Guild Wars 2

Ok, then “escape”, “retreat” or “disengage” from mass fight. The already can’t survive inside long-lasting mass fight (with some exceptions).
" Not being able to teleport up a cliff doesn’t make a teleport magically useless"
Ofc, but much less useful. This ability helps my mesmer to disengage (or reposition) lost mass fights many times. And now Shoutbow with low CD leap could cut me down?

edgarallanpwn.8739:

Mak.2657:

ronpierce.2760:

If a necromancer can do it without v-teleporting a theif can. Lets be honest here. Its really not the end of the world.

But he can’t without wurm porting (some type of z-axis porting). And even zerker necro much tankier then mesm.

edgarallanpwn.8739:

Also, if you build PURE GLASS CANNON, and complain when you have trouble taking on most builds that aren’t able to be bursted down because they were smart enough to take defensive utilities, then that’s YOUR fault, not the games, not balance.

Dude, blink (port) IS this best defensive utility now…. And I wasn’t talking about ability to burst down cele builds (that issue is here though). I was talking about survivability of zerker builds and thier fight style.

Using LoS with a teleport is a defensive mechanism yes,. but an abusive one. Aka why its getting nerfed. Both classes have other defensive mechanisms that could be buffed.

And bursting cele’s isn’t a problem. Expecting you to be full zerker and being able to burst every build automatically is. AGAIN…zerker is what it is. Clear advantages, clear downsides. You want the best of both worlds, and that’s UNBALANCED. Cele’s are neither 1) too tanky 2) do too much dmg 3) have too much sustain.

It’s a balanced trinket with rounded stats, for a….. balanced build. PvP builds are never meant to be pure statted. It’s just not viable. There’s too many unknown variables.

Actually it does have to much sustain and by extension is to tanky. If you can resist being one shot after being baited then can run around and refill your health bar constantly that’s virtually unlimited HP aslong as you can doge. And anything squishy will die over time even with perfect doges, the lack of sustain kills you.

If a player gets z-axis momentum… Then they have a chance and makes the 1v1 balanced. And it just comes to whoever outplays who.

If you want imbalanced or zerk to give something up well, for a game revolving around cap points sustain has the clear advantage. Most players have made peace with that the disadvantage was being unable to contest the point. Now they are taking away the onlything the balances the matchup.

This boys an girls is why we will never have /duel and 2v2s, 3v3s will never be an offical format. Thanks for making the game less enjoyable and less e-sports. (Cuz other than MoBAs what Esport isn’t balanced 1v1? And even then “MOBA” genres get more streamer viewership than events.)

ronpierce.2760:

Mak.2657:

Abusive or not it’s almost the only reliable way for zerk to survive in mass fight

Thieves have just as many if not more tools than most zerkers for survival or hit and run. Aside from guardians which have a totally separate defense (blocks), Rangers/Power necros/Some warriors etc pull it off with less going for them in a general sense.

Point being, this is an overly generalized statement, and completely untrue considering there aren’t even THAT many thieves who understand how to abuse it, and they’re still prefectly fine. Instead of porting up a cliff, tp to the base of the cliff and LOS a split second later, it won’t be that different. The major difference is the difference in mobility between nodes, and in that case, good riddance. Not being able to teleport up a cliff doesn’t make a teleport magically useless… To suggest it does is being a bit overly dramatic…

You got it.

All i hear mainly is “I can’t abuse broken mechanics, and now my pvping is going to be worse because my gameplay relied on being able to do something i shouldn’t have”.

Anyone who was somewhat competent with their class will be fine.

edgarallanpwn.8739:

edgarallanpwn.8739:

Mak.2657:

ronpierce.2760:

If a necromancer can do it without v-teleporting a theif can. Lets be honest here. Its really not the end of the world.

But he can’t without wurm porting (some type of z-axis porting). And even zerker necro much tankier then mesm.

edgarallanpwn.8739:

Also, if you build PURE GLASS CANNON, and complain when you have trouble taking on most builds that aren’t able to be bursted down because they were smart enough to take defensive utilities, then that’s YOUR fault, not the games, not balance.

Dude, blink (port) IS this best defensive utility now…. And I wasn’t talking about ability to burst down cele builds (that issue is here though). I was talking about survivability of zerker builds and thier fight style.

Using LoS with a teleport is a defensive mechanism yes,. but an abusive one. Aka why its getting nerfed. Both classes have other defensive mechanisms that could be buffed.

And bursting cele’s isn’t a problem. Expecting you to be full zerker and being able to burst every build automatically is. AGAIN…zerker is what it is. Clear advantages, clear downsides. You want the best of both worlds, and that’s UNBALANCED. Cele’s are neither 1) too tanky 2) do too much dmg 3) have too much sustain.

It’s a balanced trinket with rounded stats, for a….. balanced build. PvP builds are never meant to be pure statted. It’s just not viable. There’s too many unknown variables.

Actually it does have to much sustain and by extension is to tanky. If you can resist being one shot after being baited then can run around and refill your health bar constantly that’s virtually unlimited HP aslong as you can doge. And anything squishy will die over time even with perfect doges, the lack of sustain kills you.

If a player gets z-axis momentum… Then they have a chance and makes the 1v1 balanced. And it just comes to whoever outplays who.

If you want imbalanced or zerk to give something up well, for a game revolving around cap points sustain has the clear advantage. Most players have made peace with that the disadvantage was being unable to contest the point. Now they are taking away the onlything the balances the matchup.

This boys an girls is why we will never have /duel and 2v2s, 3v3s will never be an offical format. Thanks for making the game less enjoyable and less e-sports. (Cuz other than MoBAs what Esport isn’t balanced 1v1? And even then “MOBA” genres get more streamer viewership than events.)

you need a better understanding of how balance works. I’m just going to leave this here. I would advise maybe brushing up on how to read enemy skills, evade them, and skill tells so that way you’re able to zerk properly.

This video below will help explain things.

The game will never revolve around 1v1 or 1v2 balance. ever. Especially since the ques are meant for team play. Balance is designed around team play.

" i shouldn’t have"
Again, who define what I should or what I shouldn’t have? You?
“Anyone who was somewhat competent with their class will be fine”
Form of l2p?
Many good mesmers already admit mesm is not fine in tpvp. Believe me they are competent. And now depriving one of the best sustain tool. They are only hoping this change hits thieves more then mesmers ))
Wanna all jump to bruiser meta?
But mb I am really overdramatic. Will see

Lordrosicky.5813:

Booms.2594:

sounds like a wvw hero is mad that he has never come close to competing in spvp because of these “OP teleport spots” that he doesnt know how to use since he doesnt get them in wvw

You mean the wvw heroes who would wreck you?

maybe 1v1 in open field since thats all they practice but theyd never take a single game off me in pvp

ronpierce.2760:

Trey Enma.7851:

Jaxom.7310:

i lik win enemy is down, n a mez creates portal, blinks away, drops the other end, ports back to u, starts finisher, ports away, an den ports back on u to finish u. thats fun

I might be wrong, but I’m pretty sure there’s a delay on using portal repeatedly that prevents this from working anymore.

They can do it with blink, but I still don’t really think its that big of a deal. Its more utility intensive, harder to pull off and less safe than Mist Form/Elixir stomping (ugh).

Yeah, but what he was describing was placing a portal, blinking away, placing the end, starting a stomp, porting, and porting back to finish the stomp. It used to work, but it doesn’t anymore and probably hasn’t for quite a while at this point.

Mrbig.8019:

Saiyan.1704:

Mrbig.8019:

Saiyan.1704:

Drennon.7190:

Booms.2594:

Saiyan.1704:

This better not change how Guardian teleports with flashing blade and Judge’s intervention… that’s all I gotta say…

it will. which is why im kittened.

Didn’t you hear? Teleports are super OP.

I’m still trying to understand the extent of “No Vertical Teleport”.
Please tell me, which of the following attached pictures are allowed if this patch went live? Obviously there are more spots to Teleport but this will give me an idea.

A-> with Sword u can engage-disengage from below the treb. Clearly broken and uninted, since u teleport through walls ( altough there’s a walk path for it).
Broken.

B-> Same as A. Another case of “through walls” vertical mobility.
Broken

D-> Same as A. With sword u can go through walls as long as u have a target on mid.
Broken

E-> Same as A.
Broken

They’re all broken ports mechanics that reward the thief and thief only ( my main is thief btw).

If your ability is a shadow step (and almost all teleport abilities are shadowsteps, ask Coulter for details) it SHOULD be that you shouldn’t be able to go through walls, even if there’s a walk path for it ( teleporting on Niflhel mid ledge from below is the clear example).

Shadow step should work ONLY if there’s a STRAIGHT WALK PATH, otherwise teleport classes have too much edge over the others.

This is a good change, but they really need to rebalance certain professions after this change, cuz thief will get much worse, mesmer will receive a bigh hit but will be compensated by thieves not being able to pursue them as good as before and even necros will get a hit but they still have spectral walk ( spectral return is a TRUE teleport btw).

Mostly cuz i don’t want to see pew pew rangers invading tPvP.

Thanks for the reply.
A lot of thief skills say Shadow Step. Guardian has Teleport. I’m pretty sure the Guardian’s Teleport is on the same mechanics. Edit: Right like you said lol.

It will hurt Guardians more than thieves if this is the case. Our two “Teleport” skills will become even more frustrating and wasteful… these need to be class specific.

At the very least Anet could redefine these skills.
A “Teleport” should be an instantaneously port regardless of objects while Shadowsteps should be line of sight/pathways only.

It won’t hurt guardians cuz guardian mobility isn’t mandatory.

Their teleports are used more to stick on target/burst in rather than an in-built mechanic.

This isn’t the case of thieves/mesmers ( thief more heavily) , since they are totally dependant upon dodging-teleporting-stealthing in and out.

How the Guardian engages is half the battle. The middle of Foefire is a good example. I’d like to Teleport over a hill to engage, or the ability to disengage a zerg in mid by targeting some one who’s coming from far.

We’re not a mobile class but we had options. Now these options will be taken from us.

The patch will hurt us just the same.

Mak.2657:

" i shouldn’t have"
Again, who define what I should or what I shouldn’t have? You?
“Anyone who was somewhat competent with their class will be fine”
Form of l2p?
Many good mesmers already admit mesm is not fine in tpvp. Believe me they are competent. And now depriving one of the best sustain tool. They are only hoping this change hits thieves more then mesmers ))
Wanna all jump to bruiser meta?
But mb I am really overdramatic. Will see

Nobody said they weren’t fine. What we said is bandaiding them with having to use hopscotch teleport mechanics to be useful is 1) Not fixing the real problem 2) broken to play against and unfair mechanics

They are nerfing portals, so if its really that big a deal, how bad these 2 classes are supposedly doing(since someone said thiefs are bad lol) will stand out more and warrant anet buffing them. You want mesmers to be buffed in useful areas, not by being able to break los mechanics and hit and run at the touch of a button

edgarallanpwn.8739:

Mak.2657:

" i shouldn’t have"
Again, who define what I should or what I shouldn’t have? You?
“Anyone who was somewhat competent with their class will be fine”
Form of l2p?
Many good mesmers already admit mesm is not fine in tpvp. Believe me they are competent. And now depriving one of the best sustain tool. They are only hoping this change hits thieves more then mesmers ))
Wanna all jump to bruiser meta?
But mb I am really overdramatic. Will see

Nobody said they weren’t fine. What we said is bandaiding them with having to use hopscotch teleport mechanics to be useful is 1) Not fixing the real problem 2) broken to play against and unfair mechanics

They are nerfing portals, so if its really that big a deal, how bad these 2 classes are supposedly doing(since someone said thiefs are bad lol) will stand out more and warrant anet buffing them. You want mesmers to be buffed in useful areas, not by being able to break los mechanics and hit and run at the touch of a button

you don’t really believe anet would ever give thieves any meaningful buff, do you lol?
they nerfed the class every single patch since launch….

oh and btw, looking at chinese patch it seems like they nerfed steal and trickery line… so yeah, if this is buffing then i am japanese president….

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

As an Engineer main, these changes sound terrible. Teleport spots and jumping spots add another level of complexity to the game, and make otherwise basic plays and movements a lot more interesting. We’re still finding new spots like these today, over 2 years since these maps first came out. Removing them is a hands down bad idea.

edgarallanpwn.8739:

Nobody said they weren’t fine. What we said is bandaiding them with having to use hopscotch teleport mechanics to be useful is 1) Not fixing the real problem 2) broken to play against and unfair mechanics

They are nerfing portals, so if its really that big a deal, how bad these 2 classes are supposedly doing(since someone said thiefs are bad lol) will stand out more and warrant anet buffing them. You want mesmers to be buffed in useful areas, not by being able to break los mechanics and hit and run at the touch of a button

What I m afraid of anet make all equal and difference between play styles will be diminished. It is still capture a point game and allowing some1 to run away whilst he can’t hold point is not that bad . Should to see supposed buff though.
But at at this moment we can see nerf for some classes definitely through this fix, meanwhile buffs only supposed.

Sins.4782:

Teleport spots and jumping spots add another level of complexity to the game, and make otherwise basic plays and movements a lot more interesting.

Seems jumping (leap) spots (mechanics) not touched. Only ports would fixed

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

Wow using teleport and blink mechanics with no issues and gw2 pvp is a joke compared to wow’s. Explanation then?

Saiyan.1704:

Mrbig.8019:

Saiyan.1704:

Mrbig.8019:

Saiyan.1704:

Drennon.7190:

Booms.2594:

Saiyan.1704:

This better not change how Guardian teleports with flashing blade and Judge’s intervention… that’s all I gotta say…

it will. which is why im kittened.

Didn’t you hear? Teleports are super OP.

I’m still trying to understand the extent of “No Vertical Teleport”.
Please tell me, which of the following attached pictures are allowed if this patch went live? Obviously there are more spots to Teleport but this will give me an idea.

A-> with Sword u can engage-disengage from below the treb. Clearly broken and uninted, since u teleport through walls ( altough there’s a walk path for it).
Broken.

B-> Same as A. Another case of “through walls” vertical mobility.
Broken

D-> Same as A. With sword u can go through walls as long as u have a target on mid.
Broken

E-> Same as A.
Broken

They’re all broken ports mechanics that reward the thief and thief only ( my main is thief btw).

If your ability is a shadow step (and almost all teleport abilities are shadowsteps, ask Coulter for details) it SHOULD be that you shouldn’t be able to go through walls, even if there’s a walk path for it ( teleporting on Niflhel mid ledge from below is the clear example).

Shadow step should work ONLY if there’s a STRAIGHT WALK PATH, otherwise teleport classes have too much edge over the others.

This is a good change, but they really need to rebalance certain professions after this change, cuz thief will get much worse, mesmer will receive a bigh hit but will be compensated by thieves not being able to pursue them as good as before and even necros will get a hit but they still have spectral walk ( spectral return is a TRUE teleport btw).

Mostly cuz i don’t want to see pew pew rangers invading tPvP.

Thanks for the reply.
A lot of thief skills say Shadow Step. Guardian has Teleport. I’m pretty sure the Guardian’s Teleport is on the same mechanics. Edit: Right like you said lol.

It will hurt Guardians more than thieves if this is the case. Our two “Teleport” skills will become even more frustrating and wasteful… these need to be class specific.

At the very least Anet could redefine these skills.
A “Teleport” should be an instantaneously port regardless of objects while Shadowsteps should be line of sight/pathways only.

It won’t hurt guardians cuz guardian mobility isn’t mandatory.

Their teleports are used more to stick on target/burst in rather than an in-built mechanic.

This isn’t the case of thieves/mesmers ( thief more heavily) , since they are totally dependant upon dodging-teleporting-stealthing in and out.

How the Guardian engages is half the battle. The middle of Foefire is a good example. I’d like to Teleport over a hill to engage, or the ability to disengage a zerg in mid by targeting some one who’s coming from far.

We’re not a mobile class but we had options. Now these options will be taken from us.

The patch will hurt us just the same.

So a class with 1 teleport ( 2 if u take the not viable sword) will get hurt the same as a profession which has teleports as an in-built mechanic.

kappa.

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

It’s kinda pathetic that people think Vertical Range is fair game. It’s just as pathetic when people think Guardian is anywhere near hard to play just because it has “instant cast skills” which you can “time.” Couple that with a vertical range teleport, it’s just flat out cancer. Guardian’s don’t need that crap. So do Ele’s. It’s for a greater cause even though Thief and Mesmer will get hit by it.

In-fact if “Guardians” are gonna get worked up over this change then that’s just fail.

BlackTruth.6813:

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

It’s kinda pathetic that people think Vertical Range is fair game. It’s just as pathetic when people think Guardian is anywhere near hard to play just because it has “instant cast skills” which you can “time.” Couple that with a vertical range teleport, it’s just flat out cancer. Guardian’s don’t need that crap. So do Ele’s. It’s for a greater cause even though Thief and Mesmer will get hit by it.

In-fact if “Guardians” are gonna get worked up over this change then that’s just fail.

lets just go back to spamming axe autos with 6 stances up since thats all you can do

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

Maybe, but i am at the point where i literally dont care what they do as long as they do something. Any change is a good change from my point of view. I am so bored of playing the same build of the game for 12 months in a row.

edgarallanpwn.8739:

snip

I can play around those skills just fine thank you, I’ve had a lot more experience avoiding troubling skills than someone who gets carried by their low risk builds that compensate for their crappy APM and inability to react. If your going to get personal tho, lets take a top player like supcutie, who also uses blink plays and gets pushed off point to the tanky sustain. Are you making claims he and all zerkers who are affected from this nerf are “unable to zerk properly”?

But as for balance what? Z-axis plays should be nerfed because It’s balanced 1v1 against sustain? lol…

GW2 suffers if anything from it’s lack of 1v1 balance, we can cry “Team game” till we’re blue in the face. I’m sure that’ll get some of our “3m+ before china release” views that way lol… Other games can get players who don’t play the game to watch, we struggle to get from our own pool lol.

But seriously other than Moba’s (which again still have lame viewership for events compared to streamers, and ppl are vigilant to point out how GW2 is “NOT” part of that genre) most Esport games, or games with a significant competitive viewership like Fighting games, Shooters, and Starcraft. are pretty close to balanced 1v1. Hrmmm I wonder if there is a connection in their successful viewership? Competitive pokemon gets better views… and that is also balanced 1v1.

Imperfect balance only works and is compelling when you have a LARGE pool of builds/selection/champions, as well as players, and a game type to compliment it. 20ish viable builds with 2-3 consistent long standing apex predators on territories isn’t that.

The biggest shame then is that the engine for GW2 (net coding packet loss issues aside) is perfect for 2v2s and 3v3s as well as duels. And I realize that this part is heavily opinionated, but choosing to go down this path will only hurt us in the long run, unless we get something new and awesome born from the content of the expansion.

Back to “Blink plays” if you recall during the design preview of courtyard they mentioned them in a way implying they were intended, so if they are backing out now that will hurt their current design, so it IS part of balance and should not be removed. That being said I don’t have a problem with tweaks (like ports to the top of on the far side of the bridges on foe fire being removed.) but @ anyone who cries “ABUSE” your argument is invalid. It is intended. (or was if they remove it)

I know some of what I say can be very unreasonable, it’s just that I don’t understand how people think the old 100% Quickness is broken but not vertical range teleport.

Vertical Range teleport makes it so you have to mirror a guy who abuses vertical range with a class that could do it and it just enforces the meta in a sense when it comes to conquest. Not to mention it affects map control as a whole more than Quickness could ever do. DO NOT even get me started on how easy it is to wait other people’s cool downs out when you abuse vertical range teleport. This is A LOT more anti-fun than the old quickness, just that people refuse to understand.

Like “Long Bow Ranger” isn’t even a good argument by going against vertical range tele change, Ranger is like a braindead anti-fun class and their easiness needs to be fixed to receive any real “fix” as a class.

Of course compensation needs to happen much like what needed to happen with the Quickness nerf a long time ago, but they HAVE TO BE CAREFUL not to make the same mistakes that they did on the past.

This change should affect Thief and Mesmer the most and will maybe need compensation but I will say good riddance to Guardian and Ele.

tbh i think it affect less thief compare to mesmer.

thief has a tons of ways to avoid being focused other then abusing blink spots.
but it’s not the same for mesmer.

lighter.2708:

tbh i think it affect less thief compare to mesmer.

thief has a tons of ways to avoid being focused other then abusing blink spots.
but it’s not the same for mesmer.

Like I said before. I MUCH prefer them balance the game forward without consideration of bugs and exploits. Technically speaking, balancing around bugs can often lead to them not buffing other weapons and defenses in general because clutch escapes on top of acceptable defenses would be incredibly OP for obvious reasons. HoT has a chance to fix a lot of past issues and I think that’s what they’re doing. Right now they’re laying down some pavement to move forward. One fix doesn’t mean nothing else can change with it.

i’m just curious why thieves qqing the hardest…

ronpierce.2760:

lighter.2708:

tbh i think it affect less thief compare to mesmer.

thief has a tons of ways to avoid being focused other then abusing blink spots.
but it’s not the same for mesmer.

Like I said before. I MUCH prefer them balance the game forward without consideration of bugs and exploits. Technically speaking, balancing around bugs can often lead to them not buffing other weapons and defenses in general because clutch escapes on top of acceptable defenses would be incredibly OP for obvious reasons. HoT has a chance to fix a lot of past issues and I think that’s what they’re doing. Right now they’re laying down some pavement to move forward. One fix doesn’t mean nothing else can change with it.

I agree with that. Anet should fix exploits and bugs and if this causes certain professions to become too weak, rebalancing them is the better way to go.

Daishi.6027:

edgarallanpwn.8739:

snip

GW2 suffers if anything from it’s lack of 1v1 balance, we can cry “Team game” till we’re blue in the face.

Someone mentions that they are trying to lessen “differences” between spec to help with balance, someone else mentioned that lately they’ve been “nerfing” zerker in all modes, classes without much stab seem to be happy about stab change, someone else mentioned that vertical maps with wvw will promote different specs and more squads then zerg, someone else mentioned small buff to healing,healing percentage,customization have been made…

They have their own way of “balancing”, if you follow the game they have been preparing for something. Not sure what but A 1v1 balance is not really possible anyway if you follow traditional archetypes, a 1v1 balance would be me putting war and thief on a scale,it would be even,each would have exact same build with modified theme(battle/shadow) that is not the case lol,even the extra HP or damage potential on one makes it uneven. MMO combat style is different than MOBA’s.

lighter.2708:

i’m just curious why thieves qqing the hardest…

Well we can’t rely much on stealth much in conquest,great mode btw devs, so I understand my fellow thieves since complete glass is effective only pve also it’s seem the Trickery line may be nerfed for power thieves which we chose for utility since against full glass is bad in pvp, thief also is not here to fight/1v1 but for mobility/decap/cap, great mode again btw devs, since the damage and team pressure is not worth it. I don’t play meta so I will see how this goes or could possibly affect me.

Sagat.3285:

lighter.2708:

i’m just curious why thieves qqing the hardest…

Well we can’t rely much on stealth much in conquest,great mode btw devs, so I understand my fellow thieves since complete glass is effective only pve also it’s seem the Trickery line may be nerfed for power thieves which we chose for utility since against full glass is bad in pvp, thief also is not here to fight/1v1 but for mobility/decap/cap, great mode again btw devs, since the damage and team pressure is not worth it. I don’t play meta so I will see how this goes or could possibly affect me.

Hey you can rely on stealth in Strong hold though! :} Stealthing those door breakers!

Btw I’m wandering why ppl call v-porting “exploit” or “broken mechanic”

Mak.2657:

Btw I’m wandering why ppl call v-porting “exploit” or “broken mechanic”

Because it is. Stand in a non-key spot and try to teleport to a higher ledge, it doesn’t work. Very specific spots have been mapped out and learned~ hence, they’re exploited areas. Vertical teleporting is generally not accepted in the game, but in certain maps you can find spots that allow it, and it gives an unintended advantage. They also can’t over buff classes that can exploit this bug because if they do without fixing v-teleporting they’d have very OP roamers that essentially couldn’t die if they played their cards right. It also ruins “average travel time” between nodes and creates huge swings from a class without teleports versus one with.

ronpierce.2760:

Sagat.3285:

lighter.2708:

i’m just curious why thieves qqing the hardest…

Well we can’t rely much on stealth much in conquest,great mode btw devs, so I understand my fellow thieves since complete glass is effective only pve also it’s seem the Trickery line may be nerfed for power thieves which we chose for utility since against full glass is bad in pvp, thief also is not here to fight/1v1 but for mobility/decap/cap, great mode again btw devs, since the damage and team pressure is not worth it. I don’t play meta so I will see how this goes or could possibly affect me.

Hey you can rely on stealth in Strong hold though! :} Stealthing those door breakers!

While they won’t way for you to stealth them,also don’t have different patterns of walks so a foe will AA then CC+kill in the soon to be know path,won’t help you fights foes at gate while the foes will be closer to spawn point and their allies will attack you, also the main purpose is to kill Lord not a TDM and we have a thing called revealed. I am not worried at all about stealth in SH. Other focuses will dominate there.

Why can’t you rely on stealth, stealth is a perfect offensive and defensive mechanics, completely get rid of focus, shadow rejuged team spike, stealthed backcap, mind games are all big part of winning the match imo..

ronpierce.2760:

Because it is. Stand in a non-key spot and try to teleport to a higher ledge, it doesn’t work. Very specific spots have been mapped out and learned~ hence, they’re exploited areas. Vertical teleporting is generally not accepted in the game, but in certain maps you can find spots that allow it, and it gives an unintended advantage. They also can’t over buff classes that can exploit this bug because if they do without fixing v-teleporting they’d have very OP roamers that essentially couldn’t die if they played their cards right. It also ruins “average travel time” between nodes and creates huge swings from a class without teleports versus one with.

It’s not about some places can be used for v-port. It’s about how port works (pathfinding through net of nodes). I found some not very well-known port spots (not comfortable though) cause I know how it works. You assume this unintended. I m not so sure. It creates “huge” difference in roaming mobility mostly for thief and mb for mesmer in lesser degree. Both classes that can’t hold point. And can’t stay in long lasting group fight (mesmer esp). So removing tool that is base for mesm sustain and play style. Curious to see how mesm will handle these fight.

lighter.2708:

Why can’t you rely on stealth, stealth is a perfect offensive and defensive mechanics, completely get rid of focus, shadow rejuged team spike, stealthed backcap, mind games are all big part of winning the match imo..

Stealth focus diminish your effect in conquest AKA SA and most stealth traits, while many can argue just use it you will get and stay in stealth anyway it doesn’t work like that for power thieves, Trickery AKA interrupting that heal since your damage is not good enough,stealing some of that vicious boon spam became dominant even more since the weapons that could do this without it were nerfed. Condi thief,venom share don’t really care and while they do work when play properly assasin/rogue is attached to thief for some reason and has received more variation,improvements,attention and nerfs so it’s more “visible” on them especially how damage works.

Perfect is an opinion btw unless everything is copy of each other with just different themes.

lighter.2708:

Why can’t you rely on stealth, stealth is a perfect offensive and defensive mechanics, completely get rid of focus, shadow rejuged team spike, stealthed backcap, mind games are all big part of winning the match imo..

- stealth doesn’t get rid off focus, channeled spells and AI still follow you
- stealth doesn’t prevent any dmg
- define stealthed decap? can’t cap while being in stealth and any decent team watches map/communicates… in fact stealth puts you often in huge disadvantage for that very reason
- mind games are only worth it when risk/reward correlation is same for every class, it is not current meta though…

ronpierce.2760:

lighter.2708:

tbh i think it affect less thief compare to mesmer.

thief has a tons of ways to avoid being focused other then abusing blink spots.
but it’s not the same for mesmer.

Like I said before. I MUCH prefer them balance the game forward without consideration of bugs and exploits. Technically speaking, balancing around bugs can often lead to them not buffing other weapons and defenses in general because clutch escapes on top of acceptable defenses would be incredibly OP for obvious reasons. HoT has a chance to fix a lot of past issues and I think that’s what they’re doing. Right now they’re laying down some pavement to move forward. One fix doesn’t mean nothing else can change with it.

it would be all great and right but given what anet has been doing past 2 years i am pretty sure the only thing that will happen is just more nerfs to the class…

they don’t care weither or not class/build is viable in pvp, they only care about numbers and statistics… the only time they will consider buffing thieves if every single thief will quit game on patch day and never log in again—— which obviously won’t happen so i promise you there will be NO, absolutely NO meaningful buffs for the class to make for supposed “fix”

that is why thief players are not happy with the change, after 2+ years of constant nerfing they all know very well that there will be nothing good comming thieves way

maybe, just maybe devs will consider some minor changes but it won’t happen at least for a year after xpac comes out because they want people to play revenant; i hardly doubt that players are willing to wait THAT long

Cynz.9437:

that is why thief players are not happy with the change, after 2+ years of constant nerfing they all know very well that there will be nothing good comming thieves way

Tbh it’s not true. Thief (as mesmer) got not only nerfs, but worthy buffs too. Initiative regen regen buff e.g.

Mak.2657:

Cynz.9437:

that is why thief players are not happy with the change, after 2+ years of constant nerfing they all know very well that there will be nothing good comming thieves way

Tbh it’s not true. Thef (as mesmer) got not only nerfs, but buffs too. Initiative regen e.g.

True only for pvp power/assassin speced thieves,overall support thief has improved if such thing exist,condi thief has now 3 variations krait bleed stacking,interrupt+confusion,trap+speed. I am not sure if this is force you to play other specs but it’s suspicious. You see most thieves in wvw also.

Mak.2657:

Cynz.9437:

that is why thief players are not happy with the change, after 2+ years of constant nerfing they all know very well that there will be nothing good comming thieves way

Tbh it’s not true. Thief (as mesmer) got not only nerfs, but worthy buffs too. Initiative regen regen buff e.g.

they buffed condi build really… how many condi thieves do you see in pvp… or rather how viable/helpful is condi thief at any decent level of pvp?

I’m saying there is not a row of only nerfs, but some buffs too. And thief still outstanding zerk user. Dunno would it be after fix. Zerk without mobility fades in comparison with bruisers imo.

BlackTruth.6813:

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

It’s kinda pathetic that people think Vertical Range is fair game. It’s just as pathetic when people think Guardian is anywhere near hard to play just because it has “instant cast skills” which you can “time.” Couple that with a vertical range teleport, it’s just flat out cancer. Guardian’s don’t need that crap. So do Ele’s. It’s for a greater cause even though Thief and Mesmer will get hit by it.

In-fact if “Guardians” are gonna get worked up over this change then that’s just fail.

i play every class, it doesn’t matter to me if they nerf any one in particular.

but every time they remove something that makes this game more interesting, in this case the use of blink cooldowns to disengage, existing pvpers should complain.

also whatever this guard rant is about, it’ll barely affect guard.

Phaeton.9582:

BlackTruth.6813:

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

It’s kinda pathetic that people think Vertical Range is fair game. It’s just as pathetic when people think Guardian is anywhere near hard to play just because it has “instant cast skills” which you can “time.” Couple that with a vertical range teleport, it’s just flat out cancer. Guardian’s don’t need that crap. So do Ele’s. It’s for a greater cause even though Thief and Mesmer will get hit by it.

In-fact if “Guardians” are gonna get worked up over this change then that’s just fail.

i play every class, it doesn’t matter to me if they nerf any one in particular.

but every time they remove something that makes this game more interesting, in this case the use of blink cooldowns to disengage, existing pvpers should complain.

also whatever this guard rant is about, it’ll barely effect guard.

I don’t think its fair to consider exploits ‘interesting’. Secondly, they still can be disengages. You just don’t get to magically end up on a cliff free of harm, the interesting part is out pacing and out positioning your enemy, not taking advantage of poor pathing knowing your enemy can’t.

Lastly, I don’t really find it ‘interesting’ to have a certain few classes who can just disengage whenever they feel like it. People are supposed to die. People complain that bruiser builds don’t die faster enough and that its boring, there’s honestly nothing more eye-roll-provoking than getting a guy to 10% and then him teleporting on a cliff and being completely gone. It might be fun for the guy who just gets a free walk all the time, of course, but its really not interesting. If you want to play glass, take the risk involved. Cop-out mechanics are actually boring for everyone but the user.

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

BlackTruth.6813:

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

It’s kinda pathetic that people think Vertical Range is fair game. It’s just as pathetic when people think Guardian is anywhere near hard to play just because it has “instant cast skills” which you can “time.” Couple that with a vertical range teleport, it’s just flat out cancer. Guardian’s don’t need that crap. So do Ele’s. It’s for a greater cause even though Thief and Mesmer will get hit by it.

In-fact if “Guardians” are gonna get worked up over this change then that’s just fail.

i play every class, it doesn’t matter to me if they nerf any one in particular.

but every time they remove something that makes this game more interesting, in this case the use of blink cooldowns to disengage, existing pvpers should complain.

also whatever this guard rant is about, it’ll barely effect guard.

I don’t think its fair to consider exploits ‘interesting’. Secondly, they still can be disengages. You just don’t get to magically end up on a cliff free of harm, the interesting part is out pacing and out positioning your enemy, not taking advantage of poor pathing knowing your enemy can’t.

Lastly, I don’t really find it ‘interesting’ to have a certain few classes who can just disengage whenever they feel like it. People are supposed to die. People complain that bruiser builds don’t die faster enough and that its boring, there’s honestly nothing more eye-roll-provoking than getting a guy to 10% and then him teleporting on a cliff and being completely gone. It might be fun for the guy who just gets a free walk all the time, of course, but its really not interesting. If you want to play glass, take the risk involved. Cop-out mechanics are actually boring for everyone but the user.

honestly why are you typing this.

also

ronpierce.2760:

People are supposed to die. .

no, they’re not. that’s why bunker comps have been meta for the majority of release. no loot bags here man…

Because it’s a lame exploitation of something clearly not intended? Should be pretty obvious.

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

BlackTruth.6813:

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

It’s kinda pathetic that people think Vertical Range is fair game. It’s just as pathetic when people think Guardian is anywhere near hard to play just because it has “instant cast skills” which you can “time.” Couple that with a vertical range teleport, it’s just flat out cancer. Guardian’s don’t need that crap. So do Ele’s. It’s for a greater cause even though Thief and Mesmer will get hit by it.

In-fact if “Guardians” are gonna get worked up over this change then that’s just fail.

i play every class, it doesn’t matter to me if they nerf any one in particular.

but every time they remove something that makes this game more interesting, in this case the use of blink cooldowns to disengage, existing pvpers should complain.

also whatever this guard rant is about, it’ll barely effect guard.

I don’t think its fair to consider exploits ‘interesting’. Secondly, they still can be disengages. You just don’t get to magically end up on a cliff free of harm, the interesting part is out pacing and out positioning your enemy, not taking advantage of poor pathing knowing your enemy can’t.

Lastly, I don’t really find it ‘interesting’ to have a certain few classes who can just disengage whenever they feel like it. People are supposed to die. People complain that bruiser builds don’t die faster enough and that its boring, there’s honestly nothing more eye-roll-provoking than getting a guy to 10% and then him teleporting on a cliff and being completely gone. It might be fun for the guy who just gets a free walk all the time, of course, but its really not interesting. If you want to play glass, take the risk involved. Cop-out mechanics are actually boring for everyone but the user.

honestly why are you typing this.

also

ronpierce.2760:

People are supposed to die. .

no, they’re not. that’s why bunker comps have been meta for the majority of release. no loot bags here man…

Check his post history. He thinks everything is OP.

Check it and actually ready it and realize how much I defend. I just prefer a game to be balanced around less cheesy mechanics. I don’t find a lot OP, but I find things that could use some work to being less poorly designed. Of course… I don’t think you really care about that, you’re just trying to pick me apart because I’m for your cheesy mechanics going away, that, let me remind you, were never even intended in the first place. Cry at me all you want, I’m not calling the shots. I’m just agreeing with them.

I saw a Thief teleporting on a bridge in Stronghold in the GW2 HoT livestream, so I’m confused now…

Teru.2063:

I saw a Thief teleporting on a bridge in Stronghold in the GW2 HoT livestream, so I’m confused now…

I saw that too. I wonder how they are choosing with v-ports are okay and which ones are not.

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

BlackTruth.6813:

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

It’s kinda pathetic that people think Vertical Range is fair game. It’s just as pathetic when people think Guardian is anywhere near hard to play just because it has “instant cast skills” which you can “time.” Couple that with a vertical range teleport, it’s just flat out cancer. Guardian’s don’t need that crap. So do Ele’s. It’s for a greater cause even though Thief and Mesmer will get hit by it.

In-fact if “Guardians” are gonna get worked up over this change then that’s just fail.

i play every class, it doesn’t matter to me if they nerf any one in particular.

but every time they remove something that makes this game more interesting, in this case the use of blink cooldowns to disengage, existing pvpers should complain.

also whatever this guard rant is about, it’ll barely effect guard.

I don’t think its fair to consider exploits ‘interesting’. Secondly, they still can be disengages. You just don’t get to magically end up on a cliff free of harm, the interesting part is out pacing and out positioning your enemy, not taking advantage of poor pathing knowing your enemy can’t.

Lastly, I don’t really find it ‘interesting’ to have a certain few classes who can just disengage whenever they feel like it. People are supposed to die. People complain that bruiser builds don’t die faster enough and that its boring, there’s honestly nothing more eye-roll-provoking than getting a guy to 10% and then him teleporting on a cliff and being completely gone. It might be fun for the guy who just gets a free walk all the time, of course, but its really not interesting. If you want to play glass, take the risk involved. Cop-out mechanics are actually boring for everyone but the user.

honestly why are you typing this.

Because his post made so much sense that it’s mind blown, i know.
but people just bashing his well thought, well written, standing arguments with simple opinion and personal taste…it’s just..sad…

Phaeton.9582:

ronpierce.2760:

Phaeton.9582:

this has to be a joke

only new players would have a problem vertical with ports. no exceptions.

What? A lot of people have ‘a problem’ with people exploiting a map to have unintended mobility.

Zero good players.

Just trying to further lower the skill cieling for more money.

removing some of the spots is not lowering skill ceiling, in fact it demands you to actually play well instead of being bads who getting carried by these spots constantly, you have no idea how many times, i just click a button and im completely out of the danger zone while on other classes i would have already dead. that’s just like a “oh kitten” button for bads.
memorizing these spots are not skills…they are not skills…anything but skills…please…stop lying to yourself…

im very excited for these changes.

Nike warriors inc

stop dis

Zerker Ranger reigns supreme.