Guild Wars 2

Is there even any more sense in this thread? Nothing showed so far with videos/screenshots ever proved that condi gameplay is something different from simple spamming where your only chance as player is to emulate the spamming but with cleanses.

-Now there are many, many ways to negate/reduce power damage but there is no way to reduce condition damage.

-You can weaken the damage, put long protection duration on you to reduce dmg, increase your toughness levels

What there is against condi damage? absolutely nothing other than cleanse spam, ofc some try hard condi spammer will come here and say that a couple of seconds of resistance on skill with an average CD of 40s , a handful of skills available to few professions, should be considered a counter

A 2s resistance every 35s+ is enough against condi spam? What people are ready to say in order to win..amazing.

Please stop the non sense about precision required for condi builds, a couple of traits require crits to apply a single additional condi..and of all sudden all condi builds require precision

I can go around with 10k HP if facing power builds, I can dodge powerful burst, weaken others, protect against other ones. Against condi build, your toughness means nothing, instead you must have:

-increased vitality
-all possible condi cleanse
-enough dmg to get through all the toughness, typical of most condi build

Such a huge amount of limitations on build diversity.

Most condi builds can apply 4-5 condis with the auto-attack alone and here they come telling you to dodge -_-, there is no set up with condi builds, no need to watch for enemy number of dodges, if he has aegis,protection, if you’re slowed/weakened or the enemy toughness…you can just pew pew off CD till you don’t overwhelm the enemy condi removal ability.

Condi build is a simplistic gameplay and widely chosen by new players for the increased sustain and efficiency, if there is something broken, that would be condi dmg.

There should be a stat that reduce incoming condi damage, a condition that reduce condi damage on the caster…something that force the condi user to pay attention for once other than unload : well-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-1-1-DS-fear-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-signet-DS-fear ect etc

Typical necro gameplay – Do you even know what boons the enemy has bro?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd7Sby_wqo4

PvP version for the try hard “defenders”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dyiUVGLXQE

Much skill, pew pew

Just a quick correction to the above post… condi damage is more easily countered than power damage. If you pin a group of condi people against a group of shouters (warrior/guardian/now even tempest or Necro), the condi damage will be completely insignificant. Play as a condi build against a team with a shout guardian and a shout warrior on the same team and tell me how wonderful your damage is when those two are in the same fight. Your damage output will be close to 0. Not to mention you could mix in a Revenant with Mallyx giving everyone Resistance too.

You can complain in the same manner about Dragonhunter trappers. Passive gameplay. You can easily complain about Chronomancers, power Revenants… even boon-spamming scrappers which are super hard to kill and still deal nice damage.

Learn to play against condis and learn to avoid the hard hitting skills (like Reaper’s Soul Spiral). People don’t like dying slowly from a few stacks of bleed, but it’s the same thing dying from 10 bleeds as it is being instakilled by a Mesmer shatter or DH trap.

hmmm this isn’t a Thread about whether we should have condition damage in the game Sup, so not sure why you attacking peeps for not PROVING that it should be.
You maybe feel that ALL condition builds simply spam a skill against you but i can assure you that is not the case Of course if you didn’t have Diamond Skin you would HAVE to learn to play against Condition players and learn. Some of your assertions btw are more than a little over-the-top.

Sinning.7483:

roelvanesch.2817:

So Diamond skin prevents you from winning a 1v1 with a full condi build? I have yet to die in a 1v1 on my bunker ele against most classes, physical or condi, thats why its a bunker ele.

To answer your question roelvanesch, yes, that is exactly what has been said above and also in numerous other threads…Diamond Skin prevents you winning a 1v1 with full condi build.

As to your second sentence I am at a loss as to what it is you are saying here? That because you believe can’t be killed as a Bunker Ele by ANY class that Diamond Skin being OP should not be addressed? Not sure of that logic or the arrogance of such a statement.

Its the sole purpose of a bunker build really. Of course ele has group support as well.

Sinning.7483:

hmmm this isn’t a Thread about whether we should have condition damage in the game Sup, so not sure why you attacking peeps for not PROVING that it should be.
You maybe feel that ALL condition builds simply spam a skill against you but i can assure you that is not the case Of course if you didn’t have Diamond Skin you would HAVE to learn to play against Condition players and learn. Some of your assertions btw are more than a little over-the-top.

Defending something means that you use it right?..Well ofc you’re wrong but to state it would be pointless anyway so feel free to believe whatever you want.

Going back to the real facts :condi builds are nothing more than spam as such with the opportune build, condi users usually pose no threat but the problem is…being locked into a specific build where on the other hand there are several ways to outplay power builds, can use different amulet, traits and builds.

At a given level of skill is even possible to outplay 2 power builds at the same time but this is not possible against 2 condi builds, why? Because all you have against them is a limited number of condi clear and you’re telling me that the 2 condi users are more skilled than the 2 power users?…hahahaha

You don’t see backstab thieves, you don’t see axe wars..you see bloody condi reapers, cele scrappers, shield chronomancers, burn guards , condi/bunker druid and so on *so spare me the “my condi build takes skills” BS

Truth of the matter is that condi users do not sit on a level that deserves a skillful counter, condi application as it is, braindead spamming deserves nothing more than a braindead trait full counter.

I’m sick of this trash system where you need to have a trillion condi clear to counter the brainless ranged condi spam that enemy team throw at you

Can’t even move a step without being bombed by some staff necro, grenade scrapper, chronomancer, entangle druid, burn guard, new condi berserker sword and some other condi BS.

Ha the irony ..condi builds takes so much skills…that almost everybody plays one..lol

P.S As I stated months ago : condi damage in this game needs even more hard counters like toughness reducing condi dmg, an easy to access boon (no like ultra rare resistance) that reduce condi dmg and so on..so that people may think twice before going full yolo build with rabid amulet lololol

One more thing..be careful with your nerf requests, once the counter get nerfed, the reason why that counter existed doesn’t fall much behind

Supreme.3164:

tl;dr

And I’m sick with power stuff critting me for half of my hp, over and over… dodge this, dodge that, bla bla bla, like I’ve 1000 dodges.

Like… dodge True Shot, dodge Trap, dodge next Trap and then dodge next True Shot etc… yet “condi builds are less skilled”?

By all means, rework diamond skin. The threshold of health is difficult for pure condi builds to get over when you consider the sustain held by most eles, however is almost a non-factor when going against power/hybrid builds. This means that this grandmaster trait has two extremes: either OP vs pure condi, or useless to the point where you’re playing with one less trait.

Make it less binary and more interactive, both for the ele and the enemies.

Supreme.3164:

Is there even any more sense in this thread? Nothing showed so far with videos/screenshots ever proved that condi gameplay is something different from simple spamming where your only chance as player is to emulate the spamming but with cleanses.

-Now there are many, many ways to negate/reduce power damage but there is no way to reduce condition damage.

-You can weaken the damage, put long protection duration on you to reduce dmg, increase your toughness levels

What there is against condi damage? absolutely nothing other than cleanse spam, ofc some try hard condi spammer will come here and say that a couple of seconds of resistance on skill with an average CD of 40s , a handful of skills available to few professions, should be considered a counter

A 2s resistance every 35s+ is enough against condi spam? What people are ready to say in order to win..amazing.

Please stop the non sense about precision required for condi builds, a couple of traits require crits to apply a single additional condi..and of all sudden all condi builds require precision

I can go around with 10k HP if facing power builds, I can dodge powerful burst, weaken others, protect against other ones. Against condi build, your toughness means nothing, instead you must have:

-increased vitality
-all possible condi cleanse
-enough dmg to get through all the toughness, typical of most condi build

Such a huge amount of limitations on build diversity.

Most condi builds can apply 4-5 condis with the auto-attack alone and here they come telling you to dodge -_-, there is no set up with condi builds, no need to watch for enemy number of dodges, if he has aegis,protection, if you’re slowed/weakened or the enemy toughness…you can just pew pew off CD till you don’t overwhelm the enemy condi removal ability.

Condi build is a simplistic gameplay and widely chosen by new players for the increased sustain and efficiency, if there is something broken, that would be condi dmg.

There should be a stat that reduce incoming condi damage, a condition that reduce condi damage on the caster…something that force the condi user to pay attention for once other than unload : well-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-1-1-DS-fear-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-signet-DS-fear ect etc

Typical necro gameplay – Do you even know what boons the enemy has bro?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd7Sby_wqo4

PvP version for the try hard “defenders”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dyiUVGLXQE

Much skill, pew pew

Wow, spamming seems to have a loose definition these days. What about power rangers who press 111121112111112 or perhaps thieves that use heartseeker over and over with no cooldown until their initiative runs out? What about Rev with sword 3 being a long evade that some classes (like base necro for example) must use both dodges to avoid, or lose a large chunk of hp?What about mesmers that use all their shatter skills from stealth and can kill half the classes in the game from full HP in a second? I don’t personally consider any of that spam, just using skills.

I never said condition builds Need crit, I said they can make use of it, but its not required. Once again, there are plenty of power based builds that don’t use any crit at all, like the ones I mentioned on one of my last posts.

No Classes auto applies 4-5 conditions, you made that up. Necro auto applies 2 (bleed and poison) after a full chain, which takes 2 seconds

Simplistic gameplay applies to both power and condi builds, Guild Wars 2 really isn’t that hard of a game to play, unless you think the examples I listed above are somehow more skillful even though most of them use 1-2 keys to perform a ton of instant damage.

as a side note- " well-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-1-1-DS-fear-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-signet-DS-fear ect etc" -shows that you really don’t know what you are talking about.
As a necro main, I can tell you that no condtion build runs wells. The fact that you even used a terrormancer as an example of “typical necro gameplay” is laughable, because that build has not only been dead for months, but was also considered to be much harder to play then power necro when it was popular, mostly because power necro is Dagger 111111111 DS 1111111 Lich 11111111. Funnily enough, power necro is probably one of the most spammy builds in the game by your definition, anyway.

Wow… Supreme got rekt cuz of his ignorance.

Well said.

Problem of Diamond Skin is that elementarist have a Full Condi Cleaner every time their HP floats between 89% and 90% Health.

This is not really an issue if you have a power build around. But on Pure 1×1, condi builds are done.

SoulSin.5682:

This is not really an issue if you have a power build around. But on Pure 1×1, condi builds are done.

Wow, it’s like complaining that you can’t kill 1v1 Bunker Guard/Druid with Bruiser.

It’s team game, you aren’t supposed to do everything on your own with any build.

Morwath.9817:

SoulSin.5682:

This is not really an issue if you have a power build around. But on Pure 1×1, condi builds are done.

Wow, it’s like complaining that you can’t kill 1v1 Bunker Guard/Druid with Bruiser.

It’s team game, you aren’t supposed to do everything on your own with any build.

I get your point, but it’s not likely a Bunker will be able to kill a bruiser either.
Getting locked until help arrives is different from a straight downhill fight.

On voice you can call help, but on Solo you can run and pray that the Ele will stay behind to cap the point instead of chasing you.

Worth mentioning that I dont play Condi builds, but i can somewhat understand the frustration from that trait.
I’ts like engies in the past while using power builds. You simply couldn’t kill then, but they could kill you.
(to a lesser degree, Diamond Skin isn’t meta, at least)

Morwath.9817:

SoulSin.5682:

This is not really an issue if you have a power build around. But on Pure 1×1, condi builds are done.

Wow, it’s like complaining that you can’t kill 1v1 Bunker Guard/Druid with Bruiser.

It’s team game, you aren’t supposed to do everything on your own with any build.

Think you missing the point or perhaps the scale of things.

The Condition builds aren’t just having problems killing the Diamond Skin player, they can’t even get him to stay below 90% health

My biggest issue here is that the skill exists in its current form and I don’t see why as it IS yet another step towards limiting build variety.

One of the vocal posters here feels that Bunker Ele is only viable build for them..look at Meta Site and yes its Tempest with Diamond Skin. I never run Meta Builds myself prefering to do my own builds that i find fun to play…..we need to move away from sooo many people running Meta and feeling trapped in it.

Sinning.7483:

Morwath.9817:

SoulSin.5682:

This is not really an issue if you have a power build around. But on Pure 1×1, condi builds are done.

Wow, it’s like complaining that you can’t kill 1v1 Bunker Guard/Druid with Bruiser.

It’s team game, you aren’t supposed to do everything on your own with any build.

Think you missing the point or perhaps the scale of things.

The Condition builds aren’t just having problems killing the Diamond Skin player, they can’t even get him to stay below 90% health

My biggest issue here is that the skill exists in its current form and I don’t see why as it IS yet another step towards limiting build variety.

One of the vocal posters here feels that Bunker Ele is only viable build for them..look at Meta Site and yes its Tempest with Diamond Skin. I never run Meta Builds myself prefering to do my own builds that i find fun to play…..we need to move away from sooo many people running Meta and feeling trapped in it.

…and where is problem?
If you can’t solo Bunker Ele, you can kill 4 other people in his team or multifocus that Ele…

Not that Bunker Ele can kill you…

SoulSin.5682:

Problem of Diamond Skin is that elementarist have a Full Condi Cleaner every time their HP floats between 89% and 90% Health.

This is not really an issue if you have a power build around. But on Pure 1×1, condi builds are done.

How’s that the case?

“Conditions cannot be applied to you when your health is above the threshold.” they don’t get removed.

Supreme.3164:

Is there even any more sense in this thread? Nothing showed so far with videos/screenshots ever proved that condi gameplay is something different from simple spamming where your only chance as player is to emulate the spamming but with cleanses.

-Now there are many, many ways to negate/reduce power damage but there is no way to reduce condition damage.

-You can weaken the damage, put long protection duration on you to reduce dmg, increase your toughness levels

What there is against condi damage? absolutely nothing other than cleanse spam, ofc some try hard condi spammer will come here and say that a couple of seconds of resistance on skill with an average CD of 40s , a handful of skills available to few professions, should be considered a counter

A 2s resistance every 35s+ is enough against condi spam? What people are ready to say in order to win..amazing.

Please stop the non sense about precision required for condi builds, a couple of traits require crits to apply a single additional condi..and of all sudden all condi builds require precision

I can go around with 10k HP if facing power builds, I can dodge powerful burst, weaken others, protect against other ones. Against condi build, your toughness means nothing, instead you must have:

-increased vitality
-all possible condi cleanse
-enough dmg to get through all the toughness, typical of most condi build

Such a huge amount of limitations on build diversity.

Most condi builds can apply 4-5 condis with the auto-attack alone and here they come telling you to dodge -_-, there is no set up with condi builds, no need to watch for enemy number of dodges, if he has aegis,protection, if you’re slowed/weakened or the enemy toughness…you can just pew pew off CD till you don’t overwhelm the enemy condi removal ability.

Condi build is a simplistic gameplay and widely chosen by new players for the increased sustain and efficiency, if there is something broken, that would be condi dmg.

There should be a stat that reduce incoming condi damage, a condition that reduce condi damage on the caster…something that force the condi user to pay attention for once other than unload : well-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-1-1-DS-fear-well-well-scepter 1-1-1-1-signet-DS-fear ect etc

Typical necro gameplay – Do you even know what boons the enemy has bro?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd7Sby_wqo4

PvP version for the try hard “defenders”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dyiUVGLXQE

Much skill, pew pew

This build is old.

I used to hate condis as well, but patch after patch just brought about so many cleansing options. My thief, for instance, enjoys several short and low CD bursts of condi cleanse which essentially turns condition classes into non-factors almost all of the time.

Necro can still transfer/cleanse like a beast.

Tempest is tempest :P.

Mesmer may be a little susceptible, but I’m not too sure condi is too big a threat for these guys.

Revenant with jalis, mallyx, or glint will thank you kindly for the conditions.

I’m sure druid can just out heal conditions.

Warrior might have an issue, but they have an issue everywhere.

DH just needs to slot CoP or run virtues with RF and they’ll be good for a bit in terms of condi cleanse.

Condis aren’t really that big of a deal nowadays, tbh. As for counter playing, you can dodge most condi bursts in the game the same way you’d dodge power. Condi hits you 3 times and stacks 3 bleed through his auto? That’s approx 600 tick for kitten Power builds going through a single auto hit chain, on average, 1k per swing and 3k with the whole thing IMMEDIATELY and can probably go through another chain before the bleed or what have you take their full course.

You can talk about how they’ve got defensive stats, but you’ll only find druids capable of bunkering and that’s not because of their toughness or vitality.

Honestly, the time for hating condis passed, man.

I’m genuinely curious, which condi builds have a hard time dealing the 10% damage? Maybe a sample build will also be nice.

well i fine with some builds that can counter other builds but diamond skill its just hard counter to condi necros , someone had to be on quite big high making this trait

I play carrion builds MOST of the time and I didn’t have problems with diamond skin the handful of times I’ve run against it. The condi builds that have issues are the rabid ones, I think. Most of my matches on reaper with carrion are like 500k condi dealt and like 350-400k damage. So that 10% isn’t as meaningful.

However, I think instead of having this trait “Block” condi application why not have it give them a refreshing stack of Resistance at the same health level? That way, if you do bring them down they will be affected by whatever you had already applied.

In response to condi builds being “skill less spam”; you’re being ridiculous. I’m so glad that for the most part that train has left the station because that sentiment was getting annoying to read once they revamped burning. Honestly, if you removed burning it’d still be just as powerful because then I could take foot in the grave and have even MORE stab!

Protection reduces condition damage dealt by 40%;
Boons cannot be corrupted or stripped while above 75% health threshhold.

Forsaker.9213:

well i fine with some builds that can counter other builds but diamond skill its just hard counter to condi necros , someone had to be on quite big high making this trait

Agreed, I hadn’t realize how absolutely ridiculous a tempest running diamond skin was until last AG, team we were playing 1st rd kept switching chars and changing builds and counter comping us, used two kittening diamond skin tempests. 1st time I’ve lost first round.

Why this skill exist? Is that what they call “e sport”?

E sport lol

Seriously if Diamond skin is giving you trouble perhaps pvp isn’t your thing.

It’s the worse of the earth Grandmaster traits.

Anyway defensive mechanisms are the only thing eles have against a meta that has been making them 1-shot targets for a while now.

THis is illogic you know? want to make esport but ceating an unskile dtrait …bo I don’t care fiting diamond ele. But no one can says this trait needs a brain to use it.

I’ve always thought this trait was extremely poorly designed. If Elementalists need more options for condi clearing, make it something active. Or do something like “Removes 1 (or 2, whatever) condis every 3 seconds while above 75% (or 50%, whatever) health”. Or “Reduces duration of all conditions applied to the Elementalist by 33% while above 75% health”. Or either of the two “while attuned to Earth” instead of at a threshold. Still passive, if passivity is what the design is really looking for, but they aren’t complete negation.

Why does it have to be an on/off switch?

The fact that the majority of this thread defend what’s categorized as a hard counter is beyond me.

Solution: Diamond skin – Reduces the duration of all incoming conditions by 40%

That way you could take runes of the hoelbrak with it and have 60% reduced incoming condition duration, which is a good trade off and balanced imo as opposed to the hard counter it is now.

/Thread

Countless

This has been itterated over and over prepatch…. the excuses I heard?

“Diamond skin isn’t OP because no ele chooses the trait line…”

“Then don’t go all in condi.”

“Well, don’t 1v1 the Ele.”

“How can you not shave an Ele’s 10% life pool?”

1. Eles uses Earth traitlines now…
2. There are 3 build variants in this game. Sustains, Power and Condi. Mix and match how ever you see fit. There are No Other trait in this game that completely counters a build variant like DS can. It’s a trait that completely needs a rework.
3. Telling some one to ignore a class completely doesn’t justify a bad trait mechanic.
4. Run a condi build and try shaving that 10%. Guess what, you wont be able to. DS Eles can 1v2/1v3 full condi built classes.

All this was already said prepatch…

Trigr.6481:

The fact that the majority of this thread defend what’s categorized as a hard counter is beyond me.

Solution: Diamond skin – Reduces all incoming conditions by 75%

/Thread

Countless

It’s a hard counter to builds that only use conditions and that can’t do enough direct damage to get through a bunker top 10%.

Your solution is vague. 75% always? 75% when above 90%? 75% of total duration of condi or damage of condi? Or condi duration/dmg is cut down to 25% of its normal effectiveness?

And people who sign their posts like their name isn’t in their sig or right next to their post look dumb. Please be specific and stop looking dumb.

This is such a dumb topic,

I still play trap ranger and i now have a pet that can get a ele health down 10%. I cant kill this ele 1 vs 1 but if 1 person comes to help me they drop really fast. Also if i have the point capped and they come over to take from me they cant.

This trait needs reworked simply cause its not good enough to do anything except troll the below average player in this game.

ragnarokda.1805:

Trigr.6481:

The fact that the majority of this thread defend what’s categorized as a hard counter is beyond me.

Solution: Diamond skin – Reduces all incoming conditions by 75%

/Thread

Countless

It’s a hard counter to builds that only use conditions and that can’t do enough direct damage to get through a bunker top 10%.

Your solution is vague. 75% always? 75% when above 90%? 75% of total duration of condi or damage of condi? Or condi duration/dmg is cut down to 25% of its normal effectiveness?

And people who sign their posts like their name isn’t in their sig or right next to their post look dumb. Please be specific and stop looking dumb.

Condition duration.

Countless

I really don’t get the condi hate this forum has. Condi builds are actually vastly more penalized than power builds are since there are so many things that can ruin their day.

Condi’s have to deal with having their condi application skill being dodged/blocked
Condi’s have to deal with the numerous cleanses.
Condi’s have to watch out for condi transfers least they kill themselves.
Condi’s have to deal with Diamond Skin.

Meanwhile the only thing power builds have to deal with are evades and blocks.

Cogbyrn.7283:

I’ve always thought this trait was extremely poorly designed. If Elementalists need more options for condi clearing, make it something active. Or do something like “Removes 1 (or 2, whatever) condis every 3 seconds while above 75% (or 50%, whatever) health”. Or “Reduces duration of all conditions applied to the Elementalist by 33% while above 75% health”. Or either of the two “while attuned to Earth” instead of at a threshold. Still passive, if passivity is what the design is really looking for, but they aren’t complete negation.

Why does it have to be an on/off switch?

This. Builds shouldn’t be able to passively hardcounter other builds.

Also all the “just deal 10% damage” folks seem to be forgetting that eles have the heals and defensives to easily stay above 90% vs the measly direct damage dealt by Condi builds.
Sure a condi build will eventually get them low enough, but by that time the condi build has already lost the fight.

Diamond skin is useless, just flavor of the month right now trying to counter the many Wanderer amulets floating around.

I don’t take earth unless they have 3 or more players as condi lol

Ryld.1340:

Photinous.4628:

This is by far the most skilless kittened trait in the game right now. It counters EVERY SINGLE condition build by simply being afk.

How much of an exaggeration can you make?

Did you know that Healing Signet counters EVERY build by simply being afk?

I wish this was true, LOL.

Listen, it’s really quite simple, pure condition builds (rabid, carrion, apothecary) are fun but completely useless in a highly competitive environment. Diamond skin will destroy you, period. Rabid will never deal enough sustained direct damage to take—and keep—the 10% hp off. Carrion could work if you put everything else into critical damage, but that turns you into a hybrid. It goes like this:

Power Builds and classes = Great
Hybrid builds and classes = Might be good (if class supports celestial)
Condition Builds and classes= Trashy and weak

Only options are pure power or hybrid. Condition only works if opponents are not prepared for it. Otherwise it can be hard countered. There is no way to hard counter pure power or hybrid. So…

Archon.6480:

Listen, it’s really quite simple, pure condition builds (rabid, carrion, apothecary) are fun but completely useless in a highly competitive environment. Diamond skin will destroy you, period. Rabid will never deal enough sustained direct damage to take—and keep—the 10% hp off. Carrion could work if you put everything else into critical damage, but that turns you into a hybrid. It goes like this:

Power Builds and classes = Great
Hybrid builds and classes = Might be good (if class supports celestial)
Condition Builds and classes= Trashy and weak

Only options are pure power or hybrid. Condition only works if opponents are not prepared for it. Otherwise it can be hard countered. There is no way to hard counter pure power or hybrid. So…

Tha doesn’t justify the DS “counter a certain build over a certaim threahhold” mechanic.

This again? If you’re running a pure condition build you deserve to get countered by ds eles. Enough said.

And who the kitten comes up with the idea that condition builds shouldn’t be nullified by diamond skin? Why not? Because your mindlessly easy yet rewarding condition aids build doesn’t work on someone for once? Gtfo.

Diamond skin only works in a 1v1 anyway. Any other scenario, it’s break the 10% with your team mates, unload conditions, proceed to watch the ele die helplessly. Smh, some people just can’t l2p.

If anything, diamond skin should be buffed.

/thread

ReaperJr.5967:

And who the kitten comes up with the idea that condition builds shouldn’t be nullified by diamond skin? Why not?
/thread

For the same reason pets should not be able to land hits by the Ranger simply walking into a fight. It’s just lame. Ranger pets won’t hit target unless you use some form of cc or trickery to get opponent into bad spot. This requires some skill, vs something like Diamond Skin that requires nothing to work. You should always have to do something to get a result, like that. Otherwise, you are just being carried by the computer.

That’s the problem with Guardian traps, as well. They carry too much. 1 button press for huge damage, daze and knockdown. That kitten should take two or three button presses, at least. AI carried battles are lame. Diamond skin should require some kind of action, like the resistance boon.

A single Mesmer can destroy a whole teams worth of condition builds with resistance, but it requires some button presses to accomplish. I have no problem with this.

ReaperJr.5967:

This again? If you’re running a pure condition build you deserve to get countered by ds eles. Enough said.

And who the kitten comes up with the idea that condition builds shouldn’t be nullified by diamond skin? Why not? Because your mindlessly easy yet rewarding condition aids build doesn’t work on someone for once? Gtfo.

Diamond skin only works in a 1v1 anyway. Any other scenario, it’s break the 10% with your team mates, unload conditions, proceed to watch the ele die helplessly. Smh, some people just can’t l2p.

If anything, diamond skin should be buffed.

/thread

Then I guess that for example, a guard (same low HP pool) could have a GM that makes him immune to physical damage when he’s above 90% HP, because he doesnt have enough heals and blocks to deal with direct damage, and so people not running condi builds should be punished and die cause a single trait. Also, its easy enough to down 2k health from a guard with your random condis, and hes not going to heal himself up at all ^^

Celestial Elementalist traits water magic and equips Signet of Restoration. Sitting in water attunement and doing nothing (not even move or dodge) but auto-attacking, he keeps himself above 90% against a Carrion condition Necro (not Reaper) for a minimum of 8 seconds, possibly longer depending on the Necro’s life force.

It doesn’t even matter what weapon he has equipped.

That is the epitome of brainless and lack of skill. As soon as he starts doing literally anything else, the Necro has a much harder time. And Carrion builds actually have Power.

I’ve said it before, I’ve said it again: the trait needs an overhaul. Keep the anti-condition theme, sure, but make it less of a “win/lose” switch. You either auto-win, or you wasted your grandmaster slot. There is no middle ground with this trait. It needs a redesign to be less extreme and overall more useful. We have the Resistance boon now, so why not use it?

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

We have the Resistance boon now, so why not use it?

Pls

ReaperJr.5967:

This again? If you’re running a pure condition build you deserve to get countered by ds eles. Enough said.

And who the kitten comes up with the idea that condition builds shouldn’t be nullified by diamond skin? Why not? Because your mindlessly easy yet rewarding condition aids build doesn’t work on someone for once? Gtfo.

Diamond skin only works in a 1v1 anyway. Any other scenario, it’s break the 10% with your team mates, unload conditions, proceed to watch the ele die helplessly. Smh, some people just can’t l2p.

If anything, diamond skin should be buffed.

/thread

Oh yeah, man, for real! Because condi builds only require one button to apply all condi and power builds don’t require one button to slap 5-10k dmg at someone at an instant? Making comments like “condi is brain dead easy” or “less effort for me reward” or “condi cheese” only makes it more apparent that the shifting meta has somehow left you behind and now instead of not having to pay as much attention to conditions you have to worry about being defeated by them (and probably happens often considering your general bitterness on the subject).

Things that beat me are brain dead easy to play and skill less. Yeah, that’s the ONLY reason you could possibly lose to something, right? I mean if condi builds took more “skill” then you’d win against all of them, right? Doubt it.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Celestial Elementalist traits water magic and equips Signet of Restoration. Sitting in water attunement and doing nothing (not even move or dodge) but auto-attacking, he keeps himself above 90% against a Carrion condition Necro (not Reaper) for a minimum of 8 seconds, possibly longer depending on the Necro’s life force.

It doesn’t even matter what weapon he has equipped.

That is the epitome of brainless and lack of skill. As soon as he starts doing literally anything else, the Necro has a much harder time. And Carrion builds actually have Power.

I’ve said it before, I’ve said it again: the trait needs an overhaul. Keep the anti-condition theme, sure, but make it less of a “win/lose” switch. You either auto-win, or you wasted your grandmaster slot. There is no middle ground with this trait. It needs a redesign to be less extreme and overall more useful. We have the Resistance boon now, so why not use it?

You should at the very least….go read the gw2 wiki before talking about other classes, a little necro tried to make its argument based on me generally calling wells everything on necro….well marks work same as wells, so just got wrong name OH WOW but you…

Saying that ele sit in water to heal..just broke all records on this forum, all you say from now on will be invalidated till the end of time.

ReaperJr.5967:

This again? If you’re running a pure condition build you deserve to get countered by ds eles. Enough said.

And who the kitten comes up with the idea that condition builds shouldn’t be nullified by diamond skin? Why not? Because your mindlessly easy yet rewarding condition aids build doesn’t work on someone for once? Gtfo.

Diamond skin only works in a 1v1 anyway. Any other scenario, it’s break the 10% with your team mates, unload conditions, proceed to watch the ele die helplessly. Smh, some people just can’t l2p.

If anything, diamond skin should be buffed.

/thread

The argument isn’t whether or not Condi Damages should be as viable as Power damage or whether or not Condi/Power/Bunker or any other build type is “cheese”.
That’s completely irrelevant to the point.

There is no trait that counters bunker builds.
There is no trait that counters power builds.
There is a trait that counters condi builds.

There is no justification for Diamond Skin. It is a bad, passive, trait mechanic that needs to change. There’s a million other ways to give the Ele condi sustains than making him, passively, completely immune to it…

hi I main necro and I can tell you you will not have any kind of problem breaking diamond skin with carrion gear, just saying. If you have problems your build is extremely weak.

The thing is that without diamond skin ele just dies way too fast. If it was boon it would be removed like instantly in team fight so that would not work either. As long as ele does not have any other way to counter INSANE condi bursts and cc diamond skin is fine.

In my opinion damage on carrion reaper necro is way over the top and Super cheesy. It will eat eles for breakfast without problem in few seconds in hands of skilled player. It requires you to push few more buttons than just 1 though. Surely ele might just escape but he’s not going to stand there for long.

On other hand if you are 100% condition build you should just think why the kitten you even try to kill ele 1v1.

jalmari.3906:

As long as ele does not have any other way to counter INSANE condi bursts and cc diamond skin is fine.

In my opinion damage on carrion reaper necro is way over the top and Super cheesy. It will eat eles for breakfast without problem in few seconds in hands of skilled player. It requires you to push few more buttons than just 1 though. Surely ele might just escape but he’s not going to stand there for long.

On other hand if you are 100% condition build you should just think why the kitten you even try to kill ele 1v1.

Necro’s boon removal has always killed Eles.

If us condi only players could remove the Ele’s Regen, Protection, while also applying CC effects like Fear when the Ele gets below that 10% threashhold, then currupt boon his Regen/Protection again while also applying condi bursts… yea, we would be doing well against a DS Ele too.

Necros always had the tools to kill Eles. Everyone else can’t down the DS build.

Oh and there are other available options to replace/change DS. Like reduced 75% or 90% condi duration when in Earth Attunement and/or keep the immunity to condi CC effects if that was Anets intentions…

Lol…thx god Anet doesn’t read the forum because here I am…defending clueless players from themselves

-Resistance on earth swap?
-Reduced condi duration while in earth?

-You guys realize that -condi duration can be stacked? ele has already a -33% condi duration trait? – condi duration runes exist?
-You guys realize ele can extend boons on himself by 100%? ..an ele could easily have 5s resistance every 10s with attunement swap..O_O

Stop giving suggestions without even knowing how the class work..if you can’t even beat a sub-par build…lol let me stop here

Supreme.3164:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Celestial Elementalist traits water magic and equips Signet of Restoration. Sitting in water attunement and doing nothing (not even move or dodge) but auto-attacking, he keeps himself above 90% against a Carrion condition Necro (not Reaper) for a minimum of 8 seconds, possibly longer depending on the Necro’s life force.

It doesn’t even matter what weapon he has equipped.

That is the epitome of brainless and lack of skill. As soon as he starts doing literally anything else, the Necro has a much harder time. And Carrion builds actually have Power.

I’ve said it before, I’ve said it again: the trait needs an overhaul. Keep the anti-condition theme, sure, but make it less of a “win/lose” switch. You either auto-win, or you wasted your grandmaster slot. There is no middle ground with this trait. It needs a redesign to be less extreme and overall more useful. We have the Resistance boon now, so why not use it?

You should at the very least….go read the gw2 wiki before talking about other classes, a little necro tried to make its argument based on me generally calling wells everything on necro….well marks work same as wells, so just got wrong name OH WOW but you…

Saying that ele sit in water to heal..just broke all records on this forum, all you say from now on will be invalidated till the end of time.

So now every Necro is the same player? FYI, Marks and Wells work nothing alike, other than being ground-targetted AoE’s. Marks are visible, single-strike traps while wells are pulsing effects.

It’s called math. Using Life Blast within 600 range, which is the hardest-hitting direct damage in a condition necro’s kitten nal, takes around 8 seconds to beat out the ele’s healing/second just from autoattacking with Signet of Restoration and soothing mist by enough of a margin to drop them below 90% health and not have them pop right back up above that threshold before the next attack hits. Without using life blast, the direct DPS the Necro deals is actually lower than that healing/second. Now, Sinister or Viper can penetrate it due to more reliable crits, but Carrion has difficulty and Rabid just can’t do it.

I am not saying that eles that are any good will sit in water to heal (although if they want to heal, they’re in water, so I’m not sure why you take offense to that), I am saying that it really does not take much effort from the ele to maintain diamond skin.

What always gets me on this topic is that whenever it comes up, people swarm to defend this trait that they call “terrible.” If it’s terrible, why don’t you want to see it changed?

the only way to kill someone as a reaper is with condis this meta.. when i go power all i see is nothing because they just kite for days or

block immune evade block immune evade block immune evade block immune evade block immune evade block immune evade block immune evade block immune evade.

need something to tick past all this junk!. did you know mesmer’s can be immune for 20s while dealing damage?

Lopez.7369:

I’m honestly not sure how I would rework it. Because once you break through it, it seems like elementalists just melt. So the ideal solution would be something that boosts elementalist’s sustainability versus conditions in the long term, instead of some arbitrary cut-off.

That’s what I would personally aim for. That also turns the trait into something useful against Power builds that inflict debilitating conditions.

Gain 2s Resistance upon executing Leap or Blast Finisher in a Combo Field. (5s ICD).