Guild Wars 2

Kal Spiro.9745:

Maxzero.4032:

People keep saying that that (most) other classes get two weapon skill bars so it’s equal to Revenants two utility skill bars. Thars not true individual utility skills have far more gameplay impact then individual weapon skills. Remember 1/5 of your weapon skills is an auto attack. The 2/3 are often just harder hits on longer CDs and it usually takes until the 4 and 5 skills for real utility effects.

Utility skills often are the major game changers in combat. Imagine Engineers who could take their kit skills AND all their turrets? Or Elementalists who could take all Cantrips AND Glyphs.

Combine that with a universal resource and little to no CD and you begin to see the real power. Gaming mechanic wise the Revenant is so much stronger then all the other professions and I am going to very interested to see how Anet balance them.

Reminds a lot of when Favored Souls and Sorcerers came into computer D&D. Clerics and Wizards got left behind (at least as far as pure classes went).

This is very true. But not the problem. The problem is the idea that there may be no way to choose.

The problem isn’t, what if the elementalist could bring all their cantrips and glyphs, it’s what if, in order to take the cantrip or glyph you wanted you were stuck with two default other skills, period, regardless of how useful they are to your play style or in general. The problem is that you could never take all the glyphs because they were only available with a specific set of utilities which did not include other glyphs.

This is the concern the op is presenting.

I understand the concern but I think it’s simply the way the class is. More in combat flexibility for less out of combat flexibility.

If you play Ranger you have a pet wether you like it or not. If you play a Mesmer then you have to deal with illusions wether you like it or not.

The Revenants distinguishing feature is its unique game mechanics.
With its innate resource mechanic and Legends being able to customize legends I think would just be too hard to balance.

Btw. Cause someone mentioned above one skill (2lazy to reseach post), here it is;

“Cronacher describes one of Jalis’ utility skills. Revenants using this legend will be able to call down a rune from the sky that damages and weakens enemies as it descends. Once it actually hits the ground, it will push enemies away in order to form a safe space for allies.”

http://www.polygon.com/features/2015/2/18/8061219/guild-wars-2-profession-reveal-revenant-pc-mmo-arenanet

We didnt seen that skill in poi. 5 legends, 4 utility for each of them is possible.

DeathPanel.8362:

Your conclusion is not very sound considering all the information is not even out yet for the Revenant class and you haven’t even played it.

It’s a conclusion based on an “as-is” basis. Right now there is not flexibility between utilities. It’s a consideration though. That’s why it’s important to bring these issues up BEFORE its finalized. It doesn’t take deep understanding or playing to realize locked bars are locked bars, and thus minimal customization. We know what they said it’s like ‘for now’, and we want to encourage that they allow us to have some flexibility before it is too late, they launch and we end up having to just deal with it for a year or longer until they do a rare ability adding patch.

Lock the heal and elite,make 5 utilities per legend. Surprised many are asking a system similar to what we have now which is a failed balance, Revenant is the best designed class so far.

Sagat.3285:

Lock the heal and elite,make 5 utilities per legend. Surprised many are asking a system similar to what we have now which is a failed balance, Revenant is the best designed class so far.

This is actually what I want. Just a bit of utility choice between each legend. I don’t want to feel forced to take (possibly) several utilities I don’t want just because I feel a certain utility or aspect of a certain legend is a keystone to a build.

Kal Spiro.9745:

I think you’re missing what my point was, assuming you read it at all. Right now we only know of one elite for two legends. Based on how the legends work, though, it is reasonable to think that, if nothing else is, elites will be static to their legend because in each case the elite has been to channel the legend itself. In both cases the elite power was a toggle, not a big effect like you seem to be expecting. It changes how your character functions while gradually draining your energy. So of course you will use it often, and turn it off as well.

Using the Revenant elite is not like using the elite in any other class. It isn’t like a human necromancer summoning hounds of Balthazar, then swapping into Death Shroud and hitting Lich (as if that were a thing that could happen anyway.)

The Revenant can turn it on and off as much as it wants for as long as it can keep it up.

Have to admit I was skimming and replied prematurely. I should have replied with more detail for you. As has been pointed out we know that Jallis’ elite isn’t a toggle.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rite_of_the_Great_Dwarf

Dragon as a legend hasn’t been confirmed yet but the wiki people seem confident enough that they’ve labelled the dragon summoning pic as the Glint elite. Doesn’t look like a toggle either.

Elias.4028:

I’m not talking about rotation, I’m talking about build diversity. It seems that the biggest way to distinguish one Revenant from another will be the choice of legends you pick. And once you pick those two legends pick a weapon set and that’s it. Not a very deep customizable system. Revenants can’t do something like Guardian Mace/focus + scepter/shield with two concentrations and a shout with tome of vengeance, or the same build with different utility skills or slightly different weapon combinations.
You are set with what the legend gives you.

That’s the thing though – the legend does not set precisely how you play. It gives you 5 skills and you decide how to use them, energy permitting (though healing has standard cooldown). Maybe you’ll gear yourself to favour a few of those skills and lean heavily on those. Effectively you’ve got yourself a ‘build’ there. But you’ll still have the freedom to use the other abilities if you want.

As for distinguishing between revenants, that won’t just be a matter of pre-determined builds. It will be about players. Make smart choices on how to spend your energy and you’ll be distinguished as a smart revenant.

Elias.4028:

I believe Revenants are going to be one of the most inflexible and static professions when it comes to diversity. Once a legend combo will be deemed the most powerful, or “meta”, unless the develops change the games mechanics, that will probably stay that way consistently.

Revenants are going to be the most flexible and dynamic profession in the game. It’s the primary reason I’d play one. On paper there may be fewer total arrangements of abilities but in play you have so much more freedom with what to do them. On balance they come out on top.

Bottom line, I think what we’re talking about here is a matter of personal taste. I strongly prefer having more control over my character in combat. Cooldowns are an obstacle to that. I’ve never liked GW2 for its combat design (except for thief). You, and others, do. That’s fair enough. People are different.

Revenant may not be a profession suited to GW2’s existing build/meta-ophiles. It may be for players like me – expanding the breadth of players the game can appeal to.

Caeledh.5437:

Bottom line, I think what we’re talking about here is a matter of personal taste. I strongly prefer having more control over my character in combat. Cooldowns are an obstacle to that. I’ve never liked GW2 for its combat design (except for thief). You, and others, do. That’s fair enough. People are different.

Revenant may not be a profession suited to GW2’s existing build/meta-ophiles. It may be for players like me – expanding the breadth of players the game can appeal to.

I feel the same way. The extra limitations out of combat and the extra in combat options is what attracts me to the Revenant.

We have 8 classes that play like Wizards surely we can have one that plays like a Sorceror?

Maxzero.4032:

I feel the same way. The extra limitations out of combat and the extra in combat options is what attracts me to the Revenant.

We have 8 classes that play like Wizards surely we can have one that plays like a Sorceror?

I’m obviously on board. I have a name reserved so if by launch revenants still appeal to me I’ll play one. And I’ll stockpile ascended crafting mats but won’t craft anything for them yet.

Because ANet may yet cave to the cooldown/build/meta-lovers and rework revenants to be less dynamic and more like most existing professions. That sort of thing has happened in so many MMOs.

Worst case scenario, that other MMO will soon drop its subscription and their combat, at least, is more to my tastes.

ronpierce.2760:

Exactly. I think people are confusing some things here… We’re not talking about in-combat flexibility. They have that, no problem. We’re talking about build creation and customization. Their current set up is similar to saying if you take a trap on a ranger you must take all traps. Or survival skills you must take all survival skills (and even then, with no variation, so one of them would be cut). So on and so forth for the other classes. Necromancers typically run a signet, a spectral skill, sometimes two, or a well/corruption spell. Most well runners don’t run healing well, they take Consume Conditions. Essentially they have no say in their skills.

This matters because if you’re building for a certain aspect, and you have one utility or part of the legend that fits that role you run the risk of being forced to take some utilities that are irrelevant. You coul argue this is similar to weapons for other classes, but the catch is they have this with both weapons and utilities. Their building flexibility is pretty dry. To some that doesn’t matter, but for people who like to theory craft, that’s most of the fun sucked out right there, not being able to see how your other skills can synergize together. Instead, you’re essentially forced to 3 utilities that are what they want you to take. It’s not very interesting if you ask me.

I gave this post a 1+

Because this poster seem to get what the issue is we are having with the lack of build options.