Guild Wars 2

been gettin served in tpvp all day by portal spamming. with no way to counter this, im gonna have to call it ridiculously OP

As a Mesmer player since Beta, I’ve actually swapped to the Engineer because I was sick of the profession being flavour of the month. I also hate that the profession is a requirement in Khylo because of portal. A simple fix would be to stop the repair kit from entering a portal. As for fixing the skill, I’d probably just remove it from the game.

portals make all point capture maps irrelevant.

nerva.7940:

portals make all point capture maps irrelevant.

+ switching items from your inventory for swiftness buff is kind of same.. (but less dangerous)

Mesmers are one of the few classes with no speed buff skill passive or active.

While other classes have access to said speed buff.. Mesmers have to open inventory and equip a kitten weapon… just to get runbuff then switch back to real weapon and really fast cause you dont wanna get stuck in pvp with focus weapon (I know Ive read some WvWers do like focus weapon. kthx)

Yeah switching weapon is kinda lame/unfriendly trick, if you dont macro it.
But maybe its just another clue at class balance issue.
Some classes need to use weird workaround to achieve same results as other classes that get it for free.

And runspeed in pvp = a must.

ehtom.5047:

mesmer full shatter combo (which is somewhat avoidable too) is around 10k damage.

Zerker gear/divinity and 20% mind wrack damage and IP trait I can get up to a bit over 8k damage.

I was including duelist unload and sword strikes when I said “full shatter combo”. Basically i’m saying entire mesmer burst is around 10k, which is less than 1 thief skill.

Yes the whole discussion about mesmer’s mega damage is ridiculous. I win vs warriors because I play my defenses perfectly. Not because I have any real damage. You wanna see real damage? Let a warrior/thief get near you.

I also hope they disallow bringing the repair bundle through the portal. Then thieves will be the ones who “have” to man the treb and I won’t.

It seems to me the greatest reason why there are ‘nerf mesmer’ threads is the lack of desire for people (and perhaps teams) to play AoE specs. When I play an AoE necro I don’t find mesmers nearly as hard because i’m destroying the clones and phantasms soon after they are created. You would think with all the “Ai Wars” comments that have been made that more people would have gravitated to layering AoE spec’s in order to counter this, but I still don’t see it. I’m not sure if people have even tried it.

I don’t think that anyone can deny the fact that Mesmers need a nerf; the problem is that the nerf needs to be balanced and that the class can remain viable even after those nerfs are implemented; I do understand the fact that a lot of people would like to see the class nerfed to the ground, and I personally see the problems with the class, so I would like to make a few suggestions.

Portal CD be increased from 60r → 90r

Mindwrack damage increase trait “Mental Torment” be decreased from 20% increase damage to 10%.

Distortion no longer takes into account the amount of illusions you have active, but be a flat 1 second invulnerable.

Decoy no longer makes the mesmer invisible but instead blinks the mesmer back 900 units spawning an illusion in his place; this can also be applied to the trait “Desperate Decoy”.

I feel like those would be fair nerfs at the moment to mesmers, given the fact that over nerfs are very popular now a days.

People trying to distract the discussions from the OPness of Mesmer portals and shatters.

So okay, yes Backstab thieves are OP too. That doesn’t mean Mesmers are not. Nerf them both by all means.

Mesmers need portals because they have no swiftness? Then sure, give them some swiftness skill and remove/nerf portals.

Shatter is the only decent build? Then I’m happy for the other builds to get a buff, as long as the OP build gets a substantial nerf.

@Xeph: I dont think they will change decoy and desperate decoy. Stealth is a feature of the class and it will really annoy lots of people if it is just deleted. You should think of a different change instead of this one.

Also they need to buff confusion/condition/support mesmer builds substantially imo. Mesmers need a viable condition spec which at the moment they dont have due to confusion being unviable as a primary damage source.

Xeph.4513:

I don’t think that anyone can deny the fact that Mesmers need a nerf; the problem is that the nerf needs to be balanced and that the class can remain viable even after those nerfs are implemented; I do understand the fact that a lot of people would like to see the class nerfed to the ground, and I personally see the problems with the class, so I would like to make a few suggestions.

Portal CD be increased from 60r -> 90r

Mindwrack damage increase trait “Mental Torment” be decreased from 20% increase damage to 10%.

Distortion no longer takes into account the amount of illusions you have active, but be a flat 1 second invulnerable.

Decoy no longer makes the mesmer invisible but instead blinks the mesmer back 900 units spawning an illusion in his place; this can also be applied to the trait “Desperate Decoy”.

I feel like those would be fair nerfs at the moment to mesmers, given the fact that over nerfs are very popular now a days.

Portal Cd- I can understand putting a longer cd on it, it would balance things out quite a bit.

Mental Torment- 10% decrease I also don’t see a problem with that sounds reasonable

Distortion Nerf- This I do have a problem with, I think if you have three clones then you deserve to gain the benefits from the spell the way it is.

Decoy Nerf- Your idea completely negates what decoy was designed to do and should probably never be messed with. It’s good as is. It shouldn’t be a vamped up version of phase retreat.

As a whole I think Mesmer’s are a pretty complete class, I think A-net needs to kink out all the bugs with every characters before we even look at the big picture as far as nerfs go when it comes to any class in this point in time.

While Mesmers could probably use some nerfs most suggestions are just going to result in the profession being made obsolete or not really having any impact at all. In order to balance mesmers right you need to have a design plan other than “nerf the broken stuff”.

First we need to decide just what a mesmer is supposed to do and how they should be played. Once we do that it’s a lot easier to see where the problems are.

Next we need to make sure mesmers have a unique strength. They have to provide a meaningful advantage that no other profession can.

Finally they need an exploitable weakness. The weakness must be unique to the profession and severe enough so mesmer players can’t ignore or trivialize it.

So here’s how I would fix mesmers:

Mesmer’s Role/Play style

A Mesmer’s job is to waste their opponent’s time and resources by tricking them into attacking their illusions. Illusions don’t deal damage, but players will still see numbers from the illusion’s attacks making them very convincing to unwary opponents. If defeated illusions will apply debuffs to the target(s) that damaged them or buffs to nearby allies.

Mesmer’s Weakness

A mesmser’s weakness is their opponents competence. A mesmer player must be aware of how their target is responding to their illusions and tricks and not behave in any way that would draw attention to themselves. Mesmers have no defense outside of their mind games.

Here are some sample rebalanced mesmer skills:

Mirror Images: Summons an illusion that mimics your movements and attacks, but with a slight delay. If defeated you and nearby allies gain protection and might for 10 seconds. If it is not defeated after 10 seconds the illusion will vanish and you become weakened for 5 seconds.

Feedback: Creates a small dome that reflects all damage taken. You or one of your illusions must remain inside the dome for this effect to occur.

Chaos Armor (Staff): Give Chaos Armor to yourself and your illusions. Reducing all damage taken, but causing unpredictable effects to yourself whenever you or your illusions are struck.

Moa Morph: Summons a friendly unstable Moa Spirit. The spirit will slowly chase down your target increasing in speed each time one of your illusions is destroyed. If the spirit makes contact with a foe they will turn into a Moa Bird for 5 minutes. If the spirit does not make contact with a foe after 10 seconds it will become hostile and instantly return to you. The effects of Moa Morph persist through death.

Ether Feast (Heal Skill): Heal Yourself. Gain additional health for each active illusion. Using this skill causes you to glow for 3 seconds.

You can’t balance PvP around numbers or individual abilities, only systems and play styles. Otherwise you’ll just be playing FoTM Whac-A-Mole with the professions, and that’s terrible.

Boloth.6879:

While Mesmers could probably use some nerfs most suggestions are just going to result in the profession being made obsolete or not really having any impact at all. In order to balance mesmers right you need to have a design plan other than “nerf the broken stuff”.

First we need to decide just what a mesmer is supposed to do and how they should be played. Once we do that it’s a lot easier to see where the problems are.

Next we need to make sure mesmers have a unique strength. They have to provide a meaningful advantage that no other profession can.

Finally they need an exploitable weakness. The weakness must be unique to the profession and severe enough so mesmer players can’t ignore or trivialize it.

So here’s how I would fix mesmers:

Mesmer’s Role/Play style

A Mesmer’s job is to waste their opponent’s time and resources by tricking them into attacking their illusions. Illusions don’t deal damage, but players will still see numbers from the illusion’s attacks making them very convincing to unwary opponents. If defeated illusions will apply debuffs to the target(s) that damaged them or buffs to nearby allies.

Mesmer’s Weakness

A mesmser’s weakness is their opponents competence. A mesmer player must be aware of how their target is responding to their illusions and tricks and not behave in any way that would draw attention to themselves. Mesmers have no defense outside of their mind games.

Here are some sample rebalanced mesmer skills:

Mirror Images: Summons an illusion that mimics your movements and attacks, but with a slight delay. If defeated you and nearby allies gain protection and might for 10 seconds. If it is not defeated after 10 seconds the illusion will vanish and you become weakened for 5 seconds.

Feedback: Creates a small dome that reflects all damage taken. You or one of your illusions must remain inside the dome for this effect to occur.

Chaos Armor (Staff): Give Chaos Armor to yourself and your illusions. Reducing all damage taken, but causing unpredictable effects to yourself whenever you or your illusions are struck.

Moa Morph: Summons a friendly unstable Moa Spirit. The spirit will slowly chase down your target increasing in speed each time one of your illusions is destroyed. If the spirit makes contact with a foe they will turn into a Moa Bird for 5 minutes. If the spirit does not make contact with a foe after 10 seconds it will become hostile and instantly return to you. The effects of Moa Morph persist through death.

Ether Feast (Heal Skill): Heal Yourself. Gain additional health for each active illusion. Using this skill causes you to glow for 3 seconds.

You can’t balance PvP around numbers or individual abilities, only systems and play styles. Otherwise you’ll just be playing FoTM Whac-A-Mole with the professions, and that’s terrible.

Probably the worst Ideas I have ever read. Oh and illusions can deal damage if spec’d into the right traits. Please understand a class before you post.

Oh and what trait are you talking about ?
I hope its not the 58 dmg bleed on crit :p

CeCaKonVeu.5734:

Oh and what trait are you talking about ?
I hope its not the 58 dmg bleed on crit :p

More like 90-100 damage on crit :P It adds up.

I think xeph actually has good suggestions. The only things i’d alter about it are distortion (if it’s only going to be 1s immunity you might as well replace it) and decoy… I’d do what he suggested but apply stealth to the mesmer for .5-1s so that it can remove marking. Maybe even make decoy ground targeted, but then it’s just a beefed up blink, which honestly even with the way he proposed it is an issue.

Before nerfing they should fix broken skills/traits

Take phase retreat, it was perfect except rare bug into the ground….But last update changed it not sure why …
Now I feel lame everytime I press Phase Retreat cause its just a cheat… Need to fix/remove it asap

Odaman.8359:

I think xeph actually has good suggestions. The only things i’d alter about it are distortion (if it’s only going to be 1s immunity you might as well replace it) and decoy… I’d do what he suggested but apply stealth to the mesmer for .5-1s so that it can remove marking. Maybe even make decoy ground targeted, but then it’s just a beefed up blink, which honestly even with the way he proposed it is an issue.

Decoy is fine as is

ehtom.5047:

@Xeph: I dont think they will change decoy and desperate decoy. Stealth is a feature of the class and it will really annoy lots of people if it is just deleted. You should think of a different change instead of this one.

Also they need to buff confusion/condition/support mesmer builds substantially imo. Mesmers need a viable condition spec which at the moment they dont have due to confusion being unviable as a primary damage source.

I’m probably one of the best example’s of a hybrid condition shatter mesmer. But you figure out how to do it on your own, my lips are sealed.

there are condition builds which you can make. They are simply massively inferior to power builds.

ehtom.5047:

there are condition builds which you can make. They are simply massively inferior to power builds.

A difference in opinion

Wait, there’s an OP mesmer build? Why am I not using this?

Moa Morph: Summons a friendly unstable Moa Spirit. The spirit will slowly chase down your target increasing in speed each time one of your illusions is destroyed. If the spirit makes contact with a foe they will turn into a Moa Bird for 5 minutes. If the spirit does not make contact with a foe after 10 seconds it will become hostile and instantly return to you. The effects of Moa Morph persist through death.

Haha that’s the most kitten kitten I’ve read in a while, thanks for the chuckle. I mean, being CCed for 5 MINUTES that persists through death is completely balanced ability in a competetive setting right? 5 minutes of 4v5, it’s like hockey. Hey, can we get red cards from football in too? One guy gets driven out of the match and your team has to play the next map 4v5 too, absolutely balanced.

My suggestion for the Moa. Change it by “Friends and Foes Trick”.
Your friends become enemies and you arent able to attack the enemy team for 6 secs.
Much more fun and a great counter to brainless button spammers. I would like to see a tricked thief heartseeking his own team haha.

i would like to see mesmer change in mechanic. While clones should only distract and not be source of damage.

so in my point of view, decrease the damage cooming from shatters / illusions and buff the damage mesmer actually do.

Just delete mesmers, nobody will miss them.

From 100 tournament finals you meet mesmers in 97 games. If portals wasn’t enough, their ridiculously huge dmg burst comes second and all of their ultimates (moa/time wrap/ even the invis field) are utterly game changing and can make your team win the usually 4v4 battle at mid. Compare these 3 ultis to elementalist ulti and go laugh in some corner.

Played a thief and met a mesmer…..either the thief is a glass cannon build which is sometimes too strong or it is a more balanced thief build with more toughness and they struggle.

Thief:

1660 Toughnes
2727 Armor
17242 Health Points

This is what I did dish out against the mesmer:
http://img6.imagebanana.com/img/v5hrz1wh/gw120.jpg

This is what I have to take from him:
http://img6.imagebanana.com/img/blz9r2lp/gw119.jpg

Getting hit hard from Ilussions alone and their crits, plus the mesmers own melee crits and the shutter……

And the best is that cloak and dagger doesnt work sometimes for me to daze him……dont know if this is lag or if this is a bug.

For what does the class needs MOA with such high damage capabilities ?

Was Guildwars 2 made in China, missing quality.

In my opinion the portals need a drastic change in tPvP. It is too powerful to ‘exploit’. I see portals as a way to trivialize strategy by being able to bounce between points. I know it is a strategy within itself to use portal to travel, but it is too much. I would go as suggest to remove portal from pvp until an idea of how it can be changed is out.

Or simply make portal in pvp to have much less distance.