Guild Wars 2

Current system is not alt-character friendly. I feel like I’m obligated to play with my main all time to unlock new wvw specs etc…

99% of all that have an issue here is the guard offensive and defensive traits or effectively the first 215 ranks on every toon u own unless you want to be sub optimal.

A lot of people (probably myself included) would to a large extent stop shouting about your complete stupidity regarding WXP account/char bound if you just gave every toon an instant 215 WXP points to put into trait or even better.. You just did away with the +power and +HP stack guard traits… Hell you can keep in the +/- damage with guards just dont give the +stacks at the end of the trait line.

Lurch.9517:

99% of all that have an issue here is the guard offensive and defensive traits or effectively the first 215 ranks on every toon u own unless you want to be sub optimal.

A lot of people (probably myself included) would to a large extent stop shouting about your complete stupidity regarding WXP account/char bound if you just gave every toon an instant 215 WXP points to put into trait or even better.. You just did away with the +power and +HP stack guard traits… Hell you can keep in the +/- damage with guards just dont give the +stacks at the end of the trait line.

100 power/ 100 cond damage really is not that game changing.

2500 Hp, whilst it is very useful, please consider things such as the multitude of siege trait lines that increase siege damage and please consider how 2500 extra Hp compares to all of the extra damage is provided to people through siege. Siege trait lines give people a larger increase in damage than 100 power.

Wxp should not be account bound but I have changed my position on a respec. I think we should now have a respec if only because they enjoy adding new lines every two weeks.

Edit: also

extra abilities for siege and all that random crap like boon removal on cannons. (they all got some bs buff through wxp abilities)

I view wxp as end game character progression. (note character, not account) levels are not account bound. skill points are not account bound. traits are not account bound. wxp should not be account bound.

And before people start the but gw2 is not about power creep or giving 1 player and advantage over another bla bla bla. If that were the case lvl 1 items would do the same as lvl 80 items and the only progression in game would be the aquisition of new abilities.

All wxp abilites give one player an advantage over another player.

I think people just don’t like being made to choose.

This does not prevent the playing of alts.

CHARACTER PROGRESSION

/rant

EDIT 2.

And I am waiting for an expansion of the mercenary line to give like stacks of toughness or something. A change that I would welcome.

2500hp is an extra 250 vitality stat that you can put somewhere else. This means swapping 4 PVT items for 4 knights or zerker. That change makes a load of difference for damage output. It’s also 2 extra hits which while it doesn’t sound like much means the difference of punching through an enemy zerg to their backline and melting on the aoes.

The 100 extra power is the difference between an 8k crit and a 9k crit.

The argument against WXP character bound is quite simple. Let’s say you’ve been building up your necro and got to WVW rank 150. Then Anet discovers a glaring flaw in necro wells and “fixes” them by nerfing them into oblivion. Your necro became useless overnight and now you’re no longer wanted in your guild’s raid. You have to switch to your rank 4 guardian (who is perfectly well geared). You’ve now lost arrow cart mastery, supply mastery, defense against guards, and whatever else and you’re less useful than you ever were before. Sure you can frontline for your raid now but you’ve lost the ability to destroy certain arrow carts and to survive some encouters. Your work on the necro is for naught and hence the “punishment” that Devon is ignoring.

This is even worse when you’re the one in the guild who has to compensate for the other guys wanting to run nothing but their ranger main. If your raid needs a necro you’re there. If they need a guardian or ele you’re there. If they need a warrior you’re there. Thing is you’ll never get to enjoy that extra 2500 HP and yet you’ve spent the same amount of time in WvW as the guy who has it. This time goes less rewarded (which was the whole point in WxP to begin with).

As for the argument of respeccing wvw traits: Each month a new mastery comes out. What happens if we find out that treb mastery is required to be successful? ANET isn’t perfect. We saw that in the arrow cart mastery. What if you’re the sucker who dropped 10 points into ballista mastery when treb mastery came out? This is why we need to be able to spec into WvW traits. Every “talent” system in any MMO eventually came with the option to respec eventually. A locked character is a burned out character and results in player turnover.

If some guy drops 4 items that give Toughness in favour of 2500 hp. Unlucky for him because he will just melt like all the other zerkers out there.

The point is that for especially solo roamers and small group players that +2500 HP and the + pow/condi is a massive difference therefore making them not really optional if you want to make sure you are on a level playing field against anyone you might meet.

The thing that saddens me the most is that, sooner or later, I am convinced that WXP will become account-bound (probably you will preserve on all character the highest WvW rank you got), since the community is crying out for it – and crying out loud – since the introduction of WXP…so, why not implementing it right now? Or let’s just wait another year to do the obvious, so that players can change game in the while…

DevonCarver.5370:

We will not be changing WvW ranks or WxP to be account bound. However, we are going to be implementing a host of changes that should make this seem less like some sort of punishment(a categorization I disagree with entirely) and more of a character progression system.

I thoroughly disagree with this this decision and assessment. World XP points and ranks provide players with perks as a result of playing WvW maps with a particular character.
As such, a person who enjoys WvW and playing only 1 character can have a significant advantage over another player with equal play time, but having played 4 players. If this is not punishing a person for enjoying profession diversity, then it is rewarding a person for eschewing all other professions when playing WvW.

Rift implemented a character progression system, called Planar Attunement. It rewarded “points” to a max-level characters as they “progressed” (basically earned more XP) through the game. This points were spent on slight character bonues. Planar attunement points where character-bound.

Several months after its inception, the Rift development team realized this approach really encouraged players to focus on a single character, rather embracing diversity. They then changed PA to be account-bound rather than character bound.

Considering new alts are a potential source of revenue for GW2, why would you consider implementing, or maintaining in this case, a progression model which discourages profession diversity?

Quite frankly, I cannot understand how anyone can see the current WvW mastery system to be anything other than punishing to people who enjoy playing multiple professions.

This system should have been account based since the beginning because of all the obvious reasons that have already been stated countless times. The fact that ANet is ignoring player feedback on that issue is quite disconcerting.

DevonCarver.5370:

…….The first step is the liquid WXP that is being added to the rank up chests which is account-bound. We are planning additional systems as well. Hopefully, as we continue to announce some of those changes, you will be happier with the system.

Just make it account bound already, anything shy of this is patch-work that will ultimately end with continued resentment from an already jaded wvw community.

WvW, the red-headed stepchild of GW2.

Exceptionl.8972:

I don’t think they will ever let us buy WXP with Karma because the model for WvW is supposed to encourage players to be able to do WvW without restricting them to play PvE right? (…)

But…, but…, we already have to do PvE to get stuff for WvW. Like any of the Orr armor pieces, or dungeon armor.

Is there any chance we can get the reason for the “no changes” policy? I hope it’s not just because someone wrote something in a design document some time ago. It’s pure curiosity, though if you’d say “limitations in the code”, there might be hope it’d be a “all siege is soul bound” type limitation (got changed a couple months later) and not a “5 AoE targets” type limitation (won’t change until GW3).

I am bored at work. Someone refute me or show me the light about WxP levels, please?

Urrid.4593:

So run around on a zerg necro to get equal benefits get for your roaming thief? Seems, not too fair.

Do you think this would be fair?

Urrid.4593:

I am bored at work. Someone refute me or show me the light about WxP levels, please?

Urrid.4593:

So run around on a zerg necro to get equal benefits get for your roaming thief? Seems, not too fair.

Do you think this would be fair?

To me this comes down to how you view characters. Some people (an ANet is included in this group) view each character as a separate entity. This entity is an individual with an individual progression path. (Unless, of course, we’re talking about daily rewards in which case they are all one account thank you very much)

Other people view characters as a suit they put on. So once they’ve done an activity on one character they think it should be done on all characters. After all, it’s the same guy behind the keyboard.

Your statement is consistent with the first viewpoint. However, from the other viewpoint it makes perfect sense that you (as a player) earn WXP no matter which character you are using.

Urrid.4593:

I am bored at work. Someone refute me or show me the light about WxP levels, please?

Urrid.4593:

So run around on a zerg necro to get equal benefits get for your roaming thief? Seems, not too fair.

Do you think this would be fair?

Devon and his team used an account based model to create a character based progression system.

Think about what the rest of the game would look like if there were no classes and you could just get every trait and skill in the game with one character and use them all in the same build. Who in their right mind would ever roll an alt in that environment?

This is exactly what WxP is, and demonstrates a level of incompetency unparalleled in known game design.

The problem is that it’s effectively a never-ending character progression. At the rate they’re currently releasing masteries, nobody is ever going to complete them all (at least, nobody with any life outside GW2). So you can’t really compare it to the PvE character progression, where you can reach level 80 in just a few days.

If I could “complete” WvW character progression in, say, a month and then move onto progressing a different character, then it would be a totally different story.

The other problem is that this character progression has a real, significant impact on combat, and as such you can’t just ignore it as “roleplay” or “aesthetic”. Up until now, post-lvl-80 character progression has been stuff like new shiny skins and story-mode, which you can do if you like, but you aren’t at a disadvantage if you choose not to follow them.

DevonCarver.5370:

We will not be changing WvW ranks or WxP to be account bound. However, we are going to be implementing a host of changes that should make this seem less like some sort of punishment(a categorization I disagree with entirely) and more of a character progression system. The first step is the liquid WXP that is being added to the rank up chests which is account-bound. We are planning additional systems as well. Hopefully, as we continue to announce some of those changes, you will be happier with the system.

- Could you explain how this is supposed to work as character progression system? If you have playing time worth 10 WXP ranks and you divide that playing time between your two characters, each getting 5 WXP ranks worth of playing time. For one character you get the first rank of Cannon Mastery and the second gets the first rank of Arrow Cart mastery.

Why would someone enjoy this, rather than getting both Cannon Mastery and Arrow Cart Mastery if the ranks were bound to account? It’s just another example of the ridiculous grind you keep adding to this game.

Ragnar.4257:

The problem is that it’s effectively a never-ending character progression. At the rate they’re currently releasing masteries, nobody is ever going to complete them all (at least, nobody with any life outside GW2). ….

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. So it’s less that Anet’s being “unfair” and more that their system stinks and is more or less formless and never ending for a regular human being.

Makes sense.

Urrid.4593:

Ragnar.4257:

The problem is that it’s effectively a never-ending character progression. At the rate they’re currently releasing masteries, nobody is ever going to complete them all (at least, nobody with any life outside GW2). ….

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. So it’s less that Anet’s being “unfair” and more that their system stinks and is more or less formless and never ending for a regular human being.

Makes sense.

“In most games you go out and you have really fun tasks occasionally that you get to do and the rest of the game is this boring grind to get to the fun stuff. I swung a sword, I swung a sword again, hey I swung it again, that’s great…We just don’t want players to grind in Guild Wars 2. No one enjoys that, no one finds that fun.”
- Colin Johanson, Guild Wars 2: Manifesto Trailer

…

/drop mic
/walk off stage

Urrid.4593:

Ragnar.4257:

The problem is that it’s effectively a never-ending character progression. At the rate they’re currently releasing masteries, nobody is ever going to complete them all (at least, nobody with any life outside GW2). ….

Thanks for all the feedback everyone. So it’s less that Anet’s being “unfair” and more that their system stinks and is more or less formless and never ending for a regular human being.

Makes sense.

i dont think its necessarily bad thakittens never ending, but its frustrating that we have no options to weigh the value of a WAP. how can we know at rank 50 whether we should have 4 ranks in AC mastery, 1 rank in each siege type mastery, dump everything into guard killer/defense, or any other combination? the system takes a really long time for us to work up to having huge amounts of utility, but we have no way of assessing the value of the discrete increments. occasional respecs solve that issue. do respecs introduce other issues that cant be mitigated with being “occasional” and/or “expensive”? is there any reason we should be laden with an opportunity cost decision of “be a bit more useful now” versus “save points for the next mastery to be released”?

Just wait a few years when they realise it was a mistake and make it account bound, but by then people would no longer care and the only ones playing are the hardcore.

The thing is many remember how awesome the original Guild Wars was but when you think back there were many poor decisions that killed the game for a lot of players. Things that come to mind, changing Hero’s Ascent to 6 man parties, allowing heroes in HA for nearly a year and introducing Victory or Death which killed the long epic GvG battles.

Guild Wars 2, same old story.

kingcragus.6810:

I view wxp as end game character progression. (note character, not account) levels are not account bound. skill points are not account bound. traits are not account bound. wxp should not be account bound.

As already stated in this thread, WvW is large scale PvP. PvP is skill based and about you as a player, not what your character achieves. PvE is about your character. As such there is essentially no character progression. Different characters exist to provide variety in terms of playstyle.

DevonCarver.5370:

We will not be changing WvW ranks or WxP to be account bound. However, we are going to be implementing a host of changes that should make this seem less like some sort of punishment(a categorization I disagree with entirely) and more of a character progression system. The first step is the liquid WXP that is being added to the rank up chests which is account-bound. We are planning additional systems as well. Hopefully, as we continue to announce some of those changes, you will be happier with the system.

How would you rather categorize it? Because as I see it. You’re clearly at a penalty if your preferred playstyle involves a variety of characters instead of a single one.

You will be less useful to your server for the diminished perks you’d have on your main character. It will take you multiple times the amount of time to have the ‘must haves’ of the MASSIVE Vitality and Power/Condition Damage WvW Abilities.

I am curious to see how much those liquid WXP cans might give you. Since it takes you 5000 WXP to earn one – it’d at least make the levelling of a second character a little less painful.

Though you didn’t at all elaborate on the team’s decision to not make it account bound. I mean according to the GW 2 Wikipedia there are 9.945 Ranks to be achieved. Each of them require a minimum of 5.000 WXP after Rank 5(!). I am not sure if someone ever did the calculations during the development of that system – but let me ask you candidly: Did you ever did it? Did you ever look on your calculator and gasp at the staggering amount of WXP and how many years it’d take even the most devouted of players to play in the upper echelons of this system?

If you didn’t – let me do it for you.

Total WXP required: 49.705.000

Average hourly gain: ~ 2500 WXP on Average (if you’re on a populated server, winning some, losing some)

Time required to meet the maximum Rank:

6 Years 10 Months of playing World vs World 8 hours a day.

I will repeat it gladly.

If you decided you’d make Guild Wars 2 World vs World your main-priority in life, today. Treating it like a full-commitment job, it’d take you almost 7 years to make it to Diamond Legend.

Okay, so making completely inflated achievements that no one will ever reach unless they abandon their lifes to a grossly negligent degree is one thing (Who am I to tell someone they can’t kitten away their life to be a Diamond Legend, right?)

But to then not even have the common sense to make that rank account-wide is not only utterly nonsencial but a disservice on your player base. Because it simply discourages one play style over the other. That is a perfect example of where “Play as you like” is feasible to be applied to, because it shouldn’t matter whether I play 1 character or 10 in WvW in order to advance. It pits one against the other with glaringly obvious disfavour towards the latter.

If you hold individual character progression in such high regards – then allow people to spend and build on their characters individually with the WXP they collectively gathered on their account, but don’t punish them for playing a character that isn’t their main.

I doubt this will be read, but it should and I’d be most grateful for an transparent and truthful answer on what sort of thoughts went through peoples heads when the requirements of ranks were discussed.

Appreciate your reply.

I would love to know what the perceived ADVANTAGE is to the player for making this character bound.

Devon has said that he doesn’t view it as a punishment, and others have done a great job of explaining exactly why it feels like a punishment to those of us who enjoy playing multiple classes.

(And the maths of taking 6 years to max out each character means in only 48 years I’ll have maxed out all 8 classes!)

But saying “it’s not a punishment” isn’t the same as saying “this is a great system and let me tell you all the advantages you have because we keep it character bound” – I’d love to know what ANet think the good points – for the player – are of the system as it stands.

WvWvW is NOT about maxing out your char in wvwrank. It is about have !!FUN!!

There will be never a account wide wvwrank. just accept it like 99% of the gw2 player do it. Just play wvwvw and have fun and you will see ranks will come.

Hyung.6140:

I would love to know what the perceived ADVANTAGE is to the player for making this character bound.

WxP boosters in the gem store tomorrow! Look for them.

/wrists

Virindiira.1025:

WvWvW is NOT about maxing out your char in wvwrank. It is about have !!FUN!!

There will be never a account wide wvwrank. just accept it like 99% of the gw2 player do it. Just play wvwvw and have fun and you will see ranks will come.

On one hand, I sympathize with this view. I like playing games just because they’re fun, and wish people would do so more frequently. But on the other hand, part of why I play GW2 as opposed to so many other MMO’s is because it was developed under the idea that PvP would be a level playing field. They got that part right in sPvP, but every time more “progression” gets added to WvW, and every new bit of gear with higher stats that is introduced makes this less true.

At launch, every level 80 character with a set of the reasonably acquired exotic gear was on more or less equal footing in WvW. Yes, I know not every class is always 100% balanced, but that’s life. No game is perfectly balanced, and balance is an ongoing process. Now we have power creep in the form of WXP powers. While I don’t think most folks would like it removed outright (I wouldn’t mind), plenty of folks would like their WvW progression to be reflected on themselves personally, as it is with ranks in sPvP.

And besides, that’s why the forums are here, so the devs can get feedback. Far too many people get a little too Very Serious on here, but really, communicating your opinions to the devs is part of healthy engagement to the game. That’s a huge part of why game companies have forums in the first place, instead of just letting 3rd parties do all the heavy lifting. So am I going to continue having fun with all the other WvWers out there? Absolutely not. Does that mean we should just keep our opinions to ourselves? Absolutely not.

Of course if you’re trolling, I missed it. Regardless, that’s my 2 cents.

GW2, bringing MMO farming to PvP since 2012. Swing that sword Colin, swing it good.

now that I officially know that all my wxp points are completely wasted, won’t play alts anymore in www. Too bad , it was fun…

lioka qiao.8734:

I’m an alt-o-holic and I approve this message.

YES!

I think my total WvW rank would be somewhere near 190 if I didn’t have it spread out between 6 lvl 80s. Guardian’s lvl 70, necro’s lvl 50, mesmer’s lvl 30, ele’s lvl 30, thief is lvl 26 ish, warrior is lvl 20 ish

Totally agree!

“Punishment” is one thing…. but what about being able to see where the path you are taking is leading you guys?

No cap + No upward curve + Character based progression + Adding new WvW abilities like crazy =

Hardcore players who focus on one character having a hundreds or a thousand points worth of stuff fighting more casual and balanced players or people who play 2 or 3 characters with just a handful of unlocks…. the imbalances will just get worse over time.

Increasing the rate of WXP worked to create less imbalance in games like DAOC/Warhammer because there was an upward curve and a cap!

From the patch notes … “The World vs. World Experience Booster is now available in the Gem Store in the Booster category for 150 gems. This consumable grants 50% more WvW experience for one hour.”

Someone here called it a few pages back. Where are you? Come on up and take a bow.

I would consider buying the booster, but only if the levels were account bond of course..

KnattyDreads.1856:

From the patch notes … “The World vs. World Experience Booster is now available in the Gem Store in the Booster category for 150 gems. This consumable grants 50% more WvW experience for one hour.”

Someone here called it a few pages back. Where are you? Come on up and take a bow.

Urrid.4593:

Hyung.6140:

I would love to know what the perceived ADVANTAGE is to the player for making this character bound.

WxP boosters in the gem store tomorrow! Look for them.

/wrists

and /bow

Virindiira.1025:

WvWvW is NOT about maxing out your char in wvwrank. It is about have !!FUN!!

There will be never a account wide wvwrank. just accept it like 99% of the gw2 player do it. Just play wvwvw and have fun and you will see ranks will come.

I do not believe that anybody should tell me how to feel.
We, singularly, decide what is fun and what is not and we make our decisions.
If you feel WvW is good as it is and it is fun: good for you, Sir.
It seems evident that the majority of WvW dedicated players disagrees with you.
Let me also add one thing: I believe that the current discussion about WvW is more or less civil, constructive and simply shows that we love the game and we are frustrated that we will be forced to quit it due to a poor development.

I am still waiting for a clear answer in which A.net states their perceived advantages in keeping the system as is vis-a-vis pleasing the WvW community in something that seems largely agreed among players: WXP account bound.

Also, from Devonbro on the new WXP flasks (they will not be in every rank-up chests…):

Sentinel.5731:

so Question about liquid exp, I leveled about 3 times on my characters last night and did not get any of the stuff. Is it a RNG drop?

It is a low percentage chance per rank up chest. We are going to be adding it to more places shortly, but that’s the only place for right now.

Outrageously high dangling carrot now got knocked down a single peg now to make it more tempting for delusional people who’re willing to sacrifice it all.

Cash Shop Game 101 has been adhered to. WXP Boost – Suck my kitten.

I personally find it a little counter-intuitive to their design goals with the account wallet update, where they seem to be edgeing more towards account bound unlocks as opposed to the soulbound unlocks from before. Personally, now that they made it easier to rank up by means on PvE Objectives on the WvW maps, I think that it should remain a character bound unlock progression, if they make it account bound, they would have to make it much harder.

Also, since Liquid WXP has been out, I think I’ve had one drop.

Pretty useless IMO.

AJP.8610:

Also, since Liquid WXP has been out, I think I’ve had one drop.

Pretty useless IMO.

These occasional drops of liquid WXP mean alts are now so viable! ;p

Hyung.6140:

AJP.8610:

Also, since Liquid WXP has been out, I think I’ve had one drop.

Pretty useless IMO.

These occasional drops of liquid WXP mean alts are now so viable! ;p

Yeah its ridiculous, the fact that the chance of these dropping is obviously so small plus the fact that the increase in the rate of getting WXP appears to be only about 1.5 times what it was in no way makes up for WXP not being account bound. It was a distortion of the truth to even imply that it might be a workaround, and more masteries are coming.

I won’t let Devon forget about this

On liquid XP:
Lol.

Why would I ever use liquid XP on an alt when I can save them for a Birthday Booster+Booster+Minibooster and instantly get a level and a half?

I hate the devs for making gem store crap effectively compulsory purchases in order to not fall behind the power curve in wvw.

“We don’t make grindy games”
“Gem store options won’t affect power balance”

Lying b’stards.

DevonCarver.5370:

We will not be changing WvW ranks or WxP to be account bound. However, we are going to be implementing a host of changes that should make this seem less like some sort of punishment(a categorization I disagree with entirely) and more of a character progression system. The first step is the liquid WXP that is being added to the rank up chests which is account-bound. We are planning additional systems as well. Hopefully, as we continue to announce some of those changes, you will be happier with the system.

Still extremely unhappy with this system, and I firmly believe that eventually player pressure can force the devs to change it, no matter how proud and stubborn they act.

Is there a ball park figure for WxP vial drop rates? I got one in my very first rank up when they were added and thought I could actually play at least 2 characters in WvW (mind you people playing one character would still rank up a lot faster). Since that first vial I have ranked up over 100 times on 4 characters and not seen another drop. Am I that unlucky or are these as rare as a precursors?

I really wanted to level a Mesmer for WvW. But im not going to. Because I would be starting WvW ranks yet again. GW2 is not alt friendly as far as WvW.

The hundreds of badges I have amassed on my main will make it relatively easy to gear an alt. And yet, im still going to be missing out on the pretty much mandatory Guard killer/Defence upgrades. Nope, kitten that, ill stick to my main.

I just want to add my 2 cents and reflect everyone’s opinions; we want account-bound WvW rank. WvW experience reflects how much me, as a player, has done WvW, not how much my character has progressed. WvW is NOT PvE and we DON’T want it to be PvE, no matter how much gear grind or rank grind you add.

I have 8 alts. 5 of them are at lvl 80, 3 of them are being leveled through WvW. Not only I’m annoyed that I have to tolerate this alt-hostile system with those ascended trinkets/weapons/armor (soon to be released for sure), I can’t even reflect on my alts how much WvW I’ve done in truth. I can’t build the WvW skills on each one separately based on my own experiences because I have to grind ranks for some reason.

I really hope Arena.net wakes up someday and sees that the whole community is asking for it and a company needs to give the community what they want, most of the times.

And don’t mind the pve trolls, they will never understand the beauty of pvp and wvw. Cowards!

I’m just responding to add volume to the general opinion. Please make wxp account bound.

Character bound WvW xp has discouraged me from playing my alts in favor of adding utility to my most player WvW profession. I would like to play more professions in WvW, but i feel obligated to progress one toon as to best assist my guild and server. Nothing is lsot with making WvW exp account bound- especially since the cakitten o high.

Perhaps, if we could get the reason behind why account-wide ranking is a problem, it could make the pill easier to swallow. Right now, I just do not understand why this is an issue for Anet. It does not really make any sense.

Devon?

MAGpie.7962:

Perhaps, if we could get the reason behind why account-wide ranking is a problem, it could make the pill easier to swallow. Right now, I just do not understand why this is an issue for Anet. It does not really make any sense.

Devon?

It, as other WvW achievements, is to encourage absurdly long term play in place fo having to drive participation with continuing content. There is no other way to interpret it that makes as much sense.

The thing it the cap is 10k ranks, it doesn’t need to be character bound to fit their goals.