Guild Wars 2

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz,

Trap ranger beats offensive guardians 100% of the time with a comfortable amount of health remaining without using their ult.

Timewarp doesn’t really change up a fight, because players playing against a mesmer will generally dip earlier in order to prevent themselves from getting spiked and then quickness stomped. Mesmers are rather weak in team fight situations, and the longer they hold timewarp, the worse a position their team is in. Mesmers have very telegraphed spikes with shatters, and aoe on points typically clears clones and phantasms quickly, severely reducing their damage output. A backpoint trap ranger, for instance, can drop a huge amount of damage on point, bring significant cc with his pets, drop an ult which provides more anti-pressure and 180 degree capability than timewarp, and does so in a package which is harder to drop.

More importantly, trap rangers BURN GUARDIANS DOWN HARRRRRRRRRRD, which pressures teams incredibly hard, as a guardian has trouble dropping off point and guardians force a backline character up to get cleaved on his corpse. Additionally, his down 2 state is very telegraphed and blindable, and stab stompable, which means the other guardian on-point is in a very good position to drop him. Mesmers don’t apply that much pressure to guardians when their clones are being cleared and don’t have the bulk to extend to hit backline characters.

very well put reply. when i started calculating the elites into team fights i based them off of comparison to the ranger entangle elite as i see its the strongest and most useful one. yes timewarp is great if u can use it ikittenv5 and the other team stays in it but when does that happen? so the less and less ppl in it makes it worse and worse. but i am not saying its bad at all just easily nullified.

Never even heard of you that’s all that matters. And as far as kaypud, kaypud is better then 98% of the dps guards that play his build and play dps guard anyway. But I will say no more. But you been playing with the top teams for months? Never even heard of you or seen you. And playing against them occasionally doesn’t mean anything specially when you don’t win no offense. And before you say it’ll be hilarious maybe you should win like those guys did before you even say anything. Even off oppa wasn’t that great he probably won way more then you did and played for one of the best teams to play sPvP.

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz,

Trap ranger beats offensive guardians 100% of the time with a comfortable amount of health remaining without using their ult.

Timewarp doesn’t really change up a fight, because players playing against a mesmer will generally dip earlier in order to prevent themselves from getting spiked and then quickness stomped. Mesmers are rather weak in team fight situations, and the longer they hold timewarp, the worse a position their team is in. Mesmers have very telegraphed spikes with shatters, and aoe on points typically clears clones and phantasms quickly, severely reducing their damage output. A backpoint trap ranger, for instance, can drop a huge amount of damage on point, bring significant cc with his pets, drop an ult which provides more anti-pressure and 180 degree capability than timewarp, and does so in a package which is harder to drop.

More importantly, trap rangers BURN GUARDIANS DOWN HARRRRRRRRRRD, which pressures teams incredibly hard, as a guardian has trouble dropping off point and guardians force a backline character up to get cleaved on his corpse. Additionally, his down 2 state is very telegraphed and blindable, and stab stompable, which means the other guardian on-point is in a very good position to drop him. Mesmers don’t apply that much pressure to guardians when their clones are being cleared and don’t have the bulk to extend to hit backline characters.

You my friend have it completely backwards.

First of all skill and awareness is the number one thing in this game. Counter classes dont matter. Rangers do counter guardians hard but no ranger can beat a good and well played dps guardian ever lmao. You probably wouldn’t know because all the good players cease to play anyway and there is only one guaridan who was able to beat all rangers 1v1 unless he had no cd’s.

As far as mesmers, like I said, skill is an important factor including your teammates whether or not your Mesmer uses it offensively or defensively. As a top player or team, you know ahead of time the team will back out of time warp so your team should know what to do accordingly. Same goes for when you use it defensively. Timewarp is by far the biggest skill changer in high level tournament games. BY FAR and nothing is even close when time warp is used right.

please dont turn this into a argument or do belittling things like LMAO there is no need for that. now when i step in i will tell you from the games i seen the rangers beat the dps guards 80% + the time. all the above classes beat it plus my mesmer off point beats it and off point and in the overal points per second in a 1 min time the other classes beat the dps guard.

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz,

Trap ranger beats offensive guardians 100% of the time with a comfortable amount of health remaining without using their ult.

Timewarp doesn’t really change up a fight, because players playing against a mesmer will generally dip earlier in order to prevent themselves from getting spiked and then quickness stomped. Mesmers are rather weak in team fight situations, and the longer they hold timewarp, the worse a position their team is in. Mesmers have very telegraphed spikes with shatters, and aoe on points typically clears clones and phantasms quickly, severely reducing their damage output. A backpoint trap ranger, for instance, can drop a huge amount of damage on point, bring significant cc with his pets, drop an ult which provides more anti-pressure and 180 degree capability than timewarp, and does so in a package which is harder to drop.

More importantly, trap rangers BURN GUARDIANS DOWN HARRRRRRRRRRD, which pressures teams incredibly hard, as a guardian has trouble dropping off point and guardians force a backline character up to get cleaved on his corpse. Additionally, his down 2 state is very telegraphed and blindable, and stab stompable, which means the other guardian on-point is in a very good position to drop him. Mesmers don’t apply that much pressure to guardians when their clones are being cleared and don’t have the bulk to extend to hit backline characters.

You my friend have it completely backwards.

First of all skill and awareness is the number one thing in this game. Counter classes dont matter. Rangers do counter guardians hard but no ranger can beat a good and well played dps guardian ever lmao. You probably wouldn’t know because all the good players cease to play anyway and there is only one guaridan who was able to beat all rangers 1v1 unless he had no cd’s.

As far as mesmers, like I said, skill is an important factor including your teammates whether or not your Mesmer uses it offensively or defensively. As a top player or team, you know ahead of time the team will back out of time warp so your team should know what to do accordingly. Same goes for when you use it defensively. Timewarp is by far the biggest skill changer in high level tournament games. BY FAR and nothing is even close when time warp is used right.

please dont turn this into a argument or do belittling things like LMAO there is no need for that. now when i step in i will tell you from the games i seen the rangers beat the dps guards 80% + the time. all the above classes beat it plus my mesmer off point beats it and off point and in the overal points per second in a 1 min time the other classes beat the dps guard.

I’m not belittling anyone but being myself. And I’m clearing stating the truth. If you want to balance something you have to take what can be done when the class is actually played well. MOST do not play it well and is why 80% of classes beat it. A lot are also just copying build without realizing that the one they’d are copying is not that great in the first place. That’s like saying that everyone thought ele was bad and beat it 1v1 constantly all the time because no one knew how to play it well. Does that mean its not that great? No lol. Anet has mentioned it in a state of game and a lot of times balances are not the issue as it is a L2play issue. Balance in this game is fine for some classes and people just don’t realize it. Skill is the biggest factor in this game.

lilz shorty.1879:

Never even heard of you that’s all that matters. And as far as kaypud, kaypud is better then 98% of the dps guards that play his build and play dps guard anyway. But I will say no more. But you been playing with the top teams for months? Never even heard of you or seen you. And playing against them occasionally doesn’t mean anything specially when you don’t win no offense. And before you say it’ll be hilarious maybe you should win like those guys did before you even say anything. Even off oppa wasn’t that great he probably won way more then you did and played for one of the best teams to play sPvP.

So it was them.

They quit playing before the current trap ranger setup was used and learned, hence why the comparison is a joke.

As for my credentials, I’ve played enough to be known. Which team did you play for? Not that it really matters at this point, I’m just curious as to why you’re so angry. Every good team disbanded and left after the last SotG.

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Never even heard of you that’s all that matters. And as far as kaypud, kaypud is better then 98% of the dps guards that play his build and play dps guard anyway. But I will say no more. But you been playing with the top teams for months? Never even heard of you or seen you. And playing against them occasionally doesn’t mean anything specially when you don’t win no offense. And before you say it’ll be hilarious maybe you should win like those guys did before you even say anything. Even off oppa wasn’t that great he probably won way more then you did and played for one of the best teams to play sPvP.

So it was them.

They quit playing before the current trap ranger setup was used and learned, hence why the comparison is a joke.

As for my credentials, I’ve played enough to be known. Which team did you play for? Not that it really matters at this point, I’m just curious as to why you’re so angry. Every good team disbanded and left after the last SotG.

First of all it was not them lol. Second I’m not angry. This is the Internet and you cannot tell whether or not I’m angry lol. This is just how I am. It also doesn’t matter what team I played for but I’m just saying you have not been in the top games with us and never seen you. This comparison is a joke because I’ve said most people have a l2 kitten ue before balance is even needed. Rangers cannot beat a dps guardian 90% of the time when the l2 kitten ue not a factor.

P.S. There were also no good teams left well before the last state of game. We all left after last patch.

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

nice well thought out reply but you didnt say anything really positive about the thief how did you come up with a 6.5? what was that number compared to?

remember you need to take in account can it back cap can it hold nodes and can it neatralize against someone then for what time duration if any then factor in what classes can do what it does and or cant do and what score that class has. if you compare it to every class above it using my scores you will see it falls well short of the bar and IMO 6.5 is to good of a score in comparrison.

You’re right, I was hitting 6.5 based off of my own scale from 1-10. I should have adjusted that via your comparisons. In that case, your scale reflects the current game balance pretty accurately.

However I do feel that there are some variables within that scale which should shift those numbers depending on the team comp/requirements.

Since I play thief, let’s just take thief as an example.

Nowadays a thief is always the roamer right? He don’t need to, nor should he be neuting or holding points…it’s not his job. Backcapping when the time is right, yes, but approaching 1v1 fights especially against trap rangers/guards in desire to neut would be a stupid idea unless you know for sure you can 1v1 them. So now, according to your important aspects of the game, the thief has holding + neuting points crossed out -

That is a bit unfair imo, because we are talking about team play here…and team play means that a roamer could very well sacrifice the ability to hold+neut points because someone else in the team would fulfill that role. The problem with neuting + holding is just that…they have to stay there…and once they leave they would be trying to fulfill the role of the roamer and the point is now left empty. A roamer shouldn’t be holding+capping points so they could capitalize on their role:

The roaming thief is the one to come in mid-fight to change tides especially if it’s a 1v1 or 1v2 before the thief gets there. If it was a 1v1 before, that other person is going to be dead unless it somehow gets away…but even a ele can’t run away from me unless I have shadowstep on cd. If it was a 1v2 before, then it’s now pretty much an even fight. A thief brings so much burst that any non-bunker class would automatically start to be more alert so they don’t get bursted down instantly. Besides a 100n engi, there really isn’t any other class that can bring that much burst in such a short time. I am omitting 100b wars because more often than not, it can be broken out of because of the sheer time it takes for the 100b to execute through even with haste.

What I’m trying to say is, though your scale (in analyzing the class alone) may be valid in terms of Capping, Holding, Neutralizing, and Team Fights, there is definitely much more determining factors shifting those numbers depending on the team comps of both parties.

Though I can agree (and who can’t?) that Eles are the god-tier class still…no other class can cap/neut like rangers/engis, roam like thieves, teamfight + drop burning fields and share auras, all while being able to survive and put out good dps. It’s silly, but it’s just how eles are…and from what it seems from the last SOTG…Karl tends to think that eles are perfectly fine.

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Never even heard of you that’s all that matters. And as far as kaypud, kaypud is better then 98% of the dps guards that play his build and play dps guard anyway. But I will say no more. But you been playing with the top teams for months? Never even heard of you or seen you. And playing against them occasionally doesn’t mean anything specially when you don’t win no offense. And before you say it’ll be hilarious maybe you should win like those guys did before you even say anything. Even off oppa wasn’t that great he probably won way more then you did and played for one of the best teams to play sPvP.

So it was them.

They quit playing before the current trap ranger setup was used and learned, hence why the comparison is a joke.

As for my credentials, I’ve played enough to be known. Which team did you play for? Not that it really matters at this point, I’m just curious as to why you’re so angry. Every good team disbanded and left after the last SotG.

First of all it was not them lol. Second I’m not angry. This is the Internet and you cannot tell whether or not I’m angry lol. This is just how I am. It also doesn’t matter what team I played for but I’m just saying you have not been in the top games with us and never seen you. This comparison is a joke because I’ve said most people have a l2 kitten ue before balance is even needed. Rangers cannot beat a dps guardian 90% of the time when the l2 kitten ue not a factor.

Well, if you’re going to refuse to tell me which team you’re on, I guess I’m gonna have to go and call your bullkitten. Rangers have never had less than a 2:8 matchup against guardians. With res pet, its pretty much 0:10.

If you think running judge’s is something rangers don’t know how to deal with, you’re wrong, but I have no idea what you’re talking about because you’re refusing to provide details.

Offensive guardians have a number of poor 1v1 matchups, but they pair very well in 2v2s, where they set up a number of other classes.

Anyways, we clearly don’t agree. You’re making an appeal to authority with nothing to back it up and I’m not really willing to sit here dealing with the same fallacy repeatedly.

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Never even heard of you that’s all that matters. And as far as kaypud, kaypud is better then 98% of the dps guards that play his build and play dps guard anyway. But I will say no more. But you been playing with the top teams for months? Never even heard of you or seen you. And playing against them occasionally doesn’t mean anything specially when you don’t win no offense. And before you say it’ll be hilarious maybe you should win like those guys did before you even say anything. Even off oppa wasn’t that great he probably won way more then you did and played for one of the best teams to play sPvP.

So it was them.

They quit playing before the current trap ranger setup was used and learned, hence why the comparison is a joke.

As for my credentials, I’ve played enough to be known. Which team did you play for? Not that it really matters at this point, I’m just curious as to why you’re so angry. Every good team disbanded and left after the last SotG.

First of all it was not them lol. Second I’m not angry. This is the Internet and you cannot tell whether or not I’m angry lol. This is just how I am. It also doesn’t matter what team I played for but I’m just saying you have not been in the top games with us and never seen you. This comparison is a joke because I’ve said most people have a l2 kitten ue before balance is even needed. Rangers cannot beat a dps guardian 90% of the time when the l2 kitten ue not a factor.

Well, if you’re going to refuse to tell me which team you’re on, I guess I’m gonna have to go and call your bullkitten. Rangers have never had less than a 2:8 matchup against guardians. With res pet, its pretty much 0:10.

If you think running judge’s is something rangers don’t know how to deal with, you’re wrong, but I have no idea what you’re talking about because you’re refusing to provide details.

Offensive guardians have a number of poor 1v1 matchups, but they pair very well in 2v2s, where they set up a number of other classes.

Anyways, we clearly don’t agree. You’re making an appeal to authority with nothing to back it up and I’m not really willing to sit here dealing with the same fallacy repeatedly.

Nothing can beat us 1v1 unless consistently unless its an ele and that is 50/50. That is all I have to say about that. I have no reason to because it doesn’t matter. No one spvp’s anymore but if the day comes where we all come back to spvp, you will then realize it lol. You don’t to believe me lol idc lol because no offense your opinion about it doesnt matter. Until people realize that this can be the case for most classes, then pvp will always be a l2play issue rather then a balance need. People get so accustom to that a certain class can do this and that and cannot beat this and that and loses to this and that all the time. Yeah funny because 90% of them don’t play those classes to its fullest potential to begin with.

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

Idk why when i type (L2p) issue it rewords it as (l2 kitten ue)? Wtf lol

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Never even heard of you that’s all that matters. And as far as kaypud, kaypud is better then 98% of the dps guards that play his build and play dps guard anyway. But I will say no more. But you been playing with the top teams for months? Never even heard of you or seen you. And playing against them occasionally doesn’t mean anything specially when you don’t win no offense. And before you say it’ll be hilarious maybe you should win like those guys did before you even say anything. Even off oppa wasn’t that great he probably won way more then you did and played for one of the best teams to play sPvP.

So it was them.

They quit playing before the current trap ranger setup was used and learned, hence why the comparison is a joke.

As for my credentials, I’ve played enough to be known. Which team did you play for? Not that it really matters at this point, I’m just curious as to why you’re so angry. Every good team disbanded and left after the last SotG.

First of all it was not them lol. Second I’m not angry. This is the Internet and you cannot tell whether or not I’m angry lol. This is just how I am. It also doesn’t matter what team I played for but I’m just saying you have not been in the top games with us and never seen you. This comparison is a joke because I’ve said most people have a l2 kitten ue before balance is even needed. Rangers cannot beat a dps guardian 90% of the time when the l2 kitten ue not a factor.

Well, if you’re going to refuse to tell me which team you’re on, I guess I’m gonna have to go and call your bullkitten. Rangers have never had less than a 2:8 matchup against guardians. With res pet, its pretty much 0:10.

If you think running judge’s is something rangers don’t know how to deal with, you’re wrong, but I have no idea what you’re talking about because you’re refusing to provide details.

Offensive guardians have a number of poor 1v1 matchups, but they pair very well in 2v2s, where they set up a number of other classes.

Anyways, we clearly don’t agree. You’re making an appeal to authority with nothing to back it up and I’m not really willing to sit here dealing with the same fallacy repeatedly.

Nothing can beat us 1v1 unless consistently unless its an ele and that is 50/50. That is all I have to say about that. I have no reason to because it doesn’t matter. No one spvp’s anymore but if the day comes where we all come back to spvp, you will then realize it lol. You don’t to believe me lol idc lol because no offense your opinion about it doesnt matter. Until people realize that this can be the case for most classes, then pvp will always be a l2 kitten ue rather then a balance need. People get so accustom to that a certain class can do this and that and cannot beat this and that and loses to this and that all the time. Yeah funny because 90% of them don’t play those classes to its fullest potential to begin with.

Yeah, just figured out who you were, and I checked our ranger’s reps, and you don’t have a single 1v1 win against him.

Days transcript: “He’s running the huge heavy nuke build and if you’re not an idiot and get off point, he drops instantly. Morph is.. pfft. Now that all the first tier people left, all these second tier players have a big ego over nothing”

I know every individual who our backpoint ranger had issues with because I was the first to rotate to him. You were never an issue.

Sorry Sataar. Didn’t mean for this to kitten up your thread. I’m done replying to captain smallfry.

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Never even heard of you that’s all that matters. And as far as kaypud, kaypud is better then 98% of the dps guards that play his build and play dps guard anyway. But I will say no more. But you been playing with the top teams for months? Never even heard of you or seen you. And playing against them occasionally doesn’t mean anything specially when you don’t win no offense. And before you say it’ll be hilarious maybe you should win like those guys did before you even say anything. Even off oppa wasn’t that great he probably won way more then you did and played for one of the best teams to play sPvP.

So it was them.

They quit playing before the current trap ranger setup was used and learned, hence why the comparison is a joke.

As for my credentials, I’ve played enough to be known. Which team did you play for? Not that it really matters at this point, I’m just curious as to why you’re so angry. Every good team disbanded and left after the last SotG.

First of all it was not them lol. Second I’m not angry. This is the Internet and you cannot tell whether or not I’m angry lol. This is just how I am. It also doesn’t matter what team I played for but I’m just saying you have not been in the top games with us and never seen you. This comparison is a joke because I’ve said most people have a l2 kitten ue before balance is even needed. Rangers cannot beat a dps guardian 90% of the time when the l2 kitten ue not a factor.

Well, if you’re going to refuse to tell me which team you’re on, I guess I’m gonna have to go and call your bullkitten. Rangers have never had less than a 2:8 matchup against guardians. With res pet, its pretty much 0:10.

If you think running judge’s is something rangers don’t know how to deal with, you’re wrong, but I have no idea what you’re talking about because you’re refusing to provide details.

Offensive guardians have a number of poor 1v1 matchups, but they pair very well in 2v2s, where they set up a number of other classes.

Anyways, we clearly don’t agree. You’re making an appeal to authority with nothing to back it up and I’m not really willing to sit here dealing with the same fallacy repeatedly.

Nothing can beat us 1v1 unless consistently unless its an ele and that is 50/50. That is all I have to say about that. I have no reason to because it doesn’t matter. No one spvp’s anymore but if the day comes where we all come back to spvp, you will then realize it lol. You don’t to believe me lol idc lol because no offense your opinion about it doesnt matter. Until people realize that this can be the case for most classes, then pvp will always be a l2 kitten ue rather then a balance need. People get so accustom to that a certain class can do this and that and cannot beat this and that and loses to this and that all the time. Yeah funny because 90% of them don’t play those classes to its fullest potential to begin with.

Yeah, just figured out who you were, and I checked our ranger’s reps, and you don’t have a single 1v1 win against him.

Days transcript: “He’s running the huge heavy nuke build and if you’re not an idiot and get off point, he drops instantly. Morph is.. pfft. Now that all the first tier people left, all these second tier players have a big ego over nothing”

I know every individual who our backpoint ranger had issues with because I was the first to rotate to him. You were never an issue.

Sorry Sataar. Didn’t mean for this to kitten up your thread. I’m done replying to captain smallfry.

Lol before you’re friend over there whatever his name is makes a comment, he should be a good player first. We are talkin about top players. Only time ive ever played days is when ive pugged. Good joke. Days as everyone knows has a big mouth and nothing to back it up lol. Btw you said he’s beaten me in a 1v1? If that’s what makes him sleep at night. But its cool let rangers like him keep assuming that. Then when they lose keep qqing lol. All to good for me. Btw did I meantion days? lolol Good joke (hibas voice)

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

lilz shorty.1879:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz,

Trap ranger beats offensive guardians 100% of the time with a comfortable amount of health remaining without using their ult.

Timewarp doesn’t really change up a fight, because players playing against a mesmer will generally dip earlier in order to prevent themselves from getting spiked and then quickness stomped. Mesmers are rather weak in team fight situations, and the longer they hold timewarp, the worse a position their team is in. Mesmers have very telegraphed spikes with shatters, and aoe on points typically clears clones and phantasms quickly, severely reducing their damage output. A backpoint trap ranger, for instance, can drop a huge amount of damage on point, bring significant cc with his pets, drop an ult which provides more anti-pressure and 180 degree capability than timewarp, and does so in a package which is harder to drop.

More importantly, trap rangers BURN GUARDIANS DOWN HARRRRRRRRRRD, which pressures teams incredibly hard, as a guardian has trouble dropping off point and guardians force a backline character up to get cleaved on his corpse. Additionally, his down 2 state is very telegraphed and blindable, and stab stompable, which means the other guardian on-point is in a very good position to drop him. Mesmers don’t apply that much pressure to guardians when their clones are being cleared and don’t have the bulk to extend to hit backline characters.

You my friend have it completely backwards.

First of all skill and awareness is the number one thing in this game. Counter classes dont matter. Rangers do counter guardians hard but no ranger can beat a good and well played dps guardian ever lmao. You probably wouldn’t know because all the good players cease to play anyway and there is only one guaridan who was able to beat all rangers 1v1 unless he had no cd’s.

As far as mesmers, like I said, skill is an important factor including your teammates whether or not your Mesmer uses it offensively or defensively. As a top player or team, you know ahead of time the team will back out of time warp so your team should know what to do accordingly. Same goes for when you use it defensively. Timewarp is by far the biggest skill changer in high level tournament games. BY FAR and nothing is even close when time warp is used right.

please dont turn this into a argument or do belittling things like LMAO there is no need for that. now when i step in i will tell you from the games i seen the rangers beat the dps guards 80% + the time. all the above classes beat it plus my mesmer off point beats it and off point and in the overal points per second in a 1 min time the other classes beat the dps guard.

I’m not belittling anyone but being myself. And I’m clearing stating the truth. If you want to balance something you have to take what can be done when the class is actually played well. MOST do not play it well and is why 80% of classes beat it. A lot are also just copying build without realizing that the one they’d are copying is not that great in the first place. That’s like saying that everyone thought ele was bad and beat it 1v1 constantly all the time because no one knew how to play it well. Does that mean its not that great? No lol. Anet has mentioned it in a state of game and a lot of times balances are not the issue as it is a L2play issue. Balance in this game is fine for some classes and people just don’t realize it. Skill is the biggest factor in this game.

ty for clarifying and im glad for your input. maybe the great dps guards we used were not the best but they wer e pretty dang good and we ran our tests more then 1 or 2 times against each class and build. next time i do some test i might ask you to come help us out or if karl does get the best 3 of each class so i can show him all the numbers i have then i can mention you. but to be honest i never seen a scarey dps guard and dont find them as useful as a bunker guard and for what they can bring i would pick any class i scored above them to fulfil the dps guard role.. and no i dont think kaypud or oppa was to intemidating. kaypud would get me off point but i beat him 95% of the time and after practicing with folly when folly wanted to do it it took folly 30 trys before he beat me one and after he got used to it was way better then kaypud at it.

you are a great dps guard dont think im saying otherwise this post isnt a personal attack on anyone its just the facts that i have in front of me. we will be able to run better tests if karl wants to. i just want a balanced game and for him to say he balances the game by listining to the forums makes me so upset

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

Lol recruited me? I was never an option to be recruited rofl especially by you guys rofl. Good joke stop trying to flatter yourself as if you guys were ever even close to being considered being a top team rofl. And screw the no offenses lol but dont make me die over here of laughter lmao. Days and his ego blinds him so much and your team like he you guys were ever even considered good by top players. Anyway sorry sataar but I was making a valid statement but this guy lol…………..

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

lilz shorty.1879:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz,

Trap ranger beats offensive guardians 100% of the time with a comfortable amount of health remaining without using their ult.

Timewarp doesn’t really change up a fight, because players playing against a mesmer will generally dip earlier in order to prevent themselves from getting spiked and then quickness stomped. Mesmers are rather weak in team fight situations, and the longer they hold timewarp, the worse a position their team is in. Mesmers have very telegraphed spikes with shatters, and aoe on points typically clears clones and phantasms quickly, severely reducing their damage output. A backpoint trap ranger, for instance, can drop a huge amount of damage on point, bring significant cc with his pets, drop an ult which provides more anti-pressure and 180 degree capability than timewarp, and does so in a package which is harder to drop.

More importantly, trap rangers BURN GUARDIANS DOWN HARRRRRRRRRRD, which pressures teams incredibly hard, as a guardian has trouble dropping off point and guardians force a backline character up to get cleaved on his corpse. Additionally, his down 2 state is very telegraphed and blindable, and stab stompable, which means the other guardian on-point is in a very good position to drop him. Mesmers don’t apply that much pressure to guardians when their clones are being cleared and don’t have the bulk to extend to hit backline characters.

You my friend have it completely backwards.

First of all skill and awareness is the number one thing in this game. Counter classes dont matter. Rangers do counter guardians hard but no ranger can beat a good and well played dps guardian ever lmao. You probably wouldn’t know because all the good players cease to play anyway and there is only one guaridan who was able to beat all rangers 1v1 unless he had no cd’s.

As far as mesmers, like I said, skill is an important factor including your teammates whether or not your Mesmer uses it offensively or defensively. As a top player or team, you know ahead of time the team will back out of time warp so your team should know what to do accordingly. Same goes for when you use it defensively. Timewarp is by far the biggest skill changer in high level tournament games. BY FAR and nothing is even close when time warp is used right.

please dont turn this into a argument or do belittling things like LMAO there is no need for that. now when i step in i will tell you from the games i seen the rangers beat the dps guards 80% + the time. all the above classes beat it plus my mesmer off point beats it and off point and in the overal points per second in a 1 min time the other classes beat the dps guard.

I’m not belittling anyone but being myself. And I’m clearing stating the truth. If you want to balance something you have to take what can be done when the class is actually played well. MOST do not play it well and is why 80% of classes beat it. A lot are also just copying build without realizing that the one they’d are copying is not that great in the first place. That’s like saying that everyone thought ele was bad and beat it 1v1 constantly all the time because no one knew how to play it well. Does that mean its not that great? No lol. Anet has mentioned it in a state of game and a lot of times balances are not the issue as it is a L2play issue. Balance in this game is fine for some classes and people just don’t realize it. Skill is the biggest factor in this game.

ty for clarifying and im glad for your input. maybe the great dps guards we used were not the best but they wer e pretty dang good and we ran our tests more then 1 or 2 times against each class and build. next time i do some test i might ask you to come help us out or if karl does get the best 3 of each class so i can show him all the numbers i have then i can mention you. but to be honest i never seen a scarey dps guard and dont find them as useful as a bunker guard and for what they can bring i would pick any class i scored above them to fulfil the dps guard role.. and no i dont think kaypud or oppa was to intemidating. kaypud would get me off point but i beat him 95% of the time and after practicing with folly when folly wanted to do it it took folly 30 trys before he beat me one and after he got used to it was way better then kaypud at it.

Hah no i completely understand where you are coming from which is why I wanted to inform you guys that if its just played well its really hard to beat. And im not talking kaypuds build. Kaypuds build requires you to be on point. And like I said it depends on your comp as to what would be better in terms of dps or bunker. Both work just as well.

You guys are so incredibly awesome. Every single one of you.

Also, since the game is dying without ever having even taken off and required some skill, you’ll also all be able to tell your friends how back in the day, you were the kitten in GW2 for years to come.

Med.6150:

You guys are so incredibly awesome. Every single one of you.

Also, since the game is dying without ever having even taken off and required some skill, you’ll also all be able to tell your friends how back in the day, you were the kitten in GW2 for years to come.

Ty and Nope i got other things I could brag about irl but id rather not. Anyway lol the game isnt dying. sPvP died. WvW and pve are still thriving pretty strong and will be after march 26th too. Maybe even stronger lol.

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

Lol recruited me? I was never an option to be recruited rofl especially by you guys rofl. Good joke stop trying to flatter yourself as if you guys were ever even close to being considered being a top team rofl. And screw the no offenses lol but dont make me die over here of laughter lmao. Days and his ego blinds him so much and your team like he you guys were ever even considered good by top players. Anyway sorry sataar but I was making a valid statement but this guy lol…………..

You’re pretty good at reading. I like that you believe I’m talking to you when I’ve quoted someone else, though.

Please don’t die from laughter though, I’m trying to enjoy some non-lethal e-drama before retiring out of this game. For the record, I don’t think kaypud’s build is even a tad decent against opponents who don’t have a fetish for sitting in symbols, which is why no one’s run that trash for over 3 (4?) months.

nerva.7940:

Point capping is the lamest crap. This is why I left tpvp. Lots more interesting things to do in wvw.

Way more interesting things to do in WvW and the intensity is there! Will we get rolled by 20 people while trying to cap this camp with just the 3 of us? IDK but lets try! And you don’t know if they person that is strolling up on you is a Mesmer/necro/ele if they are a guard or a war… if you are about to get one shotted… Or if that person is really 30 people and culling wins. :P In tPvP you can see the professions on the other time and have an Idea of what is coming. In wvw you don’t know if the reason this tower/camp is contested is because of NPC’s or a real threat and you are about to lose your supply to that keep that you are trying to fortify! TPvP is fun but honestly it is catered to way to much compared to the population of people there.

jportell.2197:

nerva.7940:

Point capping is the lamest crap. This is why I left tpvp. Lots more interesting things to do in wvw.

Way more interesting things to do in WvW and the intensity is there! Will we get rolled by 20 people while trying to cap this camp with just the 3 of us? IDK but lets try! And you don’t know if they person that is strolling up on you is a Mesmer/necro/ele if they are a guard or a war… if you are about to get one shotted… Or if that person is really 30 people and culling wins. :P In tPvP you can see the professions on the other time and have an Idea of what is coming. In wvw you don’t know if the reason this tower/camp is contested is because of NPC’s or a real threat and you are about to lose your supply to that keep that you are trying to fortify! TPvP is fun but honestly it is catered to way to much compared to the population of people there.

How anyone enjoys WvW with the current culling I do not know.
It’s like Planetside2, if Planetside 2 got the flu.
.

ensoriki.5789:

jportell.2197:

nerva.7940:

Point capping is the lamest crap. This is why I left tpvp. Lots more interesting things to do in wvw.

Way more interesting things to do in WvW and the intensity is there! Will we get rolled by 20 people while trying to cap this camp with just the 3 of us? IDK but lets try! And you don’t know if they person that is strolling up on you is a Mesmer/necro/ele if they are a guard or a war… if you are about to get one shotted… Or if that person is really 30 people and culling wins. :P In tPvP you can see the professions on the other time and have an Idea of what is coming. In wvw you don’t know if the reason this tower/camp is contested is because of NPC’s or a real threat and you are about to lose your supply to that keep that you are trying to fortify! TPvP is fun but honestly it is catered to way to much compared to the population of people there.

How anyone enjoys WvW with the current culling I do not know.
It’s like Planetside2, if Planetside 2 got the flu.
.

Decent hardware? And culling is being fixed and people with decent hardware hardly (if at all) have issues with culling. Here’s a “pro” hint stop running with the zerg to farm karma/gold… If you are being part of a siege but aren’t on a piece of equipment be useful! Look at your map see if the camp closest to your objective is capped. If not get some buddies that are also standing there with thumb in body cavity to go and get that camp. If you just helped build a piece of siege go GET MORE SUPPLY! If you are defending you don’t always need to jump down the walls and Rambo kitten (even though tis fun!) You can do way more on an arrow cart or a counter catapult. If you have just capped something. Be a bro. Pay for that first upgrade… Ask some people how upgrades are going in other things that have just been capped. The biggest reason people lose stuff in WvW is they don’t take time to do the basic house keeping that comes along with it and then complain because they lost something… It’s like they go into it expecting the large scale equivalent of PvP with the same amount of effort. No it takes way more to be successful and requires way more communication because in WvW you don’t have 10 people fighting over 3 points and NPC’s/Buffs/Lords/Orbs you have 100s of people possibly fighting over several different objectives in a huge map. That is why WvW is more appealing to people like Nerva.

says “Current”.
gets long speech.

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

Lol recruited me? I was never an option to be recruited rofl especially by you guys rofl. Good joke stop trying to flatter yourself as if you guys were ever even close to being considered being a top team rofl. And screw the no offenses lol but dont make me die over here of laughter lmao. Days and his ego blinds him so much and your team like he you guys were ever even considered good by top players. Anyway sorry sataar but I was making a valid statement but this guy lol…………..

You’re pretty good at reading. I like that you believe I’m talking to you when I’ve quoted someone else, though.

Please don’t die from laughter though, I’m trying to enjoy some non-lethal e-drama before retiring out of this game. For the record, I don’t think kaypud’s build is even a tad decent against opponents who don’t have a fetish for sitting in symbols, which is why no one’s run that trash for over 3 (4?) months.

Well I am sorry lol did not notice that. I will admit my fault lol. But davinci is one of the best bunkers if not the best. So idk why you would pass over him b4 trying him lol. Me and davinci ran the worst comp in the world against even the cheesy comps (double ele, ranger, etc…) and other comps that counter us and still won. Should give people a chance lol because they might be the right fit for you but davinci was being recruited by others anyway. And people still ran kaypuds build up till last patch lol. Idk what happened after that lol.

As far as retiring from the game/spvp, you should lol. Most of us have anyway. Ive come back actually but not to spvp lol.

ensoriki.5789:

jportell.2197:

nerva.7940:

Point capping is the lamest crap. This is why I left tpvp. Lots more interesting things to do in wvw.

Way more interesting things to do in WvW and the intensity is there! Will we get rolled by 20 people while trying to cap this camp with just the 3 of us? IDK but lets try! And you don’t know if they person that is strolling up on you is a Mesmer/necro/ele if they are a guard or a war… if you are about to get one shotted… Or if that person is really 30 people and culling wins. :P In tPvP you can see the professions on the other time and have an Idea of what is coming. In wvw you don’t know if the reason this tower/camp is contested is because of NPC’s or a real threat and you are about to lose your supply to that keep that you are trying to fortify! TPvP is fun but honestly it is catered to way to much compared to the population of people there.

How anyone enjoys WvW with the current culling I do not know.
It’s like Planetside2, if Planetside 2 got the flu.
.

True the culling is annoying and why anet would ever include it in PVE or PvP without the option to turn it off or some way of indicating there are more people there is beyond me. But WvW is actually a lot of fun lol. Even the zerg fests can be when they become big battles of assaulting a keep/defending from the enemies. Plus the pve stats are so nice lol compared to sPvP.

lilz shorty.1879:

ensoriki.5789:

jportell.2197:

nerva.7940:

Point capping is the lamest crap. This is why I left tpvp. Lots more interesting things to do in wvw.

Way more interesting things to do in WvW and the intensity is there! Will we get rolled by 20 people while trying to cap this camp with just the 3 of us? IDK but lets try! And you don’t know if they person that is strolling up on you is a Mesmer/necro/ele if they are a guard or a war… if you are about to get one shotted… Or if that person is really 30 people and culling wins. :P In tPvP you can see the professions on the other time and have an Idea of what is coming. In wvw you don’t know if the reason this tower/camp is contested is because of NPC’s or a real threat and you are about to lose your supply to that keep that you are trying to fortify! TPvP is fun but honestly it is catered to way to much compared to the population of people there.

How anyone enjoys WvW with the current culling I do not know.
It’s like Planetside2, if Planetside 2 got the flu.
.

True the culling is annoying and why anet would ever include it in PVE or PvP without the option to turn it off or some way of indicating there are more people there is beyond me. But WvW is actually a lot of fun lol. Even the zerg fests can be when they become big battles of assaulting a keep/defending from the enemies. Plus the pve stats are so nice lol compared to sPvP.

I enjoyed it for a bit before I just started seeing it as silly, and having god-mode felt stupid. I’ll play it more fruitfully after the patch makes it more ideal.

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

Why would I ever want to be recruited by a scrub team like yours? I was always in between a couple of teams, and I would never consider joining eG, ever.
eG has never beaten me once… They were never a good team, ever.
Why would I join a team that never wins? That doesn’t make much sense :/

Days is a horrible ranger who only ever talks and never wins. He is a 6/10 if Vyndetta is a 10/10 and Days has never given a good match against good teams.
Even when only frees were popping, your team was mediocre and would lose to random, unknown teams all the time.

It’s funny because I’ve only ever thought of eG as a JOKE and now you’re trying to tell me that they were a GOOD team? You have a GOOD sense of humour.
Archer Hencman. You’re that thief that thinks he can only be useful spamming 1 in shortbow.

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

Lol recruited me? I was never an option to be recruited rofl especially by you guys rofl. Good joke stop trying to flatter yourself as if you guys were ever even close to being considered being a top team rofl. And screw the no offenses lol but dont make me die over here of laughter lmao. Days and his ego blinds him so much and your team like he you guys were ever even considered good by top players. Anyway sorry sataar but I was making a valid statement but this guy lol…………..

You’re pretty good at reading. I like that you believe I’m talking to you when I’ve quoted someone else, though.

Please don’t die from laughter though, I’m trying to enjoy some non-lethal e-drama before retiring out of this game. For the record, I don’t think kaypud’s build is even a tad decent against opponents who don’t have a fetish for sitting in symbols, which is why no one’s run that trash for over 3 (4?) months.

Well I am sorry lol did not notice that. I will admit my fault lol. But davinci is one of the best bunkers if not the best. So idk why you would pass over him b4 trying him lol. Me and davinci ran the worst comp in the world against even the cheesy comps (double ele, ranger, etc…) and other comps that counter us and still won. Should give people a chance lol because they might be the right fit for you but davinci was being recruited by others anyway. And people still ran kaypuds build up till last patch lol. Idk what happened after that lol.

As far as retiring from the game/spvp, you should lol. Most of us have anyway. Ive come back actually but not to spvp lol.

Yep. I’m considering dusting off my PvE character and going out and killing dragons or some kitten.

We were looking to recruit before temple came out, and our guardian, and our replays, showed that davinci had significant weaknesses on kyhlo. Intense was very impressive, but he ended up quitting. We ended up going with someone else in the end. That’s not to poop on davinci, though. He improved quite a bit after we filled our roster. He’s easily in the top 3 guardians atm, but at this point that doesn’t mean very much.

I dunno. I’m just disappointed as kitten in this game. I was pretty caustic earlier because of that, so I apologize (although I’d still throw down fat stax o cash on ranger in ranger v guard, but we’ll just have to disagree there). Maybe we’ll do fractals or some carebear kitten one day.

Peace.

Amaterasu.6280:

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

nice well thought out reply but you didnt say anything really positive about the thief how did you come up with a 6.5? what was that number compared to?

remember you need to take in account can it back cap can it hold nodes and can it neatralize against someone then for what time duration if any then factor in what classes can do what it does and or cant do and what score that class has. if you compare it to every class above it using my scores you will see it falls well short of the bar and IMO 6.5 is to good of a score in comparrison.

You’re right, I was hitting 6.5 based off of my own scale from 1-10. I should have adjusted that via your comparisons. In that case, your scale reflects the current game balance pretty accurately.

However I do feel that there are some variables within that scale which should shift those numbers depending on the team comp/requirements.

Since I play thief, let’s just take thief as an example.

Nowadays a thief is always the roamer right? He don’t need to, nor should he be neuting or holding points…it’s not his job. Backcapping when the time is right, yes, but approaching 1v1 fights especially against trap rangers/guards in desire to neut would be a stupid idea unless you know for sure you can 1v1 them. So now, according to your important aspects of the game, the thief has holding + neuting points crossed out -

That is a bit unfair imo, because we are talking about team play here…and team play means that a roamer could very well sacrifice the ability to hold+neut points because someone else in the team would fulfill that role. The problem with neuting + holding is just that…they have to stay there…and once they leave they would be trying to fulfill the role of the roamer and the point is now left empty. A roamer shouldn’t be holding+capping points so they could capitalize on their role:

The roaming thief is the one to come in mid-fight to change tides especially if it’s a 1v1 or 1v2 before the thief gets there. If it was a 1v1 before, that other person is going to be dead unless it somehow gets away…but even a ele can’t run away from me unless I have shadowstep on cd. If it was a 1v2 before, then it’s now pretty much an even fight. A thief brings so much burst that any non-bunker class would automatically start to be more alert so they don’t get bursted down instantly. Besides a 100n engi, there really isn’t any other class that can bring that much burst in such a short time. I am omitting 100b wars because more often than not, it can be broken out of because of the sheer time it takes for the 100b to execute through even with haste.

What I’m trying to say is, though your scale (in analyzing the class alone) may be valid in terms of Capping, Holding, Neutralizing, and Team Fights, there is definitely much more determining factors shifting those numbers depending on the team comps of both parties.

Though I can agree (and who can’t?) that Eles are the god-tier class still…no other class can cap/neut like rangers/engis, roam like thieves, teamfight + drop burning fields and share auras, all while being able to survive and put out good dps. It’s silly, but it’s just how eles are…and from what it seems from the last SOTG…Karl tends to think that eles are perfectly fine.

i replied earlier that as a thief and warrior can play my position almost as well as me. and i took that into account when i made my scores for them all. i put the thief so close to mesmer because i feel they can do what i do just about the same. and they are pretty even with mesmers in 1v1 and damgae per second based off a minute fight in every scenario. but the thing that put them jjust below mesmer was the holding a point part.

i made this list to correctly reflect the classes and i dont want to give any class more then it deserves because i want the true score to represent the class so we can fix the balance in the game.

im not saying you but there will be a lot of ppl that read this thread that will take it as a personal attack. im not saying they are bad or great this is all based off of the class specifically. and i fell there needs to be big changes and frequent not little pointless underwater balance once every 2 months.

lilz shorty.1879:

Idk why when i type (L2p) issue it rewords it as (l2 kitten ue)? Wtf lol

because of my big (l2 p) post it made them add it as a bad word.

now get back on the topic.

Totally agree dude, I just wanted to make discussion. I enjoy threads like this, minus the side drama.

Amaterasu.6280:

Totally agree dude, I just wanted to make discussion. I enjoy threads like this, minus the side drama.

yeah its a great thread IMO and its bound to lead to heavy debates. i dont mind the side drama cause the cause of it is over the main issue which is the balance. i would want karl to set aside the arguing and we take top of every class and we put them in every situation and calculate the outcome but not only the outcome but the total dps done and recieved by each player and how long it takes to win or lose vs each player then start adding 2v2 3v3 4v4 5v5 yes it takes time but the game took what 5 years to make? this is what should have been hapining for 5 years

Can everybody stop fighting seriously?

As to the clarification Sataar:
I don’t either class is bad, both can easily be played in the current meta and can specialize into a role as well as any other proffession. Mesmer is extremely good at burst and Necro is extremely good at AoE Cond DPS.

Mesmers are very good at bursting players down in team fights, with a Guardian controlling for them they have a really high chance to burst down an enemy. Shatter Mesmers are really strong 1v1, even though their burst is easily dodged they can fake it out a lot, and dodge + mirror or blink + mirror shatters aren’t dodgable if done correctly. They have portal for the most insane map movement there is, even if you’re using it for an ally to go back to close, or to go straight for lord on Foefire (especially since you can still staff 2 past the back door on red base(bug?)). And their burst defence is exceptional, their weakness is in conditions, which in teamfight you have your Guardian with Soldiers and PoV so that’s only present in 1v1’s.

Necros are really strong in team fights but they rely on their allies for defence, yes they have DS and Fears but they’re first to be focused and have to spend a lot of utility keeping themselves alive, when somebody goes down though they pretty much control whether they live or die (either team). But due to their focus in high AoE DPS they sacrifice self defence and can be focused down really fast even with DS. And definitely can’t manage 1v1’s unless spec’d for it.

Then a lot of people forget team comps, most people just think of what they can do specifically by themselves (ie, Guardian support well, Necro has awesome teamfights) but can you actually fit this in your team. If you have a Necro you don’t need a Mesmer, this is because of the Boon removal, you roll cond damage and boon removal into one class this opens you up to run thief or warrior. But I think it’s a lot better with Mesmer, you’ll end up running Ranger which has a lot more survivability and single target DPS aswell as AoE DPS.
But I definitely feel due to the ease of being focused with no real self defence the Necro isn’t as strong as the Mesmer, who has a lot of self defence skills to protect itself and can match the Necro’s utility.

There is a lot of chest thumping in this thread which is highly unnecessary, those who play the game and still somewhat shine are just leftovers. There is no pride to take in that, just calm down and try to enjoy the game for what you can get out of it. If your enjoyment stems from how high your ranking is on the NA ladder then you should probably just stop right now because you are embarrassing yourself.

Now to topic, I don’t agree with many of the original ratings that were given in the thread. However if I analyze it in an off-node 1v1 situation more of them start to make sense however Thief, Mesmer and Guardian are still far too low in their comparative ratings. I think independent ratings should be given for each role such as off-node, de-cap, team fight, survivability, and support(stomp/rez/buffs). I just think that there is much that your assessments leave out, I do believe warrior is in a bad place at the moment but definitely not a 3/10.

On a sidenote, why the fascination with entangling roots. Every class has MANY ways to get out of this ability, if it hits in the first place any teleport, condition removal, block, invuln or dodge will instantly negate its effect. It is one of the easiest countered elites in the game and as such you will have to wait until the entire group wastes their abilities to have it work to its full effect, however this will never happen so you camp one target instead bypassing the entire aoe effect. The only side-bonus is this ability can deal with any summoned pets rather well only because the AI is so bad or they would get themselves out

The Class-Ratings are well made. Comes really near to my opinion. Well a 3 for warrior is a bit hard, though he has Battle-Standard, is the best class against downed ppl (100b, whirlwind = nearly impossible to get a person up) and brings generally some great dmg input to teamfights. The things is timing and know when to retreat. Also a warrior can’t be left allone, but as roam support it can work out pretty good.

Ranger 9/10 in the aspect of a 1v1 or 2v2 he’s pretty effective, also roots are destroying. If it comes to bigger teamfights like 4v4 mid-fights then he looses against other classes its value due to nearly no dmg and bleeding remove through different classes (e.g. guardian; ele). Prolly would set him to an 8/10.

Oh good, quality drama before bed!

Davinci, I’ll have you recall that the last time we played, I ran a clinic on your team with a pug, carrying mine to a solid 500-1X0 victory and then your half your group quit GW and migrated over to playing smite. Sataar was in the game. Hman was as well. I neutered both of them, and mace skull cracked you three times for three downs leading to three won midfights.

Ah hee hee hee. Too bad it wasn’t recorded. I’da highlight reeled half my plays that game.
——-

Okay, okay. Enough bravado. Back to the topic:

So to go back to the game above. Yes, its possible to dictate the flow of a match as a thief. I played a nearly perfect game in terms of timing, positioning and skill use, but it still felt like, as a thief, I was only capitalizing on the mistakes that others had made wrt to their approach to me, because despite setting the pace, I knew exactly what could be done to flip the tables. In order to counter that counter, I need a team set up to make my class work, which is absurd.

While I think thief is a solid 5/10, that doesn’t mean they can’t be played, it just means they need to get a bit more creative with their play. If my positioning is even a bit off, I’m done. If I misspend any initiative that I need to escape, I die. This isn’t really an issue, but the pay-off for success isn’t that high relative to the risk.

Team comps can cover up the issues with a weaker class,. War + Ele, for instance. Thief requires reliable cc for peeling and spike setups. Mesmers a safe midline and a few allies who can capitalize on timewarp (non-lich necro, for instance? bad at timewarps T_T).

I think that the effectiveness of classes was never really measured in a vaccuum, but most exploitative comps haven’t exploited synergies. They’ve just taken multiple copies of the class with the best matchups and set them loose around the map to force rotations and gain map control.

Will a change in balancing philosophy to focus on issues that class synergies create solve the problems in GW2? Maybe, but only in the future where those synergies are the driving force behind team composition. Because matches are so atomized outside of the big mid team-fight, its impossible to rely on synergies to make an individual’s build work.

Accordingly, if the only element that everyone needs to work together for is a team fight mid, then it explains why all of Sataar’s criteria point towards the ability to bomb the kitten out of a point with aoe, or conversely survive that assault (sidepoint shenanigans are an issue because of them forcing people to rotate off the clusterkitten mid). Even spirit and temple’s mechanics turn into pseudo points (with the exception of the orb run itself, which again, is dominated by eles), so the same set of criteria reproduce themselves.

Re: Jax’s post

I think a lot of what was said there is correct. Lots of people just toss the classes they play together with a group of people they play with, and run with whatever. Many builds and setups aren’t really selected in order to have cross-class synergy (see above for why I think that is)

I wouldn’t argue that mesmers are better than necros. Mesmers might have a better trick in offensive portals and timewar kitten olid but overall their damage on point is predictable to dodge or blind and difficult to set up. Necros provide substantial damage in aoe + cc. Signet res is also more stronger than illusion of life if its precasted or stability goes up for some insurance.

Re: Taym.

Binding roots kittens on a few classes to the point where it feels like they’ve just been removed from the fight. Necros, rangers, mesmers, engineers without nades up etc. end up very vulnerable. Eles who have blown their combo and end up in an attunement like water, similarly, get stuck. Warriors end up being a solid counter to binding roots, as are thieves and offensive guardians, as each can clear multiple roots off your team nearly instantly.

Since the above vulnerable groups are the dangerous classes, people use roots. Res pet, by contrast, does very well against spiky teams, as a warrior/thief can down someone, then their target gets up and the warrior/thief has no juice left and 1/3rd of his hp.

I don’t think warrior is quite at a 3/10 in theory, but in practice, frost and shocking aura are absurdly strong anti-warrior tools in team fights, and they’re not even brought to deal with warriors specifically.

Lol this post is long. Time to go to sleep.

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

Lol recruited me? I was never an option to be recruited rofl especially by you guys rofl. Good joke stop trying to flatter yourself as if you guys were ever even close to being considered being a top team rofl. And screw the no offenses lol but dont make me die over here of laughter lmao. Days and his ego blinds him so much and your team like he you guys were ever even considered good by top players. Anyway sorry sataar but I was making a valid statement but this guy lol…………..

You’re pretty good at reading. I like that you believe I’m talking to you when I’ve quoted someone else, though.

Please don’t die from laughter though, I’m trying to enjoy some non-lethal e-drama before retiring out of this game. For the record, I don’t think kaypud’s build is even a tad decent against opponents who don’t have a fetish for sitting in symbols, which is why no one’s run that trash for over 3 (4?) months.

Well I am sorry lol did not notice that. I will admit my fault lol. But davinci is one of the best bunkers if not the best. So idk why you would pass over him b4 trying him lol. Me and davinci ran the worst comp in the world against even the cheesy comps (double ele, ranger, etc…) and other comps that counter us and still won. Should give people a chance lol because they might be the right fit for you but davinci was being recruited by others anyway. And people still ran kaypuds build up till last patch lol. Idk what happened after that lol.

As far as retiring from the game/spvp, you should lol. Most of us have anyway. Ive come back actually but not to spvp lol.

Yep. I’m considering dusting off my PvE character and going out and killing dragons or some kitten.

We were looking to recruit before temple came out, and our guardian, and our replays, showed that davinci had significant weaknesses on kyhlo. Intense was very impressive, but he ended up quitting. We ended up going with someone else in the end. That’s not to poop on davinci, though. He improved quite a bit after we filled our roster. He’s easily in the top 3 guardians atm, but at this point that doesn’t mean very much.

I dunno. I’m just disappointed as kitten in this game. I was pretty caustic earlier because of that, so I apologize (although I’d still throw down fat stax o cash on ranger in ranger v guard, but we’ll just have to disagree there). Maybe we’ll do fractals or some carebear kitten one day.

Peace.

I would have never joined, anyways. Your elitist mindset is backed by no amount of skill… eG is a crap team. I don’t know what planet you’re on.

Taym.8326:

On a sidenote, why the fascination with entangling roots. Every class has MANY ways to get out of this ability, if it hits in the first place any teleport, condition removal, block, invuln or dodge will instantly negate its effect. It is one of the easiest countered elites in the game and as such you will have to wait until the entire group wastes their abilities to have it work to its full effect, however this will never happen so you camp one target instead bypassing the entire aoe effect. The only side-bonus is this ability can deal with any summoned pets rather well only because the AI is so bad or they would get themselves out

Entangling roots is one if not THE best elite in the game for offense.

Not only does it entangle, it bleeds. For a LOT. its around 20k if condition build, the highest in the game.(also at a shorter duration than other high bleeds, necromancer’s cry).

It also has a relatively high hp if you used up your condition removal. Meaning condition builds and non-melee will have a harder time getting out by force.
—————————————————-
2minute cooldown and you have to consider: Not everyone is playing you 1v1 and this skill is aoe, you are deffinitely going to get some hits in on TOP of those bleeds.
—————————————-

But most other ultimates aren’t really that offensive(at least the ones used). And stability can always be stripped for the tranformation type. Its a great elite, but then again, ranger is primarily offensive in nature so its only natural.

Davinci.8027:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

lilz shorty.1879:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

@Archer Henchman..

I’m gonna be honest with you. I’d never heard of you before 1 week ago.
Lilz Shorty is actually Morfeus X in game and he used to play with Vexx. Me and him made TP Na stop playing because we crushed them so hard, so I have some memories with the fat lad.
He’s just too modest to say that he beat Vyndetta in 1v1s.
Kaypud is good, but from what I’ve seen, Morf is better, and he’s the only guardian who manages to match up against Vyndetta.

No disrespect to you, but I have never seen you in a top team before. Neither have I faced you, pre-SOTG/all teams leaving, and remembered you leaving a lasting impression.

We didn’t think very much of your skill either. We had a period wherein you were recruitable, and we passed you over twice. Don’t worry about it, though. I had a pretty large duration of not being able to play between november and january, so I’m not surprised that I’m off people’s radars. When we played, we only had issues with pz and qt. Once pz broke up and vain stopped playing, we didn’t really lose to anyone consistently.

But around that point half our players decided the game was kitten and left, which then happened to pretty much everyone, so competition past that point didn’t really mean very much.

Lol recruited me? I was never an option to be recruited rofl especially by you guys rofl. Good joke stop trying to flatter yourself as if you guys were ever even close to being considered being a top team rofl. And screw the no offenses lol but dont make me die over here of laughter lmao. Days and his ego blinds him so much and your team like he you guys were ever even considered good by top players. Anyway sorry sataar but I was making a valid statement but this guy lol…………..

You’re pretty good at reading. I like that you believe I’m talking to you when I’ve quoted someone else, though.

Please don’t die from laughter though, I’m trying to enjoy some non-lethal e-drama before retiring out of this game. For the record, I don’t think kaypud’s build is even a tad decent against opponents who don’t have a fetish for sitting in symbols, which is why no one’s run that trash for over 3 (4?) months.

Well I am sorry lol did not notice that. I will admit my fault lol. But davinci is one of the best bunkers if not the best. So idk why you would pass over him b4 trying him lol. Me and davinci ran the worst comp in the world against even the cheesy comps (double ele, ranger, etc…) and other comps that counter us and still won. Should give people a chance lol because they might be the right fit for you but davinci was being recruited by others anyway. And people still ran kaypuds build up till last patch lol. Idk what happened after that lol.

As far as retiring from the game/spvp, you should lol. Most of us have anyway. Ive come back actually but not to spvp lol.

Yep. I’m considering dusting off my PvE character and going out and killing dragons or some kitten.

We were looking to recruit before temple came out, and our guardian, and our replays, showed that davinci had significant weaknesses on kyhlo. Intense was very impressive, but he ended up quitting. We ended up going with someone else in the end. That’s not to poop on davinci, though. He improved quite a bit after we filled our roster. He’s easily in the top 3 guardians atm, but at this point that doesn’t mean very much.

I dunno. I’m just disappointed as kitten in this game. I was pretty caustic earlier because of that, so I apologize (although I’d still throw down fat stax o cash on ranger in ranger v guard, but we’ll just have to disagree there). Maybe we’ll do fractals or some carebear kitten one day.

Peace.

I would have never joined, anyways. Your elitist mindset is backed by no amount of skill… eG is a crap team. I don’t know what planet you’re on.

Okay buddy. When this game gets enough players to form up proper teams again, I’ll run another clinic on you. Until then, cutiepie

Archer Henchman.2534:

Oh good, quality drama before bed!

Davinci, I’ll have you recall that the last time we played, I ran a clinic on your team, carrying mine to a solid 500-1X0 victory and then your group quit playing and migrated over to playing smite. Sataar was in the game. Hman was as well. I neutered both of them, and mace skull cracked you three times for three downs leading to three won midfights.

So you’ve won 1 game out of maybe 50+ losses? GJ

Davinci.8027:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Oh good, quality drama before bed!

Davinci, I’ll have you recall that the last time we played, I ran a clinic on your team, carrying mine to a solid 500-1X0 victory and then your group quit playing and migrated over to playing smite. Sataar was in the game. Hman was as well. I neutered both of them, and mace skull cracked you three times for three downs leading to three won midfights.

So you’ve won 1 game out of maybe 50+ losses? GJ

We won 2 out of 5 games with a group of randoms we threw together against your team that night, and two of the matches we didn’t have our random ringers on voip.

Batting .600 against a pug? Feel proud. I hope smite treats you guys well.

Sleep time for real this time. Night night cutie

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Oh good, quality drama before bed!

Davinci, I’ll have you recall that the last time we played, I ran a clinic on your team, carrying mine to a solid 500-1X0 victory and then your group quit playing and migrated over to playing smite. Sataar was in the game. Hman was as well. I neutered both of them, and mace skull cracked you three times for three downs leading to three won midfights.

So you’ve won 1 game out of maybe 50+ losses? GJ

We won 2 out of 5 games with a group of randoms we threw together against your team that night, and two of the matches we didn’t have our random ringers on voip.

Batting .600 against a pug? Feel proud. I hope smite treats you guys well.

Sleep time for real this time. Night night cutie

So we had an off-night. Are you proud? Khalifa was playing d/d and we were messing around with some kitten… The sad thing is is that you put so much emphasis on those 2 wins…

I do remember destroying your main team 500 – 100 repeatedly back when people used to play, though. I remember a lot of teams used to do that to you.

You’re trying really hard to sound smart, but it’s not working.

In any case, it doesn’t matter at this point. Back when the game used to actually be competitive, you were no where on the scene, and your team was never even close to being considered one of the top teams…
I’m just really confused as to why you think you’re good :?

Davinci.8027:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Oh good, quality drama before bed!

Davinci, I’ll have you recall that the last time we played, I ran a clinic on your team, carrying mine to a solid 500-1X0 victory and then your group quit playing and migrated over to playing smite. Sataar was in the game. Hman was as well. I neutered both of them, and mace skull cracked you three times for three downs leading to three won midfights.

So you’ve won 1 game out of maybe 50+ losses? GJ

We won 2 out of 5 games with a group of randoms we threw together against your team that night, and two of the matches we didn’t have our random ringers on voip.

Batting .600 against a pug? Feel proud. I hope smite treats you guys well.

Sleep time for real this time. Night night cutie

So we had an off-night. Are you proud? Khalifa was playing d/d and we were messing around with some kitten… The sad thing is is that you put so much emphasis on those 2 wins…

I do remember destroying your main team 500 – 100 repeatedly back when people used to play, though. I remember a lot of teams used to do that to you.

You’re trying really hard to sound smart, but it’s not working.

In any case, it doesn’t matter at this point. Back when the game used to actually be competitive, you were no where on the scene, and your team was never even close to being considered one of the top teams…
I’m just really confused as to why you think you’re good :?

Chill man, there’s no need for this discussion.
Both of you stop, this achieves literally nothing except totally derailing the topic.

No more posting on this topic, keep the thread on the actual topic. If you’re so desperate to continue please go private message eachother.
Please =)!

TBH, its a bit soon to really rank professions in a game that has no tournaments,
no system to tell whos better or worst than the next,
maps with 2nd objectives (and future 2nd objectives) that could create new roles
is still under going reform,
and finally…is a game few people play comparitivly to already succesful competitive games. (more people play dominion for league of legends than this games spvp…and that game mode doesnt even make up 1-100th of its internet traffic)

I’ll start wrapping my mind around what profession is stronger in a team when it actually matters…seemingly no earlier than end of this year. Which i imagine there will be a LOT of random changes between now and then.

Jax.5261:

Davinci.8027:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Davinci.8027:

Archer Henchman.2534:

Oh good, quality drama before bed!

Davinci, I’ll have you recall that the last time we played, I ran a clinic on your team, carrying mine to a solid 500-1X0 victory and then your group quit playing and migrated over to playing smite. Sataar was in the game. Hman was as well. I neutered both of them, and mace skull cracked you three times for three downs leading to three won midfights.

So you’ve won 1 game out of maybe 50+ losses? GJ

We won 2 out of 5 games with a group of randoms we threw together against your team that night, and two of the matches we didn’t have our random ringers on voip.

Batting .600 against a pug? Feel proud. I hope smite treats you guys well.

Sleep time for real this time. Night night cutie

So we had an off-night. Are you proud? Khalifa was playing d/d and we were messing around with some kitten… The sad thing is is that you put so much emphasis on those 2 wins…

I do remember destroying your main team 500 – 100 repeatedly back when people used to play, though. I remember a lot of teams used to do that to you.

You’re trying really hard to sound smart, but it’s not working.

In any case, it doesn’t matter at this point. Back when the game used to actually be competitive, you were no where on the scene, and your team was never even close to being considered one of the top teams…
I’m just really confused as to why you think you’re good :?

Chill man, there’s no need for this discussion.
Both of you stop, this achieves literally nothing except totally derailing the topic.

No more posting on this topic, keep the thread on the actual topic. If you’re so desperate to continue please go private message eachother.
Please =)!

I do him too much good. Now people will believe he’s actually somebody…

SAtaarcoeny.8476:

Duncanmix.5238:

I don’t have team, this was just my thinking and my experience. But first yes I wanna discuss more. You said you will slow down my ele? How do you plan to do that. Lets imagine we play forest map, it is almost impossible to stop me from reaching your node on time. Unless you put people on me, which will lose you middle. Every person you place to take care of my ele is equaling to having extra less person on middle. Another thing is that you used ele on our far node, which pretty much means we agree ele is must. Now another point is, do you have guardian on middle. If you don’t have guardian on middle, its highly chance my team will take it eventually.
This leaves only discussion about is your ranger faster to deal with my ele, or my mesmer can deal faster with your ele. This is debatable, and also depend on builds + will you sent one from mid to help out etc. If you have guardian you can afford to sent one guy to deal with ele. And then I feel that my team have upper hand because mesmer ulti + for example thief, and good bye to your ele.

so we like to send 4 ppl out the beach door. i start with magic bullet stun through ur ride the lightning then beserker to cripple u and put u in combat. that is all it takes and if we land it the rest my team is already running to mid without entering combat. if we nne dextra slow on u a second person can help. guardian for example with immobaloze. plus the ranger has traps set down so he will always get the cap. now the ele on our team ignored all that and went straight to your point and you called 4 our crossing because you seen 4 us beach door so most likely 2-3 will stay at your home point but we are going to mid. we have 3 ppl beating on your guard and can have him dead in 20 seconds reguardless of what he does. the second guy will be trickling into mid and maybe the 3rd guy if your mesmer says he can take our ele but they cant so now we have ur guard down and he didnt hurt any of us we have a engi and a guard in mid so whatever 2 you have is going to have a hard time killing us 3. at that point ranger will tell me how much time he has left either he is about to die or has to break off let it get neatralized to stay alive. i would be first rotater on my mesmer and would evaluate the time it takes me to get to him on when i have to break off. but if you left 2 ppl to stay home against our ele after we kill guard i immediatley rotate back home point scare you off our ranger and let our 2 at mid 2v1 your 1 person left. plus our ele doesnt kite your 2 close back to mid hes by you base so yes you have it capped by hes toying with 2 ppl leaving us outnumbering your team.

and this whole game came down to you leaving a mesmer and us leaving a ranger at home point. just the difference in score i give classes really does make a huge difference in a actual game.

now you can put a thief or warrior in my spot and they can be as useful as me but lets say i stop playing mesmer and pick up necro or ranger and we run a top 5 class comp then our strats are amplified just because of how much better the class is.

Well obviously you are making strategy all the time that is trying perfectly to counter what my strategy is doing. But that’s because you read what I said. Also 80% of your strategy is focused on countering my ele which leaves you with early advantage.
Now that I know whats your plan I’m changing my strategy too. I’m sending 4 beach too including mesmer. But I have time warp, all my people will focus one of your guys that is most squishy chain cc on him. In the mean time my ele will run through and stop your ranger from capping, same as your ele will stop ours.
Now situation is:
- my ranger vs your ele
- your ranger vs my ele
- 3v2 on mid cause I had time warp

Wow, so the player you stomped will have 15 sec respawn + time to get to middle. So about 30 secs you have a 3v2 advantage. Gl when third is coming and they stomp you with timewarp…cuz obviously you wasted it before. I don’t get this tactic, you should try it without timwarp mabye

why are you people only considering trap rangers? it’s just not as good, it’s subpar and get’s easily countered.
furthermore a ranger shouldn’t lose a 1v1 against a dps guard – but then again keep playing trap ranger till you figure out how to abuse the only 2 really viable trait lines ranger has.
oh and on a sidenote – nobody is playing any class to it’s full potential (yet), there’s just no reason to, people might have done the theory crafting for it but why bother trying hard, when the current state of the game really doesn’t take much “skill” to be on top.
but keep the arguments coming, they’re at least fun to read.

Oh my another thread turns from balance discussion into ego wars, too bad.