Guild Wars 2

Vena.8436:

Edge is, at the very least, a very carefully designed map that has built on a lot of the flaws of the old maps and improved. Give it a try! There’s some great mechanics in there… though I still miss the yaks.

Is the plan to still limit edge to the current matchup? If so I think its as huge a waste of time as any empty plots of land in WAR ever were.

Jaxs.5830:

Is the plan to still limit edge to the current matchup? If so I think its as huge a waste of time as any empty plots of land in WAR ever were.

Its an “overflow” map (whatever that means when queues were ever only a problem during seasons and prime time) for your match-up as of so far. The bigger issue is that (as many of us see it) Edge will render everything but EBG barren.

Since the matches are orders of magnitude shorter in duration there are any number of reasons why it will be more popular (aside from just being new and better designed).

Which, after a year of the borderlands, frankly doesn’t seem so bad. I’d sooner retire them (the old borderlands), leave only Edge and EBG for a while, and eventually re-install new borderlands with whatever they learn from their Edge development. This is the opposite affect of WAR which was just “here are some kittenty empty maps and broken formats”, and then no one felt like playing on anything anymore.

Also Brightstorms.

I think everything is fine, if anything WvW gained population by attracting the PvE achievement hunters…

Seasons served its purpose.

Vena.8436:

There.

1.) ANet could transition to instanced matches. There is no reason that I can see to retain the server-vs-server-vs-server model, and it is the single biggest flaw that breaks WvW. I still greatly prefer to battle in a large scale format requiring teamwork and strategy, and while ignoring PPT is the only sane thing to do anymore it is not my preference at all. I am deeply sad that WvW has forfeited what it could have been, and for that … yes, I carry a grudge against ANet.

2.) Almost everything that ANet has added to WvW since last winter has encouraged zergs (I’m going back further than just a couple of months). You don’t have to take my word for it … the forums are full of examples. Ranks, points for kills, silly achievements that draw in PvE’ers in droves, the emphasis on flipping objectives instead of holding them … all of that can be accomplish best by running with a zerg. To be honest, I often find running with a zerg to be fun as well, but it shouldn’t trump everything else. The league system is another example … everyone jumped ship to high pop servers where there are so many people playing that roamers and scouts (even if they gather some goodies along the way) contribute proportionately far less to the success of the server than they did last winter.

3.) At least we agree on this one

4.) I wasn’t really just referring to maps when I mentioned content because more importantly I think there are fresh things that ANet could add to existing maps beyond the rather wasted bloodlust bases, but let’s face it … Southsun was a new map and just about every LS instance has been a new map. I did say that I’m anxious to give Edge of the Mists a try, but I think it’s pretty obvious that WvW doesn’t get the love that other elements of GW2 get, and that has to affect how motivated (or not) WvW’ers are to stick around.

5.) I don’t see how it is petty at all to be severely disappointed that the topic voted by WvW’ers as the single most important issue to be addressed by the CDI process went absolutely nowhere. Chris Whiteside himself directly responded to me in the CDI process development thread promising that he would ask Devon Carter to summarize the key ideas gathered from those 23 pages of player comments. Nothing ever came of that and we still don’t know which, if any, of the hundreds of player suggestions struck any kind of chord with anyone at ANet. Nobody has ever given any reason for the black hole that CDI turned into or offered any indication it would be readdressed.

As boring as it may be to you to see these points continually raised (and not just by me), imagine how frustrating it must be for all the players who care about WvW to see nothing ever being done about them. If you can so readily accept the status quo for WvW, that’s fine … but all that tells me is that you have lesser expectations for the game and what it could be. From all indications, though, you’re exactly the kind of player that ANet wants for WvW … somebody who might play fairly often but doesn’t much care what the game looks like as long as they get to socialize with guild mates and mess around a bit. Maybe no other alternatives show up and we’ll all be stuck with you here in GW2 by default, but if any game shows up and delivers what WvW COULD have been, I can pretty much guarantee that players will leave here in droves. That prospect alone … that some other game publisher could attract a large player base simply by offering WvW implemented as ANet could be doing themselves … is probably the strongest and most ironic indictment I can think of.

Crimson Riddles.3892:

I think everything is fine, if anything WvW gained population by attracting the PvE achievement hunters…

Seasons served its purpose.

It probably served its purpose from ANet’s point of view, but from a player point of view it didn’t improve WvW at all … in fact it did just the opposite.

Jaxs.5830:

Vena.8436:

Edge is, at the very least, a very carefully designed map that has built on a lot of the flaws of the old maps and improved. Give it a try! There’s some great mechanics in there… though I still miss the yaks.

Is the plan to still limit edge to the current matchup? If so I think its as huge a waste of time as any empty plots of land in WAR ever were.

I thought Edge was going to be open to all servers simultaneously, with multiple instances opening up to handle whatever demand was there. If it is limited only to the current matchup, that’s just stupid.

ANet does not use their own servers for GW2 … they lease server capacity from Akamai and ANet doesn’t even know which pieces of hardware are running the game at any point in time. The only reason for anything to be organized by realm is purely due to some decision … there is no hardware constraint.

Cactus.2710:

There and back again, a hobbit’s tale!

1.) Edge is instanced matches. This is why I said they should just retire the borderlands, leave EBG as the week-long hub central. WvW hasn’t forfeited anything considering that it was a format made to be casual from its onset, and it still carries some of better designed aspects of realm combat in recent memory.

2.) Everything you listed, save the seasons, is months old. This is why I said that there is no “growing emphasis”, its been the same since forever and a day. In fact I’d argue that optimization that killed skill lagg was anything but zerg favoring. The fact that taking things is “easier” as a zerg doesn’t make it the most rewarding either. Wipe a karma zerg twice and you will have netted more profit in WXP and drops than the zerg would have accomplished in circling the map several times over. (60 WXP x 50 people + Vial drops + loot drops, is a lot.)

The bloodlust point buff is also not “zerg favoring”, and its next to impossible to maintain with just “a zerg” and the point-on-stomp bonus is wasted on zerg balls. (So I also find that point of yours “points for kills” utterly perplexing. You’re do not get “points for kills” you get points for stomps, try stomping something in the middle of a zerg. Nine times out of ten I will guarantee you, that they will be dead before the animation even ends.)

Bloodlust was one of the better (revised version, that is) additions they’ve made.

3.) Check outside! The sky might be falling.

4.) If you ever bothered to compare Edge to something like SSC or Tower of Nightmares, you’d probably quickly realize that one takes an exorbitant amount of time more to make than the others. So drawing such comparisons is like saying you can make a submarine out of bread in a hundredth of the time it takes to make one of metal.

Bloodlust was a very good addition. (And I know you hate them, but so were traps!)

5.) Actually this may be because of Edge, as almost all of the developer work is currently put on working on the feedback provided and modulating Edge.

Cactus.2710:

From all indications, though, you’re exactly the kind of player that ANet wants for WvW … somebody who might play fairly often but doesn’t much care what the game looks like as long as they get to socialize with guild mates and mess around a bit. Maybe no other alternatives show up and we’ll all be stuck with you here in GW2 by default, but if any game shows up and delivers what WvW COULD have been, I can pretty much guarantee that players will leave here in droves. That prospect alone … that some other game publisher could attract a large player base simply by offering WvW implemented as ANet could be doing themselves … is probably the strongest and most ironic indictment I can think of.

Mayhaps, though I doubt it to be so simple. I can safely tel you, though, that my expectations are not small, and I have very, very high hopes for Edge (as do many seemingly old time jaded players). WvW as it is, was a successful failure is how I like to look at it, and its still a bucket of fun whether I am out roaming or running with the guild.

As for the arrival of Godot, well let’s just wait till he’s actually here.

Vena.8436:

Cactus.2710:

There and back again, a hobbit’s tale!

1.) Edge is instanced matches. This is why I said they should just retire the borderlands, leave EBG as the week-long hub central. WvW hasn’t forfeited anything considering that it was a format made to be casual from its onset, and it still carries some of better designed aspects of realm combat in recent memory.

2.) Everything you listed, save the seasons, is months old. This is why I said that there is no “growing emphasis”, its been the same since forever and a day. In fact I’d argue that optimization that killed skill lagg was anything but zerg favoring. The fact that taking things is “easier” as a zerg doesn’t make it the most rewarding either. Wipe a karma zerg twice and you will have netted more profit in WXP and drops than the zerg would have accomplished in circling the map several times over. (60 WXP x 50 people + Vial drops + loot drops, is a lot.)

The bloodlust point buff is also not “zerg favoring”, and its next to impossible to maintain with just “a zerg” and the point-on-stomp bonus is wasted on zerg balls. (So I also find that point of yours “points for kills” utterly perplexing. You’re do not get “points for kills” you get points for stomps, try stomping something in the middle of a zerg. Nine times out of ten I will guarantee you, that they will be dead before the animation even ends.)

Bloodlust was one of the better (revised version, that is) additions they’ve made.

3.) Check outside! The sky might be falling.

4.) If you ever bothered to compare Edge to something like SSC or Tower of Nightmares, you’d probably quickly realize that one takes an exorbitant amount of time more to make than the others. So drawing such comparisons is like saying you can make a submarine out of bread in a hundredth of the time it takes to make one of metal.

Bloodlust was a very good addition. (And I know you hate them, but so were traps!)

5.) Actually this may be because of Edge, as almost all of the developer work is currently put on working on the feedback provided and modulating Edge.

Cactus.2710:

From all indications, though, you’re exactly the kind of player that ANet wants for WvW … somebody who might play fairly often but doesn’t much care what the game looks like as long as they get to socialize with guild mates and mess around a bit. Maybe no other alternatives show up and we’ll all be stuck with you here in GW2 by default, but if any game shows up and delivers what WvW COULD have been, I can pretty much guarantee that players will leave here in droves. That prospect alone … that some other game publisher could attract a large player base simply by offering WvW implemented as ANet could be doing themselves … is probably the strongest and most ironic indictment I can think of.

Mayhaps, though I doubt it to be so simple. I can safely tel you, though, that my expectations are not small, and I have very, very high hopes for Edge (as do many seemingly old time jaded players). WvW as it is, was a successful failure is how I like to look at it, and its still a bucket of fun whether I am out roaming or running with the guild.

As for the arrival of Godot, well let’s just wait till he’s actually here.

Interesting points indeed! May I ask who or what is Godot?

it’s the holiday season where we spend most of our time with our family; so games will not be played as often as before.

Cactus.2710:

Well, at least you responded and I thank you for that. I’d certainly like to hear the specifics of what you think is deficient, though. If you ever decide to post a summary somewhere else you should at least be able to post a link to it here without getting redacted.

I don’t know of another forum where I could post a summary. Even if I knew of one, I’d be hesitant to post a lot of details because of the NDA. I will say that I was surprised when I saw the April launch announcement because based on my experience I felt it needed another 8-12 months development.

At this point I’m more interested by the fact that somebody has launched a private WAR server that is going to be open PvP and have the old battlefield objectives, keeps, and fortresses in it.