meta builds take no skill
must be true since everyone i met said so
Watching the WTS quals in NA here is what I heard:
- on the red team we have these two celestial eles running the exact same build, a celestial warrior, and a celestial engi, (insert other class here for the 5th).
3 classes dominating the competitive meta is unhealthy.
Yes nerf all the meta builds! And nerf turret engi as well! Must be true! Everybody said so!
Shoutbow is boring and kinda easy to understand, but out of the meta specs I think it’s the most reasonable one because of the fact that it’s easiest to kill out of all of the current meta specs.
twitch.tv/blacktruth009
Schwahrheit, #1 Fuhrer NA, Just your everyday typical rager
Schwahrheit, #1 Fuhrer NA, Just your everyday typical rager
Yes nerf all the meta builds! And nerf turret engi as well! Must be true! Everybody said so!
Anet just nerfed the wrong thing when they gutted might. It should have been celestial.
Yes nerf all the meta builds! And nerf turret engi as well! Must be true! Everybody said so!
Anet just nerfed the wrong thing when they gutted might. It should have been celestial.
Next step is to remove celestial and while were at it lets remove might as well. And dont forget turret engies and full zerk power rangers. Should be removed, too op.
Yes nerf all the meta builds! And nerf turret engi as well! Must be true! Everybody said so!
Anet just nerfed the wrong thing when they gutted might. It should have been celestial.
Next step is to remove celestial and while were at it lets remove might as well. And dont forget turret engies and full zerk power rangers. Should be removed, too op.
So you are saying a gross over representation of 3 classes running one specific build per class out of the 8 classes in the game, is okay?
Let me see;
The safest options to secure a win, high uptime of surviving on nodes and potential to score decaps, followed up by enough AoE to secure that resses (sometimes) don’t occur anymore because it might cost your life…
Yes, sure, the meta “is boring” and “takes no skill” – But can you blame the players for picking something safe and solid, rather than SD Flamethrower Engineers or Hexastance Warriors for an epic youtube montage?
And mind you, a good player stays a good player… The build can only “carry” to a certain extend, but you will see a noticable difference between those who went to Metabattle™ and copied a build, and those who mastered their class(es)
Bottom line; Yes, the meta is dropdead boring… I had a match against 3 Cele Eles, Cele Engi and Bunker Guard (Pug) and the fights went just on and on up until finally one opening was found… But you can’t blame people picking something that is optimal
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Lost? Confused? [TCS] – A guild for every state of body and mind
Lost? Confused? [TCS] – A guild for every state of body and mind
Yes nerf all the meta builds! And nerf turret engi as well! Must be true! Everybody said so!
Anet just nerfed the wrong thing when they gutted might. It should have been celestial.
Next step is to remove celestial and while were at it lets remove might as well. And dont forget turret engies and full zerk power rangers. Should be removed, too op.
So you are saying a gross over representation of 3 classes running one specific build per class out of the 8 classes in the game, is okay?
Its not optimal but if they nerf them down, remove them etc. theres gonna be another meta specs in their place that dominate the scene. Then ppl start complaining about that meta and demand nerfs. It’s a neverending cycle.
Ppl will always use specs/teams that have the most efficiency if they plan to win competitive games.
Yes nerf all the meta builds! And nerf turret engi as well! Must be true! Everybody said so!
Anet just nerfed the wrong thing when they gutted might. It should have been celestial.
Next step is to remove celestial and while were at it lets remove might as well. And dont forget turret engies and full zerk power rangers. Should be removed, too op.
So you are saying a gross over representation of 3 classes running one specific build per class out of the 8 classes in the game, is okay?
Its not optimal but if they nerf them down, remove them etc. theres gonna be another meta specs in their place that dominate the scene. Then ppl start complaining about that meta and demand nerfs. It’s a neverending cycle.
Ppl will always use specs/teams that have the most efficiency if they plan to win competitive games.
Except right now the meta is the LEAST diverse that it has been in this game since launch.
You used to have some zerkers, a couple condi, and one bunker (at least). Usually there was never anymore than one class or one build represented per team. Now it is more often than not you will see too teams running an almost identical comp because it is almost literally impossible to counter it even with the burstiest or tankiest of builds in this game.
Do you really think that it is okay for this game to have a competitive scene with such little build and class diversity?
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
Except that completely pushed out any form of bunker guard, mesmers are almost never scene except for 2 or three max. And every group is just “cele+hoelbrak/pack runes insert class here.” The only necro you ever really see is Noscoc and a couple of teams trying “surprise” power necro people.
Face it engi and ele cele build needs nerfed. I say just do the amulet.
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
Except that completely pushed out any form of bunker guard, mesmers are almost never scene except for 2 or three max. And every group is just “cele+hoelbrak/pack runes insert class here.” The only necro you ever really see is Noscoc and a couple of teams trying “surprise” power necro people.
Face it engi and ele cele build needs nerfed. I say just do the amulet.
Why not remove that stat from game altogether and remove might as well?
Cause the next thing if cele amulet is nerfed or removed is ppl still complaining how some classes benefit from might better and from might runes and sigils. Remove them as well.
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
Except that completely pushed out any form of bunker guard, mesmers are almost never scene except for 2 or three max. And every group is just “cele+hoelbrak/pack runes insert class here.” The only necro you ever really see is Noscoc and a couple of teams trying “surprise” power necro people.
Face it engi and ele cele build needs nerfed. I say just do the amulet.
A lot must be changed on engy and ele, the latter especially, before anything get..nerfed. The design concept of the ele is extremely bad, over two years the same build has been used. I doubt Anet will ever listen to ele community or even TOP players like @Phantaram( who agree eles need a re-design), they will just keep the d/d build in, to keep the profession in game
Nobody cares about melee. Not even warriors.
It’s sad.
Do not remove my might. Just make might improve melee attacks. Melee attacks that do not have a cc effect, or a defensive effect attached to it.
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
Except that completely pushed out any form of bunker guard, mesmers are almost never scene except for 2 or three max. And every group is just “cele+hoelbrak/pack runes insert class here.” The only necro you ever really see is Noscoc and a couple of teams trying “surprise” power necro people.
Face it engi and ele cele build needs nerfed. I say just do the amulet.
Why not remove that stat from game altogether and remove might as well?
Cause the next thing if cele amulet is nerfed or removed is ppl still complaining how some classes benefit from might better and from might runes and sigils. Remove them as well.
You are missing the point. Anet either needs to tone down something on the celestial builds. Or buff the builds that the celestial builds have essentially removed from the meta.
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
Except that completely pushed out any form of bunker guard, mesmers are almost never scene except for 2 or three max. And every group is just “cele+hoelbrak/pack runes insert class here.” The only necro you ever really see is Noscoc and a couple of teams trying “surprise” power necro people.
Face it engi and ele cele build needs nerfed. I say just do the amulet.
Why not remove that stat from game altogether and remove might as well?
Cause the next thing if cele amulet is nerfed or removed is ppl still complaining how some classes benefit from might better and from might runes and sigils. Remove them as well.
You are missing the point. Anet either needs to tone down something on the celestial builds. Or buff the builds that the celestial builds have essentially removed from the meta.
So the game is unbalanced when your profession main is not played often? That’s what I get from your posts
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
Except that completely pushed out any form of bunker guard, mesmers are almost never scene except for 2 or three max. And every group is just “cele+hoelbrak/pack runes insert class here.” The only necro you ever really see is Noscoc and a couple of teams trying “surprise” power necro people.
Face it engi and ele cele build needs nerfed. I say just do the amulet.
Why not remove that stat from game altogether and remove might as well?
Cause the next thing if cele amulet is nerfed or removed is ppl still complaining how some classes benefit from might better and from might runes and sigils. Remove them as well.
You are missing the point. Anet either needs to tone down something on the celestial builds. Or buff the builds that the celestial builds have essentially removed from the meta.
So the game is unbalanced when your profession main is not played often? That’s what I get from your posts
It’s not just “my profession” it’s several, just rewatching some of the WTS, some teams even had 3 eles. When one class represents more than 50% of your team comp that isn’t a problem?
Builds you hardly ever see used are things like full burst builds (which used to be the meta with the exception of one or two bunkers per team.)
You also don’t see any teams with an actual dedicated bunker.
And the problem is arising when people who don’t play this game but are interested see things like this and think wow so i have no chance unless I play one of three builds in this game.
You can’t tell me this is okay.
you know how to make things right? make it so you cant have double classes… 5 spots 8 professions
I think the more important point is that the conquest, node-capping and holding game mode in this game is boring in itself. If you wanna win rush 2 points fast and then hold them. Rotate if needed rinse and repeat.
It favors bunkerish builds that can do bit damage, have support and some cc and decent mobilty.
Except that completely pushed out any form of bunker guard, mesmers are almost never scene except for 2 or three max. And every group is just “cele+hoelbrak/pack runes insert class here.” The only necro you ever really see is Noscoc and a couple of teams trying “surprise” power necro people.
Face it engi and ele cele build needs nerfed. I say just do the amulet.
Why not remove that stat from game altogether and remove might as well?
Cause the next thing if cele amulet is nerfed or removed is ppl still complaining how some classes benefit from might better and from might runes and sigils. Remove them as well.
You are missing the point. Anet either needs to tone down something on the celestial builds. Or buff the builds that the celestial builds have essentially removed from the meta.
So the game is unbalanced when your profession main is not played often? That’s what I get from your posts
It’s not just “my profession” it’s several, just rewatching some of the WTS, some teams even had 3 eles. When one class represents more than 50% of your team comp that isn’t a problem?
Builds you hardly ever see used are things like full burst builds (which used to be the meta with the exception of one or two bunkers per team.)
You also don’t see any teams with an actual dedicated bunker.
And the problem is arising when people who don’t play this game but are interested see things like this and think wow so i have no chance unless I play one of three builds in this game.
You can’t tell me this is okay.
And before double eles , there was double warrior and something else before that.
Yes ofc it’s not ok when you see double of anything ..and what can be possibly done?
Eles are not like the warrior that can rely on robust trait lines, more than one reliable weapon set and more than one line of utilities.
In ele case, you have the cantrips and the 30 water/arcana build which have been the only thing that has made the profession, not viable…*usable*in PvP, I dare to say since launch.
If you want to stop seeing double eles, then nerf their sustain..but then you won’t see any eles at all in PvP as it was for almost one year between june2013 and april 2014.
The design concept of the profession is bad, it should be changed, if that doesn’t happen then you can only remove the profession altogether
to be honest, after a ton of multiclassing I’d say there are several interesting, higher skill cap builds on the aforementioned classes suitable for conquest that rely heavily on celestial amulets.
What needs a nerf are the low skill cap builds themselves, which rely on ‘land this to win’ cc, or auto attacks through heavy sustain. It’s usually the weapon set which produces a lower skill ‘meta’ build.
Phaatonn, London UK
(edited by Phaeton.9582)
I personally do not see any issue with having multiple of the same profession. Depending on the build you can significantly change the play style. Currently we see them running identical builds, which is a problem.
Please stop calling for a nerf to everything. It would be better to give other professions slight buffs to make them more equal to the top builds.
The cele stat is so overused simply because it allows you to do a little bit of everything. It is still important to have a zerker amulet or some build that can do burst damage to turn the team fights in your favor. However, the stat difference between celestial and everything else is a little too much still. They should try toning it down to +400 on each stat. How it currently stands currently is you get about the same damage as with a regular amulet but you get healing power and vitality thrown in for free. I was giving the rabid engi build a try recently (I used to play it, switched to cele) and found it had about the same damage overall as the celestial build if the profession did not have constant condi clear. The sustain was better with the cele build and because damage is spread across everything it works better in general.
Well I agree that double/triple d/d ele is over the top, and that class representation is pretty unbalanced, but on the other hand things like an engy being in every team is nothing new, you had a bunker guard in every single team for most of the game, you had a thief in virtually every single team bar the odd rare exception for most of the game, back when spirit rangers were around, every team pretty much had one, you had a period for several months when hambow warriors were in every team, often two of them, and so on.
And looking at it from the reverse, for the months before celestial you barely saw an ele in a team, and whilst engy was better represented than ele or mes, it was still under-represented.
must be true since everyone i met said so
Either you think the mechanics of the meta builds are overly simplistic…
…in which case, just look at D/D ele
or you think that because these builds are more effective than others, that they take less skill to be successful with than less effective builds…
…in which case, I say “Duh!”.
I have the answer, just gotta read it.
None of the specs in the game take as much skill as they used to because it is all about spam now. Also most builds revolve around swap or crit sigils which is passive play. Also the stronger specs have gotten the more counter specing is part of the game. Take condi necro for example, if I am vs some engis you will be super powerful. If there are 2 shout warriors and 2 dps guardians on the other team then you might as well not be there as there are so many AOE cleanses.
Character: Henry rank million/Duke Henry
Necromancer/Casual Warrior
[Team] Best WvW guild of all time. EASILY.
Necromancer/Casual Warrior
[Team] Best WvW guild of all time. EASILY.
I keep wondering what people like the OP define as a build/class that takes “skill.” Or rather, what is their definition of “skill?”
I keep wondering what people like the OP define as a build/class that takes “skill.” Or rather, what is their definition of “skill?”
The great thing about “skill” it can mean anything. Skill has become a meaningless term especially on this forum or at the very minimum arbitrary.
As u know im pro. ~Tomonobu Itagaki
This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.
This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.
Professions isn’t the problem. The celestial amulet is. Tone down the celestial amulet so that it has exactly the same amount of stats as the other amulets. Currently you get more stat points from celestial than any other amulet – this is the problem.
Melder – Thief
Professions isn’t the problem. The celestial amulet is. Tone down the celestial amulet so that it has exactly the same amount of stats as the other amulets. Currently you get more stat points from celestial than any other amulet – this is the problem.
I remember certain classes cough eles cough griped about the celestial amulet sucking big time….. now look at it….
I keep wondering what people like the OP define as a build/class that takes “skill.” Or rather, what is their definition of “skill?”
Twitchy dodge\evade spam on glass thief. Some people still think that fast reactions are “cooler” than actual strategy and forethought.
EU Aurora Glade
must be true since everyone i met said so
Reading your other topics, it seems you got issues, lots of them.
Like this nice little gem. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/what-are-the-chances-that
As u know im pro. ~Tomonobu Itagaki
This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.
This is an mmo forum, if someone isn’t whining chances are the game is dead.
Even though you probably do not care at all and are just looking to stoke a fire, for the other people reading this thread:
Meta builds offer the most return for your skill as determined by general community consensus, no matter what that initial skill is. There are always multiple ways to make a build, but there’s no point in questioning the skill required to play the meta ones, since every build requires a base level of expertise to play and win.
OP is looking to start arguments. Let the hammer fall where it may.
Resident Disgruntled, Coffee-drinking Charr.
Zarin Mistcloak(THF) Valkyrie Mistblade(WAR) Kossori Mistwalker(REV) Durendal Mistward(GRD)
I used to think (build op, pls nerf) like you, but then I took a nerf to the knee.
Zarin Mistcloak(THF) Valkyrie Mistblade(WAR) Kossori Mistwalker(REV) Durendal Mistward(GRD)
I used to think (build op, pls nerf) like you, but then I took a nerf to the knee.
Professions isn’t the problem. The celestial amulet is. Tone down the celestial amulet so that it has exactly the same amount of stats as the other amulets. Currently you get more stat points from celestial than any other amulet – this is the problem.
Then no one would use it, because not all stats scale the same or are of equal worth even to classes/builds that can use them to some extent.
(edited by zinkz.7045)
The issue is that gw2 really need a balance team. Right now, there doesn’t appear to be one, or it just isn’t very productive.
Look at the last balance “cele builds are too strong” Anet: “ok cool lets nerf might”
If you think it is bad now, wait until they add a new class to the mix.
#hireabalanceteam
so you are saying we should play bad builds because it makes the game harder?
The issue is that gw2 really need a balance team. Right now, there doesn’t appear to be one, or it just isn’t very productive.
Look at the last balance “cele builds are too strong” Anet: “ok cool lets nerf might”
If you think it is bad now, wait until they add a new class to the mix.
#hireabalanceteam
All your posts are mainly “nerf turret engis” and “game needs a balanced team”. Think you can do a better job without your actions having a negative effect for everyone else?
Celes can have a constant upkeep of 22-25 stacks of might. That out damages any Zerker build. Why wouldn’t Anet nerf might when the average class maintains (if that) 8 stacks of it?
so you are saying we should play bad builds because it makes the game harder?
^
aka FalseLights
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
Yes nerf all the meta builds! And nerf turret engi as well! Must be true! Everybody said so!
Anet just nerfed the wrong thing when they gutted might. It should have been celestial.
The whole design of the classes is broken beyond repair. The game is based around instant multi hit AoE DoTs. It’s as bad as it gets. Probably the worst balance in an MMO to date.
must be true since everyone i met said so
Reading your other topics, it seems you got issues, lots of them.
Like this nice little gem. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/what-are-the-chances-that
LOL. Thanks for sharing this gem.
#ShotsFIRED
#1 Player Granada
#1 Player Comoros
#1 Player Comoros
must be true since everyone i met said so
Reading your other topics, it seems you got issues, lots of them.
Like this nice little gem. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/what-are-the-chances-that
Josh needs his forum name changed to Sir Salt.5839.