Guild Wars 2

Somebody has to say it:

I enjoy playing GW2. My favorite part of the game is tPvP. Solo queues and team queues are both fun for me. I like high-apm gameplay even though it feels like skill spam sometimes; I like the attack/defense mechanic of conquest; I like the theorycraftable trait/skillsets and am a firm believer that there are top-tier builds waiting to be invented.

I realize there are some issues. The game launched a bit too early, and some stuff just wasn’t ready. If you don’t enjoy GW2 PvP, I understand. Sometimes technical issues override good gameplay, as when matches are 4v5: that’s not enjoyable, even though the game is. There are balance issues that reward uninteresting builds. I get that.

So here’s my suggestion: if you have a beef with the devs, that’s fine. If you want GvG, that’s cool, but filling the PvP forum with toxicity isn’t making a good case for your community. I’m sorry about the WvW change, I really am. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with wanting a team deathmatch with PvE stats.

But the game the devs designed is also very fun and has a lot of potential, now that the infrastructure is coming into place. I don’t believe the most effective way to get the GvG mode you want is to trash-talk the devs’ design choices.

I dislike hotjoins and think that they should be renamed to “practice arena” so that new players stop joining them and thinking that’s what PvP is like.

But I’m not mad that people hotjoin, or mad that some of them seem to enjoy it, or mad at the devs for making it.

Top tier builds will be “invented” when garbage skills get buffs and OP skills get toned down. We already have top tier builds right now. Believe it or not you’re actually a lot more limited than the game advertises in terms of efficacy.

I’m happy to still see some positiveness in SPvP players ^^
Everyone knows there are problems, keeping writing about them will not speed up their fix.
I’m repeating what you are saying, but people should stay more calm and discuss politely rather than whining, spamming, raging, insulting and ragequitting.
Rage brings only more rage, not gameplay fixes XD

Leuca.5732:

Top tier builds will be “invented” when garbage skills get buffs and OP skills get toned down. We already have top tier builds right now. Believe it or not you’re actually a lot more limited than the game advertises in terms of efficacy.

And yet I got flattened in by a build I had never even seen before just the other day, using some utilities that most people of that profession are trying to get buffed because they don’t think they’re powerful enough—while this dude was 100% carrying his team. I’m not the greatest player in the world but this was a top-tier solo queue match with player ranks between probably about 50 and 350.

Again, balance isn’t perfect, but there’s more depth here than we’re realizing.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Leuca.5732:

Top tier builds will be “invented” when garbage skills get buffs and OP skills get toned down. We already have top tier builds right now. Believe it or not you’re actually a lot more limited than the game advertises in terms of efficacy.

And yet I got flattened in by a build I had never even seen before just the other day, using some utilities that most people of that profession are trying to get buffed because they don’t think they’re powerful enough—while this dude was 100% carrying his team. I’m not the greatest player in the world but this was a top-tier solo queue match with player ranks between probably about 50 and 350.

Again, balance isn’t perfect, but there’s more depth here than we’re realizing.

What build haven’t you seen?

Leuca.5732:

What build haven’t you seen?

I have seen it now The point of the thread isn’t to post new/interesting builds, it’s to say that new and interesting builds are possible.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Leuca.5732:

What build haven’t you seen?

I have seen it now The point of the thread isn’t to post new/interesting builds, it’s to say that new and interesting builds are possible.

The topic is trying to make the SPvP community a bit more calm and constructive XD
And you may just write:
OT
build link
/OT
Your answer seems more like you are trying to hide that build XD

NevirSayDie.6235:

Leuca.5732:

What build haven’t you seen?

I have seen it now The point of the thread isn’t to post new/interesting builds, it’s to say that new and interesting builds are possible.

It’s not particularly difficult to explain what killed you now, is it?

Example: This S/F ele bursted me down with what I think was a Fresh Air build.

Chances are the build you died to is not really that new; it’s just uncommonly seen for one reason or another.

+1 to OP

15 charr

Leuca.5732:

NevirSayDie.6235:

Leuca.5732:

What build haven’t you seen?

I have seen it now The point of the thread isn’t to post new/interesting builds, it’s to say that new and interesting builds are possible.

It’s not particularly difficult to explain what killed you now, is it?

Example: This S/F ele bursted me down with what I think was a Fresh Air build.

Chances are the build you died to is not really that new; it’s just uncommonly seen for one reason or another.

What exactly are those reasons ?

When i used to play hammer-longbow ( note, basically the same build people bash for being OP with the only difference being signet of fury instead of dolyak) ANYONE would ask me to go back to my thief.

I used to say wars were strong and didn’t need any serious buff. They laughed at me.

Look at wars now, just look at them.

What is stopping people from using those builds is tunnel vision.

Rupt mesmer, S/F burst eles, power ranger and similars are all viable and strong, and needs very little to be on par with common OP builds.

As soon as they shave OP builds ( S/D thief, necros and wars among all) they will be godlike like they should ( being mostly builds with high skill cap) .

Power ranger-guard-necro are the only one that should be looked at for buffs (AIMED ONES, not ridicolous stuff such burning was for necros) because if you do give too much to builds already in a decent spot ( such DPS guards) they will become OP like necros and wars.

Mesmer and eles especially are in a very good state, it’s S/D thief ( which holds them back) which should be nerfed ( again , AIMED nerfs).

Mrbig.8019:

What exactly are those reasons ?

When i used to play hammer-longbow ( note, basically the same build people bash for being OP with the only difference being signet of fury instead of dolyak) ANYONE would ask me to go back to my thief.

I used to say wars were strong and didn’t need any serious buff. They laughed at me.

Look at wars now, just look at them.

What is stopping people from using those builds is tunnel vision.

Rupt mesmer, S/F burst eles, power ranger and similars are all viable and strong, and needs very little to be on par with common OP builds.

As soon as they shave OP builds ( S/D thief, necros and wars among all) they will be godlike like they should ( being mostly builds with high skill cap) .

Power ranger-guard-necro are the only one that should be looked at for buffs (AIMED ONES, not ridicolous stuff such burning was for necros) because if you do give too much to builds already in a decent spot ( such DPS guards) they will become OP like necros and wars.

Mesmer and eles especially are in a very good state, it’s S/D thief ( which holds them back) which should be nerfed ( again , AIMED nerfs).

Exactly! There is so much potential in every profession. Yes, balance tweaks are needed, but nothing like what the last few weeks’ threads would have you believe.

Same goes with match design—yeah, I’m looking forward to the new modes they’re creating. But I understand why they started with conquest and not deathmatch. It was a good decision. Same with downed state, the way conditions function, etc. Asking for changes so big they could only really have been implemented pre-alpha is unreasonable and will decrease your enjoyment of a good product.

There are a few people that like conquest and that’s good, play away.

Mrbig.8019:

What exactly are those reasons ?

Depends on what makes the build less than optimal for most styles of play. I’m assuming you know that’s kind of a given. It’s easy to get beaten up by a niche build that you’ve never seen before if you have no idea what to expect, but that doesn’t make the build particularly great for much by default. It just means the person caught you off guard, was a better player, etc.

When i used to play hammer-longbow ( note, basically the same build people bash for being OP with the only difference being signet of fury instead of dolyak) ANYONE would ask me to go back to my thief.

I used to say wars were strong and didn’t need any serious buff. They laughed at me.

Look at wars now, just look at them.

Wars were weak by comparison. Now they’re OP by comparison. Your build back then wasn’t going to touch a prenerf ele who knew what they were doing.

Also, many of us are quite aware that Anet’s policy for balance often goes astray..

What is stopping people from using those builds is tunnel vision.

Rupt mesmer, S/F burst eles, power ranger and similars are all viable and strong, and needs very little to be on par with common OP builds.

As soon as they shave OP builds ( S/D thief, necros and wars among all) they will be godlike like they should ( being mostly builds with high skill cap) .

Power ranger-guard-necro are the only one that should be looked at for buffs (AIMED ONES, not ridicolous stuff such burning was for necros) because if you do give too much to builds already in a decent spot ( such DPS guards) they will become OP like necros and wars.

Mesmer and eles especially are in a very good state, it’s S/D thief ( which holds them back) which should be nerfed ( again , AIMED nerfs).

No, what is stopping people from using those builds is a lack of global efficiency. S/F burst for example is an extremely niche build with only one skill for innate survivability. The set lacks any consistent sustain after blowing its first round of heals and has no mobility whatsoever. Anything with a bit of durability and/or well-timed dodges will completely wreck this kind of ele because it can’t keep up if its damage fails to kill in the first round, and its offhand lacks any significant pressure skills to keep an attacker at bay after dealing its primary damage. Which could bring me to the point of how eles are actually in a terrible state outside of a meta balance perspective, but I’d highly encourage you to take a look at some of the less-whiny threads on the related forum, which discuss design flaws with the class.

I also don’t understand how you can think your bolded statement is true. There is so much in this game that is below what basic operating level has come to be known as e.g. myriad traits/entire traitlines, as well as entire weapon sets for some, and a vast number of utility skills. None of these categories are in any way limited to the professions/specialties you mentioned.

NevirSayDie.6235:

Exactly! There is so much potential in every profession. Yes, balance tweaks are needed, but nothing like what the last few weeks’ threads would have you believe.

The potential is there, but the design/current balance prevents it from taking form, which is effectively making it nonexistent for the time being. It would take a massive overhaul of the game to make every traitline/weapon/utility skill have at least some degree of viability when compared to each other.

im toxic because i disagree with your assertion that theory crafting is fun in this game.

i played and theory crafted in gw1. my biggest acheivement was blood spike, which is hardly the best build of any moment but hey, it got famous and worked pretty well. im satisfied.

I was the guy who started running doylak signet in gw1 into HoH. Im all for finding gems the meta game overlooked.

I theory crafted the bejebus out of gw2 and you know what I eventually found? It was really boring. This game was more about twitch than theory craft. Good build selection wasnt as important as build familiarity and good reflexes.

why was this dissapointong? Because as a twitch game, gw2 is lacking. they have skill shot abilities but opt primarily away from them. seriously, go try a f2p called smite and imagine what gw2 would have been like if theyd gone with an approach more like that. (the gameplay, not the concept).

Leuca.5732:

Depends on what makes the build less than optimal for most styles of play. I’m assuming you know that’s kind of a given. It’s easy to get beaten up by a niche build that you’ve never seen before if you have no idea what to expect, but that doesn’t make the build particularly great for much by default. It just means the person caught you off guard, was a better player, etc.

There’re tons of optimal builds. Even DPS guard can be viable in high level of play, it’s just more difficult to make it work.

In a meta where spirit rangers are not present, other professions can shine

Leuca.5732:

Wars were weak by comparison. Now they’re OP by comparison. Your build back then wasn’t going to touch a prenerf ele who knew what they were doing.

Also, many of us are quite aware that Anet’s policy for balance often goes astray..

I’m not talking to pre-nerf eles time.

I’m talking about when they buffed Hammer animations and Mace stuns and added zerk stance ( 2 months ago IIRC).

I used to run with Healing surge and Fury signet/dolyak ( same build with less sustain but more spike) and i was able to demolish anybody.

Super surely is not the first one running that build ( or similar builds), we have been running with similar stuff for months.

Yet most of the time nobody would give credit to wars. When in TS with my guildies, when i said that any more buff to wars would have made them ridicolously OP, they would laugh at me.

Now look at them.

I’m sure the same will happen to Eles and Mesmers ( surely those 2) as soon as people get used changing their builds and adapting: Interrupt mesmer, Countless’ build, S/F burst are extremely strong, people is seriously underrating them.

Just few tweaks and they will be ridicolously strong

Leuca.5732:

No, what is stopping people from using those builds is a lack of global efficiency. S/F burst for example is an extremely niche build with only one skill for innate survivability. The set lacks any consistent sustain after blowing its first round of heals and has no mobility whatsoever. Anything with a bit of durability and/or well-timed dodges will completely wreck this kind of ele because it can’t keep up if its damage fails to kill in the first round, and its offhand lacks any significant pressure skills to keep an attacker at bay after dealing its primary damage. Which could bring me to the point of how eles are actually in a terrible state outside of a meta balance perspective, but I’d highly encourage you to take a look at some of the less-whiny threads on the related forum, which discuss design flaws with the class.

I also don’t understand how you can think your bolded statement is true. There is so much in this game that is below what basic operating level has come to be known as e.g. myriad traits/entire traitlines, as well as entire weapon sets for some, and a vast number of utility skills. None of these categories are in any way limited to the professions/specialties you mentioned.

I disagree.

S/F eles, when built correctly, have tons of survivability.

You can build for double arcane shield ( it’s not really needed anyway), you have magnetic shield which is almost a global condi removal every 25 secs + a projectile reflection.

Also obsidian flesh.

Also swirling winds.

Ether renewal grants you very consinstent healing and condi removal, so you can not care about points in water and go glass

Fresh air gives you good sustained damage and great burst.

Go figure the build out by yourself.

If you don’t, i’ll give you some advice: 20-30-0-0-20 or 0-30-20-0-20 are good examples, you would also grant AoE stability every 10 secs, you know.

Mrbig.8019:

There’re tons of optimal builds. Even DPS guard can be viable in high level of play, it’s just more difficult to make it work.

You’ve just addressed your own point. It’s not as easy or as effective, which means it isn’t optimal.

I’m not talking to pre-nerf eles time.

I’m talking about when they buffed Hammer animations and Mace stuns and added zerk stance ( 2 months ago IIRC).

I used to run with Healing surge and Fury signet/dolyak ( same build with less sustain but more spike) and i was able to demolish anybody.

Super surely is not the first one running that build ( or similar builds), we have been running with similar stuff for months.

Yet most of the time nobody would give credit to wars. When in TS with my guildies, when i said that any more buff to wars would have made them ridicolously OP, they would laugh at me.

Now look at them.

I’m sorry your guildies were blissfully unaware of how strong warriors were on the verge of becoming, but that whole power increase was not due to somebody magically discovering that warriors had a hammer and mace.

I disagree.

S/F eles, when built correctly, have tons of survivability.

You can build for double arcane shield ( it’s not really needed anyway), you have magnetic shield which is almost a global condi removal every 25 secs + a projectile reflection.

Also obsidian flesh.

Also swirling winds.

Ether renewal grants you very consinstent healing and condi removal, so you can not care about points in water and go glass

Fresh air gives you good sustained damage and great burst.

Go figure the build out by yourself.

If you don’t, i’ll give you some advice: 20-30-0-0-20 or 0-30-20-0-20 are good examples, you would also grant AoE stability every 10 secs, you know.

S/F eles that build for any long-term survivability give up a significant portion of their damage, which actually isn’t that great when compared to other weapon sets due to /focus having no damage and only one form of cc. We can take your two example trait setups as examples.

In the first one, you have no access to earth/water lines, and have sacrificed Evasive Arcana, meaning your condition removal is tied only to Ether Renewal and Magnetic Wave, with the former being extremely easy to read and your exclusive source of healing. Unless your opponent has no knowledge of how your skills work, it will take them pretty much no effort to wait for your main heal (since you have no secondary healing from traits) to either finish, or wait for it to time an interrupt, putting your only heal (barring water trident) on full cooldown. A build with that little defense probably won’t have defensive utilities either in an effort to maximize damage, but even if it does, those utilities are on such high CD that you literally have to be attacking a target who is just as squishy and has no active defense to come out victorious in an engagement, assuming you are at similar skill levels. Focus only really specializes in ranged defense, and only against projectiles. Your active defenses mean nothing to anybody attacking you in melee if your Arcane Shield(s) is not up, which is a pathetic excuse for a stunbreak with its 75 second recharge.

In the second build, you have no innate power gained from traits, and your ability to stack might is entirely reliant on using Flamewall if you are not using sigil of battle. This method of might stacking is inefficient because Flamewall has an extremely small area for you to gain might with and hit your foe at the same time. With this build (and to some degree all s/f builds except condition), your damage is reliant on keeping Air damage uptime high while supplementing with Fire. However, your lower damage output (even with Fresh Air) is most likely only going to significantly pressure the squishiest of people provided they know how to deal with the one hard cc /focus has. You still have no Water investment or Evasive Arcana, which essentially lumps your healing in the same boat as the first build unless you attune to earth every time you cast Ether Renewal, which makes your build exceedingly predictable and even further messes up a Fresh Air rotation.

It’s unfortunate that so many people are taken surprise by Fresh Air, because it’s really only a slight increase to your total overall dps.

NevirSayDie.6235:

But the game the devs designed is also very fun and has a lot of potential

The game had millions buy it.
Now with ques synced through all NA its getting 10+ min wait times, if you’re not thrown in a match with the same people.
The population probably went down after PAX.

It’s not impossible to like GW2, but it is far from common.
The devs need to change, in person or methodology, if ever is to be fixed.

ryston.7640:

im toxic because i disagree with your assertion that theory crafting is fun in this game.

i played and theory crafted in gw1. my biggest acheivement was blood spike, which is hardly the best build of any moment but hey, it got famous and worked pretty well. im satisfied.

I was the guy who started running doylak signet in gw1 into HoH. Im all for finding gems the meta game overlooked.

I theory crafted the bejebus out of gw2 and you know what I eventually found? It was really boring. This game was more about twitch than theory craft. Good build selection wasnt as important as build familiarity and good reflexes.

why was this dissapointong? Because as a twitch game, gw2 is lacking. they have skill shot abilities but opt primarily away from them. seriously, go try a f2p called smite and imagine what gw2 would have been like if theyd gone with an approach more like that. (the gameplay, not the concept).

Ah, I’m sorry to hear that. I did not play GW1, so I have no grounds to argue with you on that point. I think you could have some fun with engineers if you like skillshots and theorycrafting, but maybe you’ve already given them a shot.

I’m sure Smite is a great game. I don’t think that automatically makes GW2 a bad game, though. GW2 is probably not the best game in the universe, but that’s true of every single game except the best one. People are constantly enjoying games that are not the best one. It’s not really fair to go tell an olympic silver-medalist “You should have done better!” Or even, “You got gold four (eight?) years ago!” (If you liked GW1 better).

That’s all I’m trying to say. GW2 PvP is enjoyable. If I didn’t enjoy it, I wouldn’t play it.

NevirSayDie.6235:

ryston.7640:

im toxic because i disagree with your assertion that theory crafting is fun in this game.

i played and theory crafted in gw1. my biggest acheivement was blood spike, which is hardly the best build of any moment but hey, it got famous and worked pretty well. im satisfied.

I was the guy who started running doylak signet in gw1 into HoH. Im all for finding gems the meta game overlooked.

I theory crafted the bejebus out of gw2 and you know what I eventually found? It was really boring. This game was more about twitch than theory craft. Good build selection wasnt as important as build familiarity and good reflexes.

why was this dissapointong? Because as a twitch game, gw2 is lacking. they have skill shot abilities but opt primarily away from them. seriously, go try a f2p called smite and imagine what gw2 would have been like if theyd gone with an approach more like that. (the gameplay, not the concept).

Ah, I’m sorry to hear that. I did not play GW1, so I have no grounds to argue with you on that point. I think you could have some fun with engineers if you like skillshots and theorycrafting, but maybe you’ve already given them a shot.

I’m sure Smite is a great game. I don’t think that automatically makes GW2 a bad game, though. GW2 is probably not the best game in the universe, but that’s true of every single game except the best one. People are constantly enjoying games that are not the best one. It’s not really fair to go tell an olympic silver-medalist “You should have done better!” Or even, “You got gold four (eight?) years ago!” (If you liked GW1 better).

That’s all I’m trying to say. GW2 PvP is enjoyable. If I didn’t enjoy it, I wouldn’t play it.

I hear you, so let me make a comparison that shows both our points of view.

Suppose that instead of video games, we’re talking food at a restaurant.

I ordered the steak (a sequel to gw1, with some changes, hopefully improvement but still sorts that type of game.)

I got a hamburger, gave it a try, and decided I didn’t even like it that much for a hamburger (hence the comparison to burger kings.)

So I started yelling in the dinning hall about how upset I am. (complaining and being toxic on the forums.) Meanwhile some guests, like you, who thought it was a pretty good burger are sorta wondering why I’m ruining your dinning experience. Why don’t I just go to a different restaurant.

So, in conclusion: Yes, I am being toxic, and it does ruin the experience for those people who enjoy GW2 PvP.

On the other hand, I really did order a steak, and they really are giving me a McDouble. My whining that I’d have settled for a Whopper is sort of off-topic and petty, but at this point it falls under the general umbrella of:: I’m upset and want them to feel bad about themselves, because they wrote steak on the bloody menu and it was a lie! ::

(really anet did advertise a PvP experience much different from the one they delivered.)

Oh and I waited a really long time for my food too. shakes fist

ryston.7640:

I hear you, so let me make a comparison that shows both our points of view.

Suppose that instead of video games, we’re talking food at a restaurant.

I ordered the steak (a sequel to gw1, with some changes, hopefully improvement but still sorts that type of game.)

I got a hamburger, gave it a try, and decided I didn’t even like it that much for a hamburger (hence the comparison to burger kings.)

So I started yelling in the dinning hall about how upset I am. (complaining and being toxic on the forums.) Meanwhile some guests, like you, who thought it was a pretty good burger are sorta wondering why I’m ruining your dinning experience. Why don’t I just go to a different restaurant.

So, in conclusion: Yes, I am being toxic, and it does ruin the experience for those people who enjoy GW2 PvP.

On the other hand, I really did order a steak, and they really are giving me a McDouble. My whining that I’d have settled for a Whopper is sort of off-topic and petty, but at this point it falls under the general umbrella of:: I’m upset and want them to feel bad about themselves, because they wrote steak on the bloody menu and it was a lie! ::

(really anet did advertise a PvP experience much different from the one they delivered.)

Oh and I waited a really long time for my food too. shakes fist

Fair enough. The only thing I’d say is that Anet did advertise PvP as being more active/twitch/etc than GW1. However, they did release before key features were ready and I can’t defend that.

A lot of the missing features are in place now, though, so I’d argue that a year after launch, we’re getting an excellent product more or less as advertised. More like getting what you ordered, good quality, just after having to wait a long time for the food, as you say.

lol many people made these kind of post in the past year … and most of them end up saying that the game is bad after a while.
Rigth now after one year they are fixing problems that people told em to fix during betas, not a few months after release.. in beta.
I think i made a post once that what guild wars 2 is.. just “lots of potential”.

The best thing that Anet did was releasing this game when there was nothing on the market.

Lots of cool aid drinking here that I don’t really have time to rebutt. I will say to say that elementalist and mesmers are in a good place right now is pretty ludicrous. Elementalist is general are probably the weakest class over-all in spvp regardless of build pretty much. Mesmers are very situational and if you pull them out of those situations are also very weak. It really doesn’t matter why those classes are weak either those things making them weak exist and until A-net fixes those things the actual reason why doesn’t matter. Oh its just that x exists! Well until A-net tells me they are fixing x who cares?

Juan Ignacio.8903:

lol many people made these kind of post in the past year … and most of them end up saying that the game is bad after a while.
Rigth now after one year they are fixing problems that people told em to fix during betas, not a few months after release.. in beta.
I think i made a post once that what guild wars 2 is.. just “lots of potential”.

The best thing that Anet did was releasing this game when there was nothing on the market.

The engineer forum is filled with people who think engi is worthless, one of the worst professions for PvP and WvW. Many of them believe that Anet actively dislikes them and refuses to fix bugs because they main warriors. Of course, everyone else knows how ridiculous that is…but they don’t see it.

Then I come to the PvP forum. It’s filled with people convinced that PvP is worthless, should be re-designed from the ground up. That Anet refuses to fix PvP bugs out of spite, that the devs actively dislike PvP and refuse to make changes because they main WvW. Of course, everyone else knows how ridiculous that is…but we just don’t see it.

I don’t think PvP is bad. It’s just not great. I’d love to see stats on how much time people spend in PvE, WvW, or PvP. I think you’d find that PvP is last.

style.6173:

I don’t think PvP is bad. It’s just not great. I’d love to see stats on how much time people spend in PvE, WvW, or PvP. I think you’d find that PvP is last.

I think you’d find that for 95% of all MMOs ever released. The vast majority of people buy an MMO for the PvE—although every once in a while, a company releases an MMO with a huge focus on PvP and very little PvE content.

Time spent is unrelated to the quality of the content in this case—it’s like saying “engineers are obviously the weakest profession because fewer people play them across all areas of the game.” They’re probably the least-played profession, but that’s because people who buy MMOs like swords and bows and stuff. Or other reasons, like engineers being slightly less brainless in PvE than warriors or guardians. It certainly can’t be used as evidence that engineers were poorly designed, or are underpowered.

NevirSayDie.6235:

PvE player no? or casual?

Yeah I agree, its a great game. Conquest was good, but got a bit boring after running around capping points for hours a day. Hopefully the devs will do something interesting with the upcoming new gamemodes which will spice things up.

Most of the things people complain about are far worse in other mmos and you have to go through the pve grind or gear-grind to boot.

I do agree with the poster who mentioned Smite though- I’m pretty sure that was done on a much smaller budget than GW2 and it has amazing gameplay/strategy, a variety of gamemodes, and is easy to get into (pretty good tutorials etc).

I like the combat system in GW2 more, but I find it strange that (what I assume) is a lower budget game pulled off so much that GW2 is struggling with. Every time I play Smite I wish I was playing the same gamemodes but in GW2.

BlizzarD.9617:

NevirSayDie.6235:

PvE player no? or casual?

Just got back up to 160 on solo queue last night. Not as high as I was before and I’m not claiming to be a great player—I know the real pros are in team queue. There are a lot of people way better than I am, but at least I can debunk the ad hominem.

I do something like 15 minutes of PvE a week.

Yeah sure but i’d say a moba is a little easier to design. There is way more competition though. Balance isnt that stellar either but the various game modes keep it feeling fresh and allows other, lesser used Gods a place where they are better picks. If by some divine intervention they create a Ranked Arena, then i will have found the holy grail of gaming.

Ofcourse the true joy of that game is the amount of skill shots and even better, dem jukes! It truly allows for skill to be a much bigger factor than most moba/MMOs. Cooldowns and CC durations feel much more in-line with eachother as well, and missing a spell is actually possible and feels horrible due to high mana costs and cooldowns, which makes it feel all the better when you master a god and land 90%+ of your skills.

Gw2 should be more like that. I vaguely remember Anet saying they are somewhat looking at other moba’s for inspiration and what not, well stop looking at LoL and look at Smite. The potential is there in the Dodge mechanic.

GankSinatra.2653:

Ofcourse the true joy of that game is the amount of skill shots and even better, dem jukes! It truly allows for skill to be a much bigger factor than most moba/MMOs. Cooldowns and CC durations feel much more in-line with eachother as well, and missing a spell is actually possible and feels horrible due to high mana costs and cooldowns, which makes it feel all the better when you master a god and land 90%+ of your skills.

Gw2 should be more like that. I vaguely remember Anet saying they are somewhat looking at other moba’s for inspiration and what not, well stop looking at LoL and look at Smite. The potential is there in the Dodge mechanic.

Wow, its just like you are saying exactly what I have been thinking for a while. I keep trying to dodge in Smite, haha.