You just need to get out of the honeymoon phase and realize it.

So if the game is getting worse, why are new players landing in the game and thinking that it’s amazing? If it’s an amazing game that has gotten worse over the last 6 months, then it must have been SUPER amazing when it launched.

Or maybe we just have a lot of hate on the forums.

KodChim.5670:

It’s hard to see the community as shortsighted when we just got yet another weapon-skin-in-chest.

Putting some weapon skins into actual gameplay would be nice, so maybe you should be talking to Anet about this?

You mean like the 2 other skins sets they released at the exact same time?

I suggest reading patch notes when they come out and doing some investigating as well before complaining.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Dante.1508:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Dante.1508:

its just a money milking machine that cares very little for their players,

How do you reconcile this belief with the fact that many of the changes to the game were made in response to requests by players?

• Ascended gear: requested by people who wanted more to do, a way to progress
• Ascended available in a variety of ways: in response to outcry against FotM
• Dailies providing choices: requested by players
• AC changes: requested by dungeon players who thought the boss fights were boring
• Changes to meta boss chests I (guaranteed rare): requested by players
• Changes to meta boss chests II (1 day/account): an attempt, in part, to address the negatives brought up by players
• Guild Missions I: Players said there was no reason to be in a guild
• Guild Missions II: Response to small guilds which complained about Guild Missions I

Good kitten, man! If they care little about about what players want, why the frack are they listening to them? I recognize that not every change has pleased everyone, but sweeping, baseless generalities are over the top.

Everything you said circles around time gated grind and carrot on the stick to keep players in game and not leaving, the rares are there for exactly the same reasons to keep the populations playing, if you cannot see all those things you quoted are so the company can retain players to make money, i feel you’re a bit sheltered..

Has very little to do with caring about players and more to do with players buying gems..if they really cared about their customers over money the new and old weapons and items in black lion chests wouldn’t exist, heck the chests wouldn’t exist, we wouldn’t need 15 types of tokens, karma would actually get you stuff worth having, everything would be in game as drops etc..

Its not.

“If they really cared about their customers over money…” No business can afford to just ignore the bottom line or they won’t be a business for very long. Of course they want to retain people. What business doesn’t want customers. It’s a stretch to get “ANet doesn’t care players” from months of updates providing some of the things players asked for.

No, your disappointment with this game has poisoned your outlook. The grind comes from the thoughts “have to have that” and “want now.” How else do I account for the difference between you and me? I feel no pressure at all to buy gems, whereas you do.

I have no issues buying gems and i have no issues with Anet making money, but the way they are doing it yes that i have issues with, they could add so much to the Cash shop that i would buy…Weapon Skins, Armor Skins, Capes/Backpacks, Mounts etc without the RNG..
I actually purchased a name change and total make over today, it just annoys me when they nickel and dime players with Gambling..that is just low..

@Rakuren Kenshou.7689
It’s hard to see the community as shortsighted when we just got yet another weapon-skin-in-chest.

Putting some weapon skins into actual gameplay would be nice, so maybe you should be talking to Anet about this?

You mean like the 2 other skins sets they released at the exact same time?

I suggest reading patch notes when they come out and doing some investigating as well before complaining.

They were not added to game play, one set was added to the time gated guild commendations, the other set added too RNG money paying, pretty sure they are classed as gameplay…

Dante.1508:

They were not added to game play, one set was added to the time gated guild commendations, the other set added too RNG money paying, pretty sure they are classed as gameplay…

So you’re complaining about the new guild content they added now too?

Sigh. Heaven forbid we get new things to do and rewards for doing it. What a horrible company!

The third set I was talking about was the Super weapons which you can preview in PVP right now, which are likely to be part of April 1st content, which will be earned gasp by doing something.

Right, nevermind. You’ll complain about that too.

Heaven forbid you have to take part in an activity to gain something!

Sorry if I’m being offensive, but I’ve been listening to this junk for months now, and it’s really getting tiresome.

Vayne.8563:

Except that so far we have vertical progression and it is optional. A simple thought process is all that’s needed to see that. Anet will make it easy to get the stuff you need to play the game, mostly because the target audience for the game is casual.

If the target audience for the game was competitive, you’d have a much better chance of being right.

No, it is non-optional by definition. I’m not talking about the initial pieces of gear that vertical progression brings; they are irrelevant. You may be fine ignoring the difference between 1 & 2, but will be unable to ignore the difference between 1 & 10. It’s just in the nature of a number series that progresses in power. There is no thought or argument required to understand this.

You are right that they will give players ways to get the gear they need to play the game. And, you are right to use the word ‘need’ when we are talking about the power level of the game increasing over time. Whether the grind is easy or hard, the power curve low or steep, you will ‘need’ to maintain yourself at the power level of the game in order to play it successfully. That’s one of the goals of vertical progression, it motivates continued play. And, that’s the reason why the grind is non-optional. It’s fine to argue in favor of vertical progression against those who oppose it. It’s not fine to make the argument that vertical progression is not vertical progression.

I agree completely with OP that people needs to stop trying to find easy ways to get to goals and then complain the game isn’t ok.
If you play anything wrong you’ll have the feeling that it is wrong, but it’s really just your cheap, gimmicky and shady way to play it that makes it so for you.

I’m tired of seeing people completely astonished when I don’t join their exploits/bugabuse/repetitive and borderline exploitative activities.

Not all players want to bug their way to the end.
Not all players want to exploit their way to goals.
Not all players want to run the current unbalanced metas.
Some people want to play the game as it is meant to.
Some peopel want their skill to make them succeed, not the abuse of a broken mechanic.

So don’t be mad at me if I don’t jump inside the model of the boss in colossus, or I don’t spam 2 with a thief, or I don’t farm CoF1.
I want to shine for my skills not for my exploits.

Dante.1508:

it just annoys me when they nickel and dime players with Gambling..that is just low..

I understand your annoyance. I will never buy a key no matter what they put in the boxes. If everyone who objects to gamble boxes did so, then their continuance (or discontinuance) would depend on whether the people who don’t object spent enough money to make the model profitable. Since the trend in video games w/ cash shops seems to be gamble boxes, I’d guess the answer will be that they are profitable.

MMO’s are in a peculiar state these days. There seems to be a major dichotomy. On one side, many players won’t play without stuff as rewards; they want everything; they want it now; and they want to race through content at breakneck speed while expecting the company to produce more right now. It’s instant gratification run amok. On the other side, the developers cannot produce "stuff’ fast enough to satisfy them, and don’t know how to slow players down in a way that the impatient player base will accept.

ANet tried a token system and “time and effort intensive plus RNG” legendary. Players broke that as a means to “slow them down” in short order. Now ANet is resorting to time gating and more RNG. I’ve yet to see anyone offer an alternative that would satisfy both “sides,” since they seem to be diametrically opposed.

I try to maintain some perspective. Do I like some of the reward systems as they are? No, but I understand why they are that way. Do I have to have everything I want? No.
Can I enjoy the game as it is? Yes, very much so. Is it perfect? No. Are they trying to improve it? Seems like it to me, even though they’ve made what I see as mistakes.

Geotherma.2395:

So do you think we should have more GM/CM’s in game to do this? I know in some MMO’s CM’s often make events in game and talk to people in game (when they can). The problem is when someone sees a CM is in game you have 100,000 people spam whispering them. The point of the forums was for all players to communicate with the dev team, but sadly i can say that in a 300+ guild I only know about 5 people who ever check the forums. Mostly because it is filled with qq and harassment.

Maybe the CM’s or devs can make a date to come to servers or host live streams discussing ONE topic. That way they don’t get spammed with tons of random requests. They could do the streaming with chat and have players talk there or do both, talk in game and answer on the stream. Though again that is a lot of work as we would be taking time away from projects everyone is working on. But maybe with more CM’s relaying information from in game, devs/designers getting info from them and forums, we can have a more clear picture of what the community actually wants.

Now these are all suggestions, so i don’t want us to get locked because it isn’t a discussion anymore lol. But how long do you think before we can officially say Guild Wars 2 is no longer new? And what do you think about CM’s in game talking to people?

Whops, sorry for lack of answer;
No, personally I don’t need to see them ingame. I saw 2 GM’s in the Wintersday jumping puzzle once, and while I thought that was pretty cool it is not the place to communicate. My concern is mainly on the forum because this is where many people go to discuss/complain/ask about something. And this is where I would like to see Anet jump in. So many times I’ve seen questions that simply needs a yes or no. A current example is: Will Ascended amulets and accessories [infused] be available to us? – A simple question which are holding people back because they don’t want to waste laurels on costy infusions. But even after a month a simple yes or no has not been given. Then there’s complaints. While some are just griefing there are a lot of legitimate concerns which people would like to have confirmed or denied. But even so, simply stating that “We don’t know that yet/Can not tell you that” shows that, hey at least we hear you. You have been seen. This is what I really miss. The interaction with the people on the forum is next to none imo.

Have you tried finishing the living story?
Yes

Have you tried the new content changes?
Yes

Have you found the perfect Guild or Guilds for you?
I don’t like people

Have you made friends to occupy your time in between what you do everyday?
Again, I don’t like people.

thisolderhead.5127:

Mate- your expectations from the first day I read one of your posts was not positive.

I don’t know Dante, but it is often instructive to read post histories. Often the people who complain the most were complaining before the game even launched.

Rizzy.8293:

Have you found the perfect Guild or Guilds for you?
I don’t like people

Have you made friends to occupy your time in between what you do everyday?
Again, I don’t like people.

Misanthropes will never be content.

Perhaps you should stick to single-player games. I’m all about defending “solo-play” in MMORPGs, to the extent that you don’t need to be grouped up or doing things with the same people for any extent of time to still enjoy the multiplayer aspect. But if you don’t like people at all, what’s the point of playing where there are other people?

Gibson.4036:

Rizzy.8293:

Have you found the perfect Guild or Guilds for you?
I don’t like people

Have you made friends to occupy your time in between what you do everyday?
Again, I don’t like people.

Misanthropes will never be content.

Perhaps you should stick to single-player games. I’m all about defending “solo-play” in MMORPGs, to the extent that you don’t need to be grouped up or doing things with the same people for any extent of time to still enjoy the multiplayer aspect. But if you don’t like people at all, what’s the point of playing where there are other people?

I get where he is coming from. I play mmorpgs because I like the aspect of an open world that continually gets content updates, they usually have an in game market involving other people, and briefly teaming with people to achieve a common goal like raids, but in this case, dynamic events. (not WoW type raids, I never played WoW)

But I’m not the type of person that forms relationships with people, so I don’t really log on in game just to chat with others. This is also one of the reason I don’t do dungeons, I don’t have a like minded set of people to due them with, so I generally don’t do them, and I dislike the generally attitude of a lot of people in PUGS. Example: Instead of choosing to give out tips to someone who may be having issues, they instead choose to /rage, or they just don’t say anything. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been in a good number of PUGS with some good people, but I’m not trying to deal with that when I’m playing a game for fun.

^ Guess that was kind of long, lol Don’t know about the person you quoted, but that’s why I like mmorpg’s, but don’t like people at the same time.

I actually think this game is awesome for people who don’t like people.

You often don’t have to party up, even for champions.

People are just there. They will come along and help and don’t steal your loot. Perfect for anti-social gamers. Dungeons or Fractals are going to require a team, but it shouldn’t be so bad to be on a team once in awhile.

Rizzy.8293:

Have you tried finishing the living story?
Yes

Have you tried the new content changes?
Yes

Have you found the perfect Guild or Guilds for you?
I don’t like people

Have you made friends to occupy your time in between what you do everyday?
Again, I don’t like people.

A person in an MMo who hates people, I approve :P I hate dungeons, just sayen ^^

Rakuren Kenshou.7689:

I actually think this game is awesome for people who don’t like people.

You often don’t have to party up, even for champions.

People are just there. They will come along and help and don’t steal your loot. Perfect for anti-social gamers. Dungeons or Fractals are going to require a team, but it shouldn’t be so bad to be on a team once in awhile.

I like this, that the game was made in a way that doesn’t support griefing or elitism. Theres one team I want to see right now and that is an army of asura thieves all in Golemn Suites. I want norther shiverpeaks to look like Mech Warrior, if only for a day ^^