Guild Wars 2

Rezz, your post is full of unrealistic, trite sloganeering.

I don’t buy into these BS notions that I should just pretend that losing is always my fault when it isn’t. I blame myself when I screw up; I blame my team when they act like morons. And 2/3 of the games I play, there’s a lot more of the latter than the former.

“Never die”? “Adapt to them”? Give me a break. I do adapt to my team behaving stupidly, such as when I’m on a team with players who do a ton of direct damage but they can’t be bothered to get the treb, so I go and get it. But most of the time we lose anyway because they don’t do anything effective in the meantime.

I had one game earlier where I was fighting two players on a point at once for long stretches of time without dying. We still lost. I’m not sure what more it is realistic to expect me to do.

I very often try to discuss tactics before the match. 95% of the time I get no response or the tactics are ignored.

I’m sure my whining is a turn-off for some, but this is the only outlet I have for what has become a very unsatisfying experience. At this point I am only still in PvP out of stubbornness and because I want to raise my rank higher. I always try my best – even when trailing 400-40 – but I cannot make up for 2 or 3 or 4 other people behaving foolishly (or not being present, for that matter.)

If there were a build I really could use to “carry” an entire team, I’d love to know what it is.

Qaelyn.7612:

If there were a build I really could use to “carry” an entire team, I’d love to know what it is.

Spirit ranger, bunker guardian, hambow warrior – all very very easy to play.

Thanks. Funny but I found I died more on a hambow than my mesmer. Guardian I am not sure of. Haven’t tried a spirit ranger.

I’m leveling an engi right now and enjoying it so I may try that next.

Qaelyn.7612:

Just lost a solo queue match because, despite my repeated requests, nobody would help me take out the trebuchet. I went all the way there myself, barely lost to the warrior manning it, then had to go back again. While the rest of my team just ran around skirmishing and dying to the treb shots.

This is why I cannot win matches, and there’s nothing realistic I can do about it.

Yeah, I’m venting, but it’s frustrating.

See, there’s ur problem. U lost to a rank 35% or close to it warrior.
I feel u would make a fine addition to the league of legends community with all da qq

See, now I’m glad you posted that thread that got locked. Before that, I might have actually taken what you wrote there seriously.

I’m happy being a mediocre PvPer if being a good one makes me behave the way you do.

Qaelyn I posted my warrior build in the warrior forums Axe/Shield/Longbow if you want to go look at it. A bunch of people in game kept asking for it and after helping the 3rd person in a row i posted it on the site.

Everyone who has tried it has liked it so far(Atleast everyone that has contacted me atleast)

Thanks clint. I just can’t seem to get into warrior but I’ll give it a go.

Qaelyn.7612:

Thanks clint. I just can’t seem to get into warrior but I’ll give it a go.

Yup GL

Just tried it out in a hotjoin. Utterly and completely clueless, lol. I end up mostly flailing with the axe, I block with the shield and usually get bursted down fairly quickly. Whenever I swap to the bow I end up running backwards in circles spamming the bow without a great deal of effectiveness. Also not sure how to handle thieves, mesmers and other evasive/stealth types, nor when to activate my long-cooldown utilities.

I know it’s me, not the build, and I’m sure it will get better with practice, though if you’re in NA and wouldn’t mind showing me a few pointers that would be most appreciated.

Also.. I find the build rather immobile. Ever consider swapping in Warrior’s Sprint?

In other news, I finally seem to be having a bit more luck in the solo queue. My rank percentile is now over 50% for the first time, at least for now. (Though my win percentage is still a bit shy of that mark.)

Yea Im in NA you will just have to catch me when im on since I dont really play that much anymore. But did you read the comments on the guide to get a better idea of how to play it

Qaelyn.7612:

Rezz, your post is full of unrealistic, trite sloganeering.

I don’t buy into these BS notions that I should just pretend that losing is always my fault when it isn’t. I blame myself when I screw up; I blame my team when they act like morons. And 2/3 of the games I play, there’s a lot more of the latter than the former.

“Never die”? “Adapt to them”? Give me a break. I do adapt to my team behaving stupidly, such as when I’m on a team with players who do a ton of direct damage but they can’t be bothered to get the treb, so I go and get it. But most of the time we lose anyway because they don’t do anything effective in the meantime.

I had one game earlier where I was fighting two players on a point at once for long stretches of time without dying. We still lost. I’m not sure what more it is realistic to expect me to do.

I very often try to discuss tactics before the match. 95% of the time I get no response or the tactics are ignored.

I’m sure my whining is a turn-off for some, but this is the only outlet I have for what has become a very unsatisfying experience. At this point I am only still in PvP out of stubbornness and because I want to raise my rank higher. I always try my best – even when trailing 400-40 – but I cannot make up for 2 or 3 or 4 other people behaving foolishly (or not being present, for that matter.)

If there were a build I really could use to “carry” an entire team, I’d love to know what it is.

I know what you are talking about… not just about being lost in the leaderboards but also with all the troll responses. I lost 14 soloQ matches in a row one day and nearly every time I had 2 or 3x the score contribution than the others lol. The day before I won 8 and lost just 1 game and I was a previous top 100r before ladder reset but due to the lack of bunkers on my team and the amount of morons I have played with that day… I lost a lot of games, but did have a couple close ones… yes only a couple.

And yes, I’m one of those who try to complete all the achievements too that you seemed to support the 6 hour no life system over the previous one that didnt take much time or something and losing that many matches in a day just adds on the hours…

Qaelyn.7612:

Just tried it out in a hotjoin. Utterly and completely clueless, lol. I end up mostly flailing with the axe, I block with the shield and usually get bursted down fairly quickly. Whenever I swap to the bow I end up running backwards in circles spamming the bow without a great deal of effectiveness. Also not sure how to handle thieves, mesmers and other evasive/stealth types, nor when to activate my long-cooldown utilities.

I know it’s me, not the build, and I’m sure it will get better with practice, though if you’re in NA and wouldn’t mind showing me a few pointers that would be most appreciated.

Also.. I find the build rather immobile. Ever consider swapping in Warrior’s Sprint?

In other news, I finally seem to be having a bit more luck in the solo queue. My rank percentile is now over 50% for the first time, at least for now. (Though my win percentage is still a bit shy of that mark.)

did you try long sword + warhorn / long bow, vigorous shouts warrior build? rabid amulet + zerker jewel, soldier runes
0/0/25/30/15
dodged march, cleansing ire
lung capacity, quick breathing, vigorous shouts
signet mastery
healing signet, for grape justice, shake it off, fear me, signet of rage
i use earth runes on both weapons and leech rune on warhorn.

its my casual warrior build.
go try it in hotjoins 5 v 5 or 8 v 8.

it is my casual “team support” build so i go into team fights, build up adrenaline, cover node with 9 seconds fire field, blast area might with long bow 3, swap, warhorn 5 blast area might again, then long sword 2 for own fire shield to flail the sword around like a mad man trying to cut someone.

for grape justice and shake it off have 20 seconds recharge time each due to lung capacity so i use for grape justice to remove single condition while saving shake it off to remove 2 conditions at once. i use warhorn 4 or 5 to convert certain conditions into boons. poison > regeneration, burning > aegis, vulnerability > protection, confusion > retaliation otherwise i just use long bow f1 level 3 adrenaline to remove 3 conditions.

i save fear me! for reviving team mates provided the enemy who is stomping do not have stability or invulnerability.

for downed enemies i do not stomp them, i burn them up with 9 seconds fire field followed by long bow 3 and then lots of long sword 1.

i have “auto targeting” turned off so i use long sword 2 to get around places quicker and to escape from being zerged down as well. sometimes the healing signet passive bugged out when i try to disengage using long sword 2 though.

its not a “god mode” warrior build but i do have casual fun with it in my 8 vs 8 hotjoin sessions. i only tried one round of 5 vs 5 solo arena with it so i do not know how it works inside solo arena. not enough time to play that many rounds.

Some things I’ve read in this thread that I thought I’d spend my 2 cents on:
While being in ELO hell is definitely frustrating, as OP said, if your skill level is better then the average at your bracket, you will eventually climb in positions. It might take 10 or even a 100 matches but eventually you’ll get to the play level you deserve. Hang in there and try to learn as much as you can from each match.

For games that usually end up with 500:350 end result or better, with rare occurrences of leavers/skyhammer dropouts/trolls and what not you want to get to at the very least 80 percentile.

For team carrying, rolling a super duper bursty 1v1 master is probably the worst thing you can do. What you need is a a reliable class that is able to hold its own or has high mobility (or preferably both). Decap engies, gs or sword (or both) warrs, any thief with a bow, and to a lesser extent portal and blink mesmers, bunker guardians, MM necros, hambow warrs, spirit rangers etc.
Why ? Because if you are stuck in Braveheart reenactment the side that has that one sneaky/sturdy guy that plays conquest mode instead of DM will win most of the times.

Alternatively, you can help your team mates romp ‘n’ stomp by rolling full condi necro, HGH grenadier engie or glass cannon staff ele. As a plus, in some maps you can position yourself so that you can intercept someone assaulting a side point.
At low MMR, 9/10 times the opposing team will completely ignore you and the ledge of your choice and happily die to your AoE spam while trying to take out the rest of your team.

Ofc. goes without saying that if your play level has already peaked you won’t see any long term improvements no matter what build or tactics you employ and the real problem might just be you.

Best of luck and may the odds be ever in your favor.

I’m seeing a lot of “Don’t play mesmer” type of comments here. I actually think mesmers are great for solo queue. If you play condition, especially after the Dec 10th buff, you can basically handle any 1v1 on a side node easily and can survive a fairly lengthy amount of time 1v2. Also, mesmers have access to portal which when used correctly can really change the outcome of a fight. Mass invis rez, good condition, utility – a good mesmer can do a lot for a team in solo queue.

Now, there is one class I would probably stay away from in solo queue and that is the thief. Thieves are just hard to play in general. AoE wrecks you, stealth hurts your team and all you have to make up for it is Black powder stomps and high burst damage. Don’t get me wrong, thieves are extremely strong, but in my opinion, they are fairly reliant on your teammates support. Not to mention, a good thief is quite difficult to play (good reaction times, map awareness etc)

As an average solo queue player, the best advice I can give you is just to keep playing. Doesn’t matter what class you play, just pick a build and stick with it for awhile. You play enough, and things such as rating should come naturally… or so everyone says. xD

Rezz.8019:

1….

This dude basicly told you step by step how to get in top 100 and you just say its “troll response” thats why your stuck on 50%, you dont understand how kitten works.
I cant play all the time so due to inactivity i climb from 90% to top 100 every other week, and till you get top 100 where people know what their doing its always about how hard you can carry and how good you can fix your teams mistakes.

Leeto.1570:

Rezz.8019:

1….

This dude basicly told you step by step how to get in top 100 and you just say its “troll response” thats why your stuck on 50%, you dont understand how kitten works.

^^ I Agree with the above statement

Osi.3504:

I know what you are talking about… not just about being lost in the leaderboards but also with all the troll responses. I lost 14 soloQ matches in a row one day and nearly every time I had 2 or 3x the score contribution than the others lol. The day before I won 8 and lost just 1 game and I was a previous top 100r before ladder reset but due to the lack of bunkers on my team and the amount of morons I have played with that day… I lost a lot of games, but did have a couple close ones… yes only a couple.

And yes, I’m one of those who try to complete all the achievements too that you seemed to support the 6 hour no life system over the previous one that didnt take much time or something and losing that many matches in a day just adds on the hours…

The matchmaking doesnt work properly at off peak hours, and even in peak hours when it has as much people queueing as posible sometimes it doesn’t work either.
If u lose 3 matches in a row the best advice anyone can give (and it comes from experience) is to stop playing and go play something else or watch a movie or whatever. But since u need the achievement points, well, u are screwed and u will need to suffer this pain again and again (i’m glad i can stop after losing 3 matches in a row).

Thanks for the replies.

Clint: I’ll read the thread again and try to pick up some tips.

Deimos: Tried something like that but found it very passive and didn’t do much damage. I could hold a point for a while but couldn’t take one. Again, most of that is likely my lack of experience. I will try it again.

Leeto: No, he didn’t. Blaming me for all my losses is just as irrational as me blaming my team for all my losses (which I don’t do). Sometimes we just lose because the other team was better, and I say “nice try guys” in team chat and move on. And telling someone to “never die” – while simultaneously telling me to run a zerker build, no less – is not advice, it’s sloganeering.

I always find it funny when people pretend that one player can carry an entire team. If this were true, I’d expect to find fairly regular occurrences where a team in a 4v5 wins anyway because 1 of those 4 is so uber he makes up for losing the 5th. Yet not only doesn’t this happen regularly to me, I’ve never been on a team that did it once. So while I’m sure some builds can carry more than others, I reject the suggestion that I personally can make up for a team of bad players.

Others: Thanks for the kind words, it’s possible the tide is turning so I will try to take the losses in stride and keep at it.

I haven’t tried using portal yet, I will have to tinker with that. I can see it being useful, though it does take a precious slot and has a long CD.

If you are in the black hole (the lower half of the % zone) the only thing you can do to climb up is play an extremely mobility oriented class who can easily dispatch bad players in 1v1 situations (reads, thief).
Don’t cap points, contest them, this way you will earn a time advantage and you’ll be able to exploit your superior mobility even more.
Don’t engage outnumbered fights hoping that your teammates will do something valuable in the meantime, always disengage fights that you can’t win within 10 seconds.
Play dirty, a dishonorable victory is better than an honorable defeat, i can’t tell you exactly what i mean but you can ask around and find out.
Play a build that’s forgiving but still punish bad players: dagger pistol can be fun at times but it is too much error prone, sword dagger is surely cool for duels but it takes too long to kill soldier amulet users with it, sword pistol is the way to go here.
Ping the map: sometimes your teammates will zerg around in a solid pack of 4 players, pinging the map can be an effective way to tell the zergball where to go (hold shift and click on the minimap).

Lastly, know when to stop. If you already lost 3 games in a row it is extremely unlikely that you will win 3 to even up, wait until the next score calculation and then try again. Keep in mind that a win streak after a loss streak is always better than alternating the two of them.

Edit: and if all else fails, you can type “all is vain” in map chat and have a laugh

Rezz.8019:

4. Do not expect the team to adapt to you. You have to adapt to them.

Problem is this applies for your whole team.

Most of the time, at all levels, you lose because all 5 players can’t adapt one to another. When this happens, you might see people running around not knowing where they could go to actually help and not get killed.

However, I see what you mean: if the team loses, it’s everyone’s fault and no one has the right to blame you, but you alone can make the difference.

Then, it might be me. I realize I haven’t played many matches (100, 150) and many times I make stupid mistakes (miss-clicking and failing to interrupt a stomper, for example) and realize right away what I made and what I should have done in order to prevent it. On the other hand, I’m starting to learn where to go and when to leave the fight as it is, and when to ress (when I can ress someone before the stomper finishes his animation) and when to stomp. IMHO practice makes perfect, for you have to obtain good and fast decision making.

About carrying the team… I’ve seen people having success by roaming side points exploiting the common habit of concentrating most energies on mid. What do you think?

And what do you mean by helping your team? Something simple like good aoe skills/cc or teamfight capability and ress/stomp experience or something more like support-oriented builds?

Qaelyn.7612:

Just tried it out in a hotjoin. Utterly and completely clueless, lol. I end up mostly flailing with the axe, I block with the shield and usually get bursted down fairly quickly. Whenever I swap to the bow I end up running backwards in circles spamming the bow without a great deal of effectiveness. Also not sure how to handle thieves, mesmers and other evasive/stealth types, nor when to activate my long-cooldown utilities.

Remember, hotjoin is a mess. Always avoid 8v8.

And also remember even Axe autoattack can be deadly. But you need to remember you have to choose your ground carefully and force enemies on narrow points in order for it to land.

Soloq is hotjoin with better rewards, if you want to work on your ranking on a leaderboard just do Teamq.

Class does matter I think.

My win percentage went way up with a bunker war versus my skirmish thief.

On my thief I could always get a ton of kills, which didn’t really amount to much in the end. But on the warrior I’m always just holding points which ends up winning the match more often than not.

If you can use a build that can reliably bunk mid then you can move way up in the leaderboards I think. That’s if you can consistently keep the point when it’s 1v2 against you. If you can hold it 1v2 for like 20 seconds reinforcement will come eventually and that can allow you to successfully hold mid.

Team that holds mid for extended period of time usually wins in my experience.

Excalibur.9748:

Class does matter I think.

My win percentage went way up with a bunker war versus my skirmish thief.

On my thief I could always get a ton of kills, which didn’t really amount to much in the end. But on the warrior I’m always just holding points which ends up winning the match more often than not.

If you can use a build that can reliably bunk mid then you can move way up in the leaderboards I think. That’s if you can consistently keep the point when it’s 1v2 against you. If you can hold it 1v2 for like 20 seconds reinforcement will come eventually and that can allow you to successfully hold mid.

Team that holds mid for extended period of time usually wins in my experience.

You’ll increase your win rate because bunkers are always important.

Same with Bunker guardians, for example.

Problem is you aren’t pushed to learn that much about tourney pvp, IMHO.

I’ve found myself to learn more as a roamer.

Excalibur.9748:

Class does matter I think.

My win percentage went way up with a bunker war versus my skirmish thief.

On my thief I could always get a ton of kills, which didn’t really amount to much in the end. But on the warrior I’m always just holding points which ends up winning the match more often than not.

If you can use a build that can reliably bunk mid then you can move way up in the leaderboards I think. That’s if you can consistently keep the point when it’s 1v2 against you. If you can hold it 1v2 for like 20 seconds reinforcement will come eventually and that can allow you to successfully hold mid.

Team that holds mid for extended period of time usually wins in my experience.

I find carrying my team easier on my thief. I still reroll to guard bunker if the team needs it, otherwise I stick to thief.

Coulter.2315:

Soloq is hotjoin with better rewards, if you want to work on your ranking on a leaderboard just do Teamq.

See I won’t do that on a new character, I don’t think it’s fair to my potential teammates.

But I do recognize that hotjoin isn’t really of much relevance to tournament play. I try for 5v5s but even there half the time it’s stupid zerging.

I’ll try the bunker warrior thing again. But I find 2 players can take me down pretty fast.. might just need practice.

Qaelyn tip for ye: start mentally slowing down the pace of a fight when you are 1v1, you already know your skills, so take your eyes away from them and focus on the enemy.

What class is he? What build is he running? What can he do with that build?

Most builds have a go-to must dodge skill. Its what makes them tick. Hambow is pindown and earthshaker, for example.

Use every dodge wisely and not spam. Know how much damage can your build do, or how much sustain does it have.

Hope this can help you a little bit more.

Quickfoot Katana.8642:

Most builds have a go-to must dodge skill. Its what makes them tick. Hambow is pindown and earthshaker, for example.

Pin Down is hard to dodge, because has only 0.25 seconds cast time. And you can tell it from an AA only when the animation ended. Only times when my Pin Down got evaded was when I used it on targets who were already dodging.

But I agree with you, by adding: be ready to either dodge or generally react to a skill. In general, be prepared.

AKA: when you are immobilized, be ready to blind the warrior/block/teleport/whatever defensive thing your build offers (if it has some).

Great advice, thanks.

In fact, one of the things I am working on is remaining more in control of combat. One reason I started PvP was that I would panic when attacked in WvW, and that’s much better now. But I still tend to play somewhat reactively, circling around and trying to toss a lot of attacks around without paying as much attention to the opponent as I should. I can see this is where experience comes in.. and I also have 3 or 4 classes I really don’t know at all and so can’t really counter from knowledge.

The largest difference between the people at the top of the board and those at the bottom in my opinion is knowing when to disengage. Given your response to the dont die comment I think you still dont fully understand this vital part of conquest. The only time contesting a point is the correct choice is when you can hold it for longer than it would take that point to give the other team 5 points plus your time to return to the fight.

I’ve seen alot of people suggest playing a thief and this is probably the reason why as they are the best class at quickly winning a 1-1, moving between the points while your team zergs and most importantly disengaging when dying means giving the other team a leg up. This is what most lower mmr teams lack. If my team did’nt allready have a thief I would change to mine regularly and this was at higher mmr levels.( I played a duo s/d theif, very good at taking points and moving around the map. Also very good at spiking at mid and not being rally fodder).

Engineer is also good at this allthough they dont generally speaking have the same spike ability. Another good way to help a low mmr team is by being a beast mid bunker player since the zerg will generally go there and if you can turn the tide and have 1 other player who understands map mechanics you’ll win more than you’ll lose.

I understand these are easier said than done things but the first step is understanding what dying really means to the score as most new players I see think they are helping their team when they contest a point vrs 2 players for 20 seconds when in reality they are not. They would be better off helping their team win what ever fight is closest and then coming back when there is’nt a fight they can not win at the point they just left.

Hope that helps as for me when I realized this vital fact what I was able to bring to my team greatly increased.

I’m sorry, but I think the advice Rezz gave is naive.

The win does not depend totally on you in 80% of SoloQ matches. It’s Conquest. You are 1/5 of the team. You cannot be everywhere at once.

As far as dying, if you engage, you are going to die regularly. If you hang back, you are not helping. If you cap a point and just safely run away, how many points do you gain for your team before they recap it?

If your team’s health bars are constantly dropping to zero, you cannot save each of them all by yourself.

That is a fantasy. And I think anyone who has played hundreds of matches will eventually understand that.

Players who WANT to feel “uber” need to believe that fantasy. But the truth is…you really don’t matter as much as you might like to think. Team ability, team class composition, team strategy, smart point rotations…these all matter more.

That is what I have observed.

Silentshoes.1805:

I’m sorry, but I think the advice Rezz gave is naive.

The win does not depend totally on you in 80% of SoloQ matches. It’s Conquest. You are 1/5 of the team. You cannot be everywhere at once.

But if u always die far 1v2 or afk and u loose it is 100% you fault of you that u loose.
Why even one Person can loose the game for his Team , but u are not able to carry the game alone? so sad

Pasman.8740:

Silentshoes.1805:

I’m sorry, but I think the advice Rezz gave is naive.

The win does not depend totally on you in 80% of SoloQ matches. It’s Conquest. You are 1/5 of the team. You cannot be everywhere at once.

But if u always die far 1v2 or afk and u loose it is 100% you fault of you that u loose.
Why even one Person can loose the game for his Team , but u are not able to carry the game alone? so sad

IMHO we should leave the issue about a team of people who are neither coordinated, and maybe not incredibly good, but are actually TRYING to win.

In that situation maybe you can make the difference, and make their job easier.

I think the truth is somewhere in the middle. Saying that one should never die is definitely oversimplified nonsense, but it’s true that “going down in a blaze of glory” is often selfish and pointless. And I am definitely getting better at realizing when trying to fight would be futile and a waste of time and resources.

In other news, just hit rank 30. Still losing most of my matches, especially in team queue.

I agree with silentshoe. Strategy and team actually executing it and doing it well is what’s important to win.