Guild Wars 2

flyswatter post

Excellent Name.9574:

I was wondering after the HoT aftermath and the damage it did to the game and player population, will Anet have the strength to forget HoT and move on?

What went wrong with HoT, IMHO, and should never be repeated:

01. Pricing the expansion as the full game for players already owning the original game
02. DLC worth of new content, not worthy of expansion name
03. Rushed and short story mode, with a really underwhelming final battle design.
04. Questionable map design, not the beauty of HoT maps, just usability. Minimap system is not enough for HoT layout.
05. Lack of new character slot for the new profession (remedied after an outcry from players).
06. Killing the casualness of the original Guild Wars 2 in more than one way and thus making maps either extremely hard or right down impossible for solo completion.
07. Nerfing the older content, all in hope player base will be forced to buy into deeply flawed new one.
08. Essentially killing off PvP with tying it to the expansion.
09. Nearly destroying WvW which survival is still up in the air.
10. etc.

I don’t really understand some of your points at all.

1) It’s ~$25. Wtf are you talking about? That’s about as much as a pizza and coke.
2) It’s plenty of content. The mastery points were so awesome. And I had fun, not only w/ the main story, but with the zone-metas and elite skills for literally months.

…

6) Are you kidding me? I soloed every aspect of HoT on multiple, full-glass characters. And I’m not even very good. This is a learn-to-play issue.

I could see you point if it was $300. But it’s like $25. You have no case. Where else could you possibly get so much bang for so little money?

Ayrilana.1396:

Excellent Name.9574:

Fallesafe.5932:

Excellent Name.9574:

I was wondering after the HoT aftermath and the damage it did to the game and player population, will Anet have the strength to forget HoT and move on?

What went wrong with HoT, IMHO, and should never be repeated:

01. Pricing the expansion as the full game for players already owning the original game
02. DLC worth of new content, not worthy of expansion name
03. Rushed and short story mode, with a really underwhelming final battle design.
04. Questionable map design, not the beauty of HoT maps, just usability. Minimap system is not enough for HoT layout.
05. Lack of new character slot for the new profession (remedied after an outcry from players).
06. Killing the casualness of the original Guild Wars 2 in more than one way and thus making maps either extremely hard or right down impossible for solo completion.
07. Nerfing the older content, all in hope player base will be forced to buy into deeply flawed new one.
08. Essentially killing off PvP with tying it to the expansion.
09. Nearly destroying WvW which survival is still up in the air.
10. etc.

I don’t really understand some of your points at all.

1) It’s ~$25. Wtf are you talking about? That’s about as much as a pizza and coke.
2) It’s plenty of content. The mastery points were so awesome. And I had fun, not only w/ the main story, but with the zone-metas and elite skills for literally months.

…

6) Are you kidding me? I soloed every aspect of HoT on multiple, full-glass characters. And I’m not even very good. This is a learn-to-play issue.

I could see you point if it was $300. But it’s like $25. You have no case. Where else could you possibly get so much bang for so little money?

HoT was 50$ not 25$, even so 25$ would be a fair price but it wasn’t 25$ and if You had so much fun with masteries I can only assume that your fun threshold is quite low. About soloing HoT, You are full of kittens, especially on glass characters.

Did map and story completion with every class using glass armor and had no issues doing what could be done solo. For the several HP’s that were better in a group, as well as all meta events, I had no issues doing them in glass armor. A large percentage of events can be done solo with the exception of those with champions, group events, or those that mechanically require more than one person. Even then, some players can get around that with personal skill.

People find different things enjoyable. I particularly enjoyed the process of exploring all of the HoT content and obtaining all of the mastery points. I also enjoyed the progressing made on maxing out the masteries. I found that no different than exploring a new map or from leveling a character.

To be fair, the post this person replied to stated that they soloed “every aspect of HoT” in full glass. Of course we know that’s an exaggeration. What they likely meant is exactly what you’re saying: The player personally feels comfortable running around the jungle in full glass, rather than being literally able to solo every single event and boss in HoT.

To be fair, the post this person replied to stated that they soloed “every aspect of HoT” in full glass. Of course we know that’s an exaggeration. What they likely meant is exactly what you’re saying: The player personally feels comfortable running around the jungle in full glass, rather than being literally able to solo every single event and boss in HoT.

Yea, what I meant (of course) is that I did the whole story and all the map completion solo… because I assumed that had to be what he was complaining about. Or was he actually complaining that he couldn’t do zone meta-events solo?? In that case, it’s an extra ridiculous criticism of the expansion.

AliamRationem.5172:

Ayrilana.1396:

Excellent Name.9574:

Fallesafe.5932:

Excellent Name.9574:

I was wondering after the HoT aftermath and the damage it did to the game and player population, will Anet have the strength to forget HoT and move on?

What went wrong with HoT, IMHO, and should never be repeated:

01. Pricing the expansion as the full game for players already owning the original game
02. DLC worth of new content, not worthy of expansion name
03. Rushed and short story mode, with a really underwhelming final battle design.
04. Questionable map design, not the beauty of HoT maps, just usability. Minimap system is not enough for HoT layout.
05. Lack of new character slot for the new profession (remedied after an outcry from players).
06. Killing the casualness of the original Guild Wars 2 in more than one way and thus making maps either extremely hard or right down impossible for solo completion.
07. Nerfing the older content, all in hope player base will be forced to buy into deeply flawed new one.
08. Essentially killing off PvP with tying it to the expansion.
09. Nearly destroying WvW which survival is still up in the air.
10. etc.

I don’t really understand some of your points at all.

1) It’s ~$25. Wtf are you talking about? That’s about as much as a pizza and coke.
2) It’s plenty of content. The mastery points were so awesome. And I had fun, not only w/ the main story, but with the zone-metas and elite skills for literally months.

…

6) Are you kidding me? I soloed every aspect of HoT on multiple, full-glass characters. And I’m not even very good. This is a learn-to-play issue.

I could see you point if it was $300. But it’s like $25. You have no case. Where else could you possibly get so much bang for so little money?

HoT was 50$ not 25$, even so 25$ would be a fair price but it wasn’t 25$ and if You had so much fun with masteries I can only assume that your fun threshold is quite low. About soloing HoT, You are full of kittens, especially on glass characters.

Did map and story completion with every class using glass armor and had no issues doing what could be done solo. For the several HP’s that were better in a group, as well as all meta events, I had no issues doing them in glass armor. A large percentage of events can be done solo with the exception of those with champions, group events, or those that mechanically require more than one person. Even then, some players can get around that with personal skill.

People find different things enjoyable. I particularly enjoyed the process of exploring all of the HoT content and obtaining all of the mastery points. I also enjoyed the progressing made on maxing out the masteries. I found that no different than exploring a new map or from leveling a character.

To be fair, the post this person replied to stated that they soloed “every aspect of HoT” in full glass. Of course we know that’s an exaggeration. What they likely meant is exactly what you’re saying: The player personally feels comfortable running around the jungle in full glass, rather than being literally able to solo every single event and boss in HoT.

Ah. Fair enough.

HoT was not perfect by any means, but I feel the OPs list is inaccurate on more things than I want to spend typing up.

I hope the next expansion offers more explorable zones than we got with HoT. I hope it has better writing from my perspective and I hope we run across some stories to what happened with some of our old Elonian friends (assuming we go towards Elona).

The Elite Specs didn’t kill WvW, but the desert BL was a piece of excrement (IMO). I hope for more life for WvW. Blow up the servers and introduce a more balanced match-up system.

I would certainly like to think that Anet will consider HoT and return to the ideas that made GW2 one of the best games I’ve played. I have to say that I agree with most of the OP. I am not optimistic though; it seems like GW2 was created by one group of people and then turned over to a completely different group of people to manage over time.

Only one thing is for certain and that is I will not preorder any new expansion. And, if they choose to continue down the HoT road I won’t be buying anything period.

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

now if only i could get the forums post linking to work on this forum .

You should be able to simply right-click on the chain symbol of the forum post you want to link and choose “copy link address”, then Paste into the new forum post that you want the link in.

Excellent Name.9574:

What went wrong with HoT, IMHO, and should never be repeated:.

I’m going to chime in because…. well, no real reason…

I consider myself a casual player. I average an hour a day, I suppose that’s casual (see #6).

In my opinion…

1. HoT was worth the price, I never expected a discount. I can’t complain about new players getting core+HoT (or core+Hot+Exp2) at the same price. It’s Anets game to price, if I don’t like the price I don’t have to buy it. But if I do buy it I really shouldn’t complain because I did after all agree to the price (reminds me of the parable in Matthew 20).

2. DLC vs Expansion, HoT was both, they are not necessarily distinct. Of course that wasn’t the point of the OPs statement. For this I refer back to my opinion of #1.

3. Subjective. They felt short, but I still enjoyed them and did not feel slighted.

4. Also subjective. I am a fan of more open spaces.

5. Could be a legitimate concern. Aside from my main (ranger) I tend to kill off my characters after a while, though I have taken a liking to my asura guardian.

6. I suppose a distinction needs to be made between being a casual player and playing casually. To me a casual player is someone who spends more time killing things than creating builds, crafting, farming, etc. I view playing casually as wanting to play without the fear of dying. For the former, HoT is fine. For the latter, I hear Queensdale is nice this time of year. (sorry for being snarky)

7. I can’t comment on this as I never noticed it.

8. I don’t PvP enough to comment on it.

9. Same as #8.

10. Well said, I would have to agree (again, sorry for being snarky)

DeadTreeJig.6714:

Excellent Name.9574:

What went wrong with HoT, IMHO, and should never be repeated:.

I’m going to chime in because…. well, no real reason…

I consider myself a casual player. I average an hour a day, I suppose that’s casual (see #6).

In my opinion…

1. HoT was worth the price, I never expected a discount. I can’t complain about new players getting core+HoT (or core+Hot+Exp2) at the same price. It’s Anets game to price, if I don’t like the price I don’t have to buy it. But if I do buy it I really shouldn’t complain because I did after all agree to the price (reminds me of the parable in Matthew 20).

Actually, you can complain about anything Also, complaining about something you already bought but then found cheaper elsewhere is perfectly legitimate. That’s why you see stores that guarantee if you find it cheaper elsewhere they will refund you the difference (or some such).

Excellent Name.9574:

01. Pricing the expansion as the full game for players already owning the original game
02. DLC worth of new content, not worthy of expansion name
03. Rushed and short story mode, with a really underwhelming final battle design.

these three kinda belong together. It all felt rushed and only halfway done, that’s the stuff they fixed/nerfed/added. If they’ve learned their lessons, all is well. Pricing and “bang for the buck”/value of the xpac will hardly be comparable as far as i can imagine. But in the end we’ll see how the idea of releasing an xpac within the “2-3 months”-schedule of releases will pan out.

Excellent Name.9574:

04. Questionable map design, not the beauty of HoT maps, just usability. Minimap system is not enough for HoT layout.

I still hate TD and get lost in it. I’m ok with it now and see it as “flavorfuladdition to the experience”…and i swear a lot in mapchat whenever i have something to do there and inevitably get lost…
Generally though, the minimap was not and still isn’t capable of being very helpful in very vertical maps, with a lot of overlaying layers, looking at you TD -.-.
The newer maps, especially DM, do their job better. The minimap still doesn’t give a good hint at where you are concerning your height, but at least they divided the layers also horizontally, much more like VB did.

Excellent Name.9574:

06. Killing the casualness of the original Guild Wars 2 in more than one way and thus making maps either extremely hard or right down impossible for solo completion.
08. Essentially killing off PvP with tying it to the expansion.

The powercreep that came with the elites was expected and i hope that further elites will be more on par but different in flavor or utility.
I wouldn’t go as far as saying they kiled the casualness of the original GW2. Queensdale’s still there, ppl still do SE or CoF in LvL67 Chars wearing all greens or yellows, they still do Orr-Trains or SW farms. I think the raids might have divided the playerbase more than it was before HoT. Before HoT, you were HC if you could solo dungeons or had a high frac-lvl, looking back much easier tasks than the raids, meaning everyone could get there eventually. With raids, not having much raiding experience, i can say everyone can get there eventually too, it’s just so much harder. At the end of the day, to not get too much into raids, no one forces you to raid, if you want/need something from there, you better get with the meta and pummel that golem because the loot won’t come to you. A really bad decission imho was the story stuff they put into raids exclusively, yeah i’m all in for a (soloable) story-mode for raid encounters, bare of loot and achievements, just for the experience.

Excellent Name.9574:

07. Nerfing the older content, all in hope player base will be forced to buy into deeply flawed new one.

I wouldn’t call it flawed, just unfinished yet released. However the nerf to dungeon rewards was a blatant push into new content move and hurt ANets reputation, if ppl remember at all, more than the community. PPl still do dungeons, allthough much more do fractals i assume, since they made those more appealing.

It’s sad they turned away from dungeons, it was a fun format and the game now, could make the existing maps/content much more interesting. It would have been nice if they gae CM the Aetherpath-treatment, adding an additional harder path with achievements/minis/tonics/skins/younameit dealing with the aftermath of head of the snake. maybe the mantle wanted to secure some evidence the seraph hadn’t found yet or caudecus’ ghost is haunting the mansion or whatever

A much longer answer that i actually planned, but my sig compelled me to do it

Hope the expansion will be good and i’m very curious how the whole “2-3 months” thing will work for an expansion. I think it’s hard either way. If they give us a small part of the content at the start and release the rest over time, it wouldn’t feel much like an expansion and too close to ls or current events. if they release all at once it better be “done” not “in the making for half a year”

tl:dr We will see. Play first, rant later if necessary.

Djinn.9245:

DeadTreeJig.6714:

Excellent Name.9574:

What went wrong with HoT, IMHO, and should never be repeated:.

1. HoT was worth the price, I never expected a discount. I can’t complain about new players getting core+HoT (or core+Hot+Exp2) at the same price. It’s Anets game to price, if I don’t like the price I don’t have to buy it. But if I do buy it I really shouldn’t complain because I did after all agree to the price (reminds me of the parable in Matthew 20).

Actually, you can complain about anything Also, complaining about something you already bought but then found cheaper elsewhere is perfectly legitimate. That’s why you see stores that guarantee if you find it cheaper elsewhere they will refund you the difference (or some such).

You’re right. I suppose I could have said that I choose not to complain, but that makes me sound like a snob, so I will stick with being incorrect.