Guild Wars 2

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

Crash.5362:

There are rumors from a reddit post about somene who talked to the devs at the afterparty or something about a confirmation that there wont be any Pole-Arms avaiable in this expansion, and that the ones we see on the trailers are not to be in the game.

So… This means no land spears either ? Nor 2h axes ?…
I mean, this gotta be the one and only MMO out there that doesnt have neither of these. Yet we have things like Torches and Warhorns like weapons… Wow…

If we’re seriously not getting any new weapon, it’ll have to be a huge disappointment.
Spears are BY FAR the weapon that was most used in history through antique and medieval periods. Its the most popular weapon that there has ever been period.

Pole-arms in general are the prefered weapons for warfare, way more commonly used in battlefields than swords…. I just dont get it.

Sorry if this sounded like a rant. But this is just something that I had to put out there, I love this game, but this is defnetly one of the things that leave me with a very spite taste in the mouth about it. Specially when they advertised land spears and polearms being used on trailers. I feel cheated if thats the case…

Let it out man!!! Rage for us all!! I was really looking forward to Polearms, spears or great axes as well…

Smh

Now we have to wait another two years for another Xpac for a chance to get them, and we may not get them then as well…

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

But nobody knows how Gravity works which is why it’s still just a THEORY of gravity …..

Crash.5362:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Einlanzer.1627:

lordkrall.7241:

Why would more weapons be needed? What would they add to the game that isn’t already there?

Adding stuff just for the sake of adding it is usually not such a good idea.

Uhm, what? New weapons are one of the most badly needed things in the game. They open up build options, broaden potential character concepts, and are just plain cool. Who doesn’t want new weapon options? Plus, it’s something they’ve said they intended to do.

Greataxe
Throwing Disc
Whip
Polearm/Martial Staff
Gauntlets/Claws
Tome

Just a few they could and should implement.

“Because,” or “Because they’re cool,” is not a sufficient reason to create something from nothing. There are a lot of weapons in the game. Weapons that are restricted from each of the classes. Why create whole new weapons, that also wouldn’t be universally accessible, when they can just give weapons that already exist to the classes that don’t have them.

That’s the basic thought process that ANet is using.

If you can’t justify a new weapon over an existing weapon with actual mechanics and roles missing from the lineup then there is no reason to implement it. “But I wanna,” will never be an acceptable answer.

Read the entire post. This argument got replied to several times over, by several different people.

There’s A TON of things that are being added without the need or without really being something that “its missing” on the game’s mechanics or role lineup.

How about no? I’ve been reading the arguments and not a single person has made an argument for random new weapons that was anything more than, “But, I wanna.” No one has provided a reason why new material should be created instead of porting already existing material to the classes that don’t have it.

But I will ask, what exactly do you feel is being added that wasn’t missing from the games mechanics or role lineup? I’m really curious.

Increase level 80 zones is definitely needed. A third heavy armor class was missing from the lineup. A second type of PvP was absolutely needed. Guild Halls were missing and reasonable. I could maybe accept an argument against the WvW but really it was in need of more areas too. I could also see an argument for flying, but I tend to doubt all that much effort, comparatively speaking, was needed for that, so not that big a deal. Are you saying they didn’t need to expand on endgame character building? That they should not have ported already existing weapons to classes that didn’t have them? I would love to hear that argument.

Knighthonor.4061:

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

But nobody knows how Gravity works which is why it’s still just a THEORY of gravity …..

You don’t know what theory means.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Crash.5362:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Einlanzer.1627:

lordkrall.7241:

Why would more weapons be needed? What would they add to the game that isn’t already there?

Adding stuff just for the sake of adding it is usually not such a good idea.

Uhm, what? New weapons are one of the most badly needed things in the game. They open up build options, broaden potential character concepts, and are just plain cool. Who doesn’t want new weapon options? Plus, it’s something they’ve said they intended to do.

Greataxe
Throwing Disc
Whip
Polearm/Martial Staff
Gauntlets/Claws
Tome

Just a few they could and should implement.

“Because,” or “Because they’re cool,” is not a sufficient reason to create something from nothing. There are a lot of weapons in the game. Weapons that are restricted from each of the classes. Why create whole new weapons, that also wouldn’t be universally accessible, when they can just give weapons that already exist to the classes that don’t have them.

That’s the basic thought process that ANet is using.

If you can’t justify a new weapon over an existing weapon with actual mechanics and roles missing from the lineup then there is no reason to implement it. “But I wanna,” will never be an acceptable answer.

Read the entire post. This argument got replied to several times over, by several different people.

There’s A TON of things that are being added without the need or without really being something that “its missing” on the game’s mechanics or role lineup.

How about no? I’ve been reading the arguments and not a single person has made an argument for random new weapons that was anything more than, “But, I wanna.” No one has provided a reason why new material should be created instead of porting already existing material to the classes that don’t have it.

But I will ask, what exactly do you feel is being added that wasn’t missing from the games mechanics or role lineup? I’m really curious.

Increase level 80 zones is definitely needed. A third heavy armor class was missing from the lineup. A second type of PvP was absolutely needed. Guild Halls were missing and reasonable. I could maybe accept an argument against the WvW but really it was in need of more areas too. I could also see an argument for flying, but I tend to doubt all that much effort, comparatively speaking, was needed for that, so not that big a deal. Are you saying they didn’t need to expand on endgame character building? That they should not have ported already existing weapons to classes that didn’t have them? I would love to hear that argument.

Nobody made any argument aside from “but I wanna” ?…
lol. Either you cant read, or you’re lying about having read :P

I’ll list JUST A FEW of the ones me and other people pointed out:

1- More diversity and new weaponsa attracts new players that otherwise would be disappointed at the lack of a kind of weapon expected to be there.
2- Opens for new builds and combos, more diversity and depth for playstyle.
3- It was advertised before that they exist (In trailers recently) Its hard not to expect that they’ll be there when the very game advertise them.
4- A lot of people were looking forward to it, it’d be new content added in a cheap way since the skins of spears are already in there, seems like a no-brainer to add them.

Seriously, if you didnt read those arguments (And so many others) aside from just “we want” then you defnetly have some sort of problem with reading and udnerstanding. Or you’re just lying about having read at all.

Also, worth noticing, we’re not asking for “Random new weapons” as you’re claiming. We’re asking for weapons that were expected to be there (Since they’re in just about all MMo’s, were history’s most common weapons, AND were seen in trailers, AND were on the prequel of Gw2 (Guild Wars 1))
lol.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Crash.5362:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Einlanzer.1627:

lordkrall.7241:

Why would more weapons be needed? What would they add to the game that isn’t already there?

Adding stuff just for the sake of adding it is usually not such a good idea.

Uhm, what? New weapons are one of the most badly needed things in the game. They open up build options, broaden potential character concepts, and are just plain cool. Who doesn’t want new weapon options? Plus, it’s something they’ve said they intended to do.

Greataxe
Throwing Disc
Whip
Polearm/Martial Staff
Gauntlets/Claws
Tome

Just a few they could and should implement.

“Because,” or “Because they’re cool,” is not a sufficient reason to create something from nothing. There are a lot of weapons in the game. Weapons that are restricted from each of the classes. Why create whole new weapons, that also wouldn’t be universally accessible, when they can just give weapons that already exist to the classes that don’t have them.

That’s the basic thought process that ANet is using.

If you can’t justify a new weapon over an existing weapon with actual mechanics and roles missing from the lineup then there is no reason to implement it. “But I wanna,” will never be an acceptable answer.

Read the entire post. This argument got replied to several times over, by several different people.

There’s A TON of things that are being added without the need or without really being something that “its missing” on the game’s mechanics or role lineup.

How about no? I’ve been reading the arguments and not a single person has made an argument for random new weapons that was anything more than, “But, I wanna.” No one has provided a reason why new material should be created instead of porting already existing material to the classes that don’t have it.

But I will ask, what exactly do you feel is being added that wasn’t missing from the games mechanics or role lineup? I’m really curious.

Increase level 80 zones is definitely needed. A third heavy armor class was missing from the lineup. A second type of PvP was absolutely needed. Guild Halls were missing and reasonable. I could maybe accept an argument against the WvW but really it was in need of more areas too. I could also see an argument for flying, but I tend to doubt all that much effort, comparatively speaking, was needed for that, so not that big a deal. Are you saying they didn’t need to expand on endgame character building? That they should not have ported already existing weapons to classes that didn’t have them? I would love to hear that argument.

Responding, now, to the rest of what you said.

When exactly did I say that they are adding ONLY unnecessary things ?
I am very hyped about a lot of the expansion, but since you people against the addition of a new weapon are claiming that the reason for that is that “They’re not needed” I decided to use example of SOME of the things they’re adding nonetheless that are not needed either.

New specs will add the same thing that a new weapon would: New skills, new builds, new possibilities. SO, by logic, it is just as “not needed” as the new weapon idea. HOWEVER STILL, we’re loving the fact they’re doing it.

New Legendaries ? The ability to speak new languages with natives ? The ability to fly when we’re falling on some specific maps ?

I’m repeating something I said over and over, and because you didnt read things that me and other people posted, you’re repeating arguments and misunderstanding. No one ever said that this expansion sucks, no one ever said that things they’re adding are pointless and no one ever said that the only reason they should add new weapons its because we want it.

lol, read dude, read!!!

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

But nobody knows how Gravity works which is why it’s still just a THEORY of gravity …..

You don’t know what theory means.

Actually I do

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/theory

Theory is an idea, of how something works.
Example is the “Moon causes the waves in the ocean”. That’s a theory not a fact.

I’m really tired of answering the same arguments over and over in this thread…
I’ll call it a day for myself :P I’ll reply if there’s something new from someone who did carefully read everything that was said in here by me and others.

Why is everyone such kitten bags towards people requesting, or wanting something added to this game? Especially things that have been hinted at recently? Spears aren’t exactly the most out-there request that’s been posted on these forums; it is however, probably one of the most requested as far as weapons go other than scythes and letting some other class use the greatsword.

Copestetic.5174:

Why is everyone such kitten bags towards people requesting, or wanting something added to this game? Especially things that have been hinted at recently? Spears aren’t exactly the most out-there request that’s been posted on these forums; it is however, probably one of the most requested as far as weapons go other than scythes and letting some other class use the greatsword.

People are fanboys of the hype to the point that any one who strays away from the bandwagon and DARES !!! To criticize something about this game’s expansion gets burned alive and crussified.
Well, its a good way to kill a game, accept anything they give you and think everything is amazing always.

I love this game. And this is why I criticize it.
Im not saying “hurr durr this game sucks cause it doesnt have spears and pole-arms”
I’m saying: Why not !? And pointing out several good reasons for it to have.

To the OP, I don’t think there’s anything left to say here. Just remember to post calmly, because it seems like you’ve gotten very annoyed with the people in this thread, which may turn people against you. I support the addition of polearms, but so far, it seems like they’re not coming this time around. I think a new weapon has a lower priority than what they’ve announced so far, but it is definitely a good choice for future expansions.

Cecilia.5179:

To the OP, I don’t think there’s anything left to say here. Just remember to post calmly, because it seems like you’ve gotten very annoyed with the people in this thread, which may turn people against you. I support the addition of polearms, but so far, it seems like they’re not coming this time around. I think a new weapon has a lower priority than what they’ve announced so far, but it is definitely a good choice for future expansions.

Thanks, I kinda did. Though I made sure to keep it polite.

Its just frustrating when you fill people with arguments, answer every and each single thing they give you and still they come up with the same argument over and over ignoring your answers :P.

I dont bother with people turning against me however. This is internet, and since posting a thread criticizng an aspect of the expansion goes against the bandwagon and the hype, I was very well expecting some people to try to defend it at all costs. Just not expecting people to ignore things that has been said in the thread previously XD

From another thread
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/179531/Rytlock.JPG
Clearly this isn’t a hammer nor is he under water. This either a staff or spear. But why use this to show off Melee staffs? Fishy….

Knighthonor.4061:

From another thread
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/179531/Rytlock.JPG
Clearly this isn’t a hammer nor is he under water. This either a staff or spear. But why use this to show off Melee staffs? Fishy….

Yeah we’ve all seen it, but they already said they’re not including any new weapons.
And that they’re aware they advertised spears and pole-arms being used on trailrs (This one and another where there was a bunch with sylvari with spears fighting people.)

It was said that they told the art team to not do it, since it was misleading, but they done it nonetheless. And indeed, it was misleading :P

My guess its that its just a staff being used as melee weapon or something.

Here another picture shared on the forum
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/179684/Rytlock_weapon.jpg

I’ll be optimistic for a moment and say that no new weapons does not mean a specialization of Revenant can’t use spears on land.

Crash.5362:

There is no arguments being thrown at my end ? You’re the one that eems to not be taking logic into the consideration.

PLus, what if a player doesnt like the current weapons’s set ? What if a player doesnt like maces ? Swords ? Bows ? What if he wants his character to use a specific weapon ?
He is FORCED to have on an MMo to have his character use a certain weapon just because it “offers what he needs” ?

Sorry, the argument of “There’s already things that do that, and the class doesnt need more of it” its not logical. At all. Its an MMO, diversity makes it, the option to use whatever you want makes it. Not being forced to stick with something just because it gives what you needs.

Play a different game if you don’t like half the stuff in it, no one is forcing you to do anything.

What if I want a giant flaming laser shooting eyeball as a weapon? The devs can’t and won’t tend to the needs of every individual player. It’s not even reasonable.

shadowpass.4236:

Crash.5362:

There is no arguments being thrown at my end ? You’re the one that eems to not be taking logic into the consideration.

PLus, what if a player doesnt like the current weapons’s set ? What if a player doesnt like maces ? Swords ? Bows ? What if he wants his character to use a specific weapon ?
He is FORCED to have on an MMo to have his character use a certain weapon just because it “offers what he needs” ?

Sorry, the argument of “There’s already things that do that, and the class doesnt need more of it” its not logical. At all. Its an MMO, diversity makes it, the option to use whatever you want makes it. Not being forced to stick with something just because it gives what you needs.

Play a different game if you don’t like half the stuff in it, no one is forcing you to do anything.

What if I want a giant flaming laser shooting eyeball as a weapon? The devs can’t and won’t tend to the needs of every individual player. It’s not even reasonable.

Hey. look. Another guy who didnt read the previous posts before making one.

When I said that, I wasnt referring to myself.
I stated several times over in this thread that I love this game. But that doesnt mean I cant criticize it, does it?

Also, you’re using the same argument a guy was using. Saying that “the devs cant make all you want! What if I want a lightsaber?”

Such argument was also already answered. I’m not gonna repeat myself when the content is already up there to be read, take your time and read things that has been said on a thread before making a reply. Your argument was already used, replied, and finished. Not to mention that your accusation of me “not liking half the game” would defnetly not be there if you’d take your time and read things I said. :P

Crash.5362:

1- More diversity and new weaponsa attracts new players that otherwise would be disappointed at the lack of a kind of weapon expected to be there.
2- Opens for new builds and combos, more diversity and depth for playstyle.
3- It was advertised before that they exist (In trailers recently) Its hard not to expect that they’ll be there when the very game advertise them.
4- A lot of people were looking forward to it, it’d be new content added in a cheap way since the skins of spears are already in there, seems like a no-brainer to add them.

I still don’t think you understand the argument lordkrall was trying to make.

Let’s put it this way. To make a whole new weapon type you need a couple of things. You first, need artists to make every single model of spears/pole-arms/whatever (let’s assume they make 50 models).

You need game designers to come up with skills for that weapon for each class that gets that weapon, making sure they aren’t overpowered or a rehash of a skill the class already has (e.g. not another gap closer for a warrior). You need to come up with new traits in a trait line that aren’t broken or useless. Then you need to get someone to draw the portraits for each skill for each profession, animate/code those skills into the game, then bug test them to see if they work properly.

All of that costs time and money because the people who are making it aren’t working for free. So lordkrall’s question is this: Why should Anet spend their resources (developing time and money) into making a whole new weapon type and all the stuff that comes with it, when they can just add a new weapon to an existing class like how they are doing with specilizations.

As for your previous points….
1. You can get “more diversity” by adding new skills to existing weapon sets or giving classes new existing weapon sets, so that point is kind of invalid.
2. Repeat of your previous point, see above.
3. I don’t recall any advertising at all for any new weapons types in any recent trailers.
4. People can also be looking forward to other weapons for their classes. The argument that “it’s a common weapon in MMO’s” is pretty lame because that doesn’t justify pouring all the resources into it. The same concept can be applied to gear treadmills- they are common in every MMO, so why don’t we have one? Especially considering that if they were to add another weapon, they need to make it different from the rest of the weapons for every class.

Just playing devil’s advocate.

Crash.5362:

Knighthonor.4061:

From another thread
https://dviw3bl0enbyw.cloudfront.net/uploads/forum_attachment/file/179531/Rytlock.JPG
Clearly this isn’t a hammer nor is he under water. This either a staff or spear. But why use this to show off Melee staffs? Fishy….

Yeah we’ve all seen it, but they already said they’re not including any new weapons.
And that they’re aware they advertised spears and pole-arms being used on trailrs (This one and another where there was a bunch with sylvari with spears fighting people.)

It was said that they told the art team to not do it, since it was misleading, but they done it nonetheless. And indeed, it was misleading :P

My guess its that its just a staff being used as melee weapon or something.

Yeah that’s bull crap. False advertisement !!!!

Bull bleep story about telling your art team not to make spears as models for land weapons… So bull bleep. I don’t believe that. False advertisement!!!

Zelkovan.2630:

Crash.5362:

1- More diversity and new weaponsa attracts new players that otherwise would be disappointed at the lack of a kind of weapon expected to be there.
2- Opens for new builds and combos, more diversity and depth for playstyle.
3- It was advertised before that they exist (In trailers recently) Its hard not to expect that they’ll be there when the very game advertise them.
4- A lot of people were looking forward to it, it’d be new content added in a cheap way since the skins of spears are already in there, seems like a no-brainer to add them.

I still don’t think you understand the argument lordkrall was trying to make.

Let’s put it this way. To make a whole new weapon type you need a couple of things. You first, need artists to make every single model of spears/pole-arms/whatever (let’s assume they make 50 models).

You need game designers to come up with skills for that weapon for each class that gets that weapon, making sure they aren’t overpowered or a rehash of a skill the class already has (e.g. not another gap closer for a warrior). You need to come up with new traits in a trait line that aren’t broken or useless. Then you need to get someone to draw the portraits for each skill for each profession, animate/code those skills into the game, then bug test them to see if they work properly.

All of that costs time and money because the people who are making it aren’t working for free. So lordkrall’s question is this: Why should Anet spend their resources (developing time and money) into making a whole new weapon type and all the stuff that comes with it, when they can just add a new weapon to an existing class like how they are doing with specilizations.

As for your previous points….
1. You can get “more diversity” by adding new skills to existing weapon sets or giving classes new existing weapon sets, so that point is kind of invalid.
2. Repeat of your previous point, see above.
3. I don’t recall any advertising at all for any new weapons types in any recent trailers.
4. People can also be looking forward to other weapons for their classes. The argument that “it’s a common weapon in MMO’s” is pretty lame because that doesn’t justify pouring all the resources into it. The same concept can be applied to gear treadmills- they are common in every MMO, so why don’t we have one? Especially considering that if they were to add another weapon, they need to make it different from the rest of the weapons for every class.

Just playing devil’s advocate.

LOL. Im afraid you’re the one who still didnt read what was said previously on the topic. Or maybe you just dont know how to save up information you read before putting a reply. All you adressed was YET AGAIN already debated and answered… Are you trolling XD ?

Anyway, lets do this one last time, shall we ?

Regarding the point that dude was trying to make…
I’m aware of the cost of designing 50 new or so skins. Which is why, during the debate of this topic, I started to defend the inclusion of spears are a land weapon rather than water-only. If you’d actually take your time and read, you’d notice me making this point SEVERAL TIMES.

There would be NO costs of designing new weapons. The weapons are in-game already.

To top that off, the effort of “rebalacing so that it doesnt come op” and making new animation skills is minimal in comparsion to what they’re already doing.
They’re bringing in 8 new sets of skill (5×8, in fact, 5×8 + 15 if we consider elementalists have 20 skills per weapon.) Not to mention an ENTIRE new class, with gods-know how many skills and utility ones and etc.

Would designing and balancing 15/20 or so (assuming 3 or 4 classes get spears.) new skills be that much of a effort in comparison ? Would be almost nothing.

SO yeah. Once more, all that I did was repeat arguments already used by me and others, that once more, you didnt read or pay attention to.
I understand VERY WELL what was the guy’s point, hence how I adressed each and every thing he said in a reply, but it seems you didnt take your time to read my answers, and instead, just read what he said.

Zelkovan.2630:

Crash.5362:

1- More diversity and new weaponsa attracts new players that otherwise would be disappointed at the lack of a kind of weapon expected to be there.
2- Opens for new builds and combos, more diversity and depth for playstyle.
3- It was advertised before that they exist (In trailers recently) Its hard not to expect that they’ll be there when the very game advertise them.
4- A lot of people were looking forward to it, it’d be new content added in a cheap way since the skins of spears are already in there, seems like a no-brainer to add them.

I still don’t think you understand the argument lordkrall was trying to make.

Let’s put it this way. To make a whole new weapon type you need a couple of things. You first, need artists to make every single model of spears/pole-arms/whatever (let’s assume they make 50 models).

You need game designers to come up with skills for that weapon for each class that gets that weapon, making sure they aren’t overpowered or a rehash of a skill the class already has (e.g. not another gap closer for a warrior). You need to come up with new traits in a trait line that aren’t broken or useless. Then you need to get someone to draw the portraits for each skill for each profession, animate/code those skills into the game, then bug test them to see if they work properly.

All of that costs time and money because the people who are making it aren’t working for free. So lordkrall’s question is this: Why should Anet spend their resources (developing time and money) into making a whole new weapon type and all the stuff that comes with it, when they can just add a new weapon to an existing class like how they are doing with specilizations.

As for your previous points….
1. You can get “more diversity” by adding new skills to existing weapon sets or giving classes new existing weapon sets, so that point is kind of invalid.
2. Repeat of your previous point, see above.
3. I don’t recall any advertising at all for any new weapons types in any recent trailers.
4. People can also be looking forward to other weapons for their classes. The argument that “it’s a common weapon in MMO’s” is pretty lame because that doesn’t justify pouring all the resources into it. The same concept can be applied to gear treadmills- they are common in every MMO, so why don’t we have one? Especially considering that if they were to add another weapon, they need to make it different from the rest of the weapons for every class.

Just playing devil’s advocate.

Wait how is that different from what the developers already did for Specializations?
Also there are already spear skins and trident skins in the game, so no art team needed for making new models, when most of those models are rarely seen or used in the current game due to being underwater weapons only.

Like I said above, the new skills from them are the same as new skills from the other new specialization weapons that certain classes get.

Zelkovan.2630:

Crash.5362:

1- More diversity and new weaponsa attracts new players that otherwise would be disappointed at the lack of a kind of weapon expected to be there.
2- Opens for new builds and combos, more diversity and depth for playstyle.
3- It was advertised before that they exist (In trailers recently) Its hard not to expect that they’ll be there when the very game advertise them.
4- A lot of people were looking forward to it, it’d be new content added in a cheap way since the skins of spears are already in there, seems like a no-brainer to add them.

I still don’t think you understand the argument lordkrall was trying to make.

Let’s put it this way. To make a whole new weapon type you need a couple of things. You first, need artists to make every single model of spears/pole-arms/whatever (let’s assume they make 50 models).

You need game designers to come up with skills for that weapon for each class that gets that weapon, making sure they aren’t overpowered or a rehash of a skill the class already has (e.g. not another gap closer for a warrior). You need to come up with new traits in a trait line that aren’t broken or useless. Then you need to get someone to draw the portraits for each skill for each profession, animate/code those skills into the game, then bug test them to see if they work properly.

All of that costs time and money because the people who are making it aren’t working for free. So lordkrall’s question is this: Why should Anet spend their resources (developing time and money) into making a whole new weapon type and all the stuff that comes with it, when they can just add a new weapon to an existing class like how they are doing with specilizations.

As for your previous points….
1. You can get “more diversity” by adding new skills to existing weapon sets or giving classes new existing weapon sets, so that point is kind of invalid.
2. Repeat of your previous point, see above.
3. I don’t recall any advertising at all for any new weapons types in any recent trailers.
4. People can also be looking forward to other weapons for their classes. The argument that “it’s a common weapon in MMO’s” is pretty lame because that doesn’t justify pouring all the resources into it. The same concept can be applied to gear treadmills- they are common in every MMO, so why don’t we have one? Especially considering that if they were to add another weapon, they need to make it different from the rest of the weapons for every class.

Just playing devil’s advocate.

1/2- Adding new skills doesnt fill the “hole” that there is on the fact the game is missing a weapon that every new players expects to be there, and gets surprised when it isnt there. Adding new skills alone doesnt make up for an entire weapon set. No, the point its not invalid.

3- Watch the final trailer after the end of “point of no return” in which several Sylvaries make use of spears. And even there is a scene of Faolain (I think thats her name) impaling someone with a spear.
Not to mention Ritlock in the Expansion’s trailer using a pole-weapon/spear/staff-like thing to beat a troll. There are SEVERAL topics about it, no way you missed them O_o
The VERY Anet team adressed the issue of pole-arms being shown in their trailers but not in the games…

4- Exaggerating things doesnt make your argument valid. How adding 15 or 20 skills and animatins would be “pouring all their resources”… I mean, taking skins that are already in the game, is exactly the same as picking weapons that are already in the game and allowing it to other classes. THe effort would be exactly as much as making a specialization. Which they’re already making. 8. PLus a new entire class… and a ton of other features and etc etc etc…
How would that be “pouring all resources into making a new weapon” ?

Zelkovan.
I bid you, read everything on the topic if you’re gonna jump into the debate…
Both my replies were done SOLELY on using arguments that were several times used before in the talk, while all your arguments were also arguments several times used already.
Repeating what other people said to force me to repeat myself is pointless, and you’re wasting both of us’s time…
If you have nothing NEW to add to the discussion, then why not just leave it as it is ?

To the people saying no new weapons will be added, spears may be excluded, MAY, they arent new to the game, they are just previously locked to underwater only…something ive hated from the beginning as i played a paragon in GW1 and was hoping to have spears in GW2..

Dante.1763:

To the people saying no new weapons will be added, spears may be excluded, MAY, they arent new to the game, they are just previously locked to underwater only…something ive hated from the beginning as i played a paragon in GW1 and was hoping to have spears in GW2..

Yeah. I’m well aware they didnt express anything regarding if Spears could be avaiable for land usage or not, and instead, just said that no pole-arms are being included.

And yeah, as I’ve been saying, its a disappointment that a weapon that its already in the game isnt a thing for land-usage when all logic, reason and expectations point towards such.

Crash.5362:

Yeah. I’m well aware they didnt express anything regarding if Spears could be avaiable for land usage or not, and instead, just said that no pole-arms are being included.

And yeah, as I’ve been saying, its a disappointment that a weapon that its already in the game isnt a thing for land-usage when all logic, reason and expectations point towards such.

Yes indeed, it was the biggest let down anet has ever managed to do in Gw2.. favorite profession (Rit) and favorite weapon (Spear) arent in GW2.

On topic:
I do agree that an entirely new weapon would be a pain to add, as a modder for other games mainly sins of a solar empire, the trouble of adding a single ship, and balancing it, and making sure it works, is enormous, so i can only imagine how much harder it is for a MMORPG…

Knighthonor.4061:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

But nobody knows how Gravity works which is why it’s still just a THEORY of gravity …..

You don’t know what theory means.

Actually I do

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/theory

Theory is an idea, of how something works.
Example is the “Moon causes the waves in the ocean”. That’s a theory not a fact.

Sorry, let me rephrase, you don’t understand what a theory is. Something can be a theory and still be a fact. You don’t understand how science works well enough to actually be in this argument.

Crash.5362:

1- More diversity and new weaponsa attracts new players that otherwise would be disappointed at the lack of a kind of weapon expected to be there.

Unproven, unbankable, unreasonable.

2- Opens for new builds and combos, more diversity and depth for playstyle.

This is also true of porting weapons, therefore this is not a reason to add new weapons in place of porting.

3- It was advertised before that they exist (In trailers recently) Its hard not to expect that they’ll be there when the very game advertise them.

Yeah, I know everyone was going on and on about something they thought they saw, but all I ever say was a staff being used in melee. Nowhere did they SAY with words, that they were going to introduce new weapons in this expansion, or any expansion because until now they’ve never even admitted there would ever be an expansion.

4- A lot of people were looking forward to it, it’d be new content added in a cheap way since the skins of spears are already in there, seems like a no-brainer to add them.

This one means, “But, I wanna,” which is the only real argument you have here.
So maybe now you understand why I said, there are no legitimate arguments. None of your arguments are reasonable or legitimate. You just “wanna.”

Crash.5362:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Crash.5362:

Read the entire post. This argument got replied to several times over, by several different people.

There’s A TON of things that are being added without the need or without really being something that “its missing” on the game’s mechanics or role lineup.

How about no? I’ve been reading the arguments and not a single person has made an argument for random new weapons that was anything more than, “But, I wanna.” No one has provided a reason why new material should be created instead of porting already existing material to the classes that don’t have it.

But I will ask, what exactly do you feel is being added that wasn’t missing from the games mechanics or role lineup? I’m really curious.

Increase level 80 zones is definitely needed. A third heavy armor class was missing from the lineup. A second type of PvP was absolutely needed. Guild Halls were missing and reasonable. I could maybe accept an argument against the WvW but really it was in need of more areas too. I could also see an argument for flying, but I tend to doubt all that much effort, comparatively speaking, was needed for that, so not that big a deal. Are you saying they didn’t need to expand on endgame character building? That they should not have ported already existing weapons to classes that didn’t have them? I would love to hear that argument.

Responding, now, to the rest of what you said.

When exactly did I say that they are adding ONLY unnecessary things ?
I am very hyped about a lot of the expansion, but since you people against the addition of a new weapon are claiming that the reason for that is that “They’re not needed” I decided to use example of SOME of the things they’re adding nonetheless that are not needed either.

New specs will add the same thing that a new weapon would: New skills, new builds, new possibilities. SO, by logic, it is just as “not needed” as the new weapon idea. HOWEVER STILL, we’re loving the fact they’re doing it.

New Legendaries ? The ability to speak new languages with natives ? The ability to fly when we’re falling on some specific maps ?

I’m repeating something I said over and over, and because you didnt read things that me and other people posted, you’re repeating arguments and misunderstanding. No one ever said that this expansion sucks, no one ever said that things they’re adding are pointless and no one ever said that the only reason they should add new weapons its because we want it.

lol, read dude, read!!!

And now I also will respond.

I will start by requoting and bolding the specific part of your statement I was responding to that got us this far.

There’s A TON of things that are being added without the need or without really being something that “its missing” on the game’s mechanics or role lineup.

I never said you claimed everything was unnecessary. But you obviously implied a TON (your word) of things were obviously unnecessary, and I was just trying to clarify which of the things that were introduced were unnecessary in your view, such that it would have been reasonable to introduce the actually unnecessary addition of new weapons over porting old ones.

I also love that your only apparent argument is to say that no one said something that no one claimed anyone said. I didn’t say you or anyone else said anything sucked. I’m just clarifying the arguments you’re failing to make. You don’t have good arguments and as such are flailing. If you did have good arguments you might actually be able to bring them to bare.

So now I’ll actually delve into your specifics. New specs are not the same thing as new weapons. The reason is that new specs introduce old weapons previously inaccessible to the class. As such New specs are superior to just new weapons because they include weapons AND more than weapons, going as far as traits. New weapons only introduce new weapons to a handful of classes each. That is why new weapons still are inferior and unnecessary comparatively speaking.

New Legendaries are just skins. New skins are a standard of the game and can’t be used as comparison to anything.

Being able to speak to natives is an entirely new mechanic that we really don’t know enough about to say whether it was reasonable or not.

Flight is questionable, I’ll give you that. But it is also a new mechanic that is universal to all classes. It obviously has a lot of versatility, but since we don’t have anything to reasonably compare it to it’s not a valid argument either.

Crash.5362:

Dante.1763:

To the people saying no new weapons will be added, spears may be excluded, MAY, they arent new to the game, they are just previously locked to underwater only…something ive hated from the beginning as i played a paragon in GW1 and was hoping to have spears in GW2..

Yeah. I’m well aware they didnt express anything regarding if Spears could be avaiable for land usage or not, and instead, just said that no pole-arms are being included.

And yeah, as I’ve been saying, its a disappointment that a weapon that its already in the game isnt a thing for land-usage when all logic, reason and expectations point towards such.

I’m just going to put this out there. There are no spears in the game. The weapon type of spears is actually polearms. So when they said no polearms, that’s what they meant. Go check your equipped spears if you don’t believe me.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Crash.5362:

Dante.1763:

To the people saying no new weapons will be added, spears may be excluded, MAY, they arent new to the game, they are just previously locked to underwater only…something ive hated from the beginning as i played a paragon in GW1 and was hoping to have spears in GW2..

Yeah. I’m well aware they didnt express anything regarding if Spears could be avaiable for land usage or not, and instead, just said that no pole-arms are being included.

And yeah, as I’ve been saying, its a disappointment that a weapon that its already in the game isnt a thing for land-usage when all logic, reason and expectations point towards such.

I’m just going to put this out there. There are no spears in the game. The weapon type of spears is actually polearms. So when they said no polearms, that’s what they meant. Go check your equipped spears if you don’t believe me.

then my Blade Training Trait has been lying all along…
I personally totally agree with OP on this one, and to understand why it is not only logical but almost essential to add Spears in the HOTS, not only for the success of the expansion but for the perpetuity of the franchise itself. i will try to highlight my point by paying close attention at what Anet is : A smart Company that likes to tease but that will Always HOLD IT DOWN (like P.O.P) and im about to write a BRICK about it !

but before, a quick look IN THE PAST. (GW1) spears were introduced in the second expansion as the weapon of choice of the Paragon: an HEAVY profession who uses a mix of shouts, chants and debilitating spear attacks to help allies. the spear was subsequently adopted by many other classes who choose it as their weapon of choice mainly for its high firing rate (it was a ranged weapon) and good Damage potential. in pvp and pve, the spear became staple of Gw1 almost as much as the mesmer is (mesmer bias , of course). Back to the Spears, their implementation opened up many gameplay possibilities as it allowed the player to move in range, attack in melee or from a distance while still have good mobility. only difference is, it was a single handed weapon.
Earlier during the lifespan of GW2, underwater combat took a huge hit as water was being removed from all spvp maps. Even when it was a logical choice, an important investment already has been funneled into the design and creation of many weapons that just cannot be use or seen in a third of modes in the game. lets keep that in mind.
(really, when was the last time you saw your spear/trident/harpoon? precursor selling for 150g)

Now…

-ANET is a smart company. and i think they left plenty evidence that spears are making a come back to GW2 in a big way. HoT wants itself to be an more explicit link between GW1 and GW2, something that i feel was in dire need for the franchise. As the most part of the living story 1 has been a huge letdown for many Gw1 players that migrated to the second iteration of the franchise, the continuation of the lore and the characters was existent. (Hall of Monument… ). Only towards the end of the second season of living story did we start to see link with the actual story of GW1. this fact is the basis of the hype that rapidly grew around HoT. (yes , GW1 is still on of the major factors why people are drawn to GW2). lets recall that spears were Staple in GW1, if HoT whats to really pump up the nostalgia juice in us GW1 fans, implanting Spears ON LAND would be a very good method. of of many, of course.
- ANET is a big tease. We can see in their business model that retention of a player base is what they are aiming for and for the dying MMORPG world, it is the only way to survive. One way to Achieve this Is to Leak Slowing but more or less Steadily the upgrades/items/features needed and asked by the players to keep enjoying the game. the hype management is a big part of this leakage as it allows increased flux of activity around the franchise in a way or another, before, during and after the release of said upgrades/items/features. This flux represents exposure thus revenue. The Extensive use of the spear as a Land weapon in the cinematic of the living story 2 ending (i think) as well as in the trailer of HoT goes WELL beyond the mere Fantasies of few Designers. They have been Instructed to use a spear as Both a melee And Throwable weapon, obvious attempt at drawing parallels with Gw1. Even very Important Characters (Rytlock and Faolain) are seen wielding the spear as 2 handed weapons. Aesthetic choices are often guided by game play design. i’m just saying.
-ANET Will HOLD IT DOWN! GW2 already Established itself as being a very important player in the MMO genre. Yet it Still hasen’t Pierced the cap that separates Great games and Legendary games (SC2, WOW, Zelda, ect). Gw1 was well on its way to achieve this goal, and Gw2 was the way the franchise attempted to reach it. unfortunately, there has been a lost of momentum for the migrating players. the slew of Bugs, missing features added to the uninteresting story really reduced the urge of many to spend time in Tyria while halting completing many more before they could even taste the game. While still liking the franchise in general, some prefer not playing it bur just watch it, from the sidelines, waiting for the original GW1 to resurface again.
well the spears in HoT brings this opportunity an Anet knows that the time is RIPE.
breathe…
there are so many underwater skins i haven’t seen just because they are underwater…
might as well been lost in the Mists…
And that’s Why Rytlock went there!! to Recuperate All those Lost Martial Treasures And resurface Them As a Revenant! we saw him wielding it…

Except they said specifically that they weren’t introducing it. So…

Kal Spiro.9745:

Except they said specifically that they weren’t introducing it. So…

Do they need to introduce them? they are already here.
theorically, there wont be new weapons at all. a bit like main hand/off hand, same weapon, different usage.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Except they said specifically that they weren’t introducing it. So…

Like i said in another thread, ill be surprised if they convert them to land, its my one dream from playing with spears in gw1 as they where called(Which more than one of the current in game “water spears” have skins of spears from gw1), that they will be introduced or swapped from water combat to land combat, or both. they arent a new weapon, so its always possible, no matter how slim that possibility.

People don’t seem to understand the OP.

Why do we need new weapons? Well, new weapons are a way to expand the game just as much as added new traits and/or them access to weapons that they didn’t own before.

One word. UTILITY.

I’d assume the main “difficulties” with adding brand new weapons would be making dozens of weapon models to make the weapon type feel fleshed out compared to everything else. As well as giving it to multiple professions so that the weapon type itself feels well integrated, which comes with the challenge of adding multiple new weapon skills to multiple professions.

Not really an issue with something like making land spears, since the models already exist (they’d have to flesh them out a little, but nowhere near as bad as beginning from scratch). And there are already a bunch of classes who can use spears (underwater only, but still), along with the fact that specializations mean they already have to come up with new skills for existing profession. Give land spears to Revenants by default, and maybe one or two other classes through specs, and between that and the underwater uses they’re already well-integrated and fleshed out.

So I’d say its possible that land spears could potentially happen even with the “no new weapon types” rule in effect, just because they aren’t really NEW and wouldn’t have the main problems that a new weapon type would.

So, regardless of what anyone wants, there are two things they said they weren’t doing. They said they’re not introducing new weapons, so no one handed spears of any kind. They said they’re not swapping water weapons to land weapons, so no two handed polearms either.

I’ve already stated that I would love to have a spear for my Ranger. I even came up with a group of skills I think would work for it. Polearms, which are spears, also are among the few weapons that they could introduce without having to worry about art, since they already have all the skins for them.

But it doesn’t matter because they said they weren’t going to.

Maybe it’s just me, but the problem with using the existing underwater spear models in the game or even just unlocking them for land, is because the legendary weapon itself has a “water” theme to it. Bubbles and scales around the wielder, burst of bubbles when drawn, shark animations on critical hit. How would all of this look on land? Ridiculous is my first thought, unless they just exclude that weapon from being used on land, but then that doesn’t really seem fair to the weapon.

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

This is a flawed analogy. Arenanet’s priorities can be influenced. The laws of gravity can’t.

Kal Spiro.9745:

So, regardless of what anyone wants, there are two things they said they weren’t doing. They said they’re not introducing new weapons, so no one handed spears of any kind. They said they’re not swapping water weapons to land weapons, so no two handed polearms either.

I’ve already stated that I would love to have a spear for my Ranger. I even came up with a group of skills I think would work for it. Polearms, which are spears, also are among the few weapons that they could introduce without having to worry about art, since they already have all the skins for them.

But it doesn’t matter because they said they weren’t going to.

Allow us to Dream!!
or at least show the documentation of when they said they wouldnt port underwater weapon to land

feight.2704:

Kal Spiro.9745:

So, regardless of what anyone wants, there are two things they said they weren’t doing. They said they’re not introducing new weapons, so no one handed spears of any kind. They said they’re not swapping water weapons to land weapons, so no two handed polearms either.

I’ve already stated that I would love to have a spear for my Ranger. I even came up with a group of skills I think would work for it. Polearms, which are spears, also are among the few weapons that they could introduce without having to worry about art, since they already have all the skins for them.

But it doesn’t matter because they said they weren’t going to.

Allow us to Dream!!
or at least show the documentation of when they said they wouldnt port underwater weapon to land

I don’t have any documentation that says that they won’t, but I do have something for you to think about, that I posted earlier.

I’ll quote it here for your easy reading convenience:

Maybe it’s just me, but the problem with using the existing underwater spear models in the game or even just unlocking them for land, is because the legendary weapon itself has a “water” theme to it. Bubbles and scales around the wielder, burst of bubbles when drawn, shark animations on critical hit. How would all of this look on land? Ridiculous is my first thought, unless they just exclude that weapon from being used on land, but then that doesn’t really seem fair to the weapon.

Fatalyz.7168:

Maybe it’s just me, but the problem with using the existing models in the game, is because the legendary weapon itself has a “water” theme to it. Bubbles and scales around the wielder, burst of bubbles when drawn, shark animations on critical hit. How would all of this look on land? Ridiculous is my first thought, unless they just exclude that weapon from being used on land, but then that doesn’t really seem fair to the weapon.

Actually that’s pretty easy. Technically they would not be the same weapon since it would be in a different slot. So they could just change the effect based on which slot type it’s being equipped in.

Then again, considering we have a weapon that literally fires unicorns, does it really matter if it has bubbles and sharks?

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

But nobody knows how Gravity works which is why it’s still just a THEORY of gravity …..

You don’t know what theory means.

Actually I do

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/theory

Theory is an idea, of how something works.
Example is the “Moon causes the waves in the ocean”. That’s a theory not a fact.

Sorry, let me rephrase, you don’t understand what a theory is. Something can be a theory and still be a fact. You don’t understand how science works well enough to actually be in this argument.

^
There is a difference. A ’’Thoery’’ in science means something that has, indeed, be proven and will remain a fact until it gets falsified. The ‘’Gravity theory’’ is a theory because it is a proven a fact.

Hypothesis in science is the synonym for the everyday use of the word theory.

nGumball.1283:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

But nobody knows how Gravity works which is why it’s still just a THEORY of gravity …..

You don’t know what theory means.

Actually I do

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/theory

Theory is an idea, of how something works.
Example is the “Moon causes the waves in the ocean”. That’s a theory not a fact.

Sorry, let me rephrase, you don’t understand what a theory is. Something can be a theory and still be a fact. You don’t understand how science works well enough to actually be in this argument.

^
There is a difference. A ’’Thoery’’ in science means something that has, indeed, be proven and will remain a fact until it gets falsified. The ‘’Gravity theory’’ is a theory because it is a proven a fact.

Hypothesis in science is the synonym for the everyday use of the word theory.

You’re on the right track, but not technically accurate. A theory in science is actually another term for an explanation. The theory technically comprises a collection of facts and hypotheses that, together, yield predictive value and have not been falsified.

As an aside, I love when people use the “it’s only a theory” argument about evolution.

nGumball.1283:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Knighthonor.4061:

Valandras.2093:

silvermember.8941:

Trock Bronze.9625:

its not some random reddit post that has confirmed no spears or new weapons it was actual interviews that have said so.

It seems op already knows that. It seems more like the OP wants new weapons because new weapons types are always better, which they could be.

OP simply isn’t accepting the fact that Arenanet’s priorities are no in line with his.

I can refuse to accept the laws of gravity, doesn’t mean I’m any less bound by them.

But nobody knows how Gravity works which is why it’s still just a THEORY of gravity …..

You don’t know what theory means.

Actually I do

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/theory

Theory is an idea, of how something works.
Example is the “Moon causes the waves in the ocean”. That’s a theory not a fact.

Sorry, let me rephrase, you don’t understand what a theory is. Something can be a theory and still be a fact. You don’t understand how science works well enough to actually be in this argument.

^
There is a difference. A ’’Thoery’’ in science means something that has, indeed, be proven and will remain a fact until it gets falsified. The ‘’Gravity theory’’ is a theory because it is a proven a fact.

Hypothesis in science is the synonym for the everyday use of the word theory.

You are wrong, theories that are proven true become Laws. we will talk of the Law of Gravity when inferring about the proven THeory of Gravity. theories stay theories forever.