Guild Wars 2

ColinJohanson.2394:

Shiren.9532:

Most servers can’t fill four maps, why do we need a fifth?

I’m excited about new terrain and possibly new objectives or gameplay, but populations are too sparse already, this will make that problem worse.

It’s a good question, and one we talked about a lot. Above all else, our main raises behind adding another map (which can overflow and create multiple copies of itself) include:

• On many more populated servers in NA and EU, there are queues, this would allow people to play the game they want at all times.

• We want to do things in the future, this map included, that will help get more people interested in WvW. We need to make sure we’re not just making them sit in a queue when we do that.

• The game is going to be launched in other parts of the world, and on launch in NA/EU we had queues for WvW on just about every world. In some of the largest gaming parts of the world say, China for example which we’re in beta for right now, we’re seeing massive responses from guilds that make NA/EU guilds look tiny. These guilds all want to play WvW on the same world together, this map will help facilitate a better launch in new regions, as well as the much larger guild alliances you find in the east.

Hope that helps a bit! We know for much smaller worlds this may seem like it’s no big deal, since you never deal with queues anyway, but the gameplay and experience should hopefully be fun (and different) such that it may attract new players to WvW. It also opens up opportunities for us to do other types of experiences in WvW across all worlds that may help bolster smaller worlds populations as well.

If the smaller servers get more people into WvW, those people are just gonna transfer up tiers anyway. The game is just designed that way right now, Colin.

When this thing hits, it’s only gonna make the WvW population inequality worse (just like leagues did). Top servers are gonna have one of their draw backs cleared (WvW queues) while bottom servers are gonna be emptier. Top servers can spare guilds to sit around on a map and give feedback. They have all the people, they have all the voices.

We barely have any WvW guilds or commanders, let alone any that we can spare to test some map. This is gonna stretch us further make it feel more emptier and people are gonna quit or transfer more (that’s why many have left, it feels empty, it’s hard to find fights out side of EB and the karma trains).

I honestly don’t give a care about skill lag and hour queues in the top tiers. Your game put them there and it’s going to keep putting them there no matter how many maps you give them to fill.

Edit: Maybe I am making this all up. I mean, you probably have the numbers on transfers. If the leagues hitting didn’t involve a lot of guilds moving up tiers, aggravating the population inequality further, just tell me “It didn’t make the population inequality worse” and well, I’ll have one less thing to worry about.

Otherwise it’s some rather ridiculous cycle where the problem is people move to tier 1 but since everyone is in tier 1 all the problems people in tier 1 have are the ones that are addressed instead.

ColinJohanson.2394:

Shiren.9532:

Most servers can’t fill four maps, why do we need a fifth?

I’m excited about new terrain and possibly new objectives or gameplay, but populations are too sparse already, this will make that problem worse.

It’s a good question, and one we talked about a lot. Above all else, our main raises behind adding another map (which can overflow and create multiple copies of itself) include:

• On many more populated servers in NA and EU, there are queues, this would allow people to play the game they want at all times.

• We want to do things in the future, this map included, that will help get more people interested in WvW. We need to make sure we’re not just making them sit in a queue when we do that.

• The game is going to be launched in other parts of the world, and on launch in NA/EU we had queues for WvW on just about every world. In some of the largest gaming parts of the world say, China for example which we’re in beta for right now, we’re seeing massive responses from guilds that make NA/EU guilds look tiny. These guilds all want to play WvW on the same world together, this map will help facilitate a better launch in new regions, as well as the much larger guild alliances you find in the east.

Hope that helps a bit! We know for much smaller worlds this may seem like it’s no big deal, since you never deal with queues anyway, but the gameplay and experience should hopefully be fun (and different) such that it may attract new players to WvW. It also opens up opportunities for us to do other types of experiences in WvW across all worlds that may help bolster smaller worlds populations as well.

I hate to ask this, but with what I assume is the intent to try and keep maps filled a bit more in WvW, is the idea of Server/World mergers on the table at all if the methods of attracting more people to WvW don’t pan out for those “smaller” servers.

Nice, very nice. I wish we had a sneak preview on the map. Good find Vol.

edit, oh I think the second one has shot of it?

Could this be used for gvg perhaps?

I also worry considerably about the impact this will have on low population servers. Currently, the biggest incentive for a guild to move from kitten a low population server is to avoid queues. This removes that incentive.

Lower population servers are where the most help is needed right now – in both WvW and PVE. With the current trend toward content designed only for huge groups of people (Tequatl being the example on the PVE side and this on the WvW side), everyone is going to want to play on very high populated servers.

Rather than come up with a new map that gives high populated servers something to do in WvW during their 10 minute queue, I would rather see development effort toward helping lower populated servers get more enjoyment out of the game – maybe through linking lower pop servers together for WvW (and maybe for less populated PVE maps as well) so that we have the numbers to enjoy the content in the same ways the higher tiers do (then you can worry about addressing overflow issues for EVERYONE).

Right now, the experience between playing on a high populated server and a low populated one is too different. Get us all to the same level, and then worry about things like this.

Looks really good! The screenshots look amazing and I hope the idea will be worked out good too (:

Now I got a few questions:
1. What kind of objectives will the map have to gain Wxp?
2. What size will the map have? As big as borderlands or smaller/bigger?
3. What is the capacity on the map? As big as borderlands or smaller/bigger?
4. Will this map cause extra lags? If yes, are you looking for a way to get rid of this?

@ Colin or Jon … The link you guys have provided in the blog sends you to the survey websites home page, unsure whether this is intentional but just wanted some clarification on how to complete the survey as I’m 110% intrigued to participate and represent my guild.

So if this Map comes, we can close the last few servers in ranking for WvW.
Most players want to play on EB and only play the other three maps if there is a queue there. So if they try to join EB they will automaticly join the new map which doesn’t bring points for the Matchup?

If players don’t want queues just join one of the other server without a queue…

I have to agree with Grieve. I honestly love the idea of this map and will probably enjoy fighting in it just for the scenery alone. But I play on FC. There already isn’t a large enough player base on that server and the ones it’s paired against to have something to do all day long. Effort MUST be taken to improve the population and coverage issues.

Since overflow now has a solution I don’t see why we can’t see lower populated servers merged in WvW. Especially since it’s quite rare indeed for the bottom tiered servers to ever see a queue on any individual map, let alone all 4 at once..

I really dislike this idea. I want different borderlands to replace the clones, not new maps that really only help high population servers and hurt low population servers.

Blaeys.3102:

Right now, the experience between playing on a high populated server and a low populated one is too different. Get us all to the same level, and then worry about things like this.

Never going to happen. It’s just not possible with the way ANet set up WvW. The only possible solution to the issue is for them to completely start over with WvW. Create a new series of maps equal in size to the PvE world map, pool every WvW server together on that “world” and split them between three factions. This would open up all kinds of new gameplay that would allow both large and small group battles to support each other as well.

The massive population difference between low and high servers has a large effect on what they can do with WvW. It’s really limiting them.

CORRECT SURVEY HERE:

https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/GW2_WvWCommunit

Sounds like fun. I can’t wait to try it out when it launches.

I think this new zone could be a fantastic place for GvG or 1v1 arenas…where people could take part in consensual duels and others could spectate but not interfere.

I agree with those who are saying that with the current direction of development, both of the game and the community, ArenaNet needs to seriously consider merging the lower-pop servers for WvW, or else really focus on ways to spread the population more evenly.

Please allow us to do pvp/raid fights freely on this map without having to do pvd’ing at towers/castles with sieges as it won’t affect world score anyway. This map would be so good as a fighting/pk action map like other mmorpg’s have. Please make this happen!
We really need a big, pvd-free(boring chores) and fun-only pvp boosted map.

Shiren.9532:

“The Edge of the Mists beta test will be invite-only, and guilds will be asked to put in applications if they want to be part of the test. Peters stressed that since ArenaNet wants a great number and variety of players, the test will also be open to guilds that don’t currently play GW2, and players from all around the world will be able to participate (although at least one member must be able to compile feedback in English for the developers to read). Testing of Edge of the Mists is slated to begin in November and continue into 2014.”

Well, guess that means the guild I’m in, which might be on the “most un-favored list” won’t be invited.

I’d rather test the new map than do 7 weeks of league

ColinJohanson.2394:

Shiren.9532:

Most servers can’t fill four maps, why do we need a fifth?

I’m excited about new terrain and possibly new objectives or gameplay, but populations are too sparse already, this will make that problem worse.

It’s a good question, and one we talked about a lot. Above all else, our main raises behind adding another map (which can overflow and create multiple copies of itself) include:

• On many more populated servers in NA and EU, there are queues, this would allow people to play the game they want at all times.

• We want to do things in the future, this map included, that will help get more people interested in WvW. We need to make sure we’re not just making them sit in a queue when we do that.

• The game is going to be launched in other parts of the world, and on launch in NA/EU we had queues for WvW on just about every world. In some of the largest gaming parts of the world say, China for example which we’re in beta for right now, we’re seeing massive responses from guilds that make NA/EU guilds look tiny. These guilds all want to play WvW on the same world together, this map will help facilitate a better launch in new regions, as well as the much larger guild alliances you find in the east.

Hope that helps a bit! We know for much smaller worlds this may seem like it’s no big deal, since you never deal with queues anyway, but the gameplay and experience should hopefully be fun (and different) such that it may attract new players to WvW. It also opens up opportunities for us to do other types of experiences in WvW across all worlds that may help bolster smaller worlds populations as well.

Colin, you’re going to need a bigger boat

Also, do you see China driving the much needed and often requested guild management tools?

This looks like it might be good for the gvg community. A map where they can go without having to worry about a wvw zerg crashing their match, or having either group causing queue problems for the other. It’s not a place of their own, but it does sound like it might be a better place than the borderland windmill.

Very exciting stuff – looking forward to seeing how it pans out.

Sounds like an interesting development, I’m looking forward to this :-)

Sounds and looks awesome, but i don’t think that i wanna go back normal maps.

I’m not sure I understand the purpose of this new map, especially since I wasn’t aware that queues were a legitimate issue outside of reset night (unless the person never ventures into one of the borderland maps). And indeed, Devon mentioned that one of the disincentives to stacking on a server was the long queue times. This map will:

• Not give enough reward so it becomes a hang-out place like LA; or
• Give just enough reward so it removes the disincentives to stack on T1 servers, further imbalancing server population and leagues.

Two thoughts:

• Are you lowering the regular map caps when this new map goes through? That would be a welcome change.
• Is this an attempt to help out alt leveling wexp? Players can gain wexp on their alts but not feel bad that they’re a liability to their team? If so, please just make wexp account bound.

PS: New maps, yay!

It´s good, really good, like really really good that somethign like this happens, it should cheer up even the cynics amongst us if you can pull this off properly.

Funniest thing I read in regards to applications:

“I hope Sarcx applies and gets rejected.”

I’m hopeful for the new map. I just hope it isn’t gimmicky like skyhammer and is just about knockbacks.

I really like the idea that people from any world can fill these maps. That would make for a fantastic roamer map.

Thats Great! Looking very much forward to it!
Hopefully there are some sort of objectives beside getting wxp.

A new map… that will create a copy of itself if put to an overflow situation.

I love it.

Xillllix.3485:

Thats Great! Looking very much forward to it!
Hopefully there are some sort of objectives beside getting wxp.

WvW has become so repetitive and with lacking objectives, that actual fun is enough for me as a reward for this new map

Why would GvG guilds play normal WvW now?

I don’t suppose it’s a real loss, it just means that WvW becomes a lot more casual.

The new map looks gigantic (which would be a truly great thing), or am I seeing it wrongly? Does this mean they’ve countered the problems they had with map-size limit they talked about previously?

Will the Chinese players be able to join the NA/EU servers? If so I might want to buy a Mandarin language software for giggles.

am i reading it right? it means even if we don’t have queues, we can still access the map anytime we want right? YAY!

but do these maps take players from all servers or only from the current matchups?

Guess I better pack my bags and finally move back to an upper tier server. This game seems to be moving towards catering towards the higher pop servers

So this is a test server for their expansion into the Asian markets that they are calling a new map for the NA community…………..say it with me….“Test Server”.

The thing that I find interesting about this is a few things.

DevonCarver.5370:

2) Some of the things we are building into this map are the first step towards eventually making headway on the server imbalance issues. We have some ideas that we are going to implement, but the first step is eliminating the queue. We’ve seen, regularly, that when we make a major change to WvW, people flood the game type and get stuck in queues. This will allow them to at least experience some of WvW when those changes occur.

I hope that explains it.

To resolve imbalance issues queues may need to be created more frequently. This may be done in many ways possibly even including removing some maps or set of maps all together. Or other types of major changes that will effect queues. They are setting up infrastructure to where even while queued someone can still have fun in WvW. They are also setting up a infrastructure so that test can be run with humans on a large scale.

When I read about it I didn’t think “Catering to a high pop server”. I thought “catering to GvG guilds, and creating a place to play without impacting the score that isn’t sPvP”.

I was pretty keen about the new map until I read this from the FAQ:

The current iteration is that you will only be matched up against the other worlds in your current WvW matchup. That is one of the many aspects of the map that we will be actively getting feedback on from the community and the testers.

I assumed it would be like the PvE over flows where people from all servers would clump together, creating an active environment that you could go to when it is slow on your respective server.

Practically speaking the current implementation as described above is useless outside of a T1 environment. If only the other servers in my match-up are there, then typically the population of the new map is going to be as lopsided as the rest of the match and just as empty depending on the situation.

Car.3805:

• Are you lowering the regular map caps when this new map goes through? That would be a welcome change.

Wouldn’t surprise me if this is the ultimate goal. Reducing the caps would improve skill lag, make server population a smaller factor in victory and perhaps reduce the zerging we see now in WvW.

Shiren.9532:

Most servers can’t fill four maps, why do we need a fifth?

I’m excited about new terrain and possibly new objectives or gameplay, but populations are too sparse already, this will make that problem worse.

I am all for new maps, but this makes no sense. To combat the queue? Seriously? Only a few servers have issues with a queue, while the majority of servers might have one map, let alone two maps queued.

Sure, reset night might have more people cramming in WvW, but that is it.

This seems like it is gonna hurt more servers than it will help. Servers with mid and lower populations can’t afford to lose any more numbers, and this will attract much needed numbers away from the real fight.

Need to fix the blow out match ups before this

LHound.8964:

Shiren.9532:

Most servers can’t fill four maps, why do we need a fifth?

Because there are servers with queues to fill eight :p

Then said servers should transfer to servers that can barely fill one or two. Problem solved.

I love you guys who can’t figure out why there wouldn’t be any objectives on this map. “I don’t get it, why would anyone want to go to a map with no pve to do????” Signed….. – 99.9999999% of Anets customers.

Vol.5241:

Swamurabi.7890:

Hope there’s an option for non queued servers to try out the new map. I don’t think that T1 should be the only opinion heard. Would be better if you randomly got assigned a color when your guild entered the map.

Yeah this is something that they would have to consider, especially when it’s hard to get into an overflow outside of prime-time/reset night.

I read that you can enter this map whenever you want, not just while you are in a que.

This is great. Thank you…

“These guilds all want to play WvW on the same world together, this map will help facilitate a better launch in new regions, as well as the much larger guild alliances you find in the east.”

Its a test server ppl. They are launching in China which has many more players than NA and we all now that WvW is having a hard time dealing with NA playerbase.

Before they can launch Anet needs to figure out how to cram more players into WvW and fix performance issues. This will not fix the the zerg meta. All it will do is allow them to increase the population cap in WvW.

T1 NA on reset has many guild members sitting in queue waiting to play with their guilds. If anything all the test server will do is allow them to raise the cap.

One last time…say it with me….“Test Server”.

ColinJohanson.2394:

Shiren.9532:

Most servers can’t fill four maps, why do we need a fifth?

I’m excited about new terrain and possibly new objectives or gameplay, but populations are too sparse already, this will make that problem worse.

It’s a good question, and one we talked about a lot. Above all else, our main raises behind adding another map (which can overflow and create multiple copies of itself) include:

• On many more populated servers in NA and EU, there are queues, this would allow people to play the game they want at all times.

• We want to do things in the future, this map included, that will help get more people interested in WvW. We need to make sure we’re not just making them sit in a queue when we do that.

• The game is going to be launched in other parts of the world, and on launch in NA/EU we had queues for WvW on just about every world. In some of the largest gaming parts of the world say, China for example which we’re in beta for right now, we’re seeing massive responses from guilds that make NA/EU guilds look tiny. These guilds all want to play WvW on the same world together, this map will help facilitate a better launch in new regions, as well as the much larger guild alliances you find in the east.

Hope that helps a bit! We know for much smaller worlds this may seem like it’s no big deal, since you never deal with queues anyway, but the gameplay and experience should hopefully be fun (and different) such that it may attract new players to WvW. It also opens up opportunities for us to do other types of experiences in WvW across all worlds that may help bolster smaller worlds populations as well.

Woulnd’t it be better to try fill out the bottom tier with players first and try to reduce the population of superstacked top servers that are the real issue here.
Also, why it was necessary to try make few easy bucks by reducing transfer costs just before the league to help mess up things even more than they were?

Andrew Clear.1750:

Shiren.9532:

Most servers can’t fill four maps, why do we need a fifth?

I’m excited about new terrain and possibly new objectives or gameplay, but populations are too sparse already, this will make that problem worse.

I am all for new maps, but this makes no sense. To combat the queue? Seriously? Only a few servers have issues with a queue, while the majority of servers might have one map, let alone two maps queued.

Sure, reset night might have more people cramming in WvW, but that is it.

This seems like it is gonna hurt more servers than it will help. Servers with mid and lower populations can’t afford to lose any more numbers, and this will attract much needed numbers away from the real fight.

Need to fix the blow out match ups before this

this may be true right now, but this also opens the door to lowering map caps thus reducing skill lag and helping with lower pop servers competing even if that means trying to put a population balance cap into place.

now my concern would be in a truly mismatched game if a heavy wvw pop server like mine fills the fifth map and overflows we will have no one to fight, so I hope that this map will be opened to cross servers to try and have a good three way fight at all times even if it does not effect PPT.

edit: by cross server I mean each team is from a different server, since this is wvw we should avoid having people from different servers on the same team.

Make it a joint map for every server in EU(NA). You never know who’re you going to fight. Its technically impossible but would be the best thing ever!

Test server……………/sigh

make it like overflow where anyone from any server can join in. To balance it out make it so that when you join that overflow, you are assigned the same colour your WvW match up is currently assigned.

New map sounds amazing. It really does, but one of the most important thing that stops ppl from leaving smaller servers is the long queues on bigger ones. Now that they are ‘fixing’ the problem of people being bored waiting to get in, what stops everyone to just stack on larger servers? Don’t you think this will encourage bandwagonning even more?

PhoenixDown.5467:

New map sounds amazing. It really does, but one of the most important thing that stops ppl from leaving smaller servers is the long queues on bigger ones. Now that they are ‘fixing’ the problem of people being bored waiting to get in, what stops everyone to just stack on larger servers? Don’t you think this will encourage bandwagonning even more?

Most likely.

PhoenixDown.5467:

New map sounds amazing. It really does, but one of the most important thing that stops ppl from leaving smaller servers is the long queues on bigger ones. Now that they are ‘fixing’ the problem of people being bored waiting to get in, what stops everyone to just stack on larger servers? Don’t you think this will encourage bandwagonning even more?

No it wont. If you are into the “Server Game” you wont be on the “Test Server” because it has no bearing on the match.

All this does is instead of sitting in LA waiting for the queue to pop you will be dumped into the test server where you can pvp while you wait for your queue to pop.

Which is just a side benefit to having a test server for Anet’s launch in the east.

rultax.2604:

Car.3805:

• Are you lowering the regular map caps when this new map goes through? That would be a welcome change.

Wouldn’t surprise me if this is the ultimate goal. Reducing the caps would improve skill lag, make server population a smaller factor in victory and perhaps reduce the zerging we see now in WvW.

I asked that question in the FAQ thread and the answer was a resounding no:

We would prefer to see more people on the maps, if feasible.

This morning I was pretty excited about the potential of the new map, but the more I read in the FAQ the more it disappoints me. It really is just another perk for T1.

Wow this looks awesome! I know it’s in the far future, but it’s still a nice thing to look forward to