Guild Wars 2

This has happened to me twice, last time was on my thief and it was 13k, myself and a team mate in tournament mode dropped down to take Keep, I was full health and dropped instantly.

This time was on my necro, I joined a bad team, being farmed right outside spawn, I was engaging and suddenly I hit the ground. My current build runs 30k hp, and this took less than 5 seconds, it was NOT multiple uses over a long fight.

http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/8020/ddaggers.jpg

It was 7 hits, it bounces between players. No way to aviod it

That’s ridiculous. Between two players that’s a minimum of 13 bounces! Even if it was two throws that’s still 6 bounces per throw… wtf?

Who in their right mind thinks letting something bounce that often is a good idea? Really?

It bounces a maximum of 4 times, or hits 2 targets twice. The Thief used Dancing Dagger at least 4 times.
If there’s only 1 target it only hits once because there is nothing for it to bounce to.

I wish my scepter aoe snare did that, instead it just applied bleeds in an area after a long cast time, during which you miss your target 9 times out of 10 and does, oh, 300 damage. Lolololol.

This game is awful I’m about ready to quit.

It bounces 4 times as stated above. This means 4 casts are required to hit one target seven times. 4 casts for 19k… sounds balanced to me, especially since the thief is out of initiative at that point. Dancing dagger is at its best vs. 2 targets.

Kage.2389:

It bounces 4 times as stated above. This means 4 casts are required to hit one target seven times. 4 casts for 19k… sounds balanced to me, especially since the thief is out of initiative at that point. Dancing dagger is at its best vs. 2 targets.

I’m sorry no, that burst potential shouldn’t exist, at all, even if it’s rare, or hard to achieve, it’s stupid.

Using DD 4 times in a row is not burst. Backstab is burst.
Neither of you thought to dodge/heal/Mist Form/ whatever?
What did you do, stand there for the entire fight and let the Thief cast DD 4 times?

Zunhar.4079:

Using DD 4 times in a row is not burst. Backstab is burst.
Neither of you thought to dodge/heal/Mist Form/ whatever?
What did you do, stand there for the entire fight and let the Thief cast DD 4 times?

To be fair, letting “the Thief cast DD 4 times” isn’t the issue. It can be done instantly.

Yeah there are ways around taking the damage and minimizing it, but if it catches you off guard as a low HP pool build—you’re most likely going to go down.

This happened in seconds there was no time to react.

Did you get stacks of vulnerability before this? Did tthe thief have tons of might from buffs around him? Did he have quickness? Did he have fury? How many seconds was it really? Screenshots of the final point don’t show enough of the situation to be a reliable source for balance discussion.

Dodge roll away from the target it is bouncing on, this damage does it fast if he spammed it I have to admit, but unless you had a flesh golem or something right next to you, it is easier to avoid than backstab combos.

demonstrative.9176:

Zunhar.4079:

Using DD 4 times in a row is not burst. Backstab is burst.
Neither of you thought to dodge/heal/Mist Form/ whatever?
What did you do, stand there for the entire fight and let the Thief cast DD 4 times?

To be fair, letting “the Thief cast DD 4 times” isn’t the issue. It can be done instantly.

Yeah there are ways around taking the damage and minimizing it, but if it catches you off guard as a low HP pool build—you’re most likely going to go down.

If you get caught off guard as a low HP build you’re going to go down easy, no matter what the opponent was using.
Dancing Dagger is not instant, nor can it be done instantly. It has a cast time and animation travel time.
Part of playing well is knowing when to use your dodge/defensive skills. Negating DD is one of those times.

Sadly like PvP in most games, it happens in seconds with little time to react. Excellent players respond to things in less than a half second, seeing animations out of the corner of their eye and responding near instantly.

So Dancing Dagger hit you 7 times in 4 casts, over 5 seconds or so, feels like you had a little time to respond, I understand given the team and lack of coordination that you were frustrated, I would be too.

They should call it “Flubber Dagger”

“Your dagger transforms from metal into flubber and bounces infinitely across foes as their scream in frustration”

its just the whole design of the thief class is faulty at its core..

Zunhar.4079:

demonstrative.9176:

Zunhar.4079:

Using DD 4 times in a row is not burst. Backstab is burst.
Neither of you thought to dodge/heal/Mist Form/ whatever?
What did you do, stand there for the entire fight and let the Thief cast DD 4 times?

To be fair, letting “the Thief cast DD 4 times” isn’t the issue. It can be done instantly.

Yeah there are ways around taking the damage and minimizing it, but if it catches you off guard as a low HP pool build—you’re most likely going to go down.

If you get caught off guard as a low HP build you’re going to go down easy, no matter what the opponent was using.
Dancing Dagger is not instant, nor can it be done instantly. It has a cast time and animation travel time.
Part of playing well is knowing when to use your dodge/defensive skills. Negating DD is one of those times.

The cast time is 1/4th of a second. No sense in defending DD, it’s already going to get hit in the next patch. I play a thief, don’t be delusional.

Seriously, 19k in 7 hits and you complain about that?
You are seriously complaining about a skill that does 2715 damage per hit.

Please tell me this is not true.

demonstrative.9176:

Zunhar.4079:

Using DD 4 times in a row is not burst. Backstab is burst.
Neither of you thought to dodge/heal/Mist Form/ whatever?
What did you do, stand there for the entire fight and let the Thief cast DD 4 times?

To be fair, letting “the Thief cast DD 4 times” isn’t the issue. It can be done instantly.

Yeah there are ways around taking the damage and minimizing it, but if it catches you off guard as a low HP pool build—you’re most likely going to go down.

So let me get this straight…

The issue is if you’re low health and not paying attention you shouldn’t die to Dancing Dagger?

I hope I’m misinterpreting that.

Moderator Edit: removed CoC violation

DD hard counters Zergs in sPvP. Spread apart a little more.

Seriously? DD is a weapon utility skill. It’s for crippling people AND it bounces AND can be spammed. Does anyone really think it’s fair that they have an aoe cripple that also has that kind of damage output? Lol no. I wish the cripple on my shortbow as a ranger did that kind of damage or could cripple as many people.

Gabi.5264:

Seriously, 19k in 7 hits and you complain about that?
You are seriously complaining about a skill that does 2715 damage per hit.

Please tell me this is not true.

I know it must be surprising for a thief but…for some professions this is a high number especially because when you mash button x it doesn’t respond anymore because gasp it is on a coodlown!!!

demonstrative.9176:

Zunhar.4079:

demonstrative.9176:

Zunhar.4079:

Using DD 4 times in a row is not burst. Backstab is burst.
Neither of you thought to dodge/heal/Mist Form/ whatever?
What did you do, stand there for the entire fight and let the Thief cast DD 4 times?

To be fair, letting “the Thief cast DD 4 times” isn’t the issue. It can be done instantly.

Yeah there are ways around taking the damage and minimizing it, but if it catches you off guard as a low HP pool build—you’re most likely going to go down.

If you get caught off guard as a low HP build you’re going to go down easy, no matter what the opponent was using.
Dancing Dagger is not instant, nor can it be done instantly. It has a cast time and animation travel time.
Part of playing well is knowing when to use your dodge/defensive skills. Negating DD is one of those times.

The cast time is 1/4th of a second. No sense in defending DD, it’s already going to get hit in the next patch. I play a thief, don’t be delusional.

I also play a Mesmer, Engineer, and Warrior. So what? I don’t have a problem with DD, why do you?
Its dodgeable, reflectable, and most imporantly, easily conterable.
So, it cripples and does some damage. Sounds like a nice anti-kiting melee tool. Still not sure what the problem is.

Asmodean.5820:

Gabi.5264:

Seriously, 19k in 7 hits and you complain about that?
You are seriously complaining about a skill that does 2715 damage per hit.

Please tell me this is not true.

I know it must be surprising for a thief but…for some professions this is a high number especially because when you mash button x it doesn’t respond anymore because gasp it is on a coodlown!!!

Haha yeah I laughed at that one. I can do that kind of aoe dd on a necro once every 40 seconds, if I channel for 3 seconds uninterrupted.

Gabi.5264:

Seriously, 19k in 7 hits and you complain about that?
You are seriously complaining about a skill that does 2715 damage per hit.

Please tell me this is not true.

2715 damage per hit over 7 hits is HUGE for every other class. Not commenting on whether this specific issue is hugely imbalanced, just throwing this out there.

Personally, I think the issue with thieves is fundamentally poor class design. Vanilla WoW rogues had this issue. Gw1 Assasins had this issue when they were introduced.
Witchelves and Witchunters (essentially rogues) in WAR had issues at launch as well. Eventually all of these classes were ‘adjusted’ for less burst and more utility because the devs eventually recognized the fundamental design flaws.

Thankfully, as per dev posts in this thread: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/thief/Backstab-time-to-nerf/page/2 , thieves are being re-tooled for more flexibility and less burst.

this class is just broken, don’t bother, can dodge as you want, can insta kill as you want, enough said.

Asmodean.5820:

Gabi.5264:

Seriously, 19k in 7 hits and you complain about that?
You are seriously complaining about a skill that does 2715 damage per hit.

Please tell me this is not true.

I know it must be surprising for a thief but…for some professions this is a high number especially because when you mash button x it doesn’t respond anymore because gasp it is on a coodlown!!!

And Gasp you have 2 entire weapon sets (or 4 attunements, or as many kits as you want to bring) of CD’s to use! Hitting DD 4 times is the equivalent of using every single CD on both weapon sets!

This is honestly the saddest thief complaint I’ve seen. The backstab stuff I can understand, though I disagree with. Then the condition spec crying started, and I just laughed. This, however, is the worst I’ve seen – complaining about an easily dodged ability from a visible glass cannon spec’d thief. DD is hilariously easy to dodge due to travel time (just ask anyone who’s ever run away from a thief with enough endurance to dodge) – you sat there and ate DD after DD from an obvious glass cannon (while being fairly squishy yourself), and rather than examine what happened, how it could be prevented (extremely easily, as I’ve pointed out), and adjusting your playstyle, people come to the boards to QQ, and similar people who cry for nerfs before learning how to play hear the clarion call and join in.

if pressing V to dodge 7 dancing daggers is too mainstream for you try to type /dance while dying from dancing daggers, at least it will be funny

The most effective use of dancing dagger is actually as a rez deterrent – spam it on somebody trying to revive a teammate and lol.

It’s incredibly powerful in that scenario and if people aren’t complaining about it yet, they will be soon enough.

LOL, and ppl wonder why there is a marked decrease in participation in this games pvp.

Thief, the class that keeps giving. The comedy never ends. Glad I quit pvp and only occasionally pve.

Should have waited to purchase this game and let the dust settle. This games pvp is trash.

evilapprentice.6379:

Asmodean.5820:

Gabi.5264:

Seriously, 19k in 7 hits and you complain about that?
You are seriously complaining about a skill that does 2715 damage per hit.

Please tell me this is not true.

I know it must be surprising for a thief but…for some professions this is a high number especially because when you mash button x it doesn’t respond anymore because gasp it is on a coodlown!!!

And Gasp you have 2 entire weapon sets (or 4 attunements, or as many kits as you want to bring) of CD’s to use! Hitting DD 4 times is the equivalent of using every single CD on both weapon sets!

This is honestly the saddest thief complaint I’ve seen. The backstab stuff I can understand, though I disagree with. Then the condition spec crying started, and I just laughed. This, however, is the worst I’ve seen – complaining about an easily dodged ability from a visible glass cannon spec’d thief. DD is hilariously easy to dodge due to travel time (just ask anyone who’s ever run away from a thief with enough endurance to dodge) – you sat there and ate DD after DD from an obvious glass cannon (while being fairly squishy yourself), and rather than examine what happened, how it could be prevented (extremely easily, as I’ve pointed out), and adjusting your playstyle, people come to the boards to QQ, and similar people who cry for nerfs before learning how to play hear the clarion call and join in.

I too, have infinite endurance. Everything is balanced because I can always ‘just dodge it’. I mean, this was only 4 dancing daggers. If you can’t dodge 4 times in 5 seconds, you deserve to lose. Everyone knows you should always save all your endurance to dodge dancing dagger. Once you dodge the first 4, you will be fine, because you can regen enough endurance to dodge again before the thief will regen enough initiative to dancing dagger again.

One of the above sentences is true.

Mammoth.1975:

I too, have infinite energy. Everything is balanced because I can always ‘just dodge it’. I mean, this was only 4 dancing daggers. If you can’t dodge 4 times in 5 seconds, you deserve to lose.

You have no stuns/dazes/invulns/weapon based evades/heals/blocks/blinds/weaknesses/protection/retaliation or second hp bars that you could use in the mean time? How bout an immobilize and move out of range? No? Nothing? Only 2 evades?

The only time when DD is a bit silly is when its bouncing between a downed player and someone rezzing.

I support a tone down of BS because it does happen very quickly and the damage is a bit on the extreme side with the CnD/Steal/BS combo.

However if you legitimatly get down to a DD spamming thief, then you get no sympathy, and my only advice is l2p.

Paranoid.9542:

Mammoth.1975:

I too, have infinite energy. Everything is balanced because I can always ‘just dodge it’. I mean, this was only 4 dancing daggers. If you can’t dodge 4 times in 5 seconds, you deserve to lose.

You have no stuns/dazes/invulns/weapon based evades/heals/blocks/blinds/weaknesses/protection/retaliation or second hp bars that you could use in the mean time? How bout an immobilize and move out of range? No? Nothing? Only 2 evades?

The only time when DD is a bit silly is when its bouncing between a downed player and someone rezzing.

I support a tone down of BS because it does happen very quickly and the damage is a bit on the extreme side with the CnD/Steal/BS combo.

However if you legitimatly get down to a DD spamming thief, then you get no sympathy, and my only advice is l2p.

Just pointing out that we’ve all heard the ‘just dodge’ argument 90 gazillion times and we all know that it’s just a waste of text.

While I’m at it, I’ll point out a few more that are the same. All of my stuns, blinds, and dazes take four to eight times as long to cast as dancing dagger. I have no invulns, no blocks. Weakness doesn’t affect crits, and if 2715 per hit on a bouncing attack isn’t a crit, dancing dagger really needs toning down. Retaliating for 300 against a 2715 damage attack is not a counter. Even if everyone except thieves was forced to use sigils of energy because of thieves, it still doesn’t give you enough endurance to dodge 4 times. I have one immobilise on one weapon set and it has shorter range than dancing dagger. My second life bar takes about twenty times as long to become available as 4x dancing dagger.

I don’t have an issue with dancing dagger, I have an issue with stupid arguments.

Mammoth.1975:

I don’t have an issue with dancing dagger, I have an issue with stupid arguments.

I think Anet should put in another language filter that replaces “Dodge” with “Dodge + any utility or weapon based mitigation techniques”

So these sorts of things are avoided in future. (I swear there was no pun intended)

Paranoid.9542:

Mammoth.1975:

I too, have infinite energy. Everything is balanced because I can always ‘just dodge it’. I mean, this was only 4 dancing daggers. If you can’t dodge 4 times in 5 seconds, you deserve to lose.

You have no stuns/dazes/invulns/weapon based evades/heals/blocks/blinds/weaknesses/protection/retaliation or second hp bars that you could use in the mean time? How bout an immobilize and move out of range? No? Nothing? Only 2 evades?

The only time when DD is a bit silly is when its bouncing between a downed player and someone rezzing.

I support a tone down of BS because it does happen very quickly and the damage is a bit on the extreme side with the CnD/Steal/BS combo.

However if you legitimatly get down to a DD spamming thief, then you get no sympathy, and my only advice is l2p.

/Agree. The entire premise of this scenario is 2 players running away from one thief, in which neither of them dodged ANY of the dagger hits, failed to use ANY cc, didn’t attempt to FIGHT the thief 2v1, use ANY sort of blink/shadowstep/charge to widen the gap, or even move away from the person they were next to so the bouncing would stop.

Come on.

I’m pretty sure at this point, the crowd won’t rest until the thief is crucified and the only ability we have left is to run away 25% faster than anyone else.

Paranoid.9542:

Mammoth.1975:

I don’t have an issue with dancing dagger, I have an issue with stupid arguments.

I think Anet should put in another language filter that replaces “Dodge” with “Dodge + any utility or weapon based mitigation techniques”

So these sorts of things are avoided in future. (I swear there was no pun intended)

I think you still need to come up with a utility or weapon based mitigation technique that actually works against this for each class. The only option I have is on a ninety second cooldown (and it only mitigates a third of the damage anyway), while thieves can spam 4 dds every 10-20s depending on spec. I’m still fine with it, because I’m not built like glass, so 99% of thieves are basically roadkill for me, but that doesn’t make the glass v glass matchup any more fun when one side is a thief. I understand the role they’re supposed to fill, but it shouldn’t be so easy to fill, nor should the outcome be such a certainty.

Mammoth.1975:

I think you still need to come up with a utility or weapon based mitigation technique that actually works against this for each class. The only option I have is on a ninety second cooldown (and it only mitigates a third of the damage anyway), while thieves can spam 4 dds every 10-20s depending on spec. I’m still fine with it, because I’m not built like glass, so 99% of thieves are basically roadkill for me, but that doesn’t make the glass v glass matchup any more fun when one side is a thief.

Would it be out of line of me to say that in the matter of glass v glass that thieves may have an edge over other glass as it’s what their mechanics allow them to do?

I’d also say that anyone that isnt built glass has an edge over thieves because thats what their builds/mechanics allow them to do.

You say yourself that you roadkill 99% of glass thieves, I believe that wouldnt be your class being OP, that would be a superior build for the situation of you vs glass thief.

As for coming up with a utility or weapon based mitigation?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Invulnerability
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blind
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dodge
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reflect

The same stuff that you use to mitigate any other projectile in the game.

I leave daze/stun/knockdown etc. because they dont really mitigate, just delay. But you could also use these to unload on the thief because they are glass and die when you sneeze on them.

Mammoth.1975:

I understand the role they’re supposed to fill, but it shouldn’t be so easy to fill, nor should the outcome be such a certainty.

As do I, which I why I support a BS tweaking. However spamming 4 DD in succession isnt and never should be a certain win, not because it’s OP, but because it is exceptionally easy to mitigate the vast majority of damage in many circumstances.

Paranoid.9542:

Mammoth.1975:

I think you still need to come up with a utility or weapon based mitigation technique that actually works against this for each class. The only option I have is on a ninety second cooldown (and it only mitigates a third of the damage anyway), while thieves can spam 4 dds every 10-20s depending on spec. I’m still fine with it, because I’m not built like glass, so 99% of thieves are basically roadkill for me, but that doesn’t make the glass v glass matchup any more fun when one side is a thief. I understand the role they’re supposed to fill, but it shouldn’t be so easy to fill, nor should the outcome be such a certainty.

Would it be out of line of me to say that in the matter of glass v glass that thieves may have an edge over other glass as it’s what their mechanics allow them to do?

I’d also say that anyone that isnt built glass has an edge over thieves because thats what their builds/mechanics allow them to do.

You say yourself that you roadkill 99% of glass thieves, I believe that wouldnt be your class being OP, that would be a superior build for the situation of you vs glass thief.

As for coming up with a utility or weapon based mitigation?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Invulnerability
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Block
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blind
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dodge
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reflect

The same stuff that you use to mitigate any other projectile in the game.

I’m not sure you’re reading everything you’re responding to. I already said I understand the role they’re supposed to fill, but it shouldn’t be so easy to fill, nor should the outcome be such a certainty. An edge is fine. Downing people in 2s with a shadowstep, or 5s while staying at range isn’t an edge, it’s a near guarantee, and that’s stifling potentially viable builds from other classes, and therefore it’s stifling potential comps. Thieves are not causing anywhere near as big problems as mesmers and guardians (or rather portal and block/control/immunity/dodge rotations) are, but it’s still an issue.

And I already pointed out that most of those tools aren’t available to every class, and when they are, they often don’t cast fast enough to have any impact on the initiative dump.

Yeah, sorry I added in a seperate quote and addressed the role-easy-thing bit of your post.

I tend to agree with you then I think. Situationally, dancing dagger is very strong, but that’s the case for every ability. The real issue is thieves pushing every other glass build except mesmers and warriors into nonexistence. They just don’t get run. I think an aftercast on steal might be enough to change that, but we will see what happens on the fifteenth anyway.

It’s a BUG guys Bladetrail does the exact same thing everthing that bounces between targets is multipling the dmg.

Dev’s are aware of it and will be fixing it next patch they have already stated this.

yeah honestly dancing dagger is a joke. the power ratios for the thief class are way off. thieves can spam this in a group, destroy anybody that is near an ally, for example a ranger and his pet are done for. -> necro with a flesh golem is pretty screwed too. this needs to be looked at by anet. hopefully mid november patch will be decreasing thief overall DPS like they should be, with some more survivability. screen attached.

took 11k in 5 hits. absolutely ridiculous. if you dont have any blocks or endurance to dodge you are kittening screwed

Whether it’s heartseeker, pistol whip, backstab, signets, dancing dagger or whatever else is next…the profession should have never got out alpha and beta with all these issues.

Someone wasn’t doing their job and there is a reason the game is now called Thief Wars 2 for spvp.

Unfortunately, it’s too late for this game to recover. Most people have moved on from this ridiculousness.

Personally, while thieves are an embarrassment to the programmers, I think the AI of necro minions takes the cake. I never thought I’d see a game in 2012 with such poor AI get released from any reputable game developers. It’s worse than WoW 1.0 which is nearly a decade old.

evilapprentice.6379:

Asmodean.5820:

Gabi.5264:

Seriously, 19k in 7 hits and you complain about that?
You are seriously complaining about a skill that does 2715 damage per hit.

Please tell me this is not true.

I know it must be surprising for a thief but…for some professions this is a high number especially because when you mash button x it doesn’t respond anymore because gasp it is on a coodlown!!!

And Gasp you have 2 entire weapon sets (or 4 attunements, or as many kits as you want to bring) of CD’s to use! Hitting DD 4 times is the equivalent of using every single CD on both weapon sets!

This is honestly the saddest thief complaint I’ve seen. The backstab stuff I can understand, though I disagree with. Then the condition spec crying started, and I just laughed. This, however, is the worst I’ve seen – complaining about an easily dodged ability from a visible glass cannon spec’d thief. DD is hilariously easy to dodge due to travel time (just ask anyone who’s ever run away from a thief with enough endurance to dodge) – you sat there and ate DD after DD from an obvious glass cannon (while being fairly squishy yourself), and rather than examine what happened, how it could be prevented (extremely easily, as I’ve pointed out), and adjusting your playstyle, people come to the boards to QQ, and similar people who cry for nerfs before learning how to play hear the clarion call and join in.

What kind of stupid logic is this, I can use all 5 of my weapon abilities, switch, use the other 5 and use the other 4 of my class abilities and NOT kill someone.

Using your resource pool does [Edit]not kittening entitle you to a kill.

Slow people won’t be happy until the game is slowed down enough for them to react.

xiv.7136:

Slow people won’t be happy until the game is slowed down enough for them to react.

Dear Sir / Madam.

How you react to something which has
-instant cast time
-looks like 2 simple #1 attacks which is actually -17k from you in 0.5secs

and also I just run around the field……SUDDENLY i got hit with 4 skills in 0.5secs.
FROM NOWHERE.
Because he used stealth!!!

How do you react to something WHICH YOU DON’T SEE?
Stealth is a broken game mechanic. I will never understand how they can implement such an idiotic thing.

So after I couldn’t see anything and I got hit while I couldn’t see him, I’m downed.
Trying to search for target and ask: WTF happened?
Then I see he finished the finisher move.
Then after finisher I CAN FINALLY SEE HIM! Because the stealth effect / culling issue finally makes me to see this guy who is killed my from STEALTH and finished me while was in the SAME STEALTH.

So I ask you this:
What reaction time you speaking when the enemy killing you while he is invisible all the time?

Or should I sometimes just stop running, stand there and look around and say:
“I feel some disturbance in the force…….maybe a thief is here” so i can spam auto-attack [yes best method to find thief in a 1 square kilometer map,to spam #1 every 1 cm. according to people on this forum] ?

If I can’t see anything just the map ,how I can defend myself from it?
Spoiler: I can’t.

Thank you.

Kage.2389:

It bounces 4 times as stated above. This means 4 casts are required to hit one target seven times. 4 casts for 19k… sounds balanced to me, especially since the thief is out of initiative at that point. Dancing dagger is at its best vs. 2 targets.

LOL. ‘It is fine because even though everyone is now dead, the thief is out of initiative!’

What a joke.

Might be the same bug as Blade Trail and the lightning strike/flame blast 4k-6k procs.

xiv.7136:

Slow people won’t be happy until the game is slowed down enough for them to react.

Lol. If you don’t recognize that thiefs as it is are stupid and unbalanced as kitten. Then fine… don’t nerf them.

But give every single other class (that is not a mesmer/warrior since they have it already) a chance to go glass cannon and be able to pull out the same amount of dps.

How about that?

Bump because i think the thread got the forum bug thingy when reaching bottom.