Guild Wars 2

Dodging while immobilized doesn’t make sense. However immobilized should be looked at. Dimishing returns when stacking with three stacks max, or no stacking.

I think there is 2 things what not balanced and never will be in this or any other game: pets and stealth

[Quote]General Balance:
- Being able to dodge while immobilized
[/quote]

Most kittened idea i’ve seen in a while.

What would be better :
Remove immobilize stacking, cannot use evade abilities while immobilized, reduce some of the long duration immobilizes. Make immobilize not scale with condition duration.

And about lyssa, ok idea but i think having it convert all conditions into boons would be better.

Engineer:
Automated Response, better give it like 5sec condition immunity but at 25% hp but iwth 90sec cd.
Or a full cleanse at 25% hp but with 90sec cd.

Thief:
Good ideas, maybe add:
Consume conditions grant all boons beside stability and aegis.

Else pretty good post, especially on game modes.

And about lyssa, ok idea but i think having it convert all conditions into boons would be better.

I definitely like this version of lyssa runes.

Something that I really want to see increase is the Healing Breeze which is one of the guardian heal.
I personally don’t use it that much (never in tourney cause Schelter is op).
I would like to see his allies heal increase and why not giving protection during the heal cast and for the allies that get healed.

Appreciate that you are thinking about how to improve tpvp.

But you have started this thread on the wrong time, not sure if you follow what ANet is currently doing, maybe try to watch the Ready Up Show sometimes.

They are currently working on Game Modes, they are working on more balancing stuff, and since a lot of it will be implemented in the next big feature patch, they are (at least almost) finished with everything, and therefore your post is complete useless.
Balance-wise they’ll change so many things, that we have to play and test them out first, before we should make assumptions.

Just wait till we get more infos about the upcoming changes, and then post your opinion on them. In the meantime take part in the CDI-threads.

Mrbig.8019:

HPLT.7132:

Also in the current state your are not stunned for the whole time of PW. I think he meant that the stun duration is exchanged by an equal immobilise duration.

This is actually worse because you have 20% more condi duration, something that doesn’t count with stun.

Inf strike is already 1 secs and 1/4, add pw and it’s 2 secs neat.

If you remove 0.5 secs cast time from PW you have 1.5 secs immo.

Exactly PW flurry duration.

Every time you IS-PW, your opponent, with nag “genius” suggestion, would be immo for the whole duration of PW ( with the great allegiance of immo stacking of course).

This is a beyond terrible suggestion, and i’m telling this as a thief.

All those critics, which go in the same direction as the quoted one, miss the point, that olli also suggested, that you can dodge while immobilized. I think in that case the PW change might be ok.
The “dodge-while-immo-change” would also solve the Unfairness, that some classes have dodges on their weaponsets, which already allow them to dodge while immobilized.

Thus said, I think it is better to just revert the folowing changes that anet made:
- revert the buff to initiative reg
- revert the buff to PW
- remove immobilize stacking

In Addition to that:
- reduce burning and bleed damage per tick/intensity
- Berserker Stance, AR, Diamond Skin changed to: increase your damage for 10% per each condition on you.

The problem with your suggestions for increasing the number of gamemodes in pvp is that there isn’t sufficient player base. The queues would become longer and result in more people sitting around twiddling their thumbs than actually pvping. It’s simply too late for ANet to get their act together unless they throw hundreds of thousands into pvp (which is very kitten unlikely). The game has wonderful mechanics and looks aethetically pleasing. It’s a real shame that the state of pvp has come to a point in which the monkeys put on a show once a week and talk about balance. It is all a game of let’s dangle a carrot in front of the donkey.

The development of the game is so slow I predict that it won’t be until late this year (December) before we see a new gamemode. If we do see a new gamemode before then it’ll be extremely unpolished and broken.

The carrot simply gets larger and further away, the suggestions that are required to keep this game from eventually going under would require more resources being put into pvp. Which we all know won’t happen because there isn’t any money in gw2 esports.

I used to love this game and now I simply read the reddit sub thread and have a gander at the pvp section to see if I’ve missed something. Oh wait I haven’t for the past 6 or so months. I’m just going to laugh when this “game changing” patch comes out which we’ve been waiting for for god knows how long for and it being a flop. Best case scenario is that it bring people back to pvp who will play for a few days/couple of weeks and be like this really hasn’t inspired me to play again.

Tldr: Read the above and summarise it yourself, you lazy monkey.

Edit: Adding image for emphasis

Adam.6047:

The problem with your suggestions for increasing the number of gamemodes in pvp is that there isn’t sufficient player base.

The player base is so low because of the leak of gamemodes and balance . Bring new gamemodes and you have more players. Make fights more fun (balance ) and the player base grows

Good ideas overall, but the dodge while immobilized thing ? I don’t see any logical reason for that. Maybe i’m missing something, but IMO, imobilisation isn’t that hard to deal with, in the current state of the game, and doesn’t seem game breaking.

If you are able to dodge while immobilised some stuff should also be considered. For example S/D Thiefs have access to incredible dodge chains. A change like this would be a buff to a still viable build, which dominated the meta some month ago. Also some classes rely on immobilise in order to hit their skills. I would rather see immobilise not be stackable anymore actually than that your are able to dodge while immobilise (considering that some skillshot can already be used to evade like ranger shortbow 3, thief dodge heal etc.)

Maverick Holix.1382:

I think Mr. Big missed the suggestion about being able to dodge while immob.

On a side note my neighbors dog is named Mr. Big, hes a bulldog.

Yeah i forgot to add that this is also a terrible suggestion, that makes even less sense from a physics standpoint.

It’s fine for immobilize to be stronger than stuns because it’s a lot less present among all weapon sets.

Pin down is already broken.

Adding 2 immo in the same weapon set for THIEVES is like the worse thing that could happen to this game after dumbfire patch.

At least till immo stacking is still in game.

Even without immo stacking, it would be terrible design to have 2 skills that are commonly chained to share the same condition which doesn’t stack, overwriting themselves.

Reason why this is not the way to go with PW.

BTW go thank your neighbours, they know how to pun.

Lupanic.6502:

Adam.6047:

The problem with your suggestions for increasing the number of gamemodes in pvp is that there isn’t sufficient player base.

The player base is so low because of the leak of gamemodes and balance . Bring new gamemodes and you have more players. Make fights more fun (balance ) and the player base grows

Pls tell me again about the amazing variety of gamemodes that LoL offers to its players.

Lupanic.6502:

The player base is so low because of the leak of gamemodes and balance . Bring new gamemodes and you have more players. Make fights more fun (balance ) and the player base grows

All they have to do is make pvp provide a reward that can be used in PvE or WvW and you will see an influx of players.

Free bump for a great post by a experienced and good player

I just wanted to add : GIVE US CASTBARS this would make this game so much better and kills random dodge/interrupt/(insert)…. → Nobody likes random mechanics!

Vuh.1328:

General Balance:
- Being able to dodge while immobilized

Most kittened idea i’ve seen in a while.

There was allot of talk way back when, when people actually thought Anet would make the game competitive.
Towards that end, it would fit, immobilize should allow dodge rolling.

Allot of the issue is that immobilize is generally badly telegraphed so you have to rely on condi removal, allot, to deal with it.
Conditions, well I should say, condition removal isn’t setup to deal with conditions as they are. In skills and traits, condi removal is on long CDs or passive and not setup to be in every (or even most) specs. That means it is made to deal with conditions that are a lil’ rare, or that are minor trade-offs if not cleansed, like ‘remove this or get kited easier’ like ‘remove this or have a lil longer CDs’… not ‘remove this or get hard CC’d’. What immobilize ends up being is an easier to apply, better hard-CC than actual hard CCs (goes through stability and is, allot of the time, tougher to break because cover-condis and imob always being removed last) A step towards making the game more competitive would be to fix conditions, a step towards fixing conditions would be to allow dodge rolling while immobilized.

I mean, sure, you could do it the other way, make immobilize be less of an impact, but that whole deal is a long gray argument… way back when what I saw was that most people were leaning towards just fixing condis (mainly because condi dps sucks balls to fight).

So, I mean, his idea isn’t kittened, just dated.

Liewec.2896:

a survivor!
we thought you’d all been deleted like the rewards!

You win!

JonathanSharp.7094:

Awesome post Olli. Especially the points on new game modes. Definitely some cool ideas in there.

Incoming Moba Style Gamemode.

Creeps: range=Skritts/Melee=ooze/Bunkers=Risen Ambomination.
Towers: Mini-Conduit-Towers shooting Orb of Light projectile (Guardian Staff #2).
Wild life: Wild wolfes/Earth Elemental/Shade/(important ones=)Grub/Lupicus.
Playable Characters: Races/Ice Golem/Small Wolf of Modniir/Centaur/Harpy/more.

\o/ lets do it.

wow almost had to cry because your points are so nice but i know none of them will ever come…

garethh.3518:

Allot of the issue is that immobilize is generally badly telegraphed so you have to rely on condi removal, allot, to deal with it. […] What immobilize ends up being is an easier to apply, better hard-CC than actual hard CCs (goes through stability and is, allot of the time, tougher to break because cover-condis and imob always being removed last)

There are other means of dealing with immobilization other than condition removal, which is the huge difference between hard cc and immob condition.

Three second blocks usually deal with any immob landing on a person, you can re-position yourself with a teleport. You can use invulnerability skills. You can use weapon evasion skills – which act much like using a 3 second block. You can do a counter knockdown or daze. There are other means to deal with immob primarily because it doesn’t prevent you from using your skills. The crazy part is when you get immobed for longer than 2 to 3 seconds without any requirement on team co-ordination.

it basically comes down to build variety. for a year and a half, i havent had the tools to customize any prof to my playstyle while remaining viable.

Mrbig.8019:

Maverick Holix.1382:

I think Mr. Big missed the suggestion about being able to dodge while immob.

On a side note my neighbors dog is named Mr. Big, hes a bulldog.

Yeah i forgot to add that this is also a terrible suggestion, that makes even less sense from a physics standpoint.

It’s fine for immobilize to be stronger than stuns because it’s a lot less present among all weapon sets.

Pin down is already broken.

Adding 2 immo in the same weapon set for THIEVES is like the worse thing that could happen to this game after dumbfire patch.

At least till immo stacking is still in game.

Even without immo stacking, it would be terrible design to have 2 skills that are commonly chained to share the same condition which doesn’t stack, overwriting themselves.

Reason why this is not the way to go with PW.

BTW go thank your neighbours, they know how to pun.

Mr Big is correct. Those two immobilize changes are just stupid

Olli.6137:

Mrbig.8019:

Serron.5498:

Mrbig.8019:

Thief change would make PW less strong for ress control BUT totally broken in any other situation.

Steal-inf strike-PW would be unavoidable, full damage.

Inf strike-PW alone would be enough to eat 10 k + damage.

PW being broken is more of Ini regen related than stun or whatver else.

Moreover it would make protection injection totally worthless, and any thief would be able to kill engies with no problem, while actually engi is the only real counter to thieves ( overall, not only S/P).

How can a thief of your caliber even think about this dumb change is beyond me, immobilize is already stronger than any possible stun aside maybe for ress control.

PW balance is clearly off, and i really have no idea how to fix it without making it more broken or totally useless without redesigning it totally.

Well, lets list the differences between stun and immobilize:

Immobilize stops you from moving
Immobilize stops you from dodging
Immobilize can be stacked

Stun stops you from moving
Stun stops you from dodging
Stun interrupts you
Stun Prevents you from casting skills

You can remove immobilize much more easily than a stun.
Stability does not protect you from Immobilize, but there are other ways to be immune from conditions.

From this I’d say immobilize, same duration as the stun from pistolwhip as of now, replacing the stun would be a nerf, not a buff. Stacking the immobilize would make no difference here,with another immobilize you are already immobilized through the pw.

Also, no need to be so aggressive.

Stability is your friend.

Stun can be stunbroke.

Do i even need to list how few skills remove conditions istantly ? and if they will EVER remove immobilize in the hell of a teamfight ( or even a thief who just hit you with 3rd auto chain) ?

Do i even need to list how many stunbreaks are instant ?

Dude, seriously do you even play the same game i play.

Do you really want to use a stunbreaker for a skill that a class can just spam on you?
Do you really think every single class got a stability skill?
Do you really think a max. half second immobilize is making that build insanely broken?
It may be stronger against classes with excessive access to stability(war) or stunbreakers (guard), but the other classes would have an easier time with this change.

lol srsly balance suggestion with ignoring that immob. is a stronger “stun” then stuns if u dont want interrupt and only the person on place?

just as information:
stability -> stun/daze
only condiimmunity -> immob.

thx for making a nonbrain-build even stronger. getting hit by IS. is already strong enough. u want save ini?

Some amazing suggestions, thanks guys.

The only thing I’m unsure of is the immobilise suggestion: I do think it’s seriously overpowered as it is today, but I think allowing you to dodge during it would nerf it completely. Maybe just go back to not allowing it to stack in duration?

I dont think its really great idea to put healing signet to scale more from healing power atleast on warriors current state. As a warrior your skills have almost zero synergy for healing power , shouts yes but its value is minimal compared to other possibilities.

You cant be “real” bunker as warrior so getting healing power just for the signet is not worth it (unless it has insane scaling but then it would be even more op :P ).

Unless you want to nerf it just for the sake of nerf and make it useless. What could be more useful is to tune down longbow and base damage of hammer autos / number 2 and 5. But this would make hammer greatly imbalanced in WvW / PvE.