Guild Wars 2

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Well said.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Honestly huh?

So you are blaming the players because Anet didn’t devote the resources and person power to improve wvw and professions and combat?

It’s the players fault that Anet didn’t do anything substantial to increase retention rates and bring in new players to fill up wvw servers?

It’s the players fault for the frustrating lag too?

Players fault that nearly 4 years into product life we finally get below average rewards compared to other areas of the game?

It’s the players fault that something hasn’t been done about the afwul condition and stealth spam?

…RvR is dependent on players to run smoothly, but Anet lost players because they did not reinvest strongly in this part of the game. You can’t blame players looking to get off unpopulated servers to find some good and massive fights, when the alternative is sitting around taking camps on emptier maps with one side dominating.

I like Anet and this game, spent a ton on the gemstore, but they dropped the ball big time. I’m glad they are making a renewed effort, but you still can’t blame players for switching servers to get out of these unbalanced matches.

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Honestly huh?

So you are blaming the players because Anet didn’t devote the resources and person power to improve wvw and professions and combat?

It’s the players fault that Anet didn’t do anything substantial to increase retention rates and bring in new players to fill up wvw servers?

It’s the players fault for the frustrating lag too?

Players fault that nearly 4 years into product life we below average rewards compared to other areas of the game?

It’s the players fault that something hasn’t been done about the afwul condition and stealth spam?

…RvR is dependent on players to run smoothly but Anet lost players because they did not reinvest strongly in this part of the game. You can’t blame players looking to get off unpopulated servers to find some good and massive fights and sit around taking camps on emptier maps with one side dominating.

I like Anet and this game, spent a ton on the gemstore, but they dropped the ball big time. I’m glad they are making a renewed effort, but you still can’t blame players for switching servers to get out of these unbalanced matches.

I think you misunderstand me. I do not say Anet doesn’t have any power, and therefore responsibility, in all this. I think they can make it easier for the players, sure. However, no matter what Anet does, we, the players, have the last word regarding bandwagonning and the impact it has.

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

It all boils down to: are you part of the solution or part of the problem. So long as ppl will refuse to acknowledge they also have power over this issue the problem will persist no matter what Anet does.

I think top 6 servers need to be permanently unlinked to stop the constant 500 gem join a T1 bandwagoners. Double and triple up the bottom tiers instead and review it on a monthly/bimonthly schedule.

maybe start also lowering the map caps, maybe 60per map and try to force a more even spread a bit of players around the servers as a whole to try and even up the fights and populations.

Increase the PPK value to 3/4/5 per kill, get Kills/PPT score to 60/40% of the war scores.

Introduced segmented PPT scoring with maybe 75%/100%/125% multipliers for points earned in Night/Off-prime/Prime times (I say this as someone who works shifts and spends 1/3 time on nightcrew – nightcrew needs less scoring and influence on total warscore)

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Honestly huh?

So you are blaming the players because Anet didn’t devote the resources and person power to improve wvw and professions and combat?

It’s the players fault that Anet didn’t do anything substantial to increase retention rates and bring in new players to fill up wvw servers?

It’s the players fault for the frustrating lag too?

Players fault that nearly 4 years into product life we below average rewards compared to other areas of the game?

It’s the players fault that something hasn’t been done about the afwul condition and stealth spam?

…RvR is dependent on players to run smoothly but Anet lost players because they did not reinvest strongly in this part of the game. You can’t blame players looking to get off unpopulated servers to find some good and massive fights and sit around taking camps on emptier maps with one side dominating.

I like Anet and this game, spent a ton on the gemstore, but they dropped the ball big time. I’m glad they are making a renewed effort, but you still can’t blame players for switching servers to get out of these unbalanced matches.

I think you misunderstand me. I do not say Anet doesn’t have any power, and therefore responsibility, in all this. I think they can make it easier for the players, sure. However, no matter what Anet does, we, the players, have the last word regarding bandwagonning and the impact it has.

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

It all boils down to: are you part of the solution or part of the problem. So long as ppl will refuse to acknowledge they also have power over this issue the problem will persist no matter what Anet does.

If we want to simply this…

Anet created the problems. Players are finding their own solutions to the mess or moving on to get their pvp fix.

Right now you have an up coming pure pvp rvr game that will blow wvw rvr out of the water, and all the future holds here is server linking and reward tracks… What do you think wvw will look like a year from now if Anet doesn’t reinvest in wvw?

All these issues fall squarely on the people who created and maintain this game, not the players.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

Repeating something I wrote a long time ago on this forum…

One of the reasons bandwagons occur is due to a lack of transparency. People take a risk when they transfer. Transferring is a blind activity. They don’t have any visibility into how many other players are also transferring.

Chaba.5410:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

Repeating something I wrote a long time ago on this forum…

One of the reasons bandwagons occur is due to a lack of transparency. People take a risk when they transfer. Transferring is a blind activity. They don’t have any visibility into how many other players are also transferring.

Transparency is the part that rest on Anet shoulders. The rest is up to us.

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Honestly huh?

So you are blaming the players because Anet didn’t devote the resources and person power to improve wvw and professions and combat?

It’s the players fault that Anet didn’t do anything substantial to increase retention rates and bring in new players to fill up wvw servers?

It’s the players fault for the frustrating lag too?

Players fault that nearly 4 years into product life we below average rewards compared to other areas of the game?

It’s the players fault that something hasn’t been done about the afwul condition and stealth spam?

…RvR is dependent on players to run smoothly but Anet lost players because they did not reinvest strongly in this part of the game. You can’t blame players looking to get off unpopulated servers to find some good and massive fights and sit around taking camps on emptier maps with one side dominating.

I like Anet and this game, spent a ton on the gemstore, but they dropped the ball big time. I’m glad they are making a renewed effort, but you still can’t blame players for switching servers to get out of these unbalanced matches.

I think you misunderstand me. I do not say Anet doesn’t have any power, and therefore responsibility, in all this. I think they can make it easier for the players, sure. However, no matter what Anet does, we, the players, have the last word regarding bandwagonning and the impact it has.

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

It all boils down to: are you part of the solution or part of the problem. So long as ppl will refuse to acknowledge they also have power over this issue the problem will persist no matter what Anet does.

If we want to simply this…

Anet created the problems. Players are finding their own solutions to the mess or moving on to get their pvp fix.

Right now you have an up coming pure pvp rvr game that will blow wvw rvr out of the water, and all the future holds here is server linking and reward tracks… What do you think wvw will look like a year from now if Anet doesn’t reinvest in wvw?

All these issues fall squarely on the people who created and maintain this game, not the players.

Anet AND us created the problem. We both did. The solution is not 100% on any one shoulders. Never was, never is, and never will be.

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Honestly huh?

So you are blaming the players because Anet didn’t devote the resources and person power to improve wvw and professions and combat?

It’s the players fault that Anet didn’t do anything substantial to increase retention rates and bring in new players to fill up wvw servers?

It’s the players fault for the frustrating lag too?

Players fault that nearly 4 years into product life we below average rewards compared to other areas of the game?

It’s the players fault that something hasn’t been done about the afwul condition and stealth spam?

…RvR is dependent on players to run smoothly but Anet lost players because they did not reinvest strongly in this part of the game. You can’t blame players looking to get off unpopulated servers to find some good and massive fights and sit around taking camps on emptier maps with one side dominating.

I like Anet and this game, spent a ton on the gemstore, but they dropped the ball big time. I’m glad they are making a renewed effort, but you still can’t blame players for switching servers to get out of these unbalanced matches.

I think you misunderstand me. I do not say Anet doesn’t have any power, and therefore responsibility, in all this. I think they can make it easier for the players, sure. However, no matter what Anet does, we, the players, have the last word regarding bandwagonning and the impact it has.

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

It all boils down to: are you part of the solution or part of the problem. So long as ppl will refuse to acknowledge they also have power over this issue the problem will persist no matter what Anet does.

If we want to simply this…

Anet created the problems. Players are finding their own solutions to the mess or moving on to get their pvp fix.

Right now you have an up coming pure pvp rvr game that will blow wvw rvr out of the water, and all the future holds here is server linking and reward tracks… What do you think wvw will look like a year from now if Anet doesn’t reinvest in wvw?

All these issues fall squarely on the people who created and maintain this game, not the players.

Anet AND us created the problem. We both did. The solution is not 100% on any one shoulders. Never was, never is, and never will be.

No, players did nothing except play a game mode that received very little reinvestment by the creators.

You are not going to fault the players for the wvw “stuff” that wasn’t coded into the game that could have made the difference. Do you blame players for the year long pve content drought or canceled legendaries. or anets planned release schedule of stuff?

Players aren’t widdling away at keyboard writing the next xpac, we have zero control. If it bombs, it’s not the fault of the customer, anymore than what happens with wvw.

You don’t understand how this all works… GW2 is a product. Players are the customer. Either a company creates a well liked product and customers buy it, or a company creates an average product and you get average to low results.

Anet wanted an rvr mode in the game and did very little with it, that’s their fault for whatever the outcome is.

Edit- and this entire idea by the OP to punishing players financially because Anet failed to maintain wvw is irrational. It’s also a double slap in the face to customers who are trying to stick out this mess.

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Honestly huh?

So you are blaming the players because Anet didn’t devote the resources and person power to improve wvw and professions and combat?

It’s the players fault that Anet didn’t do anything substantial to increase retention rates and bring in new players to fill up wvw servers?

It’s the players fault for the frustrating lag too?

Players fault that nearly 4 years into product life we below average rewards compared to other areas of the game?

It’s the players fault that something hasn’t been done about the afwul condition and stealth spam?

…RvR is dependent on players to run smoothly but Anet lost players because they did not reinvest strongly in this part of the game. You can’t blame players looking to get off unpopulated servers to find some good and massive fights and sit around taking camps on emptier maps with one side dominating.

I like Anet and this game, spent a ton on the gemstore, but they dropped the ball big time. I’m glad they are making a renewed effort, but you still can’t blame players for switching servers to get out of these unbalanced matches.

I think you misunderstand me. I do not say Anet doesn’t have any power, and therefore responsibility, in all this. I think they can make it easier for the players, sure. However, no matter what Anet does, we, the players, have the last word regarding bandwagonning and the impact it has.

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

It all boils down to: are you part of the solution or part of the problem. So long as ppl will refuse to acknowledge they also have power over this issue the problem will persist no matter what Anet does.

If we want to simply this…

Anet created the problems. Players are finding their own solutions to the mess or moving on to get their pvp fix.

Right now you have an up coming pure pvp rvr game that will blow wvw rvr out of the water, and all the future holds here is server linking and reward tracks… What do you think wvw will look like a year from now if Anet doesn’t reinvest in wvw?

All these issues fall squarely on the people who created and maintain this game, not the players.

Anet AND us created the problem. We both did. The solution is not 100% on any one shoulders. Never was, never is, and never will be.

No, players did nothing except play a game mode that received very little reinvestment by the creators.

You are not going to fault the players for the wvw “stuff” that wasn’t coded into the game that could have made the difference. Do you blame players for the year long pve content drought or canceled legendaries. or anets planned release schedule of stuff?

Players aren’t widdling away at keyboard writing the next xpac, we have zero control. If it bombs, it’s not the fault of the customer, anymore than what happens with wvw.

You don’t understand how this all works… GW2 is a product. Players are the customer. Either a company creates a well liked product and customers buy it, or a company creates an average product and you get average to low results.

Anet wanted an rvr mode in the game and did very little with it, that’s their fault for whatever the outcome is.

Edit- and this entire idea by the OP to punishing players financially because Anet failed to maintain wvw is irrational. It’s also a double slap in the face to customers who are trying to stick out this mess.

As said, there are people, groups and even guilds abusing this to continously farm lootbags and feed off the less fortunate. So yes, there is a portion of customers who are as much to blame for abusing this system for their own selfish goals, with Anet earning their coins under the rug.

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

Swagger.1459:

Sirbeaumerdier.3740:

As with a lot of societal issues, education is the only long term solution. Only once ppl realize the gap that exist between what they say they want vs what they factually do will there be hope.

The solution has to come from the players, not from Anet. And for that to happen players have to feel it make sense and that they have power over their gaming experience. But unless they are aware of the consequences of their actions, or care about it at all, forget any measure to counter bandwagons. The path of least resistance is always going to win where ignorance rule. Always.

Honestly huh?

So you are blaming the players because Anet didn’t devote the resources and person power to improve wvw and professions and combat?

It’s the players fault that Anet didn’t do anything substantial to increase retention rates and bring in new players to fill up wvw servers?

It’s the players fault for the frustrating lag too?

Players fault that nearly 4 years into product life we below average rewards compared to other areas of the game?

It’s the players fault that something hasn’t been done about the afwul condition and stealth spam?

…RvR is dependent on players to run smoothly but Anet lost players because they did not reinvest strongly in this part of the game. You can’t blame players looking to get off unpopulated servers to find some good and massive fights and sit around taking camps on emptier maps with one side dominating.

I like Anet and this game, spent a ton on the gemstore, but they dropped the ball big time. I’m glad they are making a renewed effort, but you still can’t blame players for switching servers to get out of these unbalanced matches.

I think you misunderstand me. I do not say Anet doesn’t have any power, and therefore responsibility, in all this. I think they can make it easier for the players, sure. However, no matter what Anet does, we, the players, have the last word regarding bandwagonning and the impact it has.

Players who are complaining about unbalanced match-up but systematically join the bandwagon every time clearly miss the irony of their move.

It all boils down to: are you part of the solution or part of the problem. So long as ppl will refuse to acknowledge they also have power over this issue the problem will persist no matter what Anet does.

If we want to simply this…

Anet created the problems. Players are finding their own solutions to the mess or moving on to get their pvp fix.

Right now you have an up coming pure pvp rvr game that will blow wvw rvr out of the water, and all the future holds here is server linking and reward tracks… What do you think wvw will look like a year from now if Anet doesn’t reinvest in wvw?

All these issues fall squarely on the people who created and maintain this game, not the players.

Anet AND us created the problem. We both did. The solution is not 100% on any one shoulders. Never was, never is, and never will be.

No, players did nothing except play a game mode that received very little reinvestment by the creators.

You are not going to fault the players for the wvw “stuff” that wasn’t coded into the game that could have made the difference. Do you blame players for the year long pve content drought or canceled legendaries. or anets planned release schedule of stuff?

Players aren’t widdling away at keyboard writing the next xpac, we have zero control. If it bombs, it’s not the fault of the customer, anymore than what happens with wvw.

You don’t understand how this all works… GW2 is a product. Players are the customer. Either a company creates a well liked product and customers buy it, or a company creates an average product and you get average to low results.

Anet wanted an rvr mode in the game and did very little with it, that’s their fault for whatever the outcome is.

Edit- and this entire idea by the OP to punishing players financially because Anet failed to maintain wvw is irrational. It’s also a double slap in the face to customers who are trying to stick out this mess.

Players aren’t (only) victims here. What motivates ppl playing WvW hold a lot of the blame.

If it’s easy loot bags and “victories” that motivate you, bandwagonning may seems to be a good idea but it does come at a cost for the game mode. You aren’t forced to play WvW or to transfer server. Maybe EoTM would be a better game mode for such a person. Maybe not, IDK.

I would have tons of reasons to transfer but for me it’s an ultimate last resort for reasons that are mine (money has no part of it). But the point is, I can choose something that is coherent with what I want out of that game mode or I can continue to shoot myself in the foot by transferring while complaining that match-ups are crap (assuming competitive match-ups are what interest me ofc).

In the end, if you hold power, even infinitesimal, you also hold a proportionate responsibility in any given situation. Players, all players, do have a lot of power over what they experiment in this game (so does Anet) so plz stop telling me Anet has 100% of the blame and you are powerless here.

I agree. The same thing is to be said for blobbing. Though Anet has put down a foundation to make it beneficial, it is us the players that determine if it is going to be used and abused. Unfortunately, the player base has decided that blobbing is more important that strong skill play anymore