Guild Wars 2

Btw honestly, in my opinion, mesmer and guardian are more op then thief , but from my point of view (ranger) lvl mobs are op so forgive me ^.^

In my opinion they need to separate, sPvp, WvW and PvE balancing.

PvE and WvW especially use bought/farmed gear that can take forever to get. (not to mention the time it takes to level the char) Then because SPvP which is free gear, insta lvl 80, has an OP class the PvE and WvW players get shafted.

once a warrior aimed shot me for 15k and killed me with 1 shot and another one haste+100b me to death. Nerf.
once a ranger killed me in 2 secs with his pigeons. Nerf.
once a mesmer blew me with his phantasm explosions. 4.5k*4. Nerf.
once a necro put so many conditions on me i could only die in pain. Nerf.
I saw a guardian facing 3 enemies and killing them one by one while constantly regenerating health. Nerf.

Downed State is there excuse to allow super high burst dmg in game.

It’s a terrible decision IMO, but it is what it is.

Harmadda.5971:

Okay I just left PVP to write this up. This is actually my first post.
I was running through the battlefield and came across a Thief.

The guy vanished, hit me and BAM I was suddenly dying on the ground.

Now as this is my first post I am sure there have been others regarding “overpowered classes” and I just read through one of the developers saying “find a counter” before making that claim but I have to say…I can’t counter what happened when I was dead before I could react. I play sPVP primarily in this game and I was just floored at what happened.

Could a DEV even counter that?
I seriously doubt it.

Now I play a Thief occasionally, and personally I don’t think they are overpowered at all, I think there are certain combinations that can be made with a few Professions that are just undeniably unstoppable. There seriously needs to be some retooling if this is going to be the norm because I literally had 1 second to react. ONE SECOND between that fast attack and I was “fighting for my life”.

COME ON.

I have seen a few on Youtube that can drop health pretty quickly if utilized properly but NOTHING like what I just went through. Those attacks (Pistol/Sword for example) could at least be countered. This was just plain wrong. W-R-O-N-G.

It’s not even PVP.
It’s not even a fight.
Hell…it’s probably not even that hard to do because I am sure it wasn’t an exploit.

The point is that stuff like this takes the fun right out of the game. You expect some level of player versus player in PVP, not 2-3 button kills.

Who wants to play PVP like that anyway?
I wouldn’t even if I could.
It’s extremely cheap and without challenege.

So Devs, this isn’t a case of someone crying “OP!!!” just because they couldn’t stop a player, this is someone who has been PVPing since release and just came across a serious WTF moment. I even said that in PVP.

“Did I just die without even any time to react??!”

The Thief responded with a ‘<3’.

Yeah.

- H

not saying this didnt happen to you sir, but i have a couple of questions, are you a glass canon? what class are you? are you specced properly?

I have 533 hours played in 33 days (yes all i do is play video games), and I have played pretty much every class, and i have yet to be killed in under a second, not even by pistol whip at its prime while playing a glass canon ele…….

so why didnt you ask the fella what he hit you with or look at your dmg log? that may have answered your question on ’wtf?" it was

good players find counters bads complain about it to devs and forums (-_^)

Red Falcon.8257:

One word, OP: Toughness.

Another word: LOL.

Glass cannon, I get crit by spammable attack for 8k+
Full thougness + full bunker spec + full bunker gear I get crit for 6.9k. 3 hits are still enough to kill said full bunker spec from 100% to 0%.

But how did the Thief gank you so fast. Did you have a chance to check the combat log?

Harmadda.5971:

Did you watch the FIRST video link posted in the thread?

Was there something wrong with the second clip (the one I posted)?

Not a catchy musical montage of moneyshots, I know, but not only does that guy brutalize all different classes too, he also goes into a lot of detail about how its done, and shows the greater context of his experience, like what he did while waiting for cooldowns, which opponents he’d fight, and which he’d run from, etc.

Vaerah.4907:

Red Falcon.8257:

One word, OP: Toughness.

Another word: LOL.

Glass cannon, I get crit by spammable attack for 8k+
Full thougness + full bunker spec + full bunker gear I get crit for 6.9k. 3 hits are still enough to kill said full bunker spec from 100% to 0%.

I cant do anything but laugh at your misfortune, as there is absolutely no way you are being hit for 6.9k by anything in a full bunker spec, what are you concidering a full bunker spec, because I am a glass canon and there is absolutely no class in this game that specs toughness 100% and gets hit for anything more than 3k crits from white hits (regular 1 hits)

3k auto attack on 100% toughness ? o_O

3k is what i do on crits with full glass canon spec with all buffs running, and thats not on 100% toughness, my mistake, thats on squishy people…… on bunkers its more like 800-1200’ish give or take.

shalmont.2539:

Vaerah.4907:

Red Falcon.8257:

One word, OP: Toughness.

Another word: LOL.

Glass cannon, I get crit by spammable attack for 8k+
Full thougness + full bunker spec + full bunker gear I get crit for 6.9k. 3 hits are still enough to kill said full bunker spec from 100% to 0%.

I cant do anything but laugh at your misfortune, as there is absolutely no way you are being hit for 6.9k by anything in a full bunker spec, what are you concidering a full bunker spec, because I am a glass canon and there is absolutely no class in this game that specs toughness 100% and gets hit for anything more than 3k crits from white hits (regular 1 hits)

It’s not hard to find that spec, elementalists who want to survive 2 seconds outside of spawn point are forced into 1 spec, which is all earth + water + arcane, cleric gear (healing and + thoughness) and so on.

just found this video, thought you’d like to see it, its probably what you were hit with.

Get some vit/toughness, trait some defense. Glass Thieves are a joke. I’m a condition thief and I think I’ve been killed by a glass thief once. That’s was in WvW when I was focusing on someone else which is sort of what they are for. 1 on 1 there are so many ways to mess up their back-stab combo then you have 45 seconds to take down their 12K health which is more than enough time. Maybe it helps to play a Thief to beat them but once you understand the setup, it’s easy.

Agree 100% with OP. The mechanics of the thief with the state of the game engine (with regards to invis to uninvis transitions and such) make the thief ridiculously overpowerd. If you do not believe me (and you play a thief), play another class for a while until you find a thief that you can’t kill because you die instantly upon starting to fight them. May take you awhile because even with all the uberness of the build, not all thieves are smart enough to use it.

There are WAY too many issues with the thief especially with regards to their burst damage. You could always theorycraft that the damage is avoidable, but in practice, it really isn’t unless you are insanely lucky.

I think the funny thing (and funny is sarcastic) is that one of the people who defended the thief in this thread said that sometimes they can’t get their opener off and find themselves in a world of hurt and have to run away…. not die…. run away…. which leads me back to the biggest problem I have with this whole thing; they get insane dps and burst damage… AND they can get away from a losing fight with ease. It’d be one thing that a thief who doesn’t pull off things perfectly dies faster than their would-be victim. But that’s just not the case.

Oddly, found me and my guildmates playing another game for the first time in 40 something days. Was fun while it lasted GW2.

Thief may or may not be overpowered, but here is the real problem. Everyone stacks maximum damage equipment and traits. When you stack damage and no defense of course you will die in 2 seconds. I play a defensive Guardian and guess what, I have never been killed 1v1 or even 2v1. It might take me a bit longer to kill someone since I can’t burst them down but who cares? It’s about surviving, not getting the biggest crit number.

KevinEvo.7061:

Thief may or may not be overpowered, but here is the real problem. Everyone stacks maximum damage equipment and traits. When you stack damage and no defense of course you will die in 2 seconds. I play a defensive Guardian and guess what, I have never been killed 1v1 or even 2v1. It might take me a bit longer to kill someone since I can’t burst them down but who cares? It’s about surviving, not getting the biggest crit number.

The OP has not given details of Profession or Build and you assume wrongly that, ‘Everyone stacks maximum damage equipment and traits’.

The point being raised is that the Thief, as is, is being allowed to effectively Gank other players.

OK, let’s look at a few facts.

1) That thief had to be a power/pre stacking glass cannon backstab build. We all know that.
2) We don’t know what class or spec the OP was, but ten bucks says he was a glass cannon himself.
3) So high damage, no defense gets first strike on high damage, no defense. What outcome do you expect?
4) OK, so the thief stealthed. This isn’t WoW. You know at BEST has has maybe ten seconds to get you. Most times, most stealth abilities, he has about 3-5. Two dodge rolls and a defensive or mobility power or two and he wastes his stealth. Then he’s yours.
5) Can a thief do too much burst damage? Probably. Does that mean that the player could have done NOTHING to prevent dying? Inconclusive. Probably though, he could have.

Here is how to not die

There is a difference of about 50% damage reduction between 2400 armor and 3000 armor.
Basically having 2400 armor means you’re giving your opponent a 50% damage buff.
You can also get away with 2800 armor (40% damage reduction compared to 2400 armor).

Yes, it is normal that a character can gib you if you are giving them such a damage buff by not stacking Armor.

Give your character a bit more defense? These builds are super high attack and super low defense. It is not overpowered.

They are super squishy.

I have encountered a thief like this many times. If you don’t react properly you will die. But they also die very very fast.

So Anet does the same blunder every other game with a stealth class does? They are “squishy” but can basically kill you in one or two hits. Why oh why did they not learn from the past?

Pradton.8576:

So Anet does the same blunder every other game with a stealth class does? They are “squishy” but can basically kill you in one or two hits. Why oh why did they not learn from the past?

They cannot kill you in a few hits if you stack armor.
Read my post above.

Its true every game makes the same mistake with their thef classes. wow had it, warhammer had it, swtor had it.

Dont worry though they always sort them out they are just a hard class to balance.

shalmont.2539:

I have 533 hours played in 33 days (yes all i do is play video games), and I have played pretty much every class, and i have yet to be killed in under a second, not even by pistol whip at its prime while playing a glass canon ele…….

Okay.

What does this have to do with me?

This was a first for me too.

Did you see the video on the first page?
Obviously it is happening not only to me, but others and across multiple classes.

The only thing I can say is that just because it hasn’t happened to you, doesn’t mean it can’t.

so why didnt you ask the fella what he hit you with or look at your dmg log? that may have answered your question on ’wtf?" it was

Ask the player what?
How did you do that?

I did, they didn’t respond except with heart symbols.
Besides, I now know how it was done.

good players find counters bads complain about it to devs and forums (-_^)

You’re just talking trash now.
Please find something better to add to the forum other than the typical “learn2play” nonsense.

Balancing happens for a reason and Devs don’t know about the problems if no one talks about them.

It’s why they ASK for feedback. They WANT you to point out the flaws so they can correct them not sit there trying to figure out how to counter broken elements.

Bad players play broken games with bugs and imbalances for some sort of online bragging rights and good players want them fixed. (-_^)

- H

“I’ve seen something like this but what I’ve seen recently is them completely stealth. They never come out.”

Exactly what happened to me.
As I said he/she vanished, I was quickly hit, then I was dying.

Those saying it’s only happening to Elementalists need to WATCH THE VIDEO on the first page. It’ happening across multiple professions and yeah even to a Warrior.

It’s NOT just one profession.

- H

Telenn.6945:

Its true every game makes the same mistake with their thef classes. wow had it, warhammer had it, swtor had it.

Dont worry though they always sort them out they are just a hard class to balance.

I hope bringing it to their attention will make them correct this.

No ‘Glass Cannon’ should be able to kill you without you having any chance to react and while COMPLETELY stealthed.

That’s ridiculous.
That’s a one-hit wonder.
The glass part doesn’t factor in because you CAN’T HIT THE GLASS back.

Glass cannons by definition are weak and do high damage…but not insta-kills.
Even my Warlock had time to respond to a Rogue regardless of the outcome.

Before I could push a button my health was completely wiped.

Completely.

- H

Red Falcon

Here is how to not die

There is a difference of about 50% damage reduction between 2400 armor and 3000 armor.
Basically having 2400 armor means you’re giving your opponent a 50% damage buff.
You can also get away with 2800 armor (40% damage reduction compared to 2400 armor).

Yes, it is normal that a character can gib you if you are giving them such a damage buff by not stacking Armor.

Could you please tell me how to get 3000 armor on the elementalist?

Pradton.8576:

So Anet does the same blunder every other game with a stealth class does? They are “squishy” but can basically kill you in one or two hits. Why oh why did they not learn from the past?

Has this happened in other games?

Honestly I stopped playing WoW years ago but even back then the Rogue could get feared two or three times during those quick fights.

Even Imperial Agents in SWTOR can’t wipe you to zero health without you reacting to it.

This was the craziest ‘instantly dead’ attack I’ve ever come across.

It was a fight so one-sided it didn’t even pretend to be a battle where you thought you could possibly win.

No joke.

The video says it all.

- H

Harmadda.5971:

Even Imperial Agents in SWTOR can’t wipe you to zero health without you reacting to it.

Actually they could. Before the nerf to their ‘backstab’ move. I lost count on how many times I got knocked down and killed before I could react on my Mercenary.

With my dagger/dagger elementalist, there is no way I can beat a backstab thief. If I go COMPLETELY defensive on my build/equips I can survive, but can’t kill him either… And if we both go glass cannon, can someone explain to me why my cannon looks more like a water gun compared to theirs?

Forgot to mention the fact that I have to be flawless on my character movement across the combat or half of my skills will miss while the thief have a lock-in feature for free on his opener (steal with it’s teleport) and on his finisher (targetted jump from heartseeker)

I agree that is crazy. As a warrior I used to hear all this "oh no 100b is so OP nerf it please" Because I had to hit with a stun of some kind, either a long cooldown bulls rush or a easily dodged bolas to use it effectively.

Now I see thieves come along and if that video is any indication, if you don’t use your clairvoyance to dodge their instant ranged opener the moment they use it, you are paralyzed, backstabbed and dead. He’s in that video consistently hitting for more than my 100b does with a full combo in a quarter of the time.

I’m a relatively tanky warrior, and adding up the average damage he did in that few seconds I wouldn’t be down, but the fight would certainly be over and in the thief’s favor.

Lumines.3916:

@Cyric, I’m glad you’re less of a troll than I initially perceived you as. I think what the bigger community needs to understand about thieves in general is that yes, thieves hurt like kitten but kitten they’re also squishy (relatively and depends on spec). We also happen to melt under condition pressure extremely easy, just take a look at all the removals a thief can have, it’s very limited.

Stealth IS a defensive mechanism, but it does not stop incoming damage at all if others are smart about locating the position of the thief. Stealth is a diversion, it’s a visual confusion, the culling issues make it more deadly than it really is.

I’d be more than happy to have a toned down version of the thief burst if there were more answers to just “shortbow and wait for cds” in between our moments of glory. Right now, thieves have to play an extreme of hit-n-run style and make it count because chilling in the clusterkitten is asking to get killed. Once we have the tools to sustain better in a longer fight, doesn’t matter how hard our moves hurt, good thieves will kill you.

This I can completely agree with, well said.

I’m done with this thread, I’m getting infracted for stupid stuff like telling someone they’re “silly”. Nevermind that the rest of the post was informative, the fact that I ended by calling someone “silly” gets it deleted. At least infract me and edit the offending line out, kitten I feel like I’m in pre-school.

It’s weird being on the other side of the argument. I used to play an Elemental Shaman in WoW and there was nothing more frustrating then a Rogue, since you had absolutely no disables or stun breaks (except for the trinket). It didn’t matter in 5v5 or 3v3 as much, but man was it frustrating. Once I finally played a Rogue though, I realized how much of a pain in the kitten it actually was since you have to get in very close to do damage and if you get caught you’re dead and if you don’t kill someone quickly, or atleast get them panicking, they can just turn around and kill you.

Although I will agree that the basilisk backstab build is a little ridiculous, I doubt it would work in anything except hotjoin, seems like you can instantly take out one person,but after that you’re pretty much just mediocre damage.

I wish I could play my thief more often in tPvP but sadly they aren’t as great as the other professions and with the current meta, it’s tough to justify one.

Cyric.7485:

Ixal.7924:

Want balanced PvP? Either give other classes equally threatening combos or town down the thief.

Other classes should have equally threatening combos, I think that would really spice the PvP scene up quite a bit actually!

Imo that would ruin the PvP scene as every fight would last at most 1 second and the deciding winning factor would be who sees the other first as no one could defend against against the others instant kill combo.

And thus the Thief has to be brought down instead of elevating everyone else to its deadliness.

Burst is a complete joke at the moment. One root and a Warrior can bring you down in about 4 seconds. Thieves getting 8k+ Backstab crits and ridiculous Heartseeker crits once you’re <25% health.

Asides from this, burst is just too high across the board. Fights rarely last long, unless you’re a 1v1 without a Warrior or Thief (which is unlikely).

The only real solution is to go for max survival build, but then you’re doing such little damage there’s little point you even being there.

If they were to tone down damage, and remove the Downed state to compensate, then there might actually be more strategy instead of just zerg everywhere.

Damage is completely over the top across the board. I hate thieves a little more because they are kitten invisible when they do it, atleast everyone else you see comming for you.
But they are by no means the only ones at fault.

Which leads to the Bunker builds being popular because they are the only ones that dont drop dead in the blink of an eye and actually have a fighting chance.
So, either you go full-on glasscannon burst-mode or you Bunker down, there is no middle ground.

Harmadda.5971:

Okay I just left PVP to write this up. This is actually my first post.
I was running through the battlefield and came across a Thief.

The guy vanished, hit me and BAM I was suddenly dying on the ground.

Now as this is my first post I am sure there have been others regarding “overpowered classes” and I just read through one of the developers saying “find a counter” before making that claim but I have to say…I can’t counter what happened when I was dead before I could react. I play sPVP primarily in this game and I was just floored at what happened.

Could a DEV even counter that?
I seriously doubt it.

Now I play a Thief occasionally, and personally I don’t think they are overpowered at all, I think there are certain combinations that can be made with a few Professions that are just undeniably unstoppable. There seriously needs to be some retooling if this is going to be the norm because I literally had 1 second to react. ONE SECOND between that fast attack and I was “fighting for my life”.

COME ON.

I have seen a few on Youtube that can drop health pretty quickly if utilized properly but NOTHING like what I just went through. Those attacks (Pistol/Sword for example) could at least be countered. This was just plain wrong. W-R-O-N-G.

It’s not even PVP.
It’s not even a fight.
Hell…it’s probably not even that hard to do because I am sure it wasn’t an exploit.

The point is that stuff like this takes the fun right out of the game. You expect some level of player versus player in PVP, not 2-3 button kills.

Who wants to play PVP like that anyway?
I wouldn’t even if I could.
It’s extremely cheap and without challenege.

So Devs, this isn’t a case of someone crying “OP!!!” just because they couldn’t stop a player, this is someone who has been PVPing since release and just came across a serious WTF moment. I even said that in PVP.

“Did I just die without even any time to react??!”

The Thief responded with a ‘<3’.

Yeah.

- H

The way I see it:

Theives dont have cooldowns, they run on initiative. Adjust them to have skill cooldowns and they can be just like every other class and can’t spam certain skills 5 or 6 times on a row.

Sounds like you got hit with 100 blades skill.

Yet another reason why trying to balance around an e-sport will never work. If elite players find backstab build balanced and easy to counter but 90% of the playerbase is getting 1-shotted without a chance to react. What do you do?

DoubleUnder.9052:

The way I see it:

Theives dont have cooldowns, they run on initiative. Adjust them to have skill cooldowns and they can be just like every other class and can’t spam certain skills 5 or 6 times on a row.

Except the backstab build isn’t a spam build. They have their ranged teleport opener, backstab once, hit their 1 attack a few times or heartseeker you once to kill you.

I don’t really understand why the devs thought it to be a good idea for ANY ability to be able to be traited to where it can take 50-75% of your life in one shot, while stealthed to attackers.

If they want an ability to be a bursty, one hit kill spell, it NEEDS to require some skill to setup a long combo chain like elementalists (I don’t play one). It also CANNOT be the opener or gap closer/spammable ability.

Pimpslapper.2047:

One second of glory, and one minute of weakness and being as frail as a granny. Trade off?

One second of glory with a granted kill. Imagine a sPvP lasting 10 minutes and you got 10 kills, top score and all that stuff.
Harsh compromise, eh?

The problem with this backstab build that baddie thieves are running, is that it’s usefulness decreases dramatically after their initial burst. If you saw in that video, the thief was 30/30/0/0/10. He is all glass and has no mobility.

Another thing. It is completely obvious when they are going to do their burst because they first have to either cast or have already used basilisk venom which you can see on their buff bar. At this point you know that their next attack is going to be an attempted insta-gib. This allows you to be ready to block or dodge their next attack. After that it’s easy.

Truga.5897:

A glass cannon got one-shot by a glass cannon.

This, and more shocking revelations at eleven.

Basically this.
Also, people NEED to understand the concept of the conquest (TEAM) pvp mode:

• The only things that are imbalanced are the ones that give an “unfair” advantage your whole team .
• His cheesy glasscannon build is about 1shotting somebody then basically having CD on all his utilities.
• He has won his team 5 points. They won’t win the game because of that so it is not imbalanced.

The end. In the actual tournaments, you see builds like this happen rarely ever because they just aren’t that benefical for the whole team.

Aleth.9630:

Truga.5897:

A glass cannon got one-shot by a glass cannon.

This, and more shocking revelations at eleven.

Basically this.
Also, people NEED to understand the concept of the conquest (TEAM) pvp mode:

• The only things that are imbalanced are the ones that give an “unfair” advantage your whole team .
• His cheesy glasscannon build is about 1shotting somebody then basically having CD on all his utilities.
• He has won his team 5 points. They won’t win the game because of that so it is not imbalanced.

The end. In the actual tournaments, you see builds like this happen rarely ever because they just aren’t that benefical for the whole team.

Except of course when the enemy team consists out of 3 backstab thieves who each instant kill an enemy. And even thieves on cooldown can manage a 5vs2.

When you read comments of the youtube video of that backstab build you will see that some of the kills shown come from tournaments.

Vaerah.4907:

Pimpslapper.2047:

One second of glory, and one minute of weakness and being as frail as a granny. Trade off?

One second of glory with a granted kill. Imagine a sPvP lasting 10 minutes and you got 10 kills, top score and all that stuff.
Harsh compromise, eh?

It’s a one trick pony. He vanishes, IMMEDIATELY start rotating defensive abilities/dodge and get out of his range.as soon as stealth is on cooldown and he can’t surprise you, you have time to eliminate him.

It’s not diff than the people griping about 100B. You see a GS warrior coming at you, get the hell away, dodge roll, pop stability to prevent snares if you have it. I don’t doubt that the thief probably hits a little too hard but it CAN be avoided if you think.You know how long the thief can stealth, you know ehre he stealthed from, you know where he’s going to attack (i.e. wherever you are) so don’t be there. Also, setting up traps/ground aoe is a good way to screw with thieves. just because they’re invis doens’t mean they’re invuln.

Oh, and if YOU have a stealth, use it. He wastes his big shot because he lost his target. Then comes the pain.

Sigh. Many valid points in this thread. But one thing I just want to add is that ANet really needs to stop and ask themselves “Is this the kind of PvP we want?” Do we really want this kind of insta-gibbed nonsense? Regardless of whether there’s a counter or not.

Most MMOs go through this phase. I’ve seen WoW footage with level 19 Ambush rogue 1-shotting pretty much everyone. I’ve played SWTOR where an Operative was pretty much guaranteed to kill anyone with an insanely long knockdown – if it went off, you’d be dead before you got up, it’s that simple. Etc., etc. But is this something you want to be the “norm” in your game?

If yes, just tell us. Myself, personally, I won’t hold it against you. I’ll just stop wasting time on this game, and go to waste time in some other game. But you need to communicate your intentions better.

People Stop Complaining about thief will u already , a thief outside stealth is a sitting duck , we basicaly have nothing outside stealth , if u nerf our backstab/stealth u’ve got to give us a huge buff to compensate or u will render us useless

Terrant.2903:

It’s not diff than the people griping about 100B. You see a GS warrior coming at you, get the hell away, dodge roll, pop stability to prevent snares if you have it. I don’t doubt that the thief probably hits a little too hard but it CAN be avoided if you think.You know how long the thief can stealth, you know ehre he stealthed from, you know where he’s going to attack (i.e. wherever you are) so don’t be there. Also, setting up traps/ground aoe is a good way to screw with thieves. just because they’re invis doens’t mean they’re invuln.

Except stability doesn’t prevent or remove immobilize/snare/root http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stability

Few classes have readily available condition removal (non passive) to remove the root/snare/immob. Not only THAT, but if you DO, immobilize is prioritized LAST among other conditions for removal.

Couple that with requiring split second and correct decision making similar to that of a fighter pilot, or end up dead in 2 seconds.

It’s the ones that come up while you are engaged in combat with more than one other person, maybe with a few conditions already on you. It’s been demonstrated in that video that’s been linked in this thread about 20 times.

I have a counter to stop this http://youtu.be/18ASBsQfXnw I suggest everyone watches this and remember PRE-DODGE

Thief in GW2 is just different from Rogue in WoW. WoW rogue would just lock you so you couldn’t move until it was done eating. Thief in GW2 gives you a chance to dodge at least. Someone stealths and you dodge roll the other way. Once that thieves stealth and CDs are gone you win.