Guild Wars 2

Unbreaking the forum. Don’t thank me.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Again, it’s a lot about perception. I don’t see it this way. I view it as paying or not paying $50 for HoT. Giving the base game away free to new players doesn’t factor into it for me.

Outside independent sources see it the other way.

Quotes from PC Gamer:

“Guild Wars 2 players rightly upset by Heart of Thorns’ pre-purchase scheme”

“People who don’t yet own Guild Wars 2 are getting an amazing deal. People who do—who have potentially supported the game for three years—are not.”

gryph.8734:

Random.4691:

Why do we need to sacrifice ? Why instead does Anet not have to make a compromise ?

I don’t want $50 worth of stuff. I don’t need financial parity to make up for the money I originally spent 2.5 years ago. I just want something —- anything, really — to recognize my role as a veteran player in helping make GW2 what it is today. A skin? A special mini? Hell, a $10 character slot? I don’t know. Just make a token effort to convince me that the last two-and-a-half years of my GW2 play hasn’t been a massive waste of time and money. Until Anet makes that token effort, I will not be purchasing HoT.

So you’re ok with everything they have done with sales prior to the pre purchase announcement ? You’re ok with the hidden extra fee for a character slot ? If you honestly believe for a second that Anet is not aware that the majority of vets don’t have a character slot available then you’re pretty gullible. They are counting on that extra $10 for the character slot from their vets, they know the majority of us do not have a slot available and will be forced to buy the more expensive bundle or an extra character slot. Any way you paint it, they are after your wallet not your best interests.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Random.4691:

Why do we need to sacrifice ? Why instead does Anet not have to make a compromise ?

A compromise would’ve been so easy, even profitable if done the right way.

Something like this:

1. Free base game for new players, free “veteran pack” for existing players.
2. Add “veteran pack” to gem store some months after release like they did with the digital deluxe update for the original game.
3. Profit from all those new players who can’t live without the veteran pack.
4. More happy players.

The “veteran pack” can be a character slot and one or more unique shinies.

Wouldn’t new players complain that they can’t get the free items too? Since it’s free why wouldn’t everyone one get it and they would have to cough up money to pay for it down the line? Not fighting you but bringing up some issues I could see people burning Anet for again.

Maybe you didn’t notice, but both groups of buyers get something for free in my hypothetical scenario, one of them still something of far greater value than the other group. And it isn’t the existing players getting the greater value.

Random.4691:

gryph.8734:

Random.4691:

Why do we need to sacrifice ? Why instead does Anet not have to make a compromise ?

I don’t want $50 worth of stuff. I don’t need financial parity to make up for the money I originally spent 2.5 years ago. I just want something —- anything, really — to recognize my role as a veteran player in helping make GW2 what it is today. A skin? A special mini? Hell, a $10 character slot? I don’t know. Just make a token effort to convince me that the last two-and-a-half years of my GW2 play hasn’t been a massive waste of time and money. Until Anet makes that token effort, I will not be purchasing HoT.

So you’re ok with everything they have done with sales prior to the pre purchase announcement ? You’re ok with the hidden extra fee for a character slot ? If you honestly believe for a second that Anet is not aware that the majority of vets don’t have a character slot available then you’re pretty gullible. They are counting on that extra $10 for the character slot from their vets, they know the majority of us do not have a slot available and will be forced to buy the more expensive bundle or an extra character slot. Any way you paint it, they are after your wallet not your best interests.

Believe it or not, I’m okay with that. It’s a freaking game. GW2 is the product of creative effort and untold man-hours of raw coding. I fully expect Anet to be reimbursed and reimbursed well for the work they have put in. What I don’t like is the idea that getting new players appears to be more important to Anet than the effort and money I have put into this game. If Anet can prove to my satisfaction that they want me to stick around (and honestly, it wouldn’t take much), I’d be more than happy to purchase HoT and keep right on plugging away in the war against the dragons. As things stand right now, I don’t think Anet could have handled things worse than they are.

Angelica Dream.7103:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Again, it’s a lot about perception. I don’t see it this way. I view it as paying or not paying $50 for HoT. Giving the base game away free to new players doesn’t factor into it for me.

Outside independent sources see it the other way.

Quotes from PC Gamer:

“Guild Wars 2 players rightly upset by Heart of Thorns’ pre-purchase scheme”

“People who don’t yet own Guild Wars 2 are getting an amazing deal. People who do—who have potentially supported the game for three years—are not.”

Technically you are. You’re getting the base game for free! In addition to the expansion pack Previously if you wanted another account you’d pay the $9.99 (which by the way I remember a lot of people calling it a steal and even bought second accounts). And as I previously stated new players/customers are always given more incentives to buy but in the end everyone gets the same offer.

Also “Amazing Deal” is a $10 off? Well I suppose everyone values $10 differently~

Would it have been better if they had just kept the base game available and priced it at $0 and the expansion $50? All in all I don’t think people really care that the game got bundle but that $50 is way too much then they were expecting to pay for an expansion.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Maybe you didn’t notice, but both groups of buyers get something for free in my hypothetical scenario, one of them still something of far greater value than the other group. And it isn’t the existing players getting the greater value.

Depends. If the base game is valued at $10 and the veterans pack equals more than that, new players get ripped off. Plus when they do get the expansion pack later they will have to pay for the vet pack while vets got it for free.

vikkival.2459:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Random.4691:

Why do we need to sacrifice ? Why instead does Anet not have to make a compromise ?

A compromise would’ve been so easy, even profitable if done the right way.

Something like this:

1. Free base game for new players, free “veteran pack” for existing players.
2. Add “veteran pack” to gem store some months after release like they did with the digital deluxe update for the original game.
3. Profit from all those new players who can’t live without the veteran pack.
4. More happy players.

The “veteran pack” can be a character slot and one or more unique shinies.

Wouldn’t new players complain that they can’t get the free items too? Since it’s free why wouldn’t everyone one get it and they would have to cough up money to pay for it down the line? Not fighting you but bringing up some issues I could see people burning Anet for again.

I think anyone – even new players could get the free items. it simply wouldn’t come with the core game, so they’d need to grab that separately.

Personally, for new players this is a great idea, but for veterans, you should’ve given a cheaper option ONLY containing the expansion for about €30. It would’ve caused many more people to purchase your expansion. Right now I am very unsure whether or not to purchase the minimum €50 option, while with a €30 euro option I would’ve pre-purchased already.

From such a great company, who have lived on the idea of a great mmorpg with no subscription model, getting it just right, I am left feeling very hollow with this approach on the expansion. I understand that BECAUSE there is no subscription model, you need to over-price the game to keep up on bucks, but at least then create an option for veterans, even make it €35-€40.

My thoughts on the expansion pricing!

vikkival.2459:

Depends. If the base game is valued at $10 and the veterans pack equals more than that, new players get ripped off. Plus when they do get the expansion pack later they will have to pay for the vet pack while vets got it for free.

First off, I don’t understand the bolded text. The only ones getting the expansion pack later are the vets, and they’d be getting the veteran pack for free. New players can’t get the expansion pack later.

The base game has no concrete value anymore, because ANet doesn’t sell it anymore. Any new player in his right mind would see that he’s getting a fabulous deal getting a AAA game as a bonus. People having a problem with my scenario should be considered not being in their right mind, and you can never account for people not in their right mind.

honestly atm it feels like we betatested the game for the past 3 years so the new players can have fun. meanwhile we went through horrible balance issues(arrowcarts buff….), terrible bugs(remember chaosstorm debacle), terrible lag issue, culling, bots and exploits, hackers and everything. we bought gems shared our ideas etc. ….and all we get is this lousy tshirt called HOT bundle…..

Can People getting real ?….

u dont pay more because new players. U pay so much because anet feel thats the price. The only people who are really kitten are people who bought the game 1-3 months ago.

They are bad luck but new player didnt do any harm to the old ones.

people need stop acting like the core game is in the price. Core game is a gift from anet. U can get it too just get a new account.

But should u ? u are maybe like me already played 3 years and got all that sexy stuff

calm down all buy HOT if u like it or dont buy it… its getting funny.

Ayrilana.1396:

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

No. There’s no cost being covered by the players. What part of the concept of a bonus do you not understand?

What part do you don’t understand? The cost of the bonus is always covered by someone – and it’s always the customer, not the seller. The “free if you buy” kind of bonus is never free, it’s just its price has been moved onto something else, to give you an illusion you receive something for free.

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

The costs do get passed on to customers. Maybe they marked the prices of the shoes up by 33% a few months ago in anticipation of the BOGO (companies set sales well in advance).

Maybe they hope you’ll buy the other overpriced accessories in the store. The socks, the shoe care items.

The cost of the expansion being free for new players is/was passed onto us customers, new and old. Maybe there were so many gem sales prior to this that they can afford to give the base away between those gem sales and predictions that enough new players will also buy plenty of gems.

Seera.5916:

Ayrilana.1396:

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

No. There’s no cost being covered by the players. What part of the concept of a bonus do you not understand?

What part do you don’t understand? The cost of the bonus is always covered by someone – and it’s always the customer, not the seller. The “free if you buy” kind of bonus is never free, it’s just its price has been moved onto something else, to give you an illusion you receive something for free.

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

The costs do get passed on to customers. Maybe they marked the prices of the shoes up by 33% a few months ago in anticipation of the BOGO (companies set sales well in advance).

Maybe they hope you’ll buy the other overpriced accessories in the store. The socks, the shoe care items.

The cost of the expansion being free for new players is/was passed onto us customers, new and old. Maybe there were so many gem sales prior to this that they can afford to give the base away between those gem sales and predictions that enough new players will also buy plenty of gems.

No. That’s not how it works.

BOGO or bundled sales on physical items involve considerations that never enter the picture with digital products, like getting rid of badly selling stock, sell-by-dates, etc.

It is absolutely pointless to make comparisons.

selan.8354:

honestly atm it feels like we betatested the game for the past 3 years so the new players can have fun. meanwhile we went through horrible balance issues(arrowcarts buff….), terrible bugs(remember chaosstorm debacle), terrible lag issue, culling, bots and exploits, hackers and everything. we bought gems shared our ideas etc. ….and all we get is this lousy tshirt called HOT bundle…..

That’s a little unfair considering the scope of the game and how well they have remedied some of these situations (especially in the bot area!) Every game has bugs and needs constant babysitting/fixing. Balance issues in GW1 were happening almost up until GW2 was released! Don’t complain about how much the core game sucked and then expect more for enduring your hellish experience. I might take this comment differently if you had first told everyone how much you enjoyed it instead of how much you hated it.

Ambika.6257:

selan.8354:

honestly atm it feels like we betatested the game for the past 3 years so the new players can have fun. meanwhile we went through horrible balance issues(arrowcarts buff….), terrible bugs(remember chaosstorm debacle), terrible lag issue, culling, bots and exploits, hackers and everything. we bought gems shared our ideas etc. ….and all we get is this lousy tshirt called HOT bundle…..

That’s a little unfair considering the scope of the game and how well they have remedied some of these situations (especially in the bot area!) Every game has bugs and needs constant babysitting/fixing. Balance issues in GW1 were happening almost up until GW2 was released! Don’t complain about how much the core game sucked and then expect more for enduring your hellish experience. I might take this comment differently if you had first told everyone how much you enjoyed it instead of how much you hated it.

dont get me wrong, i did enjoy the game, even met my husband on gw2. but we have invested a ton in this game. its not like we bought it and enjoyed the free gameplay. we actually wanted to help improve it and did support it. getting this bundle thrown into our face like that just doesnt feel well for me, at all.

Manasa Devi.7958:

BOGO or bundled sales on physical items involve considerations that never enter the picture with digital products, like getting rid of badly selling stock, sell-by-dates, etc.

It is absolutely pointless to make comparisons.

Not when used to explain the concept of sales/promotion to someone that doesn’t understand them. It was not meant as a direct comparison of what HoT is.

selan.8354:

Ambika.6257:

selan.8354:

honestly atm it feels like we betatested the game for the past 3 years so the new players can have fun. meanwhile we went through horrible balance issues(arrowcarts buff….), terrible bugs(remember chaosstorm debacle), terrible lag issue, culling, bots and exploits, hackers and everything. we bought gems shared our ideas etc. ….and all we get is this lousy tshirt called HOT bundle…..

That’s a little unfair considering the scope of the game and how well they have remedied some of these situations (especially in the bot area!) Every game has bugs and needs constant babysitting/fixing. Balance issues in GW1 were happening almost up until GW2 was released! Don’t complain about how much the core game sucked and then expect more for enduring your hellish experience. I might take this comment differently if you had first told everyone how much you enjoyed it instead of how much you hated it.

dont get me wrong, i did enjoy the game, even met my husband on gw2. but we have invested a ton in this game. its not like we bought it and enjoyed the free gameplay. we actually wanted to help improve it and did support it. getting this bundle thrown into our face like that just doesnt feel well for me, at all.

I appreciate that information, it makes me more sympathetic to your cause.

All I can say is I paid $100 for the special edition the first day it was available and I was happy to do it. I don’t feel like I wasted my money.

Angelica Dream.7103:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Again, it’s a lot about perception. I don’t see it this way. I view it as paying or not paying $50 for HoT. Giving the base game away free to new players doesn’t factor into it for me.

Outside independent sources see it the other way.

Quotes from PC Gamer:

“Guild Wars 2 players rightly upset by Heart of Thorns’ pre-purchase scheme”

“People who don’t yet own Guild Wars 2 are getting an amazing deal. People who do—who have potentially supported the game for three years—are not.”

This doesn’t change my and many other peoples’ POV. Some people see it this way but not all.

Gray.9041:

vikkival.2459:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Random.4691:

Why do we need to sacrifice ? Why instead does Anet not have to make a compromise ?

A compromise would’ve been so easy, even profitable if done the right way.

Something like this:

1. Free base game for new players, free “veteran pack” for existing players.
2. Add “veteran pack” to gem store some months after release like they did with the digital deluxe update for the original game.
3. Profit from all those new players who can’t live without the veteran pack.
4. More happy players.

The “veteran pack” can be a character slot and one or more unique shinies.

Wouldn’t new players complain that they can’t get the free items too? Since it’s free why wouldn’t everyone one get it and they would have to cough up money to pay for it down the line? Not fighting you but bringing up some issues I could see people burning Anet for again.

I think anyone – even new players could get the free items. it simply wouldn’t come with the core game, so they’d need to grab that separately.

Yes that would do nicely. They could leave the base game the same price as usually and have new people play it till they later pay for the expansion (some people take a while to get to 80).

In reality new players will always lose a bit. They’ll never be able to play livings story 1 and they have to pay to play living story 2. Added the base game free helps

Angelica Dream.7103:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Again, it’s a lot about perception. I don’t see it this way. I view it as paying or not paying $50 for HoT. Giving the base game away free to new players doesn’t factor into it for me.

Outside independent sources see it the other way.

Quotes from PC Gamer:

“Guild Wars 2 players rightly upset by Heart of Thorns’ pre-purchase scheme”

“People who don’t yet own Guild Wars 2 are getting an amazing deal. People who do—who have potentially supported the game for three years—are not.”

The PC Gamer article wasn’t independent as I seem to remember the author stating they were a GW2 player. It’d be no different than if you worked for TIME magazine and created an article about the release.

People thinking that they should get more than the base expansion, or other new players, is just entitlement. It’s really no different than when some players made a stink about the newer heroic edition of the game containing items that were not including with the edition that they bought and then demanding those items be given to them.

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

Astralporing.1957:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Regarding vets “subsidizing the new player bonus?” Get real. ANet values HoT at $50 and GW2 core @ $0. You wouldn’t be subsidizing anything.

If Anet truly valued core at 0, they would offer it as a free download in order to hook up new players. They don’t. Currently you can’t buy core from Anet at anything less than $50.

From the earlier part of the post you quoted.

IndigoSundown.5419:

• ANet decides they will make more money from new players if they value the core game at $0. They don’t go F2P because that means an endless supply of free accounts for RMT kittens and for laurel farmers, which would upset the equilibrium of T6 mats on the TP. So, they tie the “free” GW2 core to a HoT purchase.

I put the relevant part in bold so maybe you’d read it this time.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Here’s the economic equation.

• ANet decides they will make more money from new players if they value the core game at $0. They don’t go F2P because that means an endless supply of free accounts for RMT kittens and for laurel farmers, which would upset the equilibrium of T6 mats on the TP. So, they tie the “free” GW2 core to a HoT purchase..
• If ANet is correct, the new player equation favors them.
• However, say some veterans choose not to spend the $50 they would otherwise have spent (very important here). The number of new players they gain that they would not get without the “bonus” has to exceed the number of non-paying vets for the equation to pay off.

So, just how many vets are cheesed off enough to never pay unless Anet relents? If you pay later, you’re the one relenting. I’m certainly seeing posts from the usual suspects in these threads, along with posts from others I’ve never seen. The numbers might or might not rival the numbers who protested the 4/14 trait system — which did get changed. I’m pretty sure they don’t rival the protests against the Ascended horror, which kind of did and kind of didn’t get changed.

Then there’s the possibility that this is just people engaging in one of humanity’s oldest predilections, trying to get more for less. If people were concerned about the principle of the thing, they’d be challenging whether HoT is worth $50 at all, not missing and poaning about Anet trying to hook new gem store customers with the hope that they might catch a whale or two.

Regarding vets “subsidizing the new player bonus?” Get real. ANet values HoT at $50 and GW2 core @ $0. You wouldn’t be subsidizing anything.

ANET has nothing to do with the pricing on HoT, and really neither does NCSoft either.

Its their Financial report Analysis that does, as stated on Jan8th of 2015;

Also, in 2015, NCsoft is expected to roll out an ex
pansion pack for
Guild Wars 2
,
which
has sold more than 3mn copies since its release in
2012 in the US and Europe.
We
assumed in our 2015 earnings estimates
Guild Wars 2 expansion pack sales of around
2mn copies (US$50 per copy), and note that the expa
nsion packs for
Guild Wars 1
have
sold almost as much as the original game in the yea
r of their release.

Source – http://www.kdbdw.com/bbs/download/192028.pdf?attachmentId=192028

And that was even before the beta’s, any previews, or PR surrounding HoT. That was just days before Anet registered the HoT Trademarks, and they already had set a Unit price of 50USD….Even Before diving into the content they were going to provide.

Yet you all can’t see ANYTHING wrong with this?

The way I see it is like this. NCSoft is expected to make 100M from the HoT expansion (2,000,000 Copies at $50USD each), as per that report. I call this enforced profits (Must make). And instead of NCsoft finding other ways to divide this debt up, they put it all into one basket. Forcing it on its user base (new and old). They then fluff it by adding 2 more expensive options with more virtual bonuses.

And what happens if NCSoft cant make 100M in profits from GW2 in 2015? its only going to come back on the Customer base…again.

Sorry, I cant get behind this scumbag move.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

I don’t think anyone’s arguing with that at all. In fact every customer should always evaluate what they’re buying (unless they don’t care). I just think personally everyone jumped the gun too quickly. Anet hasn’t even announced everything that’s going to be in the expansion pack. They opened pre-purchases for people who are confidently interested. Everyone else should wait and see. At least now everyone knows the price and will evaluate ‘when the times comes’ if $50 is a make it or break it.

The only reason I’m upset is because of the Guild Halls has completely been ignored on the forums even though it was a great announcement that I feel added a pretty good value to the expansion. Instead of interesting discussions on the forum, it gets flooded with people wailing and pure hysteria about $50 and not knowing how to consolidate threads.

I’d say an easy solution would be just to throw in a character slot for everyone and the vast majority will be happy.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

in before the inevitable merge with the mega thread of generalized complaints or the flat out deletion of the thread

Tell ya what, for 49.99 give us that 1 character slot and separate the base game from the expansion so that if we want to create ‘yet another account’ we can.

Problem solved. like seriously.

sirsquishy.8531:

ANET has nothing to do with the pricing on HoT, and really neither does NCSoft either.

Its their Financial report Analysis that does, as stated on Jan8th of 2015;

Portions of financial reports that contain financial analysis are generated by the company, usually by a Financial Analyst or a similar position. This report is then vetted by management and included in the report as a service to stockholders or prospective stock buyers. The data comes from records of past performance and — in the case of a price on a new product — from the price set by company executives. If you want us to believe there is a third party (i.e., not ANet and NCSoft executives) setting the price, you’ll need a citation from something other than an NCSoft financial report.

Your issue seems to be that companies want to increase profits. This is what happens almost every time a “for-profit” company prices a new product. If you don’t believe that HoT is worth the price, then you obviously should not buy it.

honestly, a real vet is married to anet….we don’t have to complain, we don’t have to even leave ….we’ve already paid for perpetual bandwidth on their service.

even if we left, we have a permanent room in everything else they made, as long as they are alive. We don’t have to complain really, we don’t have to buy anything from alllll the great stuff we have already ….heck…I’m still not even done with gw1.

Anet put a ring on it with us long ago, we do them a favor by complaining. Keep that bandwidth coming, I love you <3

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

it’s also sillly to think that veterans should be attracted to deals made for only newbies.

what hurts is they didn’t think of us. but that’s fine, this would be a great time to have a gw1 revival – would love to see the look on their faces when they get complaints about lag from all the vets going back to hero’s ascent. -shows wedding ring-

it’s been so long that we’ve played gw1, it’s literally like a new game…..Guildwars 3 even!

IndigoSundown.5419:

sirsquishy.8531:

ANET has nothing to do with the pricing on HoT, and really neither does NCSoft either.

Its their Financial report Analysis that does, as stated on Jan8th of 2015;

Portions of financial reports that contain financial analysis are generated by the company, usually by a Financial Analyst or a similar position. This report is then vetted by management and included in the report as a service to stockholders or prospective stock buyers. The data comes from records of past performance and — in the case of a price on a new product — from the price set by company executives. If you want us to believe there is a third party (i.e., not ANet and NCSoft executives) setting the price, you’ll need a citation from something other than an NCSoft financial report.

Your issue seems to be that companies want to increase profits. This is what happens almost every time a “for-profit” company prices a new product. If you don’t believe that HoT is worth the price, then you obviously should not buy it.

No one knows if HoT is worth the current price point. No One. And All I am saying is before HoT was announced, it was projected in the report then 3 days later HoT was a registered Trade mark THEN they started to really dive into the development work (it left the whiteboard, sorta speak). Out of the gate they valued HoT at the current prices (49.99 being the baseline they will not go below). The other 2 Price points are for players that want more.

My main complaint is the Character slot. Why did they make an awesome class and then expect players to pony up Gems(or gold/Cash) in order to play that content After paying the HoT price?

My second complaint is that the Base game is not separated from HoT. The bundle is fine, but I have the base game and don’t need it. I would like to be able to ‘Gift’ it to a friend, or build a Bank account (I have one already).

And my last complaint is more of a systematic issue with the current players that CAN refund their GW2 as long as its 30days or less, they get HoT for 9.99 (base game cost them 39.99). Sure they lose all their exp/characters/Whatever, but in that model HoT is 9.99 not 49.99 as they get a refund for a game they already bought and that base cost gets rolled into the HoT purchase. That violates the 49.99 baseline Price that NCSoft is pushing on everyone else. Even with those players sacrifices they have to make.

pretty cut and clear I think.

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

They don’t have to. On the other side of the equation, veteran players don’t have to buy what they perceive to be a bad deal. And there’s nothing selfish about refusing bad deals. When a deal is obviously looking bad, the problem lies with he who proposed the deal.

I’ll post what I posted in another thread already regarding NCsoft and who markets the game. I’ll also provide an additional part of the previous paragraph that is very pertinent.

There’s a book called “Innovation and Strategy of Online Games.” There is a section in there that talks about NCsoft and it reads like this:

“NCsoft operates local servers and has a full satellite office in the U.S.; which is significantly more expensive than partnering with a local publisher. Problems can also arise with delayed transmission of new policies and patches between headquarters and the satellite office, but the advantage is that they retain full control of their game and also get to keep all the profits.
NCsoft’s US marketing strategy follows the local server-direct publishing-package sales model, which is an expensive option, but more lucrative than other distribution methods if successful. NCsoft’s size and financial resources allow it to take this route, enabling it to establish local offices in any market it wishes to enter as well as recruit local talent and buy out local domestic developers to assist in their releases.”

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

They don’t have to. On the other side of the equation, veteran players don’t have to buy what they perceive to be a bad deal. And there’s nothing selfish about refusing bad deals. When a deal is obviously looking bad, the problem lies with he who proposed the deal.

Yes, there’s nothing wrong with not buy what they feel is a bad deal. It’s different when they assume their position (e.g. Veteran) should award them with some additional perks above the standard release.

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

They don’t have to. On the other side of the equation, veteran players don’t have to buy what they perceive to be a bad deal. And there’s nothing selfish about refusing bad deals. When a deal is obviously looking bad, the problem lies with he who proposed the deal.

Yes, there’s nothing wrong with not buy what they feel is a bad deal. It’s different when they assume their position (e.g. Veteran) should award them with some additional perks above the standard release.

And like I said, that’s not what’s happening.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

They don’t have to. On the other side of the equation, veteran players don’t have to buy what they perceive to be a bad deal. And there’s nothing selfish about refusing bad deals. When a deal is obviously looking bad, the problem lies with he who proposed the deal.

No matter what anyone says your opinion on it being a bad deal will never change. So the way I see it, wait to see what they do (by now the obviously know about the issue) and decided your course of action then.

Giving the bundle is more a a positive then negative in my eyes because it brings more potential players that the base game alone could not do. Honestly it’s a pretty smart idea.

Ayrilana.1396:

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

Of course it gets passed on the customer. The sole reason beyond this is after all to increase income for the seller.

No. It does not. Sorry.

Ah, yeah, so Anet did it not because they thought they will get more money that way, but from the goodness of their hearts. Good to hear that.

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

Astralporing.1957:

Ayrilana.1396:

Then you don’t have an understanding of what a bonus or sale is. I guess you assume that the costs from a buy one gent one free sale gets passed onto the customer. I guess you assume that anything that gives you 33% more gets passed onto the customer.

Of course it gets passed on the customer. The sole reason beyond this is after all to increase income for the seller.

No. It does not. Sorry.

Ah, yeah, so Anet did it not because they thought they will get more money that way, but from the goodness of their hearts. Good to hear that.

The cost does not get passed onto the customer.

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Ayrilana.1396:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Expecting more from a product you haven’t bought yet and therefore not buying it isn’t entitlement. It’s being a critical, discerning customer.

There’s a difference between expecting more from a product and expecting more because you’re a current player or veteran to the game. The latter putting some form of prestige upon themselves assuming that they deserve something more because of it.

And no one is doing that. What’s happening is that people resent being offered a worse deal on buying the expansion for being a veteran.

They added a deal specifically to bring in new players. It’s a little selfish to assume that Anet must compensate veteran players for whatever deals they give to bring in new players.

They don’t have to. On the other side of the equation, veteran players don’t have to buy what they perceive to be a bad deal. And there’s nothing selfish about refusing bad deals. When a deal is obviously looking bad, the problem lies with he who proposed the deal.

Yes, there’s nothing wrong with not buy what they feel is a bad deal. It’s different when they assume their position (e.g. Veteran) should award them with some additional perks above the standard release.

And like I said, that’s not what’s happening.

Perhaps you are not but many other are.