Guild Wars 2

So at first, the fact that there are no mounts in Guild Wars 2 doesn’t seem like a big deal, since there’s Waypoints everywhere. There’s an annoyance factor in having to walk everywhere that you haven’t been yet, which can make grouping a headache, but otherwise it seems okay at first

Around levels 70-80 though, it completely falls apart. So many of the Waypoints are contested in the 70-80 zones, that you’re forced to walk everywhere including to, through, and past Waypoints you’ve already discovered. If you die, you start almost at the entrance to the zone, and when going to a different zone (say from Frostgorge to Orr, for Story Quests), you have to just walk everywhere then, too

Who thought this was a good idea?

You don’t need mounts. If a waypoint is contested and you want to rush there then use the closest waypoint and any of your speed conditions to reach the location faster. You don’t need a mount to travel around Tyria.

Besides if the average players reach lvl80 the low pop high end zones will start to fill up, and the contested areas will have players that capture them.

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

I still hope that we might see one day mounts which just grand you a swiftness buff…

On the current situation, I think one problem is that those zones were not tested enough, but maybe it will get better when more players arive at those levels and actually keeping the waypoints protected.

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

Okay, that’s nice

You’re not “exploring” a place you’ve already been. You clearly haven’t been to the development joke that is the Orr zones yet. Low population, every Waypoint contested, sent back and forth constantly. You’re forced to run around places you’ve already “explored”

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

I find it awesome that waypoints get contested. If I join in a DE where we have to assault the contested area and we manage to clear it I always feel a sense of accomplishment. It does feel like my actions caused something in the world.

Drudenfusz.2971:

I still hope that we might see one day mounts which just grand you a swiftness buff…

On the current situation, I think one problem is that those zones were not tested enough, but maybe it will get better when more players arive at those levels and actually keeping the waypoints protected.

Some kind of Swiftness Buff that didn’t require a specific weapon, or to choose a specific skill would be fine, too. I don’t care if my character actually rides an animal around the map or not, we just need some way to move a lot faster than we currently can

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

Okay, that’s nice

You’re not “exploring” a place you’ve already been. You clearly haven’t been to the development joke that is the Orr zones yet. Low population, every Waypoint contested, sent back and forth constantly. You’re forced to run around places you’ve already “explored”

This is an MMO. In this game that translates to: You CAN NOT solo clear a whole area. You will need massive amount of players to keep order in the world.

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

Okay, that’s nice

You’re not “exploring” a place you’ve already been. You clearly haven’t been to the development joke that is the Orr zones yet. Low population, every Waypoint contested, sent back and forth constantly. You’re forced to run around places you’ve already “explored”

nope i only go back to places i have already been to for certain purposes like karma vendors or something like that also no i havent been to orr yet but i look forward to that but if you are suffering from low pop area i’d recommend that you change to a higher populated server if you are not on one yet O-o

zogrim.6925:

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

Okay, that’s nice

You’re not “exploring” a place you’ve already been. You clearly haven’t been to the development joke that is the Orr zones yet. Low population, every Waypoint contested, sent back and forth constantly. You’re forced to run around places you’ve already “explored”

This is an MMO. In this game that translates to: You CAN NOT solo clear a whole area. You will need massive amount of players to keep order in the world.

Well that’s pretty poor game design, when there’s empty zones, now isn’t it?

Why are there empty zones?

OMG!!! The horror of running somewhere! Blasphemy!…

Seriously folks. There are other much more pressing matters in this game than having to run places. I mean so it takes you 45-90 seconds to run from the begining of the zone to where you want to go.

To me, and this is just my perssonal opnion, the OP is just gripping to gripe. It’s called a time sink. There for a reason… to slow you down, so you don’t burn thru the content so fast. I could understand if one was actually walking all those leagues in real life, but come on. Heaven forbid we all don’t get everything in an instant’s time frame.

So you have to run. This so called “issue” is about askitten as the posts about not having quivers(game breaking emersion) or people complaining that black powder weapons should have a long reload time like in real life(more realistic). Yeah realistic… cat people, plant people, and house elves from harry potter (asura) are realistic.

Lets not clutter up the HELP forums with rediculous QQ posts about how bad it is to walk everywhere.

My opnion, if you don’t like it… don’t read it.

Bahamut.7029:

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

Okay, that’s nice

You’re not “exploring” a place you’ve already been. You clearly haven’t been to the development joke that is the Orr zones yet. Low population, every Waypoint contested, sent back and forth constantly. You’re forced to run around places you’ve already “explored”

nope i only go back to places i have already been to for certain purposes like karma vendors or something like that also no i havent been to orr yet but i look forward to that but if you are suffering from low pop area i’d recommend that you change to a higher populated server if you are not on one yet O-o

I am on a high population server. 70-80 zones are still empty

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

Okay, that’s nice

You’re not “exploring” a place you’ve already been. You clearly haven’t been to the development joke that is the Orr zones yet. Low population, every Waypoint contested, sent back and forth constantly. You’re forced to run around places you’ve already “explored”

nope i only go back to places i have already been to for certain purposes like karma vendors or something like that also no i havent been to orr yet but i look forward to that but if you are suffering from low pop area i’d recommend that you change to a higher populated server if you are not on one yet O-o

I am on a high population server. 70-80 zones are still empty

I am gonna make an assumption…. The game is only 2 weeks old. There is probally not enough level 70-80s in the game yet to support the zones. Give it some time. A few months atleast. Most people in this game are the casual crowd. They like to take their time exploring every inch of a zone before they move on to the next.

At about the 3 month mark I bet you will see these high level zones start being populated. The waypoints will not be contests as much. Just give it some time.

Sorry to stomp on another of your posts Ganadorf, please believe me I’m not out to get you lol.

To be honest though, I love the dynamic feel of the in game environment. Things should change and become easier or harder depending on the player interaction with the area at large. Most devs recognise that for most players, a great way to keep players interested is to provide changes to the environment like this, ranging from world building changes in Atriarch over ten years ago, to city sieges in games I worked on like Mir, to “faction” areas in Guildwars and DAoC all the way through to semi-random invasions like those we see in Rift and GW2 today.

It gives players a reason, away from the levelling/item grind, to band up and work at something together for a few minutes, and whilst a truly realistic and dynamic system hasn’t been created yet, its an excellent work in progress.

The mounts thing has been done to death in the GW community. The sides are balanced and the community should by now have realised there is no point arguing the point, every thing that could be said has been, and there’s never been an overwhelmingly clear enough community desire for them for the devs to need to change their stance.

Besides, if you had spent so long developing an environment like the one we have in Guildwars 2, would you really want people skipping past it on their horses of +200% movement speed, or would you want them to interact with it and make the most of your work.

It also functions to add an element of risk to exploration for any player too, another challenge to be met through luck, skill and perseverance.
Many of us will remember paying for “runners” to help us make it to droknars forge, in the original game, way back when, so that you could make use of a valuable waypoint early on in the game campaign. I’m sure others will remember times when they have desperately tried to force their way through an area just to reach a distant waypoint, and the sense of achievement that comes with passing through a fresh swirly gate with only one companion a bad collection of conditions and 30 health to go.

Mounts bypass all of that. Hell I know from pushing a lowbie character all the way through moria without doing any more than the essential quests to get through the door back when that xpac was released on Lotro, that even ranged attacks aren’t enough of a threat to hold you back if you’re determined and crafty. What you gain in a little extra speed, is almost complete detatchment from the environment around you, and a little convenience devalues the game a great deal.

I’m sorry that you find being able to teleport within 5 minutes reach of anything you want to get to (assuming the spawns are amiable) is too slow or inconvenient for you, but for a lot of us, and clearly the players the devs currently choose to cater for, it’s all the more enjoyable and challenging, even if it does get a little tiring from time to time.

Sounds like someone had a rush to get 80. This is not WoW, now why the rush??

zogrim.6925:

Why are there empty zones?

Because it’s a level 80 zone and the game has been out for 2 weeks.

The majority of players have not had time to get up to level 80, or haven’t wanted to focus entirely on levelling. And a lot of those who have gotten to level 80 have done it through crafting, so they probably haven’t actually gone to that zone, or aren’t spending a lot of time there.

Give it time and the high level areas will fill up as more people reach those levels, then there will be more people to defend waypoints and less problems with them being contested.

I kinda agree. And I honestly don’t see what this has to do with exploration. You still explore but you simply move faster.

Most areas are huge and using waypoints is starting to feel kind of taxing from a financial pow (i’m lvl 55) and I honestly don’t feel like spending most of my playing time running from one point to another. I would like to see mounts at some point, after the critical things have been added or fixed of course.

I really hope the negative reaction to mounts isn’t because this other MMO (you know which one) has them cause that would be just stupid.

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

Ganadorf.3460:

Bahamut.7029:

the game is made that way to force you into exploring .. i am actually ok with that i used to be so mount-aholic back on wow i am glad i can enjoy the great scenery and exploring is much more fun when you walk around .. because you can feel how big the world is if you get a mount you lose that beautiful feeling.
And about contested waypoints i agree they kinda suck but they are also helpful in terms of finding out about cool events :P

Okay, that’s nice

You’re not “exploring” a place you’ve already been. You clearly haven’t been to the development joke that is the Orr zones yet. Low population, every Waypoint contested, sent back and forth constantly. You’re forced to run around places you’ve already “explored”

nope i only go back to places i have already been to for certain purposes like karma vendors or something like that also no i havent been to orr yet but i look forward to that but if you are suffering from low pop area i’d recommend that you change to a higher populated server if you are not on one yet O-o

I am on a high population server. 70-80 zones are still empty

huh who knew … maybe people hate orr way too much ?

Danikat.8537:

zogrim.6925:

Why are there empty zones?

Because it’s a level 80 zone and the game has been out for 2 weeks.

The majority of players have not had time to get up to level 80, or haven’t wanted to focus entirely on levelling. And a lot of those who have gotten to level 80 have done it through crafting, so they probably haven’t actually gone to that zone, or aren’t spending a lot of time there.

Give it time and the high level areas will fill up as more people reach those levels, then there will be more people to defend waypoints and less problems with them being contested.

Exactly!
(I was directing the question to the OP.)

Cytheria I remember those day of having “Runners” lol. Wow you just brang back some fond memories. It was good money too. It almost makes me want to go back to GW1 and see whats going on there.

Kailthir.6384:

Cytheria I remember those day of having “Runners” lol. Wow you just brang back some fond memories. It was good money too. It almost makes me want to go back to GW1 and see whats going on there.

Ghost towns basically

Bobbeeoh.2754:

Sounds like someone had a rush to get 80. This is not WoW, now why the rush??

I wasn’t in a rush, it took me 67 hours of time played, and well over an entire week with the same Class, and about 2 weeks after the game came out

If I was in a rush, I would’ve been 80 about 10 days ago

I really don’t get the hole anti-mount thing.
People say that you don’t need mounts.
I found my self needing one more than once..a lot more than once.
I like the waypoint system and it is a great convenience but the game also needs mounts.It’s as simple as that.
Players that don’t want to use mounts,will keep on using the waypoints,and players that want to use mounts,will also keep on using the waypoints,and the mounts.

While I understand what you’re saying about ‘game detachment’ I have to disagree. Mounts are always a good idea, if for no other reason then they’re just plain cool. As for teleporting around everywhere, it’s ok, but quite frankly it’s just flat out ridiculously expensive. Where it really gets me the most though is in BGs. I understand why they did it like they did simply because if you die and you can res in fairly close proximity, you get in the fight much quicker than if the other side has to run farther to get back to the fight, meaning you can win just by shear attrition factor. The maps we’re playing WvW on are HUGE, which is cool, but only having one waypoint to spawn back at and having to run all the way back across the map to get to the battle is really quite aggravating, and makes for some very dull pvp. Besides, taking a fortress that has a waypoint in it would be a huge tactical advantage and make for a great reward for a team that is willing to put the effort into taking it. But without more waypoints, WvW is definitely one place where mounts would be a big boon.

Ganadorf.3460:

Bobbeeoh.2754:

Sounds like someone had a rush to get 80. This is not WoW, now why the rush??

I wasn’t in a rush, it took me 67 hours of time played, and well over an entire week with the same Class, and about 2 weeks after the game came out

If I was in a rush, I would’ve been 80 about 10 days ago

Did you clear the whole map? Get all the vistas/points of interest/hearts etc? On every zone? If you didn’t, you were rushing. I have played 82 hours on my main and 98 hours across all my toons. My main is only level 42. So yes in my opnion you did rush to reach level 80. I bet you missed out on alot og things.

Most of us are taking out time enjoying everything each zone has to offer.

Feywray.4351:

The maps we’re playing WvW on are HUGE, which is cool, but only having one waypoint to spawn back at and having to run all the way back across the map to get to the battle is really quite aggravating, and makes for some very dull pvp.

Actually there are 4 respawn points that players could use. The problem is that keeps usually aren’t upgraded to that level.

zogrim.6925:

Feywray.4351:

The maps we’re playing WvW on are HUGE, which is cool, but only having one waypoint to spawn back at and having to run all the way back across the map to get to the battle is really quite aggravating, and makes for some very dull pvp.

Actually there are 4 respawn points that players could use. The problem is that keeps usually aren’t upgraded to that level.

Researched in what way? Cause if you mean actually finding them then yes, personally I have and I still say it’s far. Or researched as in the actual disntance you have to travel to get to battles over objectives because that kinda proves that a faster way to get around the map is required (in my personal opinion)

Ganadorf.3460:

I am on a high population server. 70-80 zones are still empty

Give it a couple of months and the 70-80 zones will be packed.

Guys saying that we don’t need mounts, isn’t really the point. We would like mounts because the’re cool! My preference would be to have mounts, I liked having mounts in wow, it was great fun quickly exploring around the landscape on a fast horse.

IMOO not having mounts at the moment is the only thing that gives wow an advantage over GW2. GW2 has done an amazing job of changing / improving so many MMORPG gaming aspects that really annoyed me in wow, instanced loot/mines for example. Just a pity there are no mounts.

Seen a few arguments of people saying that mounts don’t fit into the history and mythos of GuildWars, but those people have to realise… it’s a fantasy world.

Nemo.6295:

zogrim.6925:

Feywray.4351:

The maps we’re playing WvW on are HUGE, which is cool, but only having one waypoint to spawn back at and having to run all the way back across the map to get to the battle is really quite aggravating, and makes for some very dull pvp.

Actually there are 4 respawn points that players could use. The problem is that keeps usually aren’t upgraded to that level.

Researched in what way? Cause if you mean actually finding them then yes, personally I have and I still say it’s far. Or researched as in the actual disntance you have to travel to get to battles over objectives because that kinda proves that a faster way to get around the map is required (in my personal opinion)

Sorry, my original wording was misleading so edited my post.
What I’m saying is that on every WvW map, there are 3 keeps. And keeps could be upgraded to have a waypoint, thus ease traveling.

Op, be productive and create a game that suits your standard and taste. If your arguments are valid I’m sure it will replace all other mmo out there.

Wazabi.1439:

Op, be productive and create a game that suits your standard and taste. If your arguments are valid I’m sure it will replace all other mmo out there.

Oh yeah, because the alternative to suggesting improvements to an otherwise great game is to go make your own game.

Kailthir.6384:

Ganadorf.3460:

Bobbeeoh.2754:

Sounds like someone had a rush to get 80. This is not WoW, now why the rush??

I wasn’t in a rush, it took me 67 hours of time played, and well over an entire week with the same Class, and about 2 weeks after the game came out

If I was in a rush, I would’ve been 80 about 10 days ago

Did you clear the whole map? Get all the vistas/points of interest/hearts etc? On every zone? If you didn’t, you were rushing. I have played 82 hours on my main and 98 hours across all my toons. My main is only level 42. So yes in my opnion you did rush to reach level 80. I bet you missed out on alot og things.

Most of us are taking out time enjoying everything each zone has to offer.

There was a few Norn zones which I did 100% completion for, because I really liked them, but other than that, no. That doesn’t mean I rushed, it just means I did what I want to do. I have no desire to wander around every zone on the map looking for vistas and points of interest. If you like doing that, then that’s cool, but the fact that I do not, does not mean that I am “rushing” through content

i think its good theres no mounts, even still, im level 80.
while mounts are nice, they arnt needed in this game.

and its nice the waypoints get contested, you have to fight for the zone your in for them instead of it babyfeeding you throughout the game.

Wazabi.1439:

Op, be productive and create a game that suits your standard and taste. If your arguments are valid I’m sure it will replace all other mmo out there.

Give me a development team, and funding, and I’ll make a better game than this. Probably not as good as WoW, but better than GW2, SWTOR, etc.

Of course, since I don’t have that time, money, nor trained manpower to create my own game, I’ll just play a game like Guild Wars 2, which despite a few fundamental flaws, I mostly enjoy

Shocking, I know

i cant really comment on the WvW battlegrounds specifically, I’ve not PvP’d yet in GW2.

However in faction battles on GW 1, and to a lesser extent PvP in general, having to run back from respawn made a real difference to warzone balance, if a side pushes too far forward, the “supply lines” (ie your recently ressurected character returning to the fight) become stretched, making it progressively harder to maintain pressure, whilst the defending side with less distance to cover, become comparitively stronger as players can return faster affording them the chance to recover, or at least gain a few extra points before they get steam rolled into oblivion.

Whilst having mounts in these area’s would no doubt make the process of running back less of a chore, on the downside it’d make it far simpler to steamroll an opposing team before they had a chance to get organised, and I know from faction battles in GW1 that some teams really needed the extra time to really gel, and some of the most interesting matches have been ones where the dominating side flip flops purely as a result of the time it takes for players to get back to the action.

I grant you, both sides would gain the same benefit, but I’m sure you’ve seen enough action to know that the right returning mounted player in the right place a second after team member “x” drops the right snare/trap/bind/condition/skill/etc is going to do far more to the opposing team because they could get back faster than team member “y” having to try and hold on to that skill and try to survive while they wait 5-10 seconds for the right player to get to the right place….

Or to TL;DR it all, if you reduce the time it takes to return to a fight, you limit the ability of the opposing team to capitalise on the loss of a couple of players. As travel times decrease, you progessively change the game from a somewhat fluid, and potentially very rewarding tactical challenge, to essentially a clickfest excercise where the team with the best coordinated “spike” damage is going to walk all over the other team.

I hate to resort to a sports analogy, but the battlegrounds are team area’s after all, where you play to a teams strengths and capitalise on their weaknesses much like in sport. Football (or soccer if you’re from the other side of the pond) would be pretty rubbish if you could essentially teleport (or to keep the mount analogy, ride a motorbike) with the ball to the opposing net, and where the only challenge was could you “kick” the ball faster than the goalkeeper could “save” it. Reduce it down further and all pvp would become is a count down timer where the team with the lowest aggregate time clicking their collective mouse buttons at the count would win.