Guild Wars 2

Proof that a player can carry a match like Atlas but still lose that match due to a bad team or bad match making for that matter, regardless of how good he is.

It does happen! In the past it has happened to some of us more often than others. This is evident from a thread that I wrote and followed very closely in the past, here -> https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/High-MMR-is-punished-for-solo-que/first Later my concerns were identified as an in-game bug, here -> https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Updates-to-Matchmaking/first#post5524291

In shorter words: “Consider MMR ideally being actual skill level”
With 10 being a high MMR and 1 being a low MMR, due to how three node conquest works, a red team with skewed MMRs of 10,3,3,2,1 has a low likelihood of beating an average MMR blue team of 5, 4, 4, 4, 3. The numeric of these MMR allocations look good and balanced on paper but they don’t work for conquest play. This is mainly because a single good player can only be on one node at a time. if his team mates are all low MMR players, they’ll just keep losing on the other two nodes vs. the average MMR players and ultimately lose the match, almost every time.

This is not meant to be a negative post but rather a post to review my original concerns and comments about higher MMRs being punished during solo ques and question if it is happening again. It is also important to point out this problem within the unranked algorithm before a new algorithm is decided for season 3 ranked. I would sincerely like to avoid these kind of matches during S3.

Check out the imaged posted
This was in unranked
I was the blue warrior and those are not treb spam points
~ ty much for reading

Free advice, don’t play on week ends; They could have been trying builds or were just casuals, And also the like hood of a 10 being match with a 3 or 1 on a Sunday/Saturday is pretty low.

Maybe…

But this isn’t one case example, this has been happening to me frequently again lately. I’m in a match where I can kill 9/10 players I come across very easily and hold nodes even in 1v2s “sometimes win those 1v2s” but yet my team mates are getting crunched like ambient creatures on the other two nodes so quickly that there isn’t even time to rotate to assist those team fights before it gets neutralized or capped. The team mates are on a constant stagger to the point that the entire match is pretty much a 3v5 and I have no material to work with to actually hold nodes. When this type of situation happens, all you can do is fallback & peel away, get decaps/cap and defend in that 1v1 or 1v2 that you know you can win. Upon all of that, these are matches where I usually don’t even die once but get above double the score of the 2nd place scorer and sometimes my score is actually higher than the highest score on the enemy team. This is definitely indication that the 10,3,3,2,1 vs. 5,4,4,4,3 splits are happening again.

Hey, I’m not saying I’m anywhere near the MMR of pro players/teams but 4 years in at this point, I know I’m somewhere in the middle of intermediate to pro at the very least. I am also generally an advocate that “score doesn’t matter” but in the case of the posted image, when a single player’s score is just plain transcendent compared to all of the other team mates, something is wrong with that match making.

I just did hit my first year. Knowing that i can´t play as much as other competative players and propably will need more trainign with my age over 40 i did stick to one class that is flexible (i hoped it is ….) Its elementalist. Did WvW since last summer and started PvP with HOT.
The result is i am above average with ele but nearly garbage with all other classes only knowing most things i need to know for counterplay.
And now after season two going back unranked i encounter the described from Trevor Boyer. Can often 1:2 and kill both while i see my team struggling and running around like chickens. (if i play ele, going another class kills me).

+1 to Barbie.

I have the same problem but it is easily overcome by trio q with other good MMR players.

MatchMaking should put 10-9 togethers vs 10-9 togethers like it was season 1 ranked.

10 or 9 should never be put with/against 3 or less.

Jourdelune.7456:

+1 to Barbie.

I have the same problem but it is easily overcome by trio q with other good MMR players.

MatchMaking should put 10-9 togethers vs 10-9 togethers like it was season 1 ranked.

10 or 9 should never be put with/against 3 or less.

I don’t think season one worked that way. It MMR averaged teams that is not the same as saying on a scale of 1-10 both teams had all 9’s and 10’s. Lets make a theoretical scale of 1-5 for player ability. I believe that season one would say 3,3,3,3,3 is the same as five,5,2,1,1 or at least the matcher would green light that matchup. Surely the team with the two 1’s is at a huge disadvantage yet the teams average are the same. I’m out of here if we go back to MMR averaging personally. I dont wan’t to be forced to group with anyone outside of a fairly tight MMR window.

Odd you are the only one on your team with a score that isn’t a multiple of 5, your screen cap doesn’t include any stats, and you claim no treb points.

Trevor Boyer.6524:

Proof that a player can carry a match like Atlas but still lose that match due to a bad team or bad match making for that matter, regardless of how good he is.

It does happen! In the past it has happened to some of us more often than others. This is evident from a thread that I wrote and followed very closely in the past, here -> https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/High-MMR-is-punished-for-solo-que/first Later my concerns were identified as an in-game bug, here -> https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Updates-to-Matchmaking/first#post5524291

In shorter words: “Consider MMR ideally being actual skill level”
With 10 being a high MMR and 1 being a low MMR, due to how three node conquest works, a red team with skewed MMRs of 10,3,3,2,1 has a low likelihood of beating an average MMR blue team of 5, 4, 4, 4, 3. The numeric of these MMR allocations look good and balanced on paper but they don’t work for conquest play. This is mainly because a single good player can only be on one node at a time. if his team mates are all low MMR players, they’ll just keep losing on the other two nodes vs. the average MMR players and ultimately lose the match, almost every time.

This is not meant to be a negative post but rather a post to review my original concerns and comments about higher MMRs being punished during solo ques and question if it is happening again. It is also important to point out this problem within the unranked algorithm before a new algorithm is decided for season 3 ranked. I would sincerely like to avoid these kind of matches during S3.

Check out the imaged posted
This was in unranked
I was the blue warrior and those are not treb spam points
~ ty much for reading

Yup, I fired the treb a couple times during the match while rotating between far and home to try and assist the losing team fights at mid.

Maybe 15 to 20 of those points were form the treb at the most. I said “it wasn’t treb spam points”. I did not claim that “none of my points were from the treb”. Don’t put words in people’s mouths. All it does is convolute the point of a poster’s post.

Not trying to insult or anything but is it possible that you didn’t rotate well?

If you can kill 9/10 players you come across, why don’t you go into the team fights and help your team win the fights rather than rotate between far/home and hopping on treb (which mind boggles me to be honest).

You mentioned that you didn’t have time to assist them – maybe you need to rotate with them from the start?

The fact that you have a significantly higher score than your team suggests that you won your 1v1/1v2 fights, captured your nodes and held your own but it also suggests that you didn’t support your team enough, hence why they have low individual scores.

Not sure what you aren’t understanding about this but there isn’t anything you can do to help a team of players who get crunched in 2 to 4 seconds of combat, each and every time they engage. There are no magical rotations or team strategies that can cure a team full of people who are bad at combat.

The only thing a good player can do in that type of situation is peel around and catch 1v1s and 1v2s that he knows he can win and try to get something done while drawing agro in hopes of allowing the team mates an advantage 4v3 situation. If they are too poor to win 4v3s, well then it’s gg. Staying in some “team fight” that you already know is lost, isn’t going to get anything done other than expediting your return to the spawn point and it sure as hell isn’t going to decap any nodes from the opponents or score even a single game point for that matter.

Your initial response seemed as if you didn’t understand the above. This makes me wonder two things:

• (A) Do you even really play conquest?
• (B) Are you just trolling me?

~ Not trying to insult you or anything

wow~ someone is a little touchy and sour.

-checks post history- oh right… you were one of those people who didn’t make it to legend and blamed MMR!

Never mind me – please continue as you were

/exits topic

brannigan.9831:

Jourdelune.7456:

+1 to Barbie.

I have the same problem but it is easily overcome by trio q with other good MMR players.

MatchMaking should put 10-9 togethers vs 10-9 togethers like it was season 1 ranked.

10 or 9 should never be put with/against 3 or less.

I don’t think season one worked that way. It MMR averaged teams that is not the same as saying on a scale of 1-10 both teams had all 9’s and 10’s. Lets make a theoretical scale of 1-5 for player ability. I believe that season one would say 3,3,3,3,3 is the same as five,5,2,1,1 or at least the matcher would green light that matchup. Surely the team with the two 1’s is at a huge disadvantage yet the teams average are the same. I’m out of here if we go back to MMR averaging personally. I dont wan’t to be forced to group with anyone outside of a fairly tight MMR window.

Well… for me it was. I was never put into group with noob in season 1 nor season 2. But in unranked (even with thousands of wins into it), it do.

The matchmaking in unranked do what Trevor said.

This matchmaking is aggravating, because no one with thousands of game wanna play with people with less than 500.

But it do.

If you can’t acknowledge a problem, you simply let it go… and so, the player base from 2 years ago, is not the same as today because of this.

When you will get into the thousands games range, probably you will see that coming.

FLIMP.8172:

wow~ someone is a little touchy and sour.

-checks post history- oh right… you were one of those people who didn’t make it to legend and blamed MMR!

Never mind me – please continue as you were

/exits topic

I’ll be honest with you, I didn’t try very hard during S2. I was busy with work, had a few bad things happen IRL to tend to and overall was too tired to give a kitten about GW2 at the end of the day. Not to mention that a good 75%+ of the players I normally play with had quit the game after the disappointing balance patch right before S2 started and that was a bit discouraging as well.

During the last 3 days of S2, I had taken a leave from work and had time again. I grinded as hard as I could in solo ques. I was actually on a win streak and only two games from legend when ranked got closed.

Don’t believe me? Trying to make me look like a bad player? Take a look at this image. There are plenty of players who would vouch that I wasn’t online much during S2. This is also visible from my lack of forum activity during S2.

Great dirt tossing though. It keeps things interesting. You know what would be very interesting? If you formed the best team you could make and I formed the best team that I could make and we recorded the outcome of the match or possibly we could simply record a 1v1 session with you and I.

~ Get back with me on that one. I’m being serious about it. The good old dirt tossing is boring. I like to provide evidence when my reputation is in question. It’ll give the community something stupid to watch anyway. They’ll enjoy it.

I would REALLY like to see what happens when players new and old get their legendary backpack. I sure as hell don’t think they’re all staying.

Trevor Boyer.6524:

During the last 3 days of S2, I had taken a leave from work and had time again. I grinded as hard as I could in solo ques. I was actually on a win streak and only two games from legend when ranked got closed.

…

Trevor Boyer.6524:

I’m actually having the exact same thing happen to me right now. Made it to t7 diamond then suddenly a magic lose streak begins, full of nightmare matches where team mates are unable to win even a single combat over the course of an entire match, make gross errors in rotations, argue and in general do not listen to anything spoken in /t chat to the point that one could confuse it with players trying to throw the match on purpose.

Pretty kittened off about it actually.

Sorry! I’m really leaving now.

/exits topic again with Bjorn’s credibility

Yup, I experienced a lose streak earlier in the day and then immediately hit a win streak afterwards. This happens to everyone in spvp, including you:

FLIMP.8172:

Background info:
- climbed my way to Ruby really easy
- got stuck for a bit
- climbed to Diamond easily
- now stuck in Diamond bouncing between T5 and T1 for a few weeks now

(I had a 25 streak loss once)

So you went through my post history, hand pick quotes from separate discussions in separate threads from different dates & times and arranged them in a way that would suggest that I am lying. Even though you, from your own experiences, clearly understand that a player can go on a lose streak and then go on a win streak. This is all bad conduct my friend and it makes you look aggressive, toxic and a bit pompous.

But since you want to hit my credibility so hard, I’ll go ahead and hit yours:

~ #1: Researched your post history. You are predominately a wvw player and haven’t even posted much in the forum until about 1 month ago when it looks like you started playing conquest more often. You made this thread: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/MM-system-Thank-you to share your vast knowledge of conquest to all of the players who have been doing it for almost four years now and I actually laughed out loud when I read this part of your post:

FLIMP.8172:

Winning your 1 v 1 or holding a point 1 v 2/3 doesn’t mean kitten
Even if you’re successfully doing the above, if your team mates are losing their fights, it pretty much means you’re not carrying. Even if you’re doing a fantastic job winning a 1 v 3, if your team mates are losing the 4 v 2 and losing the other points then you need to join the team fight to help them. It’s a team game so play more like a team and help them.

Seriously though, I actually laughed out loud at this. It woke my gf up and kind of kittened her off.

~ #2: That same point of view in the above quote is the same thing you said to me in your original post in this thread. Now I know the answer to the question that I asked in my response. The answer is -> No, you indeed haven’t actually played much conquest. This much is evident with a review of your post history and your comments about joining team fight wipes, rather than winning 1v3s and holding nodes whilst granting your weak team advantage situations elsewhere. If you don’t understand why this is a good thing to do for a bad team, you’ve got a lot to learn.

~ #3: Your lose streak in diamond went on for 3 weeks. Mine went on for 3 hours.

~ #4: I issued you a challenge to either a recorded 1v1 or a team vs. team and you dodged me. This is disappointing seeing as how you have a youtube channel dedicated to wvw pvp. I’d have figured that you would have taken this opportunity to create hits for your channel. The only reason that you wouldn’t, is if you were concerned that I would beat you.

~ Cheers to credibility bruh